My Thoughts On Gas VS Electric Paramotors

[@TuckerGott]

It is the last week to enter the SP140 electric paramotor giveaway! Check out the webstore, every $5 spent until May 4th gets you one entry to win. - tuckergott.com/collections/new-arrivals

[@dionbritten]

I'm in it to win it, dude 🙏🏻 hopefully one day I'll get to fly and eventually fly with you 🙏🏻🤙🏻 best of luck to everyone 🙌🏻 you all are amazing 👏

[@Mr.Steepz]

Love the merch, love the quality content. It doesn't get any better than this! thank you!

[@dionbritten]

@Mr.Steepz I 💯 agree with you bro you never know you could be the one that wins good luck 🙏🏻🤙🏻

[@Jasesaviation949]

You should react to Anthony Vella’s crash 😢

[@captkurk357]

Does it offer any form of regen? If you fly high as you said and go windmilling silent they should implement some sort of regen could be life saving. Thoughts?would it be worth it could it recover enough to be worth the technology.

[@kwaaaa]

A lot of hobbies suffer from traditionalist mindset, that is, they will have a negative bias towards new gear because it's too different. It's great how really fair Tucker's comparison between the two is. I know we all suffer from our biases, but this is really an unbias and well thought out review of a new product.

[@platypii]

Great review! I really liked your point that it potentially appeals to a DIFFERENT audience than gas paramotors, and that can bring more people into the sport that otherwise might not have gotten into it. In fact I am one such person who bought an SP140 as my first paramotor. Love it!

[@huepix]

Yes. I'm not that interested in a gas one, but this is clean, efficient etc. Bit heavy and that flight time limit, but to get in the air, it's electric for me

[@seashackf1]

@@huepixit’s not really more efficient though. Heavier, costs nearly the same, but only has a fraction of the range. Recharging takes 4 hrs and isn’t possible on site. So max you can do in a trip is around 30 min. Whereas you can go all day with gas.

[@simonhales631]

Obviously Gas has more flexibility but electric is good for a big chunk of people. There are many people that go for a quick flight for a half hour at night and no maintenance or mess makes it easy for them. Tucker hit all the key points, but the bottomline like electric cars is if it works for you and you like it buy one. If it does not fit your needs or you don't like it, buy gas. There is not better or worse, just what fits the pilot.

[@Robbo1966]

Great review Tucker, head gear and mic so clear glad your enjoying Arizona

[@hightension01]

I never thought I'd live in a world where Tucker Gott regularly flies behind my house.

[@mgrosser2197]

THIS is what I've been waiting for!!!! I purchased Jeff Goins Paramotor book about 3 months before finding Tuckers channel (back around 5k subscribers) and the thing that stopped me from training and a motor purchase was the 2 stroke power plant This may sound strange, but I'm an automotive mechanic by trade and I refuse to rely on a 2 stroke during recreational activities. I work all week on greasy smelly stuff, I don't want to have to do it when I'm off work too. All of my motorcycles are injected, water cooled, 4 strokes. You just check oil level, tire pressures, and go ride. 2 strokes are a nightmare, so I've been waiting for a reliable 4 stroke on a cart, or electric. My wife and I live in Sedona so we don't need the range. The pretty views are at arms length it feels like Great video Tucker. I'll definitely be focusing more on the hobby now that I can get into it and not have to be a mechanic while I'm supposed to be having fun

[@GupStar]

No matter the grease, 2 strokes is never enough for me

[@slickjimmy76]

One of our local pilots has 10 years on his moster 185. I do believe they can be reliable with proper care, air fuel mixture & quality oil.

[@jackhydrazine1376]

If you think two-strokes are bad wait until you strap that big battery on your back and it explodes...and you can't get it off of ya.

[@mgrosser2197]

@@slickjimmy76 I'm sure you are correct. Look at some of the rotax general aviation 2 stroke engines as an example. Hell my dad has a weed eater that he's had since I was a kid in the 80s My hangup lies in the normal condition of 2 stroke care. By design, you will be working on them, they will be loud and smelly, and I know I will not enjoy it because I've been a mechanic for 25 years and I'd like to leave that stuff at work. My main hobby now is MTB and I ride a hard tail so I don't have to jack with cleaning and adjusting a bunch of hinged joints and suspension components Maybe I'm lazy, but I spend too much time doing that crap at work to come home and do it some more

[@kens97sto171]

@@jackhydrazine1376 I believe Tucker said its LFP chemistry.. It's not going to explode. LFP is a very stable chemistry.. I have seen newer cells get pierced with a nail... little smoke.. and that's it. vs.. 3 gallons of flammable liquid on your back with plenty of opportunity for leaks, and a hot exhaust to ignite it.

