Mythic Plus Drama and Delves' Future, New Companion? - Warcraft Weekly

[@zuluhawk]

DO NOT add a timer to Delves, dear god

[@slimi32]

yeah, I literally hate M+ because of timers

[@mossysnail6857]

do that and delves die. I SWEAR TO GOD DON'T FKIN DO IT.

[@MadHerbertPotts]

I can’t think of a single game I’ve ever played that I felt like a timer made it more enjoyable for me. I dislike it so much that I completely understand I’m likely an exception though.

[@ugladden]

Delves straight up saved WoW for me.

[@ajamesrichards]

Same

[@JC-ok4yx]

I can finally keep up playing just a few hours a week. I have a toddler and kid on the way. I just want to be able to keep up with my raid team. We run heroic, nothing crazy. 4 hours a week. I’m down with it.

[@davidbeceiro5571]

Delves saved the game for a lot of people :)

[@la7era1u54]

same

[@zackriden79]

GAY

[@00Recoil]

If coffer keys are keeping M+ dregs away from Delves, I would say they were working as intended.

[@Alexjw1990]

Unfortunately it’s also allowing delve babies to think they can do M+

[@Tijuanabill]

Its so strange to me that you would say something like this. Why on earth would you care about who does what content, and why would you pass judgment on people who like content you don't? Delves are solo content, so it literally doesn't matter who else does them.

[@josephflannery9015]

I can’t imagine being you and never losing my virginity. And don’t say you did because relatives don’t count

[@Mythodyn]

M+ players complaining people don't have to take their shit anymore is hilarious to me.

[@shwaaank]

This!

[@Nhouyengah]

Who says this tho ? I'm 2k4 m+ and doing delves with my guild when they need someone, it's pretty chill.

[@Mrfiufaufou]

True, some people just don't understand they are the problem, everyone else does tho.

[@cedrickhached9555]

M+ toxic playber base killed it. Solo delves FTW :)

[@terryfunk1728]

as a toxic m+/pvp only player i cant blame u :D

[@MrPFMneto]

There is nothing toxic about doing your best to time the key...

[@alphaking32]

@@MrPFMneto No one ever said this and you told on yourself as well as being toxic.

[@idiosyncraticRyugu]

@@alphaking32 nah, it's generally the kids crying about toxic keys that just want to get carried and completely disrespect other people's time for a key.

[@YumYum820]

​@@MrPFMneto 🙄 doesn't mean m+ players have to make it miserable for everyone else.

[@ohnoezitsjoez]

I am firmly within the Delve demographic. I was over the moon I could get a single piece of Hero track a week, with a random map Hero piece here and there. I am perfectly content with where the gear landed, I don't have any need for Gilded Crests or Myth track. Delves need more work (glares at Brann) but the gear/power is not on the top 100 Delve problem list. Also 11.1 companion will be a goblin methinks.

[@Gigatoast]

Gazlowe or whoever he is. The goblin from Azj Kahet leveling campaign

[@Shadow-iv9ft]

Honestly I'd love for it to be Harrison Jones in 11.1. He needs to make a comeback and this seems like the perfect moment. Exploring dangerous delves sounds right up his alley. My next guess would be the new guy in the fedora at the delves hub in Dornogal - Jackson something.

[@scorpogee6280]

Why is it that some players get upset over others getting equipment a bit easier now to improve their game play? Is it such an ego trip that you have it and others don't or must work harder to achieve what you did? I'm 99% casual solo and I don't care to socialize when I play WoW! I don't care for M+, I don't care to do dungeon runs or raids where some noxious individual doesn't like how I play my character of the moment. I'm casual which means I set my own time during the day. I love the follower dungeons. I love the delves, so stop trying to have me play your way.

[@julianahavart]

It's an pride attitude people have. Instead of working together to have fun and succeed, they want numbers to show off. People want to validate themselves with numeric achievements instead of playing to have fun and the numbers coming on the side. Thats why M+ gets so toxic in pugs at times. People feel their worth is being invalidated due to mistakes of others. Or their own mistakes, which happen to everyone. So if someone else is getting free gear, free numeric value to show off? Yea, that's a problem in that mindset.

[@stacylgh]

@@scorpogee6280 100% this. They don't want anyone who doesn't do M+ or raid to have gear anywhere near theirs because they are not special then.

[@shwaaank]

​​@@stacylgh the fun thing is, solo players dont get mythic track gear, yet m+ Andys still whinge

[@nolabets3130]

No one said that

[@cosmokramer7926]

@@julianahavart WoW has always had the most petulant player base I've ever encountered. Other classes that needed dev attention getting attention sends players of other classes into meltdown with things said like "Um, when the hell are you going to fix my class? This wasn't even needed for *insert class they don't care about*" in the announcement threads for buffs. IDK what it is but they act as though anyone else getting nice things or attention means there's less of Dev Daddy's love they're going to get. WoW players are basically the jealous sibling seething when their brothers and sisters have birthdays. It's basically safe to dismiss 75% of complaints as infantile selfish masturbation.

[@AgentNoun]

Something I'd love to see for future delve features would be a *choice* of companions. This would be a longer-term thing since I'm sure each companion's a good amount of work to implement, but over time as we build up a roster, it'd be cool to be able to pick who we bring with us. I love your historical timewalking delve idea, too. And if we did get delves in legacy zones, a portal room like we get for M+ dungeons from prior expansions would be nice. Also, as someone who really likes delves, I agree about the myth track gear. I think it's fine for myth track gear to be really difficult to achieve and something that comes primarily or exclusively from group content. IMO delves don't need to offer myth track gear to be worth it long-term.

[@Eldun]

They teased in the future we could use an alt as companion. I like this idea ALOT. This idea is not final or mean its gonna be implemented, but i like it alot it exists.

[@AgentNoun]

@@Eldun Using alts would be really cool! It'd be rad to use them as companions for follower dungeons, too, really drive home the idea that your warband are a bunch of characters who know each other and work together.

