My HONEST THOUGHTS On Season 12 | OVERWATCH 2 DISCUSSION

[@AbbyOW2]

What are your thoughts on Season 12? How would you improve the balance, the shop, any of the existing systems? What do you think of CLASH?

[@Sahilow]

I think they should add speed boost to flash expect for points A and E like they did to flashpoint.

[@omarmoumani0709]

I just started replaying the game,I stop playing around the end of overwatch one

[@emanchi8403]

Tanks still feels like I’m working a job. Don’t think they’ll truly be fun again until they bring back 6v6. Also, Sombra and widow are very problematic right now. Not sure why they nerfed Hanzo to the ground when Widow was always the bigger problem. Supports are still the easiest/ most overtuned role but it’s been like that forever now.

[@omarmoumani0709]

Make everyone tanks to balance the games

[@mastergrivus5529]

Going from 3-1 to 4-4 in clash is extremely frustrating and funny at the same time. Also, Sombra should get her kneecaps shot off

[@Zazafe3101]

Shooting at dva as soldier feels like playing overwatch in my dreams

[@michaualtington]

idk why but in the few overwatch dreams i had i was always doing some fake made up doomfist roll out on like eichenwalde second that would never work in game

[@A.Cobalt]

@@michaualtingtonI was doing the same, but with Sombra lol

[@its_lucky252]

it feels like throwing minecraft snowballs

[@Synky]

​@@michaualtingtonLMFAO I can totally imagine that

[@Frallicus]

The Bap opinion is spot on. Why is the character who has 3 health bars, amazing vertical mobility, amazing utility, and good damage not getting the health nerf?!

[@DavidSk2683]

2CP felt different. Sometimes frustrating yeah like any mode could be, but fun and the maps were beautiful. Really miss it

[@filipomerovic5126]

It was frustrating in comp but like it was always indecisive anyone could win any time, unpredictable, chaotic, and had a chance for niche heroes like sym torb bastion and orisa to shine

[@thiefpotato2759]

I am really tired of fighting Ashe this season. Bob is completely unkillable, which makes her ult determine who wins fights with relatively no skill required. They need to undo the tank passive buff to Bob, so Bob has actual counterplay. I legit hate how sombra is getting talked about when I havent won a single fight against a team with Bob out (unless its badly placed) since the beginning of Season 12. I also think that DVa, on top of getting nerfs to her sustain, needs a nerf to her ult charge. It feels impossible to kill her on top of dealing with DVa bomb literally being available everytime you finally demech her. The game is relatively fine outside of Ashe/DVa. Maybe nerf Illari because the fact that she is evading nerfs is insane.

[@Mr_Eyes]

Torb's health pool is unreal right now. A flanker has to deal with a 300 hp turret, and then his E that gives him a total 400 hp. I also think deployables need to be destroyed maybe 3 seconds after the owner dies. Pylon, turrets, traps, etc. Zero reason for any character to be able to get value like that after dying.

[@omarmoumani0709]

The need to balance sombra 😢 I keep getting cooked (mostly because I suck at the game)but still she needs a nerf;moreover, Genji needs buff and his brother. I refuse to play any one but Genji

[@A.Cobalt]

I agree, Sombra is just kind of bullshit right now, like if you get hacked at all, you’re dead (I say this as a Sombra player).

[@greenpig1175]

@@A.Cobaltshe’s just too good against bad players rn, and just eh against good players

[@itzpurple_queen9711]

You got your wish, Virus just got a damage nerf

[@le_m4cho965]

​@@itzpurple_queen9711she just got her virus reverted, virus got a innecesary buff a while back

[@le_m4cho965]

This balance team is dumb AF, a while back they were asked "Who is the most difficult heroe to balance" they say Sombra because she has perma invisibility. If she's difficult to balance because of perma invisibilit then WHY DONT YOU GUYS REMOVE IT AND STOP GIVING HER HORRIBLE CHANGES 💀

[@ramsical]

this season should be called season of swapping because the countering has been INSANE

[@ryryhc]

Fr dude

[@MistaUzumaki]

I mean thts the point of the game honestly if you don’t know who counters who then you’re not going to make it that far. If sombras hacking along with an Ana anti grenade all you need is Kiriko. Dealing with Zarya go Ram or Rien. Dealing with Mauga a sigma and an Ana.

