Mic Pre Coloration

[@NoirEtBlancVie]

You did a wonderful job with this. I don’t think I’ve ever seen as organized and comprehensive of a test, you’re truly a talent to knowing your audience, well done!

[@meistudiony]

Thank you so much! I really appreciate that!

[@djdanger9812]

FINALLY someone who knows how to compare pres!!!! From the analyser to the audio comparisons this is perfect. In a world of digital music so many of us are looking for colour and this is a comparison ive been looking for, for so long. Instant Sub for me. Keep up this content friend.

[@meistudiony]

Wow, thanks! This really means a lot to me. Didn't expect this video to get any traction... kind of a dry topic. Appreciate your support!

[@djdanger9812]

@@meistudiony Keep the content in-depth and nerd out on the details. Don't fall for the "Hollywood" approach like other channels and you will get followers that respect your content and opinions. Stay strong and keep building the channel mate.

[@meistudiony]

@@djdanger9812 appreciate it! Thanks again!

[@jamisonfrench]

Aye! This video is fantastic. The visuals and demos are 💯 . Thanks for sharing. Love seeing the frequency responses between the pres. 🔥 👌

[@meistudiony]

Thank you for checking it out!

[@thechrisricci]

It's subtle. I've done similar tests on electric guitar with different mic pres. The most flattering, I've found, is probably an API 312 or 512. They seem to accentuate the midrange frequencies and/or harmonics in a nice way. But, the pre is just one link in the signal path.

[@meistudiony]

I agree. I sometimes wonder what others are hearing when they say theres this night and day difference between “X” and “Y”. Is my hearing THAT bad that I dont notice it?

[@ryancrawford9894]

Probably the best preamp breakdown I’ve ever seen. One small correction: the Lola is a fully differential preamp. One op amp provides gain for the non-inverted signal, the other for the inverted, so it’s more a parallel configuration than series. This gives it more available current to drive the output transformer.

[@meistudiony]

Aw crap you're absolutely right! I even have that in my notes and said the wrong thing. Good catch! Thanks for checking out the vid!

[@ryancrawford9894]

@@meistudiony all good, just nerdy nitpicking :). Great work though, it’s not an easy topic to discuss concisely and objectively!

[@meistudiony]

@@ryancrawford9894 all good. I appreciate the call out on it. The last thing i wanna do is add to the confusion and misinformation out there. The more correct things can be the better.

[@nugznmugz]

Appreciate all the work you do!

[@meistudiony]

Appreciate you watching and commenting!!!

[@Cysquatch]

I just wanted to say I really appreciate the way you structure these videos and the obviously absurd amount of man hours you put in to each one. It's nice seeing somebody approaching this as electrical science and not just throwing out marketing nonsense about "mojo", "depth", "personality", etc. Funny enough, the MA1 and VC-1 were consistently the ones that made me open my eyes on blind listening. Not because they could do some funky stuff when driven, but the cleans actually really grabbed me. And the 1073 was my least favorite of the non-interface options almost across the board. Go figure. But, I agree with your point that these are all far more similar than they are different at their core, and are really just a choice of different hammers for driving different nails, as it were.

[@meistudiony]

Thanks for the kind words! Really appreciate it! Thanks for checking out the video!

[@BandrewScott]

That analysis of the JoeMeek preamp is hilarious. I’m going to have to finish the listening portion on my headphones ,but the info so far is OUTSTANDING!

[@meistudiony]

Thanks Bandrew, that means the world to me! And the joe meek is the weirdest pre ive ever used. I was happy to see my freq sweeps matched julian kraus’. Made me feel like i did it right! Lol

[@TheJTish]

I still say this is one of the coolest tech videos on youtube. I think this is my 10th time watching.. and I'm still picking things up LOL. Cheers from Bugtustle! Lots of new amps lately.. cool and rare stuff from late 40's early 50's (Kay, Danelectro, Gibson, National). Still not recording (at least anything serious).. but working towards lol

[@meistudiony]

Good to hear from ya! Shoot me some pics would love to see em!

