Microtech Combat Troodon Gen III vs. Vespa Big Dragon Clone

[@GigiEDC]

Other differences that I’ve found - Blade thickness: 3.25mm (Vespa), and 3.16mm (Microtech) when measured from the center of the bottom blade hole. Handle length: 5.477”/139.13mm (Vespa) and 5.408”/137.35mm (Microtech) Handle materials: 7075 (Vespa) and 6061 (Microtech) Handle width at the bottom: 29.50mm (Vespa) and 28.72mm (Microtech) Handle width at the top: 32.7mm (Vespa) and 31.70 (Microtech) Weight: 151.4g (Vespa) and 144.1g (Microtech) All other measurements appear to be the same.

[@-C-E-L-L-]

Vespa using a 7000 series aluminum while the microtech using a 6000 series aluminum is kinda nuts

[@GigiEDC]

@@-C-E-L-L-I think Microtech got the memo and started using 7075 thankfully. You can really tell the difference after using each for a few weeks. Far less dings on the 7075. Take care!

[@Skylark427]

I believe the reason they use 7075 aluminum is because they do not use titanium fasteners like Microtech does. With zinc being 7075s primary alloying enement, it will slow the corrosion between the aluminum and stainless/non stainless fasteners(slow, not stop). Titanium doesn't have the same reaction to aluminum, hence why 7075 isn't needed for Microtech. That's just my honest opinion.

[@Skylark427]

The other thing I thought I'd mention, from the composition sheets I have seen for both Vespa and Green Thorn, it points to them using YJ01-V1, which is a sprayform version of M390. It isn't a bad steel at all, but does lack the performance of true powder metallugry M390. It could also help explain why it is half the price roughly.

[@Bellabear88]

Great videos. Thank you for the detail and effort you put into them Answered a lot of questions I had about the Vespas.

[@GigiEDC]

Thank you very much!

[@awoodfinz]

Also keep up the good work, my man. This is great content for us knife enthusiasts.

[@GigiEDC]

Thank you brother!

[@greebuh]

The fuller groove isn't centered on the real one. And the Vespa is more seamless where the two halves come together.

[@GigiEDC]

Spot on. I forgot to mention that but the seam on the Vespa is much tighter. Thank you for the comment!

[@Tabrox5]

Doing the lords work. Great review!

[@GigiEDC]

Thank you!!

[@Tabrox5]

@@GigiEDC I ordered one from aliexpress and my shipping is saying may 31 delivery 😔

[@GigiEDC]

@@Tabrox5it will arrive much quicker than that :) mine said May too, it showed up in a week.

[@Tabrox5]

@@GigiEDC you were right! I got it already. I've handled one of the new CT's and the action on this vespa is a bit rougher. Any tips on how to make it smoother / deploy like the new gen 3's?

[@GigiEDC]

I hate to hear that man! I would try taking it apart, using air duster to clean out everything and then with a cotton swap, apply a thin layer of gun CPL to all internals. Rem Oil is great as well. If that doesn’t work, you can always message the seller. Let me know if you need more help - sorry for the late reply!

[@marathonmedranoruiz]

where can find the vespa product since time ago is dificult to see

[@GigiEDC]

Hey my friend, I’ll add the link below. The non-serrated dagger edge is hard to come by at the moment but there should be more available in the near future. “China High-End EDC” is the store I typically use on DHgate or AliExpress but there are others that sell Vespa products. Be aware of the $50 Gen IIIs for sell, they’re good as well but they aren’t what’s in this video. a.aliexpress.com/_mruwLXE

[@justinmurray4652]

​@@GigiEDC Which ali store has the good $50 dollar gen 3 troodon clones?

[@GigiEDC]

@@justinmurray4652 I personally don’t have experience with the $50 model but I’ve heard good things about them. I plan to get one soon to compare them. “HIGHEST ROOM store” seems to have good reviews after checking them out. Take care!

