Digging in to Euclidean Rhythms: Prime numbers, cool rhythms, and odd time signatures

[@andytuke8986]

Grateful Dead and Primus (both from San Francisco by coincidence) wrote songs in 11 time, both called Eleven

[@timothynewman6062]

if you like the idea of electronic music produced with these rhythms, check out Steevio's track "Primes," Jeff Mills's work on "Growth" [AX-10], or my personal favourite, Dario Zenker's old work as #4.26. on Frozen Border - specifically the track "Whativa"

[@SoundVoltage]

@timothynewman6062 - Thanks, I'll check those out.

[@pierrephilip1682]

why do i find myself attracted to maths in modular music? thanks for being here and making these :)

[@TheBigLou13]

The concept of the relative primes is revelatory! Thank you!

[@louisaruth]

you have my name... i have never been so jealous of a handle before i guess it's our name now

[@TheBigLou13]

@@louisaruth You can change your name to anything you want. Even to Lou. My handle is not Lou - was taken already. And then there is your account address which is another alphanumeric identifier. Its confusing. Its KZbin.

[@synthdromes]

Nice video! Makes it very easy to grasp the concept! However I think your demo examples are wrong. What you depicted would be initially 10010100 (with 1 being the tom hits), but what I'm hearing is 10010010. This offset stays the same as you rotate the rhythm.

[@SoundVoltage]

Dang, I'll have to check on that. I might have used the wrong clip :( Thanks for the catch!

[@crossmod]

Glad someone else noticed it, thought I was going mad. I clapped out the rhythms before I heard them in the video and was really confused when they started playing.

[@flrn84791]

@@crossmod Same here haha

[@tiesergrote]

Yeah rhythm and visuals don't match in the demo section. The light changes according to the rhythm we're hearing though .. weird :)

[@aiksi5605]

Thank you for restoring my sanity

[@jennoscura2381]

I have a drum machine app on my phone. I programmed in the clap pattern from Ghana. I then added a four on the floor. They work really well together. I am going to have to try this out on my Behringer RD-6. I bet it would be even better on an RD-8 if use things like the conga and clave.

[@LondraCalibro9]

2 minutes in and subscribed - love working with euclidean sequencers.

[@benjiusofficial]

Looking up all these number theory concepts has finally leaked into my music learning videos.

[@ckline]

Great stuff, reminds me quite a bit of the "Moments of Symmetry" approach to microtonal scale construction developed by Erv Wilson. Definitely something worth looking into!

[@SoundVoltage]

Oh that is very interesting! And my next video was going to touch - even if only tangentially - on microtonal music. This could fit in very nicely - thank you!

[@jazmanaut]

Thank you for this. Very revealing!

[@omnidivergence9846]

This is the best educational channel for modular on KZbin. Another excellent video. 👍

[@alasdairmacintyre9383]

This is so awesome man. Its almost easier for me to think of Euclidean rythms in odd time because I'm already so used to thinking of dividing those notes into 2 or 3 groups

[@kirillstuk463]

Thank you so much for sharing such an interesting idea! Here's a lot of space to explore for me now.

[@degstep9968]

Your channel is very professional, it's a real pleasure to watch your content

[@SoundVoltage]

Thanks! I end up putting a lot of time into the videos so it's really nice to hear someone say that. :)

[@nStueckKuchn]

This was really helpful! And thanks for the reminder, I love my Torso T-1 but never really cared about rotating the rhythm. But I mainly sequence Melodic Patterns, I really have to sequence more drums and rotate more! 😄

[@TZB131]

Beautifully put, thanks for your strong explanation. For anyone interested in this type of thing, I would highly recommend checking out the live coding environment Tidal Cycles. The way it handles euclidian rhythms is similar to Godfried Toussaints shorthand notation which I find to be particularly elegant.

[@ModularExploration]

Great job! You hit just the right balance of Maths theory and practical examples - thanks!

[@Trojanspeak82]

Music is something really wonderful..

