Myth of European Social Equality

[@AFNick]

I know a lot of you have asked about what recommended books you should read to learn more in depth about the content on this channel. I made a complete reading list freely available to subscribers who join the channels mailing list. To download the reading list, click on the link below. nickpardini.substack.com/subscribe

[@willlockler9433]

Interesting. America must seem like chaos to this old money.

[@AFNick]

It is. The chaos is the same thing that keeps the US economy dynamic.

[@willlockler9433]

@@AFNickAgreed. May we keep it so.

[@ruigoncalves2]

I’m Portuguese, living in Denmark for the last 5 year. Work in IT, and visited the US 2 times. Portugal is the poorest country in Western Europe. People back home are poor but also brainwashed, not only is richer Europe something the media doesn’t talk about, the US is the boogeyman of caos and “lack of state support”. It’s sad because we in Europe have more in common with the US that we have in differences we could learn so much for each others.

[@AFNick]

Your comment is similar to the analysis I did on Portugal’s future six months ago kzbin.info/www/bejne/mGnFgqScr5eUqsU

[@willlockler9433]

@@ruigoncalves2 There was a famous quote, I forget by whom, when the US was expanding from the Atlantic to the Pacific,; "Go west young man". Perhaps it still applies.

[@lennyf923]

Hey Nick awesome video. When I was younger I wanted to move to Europe because I went there a few times and it seemed so great to live there, but as I got older I explored the idea of being an entrepreneur more. Off of the top of my head I could not think of any known European entrepreneurs and did some research on starting a business in Europe, and you got it right on the ball. Since then I've decided to stay in the US so that I have a better chance with social mobility.

[@dencentbeatz794]

Depends on the country. In some countries it’s way easier to do business even more than the us

[@erichanson5194]

This is interesting. There are many mechanisms that decrease social mobility in Europe. Social programs that transfer risk of individuals to the state reduce the autonomy of individual citizens due to the law of requisite variety. College is free in Germany, but the state tests students into tracks after elementary school. Only 33% of german students are college educated compared to 66% in the us. Students with the resources to prepare for the test or study abroad get to be in the educated class, while students without resources often get locked into a lower social status before they enter middle school.

[@WillieFungo]

And don't forget American college is nowhere near as the internet makes people believe. Community colleges cost around $5,000 per year. With scholarships, this number can reduce to 0 or even them giving the student money.

[@petelipson3769]

I am no expert on Universities in Germany........but a college education,degree in the U.S. is much more diluted than it was 30 years ago......i do not think the college degree system is as watered down in germany. There are a lot of Exercise Science (P.E basically), Sociology, Mass Communication majors with degrees working minimum wage jobs in the U.S. Is this the case in Germany i wonder? 12:40

[@uncreativename9936]

Europe also sends WAY more people to vocational schools and such, it's not all about traditional universities. It's insane how poor vocational training in the US is. I met someone recently who worked with plastic molding (he didn't have a college degree), I asked him how one would get into his field and he said he had no idea, he got into it through knowing somebody. They also still have real apprenticeships for people to get into different fields, even a lot of trades in the US employers don't want to bother training people and just want to hire people who already have experience. Edit: Europe pacifies it's population by actually giving them better material conditions. America pacifies it's population by giving them a *chance* at becoming wealthy, which is much cheaper. As Steinbeck said "America is a country of temporarily embarrassed millionaires"

[@schurlbirkenbach1995]

​​​@@petelipson3769it's the same in Germany. If you are not really excelent and don't have good relations to political parties or important people, a degree in sociology, history, or in cultural studies leaves to nowhere. The majority of these guys finish in the state administration with a salary which reflects more or less the statistical average salary of the country.

[@FirstLight666-e9v]

As of 2024, approximately 35% of Americans aged 25 and older have at least a bachelor's degree

[@fireblade3682]

As a european, I can confirm that this video is mostly accurate, especially in southern europe. Northern Europe, with the protestant reformation became more capitalistic, whereas catholic southern europe remained quite feudal. In my home country of Portugal, it is very evident that most of the people that have money are descendents of aristocracy (which even have a different physiognomy, they look northern european) and politicians and their families, which are usually commoners that a few generations ago were even poor. There are exceptions though, you do get industrious entrepreneurs that manage to become "new rich", but this is done by understanding the complex bureaucracy and working around it and managing your own business. It is impossible to become wealthy just by working a middle class job, unlike in america (although its becoming harder in america too).

[@mihaelalekic1502]

Just google the Wallenberg family and you'll see the Nordics (Sweden) are not much better.

[@tawnybrawn]

My mother’s mother’s family arrived with William the Conqueror & helped conquer Britain. I was shocked to discover they had the same land & titles from 1060AD & remain in communication with relatives in Normandy.

[@SIMONREMISH]

what a crazy thing to hear damn

[@hhkk6155]

Fun fact: in Europe most of people don't own homes, they are renters in 5th-10th generation. In some (rich) countries 80% of people rent small apartments 😮😮😮And somehow it's considered a good thing 😂

[@AFNick]

Proves the point of this video

[@hhkk6155]

@@AFNick yes

[@schurlbirkenbach1995]

@@hhkk6155 that's maybe true in Germany, that most people are renters but surely not in Eastern Europe or in Italy. Even in my homecountry Austria which is culturally very near to Germany, 60 % are owners. Beside, that Germans are rich, is a myth. German companies are rich. German people are not rich. The rate of owners is one of the lowest in Europe.

[@hhkk6155]

@@schurlbirkenbach1995 in eastern Europe, that was part of commi block, many people are owners because that government have them the apartments. That's why in countries like Ukranian/Rus/Belarus like 90% of people are owning apartments (it would be closer to 100%, but some people sold their free housing)

[@schurlbirkenbach1995]

@@hhkk6155 Same in Hungary and Romania. I know both countries. But also in Italy, Spain, France more people are owners.