[@ramsical]

@@MistaUzumaki yea but as someone who played since ow1 if you were skilled enough you weren’t required to counter swap but in ow2 it doesn’t seem you like you have a choice but to counter if you want the win, which i find to be sad

[@MistaUzumaki]

@@ramsical I felt tht cause some days I really just want to play a certain character & it becomes almost impossible because I like to switch so it doesn’t hurt the experience.

[@DetectiveTM2]

Here I was thinking we've gone through every horrible meta combination possible. From GOATS to Double Shield and Sojourn on 2's launch to Immortals (Raid bosses/ Orisa and Mauga, namely): I've played it all at one point or another. We as Overwatch players have had to endure a lot over this game's lifetime, but this season did it... I actually can't play it anymore. Sombra and Widow are two characters that simply shouldn't be meta, EVER. I'm tired of people saying losing out to Sombra is a "skill issue;" it's not, first of all, and that's also beside the point. It's NOT fun. She's not a fun character to interact with. But going back to the "skill issue" thing, I hadn't played Sombra since her rework several seasons ago-I won three back-to-back ranked games on her despite not knowing the intricacies of her game plan. I shouldn't be able to do that, it's ridiculous. And Widows, although much rarer, can hold entire lobbies hostage while easily evading any dive heroes (who are meant to counter her) with her grapple. At high-level play, these characters are dominating atm, and in upper-Diamond where I am, it's just hell. I thought of finally pulling the plug and deleting Overwatch off my console. It's crazy that I find myself hating the game I loved over all of these years because of this dev team's poor management of the IP. Oh, but Clash isn't too bad, I'll admit; Anubis isn't the best map, but Hanaoka's actually nice to play on. It's Better than Push at least. Geez I miss 2cp though, that was a million times better than anything we've gotten in Overwatch 2.

[@Ccscenario]

you should make a video about the quiet quitting of overwatch players, it’s been hard to notice but it’s happening 😔

[@SOOH27]

The genji winston thing i felt and complained about and all i was met with was "well yeah no character should be able to be dominant all the time a good genji shouldnt win against a good winston" The issue is, right now the BEST genji could not win against the WORST winston. You could have an actual MONKEY playing winston, and beat fucking Necros. It used to be possible to win against or at least drive off an enemy winston, which, with genji's insane skill ceiling, made him one of the most fun characters cause he had the ability to win EVERY matchup. It wouldnt be easy, but it was possible. But now that's gone because gigamonke exists nobody understands my fucking frustration with this cause they'll just be like "well yeah counters exist" Like bro, i didnt come here to play fucking pokemon. I came because there was a character that had the ability to truly become the strongest with skill alone. A hero that made you FEEL like a hero. And now that hero is gone. Reduced to this state by a fucking monkey.

[@rogue4340]

Don't care about giving money to blizzard when u can lose it all over stupid report system suspending your account. The gameplay still feels dogshit even more so since the last season. Good thing I'm not playing it daily anymore

[@griffionow1468]

@rogue4340 Best For your mental! And you are absolutely correct about the report system. I got false banned for cheating and Blizz support gaslit me before eventually unbanning. It's shit

[@rogue4340]

@@griffionow1468 I've mostly seen suspends due to stupid chat reports that don't even make sense, all blizz supp do is tell you terms & conditions with a half assed response.

[@AbbyOW2]

The only solution, which is sad to say, is literally never touch chat.

[@griffionow1468]

@rogue4340 Well I don't talk much in chat cuz of toxicity anyway, but I also see most complaints be about chat bans. The really fucked up ones are outright account bans like in my case for cheating/hacking. And in that case, being unable to play the game entire while being gaslit by Blizzard "Supports" automated responses made me want to never support OW myself again!

[@griffionow1468]

@@AbbyOW2 Yep, I already don't due to toxicity

[@willtheconqueror6148]

No matter how much they buff armor there are a lot of stupid tank players that will feed and die and go 7 and 13

[@YoursTruely]

That dash reset on Hanzo was actually CRAZY

[@ryryhc]

For me its Sombra, I believe that there are some characters in this game that should never be meta. Some characters should just be niche picks good in certain situations or by people who really know how to play them. For me Sombra is definitely one of those heros. Shes just infurating and unfun to play against. I just dont get why you would buff a character thats infuriating and buff them in a way that makes them more infuriating

[@_Couldnt-Care-Less]

7:55 if they nerf his turret they will buff torb himself so what u should ask is for turret buffs and torb nerfs

[@AbbyOW2]

His base self is already strong enough, they have to decide on a weakness, either let the strength be his turret or his normal self where for almost 90% of OW2's life he was the better reaper until reaper finally got the spread change. Torb will still be good though but Im trying to follow their philosophy on where you keep one thing strong one thing weak