[@drowninreverb9067]

thank you for all the work you put in your videos

[@pernordin2641]

I just realized I think my old heros (mid 80:s) Marc Barreca and K. Leimar use Euclidian rythms, most notably in their early works. Also the Swedish composer Ralph Lundstens ”Andromatic” was not just the worlds first plolyphonic sequencer, it was a very elaborate Euclidian sequencer found in his second-to early works the early works where real old-school oscilator rcorded onto tape and then spiced and fitted back by sticky tape again or just ongoing oscillator tweeking recordings typical of pre-synths electonic music. But the the Andromatic was buildt for him by a Finnish physicist and it was a 10 step (!) sequencer that could be devided into sub divisions in very intricate ways. Now housed at the Swedish Museum of Musical History. I think it is most prominantly showcased in his early work ”Erik XIV” and the work at the same time.

[@SoundVoltage]

Oh, that's very interesting. I'll look at Marc Barreca, but K. Leimar has always been a hidden gem IMO, I have a vinyl copy of his 1980 "Closed System Potentials" that I'm very proud to have in my collection.

[@pernordin2641]

@@SoundVoltage K.Leimar and Marc Barreca where bound brothers from the start, both their own works and I do believe (I have the albume but not at hand to check) ”Savant” was a cooperative work? Or no? Savant ”Artificial Dance” / ”Shadow in deceit”/”knowledge and action”/etc,etc an absolute precurser to Eno / Harold Budd ”Ambient: My Life in the Bush of Chosts” and ”Stationary Dance” stands there both along with ”Eno/Budd” but also Eno-Moebious.Roedelis /cluster ”After the Heat”. And Marcs ”Music Works for Industry” (not on LP but released - at least first - on Cassette which I have) was a mind-opener and yes, K. Leimars ”Closed System Potentials” and his ”Imposed Order” where just ”wow”… Both where mind expanding and so many decades later still remain a great inspiration. I never try to copy my heros, but I draw from them endlessly inspiration. And most of the time, you can’t hear it, which is why they are great inspirations: ”Do your thing… here are some hints on how we do our own thing”… I am not a huge fan of either of their later works (with some exceptions), but the stuff they did back in the 80:s or so where absolutely fabulous… groundbreaking. If Eno claims he has never heard or was inspired by Leimar/Barreca I would be dumbfolded. Grammy Award worthy.

[@Noise-Conductor]

Great breakdown!

[@justinhowellrocks]

This is a great video. The presentation style is really clean and well put together. One piece of criticism I have is that the rhythm seems to be misrepresented during the Demos section. The rhythm that we see is On-Off-Off-On-Off-On-Off-Off Whereas what we're hearing is On-Off-Off-On-Off-Off-On-Off Feel free to correct me if I'm being a dumb-dumb, however.

[@bltrucker]

came here to say the same thing. it's definitely off.

[@zayneupton1043]

You are correct.

[@kaliyuga6613]

Well explained! I'm gonna have a go.

[@JohnBullfrost]

Thank you! Super nice to listen and write down with plumbago and a pad.

[@kallethoren]

I feel like the graphics don’t match up with the sound? In the first audible example, if the clap beat is considered the first beat of the cycle, I hear a rhythm where beats 1, 4, and 7 are accentuated, but the graphic shows beat 1, 4, 6 being accentuated. Have I misunderstood something?

[@gnuPirate]

This is in my watch SOON playlist. Got some study to do, but I love this stuff, keep it going!

[@al.cavalu]

I'm watching it for the 2nd time now...

[@ampspedalspickups]

Great video!

[@DrMarlowski]

Hey man! Cool youtube channel. I randomly stumbled upon this video today. I love the mathy and techy side of music. Subscribed!

[@HeadbangersLoungeandLaundry]

I’m just learning about synthesizer music and found your video fascinating.

[@jedgould5531]

Ofc it’s a hassle to risk YT take downs forcing re-edits. But for short segments illustrative of a Brubeck or Zappa time signature, you can clearly play it 2-3 times, even from a video. In the case of unusual time signatures, I submit it’s pointless for it to go by just once, otherwise where’s the ‘one?’ [It may place it in better perspective to consider YT’s primary take down objective is avoiding people going to YOUR content instead of paid] YT seems to recognize using short examples to aid understanding are essential. Nice job explaining Euclid’s place in music. The geometric illustrations were helpful. Also, it’s much easier to follow you when you avoid breaking your train of thought (at 13:13 it’s in text). Unless you do not mind troubling people to rewind to catch up. Some viewers can read while listening; I can’t.

[@OctoberMusicIsLife]

that was very interesting.

[@INVICTOR]

very educational! love how you simplified the math part :) suscribed!

[@TRDRT]

Really handy explanation, thanks!

