Most IN DEPTH Smash Ultimate Tier List

[@titreynium8115]

“Snake is just really solid overall” okay bud listen here

[@ExceedRed]

*Insert Lenny Face

[@WaluigisWharadise]

He is not as "solid" as he used to be...

[@cutecommie]

Everyone makes that pun. ZeRo did it in his review of a bad tier list.

[@nathanieljones8043]

look puns aside I feel like he's as good as mvd brawl

[@SandyCheeks1896]

I laughed my ass off. Wasn’t sure if it was intentional.

[@PunchyFency]

I dont think anyone has done the timestamps yet so here u go: S CLASS: Peach/Daisy: 2:30 Pichu: 3:50 Young Link: 5:00 Fox: 5:52 TOP TIER: Olimar/Alph: 7:28 Inkling: 8:43 Chrom: 10:34 Palutena: 11:45 Shulk: 13:06 Wario: 14:40 Snake: 16:05 Lucina: 17:30 Marth: 17:30 Mii Swordfighter: 18:50 HIGH TIER: Cloud: 20:57 Pikachu: 21:42 Ness: 22:38 Roy: 24:04 Wolf: 33:01 Mario: 25:10 Pokemon Trainer: 26:56 Greninja: 27:29 Ike: 28:02 Luigi: 28:35 Zero Suit Samus: 57:47 Mewtwo: 29:08 R.O.B.: 29:36 Lucario: 1:02:54 Pit: 30:21 Dark Pit: 30:21 Corrin: 43:06 Yoshi: 39:37 Sonic: 31:02 Donkey Kong: 31:40 Duck Hunt: 36:22 Meta Knight: 32:09 Lucas: 1:02:14 Mega Man: 32:24 Robin: 33:44 Doc Mario: 1:00:21 King Dedede: 50:40 PAC-MAN: 47:38 Richter/Simon: 44:52 Bowser: 1:01:05 Ice Climbers: 52:46 Zelda: 49:52 Ridley: 58:48 Isabelle: 53:22 MID TIER: K Rool: 55:51 Bayonetta: 34:38 Captian Falcon: 47:01 Diddy: 42:34 JigglyPuff: 59:44 Falco: 56:41 Villager: 53:43 Wii Fit Trainer: 51:56 Toon Link: 44:11 Ryu/Ken: 38:49 Rosalina and Luma: 51:20 Dark Samus: 49:09 Samus: 49:09 Link: 48:01 Mii Brawler: 55:10 Ganondork: 40:17 Incineroar: 41:00 Sheik: 35:37 Mii Gunner: 55:10 Mr. Game and Watch: 45:29 Kirby: 38:02 Bowser Jr.: 46:33 Little Mac: 37:01 tell me if somethings wrong :)

[@aurielkudo9595]

Not all heroes wear capes

[@JulesTrades]

You are the mvp here. thank you.

[@KingRaichu]

Lol. "Ganondork"

[@kit2780]

Personal opinion, do not think Ridley is higher than K Rool, very interesting list

[@PunchyFency]

@@KingRaichu wow didnt even mean to do that but i like it

[@yacobo4397]

It's not a tier list video without a visible dislike bar.

[@dezlovecraft5247]

itll get there, just wait a little

[@mayito_76]

don't worry that's just people from australia actually liking the video

[@SpinEnjoyer]

He put a top teir smash 4 character who got buffed even more in ultimate in the bottom

[@SkillUpMobileGaming]

This list is ass, though. For real. Cloud should be higher up for sure and King K Rool really just isn't a bottom-tier character.

[@timmacasaet]

This tier list sucks my main should be higher

[@dil7508]

Tonic Timbo Stop acting like a child

[@timmacasaet]

@@dil7508 I think the joke went over your head but no hate ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[@phinn8193]

@@dil7508 r/wooosh

[@ShiningBlueOfficial]

Well shrek was so bad he's not even in the tier list

[@Ree_Mixx]

Ikr my main should be top tier because I play them better than any other characters smh

[@jorel20001]

The only people who think snake is high tier do years of research

[@mike4455]

Jorel Ferasol 😂😂😂😂😂

[@hedgehugs]

this meme won't ever stop being funny

[@theSato]

it's already not funny lol @@hedgehugs

[@FierceFIYA]

@@theSato Yeah, I’m a comedy expert. Along with that I know many things that most don’t know about funny jokes. Sato isn’t part of the those who have a sense of humour and I’m not saying that because I don’t like them. I’m saying that based off of years of research.

[@nathanieljones8043]

only people that know alot about the game think hes' good

[@clayjack9969]

you this tier list is more legit cause he didn't put all the mii fighters next to each other

[@clayjack9969]

@Bit Bite Chomp Oh yeah they're great, but I see a lot of fan made lists that just lump them together or don't rank them at all.