[@_Couldnt-Care-Less]

@@AbbyOW2 yes i think his weakness should be himself the problem is the turret is too weak i think what they should do is to make u be able to carry ur turrent, buff it dmg and remove some oberload buffs to himself and put on the turret i mean (turret lvl3 with no health buffs) and ofc nerf torb

[@griffionow1468]

I don't think ANY hero should drop to 225 HP. This change is just making the changes or "shake up" from season 9 more irrelevant. And I don't understand why Blizz is set on doing that when a mid year "shake up" is what they want to do to keep the game fresh. But here we are 3 seasons later. The game felt surprisingly fresh after the S9 changes yet we are already back to power creeping everything. I think the S9 changes should have happened at the beginning of OW2 to evenly distribute the power of that second tank to the entire team. I agree with flats, we need global damage and healing nerfs, yet Blizz has already said they don't want to do that. So at this rate, idk what they are going to do once the power creep is so bad we are right back to where we were pre S9. Are we going to 300 HP for the standard, the 225 go back to 250 and tanks default in the 1000s?! This balance team is actually insane repeating the same mistakes over and over.

[@AbbyOW2]

The answer is simple, they have no clue what they are doing with the balance anymore. I am simply playing into their words and their philosophy, the least they can do is be consistent with it.

[@griffionow1468]

@AbbyOW2 Just got to the part where you said put CTF in quick play and I AGREE! CTF is my fav mode lol. But yeah I'd be surprised if they can even be consistent but if it's consistency in not knowing wtf they are doing, they are nailing it!

[@md3vmc793]

@@griffionow1468season 9 changes werent good anyways 😂

[@griffionow1468]

@md3vmc793 I disagree, as I said, they should have been implemented at the start of OW2 to distribute the lost tanks power evenly through the team. If you didn't enjoy it, that is fine, but the fact is the changes were a good "shake up" for the game that brought in players new or old and have the game solid retention for awhile.

[@afterthought9538]

Well then, buff Genji's and Hanzo's damage. They feel like ass to play.

[@tiam9465]

Playing Hanzo sill feels really off to me especially compared to how it was in Season 8. Nice to be able to be kill supports for the most part now but he sucks so much dueling other dps it's quite sad. Unironically I think he lost the 25 hp when he needed it the most. I'm fine if they don't want to give him his hp back but they should buff his primary to the 250 breakpoint so he doesn't lose so many dps duels.

[@jaivettasheem1314]

I swear as a hanzo main for 6 years I really wanna unsitall the game and never touch it again. Not to mention this balancing and characters just being better in all aspect then my main. Also the shop being a scam and people just turn a blind eye.

[@CrypticDabi]

Bro arrge dropped down to diamond 5 because of the latest patch from being top 500 its insane that people are blind to the issues that they keep creating for this hero. I only have 400 and somethings hours on him but it starting to get real hard to keep playing this game. I'm not a one trick but fuck for my main to be neefed but other characters getting compensation for therye nerfs is so fucking backwards

[@jaivettasheem1314]

@@CrypticDabi indeed yet people say oh he can one shot now. not knowing he takes so much skill to land head shots on these high hp and mobile characters then gets two tap by a support or ash or reaper. He a throw pick and i love hanzo but he aint good and i dont care what anyone say till they play him .

[@Drew-fn6rq]

From what I have seen as a flex support player in high diamond It's just forced 50-50 on which super tank plays better or doesn't throw.

[@TrottiexD]

wait so i wasnt crazy and knew u could buy the UBP skin separately after what happened with lillith moira

[@chaosnole13]

I get wanting pylon nerfed, but people saying Illari's rifle didnt need the nerf when damage boosted shes basically just a perma ulted sojourn like her charge shot is not far off from sojourns rail shot. That's where we are still at, seeing Illari's pocket boosted by Mercy's dropping 12k damage bc supports can be just as good as DPS or honestly better bc they offer way more utility on top

[@AbbyOW2]

Pylon uptime is what allows Illari to get away with her DPS playstyle, it basically removes a part of a gameplay choice from her kit, there is nothing incentivizing that Illari player from DPSing, imo, her damage is fine, Pylon perma-uptime is what encourages the perma-DPS playstyle because she need not care too much about her team and is generating value and ult charge without playing the game herself as a player at times. So that is why I believe Pylon should be a good enabler for Illari to step aside and poke but shouldnt have permanent uptime that it slows the game down.

