Why We Bleep Podcast 010: DivKid / Ben Wilson

Thanks to Episode Sponsors www.signalsound... & obsidiansound.net // Today we meet my pal, fellow Northern KZbinr and all round music-production-knowledge-fountain DivKid. In this longform chat we get deep into technique and process, diving into mix techniques, gigging in Bradford, seeing Sunn O))), discover his desert island synthesizers (kinda), modules, and more.
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[@DivKid]

oooooh nice, wonder who this Kid Div geezer is then, let's hope he's not chatting rubbish for 2 hours! :)

[@Wagoo]

Dunno he must be a right old daft apeth!

[@DivKid]

yeah I reckon so :) @@Wagoo

[@sauce_aux]

DivKidVideo that guy is always peddling boogie pies !! 😂

[@t1mmy13]

Did you hear that one thing he said at that one point?! Dude is a hack!

[@RobinRimbaudScanner]

Two hours? You'd be lucky to get him talking for 'only' two hours!! More like closer to three and I heard Mylar Melodies edited this down from 9 solid hours!!

[@tomburnell8453]

More epic than Al pacino meeting Robert DeNiro for a coffee in Heat ;-)

[@kentxx12]

Sorry but NO!

[@thomastraylor6337]

Classic comment.

[@DivKid]

haha amazing!

[@5kMagic]

Holy crap! I actually just watched that film on Netflix, then I came here to listen to something music related as I drift off to sleep. This must be the right place ❤️

[@anodyneinstitute]

49:55 In reference to Sunn O))) "It's so loud that we're reaching a point where it sort of stops being sound and it starts just being feelings." Lmaoooo I absolutely died hearing that description, love it. And I mean, isn't music just 'air that makes you feel things' anyway.

[@piotr803]

great chat guys. would definitely listen to a part 2 of this.

[@andrewgreaves56]

My two faves together! I’ve spent many thousands because of you two bringing the best out of modules. Delightful.

[@audeon_visual]

Such a classic episode, man. I still get so much from this conversation.

[@Flohr]

The biggest crossover event of 2018. Y'all are the best, loved the chat.

[@MakingSoundMachines]

The thing that regularly happens to us with videos from @DivKidVideo is, you watch two minutes of one of his reviews, then you think, "oh this is cool, let's try to patch that up", then fail miserably to replicate exactly what he did and instead end up with something super suprising and amazing instead. Thanks both of you for this awesome long-format talk and all the inspiration!

[@gooneybird808]

Awesome..glad you brought up flying lotus! Great mixing tips! Awesome

[@SatanIsOn]

I just fired up my Pamelas New Workout and by plugging channel 1 doing stepped random into cv 1, you can easily change the syncussion trigger by assigning cv 1 to the level of channel 2. The built in attenuators of the Pams make this very easy, maybe this works for you live. It would definitely cut down the amount of hp needed. Anyway, I really enjoyed the podcast, you both have been so helpful in learning all of my gear. Thanks m8s!

[@jdavis.fw303]

Man you two are my GOTOs for modular, it was awesome to hear about all the other aspects of your musical production skills.

[@TheOneTheyCallJack]

Every time I come back to this I get so inspired, I feel like there needs to be a DivKid MK2 episode

[@precarious333music]

YES!!! Can't wait to watch this one. We all love Ben and owe him much gratitude. To see him interviewed by one we hold in equal regard is almost too much to ask, but here we go...

[@precarious333music]

01:57 Hey Mylar, if you want preset rhythms Falafular Corny Rhythm would be a great choice. Not only do you get preset patterns modeled after those found on classic drum machines but you can call them up with control voltages so you could sequence them as part of a set. You can even load your own presets into it. It also includes a fill function, auto-fill and builtin conga sound based on the CR8000. All together there are outs for 7 gates including accent. I love mine. kzbin.info/www/bejne/p2KyhoaBm7SYsJI

[@fablesofsilence]

Great to see the two of you enjoying what you do! Killer combination ;-)

[@synkrotron]

Alex and Ben chatting about stuff... I really enjoyed this Why We Bleep Respect to all the previous and following WWB episodes but this, for me, has to be the best

[@rossconran2333]

That cross panned reverb trick i was doing 35 years ago to create an artificial stereo presence on mono sources.If it sounds a bit too contrived just pan 75% each way.

