How Persona 3 Lost Its Identity | Original VS Reload

[@NamsCompendium]

Review code provided by Sega & Atlus. Special thanks to these lovely people for lending their voices to this project! Tony4You: www.youtube.com/@Tony4You Bubbletea: www.youtube.com/@bubbletea_ A Cursed Jessie: www.youtube.com/@ACursedJessie

[@Mammoth109La2]

Btw, Persona 3 Reload arrived on my 18th birthday.

[@SipSop09]

@@Mammoth109La2 Ooh, I think we share a birthday ^^

[@Pokoh-ur2fy]

You don’t get enough hate 🙏🙏 never make a goofy ahh video like this

[@ShineEdgateAshton14]

​@@Pokoh-ur2fywas a threat?

[@kenjianimates]

You can obviously see most people in the comments have not played the OG.

[@KignDididi]

I don't have anything against the in game 3D cutscenes but I think it's really funny how the protagonist's awakening and Shinji's death don't get a 2D animated cutscene but the scene where the team gets new drip does lol

[@joetheawesome]

That one arguably would have worked better as a 3D cutscene too

[@daveharrenburg7670]

It's pretty clear to me that they were using it as a marketing thing to show how "good" the in-engine cutscenes are. The awakening is in virtually all the trailers.

[@Mavuika_Gyaru]

Alright but the drip scene was heat. Especially Makoto's pimp walk

[@juandaviduribe8267]

Let's be real, the 3D cutscenes were all better

[@thatoneguy5343]

@@juandaviduribe8267 I do think Makoto’s awakening in the OG is better, but other than that I agree.

[@CupofJoe_93]

The long and short of this is “The remake was made in a post P5 world” Which is both fortunate and unfortunate at the same time.

[@CupofJoe_93]

I finished the video. I agree with most of being said here, but in my opinion the end scenes really saved it. I cried when Makoto put his finger up and I cried when he laid on Aigis’s lap. So I think it accomplished making us remember the feelings we felt the first time around. That and the title screen post credit really hits it home.

[@TheCreed1217]

@@CupofJoe_93 even with the cons the remake is amazing. For me at least its more fun to play, less grindy, wastes less of my time with mechanics that weren't fully developed back in 06, has better voice acting and keeps most of the emotion from the OG script but improved and as you said the most important thing: they managed to evoke the same feeling I felt from the ending when I played it in 2013 if not stronger now from a more interesting scene direction and compositional choices via art direction. I feel like it improved the things I REALLY wanted improved the most and it made the game a better experience for me but at the expense of other things people care for more like combat (which I don't play these games for their combat, I play it for everything weaving together but mostly the story.) Art direction has its flaws but the parts that work make me smile, I can't wait for The Answer since I'll likely enjoy it now.

[@MACGamer100]

I really don't understand the criticisms of it playing like P5....like I feel like it seems people hate it on it due to the popularity of the game rather than anything else... P5R had the most addicting gameplay in the series for me, so to see it in P3R is exactly what I wanted. Idk I find it so strange.

[@BLIZZ2012]

@@MACGamer100 some of the sentiment stems from how most early Atlus games handle. They are very challenging and require a whole lot of forethought compared to games like P5 where mechanically you could exploit so many aspects and break the game in two. It’s sort of a constant rift between new and old players. Personally I’m of the camp that yeah if the games combat is addicting I couldn’t care less if it’s easy but it doesn’t mean I would oppose a good challenge so long as it’s executed well

[@TeryonTheHuman]

@@BLIZZ2012 when you almost seize to exist as a company and have to be saved TWICE by modern persona you don’t have the luxury of making a “difficult” game in a dying genre that most old devs of it are abandoning. You see how that worked out for SMT 5 trying to be a “hardcore” turn based rpg in the 2020’s. They’re having to completely redo it and offer easier and more QOL features just to give it a second try at selling decently because its first run sold like ass. If “old school” atlus fans had their way with the franchise it would be dead.

[@machinegun5183]

"everything is so fucking green you'd swear it's persona 6" what an epic line

[@VileVeilt]

Kind of reminds me how Yakuza kiwami 2 have that green tint in it's cutscenes it's kind of strange and annoying.

[@sil9411]

i thought the same on the final boss.

[@lucascaracas4781]

I am a fan of the color green

[@slooshified_]

i watched the whole video for this, but i couldnt find the line :( mind sending the timestamp here?

[@frickthefuckoff]

​@@slooshified_58:08

[@BerryHuttz]

Once we all just agree that Persona 3 Dancing is the definitive way to play, we can all be happy.

[@waleedtheXIVth]

A retelling of the persona games in a rhythm game sounds actually dope

[@JoelPerry1]

Lemons? 'Nuff said.

[@ibilesfighter3.16]

no its garbage souless slop, play 4 dancing that actually had love out in it

[@Pholard]

​@@ibilesfighter3.16it's a joke

[@nitomae]

Wait until Persona 3 Dancing Reloaded

[@n3crosis23]

While I did enjoy reload it did feel like it existed in a weird limbo. It’s not a completely faithful remake, but it’s also not that different to be it’s own thing. It feels like reload was more of a testing ground for what they want to do with persona 6 first and a faithful remake second. It also deeply bothers me how many versions of persona 3 exist but none of them encapsulate a “complete” experience, so you have play the other versions to truly experience everything (FEMC, og mechanics, and now linked episodes/theurgies/rest of the reload additions).

[@TheCreed1217]

Link episodes, and the addition of the answer and new content in the answer make P3R the most complete version that exists. P3P content is in the game too, lacking FemC and Theo isn't nearly as much of a loss when they integrated some of what made that game unique into the Link Eps but made it BETTER. So aside from two missing SLs and a shinji revival not much is missing.

[@sarxanova5105]

Remakes aren't supposed to be 100% faithful, that's why it's a remake and not a remaster.

[@debishvebishwish4839]

@@sarxanova5105 tell that to FF7 fans lolol

[@alexandersmith4731]

​@@debishvebishwish4839the Japanese fans have their merits on that at least, they were promised a full true remake, not whatever they did nowadays

[@milkflavored]

Honestly I think you have to watch the movies too (and while reload took a ton of inspo from them, I wished they’d gone farther bc the films provide s ton of nuance)

[@ChiangKai-Shrek]

I'm gonna be honest. I do not get why people have suddenly started loving tactics over direct commands. Like, I can see why people say that they fit the theme of the game or whatever, but after like January when the party has found their resolve, it doesn't make sense for them to still not listen to their field leader. But then again I've only finished Reload and absolutely adored it, so I will acknowledge that I am completely biased. (I did try FES but I only got as far as the September full moon before I screwed up my emulator, I did like what I played though)

[@nunyabiddeness6544]

I agree with this, a great compromise wouldve been to have all party members controlled by AI until you reach a certain threshhold in their link episodes. This way, it feels like the characters had to spend time with the protag in order to build trust with him, and this has a direct impact on combat, marrying story and gameplay. Some characters might also need additional conditions to be met for it to unlock, like Junpei wouldn't be able to get direct commands until after you beat the shadow on the train, for example. Also, by the end of the game the player is likely to have direct commands for all party members, allowing the player to feel like they "earned" the strategic advantage of direct commands, which would pay off in harder late game boss fights and especially against the final boss. I wish the team had implemented a smarter version of this mechanic like I outlined instead of tossing it into the garbage

[@raiseasato]

They started loving tactics bc they needed an extra reason to prefer the old over the new. Just go look at forums from back then - people HATED it and they did all the way up until Reload came out.

[@hungcatuwu7320]

​​​@@raiseasato actually no there are a good chunks of peoples does love tactics even before reload announcement came out peoples who hated tactic commands are people who mostly cant enjoyed original persona 3's old mechanics not a extra reasons to prefer old things over new things as you said bud

[@raiseasato]

Okay "bud" LMAO

[@chloemarlowe3817]

Personally, i think it's because some people are able to look back and examine why a game works the way it does. Why Tactics was designed and implemented the way it was and why it was actually a good design decision. For example, a very small detail about the Tactics system in FES that actually has huge effects on the combat is the fact that the MC is guaranteed to always have the first turn unless ambushed. Some people have complaints about how the getting up from knockdowns skips turns making it hard to adjust your Tactics mid-fight due to knockdown looping. When you are guaranteed the first turn in every fight, and this first turn can be used to cover your weaknesses and change Tactics, it's your fault you got into the knockdown loop to begin with. Ironically, despite not being able to control your party members directly, P3/FES gives you the most control over encounters in the series and is probably the most fair game.

[@jacobturner8965]

This comment section is more full of people saying there "will be a war" than an actual war 😂

[@darrylaz3570]

Oh don't worry there is war, it's just not here, it's on Twitter and probably Reddit because of course it does

[@ranshi6417]

to be fair I have seen P3R critique comments sections, they are not pretty

[@ZeR-nr6if]

Bc his critique is actually based on facts and not, p3r le bad, original bettar, like a guy who did a re4r critique who shat on the remake bc it wasn't the 2004 one

[@TheMetalGaia]

While I really enjoyed Reload for what it is, I totally understand your perspective here. Thanks for providing your honest thoughts!

[@theimpersonator7086]

Persona 3R is a interesting case example of how a lot of iconic media with distinct atomspheres and tones work because of the tech limitations of the time they were made, not in spite of them. It's a shame that the dark, gritty, and melancholic atomsphere of 3 was lost in translation, as that tone was very distinct from both 4 and 5. Also glad you mentioned the usage of the Portable script. One casualty of doing this is how Junpei's father is not mentioned in 3R, which is such a shame as Junpei's father and how he views him is pivotal to understanding Junpei as a character.

[@knightofblackfyre7950]

Portable script? I'm gonna assume that just means the script portable used, but Junpei's father is mentioned in Portable in his social link. If they used Portable I would've figured they'd use it for his link episodes as that's suppose to be his social link in reload.

[@richieonkz]

That part probably will be used on The Answer, i think

[@gLilihierax]

This is a problem with game remakes, talking specifically about P3, most new players will never play P3:FES since their first P3 game would be Reload. Basically, all the things that he mentions in this video are criticism that nobody will care (only old fans). If the OG P3 games (Vanilla and FES) sold more than 1M I would be surprised. Persona 3 and Persona 4 fans are becoming P1 and P2 fans, I expect the same weak arguments about P4 remake. Thats why I value much more the opinion of a new player than someone who already played the game, since that opinion will be tainted in some way and will be super critical about the Remake. If you ask a player who recently finished P3: Reload to go back after a week to play FES he would go crazy.

[@Zeik56]

​@@gLilihieraxBoth perspectives are valid. Dismissing one because it doesn't align with your own opinions is everything wrong with this era of internet criticism.

[@tabris95]

​@@gLilihieraxIf you'd prefer the opinion of someone new to Persona 3 and Reload is their first experience, I'd say Reload is a huge mess and probably the worst Persona I've played compared to P4, P5, and P5 Royal. The pacing is all over the place and bounces between being drip fed to you for months, to large amounts of time dedicated to ham fisted exposition. There is very little plot until all of a sudden there is, and the plot they introduce with Strega is BAAAAAAD. Easily the worst villains in Persona. Ikutsuki being killed off in the same scene he's revealed to be a villain is one of the most wtf moments I've seen in a JRPG. Don't get me started on Ken's scream during THAT death scene. What's even worse is how badly designed the Social Link system is in this game, with about 75% taking place at school during the day, including your teammates who you literally live with! "Sorry Makoto, I'd love to blow off some steam with you after risking our lives to save the world, but it isn't a school day so I'm not interested." Because of the way events and exams work in P3R, I ended up with over a solid month of dead days at the end of the game where I literally had nothing available to do outside work or sleep because my social stats were maxed and all of my remaining Social Links were classmates. This completely KILLED the momentum built up from the plot twist in December and really dragged the end of the game down for me. Honestly what a mess.

[@limkenny1]

on one hand, I do agree with your criticisms over the art direction, cutscene direction, storytelling, and gameplay, and I do prefer FES over Reload when it comes to them on the other hand, Shinjiro says fuck in Reload

[@NamsCompendium]

Shinji is hands down the best part of the game

[@TheCreed1217]

that shinji death scene is just 100% better directed and acted in Reload, only thing worse is Kens god awful cry

[@CowDriller]

​@@TheCreed1217Ken's awful screeching straight up made me lol and completely usurped the sad scene into a gag

[@smackyguardian]

He’s trying to be Ryuji lol

[@TheCreed1217]

@CowDriller that shit takes me out so hard mixed with Koromaru's howling it becomes full on satire. Like the voice director really said this is the best take???

[@KE100able]

What I love about the fatigue system is if you go back to the first floor and nobodies tired you get your hp and sp refilled for free.

[@athorem]

Yeah, I'm a veteran of the war in 'Nam The war in Nam's comment section

[@bigdongroma539]

Ken Amada og: waste of disk space because of only instakill moves Ken Amada remake: I'M THE HEALING GOD AND NO ONE SHALL DIE ON MY WATCH lmao

[@NamsCompendium]

not taking ken slander here. he's good as fuck in both games

[@Jdudec367]

@@NamsCompendium dang right, he has great healing, light skills, pierce attacks, etc.

[@fmaster99]

​@@NamsCompendium Where? He is permanent bench warmer in FES /OG

[@ShioSatou]

Ken is not just light instakills in the original lmao, he literally only learns two light skills in the entire game. If you look at his kit in totality, along with his stat distribution, its very clear that he is a jack of all trades type character focused on single-target knockdowns and assassinations, of which instakills are part of but are hardly the focal point. Use Gae Bolg on him during mid game and watch him outclass the majority of the cast while still having healing and covering 4 seperate elements lmao

[@tradne85]

I abused the shit out of the Armageddon spell with War Cry passive. *Everyone* was irrelevant to me at that point. What’s that? Helel (called Lucifer in the original P3) doesn’t come with War Cry in FES? I used the fusion system to go through the steps to make a Helel that did have it.

