What can a $500 CNC Router Do?! TwoTrees TTC450 Review

[@craigpattillo4765]

I've had this machine for about 2 months now and have yet to use it because of many problems from the beginning. I had a bad relay in the 500w control box as well, it never came on one time. Tech support made me do tons of testing and make videos of what I was doing to prove it was bad. Finally 4 weeks later they sent me a new control box like they did for you. Since then, I have had to replace one of the Y motors and some wires. Now still trying to figure out why the Y axises are moving in the opposite direction. Tech support is really responsive, but it's only through email or Whatsapp between 1am - 4am. They would rather you rebuild the entire machine than replace it with a new one. Now I understand why it is a $5oo dollar cnc! I would not buy another one or any other of their products.

[@mattivirta]

if you has change motor and run opposite direct, motor has wired wrong, not have same, and software can change were motor run, too.

[@0Logan05]

I bought one, 2 years ago.. No issues.. The few times I reached out regarding other things TT has been great… 🤙🏻

[@colinwilson8747]

Good honest review. Thanks

[@ModernHobbyist]

Thanks for watching!

[@ThatGuy-dj3qr]

This is the third review of this machine I have watched and not one reviewer bought the vacuum attachment. Is there a reason you opted for no dust/chip removal? To me it seems like an obvious option unless there is a design issue with the vaccuum assembly. By the way, thanks for the excellent, honest review.

[@ModernHobbyist]

I might have to make a separate review about that but TwoTrees sent me this machine so I didn’t really get a say in what they included unfortunately. Appreciate the feedback though!

[@basdatch]

I bought the vaccum, it makes a huge difference. It's not perfect but you get maybe 90% less chips flying everywhere. And the LED attached is a nice touch. Only design flaw is maybe the tube has to be carefully set, when I started a job I didnt see it was touching the 500w spindle fan so it melted it a bit -_- but that's probably on me though

[@madbuldog]

The TTC 450 Pro is the actual upgrade to this machine, with much of the issues already or partialy delt with.

[@thomcarr7021]

The one necessity for successful marching is rigidity. Even a slight flex (.005") will cause chattering and an ugly edge. There is just no getting around it. As the video shows, the "spindle" can be seen moving at an angle unintentionally when there is resistance. This will only increase as the cheap alum frame is used.

[@chiboreache]

portal made from bakelite 🤭

[@goingbonzo5923]

Yeah and the only way around it is reduced feed rate and reducing the depth of your bite. More time consuming is all. I guess for the ultimate hobbyist it would be okay.

[@thomcarr7021]

@@goingbonzo5923 The cutter will still flex all over at low speed. The fix is to buy something you can actually use.

[@goingbonzo5923]

@thomcarr7021 you're probably right. I was looking at the shapeoko, but it's like 1800 for the cheapest one, although they are rated well when it comes to rigidity.

[@AkieShak]

thanks for the review, really helps, im on laser cutting and want to try to get one TTC 450 pro, was doing some study on them

[@frontcentermusician]

Went round and round with them when I ordered the Pro version a couple weeks ago. Hope the support is going to work out better if I do need help down the line.

[@ÆCME]

Great review and peice on this. Only issue is isn't the software cost more than the cnc ?? I know there's free cnc cad's out there but I've heard there dreadful... I know that's a separate issue, but would have been good if we could have seen the software & inputting the shapes you created, An excellent video. Thank-you

[@eightsprites]

Seems like a really good hobby sized machine. I know nothing about CNC, but I had 3D printers. Interesting machine.

[@BleuCollarFndryMTL]

Great review, I found it very useful

[@TheElectronicDilettante]

All of these budget cnc’s have two easily, and cheaply remedied issues. First, should have mounted vacuum inlet as close to the bit as possible so as to keep the cut path clear and the bit cool. Second, how they mount the spindle motors, is completely inadequate. It should have a big beefy aluminum mount as close to the work as possible and another at the top. I bet as a bit starts to cut you could measure measure the deflection of the motor with a wooden ruler. Should be barely measurable with a dial indicator. Good review and video.