[@cyntheticgaming]

I’d love to have hero companions for delves too. Or even roaming Azeroth to recruit new delves companions

[@misskleobaby5587]

I love delves! I hope they make new ones

[@Nickster292]

Id run all the delves in elwynn and westfall

[@cosmokramer7926]

Yeah, I finally got my wife to come back and try WoW again and she's actually having fun just doing duo delves. She was driven away in the past because just doing levelling dungeons randoms were such assholes to her. To this day she has panic attacks if we try dungeons or even LFR, not because of the content but because of how other players treated her in the past. And she's a normal well-adjusted person just new to video games, not some anxiety ridden bubble girl as sometimes you see having meltdowns over non-issues. I probably wouldn't play WoW anymore without delves, they've been that much of a boon for how we play. I'm not a total shitter, I've done heroic raiding, KSM, 1900ish rpvp just to get the mogs, I just don't really care about dealing with most other players I'm not IRL friends with anymore.

[@Melchizadeckk]

If it turned into a forced shared experience with its current player base, then I'd have either be in a Guild that I like the non-toxic people, or just do the story related content and call it a day. I will not play with toxic jerks, nor do I enjoy running through instances as fast as possible, taking shortcuts, and hopping over areas in the map.

[@litospud]

I feel exactly the same way

[@mrJHexx]

Exactly !

[@mcdoogle_robotman]

Same

[@karolusmagnus3992]

same! the timed nature of M+ is incredibly stressful

[@hedonismbot3274]

The whole rush mentality killed it for me. There is no time to enjoy anything. It's a rat race as if I am working at the stock exchange or everything else in society. And that creates unhappy people that just want to be better than others without enjoying anything.

[@kyleturtle4261]

To be honest PUGing has been a nightmare for me for years as every role. I love delves for the fact that I can go through at my own pace not needing to worry about timers, worrying if I’m busting someone else’s key, or wondering if I will be selected for any groups. The only time I run M+ this season is if someone in my guild, at least two other guild members are running with me. I can see some of the issues with people trying to “ice skate uphill” but you can use the rating system to at least see what people have done before coming into a M+ group.

[@kevinc8955]

I’m done pugging permanently. Even when it goes well as a healer it’s still far too much stress. Too many incompetent DPS that don’t use defensives or interrupts.

[@zerti86]

i totally agree with you on this. pugging is a nightmare 9 out of 10 times, it's either people not knowing mechanics and not reading chat, or people wiping 2 times in a +3 and then instantly disband. i also don't believe i have ever encountered that many bad tanks in groups.

[@Scuuurbs]

I don’t think MMOs should be forced group content, but I think the group content on offer should feel more rewarding than stressful. As it stands (for me anyway) Delves are the only endgame content where I feel my time and energy is properly rewarded without having to temper my enjoyment with stress or bad attitudes. M+ and raiding are much more time-consuming and are either enjoyable but not rewarding, or are rewarding but too stressful to enjoy.

[@Mrfiufaufou]

Essentially what you are asking is to have ff14 system here, assholes are banned immediately. Me too brother, me too. That sadly requires active gm's, which wow do not have.

[@Azari_D]

3 new delves and some new stories for existing delves would actually be a great way to update that content

[@stonehenge313]

I have found the delves to be terrific to bridge that gap we had between open world veteran gear and M+ gear. It allows me to be able, with my limited time, to gear something that I can participate in M+.

[@Gigatoast]

Totally agree. Hide the myth track gear behind high keys and difficult raid difficulties. No reason why we can earn champion and occasional hero track gear in delves.

[@mrfluffyhedgehog]

Delves are the best thing since sliced bread. I do them solo most of the time late at night, when no one on my fl is online. People complaining about them being "too easy" or provide too high ilvl items just want to gatekeep their precious higher tier loot. I personally do not "need" delves, we should clear heroic next week and I complete M+ achievements for the portals and mount each season, so gear from delves is a non-topic for me, but I enjoy them quite a bit as a fun little extra game loop I can play. Delves should get higher tiers with scaling loot going forward. Those top level delves should be limited to a few runs per week however, so no one can spam them for endless gear.

[@Dahkeus3]

@18:29 is such truth. When I started playing WoW in BC, tanks would mark targets and call out for sheep’s/saps/traps/etc on those mobs. I know this went away partly when you could just AoE stuff down, but that level of communication is still so rare even in content that merits it nowadays.

[@mortaljorma69]

I remember many, many group disbands just during the magister's terrace trash if cc failed. I miss those times.

[@stacylgh]

If M+ players feel forced to play Delves then that's their problem. They shouldn't be allowed a voice to change Delves because they won't be there long. I've played solo 99% of the time since Wrath. The Delves are for Casuals like me. They've said for years that we don't belong in Endgame content and gatekept participation. LFG is super toxic and not fun when the tank is pulling the whole dungeon. I want to actually play my class not just shoot Ice Lance while running. Delves have helped me become a better player because I have to use my entire toolkit. WoW needs Casuals to keep money coming in. People have left for years because of how toxic the Dungeon and Raiding community can be. Money talks and the changes in Dragonflight and TWW has brought people back. I've loved Follower Dungeons too. I finally get to actually experience the story.

[@daniellucas5522]

The only solution to that problem is to make delves less rewarding. People who are forced to take part in content they don't want to because of the rewards being too good have a real problem that has to be addressed. No other form of endgame gear guarantees everyone who completes it gets loot. It's just objectively better for gearing up than anything else, which is a problem in game balance.

[@Dr0Damyen]

Delves really help getting better with your class and talent choices. I get the time to experiment, try out and learn. No way I can do that in a dungeon run especially m+. You need to play perfect and have the meta build or you get shamed and blamed.

[@Bruno-pw3ck]

@@daniellucas5522 Nobody is forced to do shit. You do what you choose to do.

[@PaladinReview]

@@daniellucas5522I don’t think delve rewards need to drop. But Mythic + needs to increase its reward level. Outside of getting your BIS items, there’s almost no reason to engage in Mythic + at the moment if you’re a heroic raider. For how agonizing some of the higher keys are the fact that a 7 drops 610 hero is abysmal.