[@hhkk6155]

Another thing is, American living standards were heavily inflated by global reserve currency ( money printer) but it's coming to an end

[@rightwingsafetysquad9872]

Sort of. The reserve currency status has allowed America to deindustrialize without falling apart. If we lose the reserve currency, we will have to reindustrialize. This is what Trump has started to head off. And if you pay close attention, Biden's administration has quietly continued only slightly modified. Whether Trump wins the election or not is largely irrelevant to everyone except Trump himself because he has so thoroughly won on the issues that both parties are implementing his policies - except strong border control, but he was soft on that as well in action.

[@onetwokaafour]

​@@rightwingsafetysquad9872true!

[@mharley3791]

@@rightwingsafetysquad9872 this. People have so many misconceptions about the reserve currency status and do not understand that it has pros and cons. If you stop being the reserve currency, it would lose its political countries, but it will become competitive and industry again. Other countries do not want that which is why they do not want to be the reserve currency.

[@allisonhowmann]

Finally someone talking about this! I have been yelling about how ridiculous it is for Americans to romanticize Europe when you could NEVER EVER buy a place in Paris without being of generational wealth. In Europe they give people just enough to not revolt, but no new rich.

[@keegster7167]

but most young people in America also are not aiming for owning houses anymore, anyway. If you're renting either way, isn't it better to live in a system set up more for renters?

[@allisonhowmann]

​@@keegster7167 If the choice means no economic mobility like in Europe I would not be in favor of this. It's really not that great in America, I agree. But there is still a middle and upper middle class and It can be possible to jump if you make some sacrifices, get creative, etc.

[@hhkk6155]

Old money in Europe, don't pay taxes at all: trusts, tax exemption, and all kind on schemes 😅

[@bassafarside6071]

@@hhkk6155 News flash: Trusts are not reiconized at all in Germany. They literally do not exist as a matter of law.

[@don_kandon6006]

You dont need to be old money to evade tax legally, and dont need form crazy formations of trusts etc. Open bank account in Swiss (500k+), form portfolio, never sell, and borrow against it at 1.8%. Since you never sell, no capital gains tax. Portfolio appreciates 7-12% or more, you only pay 1.8% ish interest + 1.2% fee to wealth manager and bank. Matter of fact if you have a good interview with a bank, and show that you looking to form very long relationship, you only need 250k to open bank account, and not what you usually hear 1+ mil.

[@alifnomad3223]

@@don_kandon6006 switzerland has no capital gains tax.

[@don_kandon6006]

@@alifnomad3223 I know. But that is for those who live in income tax country. Then you can do what i wrote and pay no income tax that way.

[@timog7358]

great video. youtube algo is on point again

[@josephang9927]

It's a very stagnant economy. In the past Europe grew by colonialism, opening options for people to go up in the hierarchy, but now they are just good enough to not even try to progress economically. Most of them also hate children or despise de idea of relying on family, so they overrely on the state. Why build wealth and accrue assets if you have no children anyway? It is basically demographic nihilism. I see no real future in such society, nor I see stable geriatric states, but rather only a few people on independent small towns and cities that hopefully change the trend and keep European culture alive, like they did in Orania.

[@edheldude]

In the past? In the recent past (200 years), Europe grew by trade (we are expert traders), exploration, science, industrialization, and by spreading the fruits of our culture all around the world. Everyone has benefited.

[@josephang9927]

@@edheldude Agreed, but sadly Europe is entering a dark age of stagnation and comfort. Lets pray it is just a short down and it recovers. It would be a tragedy for Europe to be irrelevant for a century or more compared to the rest of the West. No one wants that, not even the invaders that want to parasite it.

[@lasmmaeify]

They're still in a neo colonial relationship w Africa to a lesser extent, that is changing though w Africa wanting to throw them off

[@bevbevan6189]

Tremendous video. It was fascinating how the European upper class’ expectation that all systems were rigged made them among Madoff’s leading pigeons.

[@kono5933]

Bev bevan?? ELO?? 🤣

[@bevbevan6189]

@@kono5933 Not him. Just a fun obscure name.

[@kono5933]

@@bevbevan6189 it's fun alright!

[@humanperson8418]

Can you do a video mapping the lineage of old money? Where it came from? Assets? How they prevent dilution over generations?

[@e.t.theextraterristrial837]

They're stuck in the past over here and they're waaaay more discriminating not only in terms of race/ethnicity but also class. I'm obviously generalizing here, some countries are better at this, especially Nordic countries because of how Viking societies worked.

[@davorjuric1609]

This video put everything I lived through into words. I am originally from the Balkans, and have spent 6 years living and working in the EU - Germany and Austria and now I am happy in the US. The entire EU system is set up so it completely disincentivizes entrepreneurship or any other attempts to get out of your box (especially if you are an immigrant, oh boy is that a lost cause) - You have extensive social safety nets making you comfortable where you are and at the same time you have high taxes actually keeping you where you are. As a lower-middle class you are paying for the entire society functioning. At the same time old money is collecting rents from apartments, companies, land and cities they owned for hunderds of years. Even if you manage to break out of the lower middle class and become a successful business owner you still end up having to pander to the upper class in one way or another. And if you managed to break out most probably because you were in some way already connected. What is interesting is the chasm between the managerial class and the middle class. They are miles above you - you address them formally - herr this, herr that. I feel more equal with Jeff Bezos than I did with my actual manager at work back in Europe.