[@Markolise442]

@TuickerGott We have electric cars that have been running for hundreds of thousands of miles, battery degradation flattens out at around 80% in lithium ion chemistries. So the 1000 cycles to me seems like a low estimate for battery life.

[@kens97sto171]

Especially since I think it is LFP chemistry.. has about double the charge cycle life of NMC chemistry.

[@OtisFlint]

@@kens97sto171 LFP is great for longevity, safety, and cost, but poor for density and performance. I'd rather have the same size battery in an NMC and get more flight time.

[@kens97sto171]

@@OtisFlint Other way around for me. But I drive on average over 50,000 miles per year.. So longevity would be my primary concern. LFP in the Model 3 is actually a fantastic car, it has a fantastic charging curve even though the peak isn't that high. And you can charge to 100% everyday. Be interesting to do a long-distance road race cross country between a Model 3 LFP rear wheel drive. And a long range model 3. Wouldn't be exactly equal because of the extra motor in the long range. I suspect there would be very little difference between the two arrival times. For daily use charging at home, you actually aren't getting any more miles. The NMC charged to 80% is actually less miles than the LFP charge to 100%. The only real advantage would be on road trips possibly but I don't know for sure, I've never seen anybody do that test before.

[@rtfazeberdee3519]

EVs have liquid thermal management and good battery management systems that helps them

[@comedicsketches]

There are a number of different chemistries, and they definitely go beyond 80% other things equal, many relatively quickly. The nuance here is that ev packs tend to not use the entire capacity which does slow degradation but more importantly hides it, since you were only using part of the capacity in the first place. There's no beating physics. I build packs in several chemistries, pack and canned, from LiCo on one hand to LiFe on the other since 2015 btw.

[@magicalkorok]

I'm the sock guy that ordered the risky socks last week! Just got them and they are soooo comfortable. Thank you Tucker!!

[@wspepsilon]

100% on some of your final thoughts there. I think another thing to mention is that it might not be the greatest yet but battery technology is changing at a fairly rapid pace. You mentioned other PEV's (personal electric vehicles) like surrons and onewheels. EUC's are another one in that segment and the batteries that are used is changing so rapidly that you can have multiple versions of the same wheel that the only real difference is in the cell type used in the battery which can drastically change the capabilities. I wouldn't be surprised if in 5 years, some of that range anxiety that you have right now with a 30 min flight can be alleviated.

[@znail4675]

I did a manual battery upgrade on an EUC and got twice the range out of that. Most comes with budget batteries despite high powered ones not costing that much.

[@zaneketchum585]

One wheels are dangerous for us older folks the EUC is more fun than i have had on almost anythign else. GEar up but get out and go.

[@fabiankehrer3645]

@@zaneketchum585 It depends on good roads nothing beats electric skatboards, carving on boards is just more fun. But when it's about range, convienience, terrain capabilities and comfort the EUC wins.

[@AnthonyVella]

I’m in the market for a new paramotor. I seem to have destroyed mine. Great comparison.

[@RominaSosaSchnoerr]

Don't make me laugh, my ribs hurt! Speedy recovery! 💪🏻

[@AnthonyVella]

@@RominaSosaSchnoerr gotta stay positive brother. A little laugh goes a long ways.

[@alanpenn5493]

Hope you have a speedy recovery dude!!

[@themaaciek]

Is your slightly used FlyProducts Rider still available for sale? But for real you're such a inspiration for staying positive in such a hard time. Get well soon Anthony, cant wait for your recovery videos.

[@von...]

hey man, have not watched the video bc I'm choosing to heed your warning of it being a tough watch -- but I really hope you are in good spirits & chilling throughout your (hopefully relatively speedy) recovery ❤

[@gonzogliding]

Keep in mind that Tucker's battery is discontinued, they no longer make the 3.7kw size. The new ones are 4.8kw, weigh 4 more pounds and so far cost the same. For me the electric paramotor made the difference, I just hope it doesn't cost me a divorce.

[@urazz7739]

That's interesting so what, do they last like 45 minutes if we go by how Tucker flies paramotors on average?

[@znail4675]

I would also consider it rather comparable to buy an extra battery as the total costs would still be lower in the long run. If you have two batteries then you can have the spare one on recharge while you fly for essentially infinite flight time with battery swaps.

[@urazz7739]

@@znail4675 Depends on where you fly from really. So far in the majority of videos I've seen of people flying paramotors, they generally aren't close to anywhere they can charge a spare battery.

[@turkeyphant]

@@znail4675 95%+ of ppg pilots take off a significant drive away from any charging apparatus

[@PoppieCiulls220]

@@znail4675my plan is to have an extra battery and charge with my electric truck while I fly

[@privatepilot4064]

Thanks Tucker! Looking for you in the skies over CG!!