[@jericho2x2]

You guys need a show on netflix. Could listen to this for hours.

[@mrotaveria]

I'll need to re watch this. So much to absorb. Thanks for this guys!

[@jedgould5531]

2:03:30 Great idea using mic gainstaging to open a verb. Same thing was done with room sound on Bowie’s voice when Eno produced Low and Heroes. Gate set at loud Bowie voice opened to allow miked ambient room sound. I wanted to be a fly on the wall at Hansa Berlin.

[@sudbenzer6603]

Love this episode.Thank you guys!

[@gregcoles9175]

This is great - feels like you're having a conversation with two old mates.

[@GuitarsAndSynths]

How did you guys get started in modular? What were your first setups like in the very beginning before having walls of modular? I am learning with a basic Doepfer A100 system.

[@MrStognabologna]

Made Monday afternoon much better :) thanks for the pick me up

[@jabezproduction]

Bloody Hell. An epic...but incredibly useful and inspiring episode...to the point where I'm considering re-watching the whole damn thing and TAKING NOTES.

[@driverhw75]

Your videos feed my modular habit. I referenced your reference to Signal Sounds when I ordered some modules from them this week. I hope their support for your excellent podcast will continue.

[@mylarmelodies]

That’s awesome, thank you! They’re a good bunch that lot

[@driverhw75]

@@mylarmelodies I blame you both for my expenditures. You need to post a video on how to hide purchases from your significant other. If not that, I'd like to see a video explaining your workflow/layout for live gigs vs noodling eg where you position VCOs vs sequencers. vs effects etc

[@mrparksy]

Great talk! I'm new to modular and both you two have cost me a fortune in modules but... At the same time you have handed over a shit load of knowledge! Ta

[@BeauSkowron]

Love this! My fave part is listening to a conversation recorded 2 years ago, talking about how an 808 'actually' sounded a long time ago and needing to go back to reference records to really understand it because it doesn't really exist anymore, and me watching this as a noob and thinking of this conversation as 'current' and exciting in the present. So good.

[@mylarmelodies]

Haha nice one- listen to the newer one with System 80 for an even deeper 808 geek out!

[@BeauSkowron]

will do! But I’ve gotta admit, technical shit aside, I really do like to just hear about why and what’s going on in other peoples heads to go about being ‘creative’... because it’s different for everyone. For noobs these vids are great cos it sort of feels like entering the Wild West... but instead of those weird olde timey theme parks, some of the really great cowboys are alive at the same time as you and make videos to show others how to be really great cowboys as well. Love it.

[@mylarmelodies]

@@BeauSkowron I love that, that's a great description of it, pardner. *nods* 🤠

[@ashcadell1]

So much to learn from this chat. Great stuff.

[@mishpult]

Very, very informative, thank you!

[@WiredSpaceWizard]

All modular purchases should include a coupon for either free haggis or blood sausage! Best episode yet, man! “Everything is not for everyone”! Eternal wisdom I’m going to put in a frame!

[@alcomatt]

Guys, this is brilliant. You should do it more often!

[@Lordxfx]

Such a joy. Even after the second time :))

[@samesong]

Blimey! Best thing I've listened to in a long time...good decision not to cut it...

[@rdean150]

Ahhh so glad you're back! I also performed a major life relocation recently and can completely sympathize with the productivity and organizational impact. You can, with sufficient effort, achieve one or the other but not both when you're undergoing such a significant disruption. At least that's what I believe. Stoked to hear that you've got an album at the mastering stage! Can't wait to hear it! Given how inspirational your videos are, I'm confident that it will be well-written, well-produced and well-received. But I bet you're sweating bullets about that last part. There will be a fairly intense level of internet scruples and unfair judgment leveraged against it, if typical KZbin comment vitriol is any gauge of the ride to come. But the modular synth community seems more reasonable and mature than average, and you've achieved a rare level of popularity, so the benefit of the doubt is surely yours. Also, Alex and Ben in a freeform podcast conversation about modular gear and production!!! Holy shit, this is one for the highlight reel. And just in time for the Best of 2018 lists!

