Is Caesar a Stun Character? - Caeser vs Qingyi STUN SHOWDOWN

[@nakfr0g]

Showcase on TTS comparisons between the rest of the stun characters can be found here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nl7OnoyIqZZll5Y

[@gestily]

Caesars chest is like a whole head of qingyi

[@eurekadiaz3771]

that's what proper lady looks like, dis is why proper nutrition is far superior than scammy skin care product in every way possible

[@Eikon_FF]

what the fuck

[@sonicshark123]

Thats the tasty part

[@eurekadiaz3771]

Whoa I cant believe my comment got deleted. i said "that's what proper lady looks like, proper nutrition wins over scammy skincare products in every way possible".

[@eongarica2960]

TF.. I instantly agreed the moment i saw the comment😂

[@nonsenseraiwaja7209]

Thanks for the video, you're the only CC that do test run like this. I don't understand why other CCs that have access to test server will just read skill text and call it a day without doing any actual showcase or comparison.

[@Luftgitarrenprofi]

Because opinion pieces still farm clicks and are 10 times faster to record compared to the scientific approach. That's why I appreciate this kind of content. Wish more people would so it'd be normalized and we'd also have even more accurate numbers due to the community effort

[@justjuniorjaw]

Because it's harder to do with very little benefit to views. Us learning the tidbits and details are hardcore players, casuals wouldn't care about this information.

[@trinitok]

Thank you so much for making this video! A lot of people comparing Caesar to other Support Characters but none of them compare her to other Stunners. 😅

[@catoblepas8697]

its the contrary, most of people are comparing her with stunners

[@Rayhaku808]

@@catoblepas8697people are talking about it. But nobody showcased it. The most we’ve gotten are just numbers. It’s great to finally see some practical comparisons.

[@undom4151]

Out of all these early access videos, yours brought something that wasn't just a review of her kit (which let's be honest, any amount of Google-Fu™ can accomplish.) Thank you for putting out this comparison. It'd be great to see how Caesar fits into an Ellen team - and whether she's a better replacement for Lycaon, or Soukaku. I really hate how awkward Soukaku plays, and Caesar seems like a really nice replacement.

[@screechingsergal5012]

I could be wrong, but doesn't Lycoan buff Ice Damage? I guess you could replace Soukaku, but if you're running both Lycoan and Ceasar on the same team, you'd have two stuns with one Crit focused unit.

[@SlaylaHarley]

Not necessarily, Caesar gives the same 1000 ATK buff as a 3-Vortex Soukaku, a very powerful interruption-resistant shield, and a basically free 25% DMG RES Debuff against all enemies in Ellen's range, all with very little field-time at C0. Comparitively, Soukaku needs a very long field time to stack her Vortex, she needs to consume all 3 Vortex stacks for her 20% Ice DMG buff, and needs her M4 for 10% Ice RES Shred. So yeah, basically running 2 Stun units aside, Caesar offers very similar buffs while taking less field-time and her shield.

[@undom4151]

@@SlaylaHarley I think bottom line is that Caesar can substitute in for any missing team member for popular teams and perform very close to BiS units, or even better depending on a player's preference for comfort. She just seems so easy to use, and let's not underestimate that her buffs are so easy to enable in both application and uptime. But honestly, this should be expected - she's an S rank agent. Which isn't to say Soukaku is bad (She really helped carry my Ellen team, but her flaws got more and more annoying as time has gone on), but A-ranks are usually designed to have hiccups in their kit to make the S ranks stand out. Soukaku's value is that most players can build her and she isn't going to cost you pulls. And if you have an Ellen, you probably have mindscapes for that blue gremlin. Umm, so TLDR, I agree. >_>

[@jimmyjims3245]

ofc Caesar will be better than Lycaon and Soukaku

[@lemon68439]

Few things to consider: * This test is with Caesar's signature weapon which gives her Impact & extra daze, no other f2p def weapon has this. I imagine M0 Caesar vs M0 Qingyi widens the gap a bit more * test is with Caesar at max energy, allowing for many parry counters, but what about the rest of fight? how long to get that second stun without energy? * At 6:35 , they clearly wait to trigger the stun instead of using the EX special right after the enhanced basic * Here Caesar is running Shockstar disco 4pc instead of the new disc set, Proto Punk, which I think most people will run with for the dmg bonus

[@ch1dd]

When all of your "few things to consider" are about caesar, it's time to stop

[@Gameb235]

qingyi's strongest defender

[@lemon68439]

@@Gameb235 skipper's cope, will do anything to undermine a character they skipped. And I will still pull for Caesar, but the powercreep qingyi comments are pure cope over a 1 second difference in a flawed test

[@zerk343]

​@@lemon68439 i think you're the one coping

[@Ghorbad]

All your points are valid in my opinion, except the set thing : it doesn't have much of an impact on Caesar, since she's maintly building daze with her counter (which I think isn't included). But yeah, overall, it's not as easy as it's showed. I'd also add that you do lose parry points when using the counter, which might be an issue depending on the enemies. And most important issue in my opinion : Caesar will have a way harder time dealing with mobs when there is no boss, because you'll have to wait for them to attack you to start dealing good damage, while Qingyi and other stunners can just go full potential from the start. It's nice to see Caesar can be that good at stunning, and that you can also play her off field and just call her to parry (allowing your DPS to deal more damage), but she's got her own downsides.