[@NinjarioPicmin]

@@clayjack9969 well yeah some people might choose not to rank them because they dont count them as legal or something

[@clayjack9969]

Ninjario Picmin nah they are playable online now and everything.

[@NinjarioPicmin]

@@clayjack9969 just because nintendo decided to allow them for their online mode does not mean any TOs have to legalize them

[@clayjack9969]

Ninjario Picmin true, but based on these lists they clearly aren’t broken so what would even be the point in banning them? I get they have custom moves but they don’t seem broken either and if they are they could just ban custom moves. I think i’ve seen mii fighters used small tournaments already. It made sense why some would leave them out of their smash 4 tier list as some cared more about online than tournaments.

[@andyanderson4918]

So this is the most different out of other pro players tier lists. That being said I think that is a great sign for the balance of the game.

[@Nessboy12]

It really is. The fact that all these lists are wildly different is proof of how close these characters actually are. Well except for kirby and mac rip them lmao

[@Anton-fn3cd]

@@Nessboy12 Kirby and Mac can both still be really annoying

[@dreadedcorsair3388]

It's looking really promising, and I hope it stays this way. No balance patches are really needed. Maybe some characters need a few buffs but it seems perfect the way it is.

[@ivancito7790]

@@dreadedcorsair3388 Nah, some characters are definitely in need of some slight nerfs. Inkling in particular need a nerf to their damage buff from ink, and something needs to be done about their unreadable Dash dance.

[@adamj6864]

ManlySpirit I think that Inkling also needs a nerf to roller. It is actually impossible to mash out of roller before inkling smash attacks you.

[@tomc.5704]

I appreciate this tier list. You aimed the balance at _slightly_ into the future. This is a tier list for a month or three, at least.

[@tomc.5704]

And more importantly, I found it informative and well presented. Controversial picks are acknowledged and explained, and you never beat a point to death. You said your part and moved on.

[@Augs_Cable]

That is if we don’t account for the inevitable balance patch coming with piranha plants release lol I think tier lists that reflect the “now” are better for a game like ultimate that will be getting patched throughout its first year.

[@1uparcade33]

Not sure if you know, but Lucario also got massive mobility buffs for literally no reason. I think that on top of the changes you listed, as well as the fact that he’s a lot better with no Aura makes him a top tier imo. Also glad that someone else sees potential in Pac, I think he’s incredibly solid in this game and is probably going to rise a lot once Sinji starts getting more and more placingd

[@grotn_]

I love Lucario in this game so much his movement is soooo smooooooth

[@Leoink1]

@@grotn_ Lucario at like 100% is SS tier, it's all about survival.

[@eldritchtoilets210]

Glad I'm not the only one who thinks that, I regularly check opinions on the subreddit and tier lists from top players around the internet and barely anyone mentions how much potential this guy has. I *strongly* think Lucario is at least top 12 right now personally!

[@2CHiLLED.]

Lucario’s air game is decent at best. And he struggles to get kills until aura. Lucario doesn’t have the frame data or hitboxes to be a top tier imo. He can easily destroy someone when they fail to take stocks but true top tier characters usually have easy kill confirms.

[@eldritchtoilets210]

@@2CHiLLED. His specials are no joke at +100% though. I think his Aurasphere is as threatening as ever given how they nerfed shields and airdodges, and you have to stay out of grab range or his stupid side B will kill you at 70%. If his meta develops, I believe he is going to mostly play patient and rely on the opponent's fear to get them to mess up and punishing them *hard* for that. I definitely see him having trouble against characters with swords however, and there are quite a bit those in the upper tiers it seems this time around.

[@cutecommie]

"Peach and Daisy are *one* of the best characters in the game." Accurate.

[@xzpeach4896]

Ikr

[@Rothgarrr]

LMAOOO XD

[@angelomendoza6666]

They’re the practically the same character idk why Daisy exists tbh. XD

[@xzpeach4896]

@@angelomendoza6666 daisy exists because she can

[@dragonfernoi3707]

They have different turnips Edit: I think Peach is better, but Daisy can sometimes combo better.

[@ogot344]

I respect your opinions although I don’t agree with some placements well explained nonetheless

[@ericlindberg4522]

I think bowser Jr. Is high tier don't @ me

[@ericlindberg4522]

Also k Rool if used right

[@ericlindberg4522]

Bit Bite Chomp Ye you right sry

[@ericlindberg4522]

And I kinda don't think s class is really a thing, just top of top tier

[@heldon7951]

He barely explained the Belmont's at all. They got all these crazy projectiles, kill confirms with the fire, a tether recovery, and decent mobility. I thought they would be at the lowest, top of high tier.

