My thoughts on A.I used on 4k transfers

Here is a video on my thoughts on the use of A.I on 4k transfers.
Here is the A.I 1950's Jaws trailer, thanks to Paul Thorpe :-
• Jaws - 1950's Super P...
My previous Aliens 4k video:-
• I watched Alien & Alie...

[@user-le4sm4wd1e]

Aliens at the cinema was very very dark and grainy, I watched it multiple times at the cinema in 1986 and it looked like a low budget b-movie which indeed technically it really is. I eventually picked up the 4K ready to rip it to bits but in all honesty it wasn't anywhere near as bad as some say. On my calibrated telly it was still film like and not waxy in any way. The clarity in some scenes was at times a bit jolting but in retrospect not a bad thing,, just revealing. End of the day it's all subjective but as an intial naysayer I'm really glad I picked it up.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Cheers mate, great comment 🤩🤩👍👍 yeah I chose the open mind route and just if it worked for me then that was fine 🤔😁 yeah had a great time with it so it's all good! As you say I didn't find it waxy but when it was sharp it was ultra sharp, so it takes a bit of getting used to but I didn't take too much notice after the initial first 10mins 🤩🤩thanks again for commenting mate 😊😊👍👍

[@cheekster777]

Thank you John.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Cheers Cheekster appreciate you checking out all the videos mate 🤩🤩👍👍

[@cheekster777]

@@MondoChelloveckMovies 🤝

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

@cheekster777 🤜🤛

[@tvnash]

Nice video as usual John, it's always fun hearing your thoughts on stuff. While I like A.I. for artwork, like say showing what characters in films from the 2000's onward might have looked like had they appeared back anywhere from the 1930's to 1970's as it's cool to think about what could've been, I'm not on board with A.I. being used in film restoration, 4K and otherwise. It takes away the beauty of film stocks and prints for me, and it makes the actors and actresses look like figures in Madame Tussaud's Wax Museum. Granted I've only seen screenshots, but I can see what folks are talking with the pasty and waxy look. I won't lie, I'm a purist when it comes to how films are shot and the type of cameras used, though Digital has never bothered me much as it does keep the integrity of the image. If someone's at the helm of using A.I., I would give it the benefit of the doubt, as the people working it would try to be true to the original stock, but to just instruct the A.I. feels too scary and dangerous. This is just my opinion of it, and I would never knock anyone who likes how the restorations of films with A.I. looks as we all see things differently with films and TV. Apologies for being a little out of the loop on your videos lately John, but I had a health scare recently and spent the last couple of months getting tests done. I won't go into details here, but I'm on the mend and feeling a lot healthier now.

[@garyrichardson475]

If they just upped the resolution of the 1080p for the 4K, it explains what we’re looking at. I still don’t like it, but at least it gives us a reason. I’ll bet that’s what happened because I don’t see any reference in the product description to rescanning the original in 4K.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Not really sure about the way this was handled in the way of negatives etc Gary, but I've heard people say definitely 4k restoration from original negs, and also just upscaled from the blu Ray, either way it's definitely been A.I ied Gary 🤔👍

[@paulandrews7275]

