MiSTer Vs RGB-Pi #1

[@RTA_RetroDev]

As a side note, RGB-Pi do not try to match Mister and/or real systems. We compare against them to make it better if feasible.

[@mdd4545]

please post your mister.ini used in this comparison.

[@bnr32jason]

What you call "Bad Overscan" is actually 100% correct for the NeoGeo and many other arcade games. The emulators have correction for this, while the NeoGeo core on MiSTer does not. Look at an actual NeoGeo arcade cabinet and you'll see that it has that much overscan or more by design. It all depends how you look at it, but technically the MiSTer is more "correct" in all aspects. If you are going for accuracy, this is what you want. Emulation might "fix" these issues, but many people don't really consider it a fix anyway. Also, playing on a flat screen CRT isn't the best way to demonstrate this anyway.

[@bittbit6791]

que sea fiel al original no significa que tenga que adolecer de todo lo malo. Se puede dejar lo bueno y eliminar los defectos. Eso no lo hace peor desde mi punto de vista. Todo lo contrario. Y creo que con Mister se podria hacer lo mismo. Pero esta claro que tanto el original como Mister tienen un overscan bestial y eso hasta que no puedes tocar la imagen no se sabe.

[@Trunchisholm]

@@bittbit6791 Lo que dices no tiene sentido. Por definición, un emulador no es fiel si no tiene el mismo comportamiento que el hardware original, defectos incluidos. Otra cosa es que no te gusten esos defectos y prefieras una emulación menos precisa, lo que me parece totalmente respetable. En MiSTer, por cierto, se pueden eliminar muchas limitaciones de las plataformas originales.

[@EmilySneider]

@@Trunchisholm tu frase si es contradictoria. Por un lado dices que un emulador no es fiel sino tiene el mismo comportamiento que el original y despues dices que con Mister se pueden elininar limitaciones lo cual es lo que esta intentado explicar el autor del video. Como siempre el fanatismo no os deja ver

[@Trunchisholm]

@@EmilySneider A ti lo que no te deja ver es la falta de comprensión lectora. MiSTer ofrece opciones. Si quieres puedes dejar el núcleo con las que vienen por defecto para que sea lo más fiel al hardware original posible, con defectos incluidos, o puedes activar opciones para eliminar ralentizaciones, centrar o reescalar la imagen, etc. Por cierto, no soy fanático de las FPGAs. Utilizo también emuladores y hardware real. No hay solución ideal. Al final lo importante es disfrutar con los juegos. Pero bueno, llámame fanático si te hace ilusión 😉

[@retrobert4190]

This video should be titled as "Man discovers different retro systems have different resolution and alignment in 2022".

[@shain6946]

You should add the real HW to the test , what do we compare? is Pi good or Mister good? Need real HW for proper test

[@ArcadeCabNBud]

mister quite clearly has overscan, and its not good.

[@shain6946]

@@ArcadeCabNBud it outputs the native signal how the original PCB or console did, the Raspberry pi is formatting the signal (changing it)

[@Trunchisholm]

@@ArcadeCabNBud So you're saying that the real hardware is not good?

[@bm-cy7ek]

Just because it's original it's not good​@@Trunchisholm

[@Trunchisholm]

@@bm-cy7ek That's not what I was saying. Neither option is inherently superior. It just depends on whether you value accuracy over convenience.

[@narudh]

Would really like to know the scart conversion box as well! Please answer thanks!

[@RTA_RetroDev]

Its a Philips one but there were many other clone ones. Not very reliable honestly (very noisy)

[@arcadeerik2603]

Thanks for making this video. I have recently purchased an RGB-Pi and its great. Is there a way to disable "IMAGE MODE" options. I would like it always to be original. Any help on this would be great.

[@RTA_RetroDev]

That’s OS2. Sorry you cannot predefault such option

[@carlostrevino1894]

Hola quisiera hacerte una preguntilla, se puede conectar un rgb-pi a un monitor de pc CRT VGA?? O no haría falta?? Y se podría conectar la Raspberry Pi 4 a VGA e instalar el OS de rgb-pi, funcionaría??? Mira si podías hacer un vídeo sobre esto ☺️ GRACIAS.