[@toga2499]

you could've just went straight into an ex there with qingyi at 6:35

[@stellar4893]

Skill issue

[@moonstar4235]

Yes. The ones where Caesar stuns faster are enemies that encourages parry so any normal player would switch to Nicole to parry instead of just staying at Qingyi.

[@Hhhh22222-w]

We comparing pure stun

[@gervoh]

@@Hhhh22222-w Qingyi's EX allowed her to instantly go into AoE combo as well as daze by itself, it adds to showcases of speed

[@lol101ioi]

he has been using the ex skill of both characters for showcase. And he forgets to use Qing Yi skill almost all the time. And he trying to prove a point that caesar is slightly better

[@tomiturner5523]

Great video and thanks for the side by side showcase. Just wanted to say that with Qingyi if you stayed in the electric field a bit longer you can make sure her hold basic attack will stun instead of leaving the daze meter between 90-100 thus resulting in faster stun time!

[@forcodingg1287]

I mean, Qingyi main selling point is not really how fast she is Stun. But more on The Stun Multiplier She is offer. Caesar Buff is Definetly Great, But it's totally depends on the Comps, For example Zhu yuan do not Cared about attacking enemy before Stun Too fast stun an Enemy will lead You have less Decibel and Energy in that Stun window. You will not have enough Decibels for Ult in that Rotation. MrPokke has really good point that Faster Stun is not that Great.

[@leedevee]

Which makes her a badly designed unit, imo, especially this early into the game. Here’s a stunner who takes longer to stun than a free A-Rank. Sure she does some damage and gives some damage amp. Just dumb, sorry..

[@forcodingg1287]

@@leedevee She is not Slower than Anby Lol. Especially In real game scenario, anby dodges basically make Her combo restart. Qingyi in other hand does not has that Problem, she can continue to Spam basic atk (forgot what it call) I give you benefit the Doubt that you watch Anby vs Qingyi Comparison before the Final Buff and Dont have Qingyi. Because Currently, Rn Qingyi is The Fastest Stunner Especially in real game scenario. Feel free to prove me wrong with Real data (not feelcrafting or beta product)

[@meguillozebern8806]

@@leedevee It still depends on the enemy. Sure she may stun a little bit longer but that is a huge damage multiplier during stun. If she could stun quickly like Koleda, then that is just a badly balance char. All the other stunners became less desirable. Also, Qingyi boost attackers like Zhu yuan because Zhu yuan wants damage boost during stun. In this case, Zhu yuan plus qingyi is a superb duo.

[@jijidu69]

@@leedevee Anby is straight up worthless against dudes like Razor who don't stop attacking.

[@miuiruma273]

@@forcodingg1287 i have build level 50: Qingyi, Koleda and Anby, and the worst is the burger girl

[@Syahburei]

Caesar relies on her enemies being hyper aggressive. I'd say once the difficulty amps up and they bring in 2 mini bosses /bosses at the same time on a regular basis for shiyu defense or in other modes, shes going to be a valuable asset in a team.

[@rizlosamtelaire9271]

Agree. On higher difficulty, enemies attack often. Caesar is leagues better than Qingyi which why I skipped her. Caesar can do fast stun time, do shield and anti interruptions and 1000 attack. Caesar is crack not only for my Zhu Yuan but any other future characters, lookin at Lighter. Lighter, Caesar and Lucy will be a heck of a team.

[@revo5124]

​This doesn't make sense since caesar full kit wasnt announced when qinqi was out. So you didn't skip qinyi because of caesar​@@rizlosamtelaire9271

[@gervoh]

@@rizlosamtelaire9271 Hardly "leagues" better, Qingyi's massive damage multiplier on stun as well as highest stunner damage adds to the entire run, we'll see if it more than Caesar buff in the future Qingyi is also not a burst stunner, as pointed out in the video

[@sirrah2458]

​@@rizlosamtelaire9271 This is so wrong and pure copium. I'm s1 who will be pulling Caesar and her weapon who also has Qingyi and her weapon and I will tell you now that Qingyi is a better stun unit for burst dps. Caesar is built as a burst stunner for onfield dps. They Both have their niches and they do not compete with eachother for the same archetype. So to sum it up. Caesar is a burst stunner for onfield dps. Qingyi is an onfield stunner for burst dps. For Yuan teams Qingyi will still be better. The only caveat to this is if you have Yuan at c1 where she can refill her ammo more often and gain more value out of being onfield for longer. However you still want to operate yuan inside stun windows and so I don't think this is the right way to play Yuan.

[@BabyBeary]

The thing is you don't want to stun TOO FAST with Qingyi to properly apply 20 stacks of debuff on the enemy. With Qingyi you can one shot Niveneh once it's stunned and skip annoying boss phases. Ceasar might be able to do the same with her 1000 ATK buff but that remains to be seen.