[@yuriistetsenko5948]

From Russia with love! ❤ I managed to get my hands on an original Combat Troodon Gen 3, although I won't tell you how, of course. This knife is a beast! Very smooth action and, oh yeah, it doesn't try to eat my finger. Dual Fuel Drive, baby! 🤘 PS: The names MT gives to their developments are epic in themselves. 😁

[@GigiEDC]

Thank you for your comment my friend! Yes the Gen III Combat Troodon has grown on me although I don’t use it much. I’m looking forward to buying the zero-blade play models. That’s great you found on in Russia, I know it’s not easy right now. Much love from the USA. You have a beautiful country, I spent a summer there. Wonderful people)

[@yuriistetsenko5948]

@@GigiEDCIt was never easy. 😁 If you mean sanctions, they have nothing to do with it, Russian stores still sell knives of European and American manufacture. They are just more expensive than before. Russian law prohibits automatic knives with a blade longer than 90mm, but hey, our knife laws are, oddly enough, some of the most lenient in the world! After all, even in America, as far as I know, there are places where Ultratech and Launch are only a dream. Prohibited knives are sold in our country by private individuals who somehow bring them through customs. You can buy and keep a prohibited knife at home, but you should not walk around with it on the street! If our cops catch you with such a knife, they will confiscate it, and they can also fine you, although the fine is small. Parting with a knife is much more offensive than getting a fine! Thank you for your kind words! ❤ When this is all over, come visit us again. I hope to visit the USA someday. I have already made a list of places that I will visit first. The Grand Canyon is first on this list. 👌

[@matthiascarroll1924]

Is that white lithium grease inside both? Curious if that’s stock or something you add.

[@GigiEDC]

Yes! The Microtech came with it and I added it to the Vespa. I add it to all my OTFs.

[@sprinkleddonuts6094]

On the Vespa how does it hold an edge? And how is it to sharpen? Most if these clones, you can’t sharpen because it is too soft.

[@GigiEDC]

I’d say the Vespa is really comparable to the genuine model actually. I haven’t sharpened my genuine M390MK Gen III but I have sharpened my M390 Gen II and other M390 knives many times. They’re both tough to sharpen and I can’t really say if one is softer than the other. Now, every other clone besides Vespa that I’ve had has soft steel that’s easy to sharpen, takes a sharp edge but dulls very quickly (HiFinder, etc). Vespa seems to actually use the steel advertised and they do a good job with their heat treat, there are some independent tests that compare them. I saw one on Reddit fairly recently. I hope this helps!

[@keeperoftruth5951]

Maybe 5 years ago but most clones that cost over $40 are using quality steel. The twilight years of the American knife manufacturing sector as a whole is not looking good. Wish it wasn't the case but we got beat in our game and we let it happen

[@GigiEDC]

Unfortunately I think you’re right. Even $40 clones are using 7075 aluminum for the body compared to 6061 used by many American makers. I’ve dropped clones and genuine MTs, for example, and it’s absolutely obvious that the aluminum is better quality on the clones. There’s still a lot of clones out there that use poor quality steel but there’s plenty that don’t. People assume they’re all pot metal but it’s just as easy to obtain M390 or other higher quality steels in China. It really is impressive what they do for the price. My Vespa Scarab M390 was $170, my genuine Scarab was $600. I sold my genuine Scarab after getting the Vespa.

[@Skylark427]

@GigiEDC I have seen the composition on the Vespa models, it's not actually M390. Its YJ01-V1, the sprayform version of M390. The big give away is the high levels of additional metals that come from using higher amounts of recycled steel(nickel is the big one, Bohler won't allow .3% or over), and the missing nitrogen addition that is added by Bohler. YJ01-V1 is still a great steel, don't get me wrong, but it lacks the strength and edge stability of true powder metal M390/20CV/204P(much larger carbide and grain size). At more acute edge angles, it's much more noticeable during sharpening. The other thing, Microtech does now use 7075 in many of it's models. But the big reason it didn't need to is because of the titanium fasteners, Vespa uses stainless/coated fasteners. The iron in those alloys will rot 6061 faster than 7075, but will still rot 7075 over time. The other thing you mentioned which I find odd, both of my Gen III CTs have zero forward and back play, this seems to be the case with most of them, talking with people on reddit. Side to side is less than a milimeter of play. I wonder if you got one that slipped past quality control. A few people had on reddit and Microtech fixed the issue for them.