[@grumbledore424]

90% of the game is solo content anyway. I've always just wanted a difficulty somewhere between "autobattler" and "soulsborne." Delves have so far ramped up enough that they fit that goal without having toxic dungeon runners blitz through to the end.

[@ginch6448]

Nicely done as usual. I agree with everyone that said...No toxic people, please. I enjoy Bran telling me to move...it must be the accent....I can not think of anyone that would be a good replacement for Bran. He is the explorer, and he also forgets to move out of the blast zone himself...I like that.

[@ganondorf66]

As an arcane mage it gets annoying fast when he keeps telling my mana is low

[@ginch6448]

@@ganondorf66 Really...well I have not taken my mage through yet, so I will look forward to that. I always forget to watch my mana.

[@scorpogee6280]

@@ganondorf66 Hahahaha! So funny! 😁

[@ganondorf66]

@@ginch6448 he says it when you cast surge, every time

[@ginch6448]

@@ganondorf66 Ahhh, gottcha. I don't have an Arcane Mage, I have frost and fire...should be interesting to see how that goes...

[@rowrowfightthepower9]

the M+ players so salty that people are enjoying delves is hilarious to me. Some people just want to get home and be apart of a world, enjoy the story or ambience, explore, RP, collect, and have -fun-. This is a roleplaying game after all, not an e-sport, and it never will be no matter how hard blizzard pushes it as one.

[@the5gen]

copium setting in for the toxic m+ playerbase

[@Tijuanabill]

I play M+ and I have never heard a single person complain about delves being easy loot. Everyone likes easy loot. This is a game we play, where tribal notions get put forth, that don't really exist in reality.

[@trindleshadowmane2495]

Delve companions are going to be explorers not faction leaders.... thats the whole point of exploration. If we get anyone its going to be someone from the explorers league or maybe someone like Harrison jones

[@gothnate]

I would like to see more puzzles in delves and fewer/less powerful mobs. That would balance it out more for me. Currently, I'm farming 8s like crazy, because they give the highest gear you can get, which can be upgraded further. The difference between an 8 and 9 is significant enough that 9s are too much of a hassle just to save a few tokens for upgrades. I would also like to see a general gear token drop added to delves instead of actual gear drops, because I'm tired of getting trinkets I can't use. I need some gloves, dammit! Either that or have a currency (I know, *puke*) drop from 8s and higher to buy a piece of gear. Limit it to one per week and we goochie.

[@evilgentlemanbane6116]

I for one LOVE the puzzles and mind tricks. I'd love to see like a Harry potter battle chess or something maybe even pet battles for new paths or buffs

[@paso7943]

Imagine having one of your own warbands char as follower in Delve instead of Brann.... or having your own warband char as the follower dungeon.

[@Leucienfireweaver]

So, if, BIG IF, we get what it seems like we'll get, which is the Harronir's home zone + Undermine as a two zone patch, with Undermine also being the raid, and the Root Home being constantly assaulted by goblins harvesting for resources... I could see the storyline adjacent delve companion being Gazlowe, with a bomb throwing DPS spec, and his mech backpack rocking Tank spec.

[@djbedu]

And hopefully that leading to the Tinker class soooooo often asked for.

[@rl1585]

Try to pug tank dungeons is a nightmare being able to just progress solo or non traditional groups is amazing. I want to see the delve endgame fleshed out make zekvirs lair or future equivalent more interesting than just hard boss. Maybe it has a monthly modifier and weekly completion that rewards some gilded crests. Time walk delves could be cool doing events from rpg lore or books would be really ideal for this imo.

[@paso7943]

I would love to see Brann as tank too for those that wants to do it as healer. I know you can do it as healer with Brann as dps. I have done it my self many times. but as you said..... having the option is great. ps. I love Delves. well I don´t like some of them. but in general I love Delves. I love the idea that I´m not forced to do the m+ for gear.

[@scorpogee6280]

I don't like the mushrooms but I still do the delve. I really hate all that jumping around, and since I have 15 alts that can do that delve says a lot. Still I would rather slit my arms then do group stuff. Give me those npcs in the follower dungeons that don't say snarky toxic stuff and I'm happy.

[@paso7943]

@@scorpogee6280 lol... same here... I hate the mushroom delve and the one where you walk in the darkness. Not the candle one, but the one where the whole delve is in darkness. The candle one in my favorite

[@michaeldendulk2230]

​@scorpogee6280 I hate fungal folly, it's the only one I actively avoid. The spider ones are my favourite, they're pretty fast and no need to mess around with side mechanics like candles or air supply.

[@mirandelf]

I reckon new delve companion could be a character like Flynn or Gazlowe who have been gratuitously brought back in TWW. They aren’t a main part of the current story as you mentioned but are well known characters from the past.

[@Ifans13]

Was gonna comment Gazlowe as well since the rumours of more goblin content. Flynn a great shout as well

[@Keyblader001]

Next season's delve companion will for sure just be one of the other explorer's league characters. Reno, Elise, or Sir Finley. They're already right there next to Brann, so he'll probably just switch places with one of them.

[@erickknutz5599]

Just a pedantic comment, but Delves already can reward Gilded, although admittedly it is just a trickle. Even so, I just recently got enough Gilded from delvers maps, to pop my weapon to ilvl623, and may even get enough to fully max it out 6/6 Hero track. Not too shabby from only playing Delves solo.

[@tonyr6180]

You've gotten five maps on the same character?

[@ToadMagic]

@@tonyr6180 i've gotten 6 or 7 on one char, 3-5 on alts

[@erickknutz5599]

@@tonyr6180 i didnt keep count, but because of the number of Runed Crests given, I just assumed it was 2 Gilded per Delve map run. But it's gotta be 2-3 per, since I got 3 on each of my last 2 map runs.

[@michaeldendulk2230]

Always gotten 3 gilded from maps, but map drops are very fickle. Had 3 on my main last reset and 0 so far this reset. I average around 3 delves a day with the time I currently have to play. I believe they worked out you have around 1 in 12 chance for a map, seems plausible l...