[@chaosnole13]

Cause rn as I see it the game has lost its identity of what classes are supposed to be. DPS feel bad, tank and support both offer way more, you lose DPS in a fight it's whatever, you lose supports or tanks and it's basically a wrap. DPS as it stands feel like they exist to get picks and be body shields

[@chaosnole13]

@@AbbyOW2 I mean I agree, I'm just also tired in general of this concept of supports needing DPS flex damage. For all the issues of mercy needing a rework, at least there's no DPS mercy. We have aggro moira's, Lucio got damage buff, kiriko as well, all while base hp got dropped on a lot of mobile DPS and some supports. I'll take heal bots in a support role over overturned damage bc support players play out of position or their tanks aren't peeling for them and blizzard feels the need to make everyone solid in damage. I already get triggered every time I get hit by an Ana sleep dart that clearly missed by a foot but hey, we needed bigger projectile sizes 🙄

[@antokiofficial]

"This character needs help!" Y'all keep yapping and yet Juno is not strong and has no cosmetics.

[@AbbyOW2]

Juno is seeing pro play and is working well. Juno has no cosmetics because the majority of the art department was fired and can only work on so many things at a time.

[@M.O.A.N.]

It's okay I guess Sombra DVA Zarya nearly every few games or if someone's main isn't working, not so fun. ACTUALLY, I will yap some more & I'm not sure how to word this.. Main: (900hrs in comp) placed Gold 1, W 118 / L 122 (Gold 4) about 50 matches felt they had fairly balanced teams & were fun ALT: (220hrs in comp) placed Gold2, W 37 / L 18 (Plat 5) about 40 matches felt they had fairly balanced teams, more often than not neck & neck (ACTUALLY FUN GAMEPLAY) Around 60 matches in I noticed win streaks & loss streaks flip flopping (W5 L5 W2 L2 W4 L6 W3 L5 W3 L2) why do they think sandbagging my main & ruining my experience in comp is going to make me give into spending money on their predatory system? Sure I could fight the match maker if I was T500 but I'm not that good & not getting there anytime soon. EOMM should honestly be illegal, it's actually criminal the matches I get thrown into & I'm sweating my ass off just to lose for 10 minutes straight. I can't even tell if I've gotten better or worse until I play on my ALT & I do very well & can hang with the rest of my team in Gold 1 - Plat 5 sooo wtf do i do about that? Do I have to keep making alt accounts just to get fun games where it isn't a steamroll on either side or just stick to getting slapped around until I can carry myself & my team in worse match ups?

[@FunniestFern]

6v6 when?

[@shn1804]

A counterpoint on tracer vs torbjorn. They gave him more armor due to tracer mowing him down (she is specifically mentioned in the patch notes). Should it be fair for torbjorn to just be mowed down by tracer? Unless they decided to nerf/destroy her to make projectile heroes more viable choices into her, it may be a necessary evil if his win rate is just too low in their eyes.

[@AbbyOW2]

I would argue that they completely misunderstood how "Torb" marked Tracer, the match up favors Torb 100% but if Tracer was able to isolate him, it was an easier kill for her since he's a floating circle. he's unironically good in that match up prior to this patch and is now even better because it artificially makes the duel even harder for Tracer since the armor damage reduction really hurts her dmg potential and allows torb more timeto slide in his pellets, I think making easier heroes easier and harder heroes harder just isn't the right way to go about it :/

[@flouse.]

Yeah being a soldier player in season 12 is tough

[@sataniaterumi9122]

sombra op make it impossible to play the New support sombra in every game mercy and Echo are useless now with the 225 hp I hate the balanced team because of them my friends will not play the game anymore 😭

[@huuREG]

first time?

[@brokentoy9]

I don't care about skins in first person games, but I feel for ya. But if it's a bundle, doesn't it lose value if you buy them separately?

[@aerostrafe1075]

What? No. Bundles are just ways marketing teams force you to spend more/justify higher cost for less work items. A bundle can include a skin you want but sprays/voicelines to artificially raise the value up $15. If you really look into some of the bundles you realize you just spent $4+ for a spray you may never bother to tag more than once. Games have been doing this for years though. Its just harder to catch vs you looking at a bundle in a store where you physically can see if you're being ripped off.

[@brokentoy9]

@aerostrafe1075 true, but if you are given an option to buy the item that you want from the bundle separately, then how do they make money on the bundle?

[@brokentoy9]

I'm all for the consumer, so let them add the option to buy things separately. But I can understand if they dont.