[@АлександрАртеменко-к9з]

This Vespa is great. I have one, and very enjoy it. This is only way to have combat troodon in Russia, because this knife is forbidden in out country. I have original Microtech Ultratech, but always wanted to have combat troodon dagger with 1 serrated edge.

[@GigiEDC]

I understand it’s difficult to get one in Russia at the moment. I pray that we’ll have peace soon so I can buy more Daggerrs and you can buy more Microtechs. Your country is amazing, I visited there and the people were so friendly. I hope to return one day. Take care)

[@Forgoten214]

Thank you for this i have a real gen 3 from nc blade was wondering what the clones were like. I'm thinking of getting a vespa but not sure what model to get yet.

[@GigiEDC]

Thanks for your comment! The Gen III Vespa is great, you can’t go wrong with it. My favorite is the Vespa Scarab though. Both have tighter lock ups than my genuine MTs.

[@awoodfinz]

we need link to get 1 bro

[@GigiEDC]

Check out China High-End EDC on AliExpress. I believe they’re on DHgate also. There’s some clones that are around $55 but this is not one of those, these go for $165 at the moment. If you send me to send the link drop your email!

[@GigiEDC]

China High-End EDC Store a.aliexpress.com/_mMwH1GW

[@CherokeeChief.]

Where can I find this exact Vespa? Microtech sent me one with the wrong blade suppose to be serrated and now can’t get a new one for a very long time. So I’d like to have a Vespa version with serrated blade to use everyday at work as a flight paramedic. I used otf for over 10 years now and microtech has disappointed me more than ever lately wish they could help us long term customers more.

[@Skylark427]

Did you get it from a vendor? Usually venders will exchange them for you within 30 days. Also, if you bought directly from Microtech, send them an email and explain the situation. They will make things right. I've seen so on the Microtech sub on reddit. The vespa will run you another $200+ and be YJ01-V1 (sprayform M390) and not real M390, I've seen the composition sheets so yeah, it's the sprayform version. You'd be better off asking for an exchange and getting the one you want without having to spend an extra $200+

[@Skylark427]

Other possible things to consider, with it being YJ01-V1, it'll chip or crack more easily if you drop it, and with them not using titanium hardware (screws, "X" button) the iron in the steel or stainless steel screws will eventually corrode the aluminum. Microtech definitely wants to protect it's name. If you bought directly from them, contact them and they will make it right. Just my honest opinion vs spending an additional $200+ on another knife when you can get yours exchanged.

[@ShaneO-nm2hh]

⁠@@Skylark427sure your not thinking of twosun? Because it is bohler M390 on this model. My cousin who lives in Australia works at Mechtest and did a precision OES and some high tech xrf test and came back as M390. There are also videos and posts with full analysis on Reddit. Maybe for some older Vespa models it may not have been but I doubt it.

[@КАЙРОСПРАВОСУДИЯ]

What about the blade quality ? 60-62 hrc?

[@GigiEDC]

It’s impossible for me to test at the moment but they’re advertised as 60-61 HRC. They hold an edge well - my Vespa Scarab is used daily and I haven’t needed to sharpen it yet. M390 as well.

[@КАЙРОСПРАВОСУДИЯ]

@@GigiEDConce I have bought Combat Troodon from Hifinder. The point has broken 😡 when a hacked it into the wood

[@GigiEDC]

@@КАЙРОСПРАВОСУДИЯthose are solid OTFs for the price but the blade steel definitely isn’t on par with M390. If you want a good budget OTF, the Vespa Scarab in 154CM is amazing. I carry the Vespa Scarab in M390 daily, it’s my favorite out of all my OTFs and I have many real ones. The 154CM is $120 I believe, the M390 is $170ish? Good luck my friend!

[@GigiEDC]

@@КАЙРОСПРАВОСУДИЯoh and I believe HiFinder also makes some CTs in M390. ~$120 I think!

[@Elmax17.5dps]

That vespa has the cleaner look. Everything lines up

[@GigiEDC]

I tend to agree! I forgot to mention but even the seams look cleaner.

[@PoltergeistWorks]

@@GigiEDC They don't really look "cleaner" but all the lines are sharper, you can tell that Microtech does tumble the aluminium handle to soften the burrs and everything is left sharper on the VESPA, it's noticable around the screws especially, I bet if you would look under madnification you would see small burrs there.