[@RekoneInkings]

El RGB pi tiene salida scart, no es VGA. Así que no sería posible así de primeras.

[@raymondrodrigues8351]

Is there any difference in lag?

[@aaaalexisss]

Wait for the next chapters ;)

[@saltymanos]

It's really minimal on RGB-Pi lag as it's a software base emulation but MiSTer being hardware emulation its lagless and in comparison next to each other RGB-Pi is only a micro 2 frames behind and most won't notice the difference. I prefer RGB-Pi over MiSTer currently with MiSTer requiring way too much tweaking and configuring but I still use both.

[@ImBetterThenEveryone]

Harware emulation? Theres no mame or retroarch or smt like that behind it? I thought it was just an old computer with extra ports. 2 frames is a lot, and after pi4 i don't see how that happens, somehow that pc has to emulate every game system different also.

[@saltymanos]

@@ImBetterThenEveryone some people are hyper sensitive to 2 frames of lag or lag in general but for the average person it will be unnoticeable unless compared directly actual hardware and that’s why most people are accepting of retroarch and other software emulators. I’m very sensitive to the lag but there are very small 2 frames of lag I’m willing to be okay with for the convenience of RGB-Pi.

[@davieslm]

What is the make and model of your scart switch and where did you buy it from? Also where did you get that cool RGB-PI sticker for your Argon One? Also your GPIO cable looks like it is exiting in the right direction. Did you fit an IDE top clip? I have all my parts ready for OS4 and my RGB-PI cable is arriving soon. Very excited!

[@mdd4545]

Unfortunatelly this test proves nothing. Please add to the test a real Genesis, Snes etc original console running 240p test suite grid patterns to check your geommetry settings of your crt tv in parallel. First of all calibrate your tv correctly through the service menu of the tv and then do the above test. We are viewing a test of a wrongly calibrated crt tv and epecially a flat trinitron crt (with bad geommetry comparing to the curved ones - i have both of those types of crt and i know in person). With my trinitron that is better calibrated than yours, i dont have those geommetry problems with rgb-pi os 4 and my mister setup. Both look similar. Also take in account that many of those differences should be on the overscan area of the crt tv and should be hidden from view.

[@rgb-pi9624]

RGB-Pi is not obssesed on be exactly the same of the original HW, are free to play better. If you are talking every day about the simulation, well this issues cutting the image is the simulation of the real hardware doesn't deppend of the TV, the image is cutted and on the video you can see moving the geometry, the image left and nothing can do, this TV is a default ceentered TV, not modified by the service mode anytime.

[@mdd4545]

@@rgb-pi9624 Excuse me but i cannot understand your english above. In any case what im trying to advise you to do is to correctly calibrate your crt tv and then do the same test and also take in account the overscan of 240p games. A good tool for that is 240p test suite on a real console. To make a point on this: for example the arcade games like Mortal Kombat 1-2-3, Nba Jam etc and how they appear on a crt (calibrated for 240p consoles) using OS4 without changing settings on Service Menu of the TV. The Same is for Mister too for some arcade cores with odd resolutions and hz. That is the nature of crt tvs.... you like them or not, but in any case do yourself a favour and try calibrate them through service menu for the best results.

[@Retromojones]

@@mdd4545 You say the tv is faulty or badly calibrated, but then also should have same problems on raspberry, or the tv only is faulty for mister?

[@exorcitop]

mdd45 are you kidding no? In my opinion my test more than enough, it is clearly seen in the menu that the RGB calibration has a value of zero. There is no geometry distortion in any of the games. So, the result is more than evident Great work Rubén and company! Keep working and showing results

[@mdd4545]

@@Retromojones I'm saying that it makes big difference if a device (like mister or rgb-pi) timings are wrongly calibrated/setuped on a badly calibrated TV. There must be a good start. Correct TV then find best setting and timings on the device. That's why I'm proposing real consoles that their timings are factory made. Also mister analogue timings if you do not play with mister.ini are raw. If done with no error then it is like original console. On rgb-pi you enhance the timings according to which TV? What is the standard?

