Minimoog reissue price difference to Moog Matriarch price

[@tadams1227]

Ive crossed over to the behringer side and purchased a poly d. So happy with it.

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

I have Behringer Odyssey and B' MonoPoly both excellent, I would have bought a Poly D, but I have a Moog Grandmother.

[@translucent_nick]

I wonder if the "Matriarch" is based on SMT circuit. Probably, they had to order special parts to be made for the exact Minimoog reproduction, such as some transistors, like they did for the old modular reproductions. I'm not so sure though, since Minimoog never had any certain special components apart from those Fairchild tempco chips on the last oscillator card (not featured on this model).

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

Hi Nick, you seem to have more knowledge about this sort of thing, I don't really know about components, I thought everything was about the same if it was analog? Cheers Tim.

[@translucent_nick]

@@DisciplinedCommotion Dear Sir, thank you for your kind words, but my field of studies and job is rather the industrial engineering than the electronics engineering (which my knowledge of this field is way more limited), but your comment gave me "an assist" for some thoughts : if the Matriarch was based on "hole-through" traditional circuits technology, it would have been more expensive. Plus, I guess that is a classic cost cutting practice for analog synth designs, to utilize digital circuits on the control path and on non-crucial audio path stages. It makes sense for Moog to base the main audio path of Oscillators, Filters & VCA on analog electronics - while use digital electronics for the more secondary parts of audio path, such as on the ADSR's, maybe on the LFO's or Noise, etc. Also, back in the mid & late seventies, the Minimoog was the main mass product for Moog Music - while they had produced in succession the MicroMoog, Moog Prodigy & Moog Rogue to cover the low cost monosynth end market. They also had the Moog Sonic Six & later the MultiMoog, to fall somewhere in the middle of the more-versatile monosynth market segment : these two instruments were cheaper than the Minimoog, but not a way lot cheaper than that. If the Matriarch was done back back in the late seventies, it would be expensive too. Probably not as expensive as the Minimoog, but still expensive, since as it would be surely have utilized the circuits and production tactics of that time. Therefore, I agree with many people who claim that today, in synthesizer technology and market choices, we never had it better.

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

@@translucent_nick thank you for more of your insight, interesting. Cheers Tim.

[@taftasay9550]

I own both, the Matriarch and the D…sold my grandmother years ago (BIG mistake in all honesty) Hand soldered and Thru Hole Circuits that will last decades to come due to their ease of serviceability, not to mention the power of the sound, ease of use and eminent playability, legacy and cool factor make the model d reissue 5 grand. This doesn’t even mention build quality as well which is superior to moogs cheaper instruments. It’s legitimately a tank with hand brushed aluminum and real hardwood in large quantities. The size of the panel and knobs exude vintage luxury back when synth manufactures cared as much about the look and feel as the sound of their instruments as well. Today, synths are manufactured in large quantities cheaply and the focus is on feature set and gimmicks. The model D is a classic powerhouse still coveted today because it defies modern day instrument building conventions with razor sharp focus. The gain staging is through the roof on it, the feedback modulation, audio rate cross mod, filter fm, filter envelope pitch mod, noise modulation with true analog pink or red noise, velocity and aftertouch, external cv mod input, a-440 tuner, a headphone jack that can power truly serious high end headphones…..what more do you want? When adjusted for inflation, the reissue is almost half the price of a 1970 minimoog at almost 1200 dollars. In todays money, that is well over 9,000 dollars and the original minimoogs have crap keys, far less modulation possibilities, and you’d have to sacrifice your headphone jack for feedback modulation. Plus, two separate mod sources can be variably swept through from a mod mix knob for all manner of sound design wackiness or musicality if needed. The feedback modulation is separate and alters the signal path of every sound you design on it. I’m done ranting. I just want people to realize that it really isn’t outrageous at this price. The TRUTH. Modern manufacturing techniques have introduced millions of people into music making who otherwise would not have been able to afford it since then, and when a “premium” product is released In smaller quantities, the masses can easily overlook that maybe it’s just not for them. 🤷🏻‍♂️. Now, to appease you, you already have a Granmother….that is hands down Moogs coolest modern keyboard they have released and will get you 70% of the sounds a minimoog can make, and it has a sequencer, arpeggiator, analog spring reverb, lots of patch points for possibilities the model d can only dream of. Can the model D provide sound design possibilities that a Grandmother can’t? Of course! D has 2 envelope generators for more complex articulation, 5 channel mixer, variable mod mix knob, true analog white and pink noise, slightly different filter that is overdriven, 3 oscillators instead of two Plus an analog audio rate LFO. The Grandmother has PWM, hard sync, linear fm, sequencing, arrpegiation, crazy signal routing with patch cables, non resonant static high pass filtering, Sample and Hold and on and on and on….. You have a fantastic Moog…you don’t need a Minimoog….unless you can justifiably afford one and it is your Synth dream to own one. From one Synth lover to another I hope you understand and find peace about the price of the model d reissue. I adore mine…but guess what…I still want to buy another grandmother so I get the cool factor and features of grandmother back….i would have already sold my Matriarch (the lesser instrument compared to the grandmother in my opinion) but it is going so cheaply on reverb I’m just waiting it out. The Matriarch is convoluted, forces you into weirdness too quickly and does not have a WIDE sweet spot like grandmother and the model d do. I had a sub 37 at one point as well….didn’t like it. It’s all preference but when it comes to balance of use, sound and feature set…the G and D are the kings. I PROMISE.