[@ParaglidingManiac]

My opinion would be - there is a time and place for both. Me personally, I like to put my glider on the back rack of my ebike and my e-paramotor on my back and go have some low level forest flying (40mins is plenty). While my gas paramotor I like to take out when I really want to explore and go somewhere further away.

[@jeremyfreetoroam]

Regarding fire, the most likely scenario for a battery to catch on fire is when it's charging. Very rarely when discharging.

[@robertkittila4758]

Great video Tucker, the one thing you forgot to mention is flying at altitude. Here in Boulder Colorado we fly at 1 mile ASL. That equates to 18% less power on our gas motors. With the electric the power stays the same no matter what altitude you fly at. Another win for electric.

[@EvanBlack11]

When Solid State battery hit the market this will be amazing. Less weight double the range and faster charge times.

[@Six_One_Six]

As a vehicle mechanic i'd rather work on gas than use the battery version. I've seen batteries do some things that i'd really not enjoy when it's strapped to my back. 2 stroke mix is less flammable than regular gas, and isn't flammable in liquid form. The risk just isnt there. You dont see small gas engines burning down (or large ones) because of gas. I love electric bikes though!

[@BenTheMagnifice]

Your main concern about the battery catching fire is super valid, and it would be so easily addressed by adding a few temperature sensors to the battery, which display directly to the throttle control screen. It wouldn't negate the problem, but it would go a very long way to reducing risk.

[@jimbennett2795]

And a quick release for the battery pack so you can just drop it if you have to.

[@mattc.310]

The plus-minus discussion is really the same with any electric conveyance. The points are identical. My friend went EV, but they do shorter drives alone or with one or two others mainly city with a charge port in their garage. I am still ICE, large vehicle, longer drives with loads or towing, fuel stations everywhere. Each to their own, just let us make our own choices. Good luck to everyone entering the drawing.

[@jerelix]

Nice and objective comparison. Thanks!

[@josephking7021]

Really interesting comparison. Well done! PS. I actually miss your flying over NJ as beautiful as AZ is.

[@Dusty_G]

Just getting into the sport, winning this unit would catapult me ahead to getting into the air after the class that starts 25 May.

[@dionbritten]

Yo bro, your videos are sick! Your journey is inspiring. Keep flying safe and stay dicey🤙🏻

[@urazz7739]

Hey Tucker, I think when you do another flight when trying to fly as long as possible, you should fly it on chill mode instead of sport mode to see how it handles. That would probably also increase flight time as well in addition to flying with a bigger glider.

[@TuckerGott]

I don’t think it would make a difference. It just changes the response time and max power. Cruise is still cruise.

[@wingrovedl]

Thank You, for all your feedback on electric paramotors. Well done ! 🤓

[@Les__Mack]

You are the best Tucker! Thanks for your great videos! Thanks for getting me into the sport tool. 🙂

[@zimsterize]

I'd say you've hit the true sweet spot - owning both.

[@sheogorath7655]

I always fear for your phone when it's in your hand with the brake! Have you ever dropped one in your years of flying? Keep the content coming, Tucker! 😃

[@Brad-py7sj]

Don’t worry, paramotor pilots don’t drop their phones, even while crashing. Anthony cough Vella 🤦🏻‍♂️

[@paramotortheory]

I got my National Forest shirt today. 5 stars. Looks great

[@butchdavis2703]

Damn Tucker is looking stout. I can see you put some muscle on. Great comparison. I am still definitely down to having an electric paramotor in my garage to fly.

[@BuzZzKiller]

I wonder if air travel will be easier. You can easily check the motor in your luggage on an airplane. The battery may be an issue. But its probably easier to mail a battery than mailing an empty tank with gas fumes.

[@Tazdeviloo7]

The same thing is happening with electric dirt bikes. More, but a slightly different crowd, are getting into dirt biking since you don't need to be a part time mechanic anymore. The down side is run time, but I guess dirtbikes don't use as much power cause it would take a world class professional to kill a battery in 30 minutes. I usually get 2 hours of racing out of mine.

[@rogertherrien1128]

What about taking your electic systen and hooking it up to a trike?? Reason I ask is I am Handicapped and cannot run!!??

[@MrCPPG]

I have the SP140 and yes it can be mounted to a trike. I have a launch on my trike in the SP140 on my channel.

[@oasntet]

There's some hard limits in battery storage technology that we're not going to magic out of the way to get batteries with the energy density of gasoline. What's more likely is that an alternative energy-dense fuel becomes commonplace enough that we get motors built around that, possibly using direct electrical conversion instead of 2-stroke engines. Hydrogen fuel cells, for instance. We're also a long, long way off from those being good enough for paramotoring, but alternate energy sources, not energy storage, are far more likely to bridge the gap between electric and 2-stroke.

