Hear Reed's doomed plan & lies of an NUSA Puppet - Cyberpunk 2077 Phantom Liberty

[@rafidsadman]

When I saw the pre-release cinematic trailer where Reed gets sold out in that train and then shot I assumed he was gonna be an antagonistic role in the DLC, or at least anti-NUSA. So when the DLC reveals he's still on NUSA's side despite the NUSA openly treating him like a pawn I instantly realized he is the worst kind of loyal people - the kind that blindly follows orders no matter how reprehensible. Men like this will commit the most heinous of acts and then try to justify it all as part of some greater good intention even when there is none. I knew not to trust the guy then and there.

[@net343]

1945 germany vibes

[@Hirnlego999]

@@net343 Nope. Like most people. Conformists.

[@kittycat1887]

he's something like Takameura. they both have many admirable qualities but they dedicate them to the wrong people

[@cato3277]

​@kittycat1887 ironically even takemura has more independence, acting out of revenge on his own terms.

[@matsimurf_5900]

OP missing the point completely. As if there are any good, legit clear moral decisions in the game at all. Songbird is the worst kind of selfish betrayer, at least reed actually helps you get cured for your service. You should kill So mi yourself(with some sympathy) shes a blackwall timebomb. Reed is an honorable man. You can twist as much as you like but songbird was a crim from before her service days, and sold reed out too. I could care less about the fact that she was an nusa/militech blackwall project, that's what hacker criminals of high skill get, arrested and put to dangerous work. Stop crying. You want sympathy for a dangerous rogue, blackwall infected hacker? She lies to you and leaves you at the spaceport after using you utterly. Also, shes happy for plenty of civilians to die for her freedom. Reed has no feats of evil like that. She has multiple. He has only killed straight up criminals. V is a worse person than reed as well, regardless of whether you avoid a single civilian casualty. V has shredded regular corpo security by the hundreds and thousands. They are basically just employees in a tough world. Johnny in PL literally sides with a terrorist and says civilian casualties ate necessary for freedom from corpos, which is stupid. He also said in the main game that killing thousands was justified to destroy arasaka. nevermind the fact that it didn't do anything but blow up one office block and the rest of the corporations are fine. Johnny is basically an evil retard who is written at every other time apart from his 2 "sacrifice the citizens" speeches as a grumpy uncle. You're waffling and fixated on your own personal emotional involvement with characters that you like, over characters you're demonising without any evidence. What, are you upset he killed the french twins before you got to bone?😂

[@KM-op3xr]

Reed is one of the best written characters. The amound of comments I have read from people that haven’t realized how much of a manipulator he is and still portray him as the good guy says it all. Even in this scene you have to pay attention to all the details and read between the lines in order to catch him in his game. Well done CDPR. Well done 👏

[@FenixFireborn]

Reed is much better at this spy crap than other characters. He doesn't directly lie, but tells half-truths or convinently ommits facts. He also never admits he does that - like Song confessed about her hiding truth.

[@jaspercheng923]

Ikr,the amount of “hes the only character that never lies to you” comments make me wanna slam my head against a wall. He is a great liar, especially to himself since he seem to genuinely believe he can “save” Songbird by getting her back to her jailers

[@di_kid00]

Truths to a person can be lies to another. It’s what the person believes, but then due to changing circumstances, acts differently than what they said they would. Ever had a partner, friend or family member who said they’d do one thing, but does differently? It’s not that they lied outright, or intended to lie, but found themselves in a situation where they have to betray their own words. That’s the great thing about the writing in the game. They took into account human psychology. And whether you betray Reed or Songbird gives 2 completely different dialogue and texts from Reed. Betraying Songbird and helping her die, he is in deep grief for her, Alex and even feels for V. Betray Reed, before V kills him at the airport, he comes off as cold and will do anything to bring So Mi to Myers.

[@KM-op3xr]

@@di_kid00 Nah, in this scene he’s playing you trying to get you to do what he wants. His “circumstances” change in the amount of 10 seconds not after some specific events. Replay it and you will see that he can’t keep his story straight. He cares for So Mi in his own way but he cares for his ideology way more. V can actually tell him smt during the “Killing Moon” that sums it up 100% “You ain’t doing this for Myers or the FIA. You are doing this for yourself, because without it you’re nothing. No one”

[@warwargr3654]

Sadly, like most characters in Cyberpunk, there is no plain black and white, everyone is a shade of Grey and sadly both Reed and Songbird are of the darker shade. Both lie to you, both manipulate you and am pretty sure the way they interact with you, especially towards the end changes because they've learned what buttons to press to get V to do as they want. Hell, one of the first messages from Reed if i recall says the two guys you meet in the abandoned apartment 'have been taken care of'.