[@Nexus_427]

While I generally think the points of this video are well formed, especially in regards to Reload's presentation, I cannot in good conscience agree with the ending of it, because of one thing; there isn't status quo of Persona 3. P3 as a story is in unique situation, because every adaptation of it, even FES, handles many of its aspects differently. The main core of the story is still the same, but the way of getting through it is always different depending on how you get into Persona 3. Before we even had Reload you already had stuff like the FeMC route in P3P, which gave a completely different perspective on events and characters simply out of the idea that the protag was a woman this time around or the pretty contentious manga which by the end just straight up brings the guy back, but the biggest one is obviously the P3 movies quadrilogy. There are some aspects of it that feel handled weirdly and worse than the original due to obvious limitations of the run time (Strega's presence is even more limited than it was in the original game and second awakenings aside from Junpei being relegated to the last minute power ups isn't really the best either), but on the other hand we have pretty much entire Winter of Rebirth, where tying Elizabeth's dates into the "main" story, while also showcasing S.E.E.S regaining their hope back is a very gorgeous way of handling that portion of the story and Door-kun's solo fight against Ryoji was also a major highlight of the movie. The point is, P4 and P5 don't have this issue (if you can even call it that), because it's generally agreed upon that Golden and Royal are good ways to experience these stories, but with P3, every adaptation of it handles things differently and so does Reload. I cannot call it a replacement of the original, because that's not what it is, it's just yet interpretation of P3 that handles some things worse and better. An interpretation which you can dislike more than FES, which is all fair, but Reload is not the first one to do that. There are people who think the movies are terrible, people who think the FeMC route is THE way to experience P3, people who think that Reload is the best and they cannot look at FES any more, hell, there are probably people who love the manga. I'm 100% certain that if FeMC was included in Reload there would be issues that would arise from it too, people feeling unhappy about how she was handled in here and all of this is making me think that ultimately, there isn't a definitive way of Persona 3 and that's not how Reload, or any adaptation of it, should be viewed as. And as for the future of the series, this team for me personally had already proven that they are great at creating original material, like P5's third semester or in this case, the entire Shinji linked episode, so I'm not really worried about P6, because that's gonna be their first full shot at something from the ground up.

[@BLIZZ2012]

Full hardly agree with this take

[@zerron2156]

I actually disagree, I wouldn't even call Royal a definitive version of P5 either, it just has a smaller delta in "playability" compared to the original than in Reload vs P3F. I can't comment on P4G yet but Royal demonstrated to me that they are capable of making good additions, but not ones that respect the original mood of the game. Shido and Maruki left me with completely different experiences. I like what Royal added but I can't in good faith accept it as a definitive version because of that. Whether we like it or not, Reload will be the final version (so long as we're alive at least) and that's why we wanted it to be definitive. Atlus has to know this too. There are ways of making a definitive version of P3, modders will try their hardest to salvage what they can from what we're left with. Despite what method I experienced P3 first, I know what a definitive version should be like.

[@Infinite_AJ]

I'm sorry, Royal is the definitive version of P5 in every single way, it's just an upgrade of the same game and I doubt many people will aheee with your sentiment there. To add to nexus's point, the p3 movies are something I didn't think I'd love as much as I did, but when I watched them I fell head over heels. I was hoping they added a lot of movie only stuff and events into reload, but was disappointed to see little of that in favor of original FES stuff. Thay just proves there's too many camps with p3

[@zerron2156]

@Infinite_AJ You're free to think that Royal is what you want it to be, I just don't agree with that because it objectively alters not just gameplay but story elements no matter how minor. Never said that it worsened the game or that it's bad. It's just not the same experience that I loved in Vanilla P5. It's that simple for me

[@MugdhaMahdiShams]

​@@zerron2156 Akechi is a worse written character in vanilla compared to royal no matter how you spin it. And the final boss is just obligatory jrpg world ending god we gotta punch in the face or shoot in this case.

[@ShadowedKami]

Time for the comment section to become a minefield!

[@oriongear2499]

Aren’t the comments section always a minefield?

[@ibilesfighter3.16]

@@oriongear2499 yeah but here itll be a minefield filled with children and pedos who cant handle opinions or criticism

[@nicktoons125]

​@@oriongear2499True it is a YT video but it's gonna be more of a minefield then usual.

[@amberank]

It's called never ever look at the comments on anything. Never on Social Media. Never on Fanfics. Never on YT. It how you can get mad or sad by people that want to make you mad or sad. I learnt this because of how many times gotten mad or sad over comments like today.

[@real1mem3s]

​@amberank2000 you obviously dont take your own advice

[@harryshuman9637]

"Have you seen the prices of some of these games?" Yeah, $0 for the ISO of the disc and all the HD mods for it.

[@battlinjoe2592]

I ripped my ISO from my disc a long time ago and never looked back.

[@harryshuman9637]

@@battlinjoe2592 Nice, but I suggest getting it from Redump, just to make sure the checksums are all good. If your disc wasn't ripped correctly it can cause problems with mods.

[@macsis6338]

Bro thinks people buy retro games, lol

[@austin88781]

There's a reason one of the most popular mods for fes and 99% of games with party members allow you to control everything they do, having your party members do their own thing is cool as an option but this is a video game about strategy. Why tf would I hinge my success on a difficult boss on whether or not Junpei decides to clutch? If he doesn't then I lose and it isn't my fault. If I am to strawman every argument like this I'd say you're conflating something being complicated as good while simple is lame. Even in military if you don't do what you're told you get in trouble. You said that this game relies more on strategy but at any point your party members can get tired so every fight after they're limping, and if you want to change personas or save you're fucked because they'll leave if you go back to the lobby. The "maybe this other party member is better" line doesn't work because you and the developers wanted them to feel like different people and also, once again, strategy. Superbutterbuns put it best, reload is roller skates and fes is heelies, both are good and there are valid reasons to like either one but only one holds up to gravel.

[@peterparker1683]

After watching and mulling over the video I can’t say I agree with the premise of the video for several reasons. You argue the intended vision of Persona 3 but the simple truth of the matter is that Persona 3 is ever changing and ever evolving. The Hashino interviews about the Tactics menu is nice but Persona 3 has been using the Direct Command system since Portable and Hashino also worked on that game. I love the tactics system and I’m glad it’s viewed more favorably nowadays but the truth of the matter is that the Tactics Command was not appreciated upon the original release of the game. If Atlus truly felt that strong about it like you argue then Persona 4 and its sequels wouldn’t even bother bringing back the Direct Command system. Arguing P3’s identity being tied to its combat system is wild since it has been changed before. Atlus took a gamble and it didn’t pay off. I do agree that the Tactics should be better in Reload. It would be nice to have options. You also talk about about how it compares with RE4 when really you should have compared it to how Pokemon remakes their games. Pokémon FireRed for all intents and purposes is a Kanto game on a Gen 3 engine. It removes all of the bugs and gunk and uniqueness that Red and Blue had and instead opts for the gameplay mechanics that were present in Ruby Sapphire and Emerald, all the while staying true and not compromising the identity of the Kanto titles. They did this again with Heartgold and SoulSilver. They took Gold and Silver and remade it with mechanics that were introduced in Diamond Pearl and Platinum(physical special split, evs and IV’s, etc) and add new features while also staying true to the Johto game(even the damn level curve lol) my point is that there is more than one way to remake a video game, and I think Reload does a decent job of capturing what Persona 3 is while using mechanics and gameplay ideas that were introduced in Persona 5. There are multiple ways to experience P3 whether through FES, Portable, and Reload. They each provide a unique experience but all of them tell the same stories and themes that resonated with a large amount of players. I’ll be honest when I say I prefer FES but that doesn’t mean someone’s experience with Reload isn’t any less valid. Same with Portable. I feel like the Megaten community suffers from clinging to this philosophy of there should be only one version of a game you should play. This goes double for Strange Journey. It’s honestly really toxic imo. Overall I agree with your thoughts on Reload but I don’t think the identity is compromised, more so it added on to its identity. Sorry for the long comment

[@Gokuvsnaruto22]

This was a really good comment, and I agree with everything you said. Thanks for writing this.

[@tokyobandz3307]

I agree with all of your points!

[@CowDriller]

"I feel like megaten community suffers from wanting only one version of a game" hard disagree on this point I'm tired of Atlus milking their games ad nozeum they should just really focus on what exactly they want the finished product to be the first time around and then add in extra content as expansion packs like the answer dlc

[@peterparker1683]

@@CowDriller that’s not what I said at all whenever people ask which version they should play they you get comments about how One game has soul and the re release is soulless. Or one game is the true vision of the game. It’s toxic and elitist

[@TheMetalGaia]

great comment, man. I fully agree with you!

[@ammy_baba9609]

It's really interesting to hear your perspective. As someone who's only experience with P3 was playing Portable on the PS Vita last year, to me there's a lot of aspects that I didn't even know about. Why has nobody told me that Makoto can wield almost any weapon in the original P3?! In those regards, I felt like you did a great job at expressing why you felt disappointed with what 3R offered. And there's also a lot that I agree with as well when it comes to comparing my experiences between P3P and P3R. Playing on Merciless was tons of fun, especially early on. I still remember how fast I was flying through the menu to defeat the first Full Moon boss on my first try, with only 5 seconds remaining on the timer as she fell, as well as guarding around the Idol boss' attack patterns. But things like the sprinting attack and Twilight Fragments just blow the game open. To me, though, I still feel like 3R is one of the best games to come out this year, even with all of the changes, because to me it's still Persona 3. But maybe my opinion will change if I ever play through the original release. On a side note, I'm surprised that you didn't bring up Episode Aigis (unless my mind just glossed over it), but it's also a kind of whole separate bag of worms and doesn't really fit in what the video is about.

[@evankrueger7321]

I'm playing through right now on Hard (due to P5's merciless being easier than its hard mode I assumed the same of this post P5 remake) and I've literally only used the twilight fragments for healing 1 time just to see what the animation looked like, so like any good feature, its as useful as you want to make it. The sprint attack requires you to go out of your way to proactivly engage with the life sim aspect of the game to aquire it by spending your very limited time to actually go to the website and its not like it matters in any significant fight... it just makes grinding XP faster and less finiky. (needless to say compared to INSTA KILL from P5 its basically nothing) Idk if Theurgy was an original mechanic but its the only thing that feels crazy OP (if your playing right you should be getting a Theurgy skill off like every 2-3 turns per character)

[@yep9462]

Portable players will probably enjoy P3R more and I say this as someone who only played that version on the male route but watched a playthrough of FES before playing it back in middle school (my parents were weird about this; ratings didn't matter unless it was obviously pornographic/overly obscene, but if it had any sort of gun violence, realistic or cartoony, no chance I could play it - made sure they didn't see the Evokers lol). Coming back to Portable last year, certain story beats don't hit as hard without cutscenes even if imo P3 is the smt game most suited to be a visual novel. The combat is a lot closer as well, and while I appreciate direct commands because the AI could pull off some bullshit even with proper tactics, a lot of the uniqueness is lost there.

[@highwindknight]

Having started from Vanilla and having played every version, and a lot of elements that are missing from P3P. The most notable one being the loss of wielding any weapon which only further showcases how flexible of a Wild Card the P3MC is as well as the MP based usage of fusion spells which made him an unstoppable nuke on two legs when he had Lucifer and Satan, or even an explorable non-tartarus 3D environment that provides so much life to the everyday interactions. But one weird one is that there is something very unique about having AI only control with the party from my experiences in the Vanilla version. In part, via gameplay, I learned a lot about the personalities of each character by how they fought, amusingly enough. As an example, Junpei is a bro, absolutely. He focuses on defending others and is versatile enough to handle any situation. And amusingly, early game he is actually a better and more reliable healer than Yukari since he has his own stash of items that can heal up to 100 HP, and heal your status ailment. It is surprising the amount of times that Junpei would outperform Yukari's role as a healer for me and even more reliably prevent status ailments from destroying the party. The best examples and memories I had was Yukari failing to heal my charmed status ailment only for Junpei to come in clutch and heal that away before I ended having the MC potentially destroy the party. And against the common norms, the most reliable party I had was any combination of Junpei, Mitsuru, Aigis and Shinji. And I do mean reliable. I knew what they would do, when they would do it. Mitsuru can easily be made to never use her status ailments. And even Fuuka was incredibly useful, because her analyzing the enemies provides the one most important element to the AI. Long term memory. Without analysis, the AI will treat each battle as a new experiment. But once you analyze, they suddenly grow long term memory of weaknesses and strength. So even Fuuka's identity as the support who provides intel to the team is cemented by how she radically improves everyone's actions. It's not the best quality of life, obviously. But it allowed a process of discovery of personality through gameplay interaction. Something that when taken away would need to be replaced with something else, which Reload does do with the addition of further small interactions. But it does not fully replace everything it took away.

[@evankrueger7321]

@@highwindknight the AI was broken in the original releases rendering any and all buff moves in the AI’s move set completely pointless.

[@malikharness633]

One problem I have with the tactics system reasoning is about the characters “being their own people” is that you can dress them in swimsuit and sexy bikini armor. These are also the only armors that have a cosmetic change that have no thematic purpose only exist for fanservice. So the player can control what they wear but apparently not control them doing an exact skill. The original developer mentioned other JRPGs letting you “customize everything down to their underwear” in the interview but it seems hypocritical.