[@Aircam73]

Hydrogen fuel cells will not work in this situation. The storage is far to large and heavy and to get enough electricity out of a fuel cell to run a propeller at full speed you would need a very large, expensive and heavy one. Plus the cost to fly a fuel cell would be around $30 an hour and that is if you could even get the hydrogen to run it.

[@Lyrainthevalley]

​@@Aircam73I heard some things a few years back about hydrogen-burning internal combustion engines. I wonder if it would be possible to overcome the safety and practicality issues of hydrogen storage too use that approach... Honestly it seems unlikely, but would be neat

[@oasntet]

@@Aircam73 We're talking about far-future tech, not today's. If the weight of metallic hydrogen can be brought down, it might be able to compete with battery. I'm not optimistic, but maybe.

[@Deltazor]

Good comparison, thanks!

[@mgkleym]

The fire risk is less that it catches fire while on your back and more that something goes wrong while it's charging and it burns your house down. Thats been the issue with ebikes and scooters anyway. Hopefully the pack is well designed because high performance lithium batteries are generally very spicy.

[@tommyNix4098]

You mentioned fumes from gas motors. Some paramotors use a fuel bladder. I have a Skymax Star, and fumes have never been an issue, both when storing indoors and when transporting in the back of a hatchback vehicle.

[@TheMaasse]

there is still fumes comming from the engine

[@davidinventsshorts4948]

This is very comprehensive, one thing of electric is the ability to just get in and just go... Maintenence is relatively easier

[@Tatankaonline]

I’m going to put my order in when I return from training. I’ve talked to Paul and there are several things back ordered so if I sent my $$$ now it would just sit in his bank instead of mine. Battery tech and life will just get better w time.

[@heliosld]

YOU hit the bug my friend! :P

[@andyf1235]

If the flight time was similar to gas and the weight was similar to what you described for the electric I would go electric for sure. No maintenance is a huge benefit. But the flight time would need to be longer for me.

[@jsauerii]

Lipo 4 has a very long life. For solar systems as long as you try not to drop under 20% you can cycle 8000 to 10000 times. Those cycle estimates sound very low. Even then at end of life you have still got 80% of its total capacity at a minimum. New technologies in batteries are bringing the cost and weight down. By the time you need a replacement they will be far cheaper. This battery will last longer for people not running it clear down every time..... FWIW My solar system is using $4000 - 320lb batteries so I am keeping up on battery tech..... You could easily set up a solar charging system to refill this thing too....

[@markcieslikowski2284]

One thing that I noticed was a left out of the equation, at least for me. Is the pollution differential between an electric and a two-stroke. Two-stroke engines are the second most polluting internal combustion engines except for diesel. Having said that I haven’t seen any mention of it by you or any of your followers.… Everybody has their own priorities. Good luck and thanks for the entertainment you give.

[@dingdongdaddy589]

Nah. The amount of filth and destruction to the environment that comes out of mining minerals for batteries is well-hidden, for a reason - it destroys their narrative.

[@Cimlite]

_"Can't believe that guy hit me all over."_ - The bug

[@JohnPowell6]

You should try a distance run with the electric - climb, glide, and repeat until you zero out the battery.

[@elitecpudoc329]

Battery chemistry is going to have the greatest impact on whether the battery will catch fire. There is still a great fear from back when overboards where catching fire every other day. But those systems were slapped together with no BMS and no concern for thermal runaway. Moving forward as battery technologies improve, and newer chemistries come out, you will see an increase in battery density, and that will only help in flight time.

[@wozandnic]

Solid state batteries are the new way forward

[@mgdubya27]

I'm all in on electric. I can "fill up" off my excess solar at home!

[@flyingtime5501]

That is my future plans as well. Still gonna 2stroke it till then tho!

[@mgdubya27]

@@flyingtime5501 I'm stroking it at the moment as well, but my goal is to all electric.

[@huepix]

My 2 stroker is electric. 🙄🤣

[@RIMHQ-YT]

I'm glad you guys keep black kids able to keep working for a bowl of rice a day making those nice batteries.

[@pauldickman4379]

@@RIMHQ-YT Either that or contribute to dislocating poor people who live near coasts by adding carbon when burning fuel. Best we all just sit at home and do nothing lest we potentially harm someone else! We should expect companies to source their products ethically, we don't have to feel bad just for buying something...

[@JohnPowell6]

Can't wait for the first wing that's also a solar panel! Then you could fly for a few hours, set down, spread out and anchor the wing and let the battery recharge for the next flight.

[@urazz7739]

Nah, flight times wouldn't be long enough for it to charge up an electric paramotor all that much and it would drastically increase the cost.