[@787gamer5]

Glad I found this channel, I like the overall analysis. I would argue that overall Canada is closer to American social classes. Their economy is just more concentrated in a handful of cities - really just Toronto and Vancouver. The dream of the middle class in those cities is almost identical to Americans. They want big houses, big SUVs, lots of consumer goods, etc. It’s more expensive and a lot harder to get those things but that’s still the desire. Contrast that to the points raised in your videos about Europeans being content to remain in what Americans would view as lower class. If Europeans had the money I think they would buy larger apartments/townhomes in the city center rather than renting a small flat, but I don’t think everything you characterized as bad/poor quality of life is actually bad in European culture. They like their smaller cars, there’s a huge market for luxury hatchbacks from Mercedes, Audi, and BMW in Europe. These cars are desirable there and more practical for the small streets. Also hanging clothes out to dry doesn’t necessarily mean someone doesn’t have a dryer. The biggest thing in Europe is space. People in the city centers renting small flats may not have a dedicated dryer but there are plenty of washer dryer combo machines. People further outside the city with space will tend to have dryers. Regardless the culture around clothes is different. The middle class in Europe prides themselves on how they dress and many of the clothes one would wear for work or wear out you would not put in the dryer. Usually handmade clothes from Portugal, Italy, France. I still think you hit the nail on the head with your main point that Europeans are happier with a lower standard of living but I think you missed what the actual lower standard of living is vs what are just cultural preferences. Smaller spaces, no ac, less lavish vacations would be examples I’d use for lower standard of living, but living in the city centre, driving a smaller car, using public transit, hang drying some clothes - that’s just a cultural difference.

[@schurlbirkenbach1995]

I am European (Austrian) and I alway believed, that people, which use a dryer, don't have a room for drying or a garden or a balcony. And I always believed, middle class means, to have a second home on the country.

[@martinmassera]

So interesting. I'm from Argentina, which has such a strong imprint of European immigration. I now understand why people in my country have this leaning to demand a welfare state.

[@wussrestbrook1200]

Lol America is made up of the same people just communism never took root in the usa

[@timothyrday1390]

Fascinating discussion that many middle-class Europeans might not be fully aware of (those that are proud of their modern social democracies). Recently, I couldn't help but think that the adoption of this socio-economic model has put so many developing countries into the "middle income trap." That is, the European model is better suited for already industrialized and developed economies (which are not at war with each other).

[@RhettPrice-mm1ss]

You matched a lot of Lenin’s analysis of British Labor Aristocracy

[@unknowninfinium4353]

Yeah, but glad that many now see mommy issues...

[@DrewskiOne]

This was great, Nick. I'm an American living in Germany near the Bodensee (aka Lake of Constanz). The real estate prices here are what you might find in the suburbs of San Francisco; $2-2.5mm for a stand-along home. These are considered expensive homes due to the lake and lack of land to build on. Anyhow, the perplexing thing for me is that no one in Germany makes the necessary income to afford such homes. The highest tax rate of 45% starts at ~$160K or 145K Euros. If you make 145K Euros you are considered to be doing very well. But, how could you afford a 2mm+ Euro home on that salary? This might be possible for two high income earners but it is not really in the realm of possibility for Germans that are accustom to earning 50-60K Euros a year, not to mention accumulating the capital to put down on a home. Your video explains that it is through inheritance and old money that makes these lakeside homes sell.

[@igottheshaft]

And the peasants vote to tax themselves to death, to receive "benefits," forever excluding themselves from owning property and achieving any true upward mobility. Honestly, it's hard not to pin the blame on public education, or state run schooling.

[@Anton43218]

What about the class hierarchy in eastern europe? Most people can barely afford to survive.

[@schurlbirkenbach1995]

@@Anton43218 you are exagerrating. We don't have the year 1945 or 1990. And I know Eastern Europe pretty well.

[@Anton43218]

@@schurlbirkenbach1995 "we don't have the year 1945 or 1990" What?

[@S41GON]

​@@Anton43218He meant we're not living in 1945 or 1990 (two years when things were really bad in Eastern Europe).

[@SIMONREMISH]

not true. most people became dependent on welfare or work in the public sector of the country because of communism, so people aren’t so business oriented. lots of people want big wages but they arent so skilled. but they’re not trying to actually build something in the country, so they leave the country in favour of EU. then they send money back home. talking about my country - moldova here. people who have business ideas, get a big chunk of the bread and can live comfortably, whereas in the EU it would be a lot harder.

[@TomasSab3D]

Absolutely true. 100%. Total. Then again... it works. You do not "get ahead". But you have access to stable low levels of misery. Unless you "marry upwards"...

[@psikeyhackr6914]

The social psychology of European Culture is imperialistic. Capitalism, socialism and communism do not matter. The social psychology of the culture will bend them all to be imperialistic. When has mandatory accounting in the schools been discussed regarding any of them? Do they use money?

[@edheldude]

That's wrong. All people organize to the level they can. Only high cultures with extremely well working systems can even create large nations or empires. Without good philosophy, institutions, traditions, focus on spirituality and family etc. you can't have a large functioning society, much less an empire. It's not tied to any one culture, it's about how ingenious the people are in whatever era.

[@pjetri24]

This is a great and accurate explanation. I live in Italy . I am part of the lower middle class. Taxation is one of the reasons why people that might consider opening a new business don't do it. This also incentiveses fiscal evasion from those who already have a business. It is impossible for the economy to thrive while social benefits increase every year, even though the medical and pension contributions serve for nothing.

[@Merle1987]

I love this channel. It's just a broham rapping over a few charts.

[@krtst]

I really came to these conclusions myself. Your video is an excellent selection of facts that have already been deposited in my head)

[@sporegnosis]

You earned my subscription with this video.

[@AFNick]

Thanks

[@inedanap6253]

Great work Nick! Very enlightening. This has inspired me to research more on the topic

[@redreignss]

Wow I had no idea that European old money has genealogies going back that far! It's crazy to try and imagine what a family like that would be like... This was a very interesting video!!

[@masa26762]

I wonder how the dynamic between winner and loser country worked after ww2. For example, 90% of Japan's imperial property had been redistributed after the war. Curious if those things contribute to actually less old money.