[@fabricated]

It's really funny how condescending Reed and everyone is to V when depending on your dialog options you can be 100% right about how everything turns out. You can flat out warn Reed that shit will pop off if you corner Songbird and he does the super-cool spy line to blow you off when well, you end up 1000% correct.

[@Paragon231]

He lies all the time. The difference between him and Songbird is that one eventually owns up to their lies, whereas the other keeps believing their delusions.

[@Sebastian-tf2gu]

actually reed admits to his mistakes if you decide to kill songbird and end her misery.

[@kevinfromsales6842]

@@Sebastian-tf2gu Doesn't he say something similar even if you don't put her out of her misery? I haven't played through all outcomes yet so I'm not sure.

[@mai_tq]

@@Sebastian-tf2gu yes, but for that, you need to kill her...................if you let her live, he will keep feeding his delusion. My personal experience, the first time I helped Reed, but it left me with a horrible aftertaste, ofcourse, I opted to kill Son Mi...but still, then I decided to go back to a previous safe....and this time decided to help Song Bird, it was to me, so..........yes, I know NUSA was brutal, but the slaughter brought to the airport, in order to get Son Mi back......................the canon in my V's story was to help Son Mi get to the moon. So, destroyed Militech/NUSA's plan to weaponize the blackwall, and opted for the secret ending where V faces Arasaka alone. At the end, Reed is for NUSA/Militech, what Takemura is for Arasaka. And I'm kind of happy that Alex survives when you help Song Bird at the beginning.... that is a plus.

[@FenixFireborn]

Way too late for Reed's reflection. Reed is beyond choosing anything at that point. He lost everything. I agree with Johnny's estimation that Reed's worldview will eventualy crumble and he will commit suicide. It's only matter of time. @@Sebastian-tf2gu

[@HomerAndRoe]

@@mai_tq With Blue Eyes in the equation, the fate of Songbird in the Moon Ending might not be as hopeful as one would expect. Unless Blue Eyes was secretly a "good guy" the whole time.

[@nathan3252]

His body language is extremely telling when you hit him with certain responses. He goes into outrage quick when you don't believe a lie and then he tries to sell you on a promise that seems like he is grasping at straws as he is unclear how far he can push the lie without getting caught. He also keeps trying to convince you to share as much intel as possible as if this were less of a conversation and more of an interrogation disguised as a conversation. I have started to question if the ending we see is truly what it appears to be. V at this point could be merely soulkilled and simply going through a conditioning process that convinces V that no one cares anymore about him/her thus convincing V that there is nothing left to live for except starting over with nothing. This way when the NUSA puts him in a new body he will be ready to carry out missions as a disposable asset with skills intact while never worrying about the asset wanting to go back to its former life because it believes there is no former life. As for the original body, its being taken apart so Militech can get their hands on the relic.

[@pinnacleevolution1634]

Yeah there is something fucky with the tower ending for sure, even if you pick up the bullet pendant at the hospital later when Misty asks you about it V will say they lost it. And we know how symbolic the pendant is in all the endings. Something doesn't add up. Also it's very fucking weird how Misty is wearing Jackies jacket and Johnny's pants in that ending.

[@pressrepeat2000]

Wow, that’s a great theory! Didn’t think about that at all. As the other commenter notes, the pendant V picks up at the hospital is also gone later… weird. And since Misty asks about it, it’s not a pure oversight, we’re supposed to notice it’s gone.

[@fajnu20]

This theory is something...

[@oktusprime3637]

"I'll personally help her disappear. From everyone, everywhere, including Myers." What a crock. He never ever had the intention of not selling her out to Myers.

[@hassetjifrebro8222]

There are no good guys in the dlc. But one is a tortured cornered animal with no choices, the other follows his doomed principles and happily follows Myers. She could ask him to flatline Alex and he will do it without hesitation.

[@Sebastian-tf2gu]

i still dont understand why is he like that. he doesnt make sense to me.

[@hassetjifrebro8222]

@@Sebastian-tf2gu I mean if he was to let them go, it means all his life was a waste. Could be easier to double down than break from the cycle. He has a value system and worldview, easier to follow than escape it.