[@AkumaQiu]

I'm fairly certain with a ducted fan design and torso bags you could double the flight time~

[@rijdendebarbier]

i will give you one tip! i have experimented, these motors if this motor is a star winding? then you can run this on high voltage low current its more efficienter and also running everyting cool you need a controller high voltage low current like 400v 20amp and then turn frequentie very high like 15/32 khz try it you will be in shok

[@SpeedyDad1]

So here's my thought on the gas vs electric. Today at the flying field, the car parked just down from your truck was my Mini Cooper. It is electric. I love it for what it is intended to be and that is an around town, short range vehicle. I never bought it intending to drive to the east coast. We have a Jeep Cherokee for that. It is a fun sporty and quite rapid car that is a blast to drive around town. I see the electric parameter the same way. No, you will not fly to Tucson with it. That's for the gas paramotor. I see a number of paramotor flyers that really don't do much more than fly around their local LZ and have fun. The electric would be great for that. No muss, no fuss. Just plug it in and fly. I want to explore so gas (until battery technology advances) is my weapon of choice. It's too bad you won't have the electric for a longer period of time. I'd like to see the differences in range based on temps. My electric Mini gets less mileage in the cold weather ("cold" in AZ - LOL). I should have cheated today and timed how long you were gone. I did think about it while flying. Theoretically, a larger wind should give you more range since the motor will not have to work as hard to keep you in the air. The rub, however is that the larger wing will create more drag which will counteract that. It will be interesting to see if the added lift overcomes the induced drag of the larger wing. Time, and your next video, will tell.

[@urazz7739]

Then again, you could keep the battery inside your house if you want so the battery is only in extreme temperatures when you are flying so hopefully the effect won't be as bad, especially since you will be flying for only like 30 minutes. So hopefully that lessens the effect extreme weather has on the battery.

[@Astepatatimekvarn]

Tucker on electric batteries as the charge depletes the output voltage does. I'm sure there are batteries developed were this doesn't occur.

[@rjstewart]

One thing to consider about electric is the current state of battery innovation. There are battery systems in prototype that charge significantly faster and have much higher capacity and weigh less. It’s really exciting to think where this could be in 3-5 years. I predict you’ll put out a new video in the future showing off 2 hour run time on a 50 lbs motor+battery that charges in under 30 minutes!

[@djkuhl]

Should be interesting when sodium batteries are available next month. They are half the cost and charge in about 10 minutes. The early versions look like they'll have about 80% of the capacity, but I think as manufacturing gets better they'll be as good or better than lithium.

[@rjstewart]

This is my thought too. 3-5 years he will be showing off a 2 hour flight time battery that charges in under 30 minutes with a total package that is lighter than any gas engine!

[@dumbcrumb879]

where did you see the info on these batteries?

[@djkuhl]

@@dumbcrumb879 You can already get them off of Chinese sites. There is an American company called Advanced Electric making battery packs but their price is higher. As always, I would take battery claims with a grain of salt until they are out in the wild.

[@timstephens5893]

​@@dumbcrumb879OnlyFans?

[@lubricatedgoat]

Sodium ion batteries will be used primarily for stationary storage and cheaper, lower range electric cars. They have relatively low gravimetric and volumetric energy density. Bad for aircraft.

[@cjermo]

I've been tossing the electric v gas decision up for a couple of years as my first PPG. I'm not quite the group you mention re only getting into the hobby with electric, but it certainly has some appeal for just getting up in the air without the maintenance concerns on a two-stroke. Most of the time, I expect 30 to 45 minutes is plenty for me, although I'd like the option to go further too. Now that OpenPPG has the ICE kit, I'm very much leaning towards the SP140 and then grabbing that and, maybe, a Moster EFI down the track when I'm comfortable enough to start looking at cross-country flights. Are there any concerns you have on the frame relative to comparable ICE setups? I guess put another way, is the SP140 in ICE mode materially worse than dedicated ICE setups?

[@737smartin]

I'd settled on electric when I was contemplating getting into the sport. The short flights seemed fine for my plans, and the ease of use was far, far more important.

[@stephenhoover4095]

Your highest fire risk is during charging, in-flight the risk of the battery igniting is very low.

[@huepix]

I understand they've added an even bigger battery option. With a bigger more efficient wing, flight times over an hour seem reasonable. That weight tho. Esp landing! Be like having a big kid jump on yer back

[@treedude1464]

3:22 eat zee bugs. LOL

[@ParaVids_andVinyls]

I will not eat the bugs, I will not live in the pod.

[@WOTArtyNoobs]

Bugs or steak? - you decide!

[@huepix]

I like dried crickets. With the right spices, delicious with some beers. Nearly 100% protein too!