[@fischure8480]

It’s great tier list but I would like to see these changes -Ike to Top Tier (his aerials are fucking insane and he can kill at stupid low percentages) -Shulk to High Tier (While his arts give him versatility, I can still see openings punishable unless reacted quickly) -Palutena to High Tier (While she got some insane buffs from Smash 4, I don’t see her top tier yet) -Mario to Mid Tier (Even if he is your bug standard character, he isn’t as good as he used to be in older smash games) -Lucario to Top Tier (While he is risky to play, I see the reward for the aura as being far better reward for the damage) -Inkling to S-Class (The Ink is way too broken, if played properly, the Ink can cause insane damage without much realization from the enemy) -Pichu to High Tier (Its self damage can be punishing especially if going up against heavy hitters, as he is the lightest in the game, a percentage boost for the enemy could be life or death)

[@thatonguy2407]

Nice list overall, but I think that you're underrating Link and overrating the Belmonts, Link's edgeguarding can be absolutely insane, he can cover low with bomb and cover high with himself, he can ledgetrap by just throwing a bomb down on the ledge, which covers attack, neutral, jump and stall, while he can just wait for the roll and cover that. The Belmonts have edgetrapping as good, maybe even better than Link, but their recovery is actually horrendous, any lingering hitbox can knock out their tether and then the up-B covers no distance, Link's recover on the other hand is going to be crazy good with how strong bombs are, being able to nearly teleport to stage with a bomb by dropping and blowing it up at mid percents, and if his up-B will make it he can cover you leaving the ledge by throwing a bomb at you, which can buy him enough time to avoid edgeguards. The Belmonts are terrible once you get in on them, as their moves are fairly slow, and punishable, while Link's aerials, down tilt and up tilt are all fairly quick and pretty hard to punish, compared to the Belmonts anyway. Also you're the first person I've seen point out how easy Inkling's roller is to punish, and I honestly think that they'll drop pretty hard when the top players get more matchup experience, but I think the Belmonts are going to drop like rocks

[@SpinEnjoyer]

The belmods have the best range in the game they should be top teir they have tons of combo setups with all their range attacks their down A is underated as a way to setup for a range combo and or just something to clear distance i dont know enough about link but the belmods are defiantly higher also they have disjointed tilts and good damage on them

[@benyager3355]

I think the reason so many people way overweight the belmonts is when you are in the zone they want you to be im, they aee so fucking oppresive, theres almost mothimg you can do when a belmont reliably gets all 3 projectiles going. I do agree that once people learn to deal the belmonts will be worse

[@SpinEnjoyer]

@@benyager3355 Yea we can just pretend you weren't fucking hammered while you wrote that (btw play the character while sober first)

[@benyager3355]

@@SpinEnjoyer and we can just pretend you weren't being an asshole while you wrote that. Try to be less of a dick when responding. Maybe tell me why im wrong instead of calling me a fucking drunk?

[@rxu3487]

@@benyager3355 you misspelled "nothing" badly, so he probably used that to say you were hammered, which doesn't make sense, since it's clearly just a mistype i guess he just can't accept others' opinions but oh well

[@darylvaldez2222]

DDD high Teir?? I must be dreaming, it's time for us DDD mains to unite lmfaoooooo

[@Clear256]

I agree he seems super good

[@thebeeemill]

“High tier” in the context of this tier list is really low mid tier. JTails was generous by not having a ‘low tier’ to signify how balanced the game is, but when it comes to push and shove, there IS a low tier even if the game is balanced well, and Dedede stands on the bottom half of mid tier on this list.

[@Pat101winter]

This is the 2nd time youve said this

[@NSFSponsor]

@Chase Yea I gotta heavy disagree on shotos being this low.

[@danielf.4098]

@Chase Ryu/Ken probably

[@RubixNinja]

This is the best tier list i've seen on youtube... and I've seen a lot of others. You have a solid collection of tournament proven characters, good insight, and a few unique picks. I actually agree with most of these picks.

[@TheBoodercg]

That link was gutsy and I LOVE it. I personally fall in love with the hit and run from toon link and the stage control from vanilla link but even I know young link is crazy. I respect it.

[@whong09]

Finally someone with a brain with the inkling assessment. I've been saying this from the start, inkling is just high tier not top tier.

[@KeleuHerdley]

Wayne Hong I hope that more people accept that opinion. Then I can play the character I always wanted to have in Smash without getting bashed on(I actually took the time to learn the character myself, and discovered personal combos, and even how every move can be utilized.).

[@jimmybob5541]

Probably the best tier list so far imo but we'll figure everything out for sure soon enough

[@chash.4284]

I literally came to this video after getting my ass whooped by the same young link as Ike, Snake, and Ganon.

[@PleasantLeech]

I think daisy should be higher than peach because she's a better waifu

[@lronjack]

Finally, someone in this comment section making sense

[@zarago7065]

Give this man an award

[@TheGloryXros]

Does she have results?

[@PleasantLeech]

@@TheGloryXros what kind of results we talking about here?

[@Lobohobo]

@@PleasantLeech Well, every time I see Daisy, it sure results in something. Take this how you want.