Right, there has been a fair bit of debate over the Cameron 4k's, both for and against and I am not going to sit on the fence here, I am firmly against the use of AI the way Cameron has utilised it on Aliens. The 4k of Aliens is not the same film that so many of us saw and loved in the 80's and 90's, the 4k of Aliens is an ungodly AI enhanced recreation and I don't like it one little bit. The base scan that was used for the Aliens 4k dates back to about 2010 and was made for the Blu-ray and Cameron made some digital fixes to remove goofs and mistakes like Bishop's body seen or smudged fingerprints on the laboratory tubes holding the Face Huggers, all those digital fixes are the same on the 4k and the framing is also exactly the same. There is also no mention of a new scan so the Aliens 4k definitely uses a decade plus old scan. Scanning technology has improved greatly since then and a brand new 4k scan and restoration of the Aliens original camera negative would have produced glorious results and it's a shame that Cameron went down the AI route instead. The Aliens 4k looks nothing like 35mm film, it is too bright, has a slight teal look and because the scan is so old the colours rarely exceed the colour range of the Blu-ray, the Dolby Vision layer is totally static so a complete waste of time and a brand new scan with a proper HDR grade would destroy the current 4k. You mention both Blood and Black Lace and Suspiria 4k's which I own and you quite rightly point out they are superb 4k discs, I cry a little inside to think that Aliens could have looked as good. Because 35mm grain is random the AI can't understand it and that is one reason why Aliens was DNR'd to hell, it was so the AI has a clean and sharp image/frame to lock onto and enhance/sharpen/ruin. Even those who like the new Aliens 4k admit it sometimes looks strange, the 'uncanny valley' feeling that we all get as the AI does various weird things with the perspective, smoothing out surfaces where there should be texture, enhancing eyes and making hair look like rubber, then there are pores on faces which look like craters and wrinkles and lines that look like canyons, it just looks and feels off. I think the Cameron 4k's are a one off from someone who hates 35mm film and had the influence to do what he wants, or at least I really hope so. I am positive labels who care about the films they restore like 88 Films, Arrow, Blue Underground, MGM, Sony, Synapse and Vinegar Syndrome are as horrified as most of the rest of us and I don't think for one second any of them would embrace this AI technology.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

I think you're right about all the labels we love will not go down the A.I way on restorations and would always go the old school route. I do think that Cameron is the one that will use that way until a new thing appears and I don't think it'll be the norm 🤔🤩🤩👍👍

[@markpugh6808]

Suspiria one of the best 4Ks due to the Colours

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Totally is Mark!! The 4k colours are insanely good 😲🤩🤩👍👍

[@Paul01191]

Hi John Excellent video I really enjoyed your thoughts on these recent 4k transfers I think these directors have that much technology at had they could miss use it. I think people today want the best transfer there is. Its like when it went from vhs to dvd to blu ray to now 4k I just think with the technology today and in the future they my turn films in what we never remember. Technically can sometimes go to far Hope you are keeping well John and keep up the good work. 👍👍👍

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Yeah I agree that technology is moving so fast and I think film restoration has reached a new level and some 4ks are astoundingly good 🤩🤩👍👍 however I'm the same as you Paul about taking it too far, there needs to be a cut off point on how much technology is used as the previously way that is used now is more than adequate isn't it 🤔🤩 thanks for the great comment, doing well mate, hope you are too 😁😁👍👍

[@markstewart515]

I Hope re mastering from the original camera negatives continue John. While Aliens 4k does look good I prefer a none AI tinkered transfer. I know 8k tvs have AI upsclers for upscaling HD & 4k to 8k.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Yeah me too Mark 🤩🤩👍👍 I like what A.I can do but it can't take over from the humans mate 🤯🤯😱😁👍

[@jimled50jl49]

Having spent watching dvd's in standard editions for decades and only recently getting a Blue Ray Player [ that's also 4K ] I have not long been buying Blue Rays rather than 4K [ Not got a 4K tv anyway ] and I am really happy with the quality, and right now the prices are coming down, so I will be sticking with Blue Ray. At the moment I am more interested in the actual movies, and I love your recommendations, having bought a few already which I would never have known about without watching your videos. I definitely have my eye on "Suspiria" but in Blue Ray. I have it on vhs widescreen un-cut special edition and yep .. my vhs player is still connected and working fine. Lol Cheers John ! Regards Jim

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Cheers Jim 😁😁👍👍 thanks for your kind words mate 🤩🤩🙏🙏 blu rays are still a fantastic medium and quite reasonable in price now, so you can pick up some amazing stuff Jim 😁😁👌👌 it's rare to hear that someone has a working VHS and it's still getting used! (Good to hear that 🤔😁) thanks for watching and leaving this great comment Jim 🤩🤩👍👍

[@DavidDunneUK]

I believe from what I’ve read is that Cameron had a full 4K restoration done on The Abyss, so I’d like to see that in comparison to the Aliens 4k, which much like yourself, I was more than happy with. By the way, the guy who makes those Super Panavision 70mm trailers has put up a video explaining how he does them : kzbin.info/www/bejne/jHqlqHZop6dmpKMsi=UFct_m1B6hXXg7fS