[@aerostrafe1075]

@@brokentoy9 Whether someone buys from the bundle vs buying something out the bundle doesnt matter. A sale is a sale. A digital bundle does not operate 1 to 1 of a physical bundle like in a store where you need to make money off the full thing because the other items become products to toss away. There is no loss there if someone buys the skin but not the random spray attached to it and believing otherwise kind of just makes it easier to take advantage of consumers. Its why these live service shops are getting worse by the year.

[@AbbyOW2]

It does not because at that point you as a consumer are putting value on wanting one item rather than the entire bundle itself.

[@adi_baa]

bro its been more than 1 season for the bundle stuff lol season 7 lllith moira gets backlash: ok no more exclusive skins for the ulitmate BP we promise next battlepass: magma mauga exclusive to ultimate battepass ........

[@AbbyOW2]

Yeah its why I said I first talked about it on twitter and tagged the executive producer, thinking it was an error on there part but this season confirms it for me that they are doubling down on it :(

[@muleboy3537]

Imagine stressing so hard over Torb turret. Brother, it is a single, large, noisy, obvious stationary target with a range limit and vulnerable startup time. It requires babysitting (which removes Torb from the fight) or dies to focus fire. What seems to be the problem you are having with this skill check? Show us on the doll where the turret touched you.

[@AbbyOW2]

'Skill check' when I'm consistently GM since OW1 LOL My point in regards to torbjorn is making easier heroes even easier to play and slowly turning them into problems for the game is not a solution, they need to stop before it gets out of hand.

[@sonicallstarify]

Sombra needs to be a support end of discussion

[@greenpig1175]

She’s never had a support playstyle in her entire time in OW

[@sonicallstarify]

@@greenpig1175 someone didn't play the mirror watch event

[@greenpig1175]

@@sonicallstarify I did, she was terrible and played nothing like she had ever played before

[@sonicallstarify]

@@greenpig1175 That's where balancing comes into play. The reality is this whether you like or not: You cannot have a DPS character with permanent true invis(not cloaked/camo like other games) and expect them to be balanced. It's a foos errand either to strong or too weak, perma invis itself is bullshit. OW is very careful to not gut a characters identity even with nerfs/reworks Support Sombra is your only answer to go forward with her keeping perma invis. You might hate this comment but that's the reality of the situation Lots of OW2 is just reverting shit back to OW1 cause of some arrogant developers who thought they knew better. Latest example before you pulled some bullshit to deny the truth, McCree/Cassidy. They finally admitted Mag Grenade wasn't it and put back Flashbang(albeit in a nerfed state but that too can change)

[@MrGrae333]

I don't know who you are but I enjoy and appreciate honest reviews, so I figured I'd give this video a chance.. To my dismay, you started being dishonest around 00:05 ... I don't know if I'll ever give a stranger the benefit of the doubt ever again...

[@aerostrafe1075]

Does buying skins really support the art team? I've always wondered this in games. The only real way OW2 makes money is through skin sales and battlepass sales so I partially doubt much of that profit goes to the art team specifically. It does support the game as a whole which does in a way support the art team but I dont know. It feels like one of those tip systems where you tip $5 in the machine but your server only got a small portion because the tip is spread across all servers at the time. Forgot what place was like that.

[@AbbyOW2]

For what it is worth, I have some behind the scenes talks with an artist on OW on this but out of respect I cannot share details In a way, the answer is, yes, it supports them. But how it does it I cannot dig into because that team has been reduced to a skeleton crew.

[@aerostrafe1075]

@@AbbyOW2 Oof thats gotta suck.

[@shaneh3109]

Simple solutions...if you want it to go away. STOP BUYING IT

[@AbbyOW2]

Thats not how it works, they already make back more than enough, this is more of a community sentiment rather than "Don't buy it xD" They still make the revenue for it through other ways.

[@brokentoy9]

I'm also hesitant on 6v6 cause every tank comp will have zarya in it. That's not fun.

[@thatonepronoun7503]

rein meta when?

[@huuREG]

ashe should have 200 hp

[@itzpurple_queen9711]

No because she doesn’t one shot without being boosted. Widow is only 200 hp because she can one shot.

[@huuREG]

@@itzpurple_queen9711 ashe should have 200 hp

[@GhostGaming316]

Buff genji

[@Sahilow]

1st like from school❤😂

[@bennettstokes195]

The ultimate battle bass isn’t really that bad a deal, it’s 20 bucks for exclusive skins and the premium battle pass perks. You get the other 20 dollars in coins which you’d spend at some point anyway

[@itzpurple_queen9711]

It’s not a bad deal, it’s just very scummy to lock skins behind it.