[@coreyriddell1759]

Hey! The thing you and Ben were discussing around the 2 hour mark about a "standard beat module" could probably be done pretty easily with something like Pams NW for your steady rhythms and a few channels of diy'd switches. Like 2 INs per OUT, and with a 3 position toggle, you could even get a signal mute in the center position. Nice thing there is that you'd inject some performability in to Pams which can get menu intensive and not allow many quick changes for improv.

[@BURG]

brilliant guys!! thanks for this

[@zebmars8944]

Great show, had a good time listening to you guys. Would not mind a part II.

[@ScottLHines]

So how many pieces are now going to be written called Drone Sausage?

[@TRUEiMPROrecords]

Thanks for this great chat!

[@mariusrbech573]

Great talk! As always. Id bloody love to see/hear Cortini on the show

[@ChanseMacabre]

That eustachian tubes knowledge is a serious game-changer. Never thought I'd solve my flight problems by listening to a modular podcast, but there you go. Great episode, even without the ENT wisdom. Going to be giving this one lots of listens to really absorb everything. :)

[@loslosbaby]

"It's still not finished yet, I'm hearing more aboriginal percussionists and I want an army of didgeridoos fifty thousand didgeridoos!" -- Dewey Cox

[@7177YT]

ear opener! awesome, glued to my pjone watching it lol.

[@atkmodular904]

Nice One! I've been looking forward to this one!

[@sauce_aux]

So did a wormhole open when you guys started talking ? Did you edit that part out ??? Also - thank you for the info on the ear popper, i struggle with narrow Eustachian tubes and deal with inner ear issues as well as vertigo. My father deals with it too. Seriously thank you.

[@modularfoundations8552]

Signal Sounds is the best module shop in UK bar none. Got all my modules from them and the service is excellent

[@chitlun]

This is great! I had no idea Ben was so knowledgeable about engineering… Top man! He mentions his favourite synth being the Roland SH-09. I had one of those and sold it for £60 about a year before the Acid House boom, hey-ho!

[@mylarmelodies]

hah, yup, hindsight is 20/20. also yes he is - chock full of knowledge that guy

[@fosferus]

Clicked on this without seeing the guest.. Imagine my surprise when I figured out who it was. Fuckin love you boys! Ben, you are incredibly knowledgeable with production. Now I'm off to fry up a drone sausage.

[@chrisfeinmann125]

Really enjoyed this, so many amazing tips. Thanks very much

[@theb_roll]

As you guys discussed drums and wanting to be able to have your chaotic trigger source and your pinned down source I kept thinking about the Erica synths Drum sequencer. That guys got all the precise control one would need for your pinned source. A little big on hp but pair it with the asimil8tor and youve got all you need going preset to preset.

[@WellsOliver]

great work guys, I owe getting into this terrible afflict-- err, hobby to you two really, and this was fun. when do we get Rob & Sean on the podcast?!

[@No.0.o.0]

SunnO))) was so loud that it resonated my nice earplugs. The comparison to a Rothko is soooo perfect! SunnO))) live is more like seeing a room full of Bacon/Rothko collaborations.

[@joantorruella4891]

I just realised i contacted you about how to get into modular in London At the same time when you where actually moving from london , what a perfect timing

[@ahorseinahospital]

Such an interesting convo

[@thedrumunkey8582]

@ 1:58:00 ish.. Why not get a TR8S and even if you don't use the built in sounds that much, use the triggers out feature for your canned rhythms? Amazing unit that costs about the same as like one decent module...

[@Skootavision]

Even if it's my own loops I prefer to remove them. Consciously prefer the impact following the groove of a loop is more impressive if you remove the source groove

[@flower5185]

sidenote- Sunn O))) is just pronounced "Sun". The "O)))" part is emulating the logo for Sunn amps

[@JapanoiseBreakfast]

They also have a dance music project called Sunn :)))

[@AndrewJohnGroves]

Great as always guys!

[@Quantumspace23]

The 2 HP mix cleaner you refer to at 84 minutes is it the Shakmat HiPass?

[@davidbaker231]

Sensational ideas! "Feel referencing." That's going straight into my procedural toolkit. So much of what was said here speaks, directly or indirectly, to stuff I think about all the time. And listening to you and Ben talk is fascinating in itself. Yorkshire, right? But you sound like you've spent a lot more time in London, at least to my Yank ears.