[@fimas8583]

so in short, ceasar has a smaller damage buff with a longer uptime, while qingyi should have a higher damage buff but only on the stun window. Qingyi is better for burst teams that do alot of damage in a short amount of time

[@char1194]

One test I wanna see is how they compare with their best 4* w-engine options, since defense doesnt have any 4* impact engines to my knowledge. As a f2p that doesnt plan on rolling her w engine im a little worried on that front. Also itd be nice to see how they compare at like half or empty skill meter to simulate multiple waves of enemies or a second stun cycle.

[@CyrilCommando]

Yeah ngl I'm kinda sick of him only testing signature. Not everyone has that kinda money. It makes a gigantic difference.

[@nerio1227]

​@@CyrilCommando I wouldn't even spend money on limited wengines to be honest. Makes the game way too easy considering those are really powerful to bait wishing. A rank ones are enough to clear anything and makes you try playing skillfully in time challenges. Would rather spent on characters for different playstyles.

[@Alecajuice]

Original Transmorpher is a craftable defense A rank that gives Impact in its additional ability. Her best F2P option will be this at R5

[@ch1dd]

@@CyrilCommando This is for the character comparison, not your account's comparison. Do you really think the difference between having both on some generic engine will matter more than comparing with signature when they're "complete"? because it doesn't. They'll be weaker in your account either way, this is the right way to test.

[@CodeJazper]

​​@@Alecajuice It's definitely good but I wouldn't say it would be her best. She scales in base stats, stats you gain in combat I don't think adds to her shield. While yes it can increase her daze, but that's about it. I just recommend putting a stun engine on her if you don't have her signature. The effects won't work but the stats still will.

[@squallionheart14]

Not really a fair test. Your starting Each fight With Ceasar energy at max. That's not going to happen at the start of the fight. So you're going to use her defensive assist in combination with her ex skill to charge stun like Ben.

[@fabian.874]

Not just that the tests starts with max energy, it's also unlimited energy. I was previously subbed to this channel, but this test made me unsub. Not sure what the purpose of this test is. The test doesn't reflect real-world conditions, Caesar's loadout is weird, etc.

[@Toonlink003]

@@fabian.874 its not unlimited energy, you can see energy being used. keep in mind that some ex follow up don't cost energy, so you may be confused on that

[@fabian.874]

@@Toonlink003 Ah, you’re right. Probably also got confused by the dodge counters, as they look similar to the special attack.

[@huynh4128]

At 6:53 you staggered basic attacks prior to using EX and even overflowed the daze bar so she was stuck in animation prior to getting the stun. This would've been dead even here.

[@charms7232]

I think it would be more realistic to start fights with half Energy since this is how much we start with in Shiyu defense runs. Some of these tests also had misplays but in the end both of them are good stunners with supportive buffs anyway. Good luck to anyone pulling in 1.2 🙏

[@Eclin]

Probably only matters in longer fights and/or multiple targets, but it seems like she mostly uses energy for her biggest daze damage. So perhaps she’ll stun a little bit slower at the second time she has to stun if she ran out of energy. Tbh she looks closer to Koleda in that regard, and she gets better the more aggressive the enemy is. and her buff is more geared towards constant dps like Ellen or Billy, Qinyi is only good for burst damage dealer like Zhuyuan or Corin imo.

[@WhiteTrashDiva]

M1 changes all that.. beats Lycaon with Ellen then too

[@Eclin]

@@WhiteTrashDivai don’t compare mindscape lol

[@oscara8454]

​@@WhiteTrashDivathat's good for investment. But it's a pretty steep price to be better than a standard stuner.

[@WhiteTrashDiva]

@@oscara8454 Even for jane teams, the best performane have been with Qingyi . . ups the total damage between 30 to 50% . . That Stun damage multiplier is just that good. . and Caesar doesn't have that. So having Qingyi M1 gives around 30% less time to stun and get that lovely Stun damage multiplier. Arguably the best mindscape so far overall.

[@zeroconduction]

I came into this video thinking a certain way about it, and left the video thinking the same... because you literally said everything I was thinking. It's certainly valuable information for those that may not have more intricate knowledge about the game.

[@meusao]

Thanks man, you videos always help us a lot.

[@jepoy1983]

Just wanted to point out that holding Qing Yi's E will do a longer version of her usual empowered E with more i-frames while inflicting daze on test 2, which should be a more fair comparison.

[@Inmediostatvirtuss]

yea, they also kinda nerfed qingyi for doing solos since she gets from her core passive an additional 20% daze on her attacks when paired with an atk unit

[@Hhhh22222-w]

She'd still stun slower than Caesar if that's the case, Caesar you can stun just as fast if not a bit slower and don't have to worry about getting interrupted or damaged

[@LadyYunalesca]

You’re the only one that puts real effort into these showcases and answer the real questions other cc are too lazy to show because they want to content farm. Thank you

[@Taunt69]

It's amazing that we got a powercrip through the update lol. Caesar doesn't have to be on the field all the time. She performs a defense assist + enhanced skill for 20 energy, and leaves the field, allowing any onfield dd to deal damage. at the same time, its amplifications are almost like Qingyi's, but they act all the time and even in stun. I'm already silent that Caesar provides the most comfortable gameplay with a huge shield and resistance to interruption

[@Kain79]

Thank u for the informative video! Can’t wait to get Caesar, her play style looks so fun!