[@AdalHRivera]

Pretty much the only reason I regard your opinions above every other smashers is because you input a shamelessly high but nonetheless equal amount of interest in the whole roster instead of just the few good-looking fighters. Like, reaching elite smash with every fighter is reason enough for me to believe your tier list is as accurate as any can be.

[@ericlindberg4522]

Beto Hernandez has esam made a tier list, cause he already did that, so he might have an even better idea of how good characters are

[@AdalHRivera]

@@ericlindberg4522 Most likely, but I still feel like Jtails is a bit more objective in his viewpoints (especially when compared to ESAM opinions)

[@ericlindberg4522]

Beto Hernandez did you see that ness placement? I think tails might suffer from the same ailment as esam

[@AdalHRivera]

Eric Lindberg I'd believe you if Ness was higher, even by a bit, but I believe that placement is justified.

[@ericlindberg4522]

Andrew Burton yeah but he is also the best pika player so I tend to trust him at least a little Edit, usually I take his pika placement and move it back by three spots, and Samus by a tier, but otherwise I tend to trust him. I don't see much bias with other characters

[@scoop92]

Greninja is right where he should be.

[@BurtDoesRock]

He's too high, better nerf Greninja

[@CipherBay]

So he needs to be nerfed more....

[@AeroLeaf4]

Can we stop the meme already?

[@notaweeb3500]

DONT TELL PEOPLE ABOUT OLIMAR

[@777Roxen]

Olimar has always been my trump card for no reason. In Brawl and Sm4sh I always played him for the memes... and it always went way better than it should have. Finding out how good he is in Ultimate? Perhaps this was my destiny.

[@NihongoWakannai]

Dude, everyone knows about olimar.

[@notaweeb3500]

Jozzarozzer it’s a joke...

[@TG-sv7ej]

His recover is way better than he is saying

[@Timmonius311]

I think Mega Man is severely underrated. His projectile game is great, all his air moves are solid including arguably one of the best spikes in the game, and he can rack up damage before you know it. Plus, he's a bit heavier which helps staying alive. Also, his recovery with up b to jump can be tricky to guard against. What do you think, Jtails?

[@souporcat]

turn speed to 2 or 1.5 if you don't have an hour to spend watching :)

[@BlazeRol777]

“Fire Fox will kill you” Hot damn better change my browser!

[@viscosity7893]

Finally someone that agrees with me about Zelda

[@realpika8424]

Where did you get your profile picture?

[@vilgon6978]

Real Pika Here’s the source for the Image: twitter.com/liyuchen1126/status/1077525795722018817?s=21

[@diegokiller2097]

I think Zelda is insane in this game

[@viscosity7893]

Real Pika sorry I couldn’t reply quick enough

[@michaelfinnigan]

I saw you playing Toon Link in a tournament, despite placing him mid-tier. Would you mind doing a tutorial video for him! Thanks!!

[@dreadedcorsair3388]

I disagree with your reasoning as to why you put Captain Falcon mid tier, however I understand why people think that of him right now. Using the logic that his recovery is his main weakness, then characters with a much worse recover such as Cloud, Ness Wolf, Ike, Chrom, Fox, Luigi, Belmont's, DK, Pit/DP, Doctor Mario, all should not be above him then. Captain Falcon's recovery has gotten much better from Smash 4 and has more drift. He has enough tools to get pass whatever you throw at him, provided that you know what it is you have to go through. Cloud and Ness are not like that. You get them off stage without a double jump and they're dead if the opponent knows how to spike. I think people who rate Falcon so low in the early meta, do not understand Falcon. And I don't mean that as an insult, it's just that every single Falcon main knows how good this character is, but also how hard he is to use. He's easily high tier, and judging by who you, and a lot of other people put in top tier, he could even be top tier in this game. His strengths stand out more than his weaknesses, and a good Falcon main doesn't let their weaknesses get exploited. He can zone break much better due to dash dancing and skid cancelling, giving his neutral much more diversity. His neutral game may be the best it ever was, he can zone with Nair one, approach with Nair, boost grabbing slightly improves dash grab and he still has throw follow ups, raptor boost combos, and continues combos which is actually really good against people who mash, or when your opponent doesn't have a double jump, Falcon kick gives him a quick and semi safe kill option. His combo game has also improved, he has really good attack cancel combos which can even lead to zero to deaths, Up air to knee can actually true combo, stomp leads to more follow up, he can link more nairs and more up airs together and deal more damage, and his edge guarding is one of the best in the game, but also one of the riskiest. Additionally, Falcon mains such as Fatality, Big D, and even ones we haven't heard of are winning tournaments and getting consistent top 8, and the character isn't even close to being optimised. I actually just do not understand the reasoning behind putting him below so many characters who have the same, if not worse weaknesses than he does. For an example, Wolf struggles with killing, his neutral isn't good at all, his recovery is terrible, and I mean, terrible which means he can't even edge guard, yet he's the top of high tier. Cloud, I may be biased because Falcon just destroys Cloud, but his disadvantage is terrible. Even Chrom, who everyone thinks is good, his weaknesses are no different than Falcon's. His weight makes him combo food, and his recovery is much worse than Falcon's. The character is definitely very underrated and seeing people put characters like the ones I mentioned above him really makes me excited to see just how far up this character will be in the future. I really don't see him being below high tier.

