MOSAIC Roundtable with Dan Johnson, Scott Severen and Marc Cook

Join ByDanJohnson.com founder Dan Johnson along with LAMA president Scott Severen and BDJ.com managing editor Marc Cook for a roundtable discussion to suss out where the MOSAIC program is today, when we should expect to see more news on the effort and, well, just a little prognostication.

[@IconicFlight]

Great info! The LSA market will really open up once this thing comes out.🎉

[@JMAv8Tor]

Awesome as always! Thanks for being in our corner!!!🛫🇺🇸

[@philipritson8821]

"Acceptable" from the FAA is high praise indeed.

[@davidbauer8800]

Outstanding update on an issue of keen interest to GA - please keep us informed as you find out more. I would appreciate learning more about which aircraft are poised to come to market when the MOSAIC finally lands.

[@josemgomez3740]

I am hoping for mosaic new rules bring more competition to the civilian aviation industry . *Acquisition cost *hour flying rate etc 😊

[@dylanpeterson6449]

The problem I have with the Mosaic discussion its that the focus seems to be about a sport pilots can fly a C182 or even a multi-engine. As a PPL I really don't give a crap that an undertrained person can fly a faster plane (actually I do but for negative reasons) as it doesnt address the core issue around GA....that a new C182 costs 850k and $200-250/hr to rent which makes it unaffordable for recreation or trainable purposes. Mosaic to me is all about the new "LSA" aircraft that we will get as part of this regulation. Unfortunately the original LSA rules never actually accomplished the affordability and the only true GA alternative is kit planes (which now just became unaffordable due to Vans's chapter 11). We truly need a 180hp aircraft that can have 4 seats, not run on leaded fuel that cost under 200k and doesnt cost 10k+ a year to maintain... otherwise drones are going to kill GA as you can already buy a DJI ag drone for 25k that can lift a person..

[@charlesreid9337]

Mass production decreases prices. More opportunity for small builders decreases prices. The biggest things holding general aviation bag is that it is not affordable unless you are at least upper middle class. Even then it is hard. Making getting a pilot certificate affordable again is the first step to accomplishing all of that. As far as your comment about under-trained that extra 15 hours didn't make you a 747 pilot. Neither did that extra couple of chapters in the book. Find your logic you should only be able to drive a compact car with a single passenger and during the day.. add 55 mph Max. I'm a commercial truck driver.. you are a danger on the road. you people kill us a lot. Yes I don't advocate for you taking 70 hours of training from a commercial driver. Because that would be most people could never afford to drive a car. At the cost of cars would be astronomical

[@j.taylorrr]

Massive problem with aviation is cost and the people who regulate and lobby are all rich.

[@dylanpeterson6449]

@@charlesreid9337 thats why i dont really care about the sport pilot rules... we are making a bunch of rules around 15 less hours of training... seems to me if the cost of flying was affordable then there is no need for a sport's pilot license (except for the medical). The issue is the cost of purchasing, running and operating aircraft... without addressing that its putting a bandaid on an open wound.

[@kevinphillips9408]

Great informative video guys. Thank you all very much

[@williamleadbetter9686]

I am hoping an instrument rating will be allowed, provided the pilot has had the full training & the aircraft is properly equipped.

[@charlesreid9337]

Dave's honestly fantastic guys are a great example of the biggest problem with modern general aviation. The people who started aviation for not upper class. The original military pilots were not officers. General aviation started with the middle class. Over the last century it has become progressively harder for the middle class to afford to fly their own plane. Right now you need to be upper middle class at the minimum to home and fly your own plane. Here as in aircraft forums people are talking about not having to pass a DOT physical as the big reason. That is a tiny sub set of people If you make the license affordable and achievable by the average person.. you will radically increase the market size for small aircraft. Do that and dramatically decrease the price. Do that can you increase the market even more The cheapest car on the market is far more complex than the average general aviation plane. It has more and better safety features. Get get cost a third as much or less

[@DougBow96]

Thanks for the update 🙂

[@westpearson6759]

Great discussion!

[@hjc0706]

Does anyone know if a plane purchased as "mosaic ready" /experimental will be eligible to be LSA afterwards assuming it does indeed meet final Mosaic rules.

[@JoeCnNd]

They need to make light sport what class 3 medical is.

