1. Introduction to 'The Society of Mind'

MIT 6.868J The Society of Mind, Fall 2011
View the complete course: ocw.mit.edu/6-8...
Instructor: Marvin Minsky
In this lecture, students discuss the introduction to The Emotion Machine, expectations and overview of the class, and general understanding of emotions, consciousness, and intelligence.
License: Creative Commons BY-NC-SA
More information at ocw.mit.edu/terms
More courses at ocw.mit.edu

[@uyghurcrypto]

I went to Wikipedia by his name and read a 15 plus page research on telepresence in the year 1980, the year I was born, and I was astonished to know how brilliant and sharp mind and forward thinking he pioneered. My all respect to him in his field. The article I read was one of many and I choose that because it corresponded to my year of coming alive. RIP.

[@dr.mikeybee]

He also did a lot of harm holding back connectionist funding.

[@annavonblack]

It always makes me sad that these MIT lectures don't have millions of views. Thanks for posting MIT, you guys rock.

[@plower221]

+Steve Bergman watching it at 1.5 speed makes it much nicer to watch!

[@annavonblack]

+Steve Bergman That's so harsh! I had worse at uni and I still managed to pay attention :P Thanks for the book suggestion. Who do you suggest I pick as my mental narrator?

[@luciochagas3458]

You're essentially advocating jumping from watching a video (arguably an activity that is easier and wider-reaching) to reading a book, which is a 'doable' pastime in only but some cultures on Earth, not counting notable exceptions to each rule. So, all in all, I am actually glad, not sad. I am glad this video exists. Even more glad because the book preceded it, and glad because time will 'fix' everything due, being sad is counterproductive in regards to this. Call me overly progressive, but not any more than nature will progress over its own agenda. Now, let's just sit around a round table for a bit and think about how does modern attention spans will deal with a 2-hour stretch of old-man's parlance. Yeah. Alright. There we go.

[@rahulsircar8766]

Catchy things get the most attention. Not the right and productive things. Harsh fact of life

[@hassanmirza2392]

MIT Lectures are not for mainstream.

[@t6hp]

What a brilliant mind. I'm so lucky and grateful for everyone who made the internet possible and accessible for me to watch these great lectures thousands of miles away from the comfort of my bed in Egypt. What a great miracle! Thank you, MIT and USA.

[@vickykashyap1042]

Send me contact number wheat importer companies of egypt

[@Unknown-th8hx]

Fuckin A. The Internet is the coolest thing ever🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸

[@patrykwisniewski9463]

Tytyy

[@fumamaxgalli9552]

Pop oĺ

[@notagain3732]

May Allah bless you and assist you on your way to learn more and achieve your goals

[@LindsayPuggleGirl]

RIP Marvin, thank you for blessing us with these lectures !

[@coemoney]

🙏 🕊

[@julio_l3948]

@@coemoney😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😅

[@Xestra37490]

🙏🏼 MIT for making it possible that all of us could attend otherwise wasn’t possible. Greatly appreciated !

[@dhangejr]

they trying to brainwash you!

[@micheledeidda2565]

never went to uni, and as a grown up with family and thanks to god a stable and good job i burn inside and with 40 i would love to learn, study to go to lectures and enjoy the sheer joy that only knowledge can give you.

[@izebellebluereadsoutloud3715]

Many colleges & universities will let you “audit” a class for free, i.e. just sit in back & listen, take notes for yourself. There’s also lots of continuing/open higher education classes online now, with guest professors from everywhere, maybe it’s called Great Classes, I forget. Neal Degrasse Tyson had a class recently through this platform I can’t remember the name of.

[@imranq9241]

Why not enroll somewhere ? Plenty of great schools out there

[@Skunkhunt_42]

You're here, go to the mit openware website find your courses, download syllabus and tests. Libgen site for your books, plan your pace with the syllabus/calendar that fits your workflow. Have someone check your tests with the key which is also provided on openware page

[@unitedstatesdale]

@@izebellebluereadsoutloud3715 Thanks , Ive been going to a few college lectures. They are probably wondering if I am a administrator.

[@mattgraves3709]

I am very grateful to have the ability to watch a complete Marvin Minsky series. Thank you so much Marvin, I hope you are in some heaven or some interesting afterlife or rebirth. Thank you MIT for making these lectures available for free. What an amazing world.

[@tear728]

I'm sure he and Jefferery Epstein are living it up on an island in heaven 🏝

[@BBMoney007]

@@tear728 you would know Jeffrey

[@x0cx102]

@@tear728 why what did minsky do

[@jarredmartin8141]

“Nothing ever explains anything, you just have to take what you got and make the best of it” ❤

[@GrahamBessellieu]

0:47 ~ “Society of Mind” vs “Emotion Machine” 7:33 ~ Influences 23:20 ~ How to achieve A.I.? 32:57 ~ A.I. Specialties 45:55 ~ Popular Research Methods 1:03:13 ~ Computers & Common Sense 1:11:10 ~ Student Theories 1:24:34 ~ What is a K-line? 1:47:17 ~ Mind-body problem

[@203066111]

thanks bro!