[@ÆCME]

Definitely, also as you say a bigger substantial motor would/might provide good weight distribution on required bit & maybe that would prevent chattering?? But all in all for 500 bucks it's a good entry point into cnc operations

[@spudnickuk]

Nice little machine and review but it only looks good enough to cut PCB and some pine but for engraving it may do a bit better as it will have less forces on the gantry . But man Don't keep on swapping your measurements from Imperial to Metric just stick to one if not you will get into a lot of trouble

[@imaginitivity7853]

That a company can supply a product that appears to have had no testing prior to dispatch is not a good sign. If they offer the 500 watt upgrade they should first endure the order supply/control is capable

[@gio-yj3en]

What is the precision and usefulness for PCB design?

[@rizos0604]

what are the noise levels when the machine is working?

[@MortillaroCustoms]

i keep watching reviews of these hobby machines and every time i get to the end Im left thinking my 50's Bench master Mill is still better. Having owned some serious CNC's in the past these all feel like toys.

[@WalkerRileyMC]

Your Benchmaster is a professional tool used in the workplace. These are hobbyist tools used for someone who's having fun. Insulting a hobbyiest cause they aren't buying a tool that is just way more than they need for the job is just asinine.

[@MortillaroCustoms]

​​@@WalkerRileyMC I was not intending to insult anyone for their choice of tool. I was purely commenting on my experience and the limitations I see these units having. That said a bench master mill is very much a hobbyist machine it just happens to come from a very different era of production. It was sold and advertised as a hobby level machine at the time. I'm not boosting either it cost me less than one of these but also requires a totally different skill set to use.

[@SorenX2008]

Why would you be comparing a milling machine, or a CNC mill, to a CNC wood router?

[@MortillaroCustoms]

​@@SorenX2008because I use my mill for all my wood and metal work and I'm debating between getting a dedicated CNC or converting my Mill to CNC with a DRO. The cost for either is similar.

[@MortillaroCustoms]

​@@Mike-pb7jm Where can I find it that cheap? I've been seeing $450-$500 if I can find one of these for $150 I'll definitely jump on that if only to use for layout lines.

[@factsoverfeelings21]

I’ve had to use a shop vac a lot with aluminum and the shocking sucks. Weirdest thing I use in my vacuum cleaners are dryer sheets. But with the shop vac I hold the hose with a dryer sheet and I haven’t had any shocking. Hahahahahaha

[@4110mahindra]

Distance from spoilboard to bottom of z axis looks less than the z axis travel

[@Enolagay8545]

What software are you using for design, Word, Fusion 360, Excel, etc.?

[@mattivirta]

normal used, Vcarve, fusion, freecad, inscape, many free cad/cam software have, and lot have cracked software what hobby user can use home.

[@andygibson289]

If you f up a cut. Can you restart where it stops at? Or do you trash the material?

[@trentbikes]

Maybe just ground your tram/bed to the mains ground. That should help with static electricity.

[@stoney268]

Nice review! Thanks for that! How do you think this compares to like a Stepcraft D600?

[@timrb]

I found if you try to move an axis too fast, or if the steps per mm is wrong for that axis, the axis will lock up.

[@mattivirta]

normal stepper motor if use too fast then loose step and freeze or not run right, and this have too small stepper motors lose easy steps, what biggest motor have then better can run, if need fast need change all line new and use motors lot more voltage, more volt mean more speed, biggest motor mean more torque and not lose steps easy, perfect change motor drivers biggest and motors, perfect cnc can use 80-90volt and motor max amperes have 5-8A lot normal used 4A 40volt and motor nema 23 or 34 and torgue minimum have 3NM/470 OZ or better motor, not lose steps and better make work.

[@hunkydorian]

You've got the cap, you've got the black hoodie, you've got the half-a55ed beard, you're ready to go !!

[@olafschermann1592]

Is there a device that is capable of milling as well as laser engraving?