[@keelannh]

been maining torb since s3 of ow1 and he is easily in one of the worse states he has ever seen. turret is cosmetic unless you are fighting a baby dva or tracer so hearing you complain about being countered on tracer i can’t help but laugh lol

[@Lucigu888_OW]

I am really liking the new squishy to squishy new interactions. The diferent hp thresholds feel great to play into. My only issue rn in terms of squishies are bap, ash, reaper and one that I feel is not being talked about nearly enough, widowmaker. She is slowly creeping up again and its getting really spooky tbh. Terms of tanks, I recommend watching spilos video and take on how armor should be done, I absolutely love that idea and I would love to see armor work like that on the live game. I also think most tanks need raw hp nerfs, only exceptions I would put there is doom and maybe queen. I think tanks in 5v5 for them to work, they need to find survivability from using their abilities properly, not just through raw hp and armor tankiness. The reason why characters like queen are fun is bc they survive by using their abilities properly. Final thing. Been trying the 6v6 mode for a while, and I am starting to feel its cracks and it doesn't really feel as good as I imagined. Neutral game feels worse than it feels rn on 5v5. Playing certain maps into double tank feels horrible, and ultimates feel more oppresive than ever. I will wait for a full judgment to the actual ingame "official" test, but I am starting to not like 6v6 as much as I liked it when I started testing it. And also 5v5 is slowly growing on me back again

[@darkcat6530]

Ye 6v6 mode was fun early on but as time goes on it can feel jarring and tiring to play It was hard for me to motivate myself to play it cause it could feel like a chore just to chase the hope off the great games you get where everyone is working together

[@aerostrafe1075]

Does 5v5 even have much of a neutral game? One feels like you're waiting for CD to be gone vs the other being an opening to exploit. One is a lot easier to notice vs the other for players.

[@Lucigu888_OW]

@@aerostrafe1075 Mostly in 5v5 poke in general feels a lot less oppresive, which is one of the issues I am starting to see on 6v6. And flanking and taking angles in general is a lot more accesible, making the neutral feel better and more impactful in general.

[@aerostrafe1075]

@@Lucigu888_OW The flanking angles feels more like "instant gratification". I enjoy an angle I worked for vs a free angle but I also play a lot of games where if you just try to take that free angle then you could just die for it. Poke I get the opposite feeling. Poke in 5v5 is outright annoying unless I am on certain heroes in certain roles that dont have to play it. Personally, I do think "oppressive" is a word people throw out way too often now and without the context behind it then pretty much anything is oppressive.

[@AbbyOW2]

Yeah I agree on Widow and also watched Spilo's vid on armor just today on a bus ride home and agree with his perspective on this, regardless, I am waiting to see what happens for the midseason before jumping into further conclusions and talks as we are very close to it

[@assassith]

Reaper is not a good counter to tanks. I think it's weird that you say Soldier is really bad in the D.va/Winston matchup just to turn around and say Reaper is a mandatory Winston counter. Even if you didn't mean it in the sense of bursting through Winston's HP, there are countless other characters like Hanzo/Cree that can burst bubble far faster than Reaper can. Maybe it was just a random comment made in the spur of the moment, but I feel like false-positive comments about a hero being good brings about a misconception within the community, further exaggerating how good said hero *actually* is. I encourage you to stat check Reaper's damage numbers and such against other characters via the Overwatch Wiki, so that you can have a more in depth understanding at where he is currently at because I believe he genuinely isn't any better as a stand alone character.

[@thederpydazer]

They may be able to burst bubble faster but the 1v1 matchups are more favorable to reaper. Since reaper has close range burst, 2 repositional abilities, and high self sustain, reaper is a more favorable match up neutral and this has been the case ever since the beta.

[@assassith]

@@thederpydazer Oh nah. If we're considering ALL of OW2's existence, Reaper has been pathetically weak. Every character is able to either out-range him, out-damage him, or has a way to keep him from closing the distance. Regardless of his ability to reposition, neither tool is useful in closing the gap. Without closing the gap, he is unable to do significant damage. He's also incredibly weak in the self-sustain category, as well. You have to be within 5m to be receiving more than 35 HP per shot and the maximum amount of HP you can get from killing a 250 hp squishy is 87 HP. It is incredibly inconsistent and severely diminished by the DPS passive.