[@kaiju8450]

Jeez man it's just his opinion

[@dreadedcorsair3388]

@@kaiju8450 it's called a discussion lol. That's what he was requesting in the video.

[@gs32621]

Pits recovery is godly wym

[@dreadedcorsair3388]

@@gs32621 you can edge guard him pretty easily actually. Just because a recovery goes far, doesn't mean it's godly. Pits recovery is just a straight line, you can pretty easily edge guard him and spike him out of his recovery. It's an average recovery.

[@gabrielcabral6142]

@@dreadedcorsair3388 better than c.falcon's either way. I got triggered a little but whatever.

[@savvyvii1377]

Great Tier List but in my opinion you underrated Mega Man, Diddy Kong, Captain Falcon and Overrated Fox and Young link

[@coldxramen]

How can Pokemon Trainer be high tier if Ivysaur would be top tier? If the optimal way to play Pokemon Trainer is to play each of the 3 pokemon depending on the state of the match, then shouldn't PT be ranked higher than their highest pokemon? And even if you are suggesting that it would be optimal to only play Ivysaur, it is so easy/safe to switch pokemon that I feel like PT should be just as high as Ivysaur, maybe a few spots lower because needing to switch is a slight disadvantage? Idk, this just does not make much sense to me. Very interesting and well-thought-out tier list overall though, lots of good insight. I disagree with a few things but JTails obviously knows more than I do. You kept saying that "X character needs a secondary to cover troublesome matchups," so if you were to do another video like this at some point in the future it may be useful to address what each character's bad matchups are so people can try to pick secondaries that cover those! Keep up the great content, I'm really enjoying the stuff you are putting out!

[@JJ-jq8re]

Idk why you think Pokemon trainer woukd be higher ranked than their highest pokemon lol? It would be the average of the 3

[@JJ-jq8re]

@@lewisbbb yes so they all have seperate tiers and Pokemon trainer has the average of the 3 jesus christ is it that hard?

[@JJ-jq8re]

@@lewisbbb no because pokemon trainer is all 3 and if you just use ivysaur its just ivysaur i dont understand what you are missing here

[@JJ-jq8re]

@@collamus6901 Or Pokemon Trainer is Pokemon Trainer and Ivysaur is Ivysaur like used in every tier list its really not that complicated i cant be wrong if im just explaining the way it is just because you think it should be a certain way doesnt mean it is

[@JJ-jq8re]

@@lewisbbb because of average because theres 3 characters inside 1 just use your brain

[@blindmanai6957]

It's been almost a year. Has your tier list changed at all?

[@JulesTrades]

it's changed marginally, but yes it has. I'll be doing an updated list soon! this month :)

[@landb3607]

"This tier list is inaccurate" no shit, nobody has any idea what the full potential of every character is. Not to mention tier lists made by one person are always going to be influenced primarily by their own experiences. This is just an interesting guess based on his. Also different, not bad, has been my experience with my main as well. I really didn't like my main until I figured out what he was intended to be in this game.

[@rtiq270]

So you made a comment making fun of him saying it's inaccurate, and then went on a fucking rant about how it's inaccurate. The fuck is wrong with you.

[@gormlessCreator]

@@rtiq270 What? They clearly said they think all tier lists will be inaccurate to some degree and then gave their opinion on this tier list. So it wasn't hypocritical at all...

[@rtiq270]

@@gormlessCreator Jtails literally pointed it out it was inaccurate to stop people from commenting shit like that.

[@thiefamongu3857]

@@rtiq270 dumbass the guy is on jtails side, he's quoting the dumbasses who say that "this is inaccurate" and responding to those types of comments. Goddamn please fucking read next time, otherwise I'll have to buy you a fucking little golden book from Walmart and make you relearn basic fucking English

[@TheHonorableRyu]

An interesting and thoughtful distinction between "solo viable" and bad/not viable. None of the characters are "bad" or not viable, but around 50% of the cast has bad matchups to the point that if someone wants to main them should also learn some other characters to cover the bad matchups.

[@krzyazn212]

That Leffen smoke incoming.

[@alexpower9173]

Pokemon trainer is super underrated. Very few bad matchups and you can abuse the specific strengths of each pokemon and reduce their weaknesses

[@agent00puffball]

Yeah I think Pokemon Trainer has the potential to be the best character in the game once people figure him out more. The versatility of being able to change characters on the fly to exploit strengths and reduce weaknesses gives him such an advantage in matchups.