[@vdub62387]

I think Brann should have dps, healer and tank options. Help with classes that don't have pets or take hits well.

[@Tijuanabill]

He tanks just fine, if you let him attack for a bit on his own.

[@MazrimCF]

Or have pets that cannot hold aggro i.e. voidwalker

[@GruffGames]

Delves are my favourite part of the expansion, though they should have been just solo from the start, focus all balancing around that. They should be difficult but rewarding, I do want to see a way to get mythic gear/crests from them even if its just the weekly vault. The mythic gear economy was already ruined when the made m+ 5 times easier than mythic raiding, there's no reason to punish the huge number of solo players.

[@DavidCodyPeppers.]

Player: why haven't you joined a guild yet? Me: guild chat.

[@mynameisandycook1]

The other reason is that even IF a person joins a guild... its likely a guild with 700 people, and 10 active players, who already play together without room for another. So that newly joined person can either just leave and go back to pugging, or wait for the next 4 suckers to join the guild and try to form a group... what is the purpose? Its pointless. Guilds ONLY WORK when the people are friends. THAT IS ONLY REAL when they know each other outside of the game. OF course there are exceptions. But not many. Find me a functional and well performing guild group, and at least 3 of them hang out IRL. "Join a guild" is such a stupid STUPID answer.

[@Tijuanabill]

@@mynameisandycook1 I feel sorry for you. I have joined guilds across a 30 year span of playing MMO's, and I always find nice people in them, every time. Sometimes the vibe isn't for me, so I just find another one.

[@mossysnail6857]

i want a block macro option for chat, i wanna NEVER and i mean NEVER see another "JOIN MY GUIILD I'LL TUG YOU GOOD" in my whisper window that i already had to do! I'm a snail, i don't wanna join YOUR GUILD, stop bugging me!

[@Tijuanabill]

@@mossysnail6857 If only there was a box in the settings you could click, to prevent guild invites....

[@rolaensin3219]

So this is how M+ goes for me. I spend about ten minutes finding a group or so and at the first sign of any problems, people just leave quietly or very loudly. Normally trying to blame X&Y player and action, when themselves aren't doing what they need to do.

[@svsv1191]

The worst is when they don't even know/understand what went wrong and blame the wrong person

[@hmmnaptime]

As someone who enjoys keys i think it's fantastic to have a way to gear with delves. Given the nuclear difficultly spike of M+, keys should give higher track heroic gear and gilded crests sooner 7s or 8s

[@yakamoto2381]

The real issue is partially the cap on runed crests being so easy to hit, and then not getting gilded until 9. There's a really big gap in the middle where there's very little incentive to complete because you're not going to realistically get crests. Unless you are doing mythic raids where you can get gilded crests, it's really hard to get to 9 dungeons to get them as a healer or tank.

[@j.a.1785]

The sweats want to ruin it for everyone else.

[@Carlosmgcosta]

Ya, i havent ran a single key this season. And I was, up until now, a mythic plus and heroic raider. Now, thank the fates, we have delves. And my man, other than in guild runs and premades. I have, since the birth of m+, never seen a oug with a party leader who gave any direction.

[@Tijuanabill]

It's just assumed no leadership is necessary in a dungeon.

[@Silentismn]

As a raider that hates M+, the same way M+ crashed raiding when introduced in Legion by giving out the same rewards, Delves shouldn't be nerfed for doing just the same. I don't want to partake in M+ to get gear just to be able to do the content that i enjoy, which is raiding. Let us have our cake, you do M+ and we do Delves.

[@stevenfletcher888]

M+ has been horrendous. Any minor inconvenience and someone is guaranteed to leave.

[@stellarjayatkins4749]

I haven’t had that problem yet. I’ve actually been surprised how many groups I’ve had wipe multiple times and finish even after the timer ran out. 🤷‍♂️

[@Bruno-pw3ck]

@@stellarjayatkins4749 You are special. Blessed. A beacon of hope.

[@Nr4747]

@@stellarjayatkins4749 I've actually had the same positive experience in M+ for the most part.

[@svsv1191]

I don't even mind that, the worst is when people who feel like they are entitled to rewards they or aren't getting yet and or cant' get that they aren't good enough and no one is gonna carry them every run, who are SUPER ANGRY before the run even starts, makes me not wanna play

[@mynameisandycook1]

@@stellarjayatkins4749 What role are you playing? If you say DPS.... rofl.

[@Cooliesftw]

M+ feels like a dried up ocean. The only thing left is salt.

[@Tijuanabill]

You are the source of the salt.

[@jasonmenear1244]

I love Delves. Literally gives me a gearing path I enjoy. Usually i eventually get some decent gear but I always end up relying on time walking raid reward or do 5 dungeons. But delves have kept me interested and playing. Plus now I am gearing up new characters and doing even more per week on multiple characters.

[@PearseNation]

I really don't like needing keys in the first place. I guess it's good that I can stockpile them if I don't want to run anything some weeks, but I'd rather just get my first 4 delves each week giving an extra chest instead. And personally, I'm really not happy with m+ right now. So I'm just delving and raid logging.

[@galencox1531]

The only thing i would wish for Delves are a bit more Crests for finishing them. Maybe 5 instead of 2 although you can get 45 through the vault it would speed up a bit the upgrading of items. New Delves would be great, especially if they would be in the old world and they already mentioned that but i think thats way down the road.. Last point, better trinkets. I know the risk of forcing other content player into delves but the trinkets right now are aweful.

[@Dr0Damyen]

I wouldn’t mind better trinkets focused on open world and delves so they aren’t useful for raid and m+ or less useful.

[@jmarshall3150]

Delves is keeping the people who never wanted to do M+ away, and that's fine. I've done M+ ever since they became available so I could avoid raiding drama, and now I do delves to avoid M+. I'm happy as things are now. I seem to remember people thinking M+ would ruin raiding, and that didn't happen. I think delves are great and should stay as is

[@theyinyang1103]

My personal feeling is not caring that i can’t get each piece to 6/6. Would be nice? Sure, but i wont lose sleep. As long as i can kill hard Zekvir solo, i am happy.

