Mormon Stake President and Temple Architect Finds HER True Self - Laurie Lee Hall | Ep. 1957

[@elilass8410]

Seeing older trans people coming out warms my heart. I can't imagine how difficult her journey has been, but it brings me such joy to see Laurie alive as her true self.

[@Mrs.Robinsons]

My kid was diagnosed decades ago and you're right- Anyone who is true to themselves is socially prosecuted in the worst ways. Now female, this is the last thing they would want to admit due to the social, political, & religious persecution. Many thanks to Lauri Hall for doing this, it helps more than realized.

[@ginamarquardt-sz8xm]

I can’t imagine either, and have that kind of faith and relationship with their God and know that they are where they should be and the church saying no that the doctrines that they teach in this case don’t apply. That they could answer all of the temple recommend questions in good faith and still be denied.

[@Rpxvision261]

Gender is a social construct. He went from one cult to another😂

[@ryangarrard3135]

This is one is of the moat touching and beautiful interview i have seen yet! I am crying right now because my father sadly took his life in 2007 and was most likely gay, bi or trans and suffered greatly. He felt he had to hide his real self from many, torturing himself. The work ya'll do is so important. Keep it up!

[@SUD_SUD_MORMON]

Qué triste lo que vivió tu padre, es muy duro, nuestra iglesia SUD o MORMONA tiene mucho por limpiar tanto dolor

[@marfiskey3102]

THIS is exactly what I mean in my comment above.. EXACTLY!!!

[@kathrynneuman1079]

Oh, I am so happy to see a trans person tell her Mormon story here. And also a former temple designer. This is going to be an amazing episode

[@staceyh7264]

Such a beautiful person. Thank you for sharing Laurie Lee. I will forever be grateful for your influence in my life.

[@Spungle15]

The fact that so many LDS have sat in spaces designed by a transgender woman is honestly incredible.😊

[@BarbaraJonesBrown]

Yep! Isn’t it wonderful!?

[@stevenparkin6486]

For me, the most shocking point was learning that Laurie's wife was told by top church leaders to divorce her transitioning husband else face her own church discipline and likely excommunication. Both Laurie and wife and in a tough spot; they married in an LDS Temple and Laurie fathered her children. Now, she must divorce to save her Church membership.

[@nanoparticle5988]

Yes, and adding to the shock is the fact that a number of other Mormon couples in same or similar situation were told the same thing around the same time period by their Stake Presidents - obviously directives were being given to local leaders from Salt Lake City Church Headquarters.

[@lavender2533]

I’m only 40 minutes in and am already crying ❤ as a 25 year old nonbinary person it is so so incredibly moving to hear not only the stories of older trans folks but witnessing compassionate and educated allies supporting and loving us. Thank you thank you ❤️❤️

[@marfiskey3102]

you need more interviews like this one. For the first time in 70 years (especially the last 5 or 6) someone has explained what "trans" is.. I liked "heart not parts" ... if more people said things like this, those of us who actually never heard of anything like this until this last few years wouldn't be so confused. For once in my life I feel like I get it. And it tool all 3 of you to get the point across. I am looking forward for more stories like this one the actually help people instead of build more walls between people.. Thank you all

[@Dutchess0909]

Hello from Holland (within the Netherlands). The last couple of days I've been listening to Laurie's interviews starting from 7 year ago. So glad you're on. Laurie, I love your clear and sensitive explanations. And your tenderness

[@lucyjexy]

Thank you so much for showcasing such a powerful story! I'm a very fortunate person to have several trans family members, and I've seen transitioning from both genders, male to female, and female to male. This is a great, great interview. Thank you so much, and well done, Laurie! Your story is amazing.

[@ValeriePeterson-w5f]

I am so glad you are covering this I am a grandma with a transgender grandkid 😢❤

[@elilass8410]

Thank you for supporting your grandchild

[@Mrs.Robinsons]

@valeriePeterson- I suggest you add a happy face because we are blessed to have courageous souls in our lives. Mine was diagnosed (hermaphrodite/intersexed) decades ago. I lost everything supporting them. My friends, family, finances, social, political, & religious perspectives. However, what an awakening! For us as a family & them being true to their soul's path. People like Lauri Hall, you as a grandma and myself as a parent are changing history, souls and vibrations of LOVE !