[@holytaco.]

SUPER underrated channel and video, you explained it very well, the art of the illustrations is very clean and understandable and you introduce the topic step by step. I guess this is too niche :/

[@SoundVoltage]

Thanks! It is definitely hard to draw much attention, especially since I'm not doing gear reviews, etc. But from your lips to the KZbin god's ears. :) This is my best performing video so far and I've added 350 subscribers in the last couple of days - maybe this is a sign of things to come

[@kgwilso]

This was SO helpful, thank you!

[@Nicole-pt4bx]

as an ambient music producer I had to stop and comment how pleasant and unobstructing your background sound texture is c:

[@SoundVoltage]

Thank you, that's really nice of you to say!

[@bradon2318]

great video I learned a lot.

[@0xSLN]

Awesome presentation! Thank you for the unique perspective

[@solongyouth]

this was great, thanks!

[@moloch808]

glad you're back!

[@SoundVoltage]

I didn't go anywhere :) I started a new job and these videos take a while to make.

[@vanglock]

At 16:49, you meant "Otskok," which translates to "jump." Great video, by the way!

[@SpikesStudio3]

Cheers for the excellent explanation. Really enjoyed that. Enlightening.👍

[@wallyh.aguilar9593]

you’re videos are great!!!! thank you

[@FelipeTellez]

I love how you are going to the source and discussing the original paper on euclidean rhythms. You make it very clear! I wonder if you might be interested in doing something similar with Curtis Roads' Pulsar Synthesis paper ;) WINKKKKKKK

[@SoundVoltage]

I really enjoyed "Microsounds". It looks like maybe there's some Pulsar stuff done in Supercollider. I'll give it a thought. :)

[@FelipeTellez]

⁠there's a new module out that explores pulsar synthesis. There is also an algorithm in the Disting that does it. Perhaps a supercollider patch for breakdown and implementation in modular? Would love to see your take on it. I also like how you are going back to Chowning for FM. Killer stuff m8, keep it up😊

[@SoundVoltage]

Ooo, I'll look for that module.

[@FelipeTellez]

@@SoundVoltage it's called Plume

[@SoundVoltage]

@@FelipeTellez Ordered :) Thanks!

[@unduloid]

That chord playing constantly in the background makes things a bit hard to follow sometimes..

[@tomwells4899]

Cool video I like the theory intellectually stimulating and very interesting indeed When I was in Poland I was at a music festival in Lublin and heard some amazing rhythms. I don't know the technical name for it but it was what I think of as progressive. The rhythm had no end and progressed something like classical music but with a definite beat and with ethnic eastern instruments. It was really cool at night the locals in the central area where I was staying had electronic versions of the same rhythmic pattern. Really cool and I really enjoyed filling in to the music with Mc puctuation and beatbox beats . Thanks Lublin you really made a difference and I liked the industrial noise that continued into the Ukraine from the cars and I really liked Lviv. Peace.

[@hoodwinkedDaDon]

yuuuuup love how beautiful you made it, nice you're a great educator

[@myrthegreenfield2281]

Oddly,” I only see an advertisement now, if thats euclidian, no idea”

[@myrthegreenfield2281]

“Watch later”

[@SoundVoltage]

Was YT not showing the video? Just an ad? That's weird. It is playing for me at least. Definitely watch it later if you get a chance. :)

[@J_Carter]

omg...brilliant explanation!! I'm only 6 minutes into it and I'm already grateful! Thank you so much. I have been on a quest to understand Euclidean rhythms and I finally get them. Can you place clear "FIXED!" comment somewhere if/when you post a corrected video? Just read the helpful post and your reply to @RomanWollenhaupt re. mismatch of rhythms and visuals. My shaky new knowledge could collapse under any confusing examples 😅

[@JohnLRice]

Excellent video on Euclidean Rhythms! As a drummer/percussionist and modular synthesist a lot of this was already familiar to me but it's always good to get a refresher and to also learn a couple new things along the way. 👏😎👍 (I noticed your video on a Synthtopia posting) One bit of constructive criticism I might humbly offer is that you might rethink the way you are using the background music/pad/drone as it became distracting and then annoying to me after a while, for instance I didn't really notice until the later half or last third of the video. Reviewing it now I realize that what you were using in the first half worked fine for me but it was that sustained chord at the end, especially during the musical example of rhythms that I didn't care for. I think if you were to use the light background music more dynamically throughout by leaving it on during general explanations but dropping it out completely when you want to summarize or drive home a point and especially anytime you play a rhythm example it would have been more effective?