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Cheers David 😁😁👍👍 that video is quite wild isn't it by giving the A.I some words and it does all the rest 😵‍💫😵‍💫 also having to run it time and again so it learns how to be better! Brilliant and scary David 🤔👌👌😱😱🤣 yeah the Abyss seems to be the beat one by all accounts, haven't seen it yet David, but really interested in what it looks like myself 🤔😁😁👍👍 yeah I think Aliens is a really good watch mate 😁😁 cheers again David 🤩🤩👍👍

[@GJarr2]

Hello John, I think that all modern film restoration uses some type of Ai. When getting rid of scratches, blemishes or tears, a restorer can't go through the whole film frame by frame, the cost and time would be extortionate. The problem comes when the overall look of the film is given over to Ai with no thought to the original look of the film. At the end of the day, the question is who actually owns these films, the fans or the studios. Keep up the great work John, all the best, Glenn.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Yeah good point Glenn 🤩🤩👌👌 everything is "altered" I suppose from the "original" way we have seen these films before (maybe even in the wrong way pan and scan etc) so we are (hopefully) seeing these as they were meant to be seen and even the people who made them didn't even expect them to look as good!! But you can't beat a skilled human to bring these things out as A.I will always be one step behind in that 🤔🤔 good point about the ownership Glenn, imagine if the people involved asked the fans what they would prefer : Human or A.I restorations??? It would never happen but as consumers it would be great to be included 🤔🤩🤩 great comment Glenn 😁😁👍👍

[@MadMartysMovieReviews-gv6hk]

Excellent vid John,very informative...i loved the 4k of Aliens,i praised it alot in my own review,sadly AI will probably take over but it'll probably get way better at doing remasters over time...i just got Suspiria 4k,looking forward to watching it 😀

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Cheers Marty 😊😊👍👍 it's definitely up to the individual mate, and if the person likes it, all good and if a person doesn't like it...all good as well 🤩🤩👍👍 I agree that A.I will get better but it'll never better tye human touch 🤔👍 I'm interested to hear your thoughts on Suspiria Marty 🤔🤩👍👍

[@MadMartysMovieReviews-gv6hk]

@MondoChelloveckMovies Hopefully will have the Suspiria review up this evening John 😉

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

@MadMartysMovieReviews-gv6hk excellent Marty! I'll keep an eye for that one mate 😁😁👌👌

[@miserableoldgit1411]

hi john great vid i to loved the 4k of aliens so i have no taste as well i et a movie sit down watch it and thats it big buying month got high noon 4k once upon a time in the west one love and dune 2 hope you and debs are well tc steve

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Hi Steve 😁👌 yeah it's just a matter of personal taste at the end if the day 🤔 you picked up great films there Steve!! All classics 😁😁👌👌

[@philipcoghill4648]

My theory as to why Aliens used the Blu-Ray master with AI enhancement (and I'm not the only one who has suggested this), is that Jim Cameron made a few digital tweaks to the film to remove continuity errors for the Blu-Ray (i.e when Bishop grabs Newt at the end you could see Lance Lance Henriksen's body sticking out underneath), and if the restoration team had done a new scan of the negative those would have been undone, so he decided to go for the upscaling method instead.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Yeah that's a good point Philip 🤔😁👍 the funny thing is that Cameron takes an age over making his next film yet he won't put the spade work in for the ultimate restoration on his past films 🤔🥴🤩 interesting thing to talk about mate 😁😁👍👍

[@agesflow6815]

Thank you, John. I hope humanity never need resort to a Butlerian "Endeavor" but if inevitable, what better time than now?