[@enoughisenough3710]

Mythic Plus SHOULD be awesome but content creators and Bilzzard's greed have ruined them. The community is toxic. If you aren't Meta and you didn't feverishly pump up your IO score during the first week you get kicked to the curb. Sure, you can run with your guild on another set schedule like for raids etc. blah, blah, blah but there SHOULD be a Dungeon Finder option for running keys - those that prefer pre-made groups can just keep doing it as is. Why do you think half of chat is for carries for gold? It's because of the toxic community enabled by content creators and their class / spec ratings combined with the biggest culprit - Blizzard and it's desire to sell gold tokens for $20 a pop. Greed always wins the day. If you try to PUG Mythic plus as a DPS you have to allocate about an hour per key by the time you form / get accepted into a group and then run it. Even then don't dare wipe a couple of times or someone will leave the group breaking the key and you have to start the process all over again. So - if you don't have a regular Mythic group to run with getting your 4 keys in (timed or not) will take at least 5-6 hours - maybe longer. Absolutely ridiculous and it's easily THE most frustrating experience in the game. Just give us a 'Mythic Finder" with a min IL per key level and have a big leaver penalty for those who bounce before the timer expires. If someone leaves and we tagged the key for 'completion' let us add a new player to fill that spot. They are already doing this for Heroic Dungeons so we know it can easily be implemented. If you are a 'l33t epeen' player just move along - none of the above applies to or will affect you.

[@Tijuanabill]

I don't really get this mentality. You don't need any score at all, to get invited to a 2. The 2 gives you the score you need, to do a 3, and so on. The score is the proof you can do the key, and if you don't have the score, that's not the fault of others, to just trust that you can do it. Also, you can form your own group as well, and invite whoever you want.

[@mossysnail6857]

@@Tijuanabill i went into the fires of Blackrock mountain, and healed for +4s across the board. IT'S HELL. IT SUCKS I HATE MYTHIC PLUS.

[@Tijuanabill]

@@mossysnail6857 All content is not for all players. I personally don't care for PvP. /shrug

[@Astteroth]

Since start of BFA M+ has been an solo experience for me. As the expansions progressed the communication in pugs has steady decreased. Nowadays I am very happy if get a reply on my hello. The most I hear from the other 4 players in my group is when something goes wrong and the insults start. And this is why I will always choose delves of the toxicity of a pug M+. Therefor in my honest opinion the M+ community has no one else to blame then them self, for the decline of players.

[@minibleau]

Timewalking delves = great idea. but paired with blizz scaling. holy shit it would be terrible

[@mossysnail6857]

if they scale it right that'd be fun. like, a delve involving a prison riot in the stockades! or taking out some random hidden Twilight Cultist cave! or even a cave full of snails who shoot lasers.

[@heavy_elite]

I had a simple +2. It was Grim Batol. I wanted to check out the Dungeon, the Routes, the Mobs and Bosses. There was this one Hunter, I don't know what he played, but instead of helping me kiting (Frost Trap or Oil Trap) he decided to go for his Bomb Trap and we did NOT make the Timer. Everyone else, helped me with kiting, since Blizzard had the GLORIOUS idea to nerf Tank-CDs so hard, that I feel the Differences. Ofcourse, we didn't time it. But no one complaint about it, since it was just a 2 and Grim Batol is definitely the hardest Dungeon this Season. And Mr. Hunter, instead of being polite and thinking, that it was a simple +2, at the end of the Dungeon, decided to blame ME and that I was an Aweful tank, despite the fact, that I did a +4 and a +3 in other dungeons the same week. Timed those even and up-graded those keys with ++. Or instead of that, possibly think, that I may or may not be a Newbie and say, "Hey, you made a few mistakes here and there." he blamingly told me, "Stop Tanking, you are SHIT". While I was sitting there, thinking to myself - "Welp... Thats why I do Solo Level 10 Delves. If I make a MIstake, I can only blame myself but still have fun doing those."

[@jonlane6527]

So my wife wanted to try tanking this season on her druid. And something I quickly realized was how much i take for granted being a long long time player. Tanking is entirely dependent on experience to speed up how quickly you adapt. As a dps player for example pulling more around her defensives is just alien and she struggles with it. I wish the WoW community was more welcoming

[@siddgeir1312]

Tank to tank, your first mistake was listening to the opinion of a hunter 😅❤

[@harkenblitz892]

The problem isn't so much with delves, its that they nerfed m+ rewards too. It was much easier to get to myth level gear in dragonflight. Now with delves, all the lower tier m+ feels pointless.

[@ethandrake5073]

Flynn Fairwind is who I want to join my delves the most, then maybe Elise Starseeker, Meerah, Gazlowe, Naleidea, Aethas

[@mossysnail6857]

FLYNN would FIT so damn well even Shandris!

[@deathblade909]

I like what they did before live . Gave us a week to try out mythic 0 , delves up to level 3 , and heroicnfor nre dungeons . Then release main season patch after

[@Buildonsound]

IMO Reasons to do delves: short, fun, challenging and it is not timed and no need to rush because someone is in a hurry.

[@bob5817]

Delves and ai companion dungeons for the win. Most of us don’t have the time or patience to deal with groups that will just be snobs and dump you if you make a mistake.

[@TAZMASTA40]

I love delves but I HATE everything about brann. I dont complain a lot with this game (almost never actually) Brann constantly throws potions in danger. Ive died so many times cause he throws them near a another pack of mobs or they land somewhere else completely out of position. Also his campsite placement can be placed in dangerous areas. Last night he set up camp in the middle of one of those purple circles in the skittering breach. Something absolutely needs to be done about Branns kit cause its to the point id just prefer to run these things in groups which defeats the purpose of delves.