[@ChrisSkitch]

Very interesting. Which core is this? And is RGB-Pi OS4 set to SuperX or Native resolution?

[@brentlacouture9994]

Dynares

[@soothius]

Where did you get your IO board from? Do you think that could be an issue? How does real hardware behave? MiSTer attempts to recreate the original hardware, faults and all.

[@RTA_RetroDev]

No IO board. Both MiSTer and Raspberry use the same RGB cable hardware built by the same person.

[@aaaalexisss]

Is the same hardware ouput fot the Pi and for the de10nano, if any issue exist on the video output exist too for the Pi...

[@larsafpetersens1488]

Not the same cable or is it? Similar but not same? Or do you mean i can just use my rgb-pi cable for the de10nano? No need to buy a second one?

[@aaaalexisss]

@@larsafpetersens1488 Is different wiring but the same components

[@MrBroken030]

The graphics are one thing but for me personally the input delay is much more important.

[@ArcadeCabNBud]

good job graphics arent that important to you cos the mister looks pretty sht to me

[@MrBroken030]

@@ArcadeCabNBud what do you mean exactly, the digital or the analog signal? I own both a raspberry pi with pi2scart rgb adapter and a mister, to me both systems look good over hdmi and/or scart rgb.

[@Trunchisholm]

@@ArcadeCabNBud How appropriate. Your comment looks like shit to me.

[@theblowupdollsmusic]

run ahead mode fixes the lag in retroarch. He made another video showing it.

[@AFFL1CTED1]

This looks amazing! I would also like to see a lag comparison between the two (without run ahead) please. I would love to get this running, does anyone know where I can find an RGB to S-Video adapter? Sadly my PVM only has S-Video (20N5U).

[@fredsk1]

The 20N5U can easily be modified to support RGB. Do a Google search for 'phrederick Sony-SSM' and you can find my Github page.

[@mahdiyussuf9804]

@@fredsk1 Is the 20N5U worth it? Like the amount of tv lines it has and sharpness compared to the models everyone runs for?

[@fredsk1]

@@mahdiyussuf9804 the SIIA chassis on which the 20N5U is based is a relatively (compared to older PVMs) simple design and is really easy to work on and modify. Because it was late-ish in the era of CRT dominance it uses integrated circuits as opposed to discrete components. They are really solid monitors but cost cutting was definitely evident. Don't pay top dollar for them but they are still a solid pick especially in certain regions where they are way more abundant than earlier more expensive variants

[@mahdiyussuf9804]

@@fredsk1 Awesome, thanks! I saw a chap selling one nearby for a few hundred, and in today's market that seems like a bargain haha. I've taken a look at your github. It seems pretty doable!

[@fredsk1]

@@mahdiyussuf9804 no worries mate. Couple hundred is absolutely a sensible buy for one of these IMO.

[@manuelgomezramirez3341]

POR EL PRECIO PREFIERO RGB PI

[@RobertKreese]

Just started playing around with RGB Pi on my Raspberry 4. I already got a MiSTer and loves it, but wanted to play around some more. The song playing in the beginning it's called "Now Playing". Does any one know who composed it? I love it! Please compare "Galaga" and 1943 (mame) in tate mode. I can't get them to look proparly on the RGB Pi.

[@batoceragames4828]

J'adore ce test !

[@theblowupdollsmusic]

Thank you for showing this comparison. RGB-PI looks like a really good product.

[@retroboy7688]

RGB pi el mejor

[@julituber7649]

El sonido también es igual ? En la mister el sonido de neogeo es brutal Estaría bien una comparativa Sonora de cómo suenan los chips en un sistema y otro.

[@Undar8ed03]

I'll stick with my groovymame pc for now. It works perfectly for my needs on my 27" trintron that has been calibrated. If you need proof, Just ask.

I'm soooo happy that I've bought RGB-Pi (and Pi4 when it was waaaay cheaper). I can enjoy OS4 now for a fraction of MiSTer price...

[@guddaboi]

The RGB-Pi is truly amazing!

[@delfinlucluc3738]

Honestly, I don’t get what you guys are trying to proof…Makes me regret buying your cable.