[@AFNick]

Good question

[@MoonShine-o5n]

I just came to the exact same conclusion after researching EU countries😂 Completely agree with you. It’s so easy to see lol.

[@WillieFungo]

For everyone except the Europeans themselves. They are too busy fixating on America's problems to see their own.

[@NoOne-kx7zs]

​@@WillieFungoAs a non-westerner.... basically neither american or European....had noted this long back. European people have a weird sense of superiority complex where they like to believe no one is near them in development. Problem is......USA and japan are objectively better than Europe in many metrics..... not to mention comparison of things like living space and services make it all too more obvious to ignore. So in order to not let their sense of superiority get challenged......they keep on talking about massive issues of America day and night. If i have to be very honest.....issues of Europe are much bigger than that of USA..

[@AmorosoGombe]

Refreshingly original analysis.

[@biobrotmithonig8872]

Hey Nick interesting video. I want to add that a very importand element in the class structure is missing though. The migrant class. Its a class with a quasi permanent status but marginalised and without political representation.

[@michaelcap9550]

Crazy Bernie needs to watch this.

[@Harve6988]

Hmm, I think there probably is still a bit of "old money" based power in the UK, mainly held up in land, and media control, but I think that has been weakened massively since the 1920s and 30s, whether it be via the welfare state, high degreees of unionisation, or just new elites from the city of London in the 80s. The growth of tech elites, expansion od univeristy (oxbridge takes more state educated people now than privately educated people) and new Internet based media further continues to under mine old power, though nothing has yet been done about land. Also, GDP per capita in the UK was near to that of the US in 2008 - it's only since then that the US has accelerated away - so the hypothesis around social protections causing long term stagnation I don't think really fits here. There is perhaps more evidence from Denmark that employment protections cause problems with worklessness.

[@dencentbeatz794]

Denmark has the easiest hiring and firing laws… it’s very easy to do business there. If u get layed off the state takes care of u.

[@Mastercane98]

I'm not so convinced about the so called generosity of the welfare state, many are just being left behind because they have little political representation. High taxes along with a rigid labour market and a business hostile environment make it almost certain that you will not be able to accumulate any meaningful amount of wealth during your lifetime.

[@michaelcap9550]

Dems game plan in the US.

[@michaelcap9550]

Describes California perfectly.

[@asalamander7182]

You can’t accumulate wealth because you can’t start a business?

[@Shiegao]

2x speed is necessary for this vid

[@AFNick]

Thanks for the feedback

[@MargaretLi-f2n]

Can't agree more!

[@LibertyJava]

I love Europe but I'm glad I was born in the US, the closest European country to the US would be Ireland.

[@HS-wo8ti]

Lol even though the USA was founded by the UK? Bear in mind that the idea of individual rights and liberty was birthed by the Puritans who left England to the USA, not from the Catholicism of Ireland.

[@badart3204]

@@HS-wo8tithe UK has developed separately for 400 years since then and don’t really believe in rights anymore. Are you going to say France and Spain are both the same bc they emerged from the Roman collapse as well?

[@nobilesnovushomo58]

“Europeans don’t use electricity as much” >Me: can’t be true >looks up AC Usage in Germany. >only 3 percent of households have ac. Wut?

[@mateobeccar2618]

So, how does the Social Mobility Index play into all of this?

[@AFNick]

Which social mobility index?

[@averagejoe1773]

Very interesting video

[@indeoo_]

A have to agree, that's socialistic policies are slowing down social mobility and reducing competition for elites, which in turn slowing down development of economy and society, since because of lack of competition elites have less stimulus for maintaining and developing theirs "elitistic" skills/competencies. But i don't agree with how you qualify who old money is. It's not some 800 years old aristocracy, even if some old families own 10-20% land in different european countries, probably 30% in UK. Their influence on politics and % in total wealth of countries is not big. Big European old money is more about industrial capital late of 19th, first half of 20th century and first post WW2 decades. This can be easily demonstrated by small case research. Just find "top 50 French companies, top 50 richest French, top 50 German companies, top 50 richest Germans", you'll see most companies and capitals where created at the time period i've mentioned. of course, situation in UK will be more conservative, since there weren't revolution in 18th and 19th centuries, and countries was not destroyed in WW2 as Germany. Of course, if you google same requests for US companies and richest people, you'll find out that median age of top US company is extremely lower.

[@dencentbeatz794]

Wdym elitistic skills / competency’s lol. It’s not cause of the socialistic polices per se but mainly cause of the US hegemony. America is the big daddy all the innovation, etc is here technically. Ur right that a freer market is here, and surprise surprise capitalism ig, but technically some European countries r easier to do business in than the US. This mfs video is such bs and pandering so hard to a certain demographic that no actual evidence is given to really given to further the argument. Europe def suffers from some economic issues, but I can’t deny that the basic rights given to citizens there is much better than the US

[@indeoo_]

@@dencentbeatz794 you dont see that there is a reason why US has hegemony in innovation, thats because US has more free market and less regulations. Very often people see regulations as something they can benefit from. In short term sometimes probably, but in long tern its just something that limits competition and prevents new innovative companies to replace older less innovative

[@ypey1]

Its the same old, just with some revolution insurance… that was a good one 😅

[@michaelcap9550]

Revolution insurance - spot on.

[@S41GON]

Having to drive everywhere might be good for the GDP, but doesn't guaranteel a high standard for living though. American way of life is so antihuman in other aspects (food quality, cost of health care, general safety) that it really questions if it's worth to sacrifice everything for some high GDP per capita.

[@mharley3791]

People always say food quality for America, which is odd because America has some of the highest food safety in the world. In fact, it ranks 3rd. The difference is that America list the ingredients by its chemical name while Europe does not. Europe places hide regulatory barriers to protect its domestic markets, and then uses the veneer of “food safety” to justify it

[@joseceballos3769]

I don't know if it's because of the food. But the US has a lower life expectancy than even Latin American countries like Chile and Uruguay. That's strange considering that Americans have a high standard of living.