[@trossity9930]

Idk. The thing I love about Delves is that it feels like we're going full Nathan Drake mode in these new unexplored tombs/crypts/caves. Having outside delves would ruin the charm, same with having old zones. At that point they might as well just be follower dungeons or something. Also I said that Mythics felt bad in preseason when it was just 0s. I ran a Grim Batol and Boralus 0 before season 1 and I've refused to touch mythics since. Havent done a single one. being forced to do basically M+20s to get gilded crests is simply a no from me. I dont care if I can't get the most powerful gear, just let me reliably get to 5/6 hero for the mythic appearance mog.

[@erorpro]

If you can have fun in Mythic +, have fun in M+, i have fun in solo Dewelves. I just need better gear to progress further but i don't care about it. For me M+ has the same problem that it doesn't give something unique to strive for or improve the experience so you what to come back.

[@bladetheman]

m+ is a nightmare, and have been for some expansions. 2500+ for +7 keys. And you need to play a meta class. "Run your key" Dosent work. There is a three step fix tho. 1. A Dungeon finder for m+ ( Like yo must complet a +3 to do a +4 for all dungeons) 2. Remove the timer for the ones that chose to go random que 3. Punish leavers harder/Reward healers and tanks extra for completion

[@mrcaterpillow9926]

You do not need to play meta. I’m playing balance Druid and have 2300 as someone who plays the game casually. If you are blaming your keys for bricking because you aren’t playing a meta class, you are fooling yourself dude.

[@bladetheman]

@@mrcaterpillow9926 The part about the meta class is for the invite not the preformence. But what do you think is most likley, that you or the 90% that hates the m+ community is right?

[@somad6997]

@@mrcaterpillow9926 balance is currently still meta, lmao, brain rot thinking the only meta is the absolute 3 best dps only

[@Permafry42108]

My vote is Monte Gazlowe as a companion. Would be great to see his take where you are working for bilgewater company and goblin style attacks instead of the bran themed attacks and powers;

[@mossysnail6857]

uh sapper charges, can use his island expedition mech suit, maybe a rail gun

[@TheSpartanx9]

Delves have been awesome for me. Coming from a break back in Legion, mythic+ was a way to assist with gearing/grinding AP with the guild for mythic raiding. Now that I come back to a solo route with a toddler in my life, hitting my head against the wall for M+ isn't something that I normally have time for or want to endure. Delves have made this accessible and have kept me going when i'm not worrying about getting timed or throwing a key when a kiddo wants attention once their independence moment is over.

[@speedbump9299]

The one thing that you missed with regards to details about M+ is that its not really the group leader who takes command of the group its the tank. The tank is the one who decides what is pulled and how fast it is pulled. That is what affects the key. The group leader really more so is just there to get people together.

[@JJE2010MO]

Delves are so much more fun than being forced to play with toxic mythic bs.

[@derekhughes3060]

Delves work because you know you are getting gear at the end, why suffer keys for gold and crests

[@lostdrewid]

The next delve companion is very likely to be Gazlowe. Season 2 is slated to be a Goblin-centric patch cycle, with Undermine as the raid, so Gazlowe as our companion before he raises up to take the reins as the goblin racial leader by season 3.

[@briane4975]

I've enjoyed the delves, had challenges and that's ok. I'm a clthy with nearly no interrupts haha but I've learned my limits ATM. Been getting the wife run through and gearing up so that's been fun too.

[@ESPirits87]

Hopefully they don't nerf gear from Delves because if they do they will die out.

[@DtLS]

Something needs to be done, there’s a big discrepancy between the difficulty and reward between Mythic+ and Delves. Mythic+ needs to be giving gilded crests and Mythic tier vault rewards at lower key levels, and maybe even Mythic tier loot at the end of dungeons at the highest reward tier.

[@Werekun]

I've only done raid (with my guild) and devls (solo or friends) , searching for pugs (solo) in mythic+ is impossible for me, I waste so much time waiting... that it was literally replaced by delvs (in solo)

[@hellraizer44]

Follower Delves - make it happen Blizz and also fix the drop rate for reagents in delves. I'm close to abandoning professions because of the drop rates.

[@mossysnail6857]

professions are DEAD man

[@meech9309]

As a possibility for Mythic +/delves, what if the higher level gear were available to delves BUT only as a solo player? Like gear that cannot be looted in groups. If a player is THAT skilled but a loner, access to higher loot might take care of a few issues, such as people that don't like doing superfast PUG runs, people that are fantastic players but can't make it to scheduled guild runs because of IRL obligations, people who enjoy the constant challenge. I'd say it should be a solo track with personal timers (beating your best record for said delve sort of like the M+ counterpart) and an "emergency eject" button that launches you out of the delve but holds your place within the delve when real life interrupts. No time penalty because you're not actually playing. It can even be more fair by porting you to the nearest flight point, so you have to fly back to the delve but it keeps the button from being abused. Make the gear drop chance relatively low compared to M+ and have a daily CD. (IE one Delve on Solo+ per day, locked in when you reach a checkpoint) Getting better gear shouldn't be easier in Solo+, but it keeps people challenged and coming back for more. I don't know. It's just a thought.

[@ozmcsween]

the gearing feels super smooth until you use up all your runed crests, then you need to start to do mythic raid, or +10 keys to progress your gear at all

[@TriciaHowell-qj7ve]

I love delves, I am having a great time and if I need to stop and go do something it's not big deal with the solo option!

[@PeterTeehan]

I need to start pushing Delves, I've been so tunnel vision with Mythic+ I've set aside delves. M+ has been my endgame forever now. A Quality of life change I'd like to see added for Delves is a summoning stone to each one.

[@slash7303]

It takes less then 2 minutes to get to any delv don't be so lazy😂

[@DuoSpear]

​@slash7303 he's one of those lazy asses saying "sum?" and not even attempting to leave capital city 😂

[@steveh7508]

Delves is the dungeon fix we needed

[@Craznar]

I play entirely solo now as I'm not entirely welcome in group content - I'd love to do group content, but without that choice, delves give me some end game to work towards.

[@matthewlawton9241]

I can say, as a fury warrior player with an item level of 602, level 8 delves are iffy. I'm not saying they should be a gimme either, but I still run into lvl 8 delves I can't really complete, which is a huge bummer.