[@WHJeffB]

Great review... I get that you were trying to push the limits of the machine for this review, but one thing I've found with a lot of the complaints about the various inexpensive China sourced CNC machines (routers, lasers, etc...) is that people try to push them too much. They're not industrial machines. They're not meant for pumping out parts 8hrs a day, 5-6 days a week. If you're a hobbyist, what's your hurry? I mean seriously... Dial down the feed rate, don't be so aggressive with your cuts and you'll find you'll get much better results. If you're intent is to do production work with one of these types of machines, you're barking up the wrong tree and need to rethink your goals. I have one of those $1200 12" x 20" 50W CO2 Chinese laser systems and it's great... Does everything I want it to, but I'm patient and don't push it too far or too fast. BTW... For cutting aluminum, use Isopropyl Alcohol as a cutting fluid. Stinks a lot less than tapping fluid and it will evaporate without leaving any residue. The usual warning about using it in a confined space, with any open flame applies. For a shock resistant chip removal, make an extension for your vacuum nozzle out of cardboard tube... Should mitigate or eliminate any shocking issues. Again... Great, non-biased review. I've been considering this machine for routing acrylic sheet to make parts that I'll convert to metal by burning the acrylic out of investment molds.

[@ModernHobbyist]

Thanks for the feedback! I actually had a bit talking about this exact same thing (this is a hobbyist machine, priced to reflect that, etc...) but it didn't make the cut unfortunately cause it came off a little more frustrated sounding than I intended. I see lots of the same complaints about these hobbyist machines and I agree with your response, this machine isn't meant for that. For a $500 machine it's pretty good! Thanks again for the comment, glad you liked the review! 👍

[@WHJeffB]

@@ModernHobbyist I think you covered the shortcomings well enough that it should be obvious to most that this is not a machine you use for heavy production and that people need to have realistic expectations for it. I guess I've seen too many people complaining that these hobby machines don't hold up, or that they can't turn one into a full time Etsy knick-knack maker. At least on the laser side. You need a machine (like an Epilog or Universal) that's an order of magnitude more expensive for that... But anyway. Enjoy your honest, no nonsense take on this machine.

[@johncaldwell9842]

I would like to know what the name of the machine and brand you have when you said "I have one of those $1200 12" x 20" 50W CO2 Chinese laser systems". I don't have a machine yet, and don't really know anything about them, but I want to get started without having the hassle he went through. Also does the machine you mentioned cut through acrylic with the laser? Cutting acrylic was what I had in mind.

[@mattivirta]

hobby users not need industrial machine ewer, newer used 8 H/day 7day/week. hobby user use machine normal about 1-5 hour/week,

[@bill5552]

thanks for the review.....I will look elsewhere for my machine.

[@andymoss4285]

You should CNC a wooden end for your vac, see if that stops the static shocks which kill the machines 😂

[@pinkeye00]

I'm opt'd for a Shapeoko tbh.

[@pdxcerealkilla9847]

Isn't that way more money and not even in this price class?

[@pontiacg445]

@@pdxcerealkilla9847 What is this price class? Useless??

[@pdxcerealkilla9847]

@@pontiacg445 it doesn't seem useless at all and seems pretty capable for $500

[@Peter-i7y1q]

Great video! What do you mean by "with the understanding to not throw any punches"? I'm not a native speaker and I'm unsure whether this means it's a sponsored video? There's nothing wrong with having a sponsored video I just don't understand your remark :)

[@ModernHobbyist]

Thanks! I said “I’m not gonna pull any punches” which basically means I’m not gonna take it easy on the machine. Many KZbinrs choose not to mention negative aspects of machines because they want the company to keep sending them free stuff, but I aim to never do that. Hope that helps and thanks for watching!

[@philwhite3760]

How well does it cut carbon fiber sheets? I'm looking for an inexpensive router for cutting frame components

[@mattivirta]

not inexpensive, have ower price ,expensive, can save 200-300$ buy other machine, and lot better machine can build DIY, buy only parts save 50% money. normal men can build same or better machine easy in home.

