how to dance contratiempo (son cubano)

Son cubano is danced contratiempo, 2-3-4... 6-7-8. Instead of thinking about is as dancing "against" (contra) the "time" (tiempo), I find it more helpful to approach it as dancing WITH the music, namely the clave, drums, and bass. Here's how.
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00:00 What is contratiempo?
00:30 The tumbadora
01:50 The bass
03:07 The 3 side of the clave
04:14 The 2 side of the clave
05:20 Fundamentals of Cuban Son coming April 1'st

[@MessinaDance]

Son cubano is danced contratiempo, 2-3-4... 6-7-8. Instead of thinking about is as dancing "against" (contra) the "time" (tiempo), I find it more helpful to approach it as dancing WITH the music, namely the clave, drums, and bass. Here's how. For learn the Fundamentals of Son Cubano, April's addition to Casino Next Level, try a month for free: 👉 messinadance.com/casinonextlevel

[@joannec7841]

Black cat is so cute. Very useful explanation thank you 🙏 ❤

[@MessinaDance]

🙏 🐈‍⬛️

[@elinannestad5320]

I struggle with hearing what is in the music, the instruments and the beats, the different rhythms. Yet I love salsa, so I have a mission to understand, to hear and feel these things. This is a very good lesson, thank you.

[@MessinaDance]

I appreciate it 🙏 Hope it is helpful

[@aquilesml21]

Excellent explanation... I got it now, thank you.

[@MessinaDance]

I couldn't ask for more 🙌 Thanks for letting me know 🙏

[@fernandomarrerojr]

Thanks for the video .. seems like this style of dance is missing in the salsa scene over here

[@bailopinto]

But in music, "contratiempo" is the moment between two "tiempos". 1,2,3,4 are "tiempos" (beats) and 1 1/2 - 2 1/2 ... (1,5 - 2,5 - 3,5....) and so on are "contratiempo". Other thing is dancing on 1 or dancing on 2, where the break happens on the first beat or in the second beat.

[@MessinaDance]

There is a long list of terms that have different meanings when speaking to musicians vs dancers. On 1 and on 2 are line / "salsa" terminology, so I don't bother with those, but if you speak to Cuban dancers, specifically in the context of son, the contratiempo will mean 2 4 6 8 and dancing contratiempo will mean stepping 2 3 4... 6 7 8

[@bailopinto]

@@MessinaDance I think they call "Contratiempo" like "contra el tiempo fuerte" = against the strong beat. Strong (1,3 beats) weak (2,4 beats). So instead of stepping on the strong beat (1) , they start on the weak beat (2).

[@alejandroteran2981]

I work with cubans. They've never heard of dancing on one or on two. They don't mind about what happens on time two. Musically, what really matters is what happens on 4 and 8.

[@alejandroteran2981]

I'm a son and casino dancer. For me, changing the order of the steps to say you dance or one or on two doesn't make much difference musically. In the end you are stepping the same times.

[@bailopinto]

@@alejandroteran2981 it depends on the figure, they step first in 4/8 to do the classic Son step, but this is 2. The musically interest depends on song, dancer, moment…. There are a lot of interesting moments, not only the cu-cum part of conga on 4/8.

[@bigcirkus306]

A question - is Salsa on 2 and Son the same thing?

[@MessinaDance]

In timing and in form, both no. As opposed to a written explanation, I'd suggest taking a look at "son tradicional" and "on2 salsa" videos and compare.

[@yoanalexander]

Heyyy question that I can't get an answer to from anywhere! TL;DR: Why does on2 new york style feel different than son cubano? Aren't they both contratiempo? Basically I learned to dance a bit of son this year, and now I decided to give mambo on2 a try, since I heard many people refer to both with son as being contratiempo. Now I get completely why son is contratiempo, but I don't understand the deal about on2. Why do they count 123-567- just like casino? I feel the difference during the pause, it feels like it happens in a different place compared to both son and casino. What confused me even more was an old video of Eddie Torres explaining on2 style and doing precisely son, and not what they teach in the mambo class. Did it change in modern times and why? What's up with that, I feel dumb. Thanks for reading this!