[@CreativeMindsAudio]

That was by far the best shoot out video I’ve seen in a while! And mic pres none the less! You really know your stuff! I’ve always seen the high end ones as helpful for coloration and distortion, but otherwise it doesn’t matter because modern pres sound amazing anyway. I’ve love for you to take this one step further and compare the Apollo unison pres with the real thing with such detailed examples and sine sweeps and harmonic distortion. So many KZbinrs just do one or the other, imo you gotta do both! Great job! And it shows how it does make a difference in EQ, compression, and saturation. It would take a lot of work to replicate all of that in the box with individual plugins.

[@meistudiony]

Thanks for the comment! Really appreciate it! Unfortunately I sold the Apollo I had about 2 months ago. Maybe i can pick up another one for cheap on the used market, but yeah, would be a pretty cool comparison test. I did a video with their sphere mic and a bunch of the originals and some really good clones (was my first video so its a bit rough lol) Might be time to revisit that one too.

[@CreativeMindsAudio]

@@meistudiony oh very cool! If you do get another Apollo please get the x series vs an older one 😂. Those old ones were not as good. I did some basic shoot outs myself could hear a difference but not by much. I never got into the detail of saturation much though.

[@meistudiony]

​@@CreativeMindsAudio I have a friend that just got a couple of X series... perhaps i can borrow one for a day or two. Thanks for the suggestion.

[@CreativeMindsAudio]

@@meistudiony hell yeah!

[@TheJTish]

luv these vids. the bode plots and spectral views interest me greatly.. I love things that bring those sweet harmonics like the tubes do. Thanks, Pags!

[@meistudiony]

Hey its been a min! How are things going?!

[@LoveRaptor]

Great video. I used to lend way more credence to preamp choice but the longer I've been doing this the more I've come to find that it mostly doesn't make a big enough impact for me to spend a lot of time thinking about it. Mic choice or moving a microphone an inch is going to have a much bigger impact on the recorded sound than preamp choice 9 out of 10 times, at least in my experience. I love my APIs and my Neves but I also love my UA Apollo preamps which are clean as a whistle! Most of the time when I'm in a studio that has a big desk with lots of preamps I'll now choose to run almost exclusively through those rather than patching off-board pres just for the convenience factor.

[@meistudiony]

Yeah, after doing this, im kinda with ya on that. Thanks for checkin it out!

[@ssserotonin1373]

Hey bro I know you did a video on impedance before and I watched it forever ago but I'm still lost on this in practice so I have a question if you don't mind which also might help others too, Thinking about the tnt dm2 inline pre capable of 50Ω, 200Ω, 360Ω, 1.5kΩ, 2.7kΩ, 6.8kΩ, 100kΩ or 10MΩ and 15db or 30db gain. the mic is se v7 (dynamic) 300 Ohms SSL 2 is the interface and pre. Im loving my tone with it raw no inline but I just ordered this inline because I feel as though I am pretty much on the dot before the last dot for gain. Im more soft spoken when I project. That being said it's great tone but the noise gets rather distracting at times and I feel it may lack power in a sense with how it takes it. Usually playing with the headphone level to mitigate. Im noticing the SSL 2 has specs for mic inputs at 1.2 k-ohm. In theory wouldn't I be better off using that 15db plus and slight riding the gain on the ssl 2 while also switching the inline pre to the 2.7kΩ option as that's closer to the 10x theory ?