[@mylarmelodies]

Ha, yes I have! But I’m back now...let’s hope the accent morphs back

[@chedhead3278]

Cheers Alex, and indeed Ben, lots of interesting points. So, if I heard correctly, organised drone sausage entanglements with eustachian rhythms and contextual eq illusions, that's dub techno, right? :)

[@BenA718]

Killer video! Am still watching it, but wanted to post this for Ben before I forget: with regards to a ‘dirt’ mic, are you familiar with the wurst mic technique for drums?

[@aeropilot4419]

Splendid, gentlemen 👍🏼👍🏼🗣🗣

[@jbowmanmusic]

Great stuff. Ebcidic album is all Lyra 8 btw.

[@paulisound]

Very impressive talk! Thanks for that. Any chance to invite Steevio for the next episode? It would be amazing! 🙏

[@justindune8921]

Probably seems odd to comment on your initial "advertisement" for Signal Sounds--but you should make a point of mentioning that they ALSO ship to the USA. After listening here, about midnight Tuesday, I placed an on-line order for a pair of Happy Nerding 3x VCAs, which I've been unable to locate stateside. And they arrived on Friday about 3:30 PM. In other words--less than 3 days. Perfect shipping, and competitively priced, easy to access. SOOOO, next time you give them a shout out, do your fans on this side of the puddle a favor, and mention that Signal Sounds is definitely a viable source for us here, and has things that stateside vendors don't!

[@aeropilot4419]

Justin Dune I ordered Ben’s Mutes from SS as well and I’m on the West Coast ... fast shipping 👍🏼

[@PerseusTraxx]

This device sounds good - I had a cold a couple of years ago which remained for months with longer term damage to my Eustachian tubes and when it's bad, it's been severely disorientating

[@mylarmelodies]

Check with your doc first but yeah it’s been a god send - I’ve actually since worked out I CAN pop my ears but I need to twist my jaw to do it! Narrow passages...

[@PerseusTraxx]

@@mylarmelodies The doctor couldn't see much, and at hospital I was surprised just how much endoscope they could fit up my nose. That said, I do have a snap somewhere of my own internal stereo low pass filter. It's cleared up since, but airflight (not an issues these days) and odd incidents cause it to arise again, alongside the feeling that it's crazy how a cold can do something so long lasting

[@loviambient]

My microwave oven finished heating just 1 sec after I began to watch this episode. :)

[@mylarmelodies]

“Bye!” *BING*

[@ericyoung5960]

Around 1:55:00 you talk about wanting basic rhythm presets.... using the envelope outs on the PGH percussion sequencer would accomplish this. 32 presets of 4 tracks each

[@pdbianchi1471]

"everything is not for everyone” ❤️❤️❤️

[@pixelwash9707]

Interesting, and I wished you didn’t interrupt him so much about his favorite VCO, but as an Aussie who grew up surrounded with weird accents from immigrants from all over the world, and living in San Francisco now surrounded by even more for 30 plus years, I still really have trouble understanding div-kid’s accent sometimes, and he definitely needs subtitles.

[@netcowboy]

These guys are my spirit animals.

[@samrajanpossible]

Hey mylarmelodies were you on the tube today at Oxford Circus? I swear it was you, had my copy of Patch & Tweak on me as well...

[@mylarmelodies]

Sadly not!! I've been spotted on the Central Line before tho...

[@dalelaushman8749]

Your dream about the moog ones in a warehouse is awesome!

[@mrsulcus674]

I saw Sunn o))) in Birmingham a few years back and the dry ice and smoke was twisted into standing waves from the volume. Kinda spoilt the records for me.

[@chemicalBR0]

yay. been looking forward to this one

[@rdean150]

Around 1:58:00, talking about a modular "preset" that you could instantly and easily switch to a guaranteed pattern and/or sound loop - that sounds like a job for a Hermod or 1010 Toolbox and/or sample-based sound source like a Bitbox or possibly TipTop One or Disting. For those kind of guarantees in a live performance setting, I have come full circle back to embracing the digital advantages when you really need it. To me, that's the number one most important benefit of digital tools - guaranteed reproducibility with a simple button push. EDIT - Looks like others have offered suggestions for this same topic - Pam and an Erica drum sequencer. Those can guarantee the pattern, but that's only half of the equation. The other half is the sound, and a sequencer alone can't guarantee the module it's feeding will produce the same sound, since most module's knob positions are added to the CV you feed it. So even if you're sending the exact same gates and CV, twisting some knobs on the analog module receiving them will change the result. But a Hermod/ToolBox paired with BitBox can give that guarantee.