[@NamsCompendium]

That was a fes addition. Those costumes didn’t exist in the vanilla release of the game and the interview in question was conducted not too long after the game came out. It is weird that they decided to walk back on that idea for some dumb fan service

[@malikharness633]

@@NamsCompendium I guess that makes sense. It’s interesting how divisive in general Persona 3 is because of the numerous versions that tbh won’t satisfy everyone. I agree with most of your other points and I’m just glad there’s a more accessible version of the game.

[@charlestrudel8308]

@@malikharness633 to be fair, Nam at some point did say that P3P that you can give direct order to your allies does also some other good stuff making that version basically as good as og P3. meaning, direct order alone wouldnt make P3 reload worse than the og at all... the problem lies that they seem to have used too much of the feature set of P5 and even dial up to 11 some way too much overkill abilities.

[@t-universegamer7609]

That's less of an actual game "problem" (if you even wanna call it that) and more of just a basic design choice. The fact the actual code for the game still included selectable skills for the characters shows they weren't completely sold on the idea either. Don't think it's something to get so hung up over.

[@LilWeySoIcy]

@@NamsCompendiumbruh all I’m saying is, it took you 20 play throughs of og P3/FES plus an interview to make you realize their ideas of individualism. They clearly aren’t expressed clearly enough in the OG game, and it’s not something anybody really ponders on or really cares about. We know they’re their own unique character. U don’t have to limit me to playing as just MC in combat to get that. Direct commands is the way to go, and I’m not playing FES 10 times to get the picture. It’s a long ass game lmfao

[@roseakahoodie]

The difficulty and Tartarus balancing in reload is so scuffed that starting around September I turned my run into a required battles only one and still ended up over levelled for Nyx

[@jaffinator2166]

Something I really appreciate here is how you connect your thoughts to other franchises. It’s too easy to just compare P3R to FES and Portable, but adding allusions to series like DMC and Ratchet and Clank go to show you’re looking at this from more than one angle, which helps your points stand even taller than they would otherwise.

[@ulime]

you geekin

[@SwimSwayer]

​@@ulimeyo??

[@JokerAnjero]

I can see your points and I understand that it's not for everybody. But for me personally, having played both FES and Portable, I can confidently say I prefer Reload over any other version

[@thebacklog1458]

After watching the entire video: I respectfully and humbly disagree with the vast majority of your points. Obviously you’re making a subjective point here, but a lot of arguments sound harsher when you try and frame the new design as flagrantly worse. Most major critiques are personal criticisms that revolve around your own personal preferences, not genuine flaws and problems with the game’s design. With that said FES can never be replaced for its art direction alone

[@smileybudd9212]

People wanted a persona 3 remake in the first place because it has so many releases with different content. People want the FEMC from Portable, they want the answer from Fes, and they want the cutscenes and over-world from the original. Its really weird how Atlus didn’t get that, they even had to be pushed to make the answer. I liked reload, but I definitely agree it doesn’t really strike that same cord as the original did, I think of it more as a fun little new way to experience the old story. I think some scenes hit harder personally, like October 4th and the very last scene and credits, even the last month at the dorm felt a lot stronger because of the grey lighting, but it definitely feels like they don’t understand the subtle ways the original felt so special. I did enjoy reload for what it was, and I like the fresh take on the original story, but I wish it was more of a complete version. Persona 3 always has this problem of cutting content into every release like portable has the femc and controllable party but loses the 3D overworld and cutscenes, and its the same for reload. I think if anything, im glad Reload will give people a chance to experience these characters and this story when otherwise they never would’ve. I know people personally who never considered playing the original but gave reload a try and loved it, which is kinda sad, but if they can experience this story in some way, rather than never at all, I think thats a good thing.

[@acallixgaming]

I disagree with almost every point. Amazing video!

[@Rman1228]

Best comment in this section 🤣 I feel the same way

[@TheWeekEndGAMES]

I feel the same hahaha

[@Speckmantelmade]

Same. The only thing I didn’t quite vibe with was the new version of Mass Destruction. Other than that, I’m not someone who feels the need to preserve the “true feeling” of gameplay in games of that genre. I’d rather have the qol improvements, and I didn’t feel like Reload was telling me “this is the definitive way of playing P3” - in that case, it would have needed to mesh every version together and that thankfully didn’t happen. I can still appreciate a well-written and thought out script for such a video. Was very interesting, but not that surprising either.

[@42Caio]

My thoughts exactly. I do agree some of the atmosphere has been lost in transition but not to the extent he's claiming. Other than that, I really think the improvements outweigh the very nitpicky issues I have with the changes. And I don't think 3 lost its identity. Reload does iterate on that identity but I don't think the game was "5-fied" or anything of the sort. It still got the mood right for the most part.

[@highwindknight]

@@Speckmantelmade You're technically agreeing with him though that the game does not have the identity of the original game then. Which is fine in a way, but it does mean that we're still left with the issue of not having a definitive version of the game which makes it difficult to determine where someone new comes in. P3P for example would work better for someone who's very into visual novels, but if someone wants a more immersive experience, P3P is a bad choice with FES, Vanilla or Reload being a better option. Depending on the type of immersion they want, even FES and Reload might be a bad choice. I wouldn't say that Thankfully it didn't mesh all of the previous iterations into itself, because it could have been a great thing. Rather, instead of a mindbreaking amazing product, we ended up with a good product. I have difficulty saying great because of how many of the changes between versions seems to lose some elements of the story and replace them with alternative elements, in particular Yukari's reduction of her snarkiness and attitude in general already heavily alters the group dynamic. I would say it's nice that we have an approachable Persona 3 version that can allow newer players to come in. But it is a shame that it isn't the best version that could ever be, and is simply a good alternative.

[@Brillthoven]

I gotta disagree with most of the points in this video. "Persona 3 Reload" made some smart updates that were necessary for modernizing the game, not watering it down. 🎮 GAMEPLAY: The original game was great, but let’s be real-it had a lot of outdated mechanics that would turn off new players. The removal of the fatigue system and the introduction of Twilight Fragments was a good call. The fatigue system in the original was annoying at worst and negligible by mid-game. Removing it was a smart move that makes the gameplay more enjoyable without pointless roadblocks. It lets players explore Tartarus at their own pace without punishing them for wanting to push forward. And the skill card system? It’s a great way to let players experiment with personas without the grind-heavy nonsense of the original. This isn’t about making the game easier; it’s about making it more fun and engaging. Being able to pick what skills are inherited through fusion is a godsend. I remember wasting hours in the original, going back and forth through fusion menus just to manipulate RNG to build a good persona. Reload lets you actually enjoy the game instead of battling the menus. And now to the topic of the dreaded tactics system... I really don’t get why people defend the original’s AI-controlled party. It’s a party-based, turn-based game-I should be able to control my characters. The idea that this somehow takes away from their identity is ridiculous. If you were leading a team in a real combat situation, you’d give direct orders. There are plenty of better ways to strengthen character identity without forcing the player to rely on AI. Take, for instance, the decision to limit the protagonist to one-handed swords. On the surface, it reduces the player's weapon choices, but it also enhances the uniqueness of the other party members and clearly defines the protagonist's role. This refinement improves the game’s balance. It feels like Nam can’t decide between more character identity or less, more player freedom or fewer options. He criticizes the Shift system, even though it adds a much-needed depth, making combat fluid and engaging, a welcome contrast to the original’s slow, clunky battles. 📖 STORY: As for the narrative, the extra dialogue isn’t “dumbing down” the story; it’s enhancing it by providing more context and depth. The updated script helps both newcomers and longtime fans connect more deeply with the story and characters. The Linked Episodes are a great addition too-they add more layers to the characters, especially the male cast, and help flesh out the relationships that were barely touched on before. These changes don’t dilute the experience-they enrich it, making the story more engaging and emotionally resonant. 🎨 ART: The criticisms about the art direction are off-base too. The brighter environments and updated color palette make the game look more polished and appealing on modern systems. The art direction in Reload is fantastic. It’s not just about making everything “brighter.” The way they explore the different uses of blue adds so much depth. It can be moody and dark, but also bright and hopeful, which aligns perfectly with the game’s themes. And for anyone saying it’s all too bright-there are plenty of gloomy settings in the game that capture the original’s atmosphere just as well. Plus, the new cutscenes are more cinematic and fluid, which is a huge improvement over the stiff animations of the original. "Reload" respects the core of what made "Persona 3" special while updating it for a new generation. The changes don’t ruin the game-they make it better suited for today’s players. Just because it’s different doesn’t mean it’s worse. The original had its time, and "Reload" is exactly what the series needed to stay relevant and enjoyable.

[@okaten3522]

This comment reeks of the classic "I barely watched the video because I'm butthurt by the concept of someone having a differing opinion to a game I like."

[@V_inco]

@@okaten3522 I swear it's like you mfs can't read. how did you get any of that from this comment?

[@TheFifthAngel]

@@okaten3522he literally talked about the points in the video and gave his take on it, just because he gave an opinion on the guys takes made on this video doesn’t mean he’s “butthurt” just as some people can like something others can dislike the same thing it’s called having differing opinions.

[@DaPurpleWarrior]

​​@@okaten3522 Your comment reeks of not reading or understanding his comment. He responded to the criticisms in the video and gave his own insight and opinions on those criticisms. If anything you sound butthurt that he commented his differing opinion in detail, so butthurt that you just ignored what he said.

[@d4sbot]

Ah yes criticism is elitism. Stfu and think about the actual points instead of dickriding a mediocre, lazy and greedy remake of an ok game. You are free to disagree with his points but you are not free to just call someone elitist because they are able to see downsides in a game instead of blindly calling it a 10/10 masterpiece.

[@BLIZZ2012]

I honestly feel when it all boils down to everything it’s an inherit difference in Philosophy. Here’s the way I kinda look at it: for me to genuinely care about how gameplay integrates into themes it needs to make a strong impression from the start. If it fails to do that then honestly I couldn’t care less about why something is “supposed to drive home the themes of the game”. For me it completely speaks volumes that I even needed to step away from the game and literally turn on cheats because I just couldn’t be bothered with the gameplay. As stated by you in the beginning of the video the original PS2 release of P3 isn’t what you could consider very beginner friendly. You COULD say “persona 3 is more then just it’s story and characters” but honestly that’s what most really care about especially if mechanically it’s not clicking. What difference does it make if all I want to do is just blitz through the dungeon just so I don’t half to see that thing ever again. At that point I’m not thinking “wow it’s so crazy how this meshes well with the themes of the game” instead it’s “get me the fuck out of here *bashes head on desk”. It’s very much so a game of its time. I can respect the intent behind most creative liberty's the devs took with the quirks and mechanics of the original game however I’m just gonna keep it a buck 50: the series is more mainstream then ever and with that you will no doubt have a bit more of a casual audience. Unapologetically I will always say yes we needed a remake. I’m not going to sit here and say that reload is completely perfect and there’s absolutely nothing wrong with it. There are aspects where atlus no doubt over corrected where they didn’t need to or the fact the game could have been balanced a bit better or that the tone feels slightly off. Nor am I saying that things like them properly importing the AI as an option couldn’t have been done ether. I’m not opposed to being challenged or having to actually think or be thrown a curve ball but once again it needs to work because if not I could honestly care jack shit about it. To me the main goal was always to have a more casual accessible version of P3 and that’s what reload is. It’s a version made for people who just Finished playing P5R and needed a way to play that’s more beginner friendly and not just a watered down PSP port. Overall I heavily disagree especially with your sentiment towards the end. It makes it sound like “god forbid the series becomes easier for a bunch of casuals” like I know your actual point was to drive home the fact of each game being unique and having its own identity but it needs to properly sell those ideas for people to care on that deep analytical level because If not nobody’s gonna really give a shit (a majority obviously not all. There will obviously be those who care and more power to you). Again obviously your not some high all authority but man it really sounds like god forbid most players just want a casual experience. Again I don’t disagree with that we can’t have best of both worlds when it comes to having both a casual experience as well as retaining what makes the original so good but overall just having it be easy to pick up and play is something I will always stand by. If more remakes are like reload then yeah anything to make the experience all the easier and enjoyable. Not everyone needs to appreciate the experience on that deep of a level so long as the intended take away is still intact. Edit: it seems like some on the other side of the debate didn’t quite get the memo so I will reiterate what I mean by casual. When I’m taking about accessibility I’m taking about basic QOL and just making the game easier to simply pick up and get into. Things like removing the forced AI, the tired mechanic, forced romance and just basic stuff most people would genuinely complain about. The challenge in the original PS2 release felt artificial ether because of limitations or how it was intentionally designed. A version of the game that plays like portable without it also being limited is what me and a lot of people really wanted. Again referring to what I specifically said (seriously come on I literally stated this as clear as ever) I’m not opposed to being challenged or having to actually think or be thrown a curve ball. You know a game can be hard without having the bullshit that made it artificially so in the first place right? And even then I was also suggesting at least some of those mechanics could have still been included as maybe a small side option. Now as far as in the context of what we got (while no doubt easy and different in art direction) I don’t personally have too much a problem with. Overall while it’s flawed in a few aspects Reload is a damn polished work that definitely oozes passion which is why I took issue with Nams sentiment towards the end. More games like reload that are instead probably more balanced and serve a unique experience shouldn’t be a bad thing. We aren’t in that classic PS2 era anymore and yeah that’s perfectly fine. You can have your preferences as well but please don’t be a dickhead about it (you know EXACTLY who you are. Seriously fuck you nobody cares)

[@BEST_PIZZA_IN_THE_WORLD]

I 100% Agree, Nam's take is pretty much a repost of some other videos I've watched about how P3R butchered the gameplay and since now it's easier it's a not worthy or bad game, making it seem as if 90% of the people didn't played it just because the characters and the story, I'm not a big JRPG fan, in fact I've only played Persona, I played PS2 P3 as my first Persona title and I loved it, every single detail about the game but I don't think Reload is a worst game just because it's not as hard or harder or has "depth" like how depressing has to be to not enjoy a game because it doesn't have "more depth" into the combat, I have played P3 (PS2), P4G, P5R, and even tho I love P3 (PS2) and is my second favorite, P3R updated the characters and story enough for me to put it as my fav, it is true that the original cutscenes were better but besides that I loved way more how everything is presented in reload than in the original, reload made me cry at the end PS2 ver only made me sad, and that's what is important to me.