[@_Nat_A_]

This Mormon Story is very important. For anyone who believes in God remember God loves EVERYONE. It is people who have chosen to live their lives in hate and judgement who don’t. If asked I proudly call myself an affirmed Christian because life is best lived with kindness and love. Just accept people.

[@daisymae4587]

Thank you for having Laurie Lee back. I know she’s making the rounds right now and it’s wonderful to hear so many different aspects of her experience. While my heart was warmed by the way members and some individual leaders accepted Laurie Lee, I’m also broken hearted at the treatment she ultimately received from the corporation. The cruelty inflicted upon her and her former wife brought me to tears. When my former spouse was excommunicated for multiple immoral acts, I agonized over the idea of divorce, thinking I’d be breaking my covenant and promise to ensure to the end with him. It’s unimaginable to hear a stake president effectively tell Laurie’s spouse at the time that if she didn’t break her covenant to stay with her spouse, the church would do it for her. My current self would have flung an F-you and walked out, but TBM me would have been completely broken by such a thing. I wish you continued joy in your journey, Laurie Lee!

[@veryfarfromthetree]

Thank you for doing this interview. Her voice is sooo important here.

[@hayleybmiller2010]

Thanks for sharing your experience with us. It helps to understand and learn what is so foreign to most of us. Glad you are you.

[@flaxenware]

I can't think of a Mormon stories episode that has touched me more. Laurie Lee, thank you for being so open about your story. If only every member would have to courage to hear your story.

[@kaydencelayne4507]

When my trans child was five and we were trying to find a space in church, I shared with my RS how I knew I wanted to love and support and protect Atty no matter what. Almost all of them showed me love and compassion and kindness... It was when our bishop called us in to discipline us and tell us we weren't welcome to bring her to church, we saw this wave of support reverse. People who had extended their support started withdrawing it because they felt it was going against ward leadership and they didn't want to be disobedient. So the conversation about members for the most part wanting to create space and leaders not wanting to, really resonated with me.

[@shannahdawn4724]

Your strength and courage to be yourself and share your story, gives me chills of utter delight. It is a very good day when one discovers an individual that chooses to embrace and embody such grace and compassion….You are my Hero and oh so Beautiful!

[@maryanne2772]

This is an amazing and informative interview. Thank you for your courage, Laurie. Barbara's comments also added a lot to the conversation. And thank you, John, for providing the space for this critical and moving story to be continued. I love how this story addresses so many specific issues and questions, in such a loving and intelligent way. I can't imagine being in such unique leadership/employment roles, having to navigate identifying as trans with the high-ups, with so many obstacles. I am truly in awe!

[@jenniferanderson4201]

Thank you, thank you, thank you for having this episode so we can learn from and listen to our trans friends. Thank you Laurie for your courage in sharing your story and experience. ❤

[@sherriekalahermullins8398]

I LOVE THIS EPISODE! Thanks so much for this offering. My heart is full.

[@oceanstaiga5928]

As always another interesting story I’m glad you’ve shared, thanks for talking about your experiences Laurie!😊

[@mormonstories]

Thanks for listening

[@wanderingrenegade771]

I am so impressed with the interview and insight.

[@lucygooseyhikes]

As much as I appreciate your approach to not polticize this issue, I think it does a disservice to this wonderful thoughtful conversation to not express the harm that the right is actively doing by running on othering trans people. Just last night during the world series game there were 3, 4 ads had photographs of what appeared to be trans people and the voiceover said Trump is for you, Harris is for they them. It is central to the rights message to America. It needs to be said clearly and called out for the harm and the target it puts on trans people.

[@tawnyachristensen7310]

Loved hearing more from Laurie Lee Hill!

[@sydneyspangler858]

Such a beautiful, moving story. Thanks to both of you for offering this content. It is incredibly important work.

[@Britbec]

Thank you Ms. Laurie Lee & Barbara for making this book possible. Got my copy from The King’s English. Can’t wait to collect it and get stuck in.