[@jayeisenhardt1337]

@@life42theuniverse That conversation ends at around 18:00 ? 15:48 "In most cultures it might be religion. Which is a sorta science that doesn't use evidence." Small beginnings around the world as religion snuffed out by killing people looking for evidence, he says. Makes ya wonder how Europe with seemingly a mostly related religion and sects had that idea of, 'There is one God. To understand the world is to understand God.' If everyone worships him then it seems it would be easier to join in on that endeavor. Was science getting more refined there than elsewhere because of that? Also religious scholars and noble mathematicians and other well to do rich people seeing learning as a status symbol. War and the arts always seem to hold such status but were learned men as commonly accepted elsewhere? Or is all of that refinement of science simply due to 'the classics' they had learned? Where there was discussion, debate and experimentation. The testing of ideals. Just random thoughts and questions on the internet.

[@life42theuniverse]

@xTop 187 Time changes things, but you actually have to change them yourself.

[@hotelrusty8337]

@@life42theuniverse wtwzs

[@frankmathews1358]

Thank you.

[@r7ndom]

I'm almost done with this course series - I absolutely love it. Thanks so much for posting it. It makes me wish I had spent far more time on my classes when I was in school and had aspired to attend a great university. With this said, being able to watch it without worrying about coursework is also awesome so I can't complain.

[@rommemory282]

just think about it like some ancient school that didn't give degrees to show knowledge, you could either solve the problem or you could not; that is the ubiquitous test.

[@PascalHueting]

@@rommemory282 diiiiieieeeedeiururrreeeert

[@laurayuan7035]

It's amazing to know that there is a course like this.

[@coltonmccoy8194]

I'm glad Minsky was an Alcor member and is safely in a freezer now. If you are reading these comments in 30 years, give me a thumbs up Marv.

[@frederick3467]

Strange comment

[@Freon12661]

Liberty

[@bryzvyy1674]

Technological Singularity is near...

[@maspoetry1]

doesn't cells explode

[@soumilyade1057]

😂

[@user-ig6sc7sg8x]

It is very interesting to see that Minsky often moves his bottle of water on the desk.

[@tovvaar]

Let me tell you about the time when I hanged out with Einstein. I love when teachers share personal histories.

[@sebastianlenzlinger9291]

when they‘re impressive

[@raymondfrye5017]

I met Prof. Minsky in Puerto Rico when Sears Roebuck sponsored his visit. The subject was Computer Science and the Future of Humanity. It was a momentous seminar as his brilliant exposition covered many themes. Genius.1975-1985.Can't recall with precision now.

[@ERICGUTTMANN]

Raymond, you probably met him when my father, Endre Guttmann, brought him over to Puerto Rico. Marvin wanted to promote his book Society of Mind and my wanted to promote his new business, The Computer Institute. My father had been a student of Marvin and they kept a cordial relationship after my father graduated from MIT. Seeing this video and then reading your words have brought many wonderful memories. I wish you the very best in life and I concur, Marvin was truly a one of a kind genius. My dad had a partnership with Sears and that is how it was advertised in the papers. Let me know if any of this rings a bell and if you remember anything particularly meaningful from his talk.

[@patrickhollywood93]

Thank you MIT. Such a great lesson to have for free on KZbin.

[@usmcvet143]

I started watching this while taking a bath and contemplating why I decided earning a doctoral degree was a good thing…..now I’m suddenly invested in this entire series and I will have to watch it all 🤦🏼‍♀️❤️❤️

[@SmokinJokin40]

Pics or it didn’t happen 😍

[@dotcotton3308]

I also want to see your wet wobblers

[@alberts1985]

Poop

[@solarestone]

I love how this dude is so keen on casual humor

[@denduangboutonglang]

Never be able to attend MIT but once walk inside and visit this place. Just stop by and it was my worth experience. I got to visit the place where educated many well known people

[@kamanijefferson638]

When I lived in Cambridge I did the same thing.

[@pragmatictrespasser5274]

Just wanna add Indian scholar Patanjali had an elaborate theory of mind. Although I agree that Eastern philosphers didn't experiment their ideas, but they were great at observation. Most of the eastern ideas come from deep observations of the world.

[@BiancaAguglia]

Have you thought about taking eastern theories you think deserve to be well known and about creating experiments for them? Somebody like you understands well why these theories could be valuable and also why they need to be tested before more people pay attention to them. We can look at ancestors who didn't have the tools or knowledge we have today and continue their efforts. An example of teamwork across ages. 😊

[@pragmatictrespasser5274]

@@BiancaAguglia Yes you are right. Actually when we look at building something we look at a bottom up approach. And for creating an experiment we first need some abstraction or language or a space where we can apply rigour and logic. The ideas I am talking about are very high level, kind of a top view observation. Maybe someday when we have better understanding of bottom level we would be able to understand why some effects were observed at higher level. The cause is the key to AI but clear observations of it's effect can be studied with the works like such of Patanjali as I have mentioned. Something happens in brain and someone observes it minutely that is what I mentioned. But why it happens breaking it down to level of binary and logical memory that is the insurmountable challenge for humans