[@vebgnx4513]

dont agree, keep the drone sir

[@HenricWallmark]

Super clear and useful!!!!! Thanks.

[@ErixSamson]

fantastic presentation.

[@bluetone11]

Only creative genius is not smart enough to bother with writing down the settings! Really interesting video friend.

[@SoundVoltage]

Thanks so much! But you know how it is, you start down an interesting path and forgot how you got there. :) Modular is filled with moments like that...

[@DarkMetaOFFICIAL]

wow, very cool video man! and congrats on the views u got goin here

[@johnchesters81]

Great video. Can you do a similar deep dive into polyrhythms & polymeters?

[@LeoPerantoni]

Super cool, thanks for sharing!!!

[@Alandpope]

Thank you for all your effort! I have been looking out for Eric Bjorklund's paper which was so influential. Apparently its name is "A metric for measuring the evenness of timing system rep-rate patterns". Do you happen to have the paper? or does anyone knows where I can download it. I don't seem to find it anywhere. Thank you and to anyone assisting us in overcoming this hurdle.

[@auedpo]

What a great video! I've been fascinated by euclidean rhythms since discovering Toussaint's book in college. I really enjoyed your delivery and the points that you make about modular noodling vs structure. That is something I see to in the rise of 'ambient music makers'. Its a lot of beautiful sound design, but often the underlying rhythm is just a 4/4 groove and I feel like a huge opportunity is is missed. By the way, what module is that with the Santa Cruz blue screaming hand?

[@SoundVoltage]

Glad you enjoyed it! That isn't a module, though, it's just a blank panel to fill in the space -- but I like something other than just a blank black panel sometimes. :)

[@cristianruiz2509]

Gracias !

[@degstep9968]

That’s very cool!! Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge 👍

[@benoftroy]

really awesome. thanks for this vid!

[@tuhla4ka]

Cool! Nice presentation and very informative. Just a minor correction - Aksak is a Turkish word and doesn't means anything in Bulgarian.

[@SoundVoltage]

Thanks, it's correct in the slides, but I obviously flubbed it when I was writing the script. :(

[@kaganozdemir4332]

​@@SoundVoltageit means something like syncopated in turkish.

[@ThatDudeLarzFoo-ah]

Made it all the way through the video in E(5, 4, 1,) Took notes. My phone died. My screen was rotated. Lol thanks for the break down. It is helpful for me to Lots of associations I can mentally use to assign to the concepts and functions of something’s structure, in order for me to effectively tap into my memory banks and apply / understand. Great system here. Thanks so much. Question: Are Eucalyptus trees related in any part of the Euclidian models here? How about Eclairs?

[@els1f]

17:00 I'd like to add Primus' song Eleven to that list😋

[@stephencacclin7310]

10-step pattern: SAMÁI TAQUÍL

[@tonymarrison]

Nicely explained :)

[@frien_d]

IDK how much of "discovery" it is. sounds to me more like an invention. The invention of an algorithm and a notation to summarize odd patterns.

[@domino-mao8912]

Hi, strange the rotation is counter-clockwise, because most euclidean sequencer softwares consider "rotation" as +1 clockwise (instead). Nice and interesting video, however, thanks a lot!

[@walrtbstudios5430]

“Modular is an exercise in problem solving”- every modulation artiste knows this, but none of my non-modular friends get it at all…

[@yehabon]

pam's new workout baby ohhh yeah

[@13opacus]

The solea in flamenco is in twelve steps but divided up to 33222.

[@gielstarmusic]

Very inspiring!

[@tomaa3522]

The niche I was born for

[@anotherstarwarsvictim]

Take 5 by Paul Desmond... you are welcome.

[@earnestgildon2704]

I.. think.. I .. love.. you ..! 🤯

[@SoundVoltage]

Quiet, my wife will hear! :)

[@danyelnicholas]

16:19 it is actually not Arabic but Turkish (Osmanli), spelled yürük semâ‘î (يورك سماعي, ) Arabic musicians might give you bizarre transliterations.