[@digimonlover1632]

I heavily agree with this. I’ll admit Reload isn’t perfect, but my god are people unbelievably harsh on it. It’s absolutely faithful lol.

[@TheCreed1217]

@digimonlover1632 some argue its too faithful and to that I say, that was the point? It's not perfect but for me its fucking great treatment for my favorite story in the franchise. I'll play this again for years before I EVER go back to FES and I''ve played that 4 times. Persona team did good with the most important part of reload: its story, characters and save for a few hiccups its overall presentation

[@organbandage4822]

I feel like Nam didn’t fully remove his nostalgia goggles when comparing the two, and I’ve felt similarly about other reviews. It’s obviously hard to do, but I was expecting a bit more nuance from Nam. It shouldn’t have to be a one to one recreation of FES. It can still be Persona 3 while having a distinct identity from the other versions. Overall, it felt like Nam wanted a remake of FES just with new graphics and a few QoL features, and couldn’t separate his expectations from the actual experience. Reload is not perfect, but I don’t think he really judged it as a stand alone experience. It is fair to compare it to the original, but at a certain point, a game needs to be judged as a singular experience. Overall, i feel like bro was not cooking with this video.

[@BLIZZ2012]

@@organbandage4822 no it has nothing to do with nostalgia as he clearly states himself. It’s as simple as a complete difference in Philosophy. What he values is the initial artistic intent of the original to be kept which is fine and all but as he also stated in the beginning the original PS2 release of P3 isn’t what you consider to be everyone’s cup of tea. To him what can be considered a creative choice is obviously an annoying or divisive mechanic to the rest. Reload being more casual and removing those specific mechanics that “set P3 apart from the rest” is what me and most wanted out of reload. Not to say the game doesn’t need retooling or balancing but the problem I have the most is sort of this sentiment that people wanting entry’s similar to P5 is a bad thing. Like just wanting to like the game simply for its story and characters is surface level or the fact the game’s are a bit easier for new players. It’s the tone of “god forbid they turn older games into ones like reload” that really rub me the wrong way. Like I fully understand older atlus games have a special flavor but your talking about a new audience who just want something a bit more approachable (more challenging but approachable) and reload being safe and yet still be able to get the message that the original was trying to tell is very serviceable and where I strongly stand. Obviously I want games to be unique and have their own voice but in the case of P3 it’s clear there needed to be a more easier version without any of the bullshit that anyone can pick up and enjoy

[@braxinIV]

Unless they somehow build the smartest AI possible, commanding the teammates directly is the better system. Constantly having to switch your teammates tactics depending on the fight already feels like direct commands but with extra steps. Like, it’s one thing when you gotta roll dice to determine whether or not your action hits, but it’s a completely different and NOT fun thing when the action is also basically RNG.

[@azfaarrealm9426]

But why couldn't they have both?

[@Magicdfox]

Missed the point. Sure tactics is not the most powerful tool for the player but it was intentional decision to serve the story. If you want to ignore that and use the direct command system, I support you having access to it. But why did they need to gut the tactics system and make it far less attractive of an option and no longer serve the same role in enhancing the narrative goal and characterization? Why couldn't we both have direct commands but also an actually similar or at least 1:1 tactics system from the original? Or hell, even use the one from P5R since it at least was willing to use all the tools available.

[@braxinIV]

@@Magicdfox nah, the point misses itself by being so janky. not everything that serves the story will serve the gameplay. There’s a reason why video game characters sprint everywhere as opposed to just walking like normal humans. The characterization from making their own decisions falls flat when they pick options that only computers with bad AI algorithms would make. It’s a constant reminder that you’re playing a game with janky mechanics, takes away from the immersion.

[@Magicdfox]

@@braxinIV I agree being super janky makes it less impactful, that’s why it doesn’t work in reload at all where it kind of worked in the original. Again though, your gripe with it is already solved with direct command so why ruin the system entirely instead of actually trying to improve it when you can have direct command for people like you?

[@VincentEternal]

Amazing video. Really highlights how fundamentally different the original and Reload are and does a great job on explaining why you personally didn’t agree with the changes and differences. While I didn’t agree with every point this video was a very well done analysis.

[@VermillionLotus96]

I gotta say I disagree with most of the points made in this video. For me, this is easily the definitive way to experience Persona 3. That's coming from someone who enjoyed FES, Portable, the movies, and the manga too. This is exactly what I wanted from a Remake, and honestly, I see this as a good standard for Remakes. Like RE1 Remake. For me, it captured the soul of the original while only adding to the experience. It's sad to hear it didn't do the same for you. That being said, I watched this video to the end and gave it a fair shake. I appreciate your honesty feelings, and your points / perspective are definitely valid. It's just, at least for me, mostly everything you brought up was of minor impact compared to everything I feel this game does right. No, it's not perfect, but at the end of the day, it hits every point it needs to for me. I love modern Persona gameplay, and I wanted to explore one of my favorite stories in gaming with that style. Ultimately, not many people liked what they did with the original. It is unique, and I had fun with it, but I vastly prefer the gameplay of 4 and 5. In my mind, why remake Persona 3 the exact same way? This provides a gameplay experience unique from the original. And I know you said you don't like this argument, but I feel it's apt. The original is still there to experience as it was. I personally don't have much reason to anymore. I was worried about it being too similar to 5, but I think they did a good job of taking advantage of quality of life improvements in the newer entries while still making this game feel unique from P5 in presentation and style. I really like the limit breaks too, and I love how thematically relevant to the characters they are. The linked episodes and personality traits tell me the makers of Reload worked hard to understand these characters. There's plenty of other ways the gameplay subtly conveys the game's message I feel you didn't really talk about. It's not totally simplistic, at least in my view. Anyway, this game stayed addictive and fun for me the whole way through. I think it appeals to a lot of people, and that's not a bad thing. I don't want to take away from that experience if that's what people want. And yes, if you so choose, you can restrict yourself and essentially do challenge runs off you like. I prefer to let people who want these mechanics to have them, rather than the sentiment "why should I have to adjust for 'better balance'". Why? Because that's the experience you're looking for. Don't deprive others of the experience they're looking for. P3R does a great job at making this stuff optional, better than P5R, where you can't stop Futaba from giving you buffs. Or you can't stop the social link perks of you wanna experience the SLs. Now those perks come from optional night stuff. Fuuka's buffs are an optional theurgy. I'm not saying the gameplay experience you're looking for is invalid, I'm just saying it's undeniable that this holds more appeal for more people. This game's story is too good not to reach as many people as it can. Hell, the voice acting alone makes this experience all worth it. And it holds pretty much all of the content from various versions of P3 I wanted. Minus FeMC, that is. I'm really excited for The Answer. I think the gameplay improvements will make that a lot more bearable for people to play. If you happen to read all this, thanks for hearing me out, too. I really like your content, even if we don't see eye to eye here. Great video 😄

[@vietnguyen2293]

Hard disagree with the “why should I have to adjust the game to cater to me”. That’s what the difficulty settings are for. Since this game was trying to appeal to more masses and its most likely many peoples entry title, they should’ve considered balancing hard and merciless for more veteran players. Anyone looking for an easier time should stick to normal mode. Saying that it’s optional takes away accountability from Atlus when they should’ve did more balancing to accommodate the new gameplay additions. Portable made it clear that Direct Party Control made the game easier and Fes’s challenge came from lack of party member control. Now they added theurgy’s and buffed all party members without giving the enemies stronger moves and damage output. Challenge runs are an optional way to play. They’re fun. However they shouldn’t be the norm for people who want a challenge, which Atlus could’ve easily provided in the harder difficulties. But instead they dumbed it all down

[@alexandersmith4731]

​@@vietnguyen2293I also don't get folks who dismiss ones that wants challenges in games, it's a freaking game, some difficulties or actual hard ones are supposed to be there, games are supposed to be repeatable and have rewards for completing challenges, otherwise just say you want to create JRPG version of David Cage *Games*

[@VermillionLotus96]

@vietnguyen2293 You have a good point there. The balancing could be better. Killing bosses in one blow is a bit much. It's not perfect. I guess it boils down to what exactly you're looking for. I guess what I was trying to get to was that, at least for me, if I properly buff myself and set up for my theurgy for max return on it, I'm happy when I do insane damage. It's satisfying for me. I like feeling like a badass in that way. They could've definitely made them harder to charge up, but at the end of the day, I was satisfied with the experience.

[@vietnguyen2293]

@@alexandersmith4731 nah for sure. i’ll never understand it. i get that some players just want to coast along their video games but that’s literally what peaceful and normal mode is for. at least there is an option for them. veterans and people who like challenge get the short end of the stick and they always get told to limit themselves like it’s not because of poor game design

[@vietnguyen2293]

@@VermillionLotus96 i hear you. i’m not saying that it makes the game horrible, i still had a lot of fun despite the lack of challenge. i just never felt a sense of accomplishment as high as i did in FES considering theurgy’s were poorly balanced

[@elijahfyffe5176]

I think a part of the problem is also the age of the playerbase. There are many modern persona fans who weren’t even BORN before persona 3 came out. Seriously, there are adults younger than P3. The themes and time may be completely alien to many players. So they may prefer reload simply because the atmosphere is more modern. I myself don’t intend to play Reload because I’ve already played FES (and FES is my favorite game of all time). Partially, this is because I know I’ll be biased against the remake. And the other half is because I don’t want to spend 4 times the amount that I bought FES for. Persona definitely appealed to me as a high schooler, and changed my life. But, I’m not the target audience anymore. I still think that FES was a masterpiece, the gameplay, the story, the *writing* (my favorite part of it). It felt unfair, but that’s the point. I’ve always wanted to see a remake of Persona 1 and 2 IS/EP. But with how the people in charge have changed, I’m not so sure. Maybe it’s best left untouched. The last thing I’d like to see is such a master class in tone be made into a more arcade style. I didn’t imagine that I’d ever be the out of touch, old man. And certainly not before I was out of college.

[@elijahfyffe5176]

Side note: I feel like games no longer mesh gameplay with message. Such as party control. Sometimes, less is more.

[@ChrisS-nb1bz]

Definitely agree something feels off. It feels like the shell of persona 3 is here but the heart isn’t

[@frogglen6350]

Aka. Nostalgia bias

[@ShadowOfMassDestruction]

@@frogglen6350 Well we could definitely tell you didn't watch shit.

[@ShadowOfMassDestruction]

@@frogglen6350 Well we can definitely tell you didn't watch the video...

[@showerthoughts1015]

Love how he just doesn't acknowledge emulating the original p3 p3f or p3p as an option. It is logical that the game is going to feel completely different because 17 years have passed since the original. Most of the original developers would have probably quit by now. Trying to make it feel more like persona 5 is what killed the mood.

[@ACEDonnell]

Im starting to think im the only one that never had enough twilight fragments

[@howisthis8849]

where the hell were you spending them

[@ACEDonnell]

@@howisthis8849 only locked chest and mainly on the ones on guardian floors. I had bad rng and got less then 10 blue breakable things in tartarus, and I had about 5 dark floors throughout my play through. Finished the game with 7 twilight frags left...

[@ChiangKai-Shrek]

Damn same. They're so hard to come by unless you grind dark floors or something

[@thelegendaryace1395]

The technique with Twilight Fragments is to not use it on chests on non-guardian floors except if you're looking to activate the Great Clock. You can gain those items you miss later on.

[@RenniganEagle]

​@ACEDonnell your first mistake was spending them on locked chests. You should *only* ever spend them on the 3 fragment chests. Those are the chests with actually useful gear. The 1 and 2 frag chests can be completely avoided and you miss nothing

[@avatartun3r]

I think this is a thoughtful and well structured video. The title put me a bit on edge, but it's hard to really disagree with most of your points. Also DQ8 is great, glad you liked it 😁

[@chrislee5268]

I played FES, and I think Reload is the definitive version.

[@ShadowOfMassDestruction]

Only by virtue of it being easier to play and comprehend for people who put forth no effort to learn but all of the cool things are gone. Small details make a big impact and Reload leaves so many out.

[@KevinPhil1990]

Idk if this would work well, but I think a way to balance out Theurgy's a bit would be to make it so that whatever the specific thing each party member has to do to fill the gauge is the ONLY way to charge it. Summoning their Personas and hitting weaknesses etc wouldn't build the gauge anymore. So, Yukari's only charges upon healing team members, Junpei's only charges with Crits etc (however, Mitsuru's will have to be tuned, since a lot of mid to end game enemies are just straight up immune to ailments, as we all know.) It would make sense from a narrative perspective too. I believe Yukari's description for building Theurgy is something like "the desire to protect her friends grows" which makes sense, as she's the healer... but if for an entire encounter, she never needs to heal, then she doesn't NEED to protect the party... so why would her Theurgy gauge build at all? Also, maybe make it so they can't pierce resitances. In that way, if an enemy nulls or drains it, it would be wasted, therefore making Theurgy's require more thought and strategy rather than "unga bunga I win" Also, bring back the chance for Oracle to have a negative impact, like you mentioned.