[@Danceitup44]

The simplest answer is that on2 is felt as quick-quick-slow and son is felt as slow-quick-quick. It’s a different sensation against the music. On2 typically connects more with the slaps 2&6 where son connects heavily with the slow beats 4&8. They are similar and instructors with a son background will teach how to integrate son timing into on2 dancing, because it only requires taking your 5/1 early on 4/8 and slipping into the feel of slow-quick-quick. I’m not an expert, but that’s what I’ve learned from dancing both.

[@yoanalexander]

@@Danceitup44 thanks for your explanation! I am still putting the pieces of the puzzle in my head, as it seems that terminology isn't used the same everywhere. For example, I came to understand that on2, as it is modernly thought, is on counts 1,2,3-,5,6,7- with an emphasis on the 2 and 6, while mambo is more like son -,2,3,4,-,6,7,8. Is it really the case? Until now I thought that mambo is just an umbrella term for on2. Is there any modern salsa dance that uses the son counting? Is that mambo?

[@Danceitup44]

@@yoanalexandernowadays we call on-2 a Mambo because Eddie Torres and others popularized it that way. There isn’t a right answer, both are a Mambo. The feel of the song will dictate the style that makes sense. Son is often an elegant and flowing dance, and wouldn’t make sense is a fast staccato song. Similarly dancing Mambo when the Tumbao is emphasized on Conga doesn’t make sense (musically, you can do what you want though). Many schools don’t teach this because it’s really hard and intimidating to learn so many styles. And so you see people plowing through turn combos song after song. And the truth is, every Salsa song has a variety of musical styles inside it. For example the songs sometimes start slow with a Conga emphasis, so dancing Son could be appropriate. When the cowbell pops off in the Montuno, dancing Mambo style makes a lot more sense. Typically you also see a half-time feel section where Afro styles sneak in, and other sections with Pachanga, etc. It’s a rich and beautiful culture of dance, I think.

[@rolandsharp]

Thanks for teaching me contratiempo. One thing that I can't seem to grasp is why you sometimes step with the left foot on 2 and sometimes with the right foot on 2 going in the opposite direction. Is this something we change throughout the song or do we chose to step on two with right or left foot and keep that throughout the song? Is there a musical reason to choose one over the other? thanks

[@MessinaDance]

For me... and people LOVE to argue about this, I think it is good practice to be able to prepare to either side, with either foot, marking any side of the clave. Like being able to kick a soccer ball with either foot. If there is a way the song feels better, it's fine to have a preference, but I don't like being beholden to a particular timing convention where if the clave "changes" in a song, I suddenly feel uncomfortable.

[@rolandsharp]

@@MessinaDance right! Do you also do this when dancing casino or timba? Does it sometimes feel better to step with the right foot on 1 and the left foot on 5? Or to swap over when the clave changes.

[@jasonye_salsadancer]

@@rolandsharp No further comments other than this thanks though video tutorial is very helpful.

[@Dragon34th]

I still don't get it. Just step on the boom boom tomba if you're dancing one 1 or step on the snare if you're dancing on 2 ie NY Salsa and it's the same thing. That's how I've been taught. Cali and Cuban salsa are usually danced on 1. I come from NY Salsa which is on 2 and also Cali pachanga which is on 1 😊

[@MessinaDance]

If you have a rhythm convention that works for you for dancing on 1 or on , that is good. I would only add that if at any point you are stepping on the open tone of the drum on a son montuno tumba, 4 and 8, the count you are definitely *not* dancing on is on 1 ( 123 567) as the 4 and 8 would be pauses. Contratiempo is a specific count of 2 3 4... 6 7 8... Most, not all, "new york style" dancers will be deliberate about the 2 3... and 6 7... but give a lot of leeway as to where the other two steps go, often anywhere between 8-1 and 4-5.

[@StpSqncr]

More clear can not be for me

[@MessinaDance]

🙌🙏

[@airisanderson1924]

Y tú eres cubano? Yo espero que si 🤣🤣

[@MessinaDance]

🤷‍♂️