[@acemanlps]

this aint it but I respect the hustle. nice video!

[@adiemus7155]

This actually feels really, really accurate. Probably the most accurate I’ve seen.

[@TeamSoBrokesTCG]

An interesting list. Good job on the explanations.

[@captainkappa9067]

The best part about this tier list is the no low/bottom tier characters. Several tier lists have one with like two characters so it seems pointless to have one.

[@MailmanSSB]

Most accurate list I’ve seen by far. Though a few things are kinda weird, the top 10 are basically 100% perfect. Nice job!

[@chocobovonhauske8518]

Toon link > young link

[@lioncubden]

toon link > young link

[@ZzShy]

Link > Toon Link > Young Link

[@desertpunkreyes5805]

I just started watching you jtails you explain everything so well . I think your take on the tier list is awesome . Your dedication to the game is noted and I respect a player who can take time to explain your take on the game . Thank you Jtails.

[@jefryduran543]

Where are the time stamps please and thank you Jtails

[@Sera-F1nn]

I like how there's no bottom tier in this list ! It's very positive, and promote the idea that every character is playable ! I love it ^-^

[@SnessFresh]

I think dk might be placed higher in the future.

[@ohianaw]

SnessFresh agreed

[@risersin7957]

I'm looking forward to Tier lists after Genesis. I value tournament results more than theory crafting.

[@Austin-ov8dt]

Link is a great character is should be in the top tier

[@johnshin6731]

Yeah

[@Hunter-ew2ve]

17:05 "I think that Snake is really solid" THATS WHY THEY CALL HIM SOLID SNAKE

[@nick-fil-a1297]

Only 5 in S class? Better buff Greninja

[@AeroLeaf4]

F N C Thank you for not saying the dumb meme we keep hearing about Greninja; he’s actually a lot better in this game. #betterbuffgreninja

[@nick-fil-a1297]

I actually am trying to pick up a pocket Greninja. He can do some serious crap

[@agent00puffball]

The fact that every pro tier list is wildly different from each other is such a testament to the balance of this game. Damn near every character is viable and no one seems to have a consensus on who's the strongest.

[@success5083]

The Falco disrespect tho :[

[@batofdestiny]

I love the fact that my main, game and watch is on the bottom of your tier list. All the more motivation to show you that he has potential. I’ve been playing him since Melee and although he’s changed throughout the years, I still have mained him since Melee.

[@bladeofgrass96]

I'm just glad my girl palutena is viable

[@maroXUprising]

Praise the goddess.

[@demonicginger7522]

I love how this game has no bad characters! IT JUST MAKES ME SO HAPPY, especially when I see people win with characters that never use to exist in tournaments

[@kiirbstomp]

Doesn't Ness hard counter Snake with his down B?

[@themoonman9721]

After that awestin vs mdv yeah I would agree,

[@luckymanx2978]

no grenades have an active hitbox before they explode

[@mefour83]

r k Don't they have to be energy based projectiles for it to work?

[@yummyhershey5902]

Dark Might, lmao PK Magnet

[@nsm6467]

dude finally someone that doesn't under cut mario.

[@foxygotmoxy2307]

I literally agree with everything

[@gacha_holic8948]

So happy to see my boy fox up in your S tank. People have been saying he is worse now than in Smash, and I just do not agree. Combo game is insane and his improved up smash makes it a lot more reliable if a kill move. Suffice it to say I’m still rocking him as my main for the time being.

[@joshawott3323]

As much as I love your stuff, Jtails, I feel like Zelda should be higher. My reason is because she is BEST GIRL! : )

[@tamzynguyen4923]

First person I see put Mii Sword fighter pretty high lol. Tornado is that OP?

[@AeroLeaf4]

Tamzy Nguyen It has set knockback, basically you can combo tornado into anything.

[@ppmusic1322]

I subscribed just because you put Pichu in S tier

[@Carolyne_games]

Interesting and well explained list. I understand that it’s still early, but what I’m really liking about this game is how people have such drastically different opinions on many of the characters. Despite having the largest cast I feel like this is the most balanced smash game so far...such incredible work from the team.

[@eggsalad1587]

bayonetta is rated too high in my opinion

[@SaucetinPFGC]

Im so glad you put young link in S, he is insane I hate playing against his amazing projectiles and he can close gaps if you try to weave around them and approach him

[@grannest5050]

I thought that falco lucario and Lucas would be upper in the tiers list but i'm fine with my main (R.O.B)

[@theweirdlyfriendlymushroom7920]

Good choice, fellow ROB player!

[@grotn_]

When you were talking about Jr you forgot to mention that he actually has a usable neutral b now. Its frame data got mad buffed you can have 2 out at the same time and a single one has the potential to break a full shield it is also very good to throw offstage while edgeguarding to negate space for your opponent to recover which makes it easier to predict how/where your opponent will recover

[@wolves44445]

I can’t see any way to justify having Pikachu and Pichu or Roy and Chrom more than a place or two apart.