[@Dan_P.]

What a kind and gentle person. Any church would be lucky to have her, and I am so glad she found love and is happy. Good work, John and Laurie Lee.

[@allisoniuculano8496]

What a wonderful episode . Keep being brave Laurie.

[@ilovemydog615]

The story of the relief society member passing her child to Laurie was so touching.

[@kinageez]

What a lovely woman. Such a beautiful soul that Laurie is. This episode is in my top favorites ❤️

[@erinrametta1]

Laurie, Thank You for doing this interview. I feel more knowledgeable on transgender from this. You are a beautiful human being inside and out. I would feel honored to have you as a friend. Thank you for being authentic

[@TheWanderingHeretic]

I'm so excited about this episode! I may not catch all of it live, but GO LAURIE!

[@nathannelson1077]

I've recently overcame my deep internalized transphobia and started the same process as Laurie. She's incredibly brave and inspirational. Her story helped me accept myself. Thank you!!!

[@xochitlkitty]

How ironic that they’re going to surveil trans people so closely and even put them on the church equivalent of a sexual predator list when they allow actual sexual predators to continue abusing and even cover up what they do.

[@karenbutler2219]

I am struck by what a beautifully good, authentic person Laurie Lee Hall is. Thank you for this interview and thank you to Laurie Lee for your bravery and for sharing your story. I've been a member for 50 years and have a 25 year old transgender son. I've been an advocate for him and am heartbroken over the most recent (stronger) restrictions the church has placed on this vulnerable population. I feel strongly in my heart the stance is contrary to the heart and will of our creator, just as the past ban against people of color. As you said at the beginning of the interview, transgender persons have existed since the beginning of time. They are wonderful gifts to us all! And absolutely no threat to children. The stereotype that they are dangerous to youth is so completely false. Thank you again for this interview!

[@echanungas7768]

He is not an authenthic woman as he identify to be.

[@explorethishumanlife]

I resonate with John's comments regarding new(er) construction, and how architects are being thoughtful about restroom facilities that offer individual privacy, and are not bifurcated by gender. How many of us have had negative experiences in traditional restrooms due to rude or malicious people, from being a young child in grade school to an adult. This is such a simple and smart move to not only make restrooms more safe, but remove the "gender" from the human experience of simply needing to use a restroom.

[@DanielFreed-f2b]

I'm so impressed with Laurie Lee!! Very inspiring. She's so courageous and wonderful.

[@pjmccord]

Laurie Lee, you are a stellar human being and example. Thank you for sharing your life experiences. How loved you are.

[@aceshigh5157]

What a fantastic episode. Thank you, Laurie, for your vulnerability.

[@michellesmith6891]

So very educational. Wish all political/religious views of leaders that make big decisions regarding transgender could watch this episode and be enlightened. I feel so many make judgmental negative decisions without really understanding and it having a negative impact on helping others to be educated, loving, empathetic and accepting. When you know better you do better!

[@jonipitcher7185]

All I can think is Lori is just a human. What dose it honestly matter if she had pants on or not. It's so sad to how the church of JESUS christ forgets how Jesus accepted everyone and we are commanded to love everyone and there was no clause that says you can discriminate based on clothes they wear. Such a good and educational episode. ❤❤❤

[@jessicawild8753]

I love this. I love this. I love this thank you so so so much for conquering things like this and for letting us see that even die hard, Mormons can grow.

[@elizabethcasady722]

Laurie Lee, Please create an Audible version of your book. My ADHD doesn't allow me to read print anymore, but I am able to listen to books. 🙏

[@BarbaraJonesBrown]

We are!

[@elizabethcasady722]

@BarbaraJonesBrown Can't wait! Thank you so much!

[@darlenewoolf6767]

Laurie is one of my favorite people to listen to. She is so gentle, kind, and eloquent. Good for you Laurie living your best life looks really good on you. 💕

[@daisymae4587]

As Laurie Lee talks about the current restrictions on transgender members, she points out similarity to the priesthood and temple ban and how many members didn’t feel comfortable around black members - a genetic trait. How sickening it is to keep people from church associated “blessings” because it makes some members uncomfortable. What’s worse is that in the modern ban, the church even mentions “comfort “ of members in the restroom restrictions. It baffles me that so many members can’t see how discriminatory and hateful these policies are.