[@reed3863]

Good comparison video. Tho some things may be optimised, the point still gets across; Caesar is an amazing all rounder character.

[@CombatPandaZenlessZoneZero]

IVE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS! Legend

[@KoNekoNoUta]

Been waiting for your data analysis! Your last Jane team video helps me a lot. Thank you!

[@chrisdomingo4772]

shoudnt there also be a test where they start with no energy?

[@x_k1ngst3r_x63]

Qingyi would easily win that lmao

[@Terra028C]

Thank you, I needed a video like this. You should compare the damage increase from Caesar to other units.

[@CombatPandaZenlessZoneZero]

She exceeds every unit except Qing Yi in a stun window. Source: Trust me Bro. Nah I've done the calcs, they could be wrong but across several DPS Caesar has come out on top of all the supports and all the stuns except QY in stun window when assessing JUST their buffs, its hard to assess the value of the more consistent stuns of a unit vs buffs because all the enemies have different daze bars and you can see from Nakfrogs last video comparing the TTS when Qingyi came out that each stunner stuns each enemy at different rates

[@x0999]

It's only been a few months since Qingyi has been hit by power creep, which is really sad 😂

[@tourist2222]

Thank you for this! This was super interesting!

[@Dakotaaj12]

Sub earned here, im loving the way you do videos.

[@GAMERMON_channel]

Caesar's rack is glories y'all

[@malapias]

Great video. I think Ceasar is clsoer to Koleda - a burst stun character that you swap in and out quickly to let your dps ahve more field time.

[@stefssj1291]

Another great video as expected

[@gustavod.4795]

I get spammed with zzz videos from other creators but yours is the one I look forward to. Quick, concise, with testing and comparison proof. Excellent work.

[@lama8984]

After testing her out in actual combat i find the comparison kinda dishonest. She is a pretty good stunner but you will not start off most fights with that amount of energy to just spam a bunch of Ex parry back to back, qingyi is way more reliable in that regard

[@Nevaryedits]

Already have qingyi and going to pull king

[@SpenceSession]

Awesome video. I like how direct and informative it is. Take my like and sub~

[@alb7466]

Would have liked to see you use different weapons as well. While Qingyi can easily use something like Steam Oven to good effect, Caesar's weapon options are frankly awful for what she wants to do

[@nakfr0g]

I have another video that breaks down Caesar's alternative weapon choices and if looking at it purely from a TTS perspective then they're actually not too bad. It's about a 15% reduction in stun application with an A-rank stun engine compared to her signature. The gap starts to widen when you factor in the additional 1k shields and 18% damage buff though.

[@alb7466]

@@nakfr0g Interesting. What about the tests starting off with max energy, which is not only unrealistic, but would comparatively benefit Caesar more than Qingyi? Or Caesar using 4pc Shockstar Disco, when 4pc Proto Punk looks to be more up her alley?

[@nakfr0g]

@@alb7466 I think most people skipped over my main point that i pushed during the video and that was that there is not winner and loser here, but the fact that they are pretty much equal in TTS by a factor of like 2 seconds. Let's say it went Qingyi's way and she got a whole 4 seconds improvement, now thats -2 to Caesar. A 2 second differential when comparing a defence character to a premier stun character is very little. And that is my point, its just surprising how well she performs in a role that is outside of her specialty. I'm not secretly trying to shill for Caesar or anything.

[@alb7466]

@@nakfr0gI'm not necessarily skipping over your main point, I just don't think the way said point was reached is entirely valid. Starting off with max energy and being able to use many counters in a short span of time is not something you will encounter in normal gameplay, and because said counters are where Caesar's Daze mainly comes from, it results in her numbers being inflated. Your point of Caesar being surprisingly good as a stunner when she doesn't have that role is fair, but I just think the circumstances in the video don't fit those of the average gameplay experience and thus, whether intended or not, could give people the wrong impression about how close the gap would really be.

[@lelegoyeng]

this vid really need the spirit in all around the world to complete.. thanks a lot mr.nak for the experiment you done here, great information like always

[@lelegoyeng]

but im wondering, what about caesar without sig and qingyi without signature aswell? pulling caesar signature quite expensive just for her can actively become stunner aswell

[@so-toa9758]

@@lelegoyeng The craftable defense w-engine with HP stats and Impact passive should be a decent alternative. At max phase, it gives 16% combat impact if Caesar gets attacked (that includes parrying). Combat impact works similarly to combat attack so that 16% should be effectively higher than giving her a stunner w-engine which has maximum 18% Impact at lvl 60.

[@bjornnilsson2941]

Thanks for this interesting showcase! I do wonder if this stays the same when they are not allowed their signature W-engines? IIRC Caesar's one is stun focused but there aren't any A-ranks that are right? Still that is super impressive and I can see why some people say Caesar is a must pull. I think it depends on your account but she could allow me to use my Ellen again since I don't have a proper way to stun for her at the moment... But going for Caesar will put Burnice in the awkward position of me possibly not having enough polychrome to get her 😭

[@TerraTheWise]

Yep. I absolutely love them already pushing out a completely broken overtuned mess of a character stepping on the toes of already pre-existing roles of multiple characters that literally just came out. Why in gods name would a defense unit stun faster than an actual stunner? Why even have stun as a role at all if this is how they’re going to handle this? Everyone was calling Caesar broken in beta and they decided to leave her basically untouched. Insanely huge shield, huge attack buff, damage buff, grouping, fast stuns, interruption resistance, she literally does everything lmao. Anyway, this clearly shows that they are not scared to power creep in this game at all. That or Caesar is a one off mistake that doesn’t happen again but I doubt it.