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

Thank you for this great insight, you gave me goosebumps with your passion, you know your stuff. I am not to bothered about the Matriarch for the same reasons you stated, although recently I have purchased a Behringer System 15 Modular, having great fun.

[@varixclub]

If I had to choose between a Model D and a Matriarch I'd always go for the Matriarch. The D's got that typical sound, that certain punch, but that's it then imho. Matriarch's got 4-voice paraphony, so when you play in that mode you've got only one oscillator per tone but still you can get real fat chords out of it: it's got a stereo filter and a stereo delay, a second LFO (to modulate PWM for instance) and all those patch points for much more versatility than the model D. You can play it 4-voice, 2-voice and monophonic. Best Moog you can get for your money and imho one of the best analog synths of all times. I've got one and I love it.

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

Yeah I think the Matriarch is better value for money, but if they were the same price £1,700 I would go for the Mini :) . Cheers for commenting. Tim.

[@electrikm38]

I would like to know the answer to that question.

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

yeah, its a mystery.

[@lundsweden]

Its segmentation marketing... Minimoog for nostalgic people with more money than sense, the Matriarch for everyone else, and the Mavis as a gateway drug for people just getting into synths.

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

Yeah, the Mini has got the nostalgic history, I've never played either, but I would imagine the Matriarch is more versatile, but if they were the same price I would probably go for the Mini first, just because I have always fancied one.

[@simoningate2056]

Why has Moog gone out of business? Maybe that's your answer - terrible business decisions (and behringer's one is £259).

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

I didn't no they had, I just thought they had joined InMusic to help with manufacturing.

[@Lorneplumber]

Marketing. Very unlikely to be buying one though I could I won’t even go for a matriarch. Grandmother and a couple of sirins are more than enough for me

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

I might have gone for the Matriarch if I didn't have the GM. (not heard of sirins?)

[@thedonal]

I'm guessing the NOS components they claim to use push the price up. They are another "limited" run. Thing is- they'll sell out at that price still. I agree- £2k synth and the rest is "brand value". Sadly, I'v read plenty on poor QC. Gibson guitars are the same- £2,200 Les Paul should be £1800-2000 really. Brand premium and even worse qc. I guess it's worth what you pay for it.

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

@@thedonal yeah, paying for name, and people willing to pay.

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

checked out Sirins now, seem cool

[@martinnilsson4795]

I've had a MiniMoog shaped hole in my soul ever since I had to sell mine some 15 years ago. Thought the Matriarch might be the way to scratch that itch, but it is not a MiniMoog but rather something quite different. As some people state the Matriarch is somewhat convoluted, but it's also pretty much everything you could want from an analogue synthesizer. The Tomita whistle patch is there and so are massive lifelike church bells and a whole bunch of sounds a Mini would never let you do... But then there's the filter. The Matriarch's filter is obviously much more flexible than the Mini's but also way too polite/polished in my opinion. The solution for me is to bypass the filter section and run the unfiltered signal through a Moogerfooger lowpass filter and back into the Matriarch's VCA, having the filter controlled by the Matriarch's envelope etc. I know it's a bit convoluted but there's the sound! That said, I'm still lusting for a Mini cos it's just that unbelievably cool in every sense.

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

yes agreed it is cooler to say I have a Mini Moog :)

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

agreed it is cooler to say I have a Mini Moog :)

[@martinnilsson4795]

​@@DisciplinedCommotion To be fair, it is a convoluted way of getting there and the immediacy of the MiniMoog is totally lost, and if I could trade the Matriarch AND the Moogerfooger + the four patch cables for a MiniMoog I'd do it in a heartbeat. 🙂

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

@@martinnilsson4795 I think I know what you mean, the Mini is more straight forward, so less distractions in getting the sound :)

[@martinnilsson4795]

@@DisciplinedCommotion Yup, the sound is just there on the Mini. That said, in the last couple of days I've spent some serious time with the Matriarch and it's really only yourself who decides how deep you want to go. I'm just gonna backtrack on previous statements and say that the Minimoog is for nostalgic old boffins (like myself) or collectors. If you want a proper synthesizer go Matriarch! :)

[@amonster8mymother]

Mogue.

[@DisciplinedCommotion]

Yeah, Robert Moog pronounces it that way. I was brought up with it sounding like Moog, hard to break the habit.