[@badart3204]

⁠@@joseceballos3769American cuisine is very high calorie due to the historical abundance of resources so now that people don’t work 12 hour days of manual labor they get really fat and die young. Most of America is overweight with the leading cause of death being cardiovascular issues.

[@truediltom]

Fantastic video

[@dutchy4830]

This is what im talking about nick, what a beautiful thumbnail. I hope it improves traction!

[@dvsmapple]

Nordic unemployment rate is largely short-term with people switching jobs. Which is arguably a good thing. The GDP per capita is also a poor measure for those countries since people there work much fewer hours. While GDP per hour is on par with the US if not higher. Same applies to the EU more broadly, when measured by PPP. Plus America's public spending is at 40% of GDP now, which is only marginally bellow that of the EU Member States. European welfare spending also comes in the form of either pensions or subsidies for training, especially in Central and Northern Europe. The former has more to do with Europe's older population while the latter tends to greatly improve productivity through higher labour mobility. On China: Europe's savings rate is ahead of that of the United States and most of the Anglosphere in general. So the welfare state does not explain it at all. Plus, social mobility as calculated by WEF is roughly the same in France and Germany compared to the US, with BENELUX and the Nordics far ahead. Again, you either don't use "Europe" as a whole or exclude BENELUX and the Nordics who have quite generous welfare states while being as if not more productive economically as the US. While having a much older population.

[@theant4268]

1:38 real question, do you see the parallel between Bismarck's policy and the social welfare programs the Democrats installed in low income regions in America? Especially since recipients almost universally vote for the party that gave it to them

[@AFNick]

Bismarck set the example

[@atlantean781]

Good stuff 👍

[@AFNick]

Thanks

[@timjeffrey]

US GDP per person has moved Infront of W Europe in the last 15 years, before it was pretty even, France Germany UK Italy etc. 2 reasons. Cheap gas/petrol and electricity in the US, plus huge increases in government debt in the US which sustains programs and lower taxes, enabled by having the world's reserve currency. This will.not last forever. You cannot continue to borrow from foreign creditors for cheap when debt is over 120% GDP

[@AtlantaSamurai]

Where does the European celebrity class fall in this? Specifically, I'm referring to their offspring. Do their kids become a part of the "Old Money" class, despite not having the traditional status and education? Or does the celebrity class just fall back into the Lower-Middle Class after a couple of generations?

[@AFNick]

It probably depends on how impactful they are. Those who are knighted (or the non-British equivalent) are likely to have more staying power. Most descendants of celebrities will sink back down to lower middle class equilibrium.

[@AtlantaSamurai]

@@AFNick I think so, too. They'll have the same fate as the descendants of rich merchants. Thanks

[@osamataha336]

@@AFNick Isn't those the same as Jester of the old days, I feel even US celeb are basically that, they are like politicians but not rewarded with power but with money

[@callspreadzero854]

There’s a reason many of Europes wealthy have homes/residency in more favorable European environs- Spain and other areas close to the Med. Others, it’s the U.S., SE Asia, or the Caribbean. I’ve made this argument for years- there is little to no class mobility in Europe. While it’s not indicative of an entire continent, the few wealthy Europeans I know either made their money abroad, or were born with land resources and turned it into something. In which case it’s been in their family for generations.

[@AntonioTorcoli]

There was never equality in Europe. But the Gini index is lower than in the US

[@edheldude]

It's never equal anywhere - that's just what life is. Some people are smarter, more creative, and more industrious than others.

[@TheNavalAviator]

There isn't equality, there is a mere sharing of the spoils but the roles are pretty set.

[@thetennisjournal]

So how do you explain that all the countries with the highest levels of social mobility are in Europe? I think you are ignoring the people who aren’t well off or marginalized groups in the USA have significantly worse lives and deal with extreme inequality, very poor social mobility. Where often they have deal with extremely high crime and government services probably worse than some second world countries. The majority of any society no matter if it’s the USA , Europe, Africa, Asia won’t be rich. Additionally being in a higher social class is not necessarily the meaning of life. Just because someone has a big suburban house and a SUV or F1-50 does not equate to life being better or leading a happy life?

[@AFNick]

The social mobility numbers are misleading, because they ignore old money, and the rest of the bands are so close together that moving up or down them isn’t as consequential as in the US

[@thetennisjournal]

@@AFNickso are you saying that? In Europe small leaps in social mobility happen more often but significantly leaps happen less than than in the USA? To be fair I agree with what you are saying I’m from the American south but spent a lot of time in Europe. Portugal for example seemed worse than the USA . However in general I think it’s not wise to prioritize massive shifts in social mobility instead of the general wellbeing of most people. I think the USA is better to get rich but worse for living a good life to me America misses the opportunity to allow people to have a better life because the illusion that they are rich or it’s just a matter of time. I want to move to Europe because it seems like a better overall lifestyle and more affordable and it seems possible to start a business also. In Eastern Europe the taxes aren’t even much higher than the USA?

[@louiec1848]

@@AFNickexactly this. Bands are so close it’s all basically the same, you might have nicer shoes or go on a nicer vacation but that’s about it haha

[@Hwje1111]

You made the europeans cope hard indeed lol

[@plagiarisedwords]

3:56 Have to be careful with GDP per capita. First you need to use PPP to adjust. Then there is the issue that its an average meaning it can be skewed by a few very high income entities. I say entities because GDP includes corporations. E.g. Ireland has higher GDP per capita than all US states because big tech shift their profits there for tax reasons. Median income is a better measure of general population welfare and these are much closer between US and Europe. The lifestyle differences are down to culture. Europeans spend more on better quality clothes which you wouldnt want to put through a drier. Gas guzzling SUVs for normal everyday driving, oversized fridges with ice cube dispensers on them (thet kill energy efficiency) is juet crass consumerism. I can afford those things but dont feel the need for them.