[@arcademimundo6539]

Personal mente prefiero RGB pi

[@Andearoid]

about overscan, you demonstrate your RGB-Pi doesn't use the good modeline. and your Mister FPGA isn't good scaled too. perhaps you have to set the geometry on your TV screen properly ? because I get best results with a PC and an old ATI Radeon on my part.

[@dieztroxrgb]

El sonido de la mister esta bajado xd y ademas que el televisor esta ajustado para la pi no entiendo mucho el sentido del video ademas de mostrar que los ajustes de señal son levemente diferentes eso por una razon obvia 🤷

[@retrovisionpass]

that Mister is not worth the price, retroarch can achieve zero input lag with the new features it have. So why pay expensive price for it, the wii have zero input lag too with retroarch, same happen if u buy a mini pc and use it for emulation. Mister is overrated and overpriced.

[@madmack_back_to_the_arcade]

Un resplandor y hace ¡BOOM! y digo, ains ya está aquí el RGB-Pi para la raspberry 4

[@NIGHTKILLER05]

Good video, lag comparison , please, great OS !

[@FabioSpelta]

Agreed, please a lag comparison by exploiting the run ahead feature of Retroarch!

[@AperteStart555]

Runahead gives RGB-Pi a clear advantage. For instance, Final Fight Arcade have 4 frames of built-in latency intentionally programed to make the game more difficult. With Runahead, you can eliminate this latency for a much more enjoyable experience than the original.

[@AperteStart555]

RGB Pi is far superior in every way: user-friendly interface , dynares, external HDD support, light gun support and almost zero input lag, even without runahead. It's the best gaming experience I've ever had on a CRT. MISter is made for the purists and RGB-PI for everyone else.

[@botvinnik_]

I don't see the superiority. Mister also has a user-friendly interface (less coloured, but also user-friendly), native resolutions, HDD and lightgun support, and zero lag. If Rpi is the best retro platform you have ever seen, just try a PC and you will get stunned ;)

[@AperteStart555]

@@botvinnik_ I have a gaming PC, but unfortunately it doesn't work with my Sony Wega. :D

[@botvinnik_]

@@AperteStart555 If your intention is to emulate retro systems in a CRT, a standard gaming PC wouldn't work, you would need an ATI GPU with analogic video output to generate the 15 KHz signal. But in terms of power and platform compatibility, a PC has no rival (no matter if you compare it with Rpi or MiSTer)

[@stevenmcgeorge1983]

I agree, RGB-Pi is much better.

[@Trunchisholm]

I have multiple software and hardware emulation machines, including a Pi and a MiSTer, and quite a few of them considerably more capable than a Pi 4. Saying that RGB Pi is superior to MiSTer, let alone to all other platforms is ludicrous. It's a great solution to those wanting software emulation on a CRT in a small form factor. That's it.

[@mirabilis]

Pointless.

[@Retromojones]

Emosido engañado!!!!

[@lisbertagustinsegura1955]

Peeeroooo la mister ehh la mister ehhh la mister… Joder gran trabajo mis felicitaciones Ruben!!! Madre mia cada vez más contento de rgbpi

[@shinobi7423]

Fanboys de MiSTer llorando en 3,2,1... ah, ¿qué ya están llorando desde hace rato?😂

[@michelmey]

[RGB-PI]😎 ︻デ═一 - - - ☠ MiSTer ☠︎ 💀

[@shinobi7423]

@@michelmey My brother😉

[@Trunchisholm]

Tengo y utilizo las dos. Ambas son opciones perfectamente válidas y complementarias. Lo de las guerras de la emulación es patético. ¿Hemos vuelto al patio del colegio o algo? 😂

[@DAN_TITAN]

La santa madre del cordero

[@6kase6]

Sin comentarios esto habla por si solo, gran trabajo del equipo RGB-PI

[@RetroMSDOS]

Un vídeo vale más que mil palabras bla, bla, bla...

[@jp4blo339]

A igualdad de precio ya me quedaría con RGB-PI, no digo na si pones el precio en la ecuación. Y hablo OS2 que es la que tengo, no me quiero imaginar cuando OS4 no sea alpha.

[@mister-fpga]

Mister.ini pas configuré