[@pragmatictrespasser5274]

@@williamhaddoc Yes you are right. Actually, the issue is the texts that we find today contain sutras but not the path how the scholars arrived at those conclusions. So issue is more that if there were experiments through which these sutras were arrived at then either they were not logged in texts or not copied afterwards once conclusions were reached. We do not find any experiments logged in ancient texts, just the sutras that were arrived at. So it feels mysterious. Actually this mystery is very significant. You try to look at vedic maths. It does addition and multiplication and stuff like that but in a different manner. It enables one to perform large calculations mentally. Now, I respect professor Minsky a lot but he says eastern people did not much after arithmatic. Well, the important thing is that even something as basic as arithmatic was done differently. If you are a true philosopher you would love a new way of looking at the same things. Why science was done differently? Why do the conclusions differ for example in field of nutrition? How did people used to think in ancient times? What were thought patterns in those scientific communities? The thing is all this thought is just too much effort. It is just easier for us to shrug off the ancient texts as wrong due to lacking empirical evidences to support their case. I believe, knowledge should be given its due respect no matter from where it is gained. We must not pride ourselves as an advanced civilization but always bow down to all our common ancestors in respect as they might tell us a thing or two that we did not knew. Small details encompass within them whole worlds waiting to be explored.

[@filevo495]

@@pragmatictrespasser5274 YES!!! I deliberately looked through the comments for this pov. I think its all too human to dismiss others' thinking that doesn't fit our narrative. we miss soooo many tricks. how ignorant to call others ignorant haha

[@SuperBrainStorms]

He also said that if you are not questioning old thoughts then you aren’t evolving. Don’t just stand on their shoulders, jump forward.

[@mohsenvand66]

From 48:48 onward, it is the most epic lecture I've ever watched.

[@uelude]

1.75 speed is a wonderful option.

[@phoenixtears25]

Facts. Thank youuuuu

[@drhmufti]

Thanks almost injects him with speed.

[@TehGoddamnBatman]

Rip Dr.Minsky, thanks for all your work

[@myroseaccount]

Can you point to a single contribution to the advancement of our knowledge of AI, Mind or Philosophy? His only significant work was the creation of a small Turning Machine in 1962

[@rblauson]

myroseaccount are you joking ? Lol Amongst many other inventions that I don’t have time to list for you : first head mounted graphical display, confocal microscope, the SNARC, the Turing machine you mentioned, amongst others. Additionally, he is regarded as the father of AI. Without his inspiration, initial expertise, and profound intelligence, AI might never have accelerated to where it is today. The guy was a true genius.

[@kensandale243]

@@rblauson What do you think of his claim that one of Newton's Laws was that kinetic energy is conserved?

[@MyLifeInTheDesert]

@@kensandale243 why do keep leaving the same comment over and over lol

[@imaginaryuniverse632]

You have some very particular requirements for thanking someone for their works 🛀

[@neuroclusterbrainmodel9122]

The ideas presented in Marvin Minsky’s book “The Society of Mind” are further developed in “Neurocluster Brain Model” which analyses the processes in the brain from the point of view of the computer science. The brain is a massively parallel computing machine which means that different areas of the brain process the information independently from each other. Neurocluster Brain Model shows how independent massively parallel information processing explains the underlying mechanism of previously unexplainable phenomena such as sleepwalking, dissociative identity disorder (a.k.a. multiple personality disorder), hypnosis, etc.

[@kevinbissinger]

Unless you have a spectrum disorder in which case you usually lack the crosstalk between brain regions

[@csmrfx]

Sadly the model does not include the primary organs and the hormones these organs use to control the brain. As a result, this type of model will always fail.

[@rommemory282]

do you have any other book suggestions on the topic from other perspectives?

[@neuroclusterbrainmodel9122]

Different researchers working in completely different areas have reached similar conclusions and have built similar prototypes of Neurocluster Brain Model. As for example, Marvin Minsky came to these conclusions while he was trying to create intelligent robot machines, Roger Sperry while he was experimenting with split-brain patients, Pierre Janet while he was experimenting with hypnosis, Joseph-Pierre Durand while he was cutting lower animals in pieces, etc. Starting from around 1890, Pierre Janet, Morton Prince and others had been working seriously in this area of research. However, later, after 1910s, this direction of research was practically forgotten, and later, if anyone tried to work in this direction, they simply reinvented the wheel, not knowing anything about the achievements of the 1890s, and not reaching even the microscopic fraction of what had already been achieved in the 1890s. Google for page “The history of Neurocluster Brain Model” which contains the extensive list of researchers and books. The most complete prototype of Neurocluster Brain Model was described in book “Beyond the Conscious Mind. Unlocking the Secrets of the Self” written by Thomas R. Blakeslee in year 1996.