[@orcsbase]

at 4:14 should use charge ex skill,not basic attack

[@bestkingu]

I'm already hype for Caesar, now I'M HYPER... if that makes sense

[@ZHibiki]

If I'm being honest, I think that if u used the EX instead of the second dodge counter in test 2 you would've actually stunned the Fabuati faster with Qingyi

[@marclenraymagdaraog691]

The only thing separating stunners from defenders is Stun multiplier... which is pretty insane dmg multiplier.

[@DTolen]

Zhu Yuan and Qinyi are going to be long, LOOOOOONG lasting characters, if they are not on the top now, they'll be soon. Hoyoverse allways releases chinese oriented characters early on their games, and provides them with supports and equipment to stay relevant in the meta. They do this not only because those characters represent their country, but also because the chinese government reward chinese companies when they promote their culture to the rest of the world. If you pulled for Qinyi, and you are now regretting not waiting for Caesar, let me tell you that Qingyi have a bigger pull value on the long term

[@adyantotrinugroho4469]

Not really. Xiao and ganyu got beaten fast in genshin. The Chinese character is gonna be good point is not a good argument. Oh and also jingyuan in HSR.

[@DTolen]

@@adyantotrinugroho4469 Xiao is just underrated, and he has gotten 2 dedicated supports so far: Faruzan, and Xianyun. They left the wanderer to die, but they made their efforts to keep Xiao viable. Also Ganyu is not a bad character, the cryo element is the one being constantly nerfed. Permafrost is the strongest team in the game so far, and Ganyu is best team slot, but they nerfed permafrost teams by sending unfreezable opponents in the abyss, because they need to sell characters, and everyone haves an Ayaka

[@adyantotrinugroho4469]

@@DTolen My issue is with the argument of 'Chinese character will be good' which in my opinion not true. While I admit both are viable I would argue Xiao is in life support as he require heavy investment to make him competitive. Other options are way easier to make work. I believe we should assess a character based on its role and function instead of where it came from. Going back to zenless, while I agree qingyi could last longer due to her supportive nature, I think zhu yuan' risk of irrelevance is quite high because she has the worse role. Restricted dps. A significant portion of her damage is only available when the enemy is stunned. What if there are enemy's that's hard to stun or recover quickly? Or an OP support that doesn't buff her playstyle? She's nice to play for now but I have doubt for her relevance in the future.

[@Nitsu96]

Great Video!

[@mebite839]

Caesar vs Lycaon/Koleda would be a bit more practical as those two are not guaranteed and probably a lot of people are looking for alternatives.

[@stuartjohns9918]

Yes please. Thinking about pulling Caesar for my M2 Ellen as I still have not gotten Lycaon or Koleda.

[@nakfr0g]

I have a stun showdown with Qingyi vs Lycaon vs Koleda vs Anby here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nl7OnoyIqZZll5Y So with a comparison of Caesar vs Qingyi, you can extrapolate it to the rest of the stun characters using that video.

[@happyfat4620]

​@@nakfr0gWasn't Qingyi buffed in between final beta and release though?

[@JoomBow]

@@happyfat4620 She was and like nobody updated their videos to reflect this so misinformation saying Qingyi is not much better than Anby still spreads.

[@embuo]

Caesar vs Qingyi: 😐 Use them both: 🗿

[@specter21_96]

I noticed you misuse Qingyi's ex special alot, and why are these test being run with unlimited energy early on? Isnt that unrealistic?

[@nakfr0g]

They start on full energy, but it’s not unlimited energy. I was slow on some of the EX specials so just take off half a second, the point that i express in the video multiple times is that Caesar and Qingyi stun at the same rate, so plus minus 1-2 seconds across any of he results still has this statement ring true.

[@BurnettGaming]

I think this test shows that they actually did a pretty solid job balancing here. I was worried that the fact that Caesar has really good stun capability AND a shield AND a massive attack buff was gonna mean that she was gonna powercreep a bunch of shit that came before her, including Qingyi, but it looks like both have their place. I have a Qingyi so I feel comfortable skipping this one in favor of Burnice later.

[@Zelphyn]

I appreciate your extra effort in this. Other cc just basing it on mostly theory which is pretty unreliable.

[@ThyBr0]

Hope to see guide video soon when she’s out!

[@specter21_96]

Wouldnt skipping Qingyi's pole strikes into the final hit as perfect parry be faster then going through all the hits?

[@Jinrai_]

Thanks! would also love a (quick) stun comparison to Lycaon, as I haven't gotten him yet and might wanna change my standard guarantee if Caesar is similarly good for Ellen.