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Yeah that's a point mate 🤔🤩 let's hope technology moves away from movies 😬😬🤩👍

[@garyrichardson475]

The comment you showed at the beginning of your video could have been said more delicately but I agree with it and I’m not sure how to make it sound any less snobby. Those who cannot see how the AI filters hurt the movie either don’t have the eye to see how it differs from 35mm or they do see it but don’t understand the value in preserving that look.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

It did make a generalisation that everyone who likes it knows nothing and if a person says that then they should fully understand the group they are talking to Gary 🤔 people have offered their opinions about if they like it or not, which is great, and people have given great reasons for their thoughts, which is great and that's welcomed! But just saying that was kind of not having that discussion or understanding of what people like or dislike about this topic....to be honest Gary, before I put this video out I knew it would attract comments like that (surprised there wasn't more) Gary, I'm a firm believer of free speech but you know when someone is just being rude 🤔🥴😁 anyway I don't discuss that much on the channel as I'm not into negativity, but over on my membership side of the channel, I talk about things like this VERY frankly.... which is great fun 🤩🤩👍👍 so I do agree with your comment Gary, but I still like Aliens 😊😊👍👍

[@LukeLovesRose]

If and when we lose Cameron - God forbid, im sure well get a more pure 4K or even 8K transfer. Until then, im very happy

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Yeah I can imagine a "retro old school remaster" of this coming out in some years from now Luke 🤔🤩👍 good point mate 😁😁👌👌

[@XFile2708]

Interesting to hear about AI being used.. me personally it doesn't bother me in the slightest if it's used and we get a great looking film.. obviously not at the expense though of over enhancing a film which needs to retain that old skool look 😎👍

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Yeah I agree Marcus, I hope, as you said it just makes the film look good and not just turn all restorations "weird" for me if they look good job done 🤩🤩👍👍

[@80sGeek]

watched Suspiria on dvd the quality wasnt great. But the blu ray was really good. not seen Suspiria 4k yet

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

The blu ray is decent mate, but the 4k is insanely good 😁😁👌👌

[@54321ZachMr]

Susperia in my opinion is a showcase for 4k. Aliens looks good, but isn’t a showcase and is a bit of a disappointment, especially compared to its sister film, The Abyss.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Yeah totally Zachary 👌👌🤩🤩 Aliens is definitely one that divides viewers, kind of comes down to personal choice and I do hear The Abyss is the best out of the 3 mate 😁😁👍👍

[@54321ZachMr]

@@MondoChelloveckMovies The Abyss was always a decent home viewing experience with great sound. I would go as far to say that the 4k rally blows its predecessor releases out of the water. The contrast of light and shadow in the underwater scenes provides a sense of depth that no other movie has. The closest thing I could compare it to is Avatar 2 without the computer graphics making it look like a Pixar film.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

@54321ZachMr wow that sounds incredible Zachary 😁😁👌👌 yeah the 4k aspects would lend very well to make this movie look amazing!! Thanks for the info mate 🤩🤩👍👍

[@roygalloway688]

Will be watching Aliens in the next few days. If I understand the process. For it to learn, you have to feed it lots of films for it to learn what is detail, what is an anomaly . The more it does, the better it can adapt and make fewer errors. Cameron has used Peter Jacksons facility to do the work. A human can spot an obvious error, but the AI hasn't got the expertise, so it does the best at how the images should look. Sometimes it's great other times it crosses it's fingers in hope. Think we are looking at at least 10 years before it gets its act together. As I stated before Cameron hates grain so it does what its told and removes at much as possible. Gemini Man was shot at 120 frames per second as Ang Lee wanted it played in 3D cinemas. He forgot most cinemas cannot handle that anyway. It's alright Directors pushing the boundaries but that can alienate the audience. To say Cameron did The Terminator films about AI destroying the planet he uses it to destroy his most beloved films. The irony of it is so obvious perhaps he is trolling us 😮

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Love this comment Roy, after reading it I can imagine how A.I "thinks" it's a fascinating process with frightening implications (if used wrongly) but in Cinema it could alter a lot of things both good and bad! I've always heard or thought that they would eventually be able to bring stars back from the dead and put them back in movies that would be quote a thing but would that destroy acting? Yeah Cameron is that invested in the world into Terminator 2 😬🤣🤣👍👍 perhaps the ultimate irony Roy 🤔🤩🤣🤣👍👍

[@stuartgeorge2324]