[@jackhydrazine1376]

You will own nothing and be happy!

[@WOTArtyNoobs]

@@jackhydrazine1376 Under their regime, you would not have a choice or gas or electric. Indeed, you may not be allowed to paramotor.

[@liamwescott9264]

What would be interesting would be to find some kind of alternative fuel for the paramotor other than gasoline. I doubt you could find anything that would entirely replace gas, but that is an intriguing possibility in any case.

[@archibuana3204]

maybe in the near time batteries capacity and durability will significant improve better

[@lobbyrobby]

As far as the weight tho I heard the sp140 doesn't feel that heavy because the battery weight is closer to your back. Is that true?

[@scottsmall9898]

Electric would absolutely rock if youbwere flying where you had good updrafts and only needed the prop just to get back into a updraft or for taking off and landing. Im still waiting for the hybrid motor to come along, its gunna happen or at least i hope it does.

[@wreckloose120]

I want to see an analysis of the KZbinr who was going for speed and suffered some type of collapse. The video made me rethink wanting to try paramotoring.

[@MikeKing]

Not much analysis needed for that one. A.V. was flying a brand new unfamiliar glider, hands off, just a few minutes into his flight at only 80' above ground, fully accelerated while filming himself with his camera, totally distracted, and just being an extremely high risk pilot, without a reserve even. If you want the sport to be safe, don't fly like that and its extremely safe. You control the risks you take while flying.

[@turkeyphant]

I think a lot of people are going to be asking your opinion on Anthony's accident. Could you see any sign of the tension knot in the footage?

[@rickyism1576]

Is that the footage of the guy falling that's floating around?

[@turkeyphant]

@@rickyism1576 well yes but it's from his channel

[@TuckerGott]

Been talking with Anthony. I for sure won’t be drawing any quick conclusions on this one.

[@turkeyphant]

@@TuckerGott no definitely don't want any quick kneejerk reactions but definitely a thoughtful analysis at some point?

[@theworkshopwhisperer.5902]

@@turkeyphant I'm also curious for an accident analysis but holding off for a bit.

[@libertyforamericanow]

1:36 wow I was thinking 4k. They are nuts!

[@OtisFlint]

a 50cc kids MX bike is $4k man.

[@libertyforamericanow]

@@OtisFlint a dirt bike takes way more to manufacture the only cool thing about this pair of motor is if you're way off grid you can charge it on solar

[@TenMillionYearProgram42]

@@libertyforamericanowdirt bikes don’t fly.

[@moppman3191]

Great series on the gas-electric comparison. I was wondering if there are electric trikes ?

[@eatsleepturbo]

You talked about the electric cult, I am probably a part of that because I own a Talaria ( Ebike, same category as a Suron) and youtube recommanded me your video specially because of the Electric Paramotor. I watched a few video and would like one try to try paramotoring.

[@merendell]

Generally lithium batteries are only a fire hazard if physically damaged or while charging. Your only going to get a in use fire if the battery/compartment was badly designed, then you get the galaxy note 4. Charging fires are far less likely with modern BMS systems but even still don't charge them unattended and do it on a fireproof surface and your probably fine.

[@swecreations]

It's interesting every time I see a news story about an electric car fire while fire statistics from multiple countries show them being at least 20x less likely in electric cars (that is per car, difference is of course much bigger if you look at it as a total figure, as there's obviously a lot more gasoline cars on the road).

[@Wihbs]

Id love to see you review the Fulcrum PowerPod.. Looks quite interesting.

[@andrewcastiglia9548]

I bet they are at the limits of the thermals of the battery at that KW draw of the motor. Eventually you just have to liquid cool the battery to be able to draw more.

[@shawnd567]

Lol yes. It's called thermodynamics. It dictates everything around us. Liquid cooling wouldn't offer much help here as the battery is running like 1C which is barely anything. The pack is probably warm to the touch at most and isn't the limiting factor. Battery technology is the limit here.

[@andrewcastiglia9548]

​@shawnd567 do you know the type of cells and their arrangement in the pack? I'm unaware. Also refresh me what's the draw of the motor?

[@fl5537]

15kW. Ebikes/Escooters are already running sustained 10kW so battery temp isn't the issue, the problem is energy density (weight of battery still too high compared to liquid fuel)

[@andrewcastiglia9548]

@fl5537 the temperature of the surface of the pack is not the temperature of the core of the cells and thermal runaway is something you DONT ever want happening on while strapped to your back at say 500 feet let alone 2 or 3 thousand feet. I would hope anyone who rides one of these even ice has some kind of emergency escape route be it being able to dump the motor and chair and glide down on the sail or having an emergency parachute on them.