[@shermannorton8723]

Just watched the Mormonish podcast with Laurie Lee, and she's awesome. So articulate, and seems very kind.

[@bees4839]

As an exmo trans man just beginning to accept myself as trans, I appreciate this interview. It helps to see other people and find my story reflected in theirs. I got married at 19 and lived not far away from the provo MTC and processed a lot of grief over the lost male milestone of being an elder that I was never going to have. There's a special irony(?) that the buildings I walked past every day were designed by a trans woman. I longed to grow up a mormon boy, and the buildings representing that life were designed by a trans woman who has found her joy, and now I'm finding my joy too. Thank you Laurie Lee!! You are amazing.

[@e.d.3729]

much respect to Laurie Lee Hall. what a kind, brave person.

[@DonnaDexter-p6e]

I'm so happy to watch this, Laurie Lee!!

[@daniellima2973]

Her interview on Mormonism was fantastic!

[@caseyjude5472]

This was such a great episode! I enjoyed it very much.

[@kaysharogers32]

I loved this story. 10/10

[@nordicexile7378]

It's so fun to me how very much like a stake president she still sounds. Just the way she phrases things and the way she puts thoughts together it's exactly like I remember in my growing-up stake. 🙂

[@CGL-zb8wz]

I couldn’t help but think how ironic when Laurie told of her experience of sitting in on a Relief Society meeting and the ‘firestorm’ that created. Just months earlier, if she had walked in as the Stake President, not only would ‘he’ have been welcomed, the meeting would have stopped and he given time to address the sisters if he wanted.

[@BreannAntonsen]

Keep being brave everyone, were helping eachother be more understanding. Stay strong and brave and blessed. I have transexual cousins more than one, grew up with a transexual aunt as well so it wasn't something I had to learn about it was something I grew up around accepted as normal. just like me , no less than me equal to me and everyone else. We must treat everyone as our equals. There's no room for trying to change someone else. Let everyone have free will to be their true selves. ❤❤

[@UmWhaaat]

So enlightening and beautiful. Thank you❤

[@4katrine]

I would not have understood until I saw it with my own eyes, my nephew, from about three years old, thought he was a girl. He acted like a girl. He wanted to dress like a girl. He didn’t believe he was a boy. He never changed until this day. It’s the way god put him on this earth. Thank you for your interview Laurie Lee. I could listen to you all day.

[@MH-tc9sk]

I love Barbara. She’s such an intellectual powerhouse. I was so disgusted by how she was attacked by Dives on MNR. Whenever you have Barbara on your channel, I’m there!

[@lyndabanksdesign]

What is Dives? What is MNR?

[@MH-tc9sk]

@ Dives is the host of Mormon News Roundup

[@BG-ig6fd]

Thank you Laurie, for coming on Mormon Stories and sharing your experience. It is so important to hear your voice, so that we can gain understanding and empathy. It takes courage. I am so glad you were able to become on the outside how you felt on the inside and live authentically. Yours is a beautiful story full of hope. I look forward to reading your book.

[@RebeccaRaven]

Just purchased the Kindle edition! Such a wonderful story...

[@fairytalejediftj7041]

This seems like a good advertisement for women bishops. It's hard to imagine a bishop who would be more comfortable to talk to than Laurie.

[@CavishBeka]

Laurie you are amazing. I'm so happy you can finally express your true self to the outside world. John as a queer person who is ace I wanna tell you how much I value the considerate way you always talk about the queer community. You live allyship in a way that I seldom see from cis-het people, and that we need more in the world. Thank you.

[@robyn874]

Courageous lady 😊 you are an inspiration to many; good luck to you going forward. Many people never know who they are or where they fit in this world. All I know is there's room for us all ❤

[@ryandickinson2905]

Excellent interview - looking forward to her book coming out!