[@sebsebski2829]

I mean... top 10 countries with higher social mobility than the US are located in the EU. Old money also exists in the USA. The argument with cars was extremely weak, and you know it, Nick. We don't need big American cars because our streets and roads are made for tiny vehicles. Think of America but with 700 million people. 8 European countries have higher savings per capita than the USA. Homelessness? Nonexistent. Junkies on the streets? nonexistent. Tents with homeless people? None. Gun crime? Almost 0. Homicide? It's 1 per 100k citizens. USA is 50 per 100k citizens. My country has a population of California. in 2019 you guys had 2950 gun-related deaths in Cali, with 245 children being shot to death. My country had 30 times fewer gun related deaths. You have your higher salary (What's the average? 20k dollars a year?) we got safety, peace, healthcare, and comfortable life. I'm happy to pay 20k dollars a year so I don't have to read every 5 days about school shootings in France, Germany, or Poland.

[@AFNick]

It’s going to take a while for my full response on this, but thanks for the comment in the mean time.

[@MoonShine-o5n]

Sounds like you’ve decided to ignore reality today. Nobody’s saying the US is perfect.. it has issues but social mobility isn’t one. The car industry is a perfect example lol.. you still have your Mercedes, VWs, and your BMWs, etc. the barrier for entry is massive. Meanwhile, here it’s Tesla, Rivian and Lucid, many others threatening the status quo.

[@vanessat9309]

I agree on the fact that Europeans neither need nor drive big cars and SUVs. Unfortunately though, Nick, SUVs are really catching on here too. I was shocked when I saw an actual "pick-up truck" parked in my small village (in Germany).

[@r.mariano8118]

The US murder rate is around 5-7/100k it’s been higher in the past but it’s not 50/100k that’s worse than South Africa.

[@johnwitherell6662]

Europe has gypsies and now has migrant problems that are about to give plenty of similar social issues present in the US. This man is also going to pretend that Europe is a utopia without gun deaths while a literal war is going on with some of the most horrific and inhumane fighting ever devised by technology. Do you remember the last time a US citizen had to worry about an invasion, while Ukraine isn't the only EU country worried about an invasion. Cyprus, for instance, comes to mind with Turkish oil exploration ships and the Greek Cypriots sometimes freaking out over a little ship plodding around in the sea. "Oh but those are not EUrope" I, too, can cherry pick US states/regions and present a utopia that exceeds anything Europe could muster. The other issue about wealth - Nick mentioned that Europeans often hang dry their clothes. For instance let's say that nearly every European could afford to buy a clothes drying machine, it's quite likely they will not have the space to put it anywhere in their house/apartment, even more so that they couldn't afford a house that has enough space over a simple appliance most Americans take for granted. Their roads are small because they are so urbanized and each person has that much less wealth of land to own and share publicly. In America there are places with enough public land that you could get lost and die from how remote it is to anything, while it's basically impossible for you to die of remoteness in Europe. Even if Europe somehow had larger roads, Europeans could not afford the cars Americans buy, period. Cloth seat 316i BMWs sound like a joke of a poverty trim (to Americans) that actually exists in Europe that is not sold in the US for obvious reasons.

[@Never-ending_]

Not a single statistic in the entire video. Just an American talking about what he thinks Europe is like. We have to share a small peninsula that's 1/4 of US with 2x as many people. We don't have SUV but we don't need them either. About low living standards. That's more of the gvt paying pensions instead of investing in the youth. There are also areas that pay for a high quality education so you can have a paid off house by 28 if marrying young.

[@Basement_stories]

If there's such high quality education then why these people don't achieve anything in science and economy later? Nowadays Europe is basically economic corpse and intellectual desert in comparison to what it used to be. All progress is made in China and USA and I mean real progress not fake one like mandatory caps attached to bottles.

[@pedrovelazquez138]

One can tell the truth with and without statistics. It's called "common sense". I work with data btw.

[@grendo45]

Where can you have paid off a house by 28?

[@ViceCoin]

Fake Eutopean gardens with suburban ghettos.😅

[@calibvr]

tbf suvs and pickup trucks are sad asf and suburban homes are structurally terrible

[@AFNick]

I agree with you on pickup trucks, but American suburban lifestyle is better than cramming a family into a small apartment built a century ago.

[@schurlbirkenbach1995]

​@@AFNick If it would be a century ago. The old houses in my hometown Vienna are usually of better quality than those built after 1945, because the rotten buildings of those days don't exist any more.

[@dencentbeatz794]

@@AFNickbro most people have like one or two kids… an apartment is just fine. Clearly u have never lived in NyC lol. Urban sprawl is garbage.

[@tikaltoki4561]

The number of views seems to be relative to quality at least in this case.

[@MoonShine-o5n]

Lol somebody got triggered by facts and likes group think.

[@WillieFungo]

@@MoonShine-o5n That's the European mentality.

[@tcironbear21]

As a Leftist I am of mixed opinion on this. On one hand, I don't care for the exploitation of the workers. On the other hand I have to acknowledge most people don't really want to make the sacrifices to be rich and I don't want to kill all the people necessary to achieve some kookie dream of utopia that would probably never work. They just want some creature comforts and low stress life. If it is impossible to achieve true egalitarianism without considerable bloodshed, this seems to be a reasonable facsimile. I would rather have system that encourages a well-educated, well-cared for population of lower class, than a system that exploits 90% of the people into near absolute poverty just so there is chance for handful plucky finance bros to become billionaires and waste their fortunes on doomed Galt's Gulches.