[@bbbildhuu]

Unintentional asmr

[@izebellebluereadsoutloud3715]

My feed gave me this after listening to some unintentional Noam Chomsky asmr. These scholars really need to hire James Earle Jones or Neal Degrasse Tyson or Wayne Dyer or Kermit the Frog to read their lectures.

[@chrisinderkum9475]

Lol, after coming from one of these unintentional asmr videos I can't stand watching this one without laughing xd

[@SuperMaDBrothers]

Every comment above this one is 100% wrong

[@uelude]

The comment above this one is 100% wrong

[@milcahwhite865]

Zean G merrtlei9$Angeal Home run

[@Krishnaa553]

Priceless! Only gratitude, that I have access to these, Thank you!!

[@emretoner8282]

Wow couldnt be more surprised at Minsky's callous dismissal of ancient wisdom in its totality. Shrodinger himself in "What is life/Mind and Matter" stated that the Vedic conception of consciousness is more amenable to the advances of quantum physics than the objectivation of the external world that underlies the Western tradition (this assumption is challenged within the western tradition with Kant and Schopenhauer--the latter of which was heavily influenced by the Vedic scriptures). The epistemological and ontological value of the Upanishads is not something that can be "jumped off the shoulders from" as modern science's fundamental antinomy is that the very feature through which we come to conclusions about the world (sensual qualities) are never in themselves measured (this is what the student at 12:23 is getting at) and can never be accounted for within this paradigm (for example, the reason we experience the color yellow as yellow at its particular wavelength is not something that we can say a priori) and Shrodinger himself contends this! Of course, the western tradition has provided us with the absolute zenith of logical thinking, the importance of which need not be stated; however, it is ironic that some of the most relatively recent advances into the nature of reality with quantum physics ultimately leave space for the ontological worldview of the Eastern tradition; that the observer effect, for example, belies the idea of a world in itself as an external entity separate from human cognition and might moreso support the implications of the ancient Hindu aphorism of "Thou art that". There are existential questions that will never be able to be "answered " by a reducitonist science as these questions cannot be treated as logical propositions; we should not assume our superiority of insight into the nature of reality over our ancient counterparts simply due to our technological advancements (see Oswald Spengler, Decline of the West).

[@pmcate2]

Just so ya know, the common term "observation" used to describe what causes a wave function collapse is actually a misnomer. Consciousness has nothing to do with the wave function collapse. Schrodinger may have just said that because it was a serious consideration in the beginning.

[@stevenzheng5459]

Content: Philosophy Chalkboard: Probability theory / disjoint mathematics

[@spiderinofiesta3341]

Only clicked for this, the "disconnect" between title and thumbnail

[@akrishna1729]

genuinely thought it was a measure theory course from the thumbnail lol

[@Omnomnomabom]

Ah, the classic college experience of some random girl derailing the lecture 10 minutes in because she can't get over the fact that Confucius =/= Archimedes.

[@amitnilajkar6272]

i have greatest wisdom of life without even meeting him. MIT thank you

[@themarktron]

R.I.P. My hero

[@quronia2151]

Thank you OCW for sharing this course. I'd have to say the professor's lecture is rather difficult to digest. Half of the time he gone tangent and speaks a lot of his biases. His smart talks make it difficult to separate between actual teaching and sarcasm/roasting. Him roasting neuroscience community got funny after 30min or so (LOL) No chill at all.... But seriously, he talks interesting stuff. RIP professor. thank you for the lecture.

[@hling4e]

I am so sad that he is a university professor that only one sided western point of view, saying that Confucius had no teaching and no science proof comparing it to Greek… the girl was right regarding the geometrical basics of Arabe, geometry is base of nature … I hope he doesn’t teach anymore 🤦🏼‍♀️

[@hling4e]

It went wrong because some one sided professor started to teach, like this one 🤢🤮

[@thecollageman3290]

brilliant , picking the right probiem , and asking the right questions, may mean everything

[@javaidbhat9292]

this is wonderful watching MIT lectures in my bedroom .thanks youtube internet who made this possible .love from india

[@ariesomega5787]

Laid the smack down! “If they [ideologies] can’t be tested, why should someone look at them twice?” 👋 😲 😂

[@sarahg2653]

Thank you so much for posting these free to the public!

[@bhaaz]

Love Marvin's conjecture at 1:01:18 on better architectures for a step change from narrow AI: "- Exploiting analogies, rather than inflexible rules. [...] - Using higher levels [higher abstraction] of self-reflective knowledge. - Switching among different Ways to Think. [...] architecture that combines these abilities [...] could also include knowledge about ways to improve itself."

[@MrAnthony59282]

RIP Marvin minsky ..

[@mtr7501]

인간의 본성을 찾아 책들이 가르키는 곳을 보다가.. 우연히 알게된 당신의 글은 한페이지를 읽을때 몇번을 덮고 생각을 하게 만드는지 ^^! 감사하고 당신의 말에 크게 공감합니다

[@frankmathews1358]

The society of mind. What a blessing.

[@clouderdataer]

This guy is a living historical book ...