[@t.hangar]

What we need is being able to turn old legacy planes into experimental. I know you can do now under “exhibition” but is very costly and difficult to be approved. Just let people upgrade and fix the thousands of old legacy planes rotting out there in ramps and hangars and this would help GA a lot more than making bigger LSA that will cost 400k

[@mauriceevans6546]

I don't know about that dan. I would like to have a shark or blackshape prime! I will also need alot of money to purchase one. So the time frame works for me because I am working on that big down payment

[@WatchmanForthePeople]

Pass it to know what's in it, and adapt it as you go just like how congress passes other bills! I might be dead before I can use new rules.😞

[@stevenkay2485]

We don't know? We've all been here and we all know. The FAA is not our friend. I flew a JMB VL3 at 180kTAS and it's a much much better and easier airplane to fly. The FAA's delay to new technology is the death of GA by cost and only in the interest of keeping their own jobs.

[@westpearson6759]

Scott, with LAMA, made a comment (I’m paraphrasing) “LSA pilots won’t be able to fly a 250 kt, retractable gear airplane, they will need additional training, certification”. Does that mean an LSA pilot will be able to take additional training and get a modification to his LSA pilots license and be able to fly those, still under an LSA license? Or did he mean that LSA pilot would need to go to a regular pilots license with that additional training also?

[@mikeryan6277]

He meant you will need a logbook endorsement

[@DanJohnsonAffordableAviation]

Common misunderstanding, but FAA has no "LSA license," only a "Private" or "Sport Pilot," etc. A Sport Pilot certificated pilot -could- fly such an aircraft but would need additional training leading to an endorsement (as @mikerya6277 noted).

[@westpearson6759]

@@DanJohnsonAffordableAviation Thanks! I did know it was a “Sport Pilot” license, mispoke. But was not clear if additional training would earn that endorsement. Great roundtable!

[@AnotherPilot1]

The GA fleet is being taken down...one aircraft at a time in the usual ways and not being replaced by anything. Im afraid there is no fixing this.

[@campgroundsacrossamerica]

I see that the guy with LAMA mentioned that 2925 is an election year. That's going on now.

[@JoeCnNd]

That's a few hundred years off, though.

[@DanFrederiksen]

I can't say that I'm impressed with the speed of it although for gov regulation you might consider it fast. If there was any competency however it would be an afternoon plus some days for hearing all interested parties just to make sure it was sensible. I'm not personally a great believer in increasing the weight to 3000lbs or even higher, that to me sounds like a PPL so why the distinction. If that's where we are going I'd rather develop a PPL-GPS that include IFR with ease assuming modern avionics, VFR is too limiting. And make certification of planes a less bureaucratic process, more sense based which FAA has already indicated in calling it "performance based", meaning if it appears to work we don't bother with the paperwork that might be impossible anyway. Like for avionics for instance. Having certified electronics components isn't possible in practice. Certainly didn't work for Boeing 787 using certified batteries. So big picture, I'd say unify the license and the certification. If you are going to allow 250KIAS and 1.5ton how is that light, how is that a limited license. 250KIAS gets close to speed of sound in the flight levels. Just having a modest stall speed doesn't really mean that it's something a lesser pilot can handle to justify a distinct license. And why call certification different things. Regarding repair you could make the distinction on use. If you are not flying passengers it can have the more relaxed repair regime. Also light planes with two jet engines should not be treated like airliners as if jet engines are inherently difficult. They are much simpler to use than PT6 or old piston. Again distinction could be made on commercial passengers.

[@jeffbertuleit5848]

No wonder the US if falling behind, just form a Committee and maybe another Committee, and then another Committee to evaluate what they think the former Committee meant. Meanwhile years go by and we loose businesses, pilot interest, better affordable training aircraft, etc. Vote on elements that are acceptable make the rules and allow for more rules later if more indecision and hand wringing is necessary. Also allow for modification of common sense changes to unseen circumstances. None of use are getting younger in the mean time.

[@pedro72246]

Regards, CHINA

[@BrianOgilvie79]

The fact that these guys cant name a single model of legacy aircraft correctly..except for Dan. Shows me how negative they are on aviation and too rose colored glasses on light sport airplanes. I can take a $35k used cessna 150 and re engine it and re paint it and upgrade the avionics..fly it as sport pilot when MOSAIC rules get finalized for under 100k. you cant touch a new LSA for 100k and add to that something that has questionable factory support and future as many LSA aircraft imported from other countries.