[@PinkFloydFreak55]

@@Sebastian-tf2gu I think the writers and devs wanted us to love/like him for every single superficial reason possible - hes handsome, cool, etc - but a pathological liar that is 100% a puppet to his morals and worldview. Basically the inverse of what we are used to seeing in Night City - people who stick to what they believe to a fault.

[@trickm0nkey]

@@Sebastian-tf2gu He's an American version of Takemura. He's a loyal dog to his master, who's Myers. Where Takemura is a Samurai, Reed is a Spy...one might even say...Ninja. Both have grand delusions of their master to justify their actions.

[@jaspercheng923]

@@Sebastian-tf2guhe holds on to his “principles” like Takemura holds on to his “honor”, it gives them a higher purpose to live and fight for. As Johnny said after meeting Alex, the system loves people like this, someone that believes in a “cause” rather than each other.

[@jaspercheng923]

He’s a great liar because most of all he lies to himself, it seems he genuinely believes NUSA would help Songbird with her situation as if Myers wasn’t the one that got her into it in the first place. It’s only when Songbird shows she’d rather die than go back that the delusion breaks and realize “the cause” is just a made up idea to control people like him

[@patrickmartin6449]

I just don’t understand how people can live with themselves, working with that kind of mindset. Johnny was right about him. He’s the kind of person, who, for good or evil, always sticks to his own principles, even if it results in his own death, suffering, or the deaths and suffering of countless others, all in the name of some “higher calling.” I saw So Mi’s memories beyond the Blackwall and I saw how he literally called So Mi’s friends and family meaningless straight to her face, threatening her with leaving her and her people to face the wrath of NetWatch if she didn’t accept his terms (the FIA’s terms, if you will). I’d like to think he’s a good man in his own way, but he is just so blinded by his own principles and completing the mission that he completely fails (or perhaps refuses) to see that what he does leaves a lasting impact on people, and often a very hard and cruel impact at that. After everything they’ve been through and knowing what he did to her, I would have expected him to at least support her when she was hurt and struggling with the effects from netrunning and her wanting to escape from Myers and the FIA, but apparently, even that is too much to hope for. That man, in my eyes, is nothing more than a machine, doing nothing greater than letting people walk him around like the useless, apathetic lap dog that he is, inflicting God knows how much pain on people all over the world all for the sake of fulfilling his hollow principles all in the name of the “greater good.” That man, in my eyes, is nothing more than a glorified thug in a fancy suit, making empty excuses for causing irreparable pain and damage to people who don’t even know him and he doesn’t even know, too scared to wake up from his own fantasyland and see his f’ed up ideals for what they are, as well as the people around him that he works for. I genuinely hope that one day he wakes up and just sets aside his own dreams for a change and just looks at the world plainly for a change. If he just sat and thought without any of his principles or objectives holding him back for just ten minutes, maybe he’d finally realize how wrong he is about the world he’s created in his head and those he works with and for. Until that day comes, I just have nothing but pity and revulsion towards that man. P.S. If you’ve managed to read all of this up to this point, good on you. Respect to you taking the time to read this and for your patience with my moral crusading.

[@di_kid00]

If you chalk it down to possibilities, it was 10% chance he’d help So Mi escape. He said, “ONCE” he hears what she has to say, then he may help. The factors: how far has the Blackwall AI taken over her mind, how much So Mi is left? It’s like judging a friend to see if they should be permanently placed in an insane asylum where the doctors are Myers and the FIA.

[@captainanus8131]

A fed with principles is still a fed. I would help songbird even if V doesn’t get a cure

[@ramkedoodle]

Reed never did V wrong every step of the way, the one promise he broke was voided after so-mi became a walking unstable wmd

[@Lucifer-bn1fz]

@@ramkedoodleTbf if anyone kept the promise to V that was Myers. Reed has nothing to say nor does he hold any influence no matter how much he likes to pretend otherwise. He just used V for his goals and Myers used him for hers. She was done with him after that regardless.

[@busanikingz3453]

​@@ramkedoodleMyers is the one with power to greenlit V's cure that's why she doesn't give you the cure if you kill Songbird, Reed can't do anything because he has no power to do so.

[@memecoinalpha]

Colin Powell died with most people not knowing he covered up the My Lai Massacre yet he'll always be remember for excellence, loyalty, devotion. It's the way of most warmongerers.