[@eraser465]

Funny they didn't provide the same courtesy to me, must be I'm not reviewing thier product.

[@ModernHobbyist]

That’s too bad! I didn’t actually tell them I was reviewing their product, but maybe they had my email flagged 🤔

[@OverflowMusicStudio]

Can this machine cut thick industrial felt?

[@mattivirta]

felt, leather, wood, maybe little pass aluminium too. spindle power not have good not can cut fast, need slowly speed and feed this weak spindle, no power, normal used 800W spindle max 1-2mm pass to wood, 1,5KW spindle better more can, normal used 2,2KW spindle hobby cnc machines. but need change all stepper motors too biggest. minimum have nema 23 470 OZ motors drivers need handle 3-6ampere, motor max ampere need be. good cnc hobby user cnc machine have nema 23 or 34 4-6 ampere motors torgue more than 500 OZ 3-9NM about, drivers can use lot more voltage normal about 40-90 volt. amperes need motor maximum 4-9A. spindle minimum need be 1,5KW whit VFD. thats is normal hobby users small cnc minimum parts. if have smallest spindle and stepper motors can use only lot smallest chip and pass, need lot lot more time and run work program lot more time cut anythink, smalles pass need use weak motors.

[@ManosDanger]

How much noise do these machines make when cutting acrylic? I would love to get one of those to play around with but I live in an apartment and dont want to send my neighbors to the insane asylum from the noise

[@ModernHobbyist]

That’s a tough call, this machine is actually rather quiet compared to most CNC routers but it’s still a CNC router. 😬

[@СергейЛеонидович-э5ъ]

Громко.Сделай деревянный коробок

[@Tom-v7i]

Can you make a video on how to program the things that you wanna make.Thanks

[@urban2153]

That really isn't a cnc machine specific video. Learning how to cad and cam is software dependant, and there are many options, but the process being creating a file and exporting gcode in a format that is compatible with your cnc controller. Free options tend to require more self investigation. Enjoy the journey.

[@Tom-v7i]

@ so it’s not a CNC machine but it’s a CNC controller?

[@williamcattr267]

11:05 So, in other words, you'd better off using a vacuum that is made for cleaning a computer to eliminate ESD.

[@frontcentermusician]

All you technical clowns need to move on. This is a hobby machine not industrial like some of you seem to think it needs to be. Not everybody can afford machines the will work 8 hours a day and produce industrial type of work. LOL.... amazing.

[@gregrburnett3400]

In one of your videos you were wearing an Iowa State sweatshirt; are you in Iowa?

[@ModernHobbyist]

Yup!

[@annebokma4637]

Is this a side quest like "where in the world is the friendly hobbyist"? 😂 And the winner is the one who doxxes you first? Free $500 CNC machine is the price? 😂😂😂

[@LuxuryMixes]

Para cortar mdf de 15 mm de cuantas pasadas estaria bien?

[@mattivirta]

500W spindle about 15 pass, 1mm/run pass. 1,5KW spindle 2 pass, 2,2KW spindle 1 pass. but need be sure stepper motors not lose steps, need minimum nema 23 or 34 motors 3-6ampere max current, 40-90volt, and stepper motor drivers need be same size. and of course, power supply too. normal used minimum small cnc machine 40volt 3Ampere motors and drivers.torque minimum 470 OZ about 3Nm. nema 17 motors can use only 3D printer or laser no need torque move.

[@andygibson289]

Do these cnc machines use a vector file format? Or would i need to learn a new system? I hope not as, I was a short bus student. Sadly, thing is I went to military school. They would send a mini van to make sure I didn't get lost walking across from housing across the yard to our education building.

[@1dboucher]

You need to earth your shop vac hose

[@WHJeffB]

Make a nozzle extension from a cardboard tube... End of shocking your machine.

[@minutemenapparel]

How do you earth shop vac hose?

[@1dboucher]

To ground a shop vac hose, you can wrap a bare copper wire around the hose's spiral and connect it to the machine's frame. This prevents static electricity from building up in the hose and ductwork.