[@CaCtuSnyan]

While Lyacon most likely stuns a lot faster, in many ways Caesar might be an upgrade because Ellen isn't a burst DPS like Zhu Yuan, meaning she relies less on the stun window. She also gains interruption resistance that allows her to do her combos more freely. Lyacon does provide a nice ice res shred though, so I guess depending on the enemies they both have their pros and cons

[@catoblepas8697]

​@@CaCtuSnyan Using your argument that Ellen benefits more of fast allies rotation to maintain her dps, switching Soukaku for Caesar instead of Lycaon make a lot of more sense considering how much time waste soukaku uses on field while Lycaon you can activate his buffs very fast. But Ellen/Caesar/M1 Rina is aswell a good option

[@CaCtuSnyan]

@@catoblepas8697 I agree, Soukaku takes too much field time and 2000atk might be a bit too saturated

[@CombatPandaZenlessZoneZero]

@@CaCtuSnyan 25% ice res shred Vs Caesars 25% vulnerability. The 1k attack buff exceeds the 35% extra stun damage so it all comes down to A. personal damage and B. How many extra stuns (if any) Lycaon pulls off as he's generally faster than Qingyi..but not by a lot. If the enemy was aggressive enough for Caesar to stun similar or more often than Lycaon she buffs Ellens damage by about 16%+ more (10% more than soukaku) but I am not sure whether Lycaons personal damage makes up for that discrepancy

[@CaCtuSnyan]

@@CombatPandaZenlessZoneZero I have M2 W1 Lyacon fully invested (bad gacha) and he tickles the enemy so I assume not....

[@brodericksiz625]

Why not use both in the same team? You get Qingyi's damage amp, Caesar's atk buff (which stack multiplicatively together btw), and you stun even enemies with huge daze bars really quickly, so why not use both? I can imagine something like Corin, Qingyi, and Caesar being an absolute boss killer team

[@captaincaption]

Corin DPS REALLLLLL 🗣️🗣️🗣️

[@elmariachi290188]

I am trying to workout zhu yuan-qingyi-caesar rotation right now. Its pretty tricky cause zhu yuan cannot use quick assist to get enhanced bullet but from what i’ve seen its actually quite close to zhu yuan’s normal team with nicole.

[@lendoker2477]

I'd say that qinqyi is still better because your combo wasn't exactly the fastest on her (could've used two ex specials and not wait until the yellow meter fills up fully)

[@galaxycentral]

Best ZZZ creator hands down

[@Liger_Soba]

Another notable thing apart from stunning is that she can dishout a surprising amount of damage, perhaps enough to run her in a duo support hypercarry team lol

[@dankazama09]

Bow to the king 🤟

[@felixS979]

The Qingy gameplay in this showcase definitely left a lot to be desired but her gameplay is a bit more complex than Caesar so I can understand her not being played optimally. Overall I do agree in the end however that they're pretty equal in terms of stun. But very different in terms of utility or purpose, Caesar has a great shield that will keep you alive specially for those that struggle on the new Shiyu modes and Qingy has an incredible stun multiplier that can lead to one-shoting enemies during the stun window. At the end of the day it's more of Caesar vs the upcoming characters that you have to decide imo.

[@sirrah2458]

Great video, -though I do wish you would have tested this slightly differently, because you play Qingyi as the active unit outside a daze window not Yuan. This means we should be starting from Qingyi and dodge countering not defensive assisting into Qingyi. I think if you did this Qingyi would be stunning about a second quicker atleast.- Edit: I was wrong. See my second comment.

[@nakfr0g]

Daze multiplier off of dodge counter is 286%, defensive assist daze multiplier is 374% off of a light attack and 457% off of a heavy attack. In Shiyu you can also basic attack with Zhuyuan before crossing the barrier and her forward movement will bring her across the line as her last two hits go off netting you 2 bullets at the start of the fight, and then you defensive assist Qingyi in. That’s the best opener.

[@sirrah2458]

​@@nakfr0gAh I see that shiyu tech is pretty cool, thanks for sharing. But in regards to tts, even though the defensive assists have a higher multiplier they take longer to execute than a dodge counter, they don't end in a basic 3 sequence like dodging does, and they put you a dash away from the enemy. This means you have to dash forward and ex to enter basic 3 like with dodging. -I did some preliminary testing just now and It's by no means perfect but I was stunning 1.1 -1.6 seconds faster dodging. The caveat is that my dodge skill is at 11 and my assist skill is at 7 so the data is completely unfair. Would you be willing to test this yourself? I'm going to farm shock chips to bring it up to 11 this week and I'll test again properly.- Edit: My testing is scuffed, I tried to make the most favorable rotation for both dodging and defensive assisting and it was only 0.1 seconds faster for dodging and that's at level 7 assist and level 11 dodging. Now I think the difference is negligible and op is right in situations where Qingyi has enough energy to ex special after defensive assist. Edit2: Ok so studying the video op made again I can see some small inaccuracies slowing Qingyi down. In the 1st test he didn't use ex special at all on Qingyi and that's unoptimal after a defensive assist since you have to ba1 and 2 slowing her tts down. On the 4th test he didn't ex on Qingyi at end losing around a second. Overall though he drew an accurate conclusion and showcased that Caesar is a powerful stun unit and the two have similar almost identical tts. I think my original assumption and comment was wrong. Op showing Qingyi starting with a defensive assist is basically the same as dodging so other than smaller inefficiencies in gameplay the video may have made because it's so hard to test perfectly this video is pretty accurate, especially the conclusion. Thanks for replying btw and it was a great video.