[@hedonismbot3274]

If that is the case try a different spec ? :) i do it all the time.

[@jerbology]

I don’t enjoy doing keys and I never use my own key. But I appreciate the points of opening communication to make runs go smoother as group leader, esp when forming the party can take forever.

[@kasperkenthpetersen4528]

I've been playing quite a bit of M+ and Raids this past year. They can sometimes be very "toxic". I love Delves. Delves is definitely the reason why I haven't stopped playing wow.

[@karolusmagnus3992]

M+ at low key levels is fine, like 2-4 seems to be ok most of the time. However, in 7+, which is what I need now to get any progress, it's absolutely unacceptable and horrid to do with randoms. It takes 20 minutes to find a group as dps, then 20 minutes to go through, someone makes a mistake, people yell and demean and then leave. If I go as a tank, the dps don't interrupt enough, healer can't keep up, healer dies, rages at me for some reason, then leaves. If people would be nice and kind to each other I wouldn't mind failing about half the time, it's just dealing with the toxic players is not ok. I'm going to wait a few more weeks for people to be able to handle 7s and then try again, because right now it's not fun by any means, it's incredibly stressful. If I had enough friends/guildies to play with it would be different, it's really just the toxic pugs that cause the issues. Same issues with pug raiding honestly, never going to do a pug raid again, so tired of people flaming each other for no legitimate reason. Like a guy wipes the raid because he kept dpsing instead of following the mechanics, then blames the group that "the dps was low" then gets so antagonistic that the raid collapses. Just horrible. Never again. Blizzard needs to just ban people who are toxic, that's the reason FF14 has such a good community, they don't put up with the bad actors. I think a lot of this also comes down to the fact that M+ is timed, if it wasn't timed I think it would be less toxic, and less competitive. I've always hated timed group content, it's not a fun mechanic. Maybe add like a prestige mode that's timed, just for show off points, but separate all gameplay benefits from the timer, like the key depleting and getting 1/2 the crests.

[@hedonismbot3274]

Yeah... there is many people who would just like to play with chill friendly people. We need a community for that 😄 unfortunately that also does not seem to work for some reason. Just like getting a daily group with neat people at the same time.

[@ChromaticLion]

I will not put myself into this horrendous grind that is the mythic+ experience. It's horrible, between the spec chaser that straight up refuses you if you are not the good classes AND the good spec because they will not be able to farm it 3 minutes faster and the one who run mythic 0 dungeons with a min ilvel cap of 610, it's just not fun, it's just wasted time refreshing the group finder for hours just to get refused again and again

[@jamesmcmillan7845]

Love it when Bran jumps back into another pack of mobs, lol.

[@RazerGold23]

My hope would be that since it’s easier to gear with Delves there would be a larger player base of 619 geared characters to pug the first few raid bosses on Mythic every week to get gilded crest and mythic gear drops.

[@Dr0Damyen]

Besides my earlier remarks I have a few more. I don’t like the rushing part from M+, I would like to try a variant without timer. For me a raid is too long. I did raid in FFXIV and liked it. If I would be able to queue the HC raid per boss, I would try it. If those options will cause to much disruption I really hope they will keep improving delves.

[@manicmonarch2608]

I want Arathor, son Alleria and Turalyon as delve companion. The fact that he hasn't re emerged into the story is criminal.

[@TheDoodoomilk]

Blizzard really saw S3 of Dragonflight completed M+ runs and went "we dont like this"

[@micheljr.beaudry21]

With my newborn taking a lot of my attention, Delves is so perfect for me. I don’t have the time nor the energy to learn all the Mythic + mechanics.

[@tomdoyle4198]

Delves capping out is perfect, players just doing delves don't need the very highest level - remember that delves is for casuals like me, mythic + and raid is better gear but is also required for harder content - delves as a delve fearing system doesn't need to be the same as other paths

[@fatherdameo6876]

As someone who really loves delves, and plan on getting a good amount of my gear through it. I still won’t jump into a higher mythic keys until I have learned the mechanics. Overall really happy with this season’s pve endgame. I pushed a little mythic for the first time in dragonflight season 1, but I think delves will help me get a little boost that I need to make sure I can perform well enough and not get flamed in group content.

[@leonardceres9061]

Right now, I find Delves to be in a funny spot. It’s fairly easy after you hit level 80 to get a character around 580 item level. You do a couple rounds of world quests maybe run a couple hero dungeons. But to upgrade your gear from there, you are going to have to put in quite a bit of work. Pretty much nobody wants to run anything under tier 8 even if you solo a six or seven, which is what you would be about power level wise those gear drops Won’t give you any real upgrade. You need to do tier 8, but currently that’s tuned for 600 item level plus. I did one at 580 and it was a slog. I died at one point at least five times. ZEK kept killing me and I was in a tank spec as a bear druid so my character can definitely take a hit, but there was so much going on. By the time I cleared it, I was in no hurry to jump back in to the fray. So my Takeaway is this the gear from lower tier levels should be higher to incentivize farming. Because right now I need at least the veteran quality 580+ or it’s not even worth it for me to take the time to try and get the item. I also feel like each one should give something like $400 valorstones because doing five feels like something I should be getting paid for and by the time I’m done with all five I should be at my cap then I can go play a different character because sticking to one character is boring AF. But I feel like I am forced to stay on one character longer than I want to because I need to farm the currency to upgrade my gear.

[@akunomatata7897]

only real way to do this is to do away with bountiful delves/coffer keys entirely, which i support

[@leonardceres9061]

@@akunomatata7897 yeah I mean it’s like I said before they are in a very funny spot right now. Like I am literally running around on my characters farming for hours just to upgrade my gear to a point where I am strong enough that the tier 8 are easy to farm. But by the time I get strong enough, the gear drops from the tier 8 won’t really be that relevant to me anymore. So right now it just feels like I’m running on a hamster wheel.