[@NSFSponsor]

Definitely big enough reasons. Roy has to be so close to do real damage. Chrom has great damage and benefits from Roy speed and doesn't need to space. Pichu is smaller Pikachu. He is harder to hit and hits harder. At a high level the self damage is not as important.

[@wolves44445]

Damion Dixon Those are important enough to distinguish the characters, but not to put a dozen characters between them. Not even close.

[@yoboyajax5983]

The minor differences have a huge impact though

[@wolves44445]

Austin Reed Not enough to say Pikachu is worse than a dozen characters that Pichu is better than.

[@tylerjensen6940]

I agree

[@enigwa3286]

Have you seen Mii Swordfighter's fair? The range of fair is absolutely absurd and they get kill setups from it. Dtilt is also super ranged and is frame 5. It's completely safe on shield. Additionally, their Chakram is an absolutely fantastic projectile. It's extremely versatile (try SH buffered retreating Chakram) and you can even soft throw it. Anyway, I'm happy to see a top player recognizing how crazy good this character is, but there's a lot more to this character than just the tornado. Some of their tools in the neutral are just straight up ridiculous.

[@amiithevampirequeen2828]

*EVERYONE. IS. HIGH TIER!!!*

[@natefroggy3626]

This tier list is a joke. If your lowest tier is Mid Tier, you need to wake up.

[@shortstacksport]

@@natefroggy3626 I mean, who the hell is lower than mid-tier? The two large tournament winners so far have been Wario and Ike. I repeat, Wario and Ike. Let that sink in.

[@natefroggy3626]

@@shortstacksport Check out where Wario and Ike are on the tier list. Top tier and high High Tier. Now tell me if you can see anyone in the Mid Tier winning a major.

[@dearthofdoohickeys4703]

I remember playing Young Link in melee as a little kid. Started from the bottom now we’re here! 🙌

[@u1f47b7]

Chrom's recovery is pretty exploitable, which I feel a lot of people don't understand. It meteors relatively early, yeah, but it goes nowhere in terms of horizontal movement. You could use Revenge as Incineroar at the edge against his recovery, and he would probably die. I've won games with 3 stocks because of it

[@JulesTrades]

Yeah which is why I think he will drop a decent margin in the coming months.

[@plank8152]

Which makes it worse is that when when he gets up, there’s a few frames with no hitboxes so most characters can just forward or down tilt and he’ll die

[@Nick-rx9gw]

What about characters without counters? Just wondering

[@2CHiLLED.]

Pand4 Characters with counters fuck Chrom all the way up.

[@Ihealwounds]

Counters screw his recovery if its not sweet spotted, also King K Rool can vacuum you with his neutral b if you go slightly above the ledge.

[@FOOLTH]

I’m definitely biased, but I still think everybody’s sleeping on falcon.

[@JamBudsVO]

Sonic being described as brainless in Smash4 with all the nonsense in there is just not right. I repeat: SPIN DASH WAS NEVER A I WIN BUTTON and anyone who still had trouble with it after all this time, its all your fault. half the time the character doesnt even win unless he is forced to time ppl out...

[@cesarebeltramello9808]

Really liked this tier list. I agree on your arguments about inkling and about the top 4 characters. The only thing i would like to see different is a more divided list whit more tiers but other than that i think is one of the best out there

[@jackfalcon5125]

Some of this just doesn't make sense sorry Jtails but the new content on ultimate has been awesome keep it up!👍

[@justaviewer4288]

I hate how some people disagree and talk smack about one little thing or something said wrong but I agree with your opinions on the characters and what fits them in the list.

[@Bluhbear]

I wonder what ESAM thinks about Pichu being two tiers above Pikachu. :3c

[@Rat_Dessert]

I didn’t really watch the video I just skipped to the end but I can say I’m pleasantly surprised on how you ranked people I like that so many peoples tier lists are different!

[@adeptproperty27]

Jtails, I love your content and your intelligence of this game. I am a dedicated Lucas main and I was wondering if you could please make an extremely in-depth guide for Lucas including his Frame data and hitboxes, along with how to win neutral and start combos, etc. Lucas Mains are somewhat rare nowadays and I know you are good with ness, so maybe you know at least a little bit of the fundamentals of our other Earthbound character. I know you would make the best guide for Lucas, so please consider! If not, I understand, I'm going to watch your more generalized competitive videos as they release regardless to help myself out. It would just be really nice if you could help me with my main specifically. Thank you!

[@DJ-ps8sg]

What does inking the ground as an Inkling do? I thought it only matters if the opponent is inked...

[@MrMint-pk6iq]

T plays Young Link now, this is a bad sign

[@mayauppstad9883]

T is really good at smash 4 link and young link is more similar to that than link in ultimate. Doesn't mean link is bad. Just that he might appeal to different kinds of players than in smash 4.