[@Djwt845]

That’s literally how it works in game the therugy charging when you hit the enemies weakness only applies to the main character

[@KevinPhil1990]

​@@Djwt845 no, it happens for other characters too, it's just MC has the biggest charge from that

[@Djwt845]

@@KevinPhil1990 huh must have made a mistake then sorry

[@KevinPhil1990]

@@Djwt845 nah, you're alright :)

[@Djwt845]

@@KevinPhil1990 that being said I do have my own issues with Nam’s video as a whole while he does make some good points on the gameplay side of things something’s it feels like he’s defending genuinely problematic game design purely on the basis that it makes the game harder (ex his section on fusion spells orgia mode the difficulty spikes fatigue system) and that his video comes off as completely biased and not willing to give reload a fair chance compared to its predecessor even over some of the more trivial aspects of the game if that’s fine

[@thynErro]

I played through Reload with my partner who knew absolutely nothing about Persona games. All the of the cutscenes in Reload worked really well for him, were impactful, and made him realize why people like this series. I think the nostalgia goggles are blinding you just a little bit. I think people are just a little too emotionally attached to the original releases to ever truly give this remake the fair shake it deserves.

[@shadowfire1500]

I'm gonna repeat myself from my response to the community post, but I 100% agree on the cutscenes. Like you pointed out at 1:02:28, the Orpheus awakening hits no where NEAR hits as hard due to the change in animation and direction. But yeah, you really summed up by my thoughts on Reload. I managed to get it cheap from a GameStop, so I'm not too upset about pricing, though I understand those who are, but it does feel like it could've been more. Little improvements all around for sure (Especially with Shinjiro's story), but overall I doubt it'll be given the same fondness the original did. It's not bad, but still a step down. Regardless, great vid, looking forward to the next, my dude.

[@usrnmntavlibl2666]

27:53 Fatigue would be basically perfect if the party exp system from 5 was implemented into reload along side fatigue. That one change would add the intended forced party variation and forced experimentation without basically shutting down your Tartarus run due to under leveling/uselessness.

[@WackNoir]

very good point

[@SariniyaKiyu]

bro, you are the FIRST person I am hearing that APPRECIATES the lack of total control of your teammates in the original P3/FES. Instant subscribe click. Not only I realised the usually monotone battles were goin way faster, I also loved how I felt like my teammates were their own people. As much as seeing Yukari miss for the hundreth time was irritating, lmao, I really loved this nuanced part of the gameplay.

[@RedHairShanks-bb3dc]

Same here sir, I actually liked that gameplay

[@CoastalSpark23]

Might be your best video to date. Though my personal feeling with Reload mostly don’t align with yours, I greatly appreciate how you painstakingly went out of your way to explain your POV while also realizing that many people aren’t going to have the same opinions as you. Truly an amazing video.

[@Manimal1920]

persona 3 lost its wallet

[@NobuKage404]

LMAOOO

[@PathBeyondTheDark]

I almost 100% agree about the atmospheric issues mostly during the Dark Hour. It is VERY green. What else need be said? There's making something too bright like most modern games do when recreating something, then there's just making it NEON GREEN. GREEN is a whole new standard of bad. It's eerie... kinda, but in no stretch of the imagination is it ominous or filling you with that sense of dread. It's hard to believe the one(s) making that decision felt the same thing from the original as Persona 3 Green. So why is the question when nothing else has been significantly altered outside brightness and quality? I also agree that the cutscene direction took a step backward. The key moments in the original were almost universally better presented in said original, barring perhaps the very last scene with Aigis and the MC (though the too much dialog issue is there as well). Where I differ a fair amount is in the gameplay. I do agree it is poorly balanced especially around Theurgy. Scarlet Havoc is... wtf were they thinking? Siegfried comes with everything you need built in to break that skill as well, no fusion baton passing necessary and therefore no sense of accomplishment. Just fuse him and Mithras and there you go, game over assuming you gave Yuki some of your time. The MC is a solo nuke, so much so it's easier to solo the game then rely only on your party members (I've done both types of runs, though by 2/3 of the way into the game the party does start getting dumb as well but at least that requires effort on the player's part, not just fuse Siegfried). But other then that, I really enjoy the combat and new Tartarus. I am someone who cannot stand not having control of party members and so am willing to lose the intention even narratively. At some point creative direction becomes pretentious or "being creative for creative's sake" aka not adding anything worthwhile and I feel less control in a video game, which is meant to be as controllable as possible in order to separate it from reality (where it feels like nothing is in your control), is always a detriment. I agree though that the option to use an improved AI controlled party should have been something they did. It may be just a novelty for myself in-particular, but those who like that system would get what they want and the spirit would have been kept intact for those players. It would have been nice to have the option of other weapon types for the MC, but it's not a huge deal for me. But I think the biggest disagreement comes in the form of Skill Cards. On the contrary, I think this game took a step back in terms of ease of access. It is entirely RNG now tha determines what you receive rather then just obtaining the card from a Persona and being guaranteed that card. As you can tell, I like Skill Cards in general. It gives you something else to pursue alongside the skills not available as such and so fusion inheritence is still important. Instead of there being only one extremely tedious mechanic to have to deal with, you have two equally important but less stressful mechanics to consider. And yet it still requires preparation and time, ie effort. It's just the right amount rather then hours of figuring out every convoluted fusion outcome just to get that one Skill on a Persona.

[@mikethepokemaster2012]

Just play the OG or fes if you dont like the Remake lol

[@Ryzer235]

@@mikethepokemaster2012nam literally says at the beginning of the video that that isn’t a good reason not to criticise reload. Sure you could play the original if you want, but that’s not what this conversation is about.

[@Skeiths]

I mostly enjoyed my time with Reload as someone who's favorite Persona game is the original P3. But it was the little things that rubbed me the wrong way, For one the atmosphere of the game just isn't as eerie or disturbing as it was in the OG, this is immediately apparent in the first cutscene, there's also things like the gunshot for the evokers not sounding nearly as hard-hitting as the original, the lighting of the dorm and some of the scene changes, one that really stuck out to me which bothers me that more people don't talk about is the scene in the boat when they're heading to Yakushima, in the original it's somber and depressing and it felt so real, that kind of stuff made it stand out from P4 and P5 especially for newer players but in the remake they just make it so they're suddenly all normal and happy despite not much time passing.

[@cheesycheese7100]

atmosphere is china brand anime game

[@PTRaisin]

I want to ask since I'm a Reload Player. Why was the Yakushima cutscene in the original so depressing? Is there anything leading up to it that? I simply don't get why they're depressed compared to the Remake.

[@Skeiths]

@@PTRaisin Yes there was it was almost directly after when Yukari basically exposes Mitsuru for deceiving them into joining S.E.E.S. After that if you recall there's a segment where it shows the whole team on their own dealing with their own individual problems, Aki talking about Shinji about his dead sister and saying that Yukari made him think twice about his reason for fighting, Junpei was still pissed mostly at himself for not being as good as MC, Yukari thinking about her dead dad, etc.

[@PTRaisin]

@@Skeiths Watching the Reload one back, I see it, Now i can understand it from two different POVs, because in Reload it seems like everyone is finally getting a bit of escapism from their issues, except for Mitsuru, who has to confront her dad. However it's also one of the parts in Reload I think show don't tell comes through, Imo. Specifically the Mitsuru Part.

[@bencarter7582]

That whole opening in the original Fes, Was creepy. Before we even meet Yukari we see, the tap running she pressed barefoot up against the sink with a gun to her head. Like until were told what was happening (The evoker, summoning persona etc), after meeting her all I could think was. 'She tried to game over herself is she ok?' it's an unsettling feeling that permeates through a lot of the game, something that Reload fails to capture in my opinion.

[@Adoochi]

I said this before on another video, but Reload feels more like a remake of Portable than it does FES. Mechanically it shares way more in common with Portable.

[@petergriscom3431]

Agreed. I know the whole engine copyright issue is a huge part of why they ported P3P and not FES, but it's probably no coincidence that they ported the version of P3 that would have the most favorable comparison to Reload, having no visuals, P4's combat engine, and sharing the same script.

[@librathebeautifulwarmonk1283]

Can't say i agree with this video as a whole, Reload made me like Persona 3 again, before, FES and especially Portable left a bad tatse in my mouth compared to 4 and 5. However i respect your opinon and will give your video its due respects. Its very well made You also make some good points, like the protag being stuck with swords. That was one of the few things in Persona 3 i wish stayed in the franchise

[@NamsCompendium]

on the bright side it's coming back for metaphor. i guess when hashino left to work on that game, he took the multiple weapon types with him

[@librathebeautifulwarmonk1283]

​@@NamsCompendiumSame some weapons for the rest of us why don't ya

[@Jdudec367]

@@librathebeautifulwarmonk1283 *Save some, sorry I just saw that and it kinda annoyed me lol

[@librathebeautifulwarmonk1283]

​@@Jdudec367i didnt catch the typo so thanks

[@Hyziant]

While I do like P3R, I do wish we got a remake of persona 1 in the modern style instead. Would’ve been far more of a significant remake, since P3 already plays in the modern style and is already quite popular.

[@ReiSyre62]

If P1/2 get remake/remastered treatment. I prefer SMTIV / SMTV Style of gameplay and Modern Persona Trilogy Writing of Story.

[@CowDriller]

That's exactly what I've been saying since the remake got announced P3 FES never needed a remake P1 and 2 deserved one waaayy more

[@codyb.3015]

Wouldn't have sold near as well and would have taken a lot more work. But I would love a P1 remake like that, never happening, maybe a remaster.

[@ShioSatou]

Please do not remake P1 in the style of modern persona i beg. As a massive fan of that game, I'm way too afraid that they'd ruin it like they already tried to with PSP

[@nightvision999]

I've only played Portable, cause that's what they released a year ago, and so can't really comment on a lot of the specific changes, but this video highlights a lot of my issues with remakes in general. This new flashy thing that follows the same general narrative, but abandons all the unique quirks of the game it's adapting and instead adopts current industry trends to make it more 'modern', which consequentially makes everything feel the same. A Persona 5 reskin does not capture the spirit of Persona 3 because, as you say, a game is more than it's characters and story. Gameplay, presentation and narrative all work together to create a singular experience that you simply won't have if you play a version that drastically changes any one of these elements. And the issue isn't that the remake is different; there can be a place for different interpretations of the same material. The issue is that the original will be forgotten. People act like it's the same thing, just better, so no one has any reason to check out the original. And Atlus certainly doesn't have any incentive to release it again, either. They will say, you can experience the entire Persona series, so why complain? But art pieces are always products of their time. And this Persona 3 simply isn't that Persona 3.

[@ParakeetDSi]

Honestly im disappointed about how the MC can't use multiple weapon types

[@highwindknight]

That is one of the biggest disappointment. It also removes a potential emotional connection that you can have. To specify, after a certain event happened, my MC only equipped one type of weapon, more specifically the weapon I found in the box left behind. And seeing him standing there in the final boss fight with that weapon in hand and those final words, it rang even further emotionally for me. Knowing that this possibility is removed entirely in different versions of Persona hurts.

[@Jdudec367]

@@highwindknight Even as somone who hasn't beaten P3 yet but got past oct 4th...I think I know what you mean.

[@p0mf47]

its also in portable you cant use different weapons but its good. it made you rethink your strategy who you will bringing in tarturus.

[@Observer909]

The tactics system is a piece of shit in the OG persona game. You can develop individualism in characters without meddling with the core game mechanic, it's called proper storytelling.

[@jerry3115]

As a massive fan of the original, I was really happy with Reload up until the last quarter or so of the game. As you said in the video, the first couple months were done extremely well in terms of difficulty and gameplay balance, and once that started to go away, the new content was able to keep me interested for a while, and overall it was still really solid. My issues started to flood in during the lategame. The new content dried up almost entirely, and the gameplay lost any difficulty as I 1hkoed even the strongest bosses with scarlet havoc. The final boss went from a fight I had to do everything in my power to prepare for to something I breezed through without much thought at all. When the credits rolled, I barely even felt anything. For the longest time, I couldn't really figure out why any of this was. Was I just overexposed to Persona 3? Was Reload bad? Did I just have my expectations too high? I'm still not sure, but I do agree with the vast majority of the points made in this video (even if I think some of them are pretty nitpicky), so that says a lot. I dunno. I'm just frustrated.

[@ReconNarwhal]

I don’t think Persona 3 “lost its identity”. It’s its own game distinct from the original 3, but plenty of the DNA is still there. One of the things I respect about it is its reverence of the original’s ending. They didn’t cave into the massive fan demand for an alternate ending to save Makoto. Even after all the side game content alluding to a possible Makoto return. While we don’t know what this remake will do in the DLC, I’m somewhat confident that it will continue to respect the original’s theme of mortality and the value of life. The dev team respects what Persona 3 stood for and that’s the most important aspect to answering this question of whether this remake lost its identity. The gameplay system differences definitely set it apart from P3 and more towards a P5 style game, but I’m not so dismissive of this. Many of the gameplay systems in 3 were a product of console limitations and old school game quirks as much as they were design philosophy. I agree with some of the critiques about the gameplay changes, but the conclusion doesn’t land. That feeling of dread as the final dungeon draws near, the hopeful spirit in the face of despair as you accept the threat of death head on, and the weight of the fallen on those who carry on their legacy are all still felt like the original. It’s an evolution of Persona 3 just as much as it is a remake and I don’t think that’s a negative thing. Also, I’m not so cynical of the P5 gameplay elements. It’s not just because of its popularity that they likely chose to adopt them. I think that’s only part of the story. Persona as a franchise has been slowly evolving its gameplay across the core titles. This current gameplay style is what modern Persona has morphed into. P3R is being made with modern Persona sensibilities, but also the mindset of Atlus on what Persona is now. That objection you addressed at the beginning about the original always being there to return to isn’t just a way to be dismissive of critiques as you portrayed it. It’s true. I don’t view that as a dismissal of your criticisms in the way I use it. It more so speaks to how the two can coexist without one being a copy of the other. The original will always have the tactics system as part of its gameplay identity to set itself apart from Reload. Yet, is that damning enough to say Reload lacks the essence of 3? I don’t think so. Everyone has their own perspective on where the lines are drawn with regard to what constitutes a faithful remake. Not everyone values the omissions like multiple weapon types the way you do. That and some of these other changes are not a hill I’d die on when deciding if P3R retains P3’s identity. The only “core values” 3 doesn’t respect from the original are gameplay related. Thematically it does go a long way to respect 3. In the same way FF7 remake/rebirth respect FF7 while having its own mix of action and turn based combat rather than the ATB system. Reload could’ve evolved the tactics system in a similar way to 7 remake evolved the ATB system for its own.