[@jorgegentilgentil4122]

Quiero comprar una de estas cómo se hace

[@GigiEDC]

La navaja falsa o real? Si quieres la falsa, busca en AliExpress. Hay una tienda se llama “China High-End EDC” y “China-KnifeCenter Store”. Ambos son buenos.

[@staticfrequency2250]

The Vespa's seam is actually WAY cleaner than microtech's. . .

[@GigiEDC]

In many ways they are! If the blade was wider on the Vespa I’d say it would have the original Microtech beat in terms of value. Take care!

[@jessebowles8277]

How many Vespa’s do you own? Which one is the highest quality/best? Can you provide a link to purchase? Thanks for the helpful videos

[@GigiEDC]

I own 3 Vespas and 3 HiFinders, they’re basically a budget Vespa but they’re good quality. I’d recommend the Vespa Scarab in M390. I have a video on it if you want to check it out. I’ll probably get one in 154CM as well. It has a better lock up than any Microtech that I own and the quality is as good if not better than Microtech. Look up “China High-End EDC” on AliExpress or DHgate. I’m in no way affiliated with them but they are reliable from my experience.

[@andrejbolcha3368]

Awesome work. Show’em how its done dude. I’ve almost bought the new gen but now i have no desire to do so. Waiting on new ultratech what they will do but honestly i have very little hope for something good. This company used to be so good and awesome. Wonder what have happened with them.

[@GigiEDC]

Thank you again my brother! Your support means more than you realize. Honestly I regret buying my real Gen III just because it was $450+$200 to fix the stripped screw. It’s nice and very smooth but paying that much just to make it acceptable left a bad taste in my mouth. Considering getting another Vespa Scarab in 154CM. Once Vespa fixes the tapering on the blade I think I’ll get another one of those as well.

[@Bellabear88]

Another quick thanks for the video. Been sitting on the fence about the vespa scarab and the vespa gen 3. Between the 2 do you have one you prefer? Yes i know the correct answer is both lol. Thanks

[@GigiEDC]

Glad it was helpful! I have a video on the Vespa Scarab if you’d like to check it out. Between the two, I really like the Vespa Scarab in M390. I think the 154CM would be great too but I haven’t gotten one yet. The Vespa CT Gen III is a great knife and the action is better but the blade is a little wider on the scarab which I like. Once Vespa fixes the CT Gen III’s blade dimensions I’ll probably recommend it over anything else but for now, the Vespa Scarab is my favorite OTF. All around solid, great looking knife.

[@Bellabear88]

​@GigiEDC oh I have watched that video also lol. I also like the little extra width on the scarab and probably will win our. Thanks again

[@GigiEDC]

@@Bellabear88you’re welcome my friend, I’m glad you found it useful! The extra width is actually one reason I like it so much. Very sturdy blade!

[@neongirl]

I recently purchased Vespa Combat Troodon in the classic design because I wanted a John Wick knife. I'd prefer the original Microtech any day, but I live in Russia and Russian law limits the blade length of automatic knives (OTF and Button Lock) to 90mm. Although they are not considered edged weapons, they are prohibited for circulation. So, unfortunately, it is almost impossible to purchase an original Troodon in my country. We have to console ourselves with Ultratech. 😁

[@GigiEDC]

Thank you for your comment, your country is great by the way! I visited there and miss it very much although the knife laws should be changed. After all, criminals don’t follow the laws anyway. The Vespa is great even when compared to the original. If it’s your only option, you’re getting great quality at a great price. The Vespa Scarab is even better than the Vespa Combat Troodon too if you’re looking for another. Take care and I wish you the best!

[@neongirl]

​@@GigiEDCThanks! I'm also considering purchasing Hera 2, although buying clones is also illegal. But as Stan Pines said, If theres no cop around anythings legal. The law does not prohibit keeping these knives at home.

[@GigiEDC]

⁠@@neongirlI love that quote 😆people say the same thing here! I hope you find one that you like and hopefully one day you’ll be able to purchase a real Microtech. I think the Hera II will work for you although I have no experience with them.