[@Hirnlego999]

Well, his WMD speech at the UN was not exactly a highlight either

[@marekgdpr680]

This conversation was the reason why I helped Songbird on the first run and don't regret that decision. I mean he either thinks you're stupid or which is more evident he's deceiving himself.

[@TheNastyTH]

Well you took is personally and jokes on you. Songbird manipulates you and lie to you all the same. When she tell you, that she trust you, she wants you to trust her. Difference is Songbird is selfish and without second thought she risk any live to get her goal. She does not care about anyone except for her. Reed lies and manipulates because it is his duty. He know what he has to do, how to archieve it and find best outcome in the end. He wants to save songbird, but he want's to do it withing bordes of his duty. So who ist worse? someone who will walk on pile of corpses to archive his goal for himself or someone who does the same as his duty?

[@TheRagnarose]

@@TheNastyTH Songbird does it to save her life, Reed does it because he's a dog to the NUSA. And what the NUSA wants is to keep Songbird hacking the Blackwall, which can have world ending consequences. Reed is the worst option by far.

[@GattsBerserkArmor]

Yes. He is a very well done character. Always speaks in half truths or omit details. Reed is a very charismatic and manipulative person, which is what makes him a master spy. It also surprised me the number of people who seem to think he is the "good guy" in this whole story.

[@lovell8983]

3:06 "so that was a fucking lie."

[@ixiahj]

All of it seemed like a fucking lie. Reed said he was trying to figure out what So Mi was going through but he knows damn well what she's been through. He recruited her. He was there when she was experimented on by Myers people. Wonder if there was a cut scenario where V manages to convince Reed to let So Mi go or let Reed kill So Mi to release her from the AI.

[@JB-xl2jc]

​@@ixiahjReed also definitely knows that running past the Blackwall messes with So Mi's memories and personality, and likely that it hurts her physically. In one of her memories, he is there to "comfort" her when she pops out of a running job, and she doesn't remember who he is because her mind's getting obliterated every time. Still sends her right back in, though.... Reed doesn't have to lie to V quite as much as the rest of the cast, because he lies so much to himself.

[@Geroaergaroe]

I don't think it was. Really. It's really clear if you go with him then "free" Song. But after what happened, he went back to baseline. That's the actual tragedy of the DLC. If they both trusted each other, they would have both went home and been freed from Myers.

[@JB-xl2jc]

@@Geroaergaroe Maybe... but maybe not. Just as likely that Reed would've listened to her and still decided that 'only the NUSA can help her!'. Can hardly blame So Mi for not trusting Reed when he really does side with Myers at every chance and the first move of his plan was to try to ICE her into being catatonic so he could "save" her. Don't forget the first time he "saved" her, which was when he twisted her arm to make her join the FIA, which led to her being enslaved and put in a state worse than death, basically.

[@muhammadammarrasyid5780]

@@JB-xl2jc No matter the situation, Reed will put NUSA's (basically Myer's) interest first. He may try to compromise, trying to get So Mi to give in so that he can broker a deal. In the end, NUSA will always hold sway over the outcome, making his promises empty whether he regrets it or not.

[@0999-g1w]

The tragedy is I truly believe he's a good man trying to do the right thing, but he can't accept the president he works for isn't as moraly sound.

[@SanosEdge]

The thing about Reed, despite his misguided loyalty to Myers he is forced to sacrifice his genuinely strong ideals and principles to see things through to the end. V outright tells Alex he figured his death was nigh. His loyalty to the NUSA and unwillingness to abandon the mission for his ideals are destroying him. He also has an utter lack of self-awareness. He claims that his job does not allow for mistakes, but he makes them all the time, at the expense of others and never admits fault. Johnny states he easily could have been Reed and stated outright Reed will commit suicide before long. Whereas Johnny is responsible for Alt's death, Reed's actions lead So Mi to ruin. Johnny believes in life over survival, whereas Reed believes in keeping people he cares for alive no matter the cost. The NUSA is as merciless and devoid of loyalty as Arasaka.