[@MitchGurowitz]

Brilliant, Great explanation! I just turned 60 and man, do I wish I had this in 7th grade. (or you as my Math teacher) Applied math is something my brain can easily wrap around, but if no application is demonstrated, my ADD takes over and I think about what module I want to buy next. Lol I really appreciate this, being around playing music for 52 years, much of this is second nature in my head, but I couldn’t ever explain why. Thanks!!!

[@SoundVoltage]

Wow, thanks so much!

[@fotgjengeren]

I enjoyed being introduced to Euclidian rhythms, but some things seem overly simplified. A beginner at music probably wouldn’t watch this because it’s not a beginner topic, so feels like some explanations are long-winded and I was waiting impatiently to get to the point 😂

[@ernopolo]

Interesting topic and nice intention but the sounding examples from around 10:00 (demos) is incorrect. What we hear (3-3-2) is actually not corresponding to the visualisation. (3-2-3)

[@grooveslap]

Euclidean rhythm is hype.

[@shadowgauge5852]

Technically you didn't cover the aspect of evening the actual intervals of time so each tick is the same distance away from the last, and still add up to the length of time in question.

[@kostantinosmag2986]

Great…..

[@dr.strangevelo6031]

👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏

[@starkid9736]

THX 4 this u helped!!!

[@jongriffin2608]

Maybe I’m missing something but do you think we might say that what Euclidean is to rhythm, modal scales are to melody?

[@ckline]

the rotation aspect is analogous to the modal scales but the overall theory would be more analogous to moments of symmetry scales, which includes modal stuff, but is expanded to describe all pitch sets (not just 12-equal/meantone) in a maximally-even way, similar to the euclidean rhythm distribution in this video, but listing out large and small steps instead of note on/off

[@ianbrown3304]

@@ckline So that's a maybe then

[@MeltdownIsland]

Radiohead has a song called 15 step

[@ianbrown3304]

Is that what the mean by 'math rock'?

[@kostantinosmag2986]

Great one nice!!!!!!!!!! :)

[@SoundVoltage]

Thanks!!

[@thomnewton9024]

Is the background music the Norns Awake script?

[@SoundVoltage]

Nope! Usually I make a music bed special for each video but this time I got behind so I just grabbed something nice off my digital recorder SD card. :)

[@liminalsequence]

I found home. Edit: I always hated math and was bad at it, come time to growing a passion for music, I became interested in math. And they both begin with the letter 'M'. Now I'm interested in English. F*cccckkkkkkkkk.

[@SoundVoltage]

The only reason you hated math is that it was explained badly. :) Math is just patterns, structure. It describes every process in the universe. We'll explore it together - welcome aboard. :)

[@Onionbaron]

Does Euklidian transform to binary in any understandable way? I'm totally lost here, but I think this makes sense..

[@shadowgauge5852]

1st convert the BPM of the chosen pattern into millaseconds.. a 4x4 riddem at 120 bpm converted to 11/16... because 11/16 at 120 bpm doesn't line up at 120 bpm, off the top of my head is I wanna say 87.1 bpm is the actual BPM of an 11/16 riddem at 120 BPM, if you trying for a symmetrical 11/16 beat and not an A-Symmetrical pattern... And I just heard a light bulb turn on.. =D

[@ianbrown3304]

My head is beating with an asymetrical rhythm just thing about this. This is bad and strangely funky.

[@greatgrandpabeebe2736]

🖖✨👾

[@thewildclaw]

Thank you! This helps. I’ve come up with a few patches using Disting for Euclidean rhythms but I wasn’t 100% on what I was doing lol. Here’s one of my first time trying it on my 5 module rack 😅 kzbin.info/www/bejne/kJ3Fl4pnjbqZfqcsi=XV0THMHJqri72P9g

[@rybotekk]

😀

[@todoesmentira5866]

"spanish" tango? really? if that is on the original paper, it alone takes away a lot of credibility from it

[@SoundVoltage]

That actually is in the original paper, and it includes a reference to the book "Authentic Conga Rhythms". I think in this case "Spanish Tango" is a name for a variation on the Tango. It's a good catch though, thanks!

[@meshuggner]

Konakol

[@SoundVoltage]

Interesting, I did not know that was the name for it! I will have to learn more, thanks!

[@shadowgauge5852]

I have a better, easier way to do this.

[@curioso....]

Thanks for this great lesson! 🦩🍹

[@SoundVoltage]

Glad you enjoyed it!