[@johnholmes6897]

You have a 3d printer? Make a cover for the stop button so you can't accidentally turn it off

[@arbjful]

I think he could mill the part easily

[@mattivirta]

not totally need, any not bush E-stop accidentally. need be open can fats stop machine if have g-code errors etc, other accident or bit go broken etc.

[@mattivirta]

@@arbjful not easy, need lto time and lot pass, not can cut and mill lot chip one pass. too small spindle and stepper motors no torque and power working good.

[@alpha_pixel_]

500w spindle and a cheap relay for control. It should be a contactor atleast.

[@Krispy1011]

a relay is a contactor but they chose to use a really cheapo

[@mattivirta]

first spindle need change minimum 800W or better 1,5KW -2,2KW spindle.

[@hunkydorian]

@@Krispy1011 No

[@Krispy1011]

@@hunkydorian a relay is definitely a small contactor - it has contactor tips and a energizing coil. We are not talking much power here, 500W, that's nothing. These mini-relays should be able to handle 10 amps with no issues. I'm done.

[@gcou812]

your link to the 2 trees site contains a trojan

[@lawrencerasmus]

Servo , never stepper😮

[@mattivirta]

hobby user buy stepper motors because have small budget, any hobby user not have money waste lot to motors, stepper motor cost normal cnc 30-50$ pcs, and servo motors whit drivers 500-2000$ only idiot waste money lot servo if build small cnc, and only hobby user, intdustial user servo because need lot more power,fast speed and biggest work.

[@hunkydorian]

@mattivirta Do you not know what a stepmotor is?

[@XristianikoOrthodoxo]

Μπορεί κάποιος να με βοηθήσει να το δουλέψω;Το λογισμικό εγκαταστάθηκε, αλλά δεν δουλεύει.Ουτε με το τηλεχειριστήριο.

[@OnefinityCNC]

When you are ready for a real CNC, let us know :P

[@ModernHobbyist]

Hit me up! 👍

[@pedrofontes8494]

Try to contact them if you’re not a KZbinr, this video proofs this machine sucks. Bad publicity

[@olafschermann1592]

Looks like it is as complicated or even more as 3D printing.

[@simmysi5156]

When you said you got a free machine from the company and that it's honest I stopped watching.

[@ModernHobbyist]

Thanks for the comment, but that’s literally how most reviews work

[@VanguardSys]

u will label for a few items than its a pain in the arse and useless - sturdy? when u moved the spindle the entire machine flexed - the main issue with these small units - very very light cuts are needed - these cheap chinese-eum machines are more pain than gain - hit or miss - beginners usually toss them - cheap is always cheap

[@ModernHobbyist]

I actually had a whole segment where i talked about this but it didn't make the final cut. This is a $500 aluminum machine, it's intended for beginner hobbyists and as such isn't gonna be the sturdiest machine in the world but it's priced to reflect that. My review takes all of that into consideration.

[@VanguardSys]

@@ModernHobbyist get what u pay for - beginners really need to know this - good job on videos

[@PTcruser65]

of course this is an unbieast review and isn't bought,wink, wink, nudge, nudge.

[@kenmunn4421]

Looks like junk….

[@mattivirta]

500$ this, no thanks ower price lot, all other same can buy normal 200-300$ save lot money, and have very small table cnc. and totally too small motors all, minimum good cnc need be nema 23 470 OZ motors, MINIMUM. and better buy 800 ER16 spindle than 500W same cost but lot better spindle, if working hobby work and sell parts better use 2.2KW spindle.

[@gamerclownz2783]

He said at the beginning he got it free and promised he won't say anything negative about it lol. Another scammy channel. It's clear from the review it's a junky machine and yet he gave it good ratings.

[@ModernHobbyist]

Literally the exact opposite of what I said, but thanks for the comment 👍

[@phantomfly5050]

Guess you didn’t watch the beginning of the video saying it will be an honest review and he won’t pull any punches.

[@Bereadyalways123]

Sounds like a disaster actually…