[@fl5537]

@@andrewcastiglia9548 A properly sized pack will not overheat because the IR will be sufficiently low.

[@wesbaumguardner8829]

Hopefully new battery technology will be released soon that has a much higher Kwh rating per pound.

[@Califaztlan831]

Gas! More power and more reliable, can go farther and most ppl are okay with the noise. 👍👌🙌😎

[@classicaudioadventures]

I think you summed it up perfectly. We're early in the era of electric PPG and the current offerings have some technological hurdles to overcome. Early adoption is just part of the process that moves the technology forward and I think eventually we'll see battery systems improve as time goes on. Maybe photovoltaic gliders will become a thing... In your opinion, is the SP140 a viable motor to train on?

[@shawnd567]

Even an entire wing of solar panels would only make a ~1- Kwh. That would give you about 10-15 minutes of extra flight time at best.

[@TuckerGott]

Definitely viable in chill mode. And even more so with the smaller battery for lighter weight.

[@classicaudioadventures]

@@shawnd567 True...not to mention that any textile based PV would also be far less efficient. I'm mostly curious to see what the future holds for EPPG.

[@bobsnabby2298]

200W per square meter is the max output in perfect sunny conditions, will any glider fly with it ?

[@bobsnabby2298]

@@shawnd567 200W per square meter max output in perfect conditions.

[@TankTheSpank]

Honestly they need to make a hybrid. Electric for lift off, gas for charging the battery / higher altitudes. Fixes noise, and makes it efficient / redundant in case of engine going out. Also it can provide more torque.

[@heartsky]

So how much weight are you thinking that will add?

[@TankTheSpank]

@@heartsky just needs a small 10 lbs battery. Or even less. Like honestly doesn’t need a big one. Just enough to get a little extra push when you need it

[@joava3328]

I think electric would be a pretty good option for me personally in part because I know basically nothing about 2 stroke engines, let alone have to maintain them. My biggest concern is the weight. I've not actually gotten into the sport yet, but after finding your channel, I really want to. However, I'm only like 5'3" and like 140lbs, so adding 78lbs...I'm not sure how well I would do taking off, let alone landing. But it might not be as bad as I think. I could start exercising. Also, I wish your shirt designs had the graphics on the front instead of the back. I'm often wearing some kind of sweater because I'm always cold, so the back is usually covered up. Otherwise, I love the shirts.

[@adamr9215]

Being that small, there are probably smaller, lighter options. He is heavier and likes sporty with extra power, so I’m sure that you could find something lighter that would work for you. Start doing some short jogs with a backpack that has some weight in it. Make sure your legs can handle it, and build up if you need to. It’s not hard to work on the simple 2 strokes, but I can understand if it’s not something you want to learn about. To me, it’s part of the fun. And there is the accomplishment you get from being able to say that you did it all, tuning through flying. Plus, it’s a friendly community and there are many that will help you out if you ask.

[@TenMillionYearProgram42]

Forgive me if it's come up and I've missed it, but one thing I haven't heard addressed is what happens in the event of a water landing? Of course, that's undesirable in any paramotor, but with a gas motor, it's a huge inconvenience and some drying time. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but a water landing (esp salt water) would yield dramatic replacement of key components in an electric paramotor.

[@marcusheap]

Can you take a spare battery with you and fly until dead, glide and land. Change battery and set off back. Probably better part of two hours flight time if you are careful with the throttle and only go up gently to 250ft.

[@TuckerGott]

You would be carrying another 43lbs and it would cost you $2,200. But yes, you could double your flight time.

[@urazz7739]

@@TuckerGott I don't think it would double your flight time because you are adding on an additional 43lbs of weight so it would drain the battery a bit faster I imagine but it would still nearly double your flight time. That's not even factoring in how uncomfortable it would be to carry another big heavy battery though.

[@TheStraycat74]

I have Extremely limited time at home every other weekend I get MAYBE 34 hours at the house. only getting 30 minutes to an hour to fly would still be a LOT better than no flying at all. I also have a very tight budget despite working 70+ hours a week (no overtime in trucking). but $8k for the motor alone is saving every penny for a year or two right now. never mind the cost of a wing that can lift a 300lbs fat guy like me.

[@heartsky]

REALLY wish that flight time was like an hour average instead of 30 minutes. That 30 minutes kind of makes a huge difference. Oh, and you should already have my address of where to send the SP140 when I win.

[@robertgary3561]

If you go out to the desert for a 3 day weekend can you just bring a gas generator?

[@4945656]

The deal breaker for me is the flight time. I'm interested in those crazy long cross country flights. 30 minutes is just not enough.