Did you get the 4 k Blu-ray steelbook email off zavvi for nightmare on elm Street????? Oooooo yes 👍🏻💿👈🏻

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Haven't got into the 4k of Nightmare in Elm St yet Stuart, want to see some reviews first bud 🤔😁👍

[@AdventuresOfTheLeighRambler935]

The 4k transfer of Aliens is amazing. Can’t understand people who say it’s too pristine because the use of A.I. 🤔 If you prefer the old grainy 35mm version at its best, (and I understand the reason why some might have a preference) then just stick with the Blu Ray version

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

Good point there, there's something for everyone now! If you want the sharpest it's there and if you want the traditional one it's there as well mate 😁😁👍👍

[@user-mp9sp9bs7v]

You can't really compare 'Ten commandments' with 'Aliens' as 'TC' was filmed on 70mm whilst 'A' was filmed on a short-lived 35mm grainy stock. Where I do agree with you is going back to the negative for a 4k (or higher) scan is (usually) the way to go. TC has the best negative, so it should always look better. Cameron has used AI to improve the image, but the jury is out as to whether a new 4K scan of this negative has been done or not. Is using AI cheaper than a full 4K scan? Film purists will be arguing over the result for ages..... AI is likely to get better, so future releases or streams may improve with time.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

The point I was making with this video was because I said I liked Aliens and the comment I got was if anyone likes it they don't know anything about 4k restorations (which I find bizarre) that's why I brought in Ten Commandments to show that I understand that TC is a far superior transfer and I rate it highly but as I always say "in my opinion" I liked Aliens but I'm not telling anybody other than my thoughts. I do think that proper restorations look better but Cameron will always do what he does!! Hopefully A.I doesn't become the norm though 🤔😁😁👍👍

[@davidmckee2898]

Even without a i you have changed the movie anyway. With using HDR. If the technology was available when James Cameron made his movies that's the way he would have done them. Same as George Lucas with Star Wars. Is this better technology was available he would have used that

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

He seems like a guy who goes for the latest technology doesn't he David, so I'm not surprised he tries the latest thing, yeah you're right all restorations do have forms of alterations in them to improve them 🤔😁 good point David 🤩🤩👍👍

[@OzzyMandias]

Sorry if you are upset in any way but my comments keep being deleted...

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

I haven't seen any comments mate 🤔🤔 KZbin do delete stuff, for no good reason 😵‍💫😵‍💫 try your comments again bud 🤩🤩👍👍

[@OzzyMandias]

@@MondoChelloveckMoviesI did buy the the inc Bluray from the 4k set off ebay for £5 with the bonus disc, just saying how 1080p image score higher than the 4k on that website...no Atmos but hey ho

[@OzzyMandias]

@@MondoChelloveckMovies Tried about 15 times to comment, I think I've upset the Cameron Police...

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

@OzzyMandias wow!! Honestly don't know why youtu.be do this as I would imagine there is nothing bad in all the comments that get stopped 🤔😵‍💫😵‍💫😱😱🤬🤬 it'll be ####ing A.I. 🤯🤯🤩👍

[@tigerblue42]

This happens sometimes unfortunately, I've had periods where I've tried to post a comment repeatedly (completely innocuous, nothing controversial at all) on several channels at some points and it's immediately removed. My suspicion is that youtube's AI (lol) gets triggered by something in the way the initial comment got posted (how long it took to type, the way sentences were formated/edited, certain words or phrases, multiple comments from the same user in a very short time period...or whatever). I don't think youtube would ever want to reveal the exact algorithm because they want it to be secret so that it can continue to do what it does without the "common man" working out how to get around it. I think if you get "flagged" in this way it can be extra sensitive to you for a short period...but normally if you stop posting for 30-60mins you can then post again without any problem. I don't think it's "personal" (but who knows these days !?).

[@garydarnell3117]

I recently saw Aliens in 4k and I thought it looked great, best it's ever looked. I liked that they got rid of all the grain I think it looks better without it. You can see so much more detail with it muddying up the picture.

[@MondoChelloveckMovies]

The picture is so revealing in the dark scenes especially Gary you're right mate 😊😊👌👌