[@ludwigvonn9889]

I use this to fall asleep. Thanks.

[@jpb10]

How is that chalk so bright?

[@mitocw]

The large chalk used is called railroad chalk. Many MIT instructors use the chalk to ensure students can read the chalkboard easily in the large classrooms.

[@frederick3467]

@@mitocw Good answer

[@EmilFr2002]

This type of content makes my life feel worth of living

[@Nick-fb9uq]

1:22:20 if the "close enough" attitude is good enough for Marv, it's good enough for me!

[@hling4e]

I am glad for the channel in publishing it, so we can have evidence what went wrong in education 🙃

[@christopherrobbins9985]

Marvin is just so damn brilliant. Funny as hell too.

[@kensandale243]

"Marvin is just so damn brilliant." What do you think of his claim that one of Newton's Laws was that kinetic energy is conserved?

[@David-sw2rj]

@@kensandale243 He said brilliant, not perfect. What do you think of Newton's claim that he could turn lead into gold? You know, that whole alchemical obsession he had?

[@brad1368]

@@kensandale243...Newton though time was absolute. He was wrong, but he was still brilliant.

[@notagain3732]

Im back for more , rewatching some parts . My subconcious knows this is better than Netflix . 3 or 20 years from know i will be glad i watched this instead of some drama ...this is far more useful... Like going to the gym instead of going to a fast food restaurant but for brain cells

[@exas4791]

I don't understand why he brought up a religious figure like Buddha, although the concept of karma is like the scientific law of action-reaction. Perhaps the lady in the audience was asking what about any Eastern thinkers who led to inventions, such as the following ? --- paper, printing, gunpowder and compass by China; -- Hindu-Arabic numeral system or Indo-Arabic numeral system; -- algebra by a Persian polymath Muḥammad ibn Mūsā al-Khwārizmī ; -- etc.

[@hegerwalter]

The next class in this topic. kzbin.info/www/bejne/bHK2ZWucib11eNU The thing about common sense is that there are lots of things that we as humans understand as common, but either don't express it, or don't use it at the time it is necessary. Or maybe we flood the solution space with things that don't work, and it takes time to realize that they won't work. A good example that someone mentioned is that it took many years for people to formulate an algorithm for sorting. You would have thought that someone in the 1500's would have written that and completely "solved" it, considering that at that time, some mathematicians were trying to factorize 3rd order polynomials already then.

[@rodolfomaggisasso6088]

Does he really wrote in his first slide “which culture to save?” between the problems for which machines are required to be developed? I Can’t believe it! 🤯

[@isaacsaffran8714]

This was such a stimulating lecture my neurons ate it up

[@jondoc7525]

This put me right to sleep like I was in that Boring class in school , but I keep watching it and get it lol

[@MrRaggarRobban]

About music ... “If you want to find the secrets of the universe, think in terms of energy, frequency and vibration // Nikola Tesla ..

[@CrazyMutherTrucker]

I love this man, he has brilliant ideas and an asmr voice. I never paid attention to his compulsion level tho. Do NOT WATCH THE VIDEO...ONLY LISTEN. HE will drive you insane in the 1st 5 minutes with the way he keeps moving the papers and water bottle and whatever else is on the table. Not sure if it's age related or if that's just him. But the 1st time I played this course, I never watched, this time I made the mistake

[@andrewjackson7758]

It's interesting the back and forth with the East Asian student around 11:30 or thereabouts, because the method of debate is quite rigorous without biased or prejudiced remarks. They're on opposite sides of the issue, but it stays civil and professional.

[@FUEGOSTARR]

Yes and as it is expected to be. Many people aren’t capable of asking questions and having their beliefs challenged without becoming hostile. But this is a generally professional and intellectual environment. Civility is the most basic standard.

[@radscorpion8]

oh for crying out loud. That's standard for literally any university. What do you think we do there, scream and throw chairs at each other? lol

[@atkgrl]

1:41:14. We must remember that numbers, maths are just a way of communication, a language of expression, of explaining, describing what already exist then using the language to express what might be. It is not the end or the completenesses only a tool and all people do not know that language so we must understand that we can still explain and e press ideas or concepts using other languages, and even if people don’t speak certain languages they will speak others some have gone extinct and other waiting birth. It does not mean existence stops, it means you must free your mind of constraints and move to creation.

[@SaturnElena]

thank you! lets see how fast can I finish viewing these lectures

[@wishfulpolymath]

No fault of the professor to not recognise any eastern philosophers- there is the culture and linguistic barrier to cross as most of the ancient works haven't been translated into English yet

[@justgivemethetruth]

12:20 - He is comparing the comments of an Ancient Greek/Roman about translucency ... i.e. physics, and using it to judge/compare to Eastern Buddhist religion ... without commenting or mentioning the weird pantheon of gods, goddesses and other theories of "meta"-physics from religion at that time. He is not making a lot of sense, at least in that section and is almost borderline xenophobic.