[@marcusclark1339]

its not distinct or on its own, it uses the original brand name for marketing, for its relevance and for those that never played original they'll assume this is largely the same as original giving a poor interpretation of that original work the fact its $70 selling dlc for content that should be in the base game is telling to how soulless this game is to just be a safe bet game to microtransaction more of the players gullible enough to buy it

[@KaueBR89]

Perfect

[@Nerevarine420]

​@@marcusclark1339lmao poor interpretation of the work ? Bfr have you played p3 in years?

[@nightmarearcade2663]

I remember once making a joke about this game saying that even though this is persona 3, Atlus still can't help but milk person 5. And visually it's all I can think of with this game.

[@MugdhaMahdiShams]

A game in the same series looks similar, shocker.

[@FakeStuff5]

​@@MugdhaMahdiShams Indeed. Though i do get his point. Where other games like OG persona 3 to persona 4 was very different. Persona 5 to reload wasn't the biggest visual change. Tho personally i do think it changed enough for me to still feel unique

[@criminalsen2441]

No I totally agree with you. The bright, pop-art style really doesn't work for this game in my opinion. They could've at least tried to maintain the original color palette:/

[@nightmarearcade2663]

Heck it isn't even just the visuals for me. Even the speed at which you run while in Tartarus reminds me of 5. Doesn't help that there's persona 5 costumes for the party members either. I always like it how each title had it's own unique sense if style in terms of presentation and using the style of Persona 5 for this remake I feel kinda ruins a lot of what made 3 so special presentation wise.

[@MugdhaMahdiShams]

@@nightmarearcade2663 This might shock you, but Persona 4 also felt like it was ripping off classic Persona 3 run animations. Shocker, I know.

[@KAPTAINmORGANnWo4eva]

I first got into Megaten when Spoony of all people reviewed Persona 4 and it sounded cool, so I actually played 3 after 4. A lot of the stuff in 3, like all but one of the S. Links and the whole Tarot motif, felt so much more natural and like they belonged in 3 compared to 4. I think when 4 and especially 4G made the main and side stories more about "let's enjoy these characters" than "let's look at the game's core themes from multiple angles," Persona lost something it only really had in 3. The 2 duology was more of a conventional JRPG story, and the games from 4 on were generally more lighthearted than 3's melancholy, but P3 captured a golden mean of almost every aspect of the game clearly and effectively working on multiple story and gameplay levels.

[@ibt2811]

To me, reload is just more fun, and in a video game, that’s all that really matters.

[@daveharrenburg7670]

It's always interesting to me seeing comments like this since I think of video games so entirely differently!

[@thegoodeboy2016]

@@daveharrenburg7670how do you view video games? Does enjoyment not interest you? Or do you get enjoyment from other things in a game?

[@papapalps2415]

'Fun', while very important for entertainment, and while it can and sometimes should be the primary motivation or general reason-for-being of a piece of art, is not and SHOULD NOT be the primary reason for everything. Art doesn't need to be 'fun' to be worth something, even if fun often is important and can go hand in hand with it. 'Fun' is a cheap, fickle thing, and it has no real deep meaning behind it. A game perhaps more than many art styles should be 'fun', but it also ideally should pursue something more important then mindless dopium. Mindless pursuit of that has killed any number of pieces of art, video game or otherwise.

[@daveharrenburg7670]

@@thegoodeboy2016 I play them for the artistic value they have, mainly through themes and how (ideally) all of the surrounding elements of a game support those themes. I actually get more enjoyment out of thinking about and discussing video games rather than playing them. I love to see all the ways video games are uniquely used as a medium for art that you just can't get from other mediums. I also view shows and movies similarly.

[@marcusclark1339]

that's just not having a standard its a censored, sanitized version of a game that lacks the charm the original had for the sake of broad appeal for over priced $70 with day one dlc and more for content that should be in the base product (FES) there's no good reason to buy it over p5 (ps3 EDITION!)

[@solomonpnq]

One thing I gotta say I love about reload so far is the way it approaches Shuffle Time and how you get experience for the Arcana of the the Persona you landed on. Among that and other game changes, I hope some mechanics like this one come back in later entries.

[@twilightvolt]

If there's one thing i'd also like to mention about Persona 3 Reload's tone shift, it's in it's promotional material. the main key art among other things is a lot brighter and more uhh..."anime" and adventurous than the original game's artwork, which gave off a more dark and dreadful atmosphere. y'know, like that iconic image of Thanatos coming out of the back of Makoto, his form melding with his uniform which was just as dark in color. artwork, color tones and lighting are surprisingly important. the marketing can make a difference since it gives the first impression before you even buy the game in the first place, and that marketing effected the presentation in game which was the part you covered in the video. you can probably tell i agreed wholeheartedly. The final boss fight with Nyx Avatar was the BEST example for me in that regard. cuz man, when i watched my friends play P3 for the first time through Reload, i saw that boss fight's presentation and thought "Damn, when did Hot Topic become a disco fever dream? Where's the dark clouds and soulless greys?" it just felt so...off. which kinda sucks considering i point new people to Reload since it's the easiest version to get into even if Portable is also easy to pick up now. it's Persona 3, but not the same Persona 3 i played in middle school when i probably shouldn't have. lol

[@digimonlover1632]

Maybe it doesn’t have to be the same.

[@debishvebishwish4839]

I still remember I bang my head harder during FES for that last battle, what grim cloud? That song is such a banger and all you can think about is the colour??

[@saltymint]

Me when my anime inspired video game has an anime style to it

[@ye9945]

You people are insufferable. Go play FES you weirdo.

[@doomdimensiondweller5627]

Digital Devil Saga was so great and I wish it was more popular. Glad to see it getting some love.

[@illusive-mike]

While I agree with a lot of things said in the gameplay section, there's one mechanic that I do believe shouldn't come back in the way that it was, one that had its design goals already accomplished on paper by other systems introduced in Persona 3 itself: fatigue. Yes, one-day crawls have become standard after fatigue went away, but that is an issue of balancing rather than systems. In keeping with the topic of gameplay representing the story experience, fatigue is already represented by the gradual depletion of SP during a crawl. In most RPGs, healing is a no-brainer. Whenever you reach a checkpoint of some sort, you can fully restore yourself for a nominal cost. Resources are balanced to get you to the next checkpoint, where you can once again easily heal. Persona 3's calendar changed that and introduced a risk-reward balance to this. You can clock out after reaching a new teleporter, or you can try to press on to get more done in a night. You're encouraged to be mindful of your SP use and presented with a meaningful risk if you try to continue while low. SP draining moves are also made particularly punishing because of this, as a bad encounter can shut you out of further progress even without killing you directly. You may even consider popping your SP restorative items during normal dungeon crawling just to squeeze out a bit of extra progress. It is, all told, an experience only Persona can provide. And it has been consistently underutilized. Any healing mechanics break this entirely, be it the Cups cards of P4G or Maruki's perks of P5R. P5 also makes it easier to rotate your party due to Mishima's Exp sharing, giving you a deeper SP pool with no downsides of grinding. Unfortunately, P3R misses the mark on this, badly. The Great Clock means that the size of your "bench" is unpredictable, but even without it the Twilight Fragments and SP restoratives are subject to random drops and farming and are generally far too abundant. At least P5 on paper had no way of fast SP recovery (for non-Joker party members) that wasn't in some way limited by calendar time.

[@justtmw]

It feels like Atlus wants to do a good SP management system, but they are afraid to make it punishing, hence why it's so inconsequential to the point it might not even exist. But that's where you can utilize difficulty options: make skills cost more on harder difficulties, or remove certain sp restoring items from pool so you cant farm them, or something else, but they just stick to difficulty options making numbers bigger

[@illusive-mike]

@@justtmw I think at least part of the problem here is what Nam said: Atlus aren't actively looking to make Persona difficult. For an SP+Calendar system to be properly impactful it has to be tuned right. Too far in either direction and you have either an unplayable game or P5. This means that a lot of work and playtesting has to go into getting the difficulty just right. But the kind of absolute bullshit that P3R has would never pass that kind of scrutiny, which means that if it was tuned at all it was only with the casual audience in mind. For an example of a different game series tackling a very similar issue, I would cite Fire Emblem. While the series has for most of its history used a linear game structure with a fixed number of missions, limiting grinding opportunities, Awakening on the 3DS allowed grinding and was very good at onboarding new players. Come the Switch entries, and the issue was resolved via difficulty settings, with Normal always allowing unlimited battles and Maddening never having free grinding. But in Engage in particular Maddening is clearly tuned for a specific non-trivial level of difficulty. Persona just doesn't seem to do that.

[@justtmw]

@@illusive-mike Oh yeah I fully believe that P3R had absolute bare minimum playtesting. If difficulty isn't the goal I do wonder why they even keep making 5 options. Hardcore audience won't see the difference between them anyway because none of it is tuned for them, casual audience won't even look at higher difficulties. Just make normal and easy and save yourself some development time

[@illusive-mike]

@@justtmw That would be exactly why the difficulty settings are mostly just multipliers on numbers. When an entire difficulty setting can be easily reduced to a single line in a table, it costs next to nothing to crank those numbers up. Sure, it doesn't actually serve the hardcore audience because making hard games is hard, but it's not like you're saving any time by not doing it.

[@justtmw]

​@@illusive-mike good point, I guess the answer was already in my question

[@bubbletea_]

this might be your best video to date, hands down. i don't even think i _cared enough_ to go into as much detail about it as you when i talked about this game. i'm genuinely proud of you.

[@willian4428]

it takes guts, good job man.

[@stormfallvalkyri8389]

I am sorry to see the hate youre getting over such a fair and well put together review. Please dont be afraid to speak your mind and continue the great work.

[@ulime]

another one geekin'

[@ForrestFox626]

I haven't seen any hate

[@ForrestFox626]

@@miikapm2 Oh. Yeah, that makes more sense.

[@GigaOtomia]

Around 27:30 you make the argument that "Tartarus is meant to be tackled at your own pace." Well, what if my pace is hyper quick? What if I *want* to get through all the content Tartarus has in one in-game night? I wouldn't be able to get through it at "my own pace", then. Tartarus was meant to be tackled in multiple sittings in the original P3. Say what you mean.

[@NamsCompendium]

If you want to get through all of Tartarus in one night in the original game, you can. You just need to have more party members unlocked and put up with the penalties of being tired. It’s possible, but they intentionally made it more difficult to do so. Friction in game design can be a good thing since it’ll encourage you to use mechanics that you otherwise wouldn’t think about using and properly ask you to manage your resources. You’re given over 10 somas throughout the entirety of persona 3 but you’d be hard pressed to find many people who’ve actually used many of those items by end game. It’s mostly a psychological thing since a lot of people have the whole “what if I need it later” mentality. By using somas, you’re able to bypass having party members abandon exploration since you don’t need to go to the first floor anymore. But at the same time, there’s added risks because you’re exchanging the option to save your game and get free healing for the ability to truly stretch the capabilities of your party members but at the cost of having them be more frail. It really makes you consider whether or not the risk of losing all of that progress is justifiable enough to clear out the block in one go. If you’re also worried about characters becoming tired, there’s nothing stopping you from trying to run past every enemy and only fight the bosses, but good luck if you lack the proper skills to do so. It’s all about finding the proper balance between taking out trash mobs and fighting bosses. But if you really want to maximize your visits in Tartarus, it’s up to you to make the most out of all of your party members. Hell you can even fly solo if you really want to but good luck taking on some of the tougher floors underprepared. I even use footage in this video of me playing with only three party members that are all suffering from fatigue because I wanted to get the most out of that visit As I mentioned in the video it’s not a perfect system and it’s not hard to think of ways it could be improved. Having a way to properly measure when a character is about to become tired and how much stamina they gain when levelling up would be very helpful since it would allow players to judge what fights are worth their time or not. Ultimately I find the fatigue system to be a good source of friction that adds a lot to the dungeon crawling and I would’ve much rather have seen a proper update of the mechanic rather than for it to be dropped entirely. You can control how long you want to stay in Tartarus for in the original game and clear out almost every block in one go. the only difference is that it’s actually a challenge to do so.

[@zerron2156]

Average gamer pace

[@zerron2156]

​@@NamsCompendiumalso hi 👋

[@Trakesh]

That's literally what I did in the original. Speedrun Tartarus in one night. It wasn't even that bad.

[@Alex_Barbosa]

You can do that in FES. It was designed to be a challenge if you attempted it. It's possible, but alot harder.