[@CarlosdeFrance]

People live longer in Europe They are happier, healthier. The food is better. But for the social mobility issue you are Right

[@wussrestbrook1200]

You could literally say this about south Korea or the massai lol what type of cope is this

[@WielkiHapu]

Having a SUV or pickup truck as a status symbol xD murrica much

[@humpteedumptee8629]

I don’t think they anyone thinks is magically a land of equality. The way I’ve always put it is simple and accurate. Would rather live in a place where your chances of becoming rich are higher, but there are little to no safety, competition is savage, and your far more likely to be stuck in a cycle of abject poverty. Or would you rather life in a place where it’s far less likely you will be rich. But you’re far more likely to live a comfortable lifestyle. And you will have less savage competition, and more readily available social services and community resources. Like no one thinks they’re in a magical utopia. It’s just a simple choice of preference and frankly neither is wrong. Some people would prefer the possibility of being rich even if it’s highly unlikely and they accept in every other category their worse off. Others would be happy to have a chill job and know they will be more comfortable in most cases. The issue is you keep saying suburban Americans, or avg. you know like half the population that don’t get the big trucks and nice housing right? Like 1/3 of Americans live better, 2/3s life like straight shit. That’s the issue with all arguments I’ve heard on this and similar topics. Y’all all just completely disregard half the us population. Then compare the top half alone against another population. Like obviously if just ignore half the population and are only comparing half. It’s not really and apple for apple comparison, like do the opposite compare new Mexico and west virgins for France. We would look poor asf in comparison. Also we pay same taxes. If you actually look up their taxes and compare it to ours, like all taxes income, sales, capital gains, get em all. You’ll find we all pay pretty close to the same percentage. Your only decent argument is they been around longer. So their old money is older. But in 600 years we’re gonna have the same old money. The best way to study this. Is just goto Europe.

[@AFNick]

I’ve been to Europe several times and lived there. The societies have made different trade offs on how to structure economies and it clearly shows.

[@humpteedumptee8629]

@@koschmx yea but I live in Texas and if make decent income at all. You’re paying 30-40% of your income to taxes (and we don’t even have an actual income tax). The taxes are just broken down more. But when add up a bunch of 1-10% 15 times and weight it. You’re paying the same tax rate. While getting way less for your money. And the thing covered by the social spending cost 100’s to thousands of times more out of pocket. The only difference is your taxes go to propping up massive police, prison, intelligence agencies, and military instead of social programs. Don’t get me wrong it’s two different approaches to solve the same problem (making them do what you want like good lil bitches). And completely different debate if massive police forces, and Intelligence preparations is better than read and circus. But the tax rate is the with 5%+/- relative to income bracket.

[@dencentbeatz794]

@@koschmxwell it honestly is better lol if u compare general population to general population living standards. Seriously come to America lol. See the difference ull go back unless u really make a good amount of cash.

[@humpteedumptee8629]

@@koschmx I said Texas doesn’t, as in it’s less than any other state. Like what’s your move here? You want to pull out random dumb shit. Ok this dude said 40% acting like there isn’t 66k other dollars taxed at 10-20%. Like omg were play dumb shit games cause the peasants can’t read and don’t understand progressive tax. They also think ot is double taxed. The point I made pretty dame simple. If your paying 20-30% to the Feds, and than live in a state with 6-10% sales tax, yea every city can set its own on top of the state. (and we’re gonna pretend its progressive, cause we dumb illiterate around here. I just didn’t worth the time to dissect shit in bs pedantic level). Then based on that alone you’re paying the same amount. But as I also said “if you’re making decent money”. That implies your paying property taxes, sales taxes, 401 may or may not be, registration, gota decent job good chance you have an annual license tax, sales tax, income tax (yes federal and state. I don’t know em all but some states Syed are 10%), than you got capital gains, you got some cds maybe add that to income. I said decent money, you’re paying the same 40% and getting less. I mean like also said you get to pay people to spy on you. So that’s kinda cool i guess. Personally I’d rather fund an insurance scheme than a secret police. It’s also nice to pay a bunch of 18 year olds to jerk off in 700 countries. But it’s debatable good, you know it’s not bad. You could also just pay for neither and pocket the difference, it’s not a you get health care or spied, you have to pick one choice. Also 8% is a bs. Being insured is not equal. You’ve never had insurance that was nothing but a rubber stamp. Like oh I pay this 100 bucks a month for insurance that’s essentially useless but it makes taxes easier. Kinda like almost everyone now days has car insurance, but the quality is worse. It’s like trend when you force a service into people at gun point is sucks, The points simple. We’re paying pretty much the exact same thing. The only difference is they pay for health care and tuition. And we chose fund people spying on us. But the German not that doesn’t understand progressive tax complains about his 40% lol.

[@gwoodlogger4068]

Some over all truths but dont describe Europe very well. It is too varied to do really. The perspective seam rather Amarican that is limited and why would we want big cars 🤣 We do have different tates, lifestyle's, priorities and values.

[@mariuspopescu1893]

There is no equality but this video is a very big generalisation, exageration and you should not take it for real. It starts from true facts but then ... 1. Europe is not something unitary, the differences between states are huge. Yes, you have England, the only state in Europe with no revolution, with an unique land ownership but that is it. Land has changed hands so many times in other countries that you can not count it. - old aristocracy are an exception, they are in the upper class along with old political families, industrial revolution old business and some new ones. The same in America just that you are missing the old aristocracy. - houses are expensive but is it different in America? Can you afford a house near a lake, in a famous area, as an employee? - I know people who bought an apartment 10 years ago in Paris, both worked with good jobs, IT and Automotive, 10-15 min walk from Eifel tour. It is not impossible but also not accessible to many. How many people afford a flat in NY or SF? In the town not in the far away suburbs ... - salaries are low due ro taxation, I hate this. But there are people who make money by starting their own business or freelancing. They have more money and options to buy real estate - because housing is so expensive a lot of people decide to rent forever instead of purchasing. They are mostly natives. Immigrants prefer to buy, maybe its a cultural thing. A lot of people from my country emigrated, most of them buy instead of renting I am not defending Europe, I hate the burden of high taxation, I am just trying to make you understand that this 15 min video is nonsense.