[@sekaiforfun]

This is very informative, one of the best channels for zzz

[@keyto5526]

M0 Casear is on par or better than M0 Qingyi in stunning certain enemies. But don't forget that QingYi with more mirror of her will win Casear as true stunner when both are getting more mirrors of themselves. If you are whale and want the best stunner, hand down it will be QingYi and not Caesar. If you compare all characters under M6, Casear will be more on jack of all trades (above average when compared to A rank characters) but master of none when compare to S rank characters. There is significance increase in S rank characters' multiplier effect of their class type when they reach M6, but of course only the whales can taste such level.

[@orcsbase]

as your video shows,these two charter's stun efficiency is clearly not equal,you mess up some of Qingyi's combo(should use charge ex but you use basic attack instead),so that Caeser can win a little bit,beside, if the mob is not so aggressive(such as Dullahan or Thanatos)there is no way Caeser's stun efficiency will be same as Qingyi

[@x_k1ngst3r_x63]

Yeah I noticed this too, the defense assist one where qingyi was two seconds behind. When qingyi came in, he went straight into basic attacking lmao

[@keanesn.1513]

Been waiting for this. Keep them Caesar videos coming.

[@Joel_Inosin]

Thanks for the comparison. The thing I'm sort of curious about that is her damage capability, though I hesitate to base any conclusions on just this footage since I imagine Caeser would actually prefer to run the new set at 4 piece right? Though maybe not if she does replace the stunner role in teams.

[@rizkyhidayat147]

Caesar is gonna be like Zhongli, shielder that buff your dps and can stun/petrify the enemy. Im still uzing Zhongli now in Genshin since his banner release

[@desrtsku]

I'm actually more interested in knowing how fast you can get Ceasar's EX back up.

[@PolskaHerobrine]

Funny numbers begin once ya realize that the damage buff and the stun debuff stack, so having both on 1 team + chonky DPS means kaboom.

[@tomatomatomatomato]

Thanks for putting in the work, as always. However there is one aspect of Caesar I wish you'd have gone a little more in depth on: W-drive comparisons. Going for any limited S-rank signature is *very* costly investment for a F2P player, and Caesar doesn't really have any good alternatives.

[@zoramarslink5788]

Qingyi increases stun multiplier. Nuf said. I'm a big fan of Qingyi + Ceasar.

[@Kicksrockskids]

I'll gamble for her.Lately I realized my thumb hurts after playing because of so much mashing attack and dodge(especially with Jane). I'll slowly build my roster into counter reactive and timing-base like how I play S11.

[@MikeShyu]

Excellent analysis. Better than all the other creator channels that just glaze up the upcoming character. Liked, commented, and subscribed.

[@SM-tf3li]

Most of Caesars stun comes from using her ex special. These tests were done starting on full energy. In Shiyu Defense you don't start with full energy. And when farming in some areas you start with zero energy. Qingyi doesn't rely on her energy much.

[@Orphic77]

I lost my 50-50 on Qingyi's banner to Rina (my 2nd Rina loss), couldn't hit the pity during her banner so Caeser it is then.

[@joaquinchua3348]

Qingyi already powercrept 😭

[@Ronnie-sh6ei]

can you do a damage buff comparision between them as well(with and without their sig weapons). thanks for the video.

[@CombatPandaZenlessZoneZero]

If it helps I did calcs on paper and Qingyi was about 5-6% better during the stun window (except one DPS that it came out at 12% better) Its pretty hard to determine how much of this Caesar catches up outside of stun because all enemies have different daze bars and levels of aggressiveness. Their sig engines add 18% and 20% damage with uncertain uptimes as both are conditional, but should be able to be kept up near 100% so not a huge difference there.

[@galukisayaps182]

amazing vid man

[@vzx]

4:16 I think you can get faster stun here if you don't do the 3rd dodge counter and go straight for early release (perfect dodge activated) EMB

[@SpaceCat_0]

Thanks! Very useful. Are you going to make Burnice + Jane showcase, btw?

[@angrywhalewatcher]

I missed my 50/50 for Ellen and have saved my hard pity for Caesar cuz F2P. 21k poly on deck 65 pulls to hard pity, can't wait for 1.2 🏍️

[@ooidaboi]

Qingyi’s m1 and m2 significantly increases her abiility as a stunner, while Cesar’s copies just gives her and her team more attack So if you want to invest vertically, qingyi becomes the better stunner imo by far

[@noiro2342]

If you ever want to invest vertically, you would do so on the dps, not the stunner. On the same point, Caesar is a better investment vertically since she directly buff team's dmg vs a few seconds faster stun

[@ooidaboi]

@@noiro2342 not necessarily, for example Zhu yuan’s cinemas are not that good. And we’re not discussing who is a better investment. If someone had a m2 qingyi and a m2 Cesar, and they wanted a good stun unit, qingyi would be a better stun unit because of the increased multiplier and the increased bar buildup an resulting daze increase. Qingyi’s vertical investment also buffs her teams damage, by buffing her stun multiplier