[@LIE4ME]

Ok lol yeah thats a counterfeit or clone. I left a comment on another video about clones versus homages like you didnt know the difference. My apologies 👍🏼!

[@GigiEDC]

Absolutely, take care and thank you for taking the time to watch and comment! It means a lot!

[@jakeMTSU]

I own 5 MT... funny enough I normally carry a krate tactical ghost... I engraved it with the mt logo LOL... its nice and got it for 80$ so if I break or lose it I wont feel as bad... its has d2 blade...

[@GigiEDC]

Nice! D2 gets a lot of hate but I think it’s a great budget steel. As far as not feeling as bad if you lose it, I couldn’t agree more. That’s a huge reason I carry my Vespa daily and my Microtechs stay in my drawer. Thanks for commenting and take care!

[@jakeMTSU]

@@GigiEDC so, i now only carry my gen 3 Troodon, dude.. its my clear fav now... light, big blade and now easy to open and close and the glass break is retracted making it feel like a UltraTech... 525$ is a worry but screw it I love it that much... 11/10 for me now....and love the pocket clip

[@SeanJohnson-qm4pu]

Someone gave me a super fake combat troodon. It was like 8 oz. With a 3.6 inch blade and so sloppy and janky. It did work and the internals were built surprisingly well but it was so sloppy and heavy. I decommissioned it. Should have sent it to Microtech haha

[@GigiEDC]

I hear you my friend, there’s some fakes out there that are absolutely terrible. For CT’s I’d only recommend looking at HiFinder or Vespa. Take care!

[@orange_sensei]

Thats a "counterfeit" not a clone

[@GigiEDC]

Yes you’re right! I call it a counterfeit in the video. Some people say clone, others say counterfeit or replica. I say either clone or counterfeit but you’re technically correct due to the use of the brand.

[@orange_sensei]

​@GigiEDC Thanks for the video!

[@GigiEDC]

@@orange_sensei of course, thank you for your support bro!

[@MrNiceKnife]

As a long time collector of Microtech this is scary as shit. So close, and a newest generation too. The blade is a dead giveaway to me, but everything else is scary. The blades are pot metal, they can stamp it with whatever they want to call it. It’s pot metal.

[@GigiEDC]

Thanks for the comment man but no, it’s not pot metal. At least not for these. Most you see are cheap Chinese D2 and they’re soft as hell but there are some counterfeiters that use higher end steels like M390 and it’s been verified by some other guys online although I personally don’t have a machine to test it, just some pick sets. M390 is fairly easy and inexpensive to get from Austria so it’s not too surprising. The heat treatment is a different story though - I don’t expect them to do as good a job as MT. The main point of these videos is to show the differences so people know the truth without pushing a narrative, especially if someone is trying to scam them which will get more and more common as these fakes get better. Someone might assume because it’s M390 that it’s real but it’s no longer the case.

[@kylegilmore3810]

m390 isn't expensive, a 2" wide, 3' long bar stock of Bohler m390 is about 70 bucks. Vespas test genuine with an XRF metal analyzer

[@РОСПОТРЕБЭКСТРЕМИСТ]

Hello! Very interesting video, you helped me decide on a gift for myself. Your analysis is the most informative on KZbin. You did an amazing job! Thank you!) What can you say after using this Vespa for a while? How do you like it? How well does it hold an edge? Were there any breakdowns during operation? Greetings from Russia

[@GigiEDC]

Hello my friend! I hope all is well there in Russia - I spent some time there a few years ago. Beautiful place and people! After using the Vespa for awhile I can say that it worked great. Occasionally it would misfire but no more than a genuine Microtech. As usual, some cleaning will fix it. Nothing ever broke and the edge holds very well. I would also say edge retention is comparable to Microtech. I hope this helps!

[@РОСПОТРЕБЭКСТРЕМИСТ]

​@@GigiEDC Yes, you really helped me a lot in making my choice. Thanks for the kind words! You also have a wonderful country with good and sincere people. Be sure to come visit us again when the geopolitical situation returns to normal. I wish you success in running your channel 🤝

[@GigiEDC]

@@РОСПОТРЕБЭКСТРЕМИСТI would love to :) I hope relations get better soon. I wish you success in your endeavors as well, my friend. Thank you again and take care!