[@henryfillingim5262]

Are the cross bars that hold the cage on Carbon fiber ? Not crazy about that if so. I like the Maverick Ty. frame. Carbon fiber takes me back to an Air Conception. Glad to be done with that. Carbon fiber is to brittle for me😊

[@adamdarrow]

The energy density of batteries is just going to get better. I bet there will be 2 hour electric flight in a few years.

[@COSMEREAUDIO]

Perfect timing

[@paulnelson5314]

Most of the noise is from the prop, I imagine the motor itself is pretty quiet. My question is does the speed controller have a sensible Low Voltage Cut-off. What I mean is if you take those cells too low you can stress them and create all kinds of issues. Heat is the real enemy of lithium chemistry cells.

[@scottstormcarter9603]

You wouldn't "throw out" the old battery, you would use it as a stationary backup battery. Or sell it to a recycler.

[@raybeattie5802]

Years ago a lady designed an electric one but with a difference! She had two props on each end of a pole which the props were smaller stopped the counter rotation & folded in the middle from your lap which could fit in the boot of a car! Also the props didn’t need a cage to surround the blades? Strange no one picked up on the design!

[@urazz7739]

Probably because the design is too complicated and would definitely require more maintenance. Also cages for the props are designed more for safety and preventing the blades from getting damaged if you hit the ground a bit while flying low. If you want people to adopt something to use on a regular basis then follow the rule of K.I.S.S., Keep It Simple Stupid.

[@raybeattie5802]

@@urazz7739 complicated? Two motors, 2 small props, 1 each end of a pole which sat on her lap & flew? Seems to me hugging a large cage on your back for safety so you don’t have a large prop wising around your body fair enough! These props were nowhere near her & with no guard plus very little weight for her to hold up! I was impressed!

[@scubatrucker6806]

Great review tucker 🤙🤙

[@1asdfasdfasdf]

Can you set up a motor break in the ESC to help cut down on the wind milling?

[@klm20079]

Problems i see now with the battery's is this; what effect climate on performance, what if in hot weather battery goes fast and cold will work slower?

[@shawnd567]

In extreme cold, the battery will be weak and probably not even work. You also probably wouldn't wanna fly in that either. Extreme heat kills batteries longevity wise.

[@claeyer3866]

If i had one , i would try to fly during thermals , just take off and try to practice and make some altitude

[@genehunter1487]

you could use the small battery, do a flat slope mountain launch, ride around on ridge lift or thermals using the motor as needed and to get to the LZ

[@PPGDV]

Flight time is definitely the biggest turn off. If you wanted to fly commercially and pack the electric motor, you don’t have to worry about trying to clean a tank and everything involved, but doing all of that for only 30-40 minutes of flight isn’t worth it. They’re several years from getting the weight down and flight time up.

[@TJK50014]

Wonder if there is a way to jettison the motor/battery pack in case of fire? A quick release and the motor/battery drops out and away from the parachute.

[@toddsmith4280]

Does the propeller regenerate electricity when idle and coming down from high altitude ?

[@flying_bros]

As an electric engineer I can say that some batteries could be very dangerous, but others are very safe. Therefore I would love to build my own electric paramotor with batteries I can rely on.

[@cccspwn]

With electric paramotors I think I can reasonably get into this sport (I live in a condo and this is probaly my only option) My only issue is that one day I want to fly above the clouds, I was wondering if electric paramotors have enough flight time to do this?

[@canolando3499]

What about the newer big battery? Can you get one to test?

[@NewtonWashinton]

I would say if you want a EP spend 10k and buy it with a extra battery.

[@wilsistermans1118]

The chance a battery will catch fire during flight is really low. For electric cars it is proven to be about 70 times less compared to petrol cars. Change of a battery catching fire is the biggest during charging. A good battery pack with a good charger (not the cheap China made ones) has protection against overheating. So the risk of fire is about zero.

[@mgkleym]

It's never zero. Remember the samsung galaxy note fiasco? GM also had to replace the packs in several years worth of chevy bolts due to a manufacturing defect in the battery that resulted in several fires. There is always some risk with high performance lithium chemistry. It's just the cost of doing business if you want top tier power and energy to weight ratios.

[@tobir693]

From what I've heard it's not that it happens more often, but when it does happen its almost impossible to put out,. I've seen interviews with firefighter who say, they've submerged Teslas for long periods of time (after catching fire), just for it to catch fire again after being taken out of the water.

[@merendell]

@@mgkleym the galaxy note was a design flaw. LiO batteries need a little room to expand and contract during use to be safe. Engineering said use battery X and leave enough space for battery X to expand as normal. Marketing saw all that extra space engineering left and said we need more battery life, lets fill that space with battery Y. And thus batteries that really should not be compressed were and we had peoples pants catching on fire.

[@europaeuropa3673]

Did I miss the max output static thrust in pounds for the electric vs gas?