[@YeszCore]

I agree with the thing you said in the beginning. You can play as any character in this game and win against a competitive player. They did a fantastic job of balancing from smash 4.

[@user-vu8uf3rl1e]

Put ike in Husband tier

[@silverfortune2205]

If there's 2 characters I tend to run into that defs give me alot of trouble online, that would be palutena and ganondorf. I keep finding players who wreck face with these 2 and it's throwing me for a loop. That being said I find it interesting that mii swordfighter is probably very good as I have begun to use MSF not too long ago and it's working out better then I expected, might be a main of mine for the foreseeable future.

[@spectre5185]

Hey jtails I love you stream and videos

[@spectre5185]

I’m said now I mane faclo

[@spectre5185]

Jtails I want to play you to show you my faclo

[@JT-pv2nj]

i have the same idea as you! no character is bad, they can only be good and then possibly drop down. we're only a month into the meta.

[@vxu3826]

okay list but chrom is disgusting he should be s class

[@muckbanger1810]

This tier list is beyond it’s time. I like the tier list and I also think that this tier list isn’t very accurate right now but will definitely be in the future. Like shulk isn’t too good rn but will be after people start winning tournaments. Etc.

[@ramsesnajera3578]

Mewtwo is better than greninja

[@peopleschamp3170]

Agreed, Mewtwo should be higher tbh

[@boyapollo808]

Definitely. I think he's in the top 20 easily. Maybe even top 15

[@AMnotQ]

Mewtwo is top 30. Too many characters are just better than him now. But top 30 is still really good. Definitely better than Greninja.

[@timotheus7845]

Top 10 EZ

[@boyapollo808]

@@timotheus7845 I've been a mewtwo main from melee, project m, sm4sh and now ultimate. I know this character in and out. However, I dont think he breaks into the top 10. The nerfing of airdodges and changes to his Nair killed a couple approach and combo options. I'm sticking with him though and adding a secondary to cover his bad matchups (i.e. cloud, marth, mario, palu)

[@TheTyranex]

So jtails how much do you factor in "potential". Are current standing and experience the emphasis for this teir list or are you looking ahead to a possible characters tech.

[@dezlovecraft5247]

if you dont know Robin "true" potential...then why put it on a tier list? tier lists are gettin dumber by the second, too early to call the meta of the game.

[@okami7847]

0:33-0:44 I get what you and ZeRo are trying to do by informing the community that no character is outright bad however low tiers don't equal bad characters either. Its just the terms "low" or "bottom tier" that people correlate to being the "bad tier". Tier lists are in a list format for a reason, so mid-tier should be the middle not the bottom. Its your opinion, your tier list but I just wanted to express my thoughts about this type of format. EDIT: Also I actually very much agree with the general placing for Link, I used to main him and definitely think people are overrating him.

[@JulesTrades]

I didn't even know ZeRo was doing this. So Low tier by definition does mean that the character simply doesn't have enough tools to compete with the higher tier characters. I think the reason that zero, myself and others separately agree on not having a low or bottom tier section is to stress that the separation between the "worst" and best characters really isn't great at all. There are tier lists that have all characters in S Class and A class rank, because every single character is extremely good, with great tools and can compete with one another on even playing field. It isn't out of the ordinary to exclude tiers.

[@okami7847]

@@JulesTrades Yeah I do agree the gaps between tiers are very small, and can see why people use very few tiers but theres 74 characters so the rows tend to get cramped and is hard to tell who is better when you have 20+ character in one tier.

[@lioncubden]

this ain’t it chief

[@falken8642]

Why is pichu 2 whole tiers above pikachu? I get maybe one tier difference due to minor differences between the characters, but 2? Is he really that much better?

[@hydroidprime_2897]

Pichu has tournament results, Pikachu doesn't. The differences between the characters are also pretty damn noticeable, with Pichu having a much better combo game and a way easier time killing. There's a bit more I could get into, as I just wanted to give a summarized answer.

[@marshi7777]

PLEASE PLEASE CORRIN & OR GAME AND WATCH GUIDE!!!!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@BigZesusTekken]

CORRINNNNN

[@Takapon218]

Big Z easy just chomp

[@patrickdelvecchio7119]

I feel like zero suit should be above Mario or maybe behind because her killing power and combo game is still there and if executed right is really good.

[@ZerosiiniFIN]

do you know what "mid" means?

[@ShiningBlueOfficial]

Seeing as I'm a pichu/shulk main (still trying to figure out who's the main and secondary). This list makes me pretty happy

[@zandom5564]

Nice tier list (Y) Really appreciate your work

[@alexvanbennekom9779]

HOW do you deal with Ness in neutral. Every time I get hit with PK Fire it’s like a 40%+ combo! Tips?