[@bptyoga]

Whereabouts in the 2 41 23 do they talk about sunn O)))?

[@solarlarvae]

Entrainment is the word you are looking for at 52.00. Very interesting phenomenon that can be observed in many different domains. For instance: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entrainment_(biomusicology)

[@rishbmusic]

At 18:26 which artist is he talking about?

[@CatFish107]

Rather have an ochd than a sample pack, tbh. Very much appreciate the vcv rack version. Big thanks!

[@leejmalcolm1]

Welcome back to Yorkshire mate!

[@mrtessellate]

Could you do this monthly ? We will pay the beer through patreon.

[@aaiieenn]

That ~30Hz high pass filter he was talking about is probably the HiPass from Shakmat Modular!

[@mylarmelodies]

Yep it was - got one on the way!!

[@MikkelGrumBovin]

I love the way Benn is being Benn,-

[@ChrisMills-AmbientSpace]

There are some golden nuggets in this. They start rolling in at 1:20:00.

[@piotr803]

1:55:30 every module such as rings, taiko, elements, bia should have a randomise button, like on vcv rack implementations.

[@steventaylor3789]

Inspiring stuff chaps

[@cardboardmusic]

It would be so useful to have a few index points on this chat. There's so much here, but it would be useful to be able to jump to the various subject areas, mixing, material, CV (career), guitars etc, and come back to them again if you want to go back and get the details again.

[@mylarmelodies]

If you want to mark any I’ll add them to the description! ;)

[@cardboardmusic]

@@mylarmelodies Okay, not a bad idea, I'll have listen later and maybe send a few. Maybe others can chip in if they find extra stuff? You cover so much in these (types of) videos, it's not always so interesting to listen to it all, especially as you go off on tangents. But in between there's some real pearls of wisdom.

[@Nomo_Popo]

Who is the Phil guy that Ben spoke of early in the talk; the one who released an album without the kicks?

[@mylarmelodies]

That's mefeller Ebcidic: kzbin.info/door/i3COeLoYEN9PaR9qD_ehag

[@cultra9292]

Can anyone tell me of which album they are talking about at 18:44?

[@mylarmelodies]

It's Ebcidic, will be this I think! ebcidic.bandcamp.com/album/charming-hades

[@Zvark]

Microbrute is a monster, but now that I'm going euro I wish it was in that form, as just a voice module, since I don't use the sequencer or keyboard anyway.

[@zakbrown6762]

Whhhaaaat??! this episode is way too good.

[@KonradVerner]

Now I listened two and a half hours and you did not talk about the sample slicer

[@Fiidsey]

Re: room sound. Our brains like to decode audio information into spatial imagining. That's why darker sounds present like they're "behind" brighter ones. With no room in a sound, our brains really don't know what to do with it. Once a sound is in a realistic sonic space, our brains are happier with it.

[@brandonlogic8675]

What’s the small fixed high pass module you mentioned for cleaning up mixes?

[@LucasMarchal]

Shakmat Modular HiPass ! www.modulargrid.net/e/shakmat-modular-hipass. Looks very useful

[@mylarmelodies]

That was it!!! Man that looks better than I remembered. Need one. Essential mix tool for live.

[@LucasMarchal]

Yep ! Just got one. The two 100hz ones are going to come in really handy as well ! Always using "real" filters or eq for this. @@mylarmelodies

[@AnderAllan]

This Podcast is the best thing to happen to podcast since the beginning of podcasts lol Also, I think you and Andrew Huang would be incredible together on here :)

[@Jimbo386000]

I would also like to see Andrew Huang on this podcast.

[@simonsandleitner2341]

1:24:30 - what is the "mix cleaner"? 🥸

[@kentxx12]

This is so good :)

[@charlieminers2892]

Ayyyyyy welcome to Yorkshire :D