[@viniciomonge3960]

Give an example of an eastern philosopher that studied philosophy of mind and enlighten us

[@justgivemethetruth]

@@viniciomonge3960 What does your trolling have anything to do with what I said. What to be a jerk!

[@jf8050]

I like when he clears the snot out of his throat every ten seconds. I would pay big money to see this guy teach at a public school in South Chicago.

[@JS-nl4wq]

@MIT opencourseware Please put English Captions for better understanding.

[@lyndelo3174]

Just hit the cc button

[@travisfitzwater8093]

What took humans so long (to progress as woefully inadequately as that animal species as) is the fascinating dearth of meta-abstract thinking among that animal species.

[@big1boston]

I prefer Manly Palmer Hall. I love all knowledge that is provided.

[@bhaaz]

The student's question at 9:27 is spot on; - I would also kindly suggest that the Western-Eastern spectrum needs further scrutiny. In particular, the continuum, discrete steps or phase space (as you like it) stretching between (i) exclusive identity or quale (Aristotle: "A is either A or NOT-A, no third way can exist. He called this the excluded middle."); (ii) combined or permissive identity and quale (Talmud: "A or NOT-A are not exclusive, A AND Not-A can and does exist, this IS the third way. You could call it the permissive middle."); and (iii) the inclusive identity and/or quale (Buddhism: A AND Not-A is only part of the picture. NOT-Not-A isn't necessarily A, there is always more to the story. The outcome of the other negation depends on context, which is always changing subtly, both objectively and subjectively, within you and me and between you and me. This is the fourth or Tetra-lemmic way. You could call it inclusive negation.") Think then on Minsky's marvelous analogies at 27:19, 33:01 and 45:46, and Feynman's theory multiplicity equivalence at 31:26. Marvin himself says that this is the Way, even in AI research. He does declare it as his "dao" or credo as surely as Feynman does in his own way: - combining perspectives on ways to think and theorize. The Way of the WAY, if you like: The Western (exclusive) way of the Eastern Dao just as well as the other way around: the Eastern (syncretic) dao of the Western Way. And, of course, that may not exclude the Middle-Eastern/ West-Asian Talmudic (permissive) thinking in between. Not to mention the incredibly rich Hindu way from which Buddhism has sprung and on which my fellow PhD friend keeps educating me. [There would be quite a bit to unpack in this, my own doctorate was on computational design, and I am still only scratching the surface. If you too feel inspired to correspond, look me up at ottonewhouse on linkedin, or onewhouse [at] yahoo [dot] com. I read on Cybernetics, Applied category theory, and Categorical systems theory. Cheers]

[@itssanti]

On the ancient eastern western divide, Marvin is quasi right. On the arabic sciences he aimed solely at algebra, wich started there and reached a high school limit as he said. But in reality the field of science the arabs or their conquered territories advanced the most was medicine wich has a different method. The theory of viruses ( althou not as we know it today) started there and the principles of hospitalization and isolation of a patient also started there. But as he noted, barbarism stopped many of the advancing civilizations regading science, in the case of the arab world, it was the mongols.

[@theunpopularmindset5273]

I’ve seen less back and forth movement with chess pieces than he made with the water bottle on his desk.

[@rickknight3823]

He'd just watched a of Jackie Chan espousing the "be water my friend" quote...

[@agimasoschandir]

Maybe he wasn't playing chess🙃

[@thesmilegame]

Hello Fellow students.

[@smb2735]

These are a treasure. Thanks for posting!

[@Ronbo710]

"Abstract means stupid." I love his non PC approach lol !!

[@chuckstarwar7890]

I had the very early version of "Society of Mind" 1986 and he gave a two lectured about his book in 1987. It was still the winter time of AI.

[@VoxxEU]

The question ~10 minute mark about the list being Western philosopher dominated is a valid one. Unfortunately the student couldn't point to them but relevant names like Avicenna, al-Farabi, Huineng, Samkhya, Xun Kuang, et. al. come to mind. Professor Minsky as brilliant as he was does intellectual curiosity, (and himself), a great disservice by brushing the students point aside. I'm not saying one is better than the other but the negating tone towards Eastern philosophy, especially in the Anglo-American school was quite obvious during my studies as well. One wonders, if as predicted the East ascends to power over the West, if many of those on the list will be so unabashedly dismissed.

[@DipayanPyne94]

Actually, Science and Maths really began in the West. In Ancient Greece ALONE. Other cultures were great as well, but not as good. Philosophy PROPER started in Greece.

[@VoxxEU]

​@@DipayanPyne94 That's simply incorrect. There was science in the Fertile Crescent and Egypt well before Ancient Greece. Likewise Ancient Sumerians had math before Ancient Greece. The archeological evidence is pretty conclusive.

[@DipayanPyne94]

No. I meant the Foundations of Science and Math. That began in Ancient Greece with a Departure from the Supernatural for the very first time in human history. Ancient Egypt, Sumeria, Mesopotamia etc were not fully naturalised. Plus, they didn't come up with Syllogistic Reasoning. It all started in Greece. The Greeks did something unique in the history of mankind. That is why we are still continuing the Greek Intellectual Tradition, even today ...