[@edbop]

Oh dear, your claim about GDP per capita is not particularly useful because it very much depends where in Europe you are talking about; Norway for instance, very strong welfare state, has a higher gdp per capita than the US. Your claim about it being less than half that of the US only applies to places like Spain and Italy. Your claim about savings rates is also dodgy as many European countries have a savings rate similar or substantially higher than that of the US. Your political/economic analysis is that of the level of a school kid. Learning how banking works I feel would help you massively, perhaps start with Werner's 2014 paper 'can banks create money out of nothing' it is freely available to read on the internet.

[@nicholastorres44]

Oh dear, when you were condescending it actually hurt your counter argument, which on its own was more supporting of the idea that Europe lacks social equality.

[@edbop]

@@nicholastorres44 Europe is a continent, it is on the other side of the Atlantic Ocean,and is made up of many countries; theses countries are different, some are wealthy some are not. Variety in wealth between countries is not the same as wealth inequality within countries, that would be like saying America has huge wealth inequality because the Canada is rich and Cuba is poor. Google maps is really useful if you are unaware where any of the places I have mentioned are.

[@edbop]

@@nicholastorres44 Europe is a continent on the other side of the Atlantic Ocean (see a map of the world) made up of a number of countries of varying levels of wealth as well as wealth and social inequality. Variance between countries is not evidence of inequality within those countries. In terms you may understand North America is a continent, Canada is a country within North America. Or this cow is small, those cows are far away.

[@WillieFungo]

@@nicholastorres44 This is the European mentality. They generally have this massive chip on their shoulder.

[@WillieFungo]

@@edbop You people always say the same things. Today its "Don't generalize Europe". Tomorow its "As a European". Whatever suits your argument at the time.

[@Ender314]

I really liked the video, and your presentation style is getting better. One critique at 11:00 you mention 700,000 years, this is a little extreme and doesn’t really fit within the time frame of your video. Unsure of how deliberate that was but it certainly caught me off guard

[@AFNick]

700-1000 years not 700,000. Maybe the way I pronounced it sounded weird

[@Ender314]

@@AFNick yea could be, love your channel, keep growing it!

[@Anton43218]

11:46 what about in eastern europe where you are eternally locked out of higher positions simply due to you not being descended from the right family?

[@AFNick]

Historical circumstances there change the class hierarchy somewhat, so I can’t comment on it.

[@nanay3000]

In Eastern Europe when the communism fell, there were were a bunch of people who quickly ran to buy land and businesses and create their family's wealth because I think it was an even playing field when communism fell to a certain extent because during communism no one could own any businesses or anything. That's the point of communism . Every everything was owned by the. Now Eastern Europe is still poor compared to Western Europe but they are quickly accelerating especially with AI / tech and everything. And I've already met and taught a lot of children from wealthy families who started building once communism fell. I'm an international teacher and a lot of wealthy families put their kids in to ESL and international schooling experiences and so I would talk to the adults of Eastern European countries like Romania about this.

[@Anton43218]

@@nanay3000 You are so wrong you don't even know. Where do you think they got the money to start those businesses? Simple, they were part of the corrupt communist elite who on paper earning decent incomes, they made their riches accepting bribes during communism and then using at as clean money since there was no certification for where you got the money from when you swapped old communist era bills for new noncommunist ones. There were other people with token amounts of money after decades of hard work however most of them got wiped out clean after scams started appearing promising impossibly large returns on investment. They did not know since literature about other economic systems was ilegal and thus only accessible to the party elite. There is nothing fair about this nor is it an "even playing field".

[@Anton43218]

@@nanay3000 You are so wrong you don't even know. Where do you think they got the money to start those businesses? Simple, they were part of the corrupt communist elite who on paper earning decent incomes, they made their riches accepting bribes during communism and then using at as clean money since there was no certification for where you got the money from when you swapped old communist era bills for new noncommunist ones. 1/2

[@Anton43218]

@@nanay3000 You are so wrong you don't even know. Where do you think they got the money to start those businesses? Simple, they were part of the communist party elite who on paper were earning decent incomes however they made their riches with bribes or other illegal means during communism and rhen using it as clean money after swapping the old bills for new ones since there was no certification for where you got the money from when you swapped old communist era bills for new noncommunist ones. There were other people with token amounts of money after decades of hard work however most of them got wiped out clean after scams started appearing promising impossibly large returns on investment. They did not know since literature about other economic systems was ilegal and thus only accessible to the party elite. There is nothing fair about this nor is it an "even playing field".

[@Robotnik]

Even Feudalismus was better than what we habbath now in Europastan. There weren rights and lots of Stipulations. What happemed was the merchant led Deformation that samodworking the Kyningan, took all other Threats out that held the Kyning and his Æthlingen to task, and as ye stated from 9:09 onwards , old money has and will always habban econoic resources as they wealthy wurden before the Tide of mass progressive Scat aka Tax, while Lower Middleclass, that came after WWII, thea enriched between 50s to late 80s, weren seen as too strong and as such, under the guise of eQuAliTy and dIeVeRsIty , weren shot down by growing Nanny State that siphoned more from this otherwise healthy Class for these nanny state programs that really, weren to keep all social Mobility to least or none at all. Good Video!

[@MrCrosby.s_lunch]

As a European I can confirm that every single thing said in this video is fake, without considering that a whole continent with 500 million inhabitants and 44 countries has massive variation between different areas, so a video that speaks about Europe as a single entity doesn't make any sense, without considering how wrong the information the video gives is. Even the whole discussion about class is not relatable to ANY country Europe but France and to a much lesser extent Britain. This video is literally crap

[@louiec1848]

Spot on for France tho can’t lie. And America is similar size in terms of population and has the same demographic diversity. It’s just a big picture comparison