[@Chezsey]

I was recently in Canada where public restrooms are usually for both genders and they are so nice and SECURE compared to the bathrooms in the USA. They are like individual restrooms in your home.

[@erpthompsonqueen9130]

Thank you. Watching from Alaska. 🕊

[@anna-marie-]

So excited for this one!!!

[@awilk07]

2:47:52 churches SHOULD be sanctuaries for people and welcoming to those who are looking for support. Instead they have become exclusive clubs that you can only gain entry by following their special rules and regulations and fitting yourself into their box

[@SUD_SUD_MORMON]

El camino que ha transitado LAURIE LEE HALL, no ha sido fácil, ha sido valiente y consecuente, Una pena que nuestra iglesia MORMONA o SUD, insista en respeta a la DIVERSIDAD, eso no es así en su totalidad Nuestra iglesia SUD o MORMONA tiene mucho perdón que pedir, ha causado y causa daño y dolor Gracias por compartir

[@paulmartinezsd]

I work as an architect and was very curious to hear about the inner workings of construction for the church. The construction industry is well known for its shady procurement methods. Happy to hear that they were able to find a way to overcome some of the corruption within the system.

[@perryekimae]

I would love to see Laurie Lee engage with trans content creators on KZbin like Jammidodger, Jessie Gender, or even Abigail Thorn (Philosophy Tube). The Mormon trans intersection does not get a lot of press outside Mormon circles, and she could bring a really cool perspective to the audiences of those content creators.

[@sandaroocompilations5182]

Laurie Lee is a hero and a pioneer leading the way for transgender people. I loved her interview and have so much respect for her. I’m glad that she was able to fully become the person that she always felt she should be. This interview is beautiful and I wish everyone could listen to it.

[@personofinterest8731]

I've been wondering how she is doing these days. I think i saw her story on MS around 2016-ish. I look forward to this!❤❤

[@ohjonash]

Amazing interview 💛

[@Cocoon68]

Who else thought that a woman finally got to serve in a priesthood calling! 😊 😉

[@susangroom960]

What a remarkable human she is.

[@elichaalmonord49]

Ty

[@Cel_566]

So amazing. So inspiring 🏳️‍⚧️❤

[@Spungle15]

1:43:21 The church missed a huge opportunity in not letting Elder Uchtdorf become prophet.

[@radicalkelly59]

Laurie Lee, Will you put your book on Audible? I would love to listen to it. In your voice!

[@lauriehall3183]

Yes, we’ll begin recording this week in my voice.

[@IamMrKatz]

Wow. Just wow.

[@katestrong8558]

Whitney Clayton's father, Whitney Clayton, was my bishop when I was a teen. Arrogant! Creepy. He had a fireside at his house with the young women and said, "I know your bodies better than you do." Driving home we were all talking about what. creep he was. Whittier, CA in the late 70s, early 80s.

[@ricksatterfield]

The number of temple dedications has been ramping up in just the last couple of years. 2024 - 16 temples dedicated 2023 - 11 temples dedicated 2022 - 5 temples dedicated 2021 - 2 temples dedicated 2020 - 1 temple dedicated 2019 - 6 temples dedicated 2018 - 2 temples dedicated 2017 - 4 temples dedicated 2016 - 6 temples dedicated 2015 - 5 temples dedicated 2014 - 3 temples dedicated 2013 - 1 temple dedicated 2012 - 4 temples dedicated 2011 - 2 temples dedicated 2010 - 4 temples dedicated

[@katesomossy4157]

I noticed that too after the Mormonish episode raised the same capacity restraint issue. But if you look at the average from 2018 when Nelson became prophet, the average is 6/yr. My take is covid lengthened the construction process for several years so that more were completed in 2023-24. It will be interesting to see how temple dedication normalizes post-covid.

[@xochitlkitty]

@34minutes I don’t believe in god, but I do believe that each one of us comes here as we are because we bring something unique to the world. What you said about the binary world being a world that doesn’t include trans and non-binary folks is so true. I want a world that does not exclude anyone, and I’m beginning to think that rigid binaries are not a natural thing at all. We see in nature that diversity of all kinds is what allows living beings to thrive. Thank you for sharing your beautiful story.