[@meistudiony]

The 10x theory is maybe a little overkill. Generally 4x will get you to the point of diminishing returns. (so for you 1200 which is what you got!) That being said, 1.2k is kinda on the low side for a modern pre. (the old neves only had max of the same 1.2k, but, was also a time when they were still trying to match impedance everywhere) Using the inline will certainly help (even at the +15dB) to get you away from the noise of the pre (and from my experience with the SSL2, its got a bit of noise when you get up there with the gain, and even more so if you engage the 4k button). The added noise from the inline is probably less than the noise fo running the SSL open, so you should be a net higher gain with lower noise. (WIN WIN) Give the mic some higher impedance and it MIGHT fill out the bottom a little more... probably not noticable on a voice unless youre a bass or baritone. Even if the interface had 3k or so, you're MAYBE going to get another .5 to 1 db in the BOTTOM end only. The top end doesnt really get effected unless you're REALLY low on the impedace, and then the whole thing just drops, but im talkin like down in like sub 300 ohm territory.

[@ssserotonin1373]

@@meistudiony Awesome thanks so much for taking the time to drop that knowledge bomb 💯

[@fermendozadrums]

I love Daking and Trident 80b on my drums, specialy the sparkle on the overheads from the Daking and the punch on snare and bass drum, the Trident sound masive on toms! :D NEVE 88RLB on overheads sound great as well, ohhh and one more thing! I have the Warm Audio WA412 and ( in my opinion) they sound a bit fatter and with more air than api , very very close tough... :)

[@meistudiony]

Honestly, I think the WA412 sounds better than the API as well at a fraction of the price. Thanks for checking the video out!

[@fermendozadrums]

@@meistudiony thank you for such detailed video! I Really appreciate it! 👍

[@redcabinacoustic-official]

OMG Pags! Maybe the weirdest comment you've gotten, but I need to watch this tomorrow. Just got back from the studio, (1:23am), and too tired to really pay attention. Can't wait to watch. Thanks in advance - peace.

[@meistudiony]

Its long and boring... the way an analytical video should be hahahah!

[@redcabinacoustic-official]

@@meistudiony Long and Boring? Maybe I am doing this right . . . Finished the vid today, very nice info, especially for someone who does not have any "boutique" pre-amps. I didn't know what else to call them, no bias intended. I have an older 32/8/2 Soundcraft and use the stock pre-amps that feed my various interfaces that are ganged via ADAT. I think I'll e-mail some questions . . . Thanks for all you hard work!

[@meistudiony]

@@redcabinacoustic-official A lot of people hear a lot of things. When I listen i kind of think about the context of a mix and I kind of dont feel that you could go wrong with anything here (except maybe the joe meek... esp if you set it wrong). Are there little subtleties? Yeah of course. Are they negated the instant you reach for an EQ? (either a plugin or the EQ on the board) I kind of think so. As long as the signal isn't noisy and not dramatically rolled off in any direction... you're golden! Soundcraft made great stuff. Is it an MH, GB, LX? I used to do repairs on them 20 some odd years ago. The pres in there are probably more than adequate for most things. If you have direct outs per channel, that would be a beast. You'd just need some good line in interfaces and you're rockin a great setup. With the onboard eq (on just about any model) you can make the argument that the channel strip goes above and beyond any of these pres without EQ's.

[@jesserios7333]

I use the Warm Audio WA73-EQ for bass and vocals and WA-412 for guitars and drums...

[@meistudiony]

Cant go wrong w either of those. Ive had my eye on the warm ampex clone for a while… might be time to retire the joe meek and replace it with that.

[@jesserios7333]

@@meistudiony all the reviews on that are positive, have never tried myself.

[@ReinerDamisch]

If you also analyze what kind of overtones are added, you may find that the 610 AND the Neve are adding even (octave above) and API starts at odd ones, when overdriven. That makes different color. It is hard to get these even harmonics with plugins. But there are a few that can.

[@meistudiony]

Yes, and thats another rabbit hole as well. The circuit topology will certainly cause this (tube tech going even order and solid state usually if not always going odd order). The harmonics when high enough level, essentially are these overtones. We tested a 1k sine wave, which the main spike is in the examples and the harmonics being the overtones either an even or odd (or both) intervals from the fundamental. Thanks for checking it out!