[@VoxxEU]

​@@DipayanPyne94 You stated they "began" in the West which isn't true. Even if we shift it to the term foundation, it is still incorrect since foundations are prior to improvements. As for a departure from supernatural, Ancient Greek science and philosophy was rife with belief in their pantheon of gods. I'll grant you that the Ancient Greeks improved upon mathematics and science, but in the same token so did the Chinese, Indians, Persians, Arabs. To this day we use Arabic numbers and the term for algebra (Arab, al-jabr) was coined by a Persian mathematician. The reason the West is so pro Ancient Greece while not acknowledging the contributions of other likely has more to do with geopolitics and religion than it does with intellectual honesty.

[@DipayanPyne94]

Oh. Not true at all. No other culture ever came up with anything like Aristotle's Logic, Euclid's Elements etc etc. Logic comes from the Greek word Logos. Other cultures never made advances as great. In fact, India was HEAVILY influenced by Greece, post Alexander in India in 326 BC. Indians, Chinese etc didn't have Deductive Reasoning like the Ancient Greeks. Even Theories about Nature were nowhere as good in those other cultures. The Greeks single handedly came up with all of that original stuff and that has never been paralleled. The Greeks were the First Perfect Naturalists, Radical Sceptics and Methodologists. You simply don't have any other cultures that used Reasoning the way the Greeks did. Even in the field of Ethics, the Greeks were like no one else. Their Ethics was PURELY Reason based. Who started it ? Socrates. Who continued it ? Well, everybody else in the west, EVER SINCE ! The ENTIRE world today is Greek. And it will continue to be so. And this is coming from me, an Indian, who has understood the whole thing ...

[@jankareaustinat310]

Alltid takk MIT

[@MrZnSstr]

I don't know how youtube ended up here, but I had a lucid dream about being on Mars and investigating somebody that was killing for water. There was a big city surrounded by a wall and had a man made river that was going only inside that city and people outside that city were surviving in caves, once I managed to get inside the city they had better technology than our current technology, their guns were melting people till only the bones were left and their letters were none like ours but they all had small symbols above them and the text wasn't separated by space. Long story short I think my brain was receiving something intelligent while I was asleep and it made me have an awesome dream.

[@laserprawn]

Eastern religious thinkers - could say Avicenna or Averroes, since they saved Aristotle; whose text and work triggered the Enlightenment in Europe upon their re-discovery. The Western Roman empire lost the Greek language as a result of their deterioration, and so only in Byzantium and the Arab world did Aristotle remain primary, as Western Europe plunged into the dark ages for a thousand years.

[@cvbabc]

No South American, African or Polynesians cognitive psychologists either. Sheesh

[@haroldlieberman3314]

I was not good enough at anything to get into this amazing school.

[@VictoryXR]

🐐🐐🐐🐐🐐GOAT MINSKY THE GREATEST OF ALL TIME

[@marysheilds9966]

Augustine was the great redactor making possible science and philosophy. There are many holes in atheism none the least is unwarranted prejudice and constant straw man logical fallacies.

[@adryrodriguez5245]

Im getting asmr AND learning new interesting topics!!

[@Tis2much4ya]

The fact that this showed up under ASMR lol

[@savantofillusions]

I’ve had to realize recently that they did primitive neuroscience which was nearly as accurate as it could have been in the 30s

[@StephanieSoressi]

If only the sound was better; Minsky is so soft spoken, I can barely make out what he's saying.

[@happyraj3396815]

Thank you for this amazing lecture. Many valuable points highlighted here .💎💎💎💎💎

[@paulr2353]

I would not do well at MIT. Just wonder if anyone knows what this guy is actually teaching. I’ve watched several of his lectures and he just keeps telling random facts and anecdotes.

[@jimreily7538]

"Society of Mind" ? He appeals to people who haven't worked in the physical sciences, because, well, he's teaching at MIT and has some personal characteristics that they enjoy, his manner of speech and so forth. You're better off spending time doing the physics, mathematics and chemistry courses that MIT offers on OCW. "If this (old) man expresses himself in terms to deep for me, why what a very singularly deep (old) man, this old man must be." That's his appeal.

[@justinneilonCA]

He fixed the R!! Great lecture!!! :)

[@savantofillusions]

@MIT OCW Marvin, the set that contains itself has to be a physical object made of what it’s made of taking up space which then becomes not space but the objects spatial form

[@savantofillusions]

And Marvin died not cool

[@agimasoschandir]

Why does it have to be physical?

[@diamondplate]

The bottle is still not aligned correctly.