[@Kristers_K]

Since the Phantom Liberty cinematic before the release, i though Reed would be someone who fights this evil, the NUSA, this corruption, not be a part of it...part of the problem. He is another version of Takemura and nothing boils my blood more than a blind loyalty no matter what. I'm far too rebellious at heart for that, i'd sooner kill myself than serve, or be puppet of someone like Myers, NUSA in general....or any corporation even, though realistically i would start a war, show mercy only to those showing remorse and are willing to stand against tyranny and corruption. My choice to to side and help Songbird was obvious, i don't care that she lied, that she screwed over V...i only care about motives, what drives people to do what they do and in the case of Songbird it was justified, so i helped her with that final push. Because in the end, if i can save a person's life, be free of something, i will, regardless of what happens to me.

[@kevinfromsales6842]

I wonder if Reed actually wanted to help Songbird disappear but deep down he knew he would just end up following orders like a good boy. He was probably just lying but idk for sure.

[@pinnacleevolution1634]

No he was playing you the entire time, so was Alex when she invites you for a drink. There's a moment when you are discussing the infiltration on the hotel and Alex says something like "it's sweet of you to say" or some shit then Alex and Reed share a half smile. They are playing you to seem more easygoing and approachable, that you are part of the team. You are nothing more than a tool for them. It's also nothing personal for them, they have been spies for longer than V has been an adult, it's their game and they are good at it. That's why Alex doesnt even try killing you.

[@sillylittlesheepjax6009]

yes he did but she gone total cyberpsycho destroying everything so he knew that plan failed

[@kevinfromsales6842]

@@sillylittlesheepjax6009 yeah I was thinking about that too. Maybe he would've helped her disappear if his plan actually worked.

[@oktusprime3637]

@@sillylittlesheepjax6009 No, he never ever wanted to help her disappear. It was just a lie to ease V into sharing more info because he was sensing that So Mi was swaying their favor in her direction. She's a traitor and the president of the NUSA wanted her back under her thumb. Reed is too much of a puppet to his nation to go against this.

[@Icannothandleany]

I saw a glimpse what what he and Alex had become or could eventually become when they killed the twins in cold blooded professional fashion

[@kittycat1887]

I swear Reed is the worst liar I've came across in this game. I can just fucking feel it whenever I hear him talking. And mf actually expects me to believe everything that comes out of his mouth, while it's clear how full of himself he is.

[@andrewdopple6946]

The thing I like about this universe, is that there is no clear cut-in-dry good ending. If you make fast dramatic changes to enforce your ideas and beliefs, the consequences could be worse, and in the end, the corps and the city will find a way to come out on top. There is no true asterism, it is just everyone looking out for their interests with someone innocent somewhere will suffer from it. I sided with Reed knowing this fully well. It is best to play the system, and go along, and try to make things even 1% better if you can. Burning down the system in a traditional punk way (like Johnny tried doing), only makes the problem worse.

[@killmonger5097]

I always go the Reed route now gotta get that Militech canto Mk6 So Mi and Reed deserve each other they both suck

[@clydu91]

The title lmfao

[@ironic4910]

If you actually talk with him at the space station he says he wants to help song but later he says you can take the cure if you give her up That's was the moment I knew he never meant to help her he was always hunting her and following orders Make sure to not shoot him in the head it's more satisfying

[@sillylittlesheepjax6009]

Ppl who pick Songbird do that mostly bec she is young female. Dont lie to yourself simps.

[@squuid15]

I clocked this guy after he betrayed the dog town guys who are there to protect Myers

[@dogestranding5047]

Do we know he actually flatlined them tho?

[@pinnacleevolution1634]

@@dogestranding5047 Really you see him not bat an eye after killing the French twins and think him going "they have been taken care of, you dont have to worry about them anymore" means what? He bought them donuts and invited them on the plane back to DC?..... Those dudes saw his face, saw him with Myers they knew he was a secret agent. They are fucking dead.

[@TheKnightDrag0n]

@@dogestranding5047 It is heavily implied.

[@thepromman]

@@dogestranding5047 It's implied - "taking care of" traditionally means killing in most spy/mafia/etc entertainment. Additionally, we have the context of how the FIA deals with loose ends given how the twins were dealt with after their usefulness ended, and how Reed reacts to Slider's death. From a security perspective, J&T could easily want to double dip and go to Hansen and say hey the FIA are operating in DogTown, here's where their apartment is, here's what Reed looks like, etc. It's understandable the FIA don't want them around, but it's also an indication that if you're not fully in, you're out, and a liability. Let's not forget how little the NUSA pays us after literally saving the president's life; you could say they're curing us is part of the deal, but imo that was only part of the deal for bringing Songbird in, not for helping the prez.