[@michaeldendulk2230]

Depends on class, I guess. Did my first tier 8 on my DH last night, at 584 ilevel. Did die 3 times due to stupidity (love that I can only blame myself), but did finish it with bountiful coffer in the end. It wasn't a walk in the park, but an enjoyable challenge, as it should be. Just a shame rewards cap out at tier 8, would love to see a difficulty tier with rewards at hc raiding level with better access to runed and gilded crests (though not as generously as raiding, of course)

[@stakkadakka3427]

Turns out Pugging your way to 2k rating is hard... It's made for organised groups. You're not going to pug a Heroic raid very successfully. Delves are great the way they are, no need to changes, Just add more and change seasonal rewards. A single peice of 616 gear a week is NOT an issue. Mythic + players need to find a good group of people to get to higher keys, same as always.

[@the5gen]

Delves is a great addition, now that I work odd hrs - can get home, do two-three runs over the hour then go to sleep.

[@Arvalia85]

Next delve companion will likely be someone from the Explorers' League. I don't see anyone outside of that being a follower for it. There's certainly plenty to pick from. With Brann being a healer/DPS companion with some tanking capabilities, I can see the next one being a tank/DPS one. Sir Finley Mrrgglton is a paladin technically and could be a tank/DPS that throws out the odd heal making him similar to Brann. Reno Jackson could also be a DPS/tank with some healing (if a hunter can heal, so can a mage). Elise Starseeker could be another DPS/healer option. Past that, they could even make Magni the next delve companion unless he's doing something else. Moira and Dagran are also certainly options, especially with him playing a part in the titan bi-weekly quest chain we seem to be getting currently. Guess the question is if the delve companions will be Bronzebeards at least for the rest of TWW or if they'll remain Explorers' League. Next expansion, I can see picking a variety of people in Quel'thalas/Lordaeron/Gilneas as companions. TLT will likely include people in Northrend we're already familiar with like a druid from D.E.H.T.A., maybe Hemet Nesingwary Jr, or a member of the Argent Crusade or Ebon Blade. Would be nice if we had more than one companion to pick from or at least 2. One that can do tank/DPS and one that can do heal/DPS. Just have the two share xp pools so you don't feel punished for picking the "wrong" one or for trying to level an alt using the other companion. Otherwise, the companions should probably do all 3 roles from the start. Brann can tank to a point, especially once he gets to higher levels, but he had to get that far first.

[@IMZAMORAK]

I was thinking t11 could drop 2 gilded crests. and a chance at a t11 delvers bounty map that give myth track. This would require t11 delves stay hard and not get the nerf bat like delves have gotten so far. and these drop only if your alone in delves

[@mr_yoru5834]

Delves are in a great place after all the adjustments. I'm so glad to have a viable path for progression that doesn't make me rush on a timer or anything similar. Higher tier delves offer a decent challenge where a higher ilevel does make things easier but I still have to play smart and avoid stuff to avoid death. I feel like the naysayers are people obsessed with the gear grind and people who insist that you have to get to tier 8 asap for efficiency rather than following a more logical progression that allows people to learn fights and mechanics. The gear should only really be about helping us play the game, but it has become the whole end goal for a lot of players.

[@thejustinriosshow]

That’s an ideal way to look at it. But 9 times out of 10 when you ask in chat if anyone needs an explanation you’ll get no response or if you try to get people to join voice they’ll just say “it’s just a 5 STFU and go we don’t need comms”

[@The_Bacon_Dragon]

When you brought up Rexxar, that had me thinking back to the Founding of Durotar and if we would see Chen Stormstout since Rokhan represents the Trolls now. If they were going to bring in Chen though then that would have been a better tie in with Brewfest.

[@noahmellemstrand4756]

For new companions, I would love to see Magni become one, Faerin, Orwena, Gazlowe could be fun

[@ajamesrichards]

The best way to fix this game is to stop dropping gear from activities and drop tokens/currency from every activity, capped per character at an amount that equals 4 pieces a week (about a month to get a full set of that IL) and require a full set of each tier before you can purchase the next one. The tokens/currency is traded at a NPC for gear or used in crafting so you can guarantee your secondary stat, thus choosing betting stats and maybe a set bonus for extra bonus effects from the NPCs that changes up how the class/spec is played. This way no content is “required” and anything you do will feel rewarding. The highest IL you can achieve is based on the highest difficulty you can clear, mythic +, raids, delves, all can reward the same tier brackets based on the difficulty. The lowest difficulty should offer a high enough IL needed to do the campaign, thus letting everyone experience the story and only “require” doing the activities on a harder difficulty if you want a higher IL to make your solo campaign faster, or to challenge yourself. The tiers would still have the color variants to easily tell who can clear harder content. Then have the same upgrade system to where if people want to do more activities each week to upgrade their gear they can push into the higher tiers faster. If a season lasts 4 months I should be able to hit max IL I care to in a month so that I can do this on 3 or 4 classes. Could also add new vendors or crafting recipes throughout the season that offer different set bonuses that change up the class. And pull from the pandaria event and give us gems for different abilities/skills that change up the gameplay

[@prosansmeta8662]

Oh my gosh, M+ this season is a nightmare full of, sorry to have to say this, noobs. They have 610 ilvl, apparently cleared a +4, but have no idea what the mechanics are, no idea that hidden buffs exist, no idea of any strategy, and often fail to use defensives that would save them. I don't know if delves are fully to blame, but delves have allowed bad players to get good gear and that is a problem. I'd sooner think that delves should have delve-specific gear, like how pvp does, that can find it's use in M+ but it'd be a red flag when inviting someone.

[@YumYum820]

M+ is a overly complicated mess. Mobs don't need 4+ attacks/spells. It makes sense if that's how they want mobs to play but then get rid of the timer and make dungeons more strategic like in the past, cc and kill one mob at a time. Blizz has two incompatible philosophies with m+, nuke mobs while controlling and cc. If they did one or the other then cool but trying both is why keys get busted so easily.

[@benderWestlund]

BTW your Zekvir guide video is awesome!!!

[@thegreattuna7187]

I took my fresh 80 hunter to the ah to get to 551, then tried to join T8 delve groups. I was completely denied, so I ran 5 today solo. I'm now 582 ilvl. All bountiful today.