[@misc792]

Minsky is wrong. Arabic mathematics advanced a great deal of trigonometry and optics. Many advanced mathematics degree stuff, not 'middle of highschool algebra'. See the works of Ibn Al Haytham, he advanced the field up to hyperbolic geometry. But Minsky does not appear to have been aware of history of science as much as he thought he did. Though to be fair, translation of his works have been publicized relatively recently, however he had been quoted by Copernicus, Descartes, was well known during the renaissance. His works in logic have also been discussed in the recent book The Enigma of Reason, his works were far superior to Aristotle's. Oh and he composed a book about how Ptolemy is wrong in a bunch of theory, exhibiting testing of theory that Minsky mistakenly says only the Greeks worked at. Oh and his optical experiment is where the word camera comes from Q-M-R in Arabic, literally meaning shrouded in Darkness, reference to Camera Obscura.

[@AL-SH]

Most of the mathematics used in Algebra were discovered and invented by Persian mathematicians, scientists, poets, philosophers, and astronomers. The Persians were far more advanced academically than Arabs. Sadly though, everything that had belonged to the Persian empire and its people was confiscated by the Arab Muslim army who had already conquered Persia.

[@awatefabobaker5982]

@@AL-SH they learned Arabic in purpose of understanding the words of allah after that they become greater we as an arab declare such matter how ever they decide to live and be in arab land and they are welcomed

[@chelsealanecreation]

Wow, this helped me so much… thank you

[@thecollageman3290]

simple is fun like playing , in the sand box. Than you so much for this.

[@coemoney]

Thank you. 🙏 🕊 Rest Easy King

[@tombouie]

Enlightening, I'm ashame to admire the work of Dr Minsky after whether before his death. I don't really seem to get smarter ; I'm cursed to only get less dumb it seems.

[@eve_ai_jiang6979]

The Dunning-Kruger affect at work then. The smarter you are, the dumber you feel. The dumber you are, the smarter you feel.

[@rorschach3005]

I might be completely out of my depth here but when professor Minsky says that its the neurologists who are supposed to prove/disprove the theory about k lines and that the idea is whats important even if you havent proved it yet then wouldnt same apply to the abstract thought experiments of eastern philosophers ? Could it be possible that someone like Budha through observation came up with an ideology or a theory of life and we are yet to define an experiment that can test this ?

[@MauricioJaguan]

Yes it's what happened. It's impossible to prove. Incompleteness theorem

[@webstarspace]

1:55:51/about the part of the lecture implicating the existence of the mind independent of the body..... brain creates a mind and to do that our brain interacts with the body that is made of the same cells and genes as our brain it is ..... it would be nice to know..... how the mind gets initiated? can we depict/compute the created mind? can it be successfully transplanted to another body/machine?

[@slamrock17]

I don't claim to have answers but I do have an interesting thought to share. Let's parse three subjects, consciousness, the mind, and quantum/conventional physics. Consciousness is something that exists independent from the mind. The mind is a tap into consciousness that allows a stream of information to be broadcasted through an individual. Consciousness is what sets the rules of the universe both on a quantum level and on the macro level. Consciousness is an inherent force just like gravity or friction. When we think we interact with consciousness but we also interact with it when we walk across the sidewalk and the atoms in our feet repel the sidewalk atoms. This interaction of atoms repeling is set by a rule just like the many rules that make up the logic gates of your mind. The mind furthermore is just a physical representation of consciousness in a specific space and time. When we say the mind and body are separate, we are dead wrong the mind is more than just the body It is an amalgamation of information derived both externally and internally. The mind is a product of physically interacting with the medium of the universal consciousness. This universal consciousness is formed through the particle interactions and interconnected electrons throughout the universe. Another way to view this consciousness is as a universal quantum internet. This quantum internet is how our minds connect to consciousness. Consciousness is like the information repository for reality. All possibilities exist within our universe but so does all of the information surrounding those possibilities.Just because you haven't thought about hearing the tree fall in the middle of the woods doesn't mean that thought doesn't exist.

[@getowtofheyah3161]

The measure theory or probability lecture notes that one of the previous lecturers ostentatiously left on the chalk board makes a good clickbait thumbnail for this lecture. I’d rather listen to his lecture anyway, so it works.

[@yookoT]

I come to him because of Prof. Winston's lecture. But I wouldn't say I like his attitude toward Eastern Philosophy and neurologists. I also feel sad and sorry for his passing, can't help but wonder what he would say if he saw the things LLMs can do now.

[@DipayanPyne94]

His attitude towards Eastern Philosophy is right. Eastern Philosophy never became as Rational as the West. Philosophy PROPER started in Greece.

[@cropsey7]

I’ve never heard anyone attempt such ideas as to try to break down a natural leaning process in the spirit of attempting to recreate it mechanically or digitally.

[@create_consume]

The comment regarding DARPA around 1:30:00 is interesting... that source of funding seems to align with a lot of financial shifts from the 80's - 00's in which capitalism became priority over progress.

[@antikoerper256]

What a privilege to watch stuff like this for free and readily accessible through the power of the Internet. The US truly is the leading global scientific power

[@finchbevdale2069]

But the Web was invented by a Brit doing research in Switzerland,

[@yohiioni1973]

@@finchbevdale2069 who told you that lie?

[@FUEGOSTARR]

@@finchbevdale2069 well even if that is the case, that doesn’t change the fact that many forms of information are widely accessible in the US region.