[@ItsMetabtw]

I wonder if that VC1 has a different pre than my VC6Q? I don’t remember mine sounding quite like that. I used to use it on electric guitars until I got the API channel strip. I might have to plug it in for old times sake

[@meistudiony]

The VC6Q didnt have the input transformer if memory serves and didn't have the "enhance", instead, giving way to a (IMO) more useful 3 band eq. Very similar vibe though.

[@ItsMetabtw]

@@meistudiony yeah that sounds right. I remember reading about it being in sorta the middle of the Joe meek range. Either way, it served me well for a few years until I could afford some of the other things I really wanted like API and Neve. I might pull it apart and see if I can dress it a bit better and lower the noise floor. It was okay on distorted guitars if I used a gate, but man did it come with some hiss

[@DapperDanLovesYou]

Oh man! I'm gonna have to set some time aside to watch this, but I'm excited to hear where this all goes! Cheers :)

[@meistudiony]

appreciate it! I was surprised at just how similar they each sounded when being used at "normal" levels... they get a little more interesting when you start to drive them a bit.

[@DapperDanLovesYou]

@@meistudiony I personally use the Cranborne Camden EC1 (and mostly use it for its clean tone and additional features). However, the Tube Circuit Emulation is actually quite fun in certain situations!

[@surgemistyuk7813]

Ooooooooo excellent video, thank you!

[@meistudiony]

Thanks for checking it out! Appreciate it!

[@joevegna]

Great stuff. Thanks!

[@meistudiony]

Thanks for checking it out! Appreciate you!

[@americatunedright1211]

Great video! The volt was the worst for me and focusrite did much better for having the same chip, maybe the clock or converter chip was better. Avid gets a bad rap from the general public but it’s consistent with good information. If I had to invest for color the API surprisingly is top for me here, with JoeMeek being second. I personally use Grace pres which I don’t see any of these replacing but if I were to expand I’ll have some good ideas here. Thanks for the info and history. 🙏

[@meistudiony]

Chips different in the volt and scarlet. The SSL2 and Scarlett are the same chip. (hope i didnt screw that up in the video lol) Without the voicing set (vintage or whatever) they're actually darn close (and cheap lol). Grace makes some REALLY nice stuff! Thanks for checking out the video! Appreciate it!

[@americatunedright1211]

@@meistudiony no, that’s my error. The volt sucks😬. The SSL slipped by my radar, if the cost of focus and ssl the same then it comes down to features I think. Maybe ssl was slightly not noticeable against the focus now that I think about it, I am an SSL fan of the analog channel strip when available at studios so one would think I’ll be biased. New subscriber, looking forward for more.

[@ronmoes42]

As you've said, it becomes obvious when you play the synth clips, in that deparment I thought the API an NEVE sounded best. different but each have a great tone.

[@meistudiony]

Thats exactly why i picked the synth. The full frequency bandwidth makes it a lot easer to hear than just a voice or something. Thanks for checkin out the video! Appreciate it!

[@zaidyusoff126]

love the video...Thanks for it!

[@meistudiony]

Thanks for checking it out! Appreciate it!

[@redcabinacoustic-official]

Thanks!

[@meistudiony]

I am beyond humbled. Thank you so much! You really didn't need to do that. It is immensely appreciated!

[@jamescassidy4045]

Question. Were you actually repeating that spoken word line for each pass, or were you mixing a speaker, or something playing back the same take?

[@meistudiony]

Unfortunately i only have a dual mic splitter so i had to say that line like 25 times. I tried to keep it as even as possible.

[@jamescassidy4045]

@@meistudiony Haha, dude, I almost thought you just mic'd a speaker, because it sounded like it was the same take just about lol. Good job!

[@hybrid.monkey]

what are those analyzers? are they plugins?

[@meistudiony]

Voxengo Span Plus, and plugin doctor. I used to use something called metric halo spectrafoo, but they haven't updated it in like 10 years. (was even better than those two IMO). Thanks for checkin out the vid!

[@hybrid.monkey]

@@meistudiony thanks for your reply, great video!!