[@noiro2342]

@@ooidaboi And Jane Doe's M2 is a 70% dmg increase which is better than pulling M0S1 QingYi or M0S1 Caesar, that's what it means by investing vertically(jstern25 already did the calc with the latest caesar beta changes). At the end of the day Qingyi only buffs in a narrow stun windows while Caesar's buff applies to all team at all times. Considering the future drive disk sets there will be multiple off field damage dealers coming(think Xingqiu/Yelan from Genshin impact and how broken they are) and they would all prefer Caesar's buff over Qingyi's buff. If you're only thinking of Zhu Yuan's team, then sure Qingyi is the better stunner due to their synergies. All other teams prefer Caesar unless maybe against phys res enemies

[@Hhhh22222-w]

​@@ooidaboi no copies are worth it rn, only maybe Jane E2 if you want more DMG, but Caesar offers better vertical investment though she's already giving immunity to DMG and interruption, regardless of your team Caesar will always benefit especially, qingyi falls off if you don't really need to stun or can't stun an enemy

[@ooidaboi]

@@noiro2342 im talking about as a stunner though, that’s what this video is about no? Youre going off on a tangent and arguing who is a better overall unit, but that’s literally not what im talking about here.

[@chavita8009]

I use Qingyi/Corin but using Ceaser/Corin would be more beneficial depending the enemy's weakness

[@minyaw1234]

I started with Jane and got her on my second roll 😮, and I still have lots of poly left as a new player. Should i go for Cesar and Burnice? I have 30k poly, should be doable, right? Would it be a good team, though?

[@nakfr0g]

@@minyaw1234 it would be an amazing team but also the most expensive team we have so far, good luck

[@Hhhh22222-w]

Rather you save if you are already clearing, if you need a second dps Burnice won't be a good option as she is tied to anomaly but Caesar can be played in any team practically

[@minyaw1234]

@@nakfr0g I got lucky on Jane, but I decided not to go for her engine because I don't have enough characters for two teams. That's why I need more characters and plan to go for both of them. In hopes that 30k poly + the free rolls will be enough.

[@CrochetPrune3]

TY now that i've lost 50/50 it's either i get Jane before 1.2 and skip or i get Caesar and skip everything after

[@Hhhh22222-w]

Get Caesar, if you already have a one DPS unit, Miyabi will powercreep other DPS anyways

[@CrochetPrune3]

Got caesar cause of neko curse😂

[@stewie_]

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one suffering from RSI while playing Qingyi 😂😂

[@dikachuugaming]

what if caesar not use her signature weapon??

[@chicoverde]

Can you do a comparison with Caesar vs Seth? Great video!

[@icenmeteor3489]

Goated nakfrg again with the pure gameplay analysis, thank you for your work!

[@Lucas-qj4hc]

Zhu Yuan vs Jane Doe Vs Ellen Joe please

[@garake-]

I'd love to see how much better Ellen performs against hyper aggressive enemies with Caesar's anti-interruption. Would staying on-field and consistently reaching the 3rd BA outweigh any stun multipliers from Lycaon/Qingyi?

[@gosudrone20]

Now do a comparison with f2p engines.

[@kisalavalinar8703]

how about caesar energy ? since both impact and ER are in Disc 6 slot ? we need more stunner different on Shiyu Defense

[@kevin909211]

Hi! question, can you also do that with a normal special attack for Ceasar? or it only works for the EX special attack?

[@gormleypeach5809]

This makes me feel way better about not getting Qingyi, slightly, Caesar is definitely subbing out a lot of characters on teams when i get her so im excited!

[@SM-tf3li]

This test isn't real world conditions. Check the energy bar. He started every fight with full energy which heavily favors Caesar as that's where most of her stun comes from. You don't start fights with full energy.

[@nakfr0g]

Check out some of the real world fights here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fH-ze6abpseNrqs Caesar builds energy incredibly fast and easily has enough energy for 2 EXEX's from the start of a fight, which will net you quite a quick stun.

[@deffru9]

Thank you for returning from Star Rail. No clickbaits, no soy face on preview, just ten minutes of really usefull information.

[@wkmirai969]

ceasar have same problem with ben ... most ppl dont like playing counter/parry character cause u know ... we play gacha game, we spend money so we dont have to use "skill", Qingyi will perform better on avg due to ease of access but ceasar will provide bigger benefit if u can counter correctly

[@Hhhh22222-w]

Burnice will always be tied to anomaly/fire teams, Caesar can be used for any team, not every enemy needs to be stunned, can be stunned or can recover very quickly (realistically only bosses need to be stunned and against bosses what is more important is your DPS, you can have the best stunner but if your DPS can't kill the boss, you cannot clear). Not to mention Hoyo RARELY releases limited Defensive units in their games, Zhongli literally being the only one in Genshin since release (if you count Baizhu that's two) and in HSR, only Aventurine and Fu Xuan so far. ZZZ might get a healer class but it's always better not to be hit in the first place. Caesar offers more utility and is more universal than Qingyi or Burnice, It's pretty simple.

[@athagan2]

Good video, but i still dont understand why u use Caesar Skill to counter, but u dont use Qingyi Skill in the first/second combo?