[@BocchitheGwak]

My only complaint, where the fuck is Memento Mori

[@RedHairShanks-bb3dc]

They removed it, the game was toned down that's why I hate this game. They probably trying to revive MC in the future installment, thus the reason why it's not as Dark as before

[@ShadowOfMassDestruction]

The more time goes on and I try to bring back the positivity I had pre-release the more this game disappoints me every time I hear about it...

[@FoxyAreku]

The fact that a mod existed very shortly after release that made the AI controlled team members in reload bareable/much better really shows how easy it would have been to have both options.

[@Soniman001]

I have never played a turn based rpg in my life where I would prefer if the characters were AI controlled

[@FoxyAreku]

@@Soniman001 one person’s opinion doesn’t invalidate the opinion of those who would enjoy the option.

[@Soniman001]

@@FoxyAreku I just don’t think it’s surprising why a feature 1% of gamers would enjoy was axed to focus on them making them actual playable characters

[@jman2856]

@@FoxyAreku”some folks prefer Kratos didn’t have a jump button n the GOW reboots.”

[@xzkilerymax8395]

naw

[@donniedouglas8187]

As someone who has thoroughly enjoyed the later persona games; I was apprehensive when I started this video. I've never played p3 on ps2 but I've played portable,p4golden, and royal and greatly enjoyed my time with each game. I couldn't stand many of the "quirks" that were in p3 like the fatigue mechanic and Tartarus, for example, I strongly believe the SEES team is the best in the series personally. While I do understand many the points made here, especially regarding the storytelling and art direction being more subtle and "mature" if you will; I can't deny that I still cried when I saw the makoto's death in reload and I felt compelled to immediately dive in for a 2nd playthrough so I could platinum the game. I'm still glad with what we got but I do have a greater appreciation for what the original p3 tried to do and I wouldn't have that if not for this video so thanks for being unapologetic in your arguments. You've earned a new subscriber because of it 😁

[@osricen]

See, I feel the same with this game as I feel with the Resident Evil 2 Remake. It's way better and a HELL of a product, but it just didn't tackle those little things that would've made it ideal. That said and even so, I prefer it to the original any day of the week. And I'm a 90s kid with a lot of bias for older games. Here's hoping P4/P4G Remake makes everything right, blows out expectations out of the rood and scratches every itch we might have. P.S. I'm still indecisive about Shadows. Should they be the weird things they were in P3 and 4? Or corrupted Personas like in P5? So we can enjoy their designs way more.

[@Shining.Umbreon]

TLDR: While I think its unfortunate that changes in a remake can alter the demographic a game appeals to, it is also true that calling a version superior to another is an injustice to both. I'm sorry to those who loved the original but felt that Reload lost some amount of its luster but in an equal amount I am happy for those who played Reload and found a game they liked even better than the original. I can definitely understand where the idea that characteristics and shifting alter the original game however i do disagree that it makes the experience worse, only different. I definitely agree with the notion that including tactics as an option was a huge miss. More options is almost always better and while i never use tactics myself the inclusion of tactics would be an objective positive. Main character weapon diversity is also a point that i missed. Having the option would again be an objective positive. For the fatigue system i have a similar opinion to the characteristics and shifting, different but not worse. I fundamentally disagree with the difficulty argument. The difficulty of a game should serve very little importance on a games quality as long as it is passable. Persona 3 Reload has passible difficulty. Difficulty and balancing should serve to prevent frustration. In games that are designed to be difficult, the difficulty serves to enhance the style the game is angling for but the difficulty needs to be established immediately as a constant in the game. By definition of being a Persona game with the fusion mechanic, they could never make a game that is impossible to become overpowered in without making the game insufferable for the average player. For the game to be fun for the majority of players the difficulty of the game can never increase far past what the developers believe the weakest player should be able to manage. The skill card and added skill argument is confusing. The argument that self imposed challenges are fit to be the "best" way to play a game is flawed, but for skill cards you do not have to keep yourself from using core mechanics of the game, shifting and theurgy, you just don't go out of the way to ruin the game for yourself? I have personally never used a skill card in any Persona game and don't feel like i have worsened or limited my experience. Tartarus argument, see characteristicts and shofting argument. The art direction argument, to put it bluntly, is literally just an opinion. Wether or not things are done "better" or "worse" is irrelevant because it will always be subjective. I understand that this is a weak rebuttal because as a whole pretty much all of this is subjective but i really don't understand why a subjective like or dislike of an art choice always needs to translate into a better or worse argument. To conclude my thoughts here i just think its hyperbolic to state that Persona 3 Reload is worse than the original. While it is indisputable that changes were made that could lead some people to have a better/worse time with Reload, I can't see a way to argue that Reload is objectively a worse game and i can't really see a way to argue for Reload being better either. Its unfortunate that someone could have a sharply different opinion on each version because of changes that were made in a remake but its very hard, of not nearly impossible, to argue for one vision for a game trumping another.

[@Niyariii]

Reviews are inherently subjective. It’s foolish to hear someone say one thing is better or worse than another and assume they’re attempting to make an objective claim. Nam is clearly saying Reload is worse (for him and people who share his values and perspective). Needing this to be spelled out for you is exactly why the writing in Reload took out any semblance of subtly, anything not spelled out for you goes over consumers’ heads TLDR it’s an opinion goofy, saying one thing is worse than another is reflective of your tastes and shouldn’t be prohibited or discouraged. Preferences and dissent should exist

[@Shining.Umbreon]

@@Niyariii The title of the video literally says the Reload has lost something from the original. If saying that something has been lost is not a claim that it is lesser then I couldn't tell you why. Titles and thumbnails are obviously emphasized because of the platform but the overall negativity of the video in its entirety gives the impression that the thought is that the game is lesser. Yes reviews are inherently subjective. This doesn't change my opinion that the video was presented in a manner that suggested that Reload is a complete failure of a game compared to the original even if that was not the intended message. Yes critique should be allowed. However critique should be meaningful and offer suggestions for improvement as well as display the positives. There is a difference between good faith critique and bad faith detraction. I do not think that Nam was arguing particularly in bad faith however several points that were made were presented less as "I believe that the game would be better with these changes" and more of "these changes are required for the game to stand up to the original". I think Nam is justified in releasing this video and justified for making the arguments that they did. You'll notice that at no point in my original comment did I reference Nam as a person because I had no intention of arguing on anything other than the points made. I also believe that in addition to dissenting opinions being healthy for critique it must also be ok for anyone to have a dissenting opinion about the critique .

[@greatsaiyaguy8868]

Personally it kinda stings to know that most people will never try the game you fell in love with, and instead go for the remake that took out what drew me in to playing it.

[@Niyariii]

@@Shining.Umbreon Reload HAS lost something though, that’s an objective statement because the game is far from 1 to 1 with the original. Whether or not what was lost is valuable or not is the subjective part, as well as whether or not something was gained in return. It simply seems like you’re using the “that’s your opinion” argument to dismiss criticism rather than accept it as you claim. Nobody ever says something along the lines of “that’s just your opinion” when it comes to a statement they agree with (e.g for you if you watched a review that praised the game I’m sure you’d leave a comment talking about how right they are). “That’s just your opinion” is thus a lazy way to semi-dismiss arguments you don’t agree with by attributing subjectivity to the argument, which is quite silly seeing as your arguments are just as subjective. I don’t have an issue with Nam’s critique, nor do I have an issue with your critique of his critique. I think they’re both healthy for the game and internet discussion as a whole. I do, however, disagree with some of your rhetoric and how you present your critique as you don’t seem to realize how dismissive your own critique is. Nam’s critique isn’t “correct”, it simply represents a perspective that people with his background would likely agree with. Same with your perspective. Him calling the game trash (which didn’t happen but for hyperbole’s sake) would be perfectly valid as it is his OPINION. That’s the part you don’t seem to understand. His view of the better vision is presented as his opinion, not fact. He compares the remake to the original because 1) the former is based on the latter and 2) while playing the game he has a reference point to how things could be alternatively executed, and thus a preference is born. Your basis for why you don’t like his critique seems to be solely rooted in the fact that you like the game and he doesn’t, rather than pointing out any intellectual failing on his part. His critique is consistent and offers a particular viewpoint, I guess I just don’t see the issue

[@Shining.Umbreon]

@@greatsaiyaguy8868 I completely understand that. It is just an inevitability that later versions will takeover the popular sentiment unless they're truly awful though so it's just something we have to get used to as fans. There's nothing stopping anyone from playing the other versions after playing Reload though (portable at the least).

[@varik5224]

i dont like that shuffle time appears before the results and cuts off the music so i cant time my all out attack with the music like P5 :(

[@spinballproduction9678]

Right? I have no idea why they thought that was a good idea.

[@ktli5648]

I'm so glad you pointed out the rubbish excuse of 'Persona was always easy' by using only the newer rereleases to dismiss terrible game balancing. Comparative dificulties exist, a game can be approachable to newcomers without being completely braindead. If the next Fromsoft game required you to handstand while playing it isn't okay just because 'they were always hard' - there are limits

[@theimpersonator7086]

Difficulty is the easiest way in most single player games for the devs to push the player to try/pay attention to the mechanics of any game. Like KH2 has a lot of complex mechanics, but was originally infamous for being button mashy/to easy. Lots of the bosses in KH2, and the series as a whole tbh, were not that threatening on Standard. It was Critical Mode in the FM version that really uped the difficulty and forced the players to use mechanics like Summons or Reflect. Also, it isnt a surprise that the most iconic bosses in the KH series are the humanoid ones, as they do a better job of difficulty and engagement than Giant Heartless

[@blues4509]

Funny enough when I expressed my distaste for Elden Ring's brand of difficulty being unbalanced imo people used that "it was always hard" excuse on me too lol. Someone that's played every Fromsoft game and never had any issues with the balancing itself in anything other than DS2 (even though I can still enjoy it)

[@ktli5648]

@@theimpersonator7086 Exactly, KH2 critical is a perfect example. Difficulty is not inherently tied to complex mechanics. I feel like P5R taught newcomers really bad habits of how to play RPGs by making spamming weaknesses alone completely viable. So when a boss comes along where you can't do that like Okumura, they call it 'bad game design'. Towards a boss, whose whole purpose is to be a wall to test your skills lmao

[@theimpersonator7086]

@@ktli5648 Yeah, goes back to the idea of Domiant Strat and the famous quote "Players will optimize the fun out of the video game." Difficulty is the perfect carrot on the stick for players, keeps them from boring themselves with mashing and incentivize them to try otherwise neglected mechanics.

[@Rumpelstiltskin01]

Yeah I agree I was having a conversation with someone that hated persona 4 after coming off of 5 because he could not get past the first lv. He kept claiming the game was too hard and it was the only a numbers game. when he just couldn't be bothered to learn how the 1 more system worked. Trying to rewrite the history by saying the games were always easy are the biggest lie I have ever heard.

[@pablozky21]

To me, it's interesting the difference of takes people can have on the game. To me, the original P3 was special, but there were areas that I felt where it lacked so strongly and I felt Reload came and finally gave it what it needed to pop as a Persona game I just don't like, but actually love: from what I feel is a much more inspired VA performance (especially for Fuuka) and then adding so much more activities so night isn't so dull, and all the moments to bond with your party in different ways, I just found it finally ended up living to the potential I thought the original was missing. Now, this is just my opinion, and if you love P3, FES and P3P much more than I did, then I can see why the remake didn't set the world on fire, but for me, it was a wonderful moment to see a game that to me I liked (especially the ending) become everything I wanted it to be

[@Festive_Mike_Pence]

ATLUS missed a perfect opportunity with Persona 3 Reload to change party control to a different system entirely. For example, As your S.E.E.S. rank increases through the story you will unlock new control factors in your party such as using items in early S.E.E.S. ranks, and being able to control skills in later S.E.E.S. ranks. This example also makes sense in the story setting for Persona 3, Why would a bunch of high schoolers follow my orders on how they should use their Persona? Sure, I might be the only person that can change Personas in the team but I still cant use their Personas. Over time as the story progresses and the bond with your team strengthens It would make sense that they would start to listen and trust you more as their leader. I think the Full Control system we ended up recieving in Persona 3 Reload was implemented to appease the influx of fans from recent popular SMT releases like Persona 5 that use the Full Control system. While I agree that the Full Control system can fit very well for some SMT games, I dont think it should have been added to Persona 3 Reload.

[@skybox6656]

That would be a excellent addition to the merciless mode

[@CrystAAHHL]

This is a really great video Nam!! Honestly, I agree with mostly everything and especially that in conclusion, Reload is just a very "safe" game in the end. I think that perfectly describes the remake at it's core that cover the driving force for every decision and change made to this game.

[@ye9945]

You can be honest and tell him how terrible this video is, I don't think he really cares. (Obviously)

[@raiseasato]

I'm genuinely surprised you agreed with him.

[@frogglen6350]

If reload is a very safe game, then so is the original since they both have the exact same narrative and setting

[@vivilover9409]

​@@frogglen6350Nam started a soul war in the persona community to be annoying on purpose. Disappointing usage of his platform. You guys think he'll make a video calling metaphor soulless and forced next month too?

[@ShadowOfMassDestruction]

​@@frogglen6350​​ Well you definitely clearly missed the entire point of what they were trying to say now didn't' you? Repeat that to yourself and ask yourself did what you just said make any kind of sense? 😑

[@jman2856]

“This isn’t the same Persona 3 anymore.” Well, yeah it’s called Reload. Reload is more of its own thing which is honestly something more remakes should do instead of being 1:1. I do think it’s interesting that Nam is probably in a similar position to the fans who were disappointed with OG P3 after coming off of the very early titles.