[@claudinealtvater640]

Thank-you Laura Lee!!!!

[@rozannmoake8146]

2:11:42 omg! That’s such a beautiful way for her to support you! Totally made me cry. Thank you, Mormon stories for opening my eyes and my mind and my heart to so many things! I was the typical Mormon when I came to LGBTQ things but I am not anymore. Lori, I cannot believe your strength. How brave you have been and I wish that I had been somebody who would have befriended you had I known you then. I wouldn’t have been. But I would be now. 💜

[@heatherhammersmith8997]

I wish Laurie Lee had been asked to share her expertise on how non-gendered bathrooms could be better designed for safety in the US!!! Because I'm more than happy to use bathrooms with trans-women but the idea of having cis-males in there with me actually makes me feel VERY unsafe (both statistics and experiences in my case prove this is a perfectly rational fear too). Beautiful interview, thanks to all

[@iamjustsaying1]

Excellent, moving, insightful episode. In 50 years, one could imagine that the church will start pushing forward the idea that they "have always been LGBTQ allies," and using Laurie Lee as proof: "Many of our sacred temples were designed by a trans woman!"

[@bmo5082]

Honestly I think in 50 years L and G will be looked at as normal but I think T issues will probably be looked at as abnormal still.

[@iamjustsaying1]

@bmo5082 I was mostly just pointing out how the church leaders try to gaslight members.

[@bmo5082]

@@iamjustsaying1 yep. I can agree with you on that.

[@dionclark6581]

One of the very best mormon human stories.❤😊

[@clcole5655]

Thanks!

[@alisonwhite2243]

This was a powerful interview. One theme that I expected to hear, but didn't, and would be interested to ask, is whether at any point during Laurie Lee's transition did she have the thought about the privilege she had as male-presenting that she sought to maintain within the church? As a woman listener, I found myself wondering why Laurie Lee would be surprised at the church privileges for men she once had being taken away when she later presented as herself, a woman? While there is no doubt that the church's actions stem from a place of ignorance and prejudice against transgender individuals, I do wonder how much of their reactions originated from that versus the inability to reconcile having a woman in the church who maintained male privileges.

[@JustMi14]

Thank you for sharing this important interview. Obviously there are a lot of negative opinions about transgender, even coming from viewers of your videos. Some of the comments here are disgusting.

[@ednachel9310]

As a former Illinois resident and a volunteer for the Nauvoo temple open house, this temple was set up for live sessions......has that changed

[@kayep6189]

I wonder if Laurie Lee had a 2nd anointing or is privy to information about it... I would think as Lead Architect that might be something floated around her... don't many or most temple president's have 2nd anointing? so it would make sense the person leading the design and construction might also have...

[@BarbaraJonesBrown]

No she didn’t have a 2nd anointing

[@ccardall]

By December there will have been 16 temples dedicated this year. This is not a hard number to find. It’s true that announcements currently outpace the construction pipeline, but it seems to ramping up. The modular construction John mentioned is in fact happening. There are now additional members of the Seventy assigned as assistant executive directors of the temple department. And so forth. My experience with every temple I’ve been to lately is that attendance is robust. The concern expressed by disaffected former members is touching, but not particularly relevant in my view.

[@MsFrenulum1]

Oliver Crowmwell : Britain’s Taliban ; Irish Genocide. Brigham Young : America’s Taliban ; Mountain Meadow Massacre.

[@windyday85]

Anyone know what episode was Lori Lee's 1st interview??

[@mormonstories]

www.mormonstories.org/laurie-lee-hall/

[@Britbec]

770 I think they said. Also check out her interview on LatterGay Stories podcast. Highly recommend.

[@cilenyswingler538]

My question is: would they treat you and welcome you the same with your new appearance?🤔 I doubt you can “seat for lunch with them” Specifically Mr. Oaks.

[@BG-ig6fd]

How do we find Laurie’s original interview with MS?

[@mormonstories]

www.mormonstories.org/laurie-lee-hall/

[@lauriehall3183]

Episodes 770-773