[@banana4335]

The "Persona 5 Effect"

[@ye9945]

you guys are so weird it hurts my head. P5 was the most successful title in the franchise you absolute trog, of course its the new standard. Cope.

[@JoelGarcia-lu3tw]

Good, P5 is the best persona game

[@mikethepokemaster2012]

Okay what wrong with that anybody popular people hate lol

[@BillyFrost1865]

@@mikethepokemaster2012i adore p5 so much but i dont want every persona game to be persona 5. Id like for every game to be distinct enough from one another

[@PTRaisin]

​@@BillyFrost1865 Idk if it's just me but I still Find Reload to be distinct enough from Persona 5 to align with to the original's own themes, own characters, own style of music. I find this point to be a very over-exaggerated. While it definitely takes it's cues from it a bit, I still feel that the mechanics of 5 have been reworked to be given a Purpose that matches the intent of what Persona 3 is. I think a screenshot of the two side by side shows how they are rich in presentation and style, but they feel very different from each other to really be completely similar, and I can personally compare this game more to it's original than Persona 5. Just me though. (Sorry for the yapping I needed to just get my thoughts out.)

[@JohnDoe-gt3jr]

Not being able to choose Kendo for my club just feels... wrong.

[@RedHairShanks-bb3dc]

Lazy is the best word

[@electricenergy116]

While I do understand the criticisms of how Reload handled its mechanics and its failure to be a proper "remake" in the sense of capturing the feel of the original game, I do think that it should be considered as to how the game would be recieved had it made these changes. For instance: the tactics menu. While it's fair to say that direct commands and the tactics menu can coexist, in practice the amount of players who would use it when direct commands are an option is too small to justify the development time. Why risk a party member making a wrong move when you have the option to make them do exactly as you want them to? And while you always could remove the option for direct commands, I think that the example given for a system like this "done right" (Dragon Quest VIII) isn't the best choice since it too released around the early 2000s, just like Persona 3. Difficulty I think is a fair point, since people choosing merciless implicity understand that the game will (or in this case, should) be difficult. However, I think a comprimise in regards to the difficulty of the bosses would be to have the bosses have different movesets on different difficulties. Balance I think is just wholly broken, I can't disagree with that in any meaningful way. This is already an extremely long comment, so a general summary of it would be that gamers, in general, have a much lower tolerance for what was acceptable design wise in 2006. Am I saying that playing to the lowest common denominator is a good thing? No, but it's the preferable option for Atlus to putting in more work and money for less return from the people expecting a game more similar to persona 5 royal. But still, the video is a work of quality, so keep up the good work.

[@DBC8O]

Great video as always, Nam. Always love hearing what you have to say on games whether I have interest in them or not, and as Reload was one of my most anticipated games of this year, I was eagerly awaiting your thoughts especially given your familiarity with the source material. P3R was my first time with this legendary game, and while I deeply enjoyed it, much of that was in no small part due to the strong foundation of the original. It was fascinating to hear your detailed gameplay/story analysis of what did and didn't work in comparison, and it makes me excited to possibly play P3 FES in the future. I absolutely agree with you on the final boss arena being a downgrade. When I finished Reload, I watched footage of the Nyx fight on PS2 and was in awe at how much more epic (and how much less radioactive green) it looked. I would also have loved to have the option to play the game with the tactics system of the original. It's such a unique way of contextualizing how the SEES team learn to cooperate while retaining their individuality, and while the option for direct commands was a great quality of life change in P4 and future games, it's a shame that the party AI had to be so drastically dumbed down as a result. Another +1 to how great the finale to the Shinjiro linked episode was. I stumbled upon it completely by accident on 10/5 just by interacting with his room without being prompted, and got genuinely choked up. Seeing his bond with Mitsuru was a real treat and it's crazy that it wasn't fleshed out in the original game.

[@HansAlRachid]

I get the temptation of giving players more (and stronger) options to tackle what the game throws at you from a dev perspective, but good lord - restrictions and player weaknesses are what ultimately makes a turn-based combat system engaging. If you have no direct answer to an issue, you have to come up with workarounds, which has always struck me as the whole point of having customizeable movesets in such a system. But I guess blowing up all opposition with ginormous fanfare and no problem gets you a cheap, easy endorphin rush.

[@jesserivera2043]

"so green that you thought this was Persona 6." 😂

[@TheDracolordian]

Made me like the vid

[@sheipi9978]

i've heard the phrase "sees don't feel like friends" as praise not as hate

[@Peheal]

It's sad that SnicketySlice had the same points as you, but with the recent persona fanbase, he got shunned so hard by them. Even getting threats and telling him to kill himself.

[@ibilesfighter3.16]

typical children, cant respect others and have to cry about everything becasue they dont know what ann opinion is what a bunch of childish losers lmfao

[@MACGamer100]

Jesus christ he got threats over that.... that's so stupid I disagree with both videos a bit, and I find it funny that they not only use the same points but the same painting analogy, but it is a video game at the end of the day and not that serious...

[@evaxephonfan9649]

I was just thinking about the SnicketySlice video. That comment section was wild.

[@ye9945]

Source? Trust me bro I'm a victim!!

[@evanfitzpatrick4357]

⁠@@ye9945The source is go to the comment section of his video and look at all those crazy fuckers

[@vietnguyen2293]

I’m so glad you brought up that point about playing with limitations to make the game more difficult. I’ve argued with so many bums about that same point and they all say the same thing: “just don’t use xyz”. why should i have to limit myself on mechanics that the game is trying to push onto you? like of course i’m going to want to use theurgy’s, but that doesn’t mean it should breaking up the whole game. they didn’t do the balancing of the enemies and conditions to use theurgies justice and it’s so skewed in the players favor. just goes to show how most modern persona fans just can’t handle difficult games

[@SMSAceofSpades]

??????? you arent required to use it so no its not "pushed on to you".

[@vietnguyen2293]

@@SMSAceofSpades it is pushed onto you. they showed it off in the trailers and there’s even a dedicated tutorial to show you how theurgy’s work. when playing the game, you obviously want to make the most of the games mechanics so i would expect the developers to take that into account when balancing the game, especially for the higher difficulties. same thing can be said about persona 5 royal which assumes that you aren’t going to do any confidant ranks and become busted. i thought reload was going to be more challenging as they had 5 years since p5r to listen to feedback. however they didn’t do that, and saying just “don’t use it” is a poor way to take accountability away from atlus for not properly balancing the game.

[@yutubnyaDimi]

For a minute there i thought this is dark souls subreddit

[@FakeStuff5]

Sir. Though you are correct in a way. I would say that not using xys fx i still fair. If you are unsatisfied that there isnt anything you can do to make the game harder, you will have to limit yourself. It xys is an optional use, so if you dont like it you can stop using it. If we dont go by this then we are going to have to point out every flaw in difficulty with all persona games

[@CowDriller]

​@@SMSAceofSpadesWhy use personas or weapons at all am I right !? " None of it is pushed onto you" afterall right genius

[@rafaelluciano5596]

I agree with just about all the points brought up here, but not the severity behind the emotion they carry. Persona 3 in any format is one of the most impactful games ever made. If you've been to stubborn to play the earlier builds, this version is probably for you. It may not have the same edge, but it does have the same heart.

[@tsf9600]

Sup Nam. While I did enjoy my time with Reload, I also mostly agree with this video. I could deal with the lack of overall difficulty, the overpowered Theurgies or the broken Persona customization, but what hurt me badly to see gone was the decisive step backwards in regards to the AI setting. They were so much of an afterthought that they didn't even program AIs to use the Shift mechanic. I've always had an issue with how modern audiences sneered at the original P3 daring to go in this direction and nothing has changed even after Reload; if anything, it's worse than before. I think your video could've leaned a bit more on the positives that Reload offers. One particular thing you could've mentioned is how Reload did manage to transmit a lot of the original themes and messages to the newer fans. I've seen an uptick in people admitting P3R even managed to make them like P3 more than it's younger siblings. Overall, you're probably getting a lot of shit for this one but I appreciate you had the guts to so thoroughly explain your views and opinions in a landscape that's probably going to throw them out.

[@CyberAnko]

Seriously, this is the video people were getting bent outta shape about. I have to say while I didn't agree with parts of your video, you did a good job explaining your points in the video. Nobody should be getting fucking death threats over someone's opinions on a video game.

[@dialga236]

honestly the worst part of the new english voicecast for me is that people who grew up with the ben 10 series reaching the end of the game wont experience the tonal whiplash of ryoji sounding EXACTLY like teenage ben from alien force haha

[@patriotsfan122480]

Haven’t finished the video yet but 20:05 I think you answered exactly why it was changed in P4 and onward with how you mentioned you like it NOW but originally didn’t. You (and many here in the comments, myself included) have played it multiple times over the years and figured it out. The casual fans likely will not. They’ll play it once, maybe twice, and either love or hate it, which for the original P3 it was a negative comment among most. So the devs likely just decided to scale it back going forward (P4 and onward) and so we’ve gotten what we have now. Would it have been awesome to have that AI rebuilt for Reload, of course. But I doubt Atlus/Sega put a ton of money into developing that (in comparison to the upcoming Metaphor or eventual P6) and didn’t see the point of doing so when a large number of Persona players likely play with direct command ultimately. Reload is meant to be the modern version of the game, but it’s also an easy money grab. Like you pointed out, it’s not a Remake akin to FFVII or RE, and what hurts it the most is - as you rightfully pointed out - the OG P3 and FES ports are not easily available unlike those mentioned remakes. I understand and agree with many of your criticisms, and still prefer FES to Reload. Love the thought and research you always put into all your videos.

[@GeorgeGwiazda]

I understand the atmospheric critiques but that affects my rating to such a small extent. The feeling of dread in January hits harder anyway because of the tonal shift.

[@BlooperTanooki]

Amazing work as always, Nam. I don't habve reload yet so I still have to make an opinion myself, but your videos are so well made and your arguments and insight so solid that it's just bliss to be a follower.

[@Thomlin12]

This game has further cemented my claim that Morrowind and Persona 3 are two similarly treated games by its respective fanbases.

[@rogercheetoofficial]

one little adjustment that has been bothering me hard ever since i decided to try the game is the scene where strega hands off the pills, in the original they didn't feel the need to bloat it with needless dialogue, they just make the hand-off and leave, the new version has a bunch of useless words that deflate the pacing and tone of the scene, it's profoundly insecure of itself

[@crimsonslayer6641]

Hot take: I like P3R’s version of mass destruction

[@funninoriginal6054]

Same, and i think It's Going Down Now is really whatever and dosen't fit P3 at all. Wish i could just hear the Mass Destruction Remix on ambush battles tbh

[@Cupuaçu-z6d]

Goofy ahh frog noises.

[@RaspyCh]

You like those overpowering frog synths?

[@s_oba]

@@RaspyCh yes

[@crimsonslayer6641]

@@RaspyCh The frog noises never bothered me to be honest

[@camika8500]

Persona fans when they get exactly what they ask for:

[@athorem]

Let me know when we get that Persona 3 remake that makes the dungeon navigation in Tartarus more interesting

[@camika8500]

@@athorem what else could they have done to spice up tartarus navigation without completely changing the core gameplay elements? (after all, isn't the main complain of the game that it deviates too much from the original?). Please enlighten me.

[@AlexanderMartinez-kd7cz]

​@@camika8500 google "roguelike" and you'll find a way -_-

[@greatsaiyaguy8868]

This isn't a port of Persona 3 FES...

[@camika8500]

@@greatsaiyaguy8868 my brother in christ we're liteeally gettin the answer and you can't tell me that you dont wanna control you party members

[@Megs813]

Great video! Keep up the good work!

[@kevinlewis720]

Hey Nam, I don’t want to keep your time especially after watching this video so I’ll keep this a bit brief. While I disagree with some complaints such as the Fatigue system, the voice cast (except Akihiko though he did grew on me the more I played throughout the opening week the game launched, and I guess Yukari was a bit toned down too), and in some areas the overall lighting, I do get what you are mainly coming from. Persona 3 back on the PS2 was a byproduct of Atlus trying in earnest anyway because of the limitations of the PS2 and the fact that Persona 3 was their “Magnum Opus” or else they would’ve been bankrupted by now. I do agree that from my point of view as someone who played Portable back in 2018-2019 that some of the tone and atmosphere was lost (like the show don’t tell type of writing as apparent as the opening cutscene), cutscenes are a hit or miss as some are better composed in FES, soundtrack in reload is a hit or miss, GAMEPLAY WITH THEURGY IS A FUCKING JOKE, I do feel like trying to talk about Persona 3 now is like trying to poke a hornet’s nest which leads into my one worry the more I grow up with this series having watched the P4 anime and played P4 Arena Ultimax in 2016, beat P5 back in 2017, P3P in 2018-2019 and beat P4G just a month before Reload came out. And that worry is… The current persona community. Now i currently respect your wishes and opinions while disagreeing with some of them, however there are motherfuckers out there going on Salem Witch Trials for people who didn’t like the remake as much or it didn’t meet the type of expectations that they wanted since FES, responding with “oh this guy is just a boomer, he’s fuckin blinded with nostalgia” or “oh this SMT elitist cocksucker.”, and it honestly disheartens me as I can see FES has a lot of bright spots even though that game was pretty damned flawed. Especially in today’s landscape where suddenly opinions are viewed as “THE LORDS WORDS” in their own eyes. Which is why while i loved this remake (especially I cried so hard again at the end like i did with Portable), I mainly just keep to myself out of the discourse because there’s no winning with those types of people. All that being said, fantastic work on your video, Nam. Really informative about your takes on what Persona 3 means to you. Cant wait for what comes next on your channel.