Neck Turning Part 1

[@Duckyistrippin]

i LOVE youre reloading bench. everything has its own little place. the flop down door with the powder scale, little cubbies for lubes and such. its just awesome. I used to have an old kitchen cabinet set and butcher block table that made for the perfect setup. Much like yours. Man i miss it!

[@dmproske]

Very good series of videos on neck turning. Answered many of my questions. Thank you.

[@Yellowshark667]

Thanks for the quick reply.... I started getting split cases just after 4 reloads. I'm annealing after 3 from now on on my .204. Very nice videos, thanks for sharing.

[@ammosmith]

@762full You should be able to use any 9x25mm FL sizing die to make them. I suggest using Imperial Sizing Wax as it doesn't form oil dents.

[@ammosmith]

@razorseal I am using a Lee shellholder. On the amount you want to peel off..it depends on your chamber cut and the case. I cut mine where I needed it for my M700 but for my M1 Garand it's different.

[@RetrieverTrainingAlone]

At 6:50 you state you do not need to use any lubricant with your expander mandrel. Yet the instructions for most expander mandrels say use a lubricant. For example, Sinclair expander mandrel instructions: "Be sure to lube the inside of the case neck before running a piece of brass over the mandrel. This can be done with a cotton swab or by dipping the case mouth into the lube. We recommend using FP-10, any of the sizing die waxes, or any sizing lube (Redding, RCBS, Rooster, etc.)"

[@ammosmith]

@razorseal No..they are very exacting in tolerances. I use mine to true up military brass or when I convert 30-06 to 308.

[@ammosmith]

It does. That's why I trim to a certain point and not cut into the shoulder.

[@ammosmith]

@pbike257 I know. I'm working on getting the proper insturments.

[@ammosmith]

@762full I believe they are standard thread.

[@sabrecross03]

very thorough tutorial. thank you, Ammosmith!

[@GunFunZS]

When you do a series, would you please put links to the next video in the description. KZbin just wants to direct traffic to other things, and makes it hard to follow.

[@ammosmith]

@Yellowshark667 Anytime. The 204 is more prone to splitting and so is the 17 Remington. Check out my annealing video.

[@ammosmith]

@byrnemonty I don't have a K31 yet. When I get one I'll make a video on it

[@andyhb572]

Interesting video, thanks. Just one observation - I’d definitely get a tube or spherical anvil micrometer, using calipers like you show is really bad engineering measurement practice. They are not expensive and if you’re going to this level of precision reloading, well worth it.

[@Newtire]

Thanks for making this film. I have one question about the adjustment of the cutting depth. Would it be better to slide the case off of the mandrel when turning the cutter inwards or does it even make a difference? I already have learned that I need that K & M expander from watching this...Thanks!

[@pbike257]

You should try measuring neck thickness with a Tubing micrometer, the flats on the tip of the Dial indicator don't allow you to get a good measurement.

[@DLN-ix6vf]

there's a small rim at the bottom of the neck ; does that get in the way when neck sizing ? is there an amount of wall thickness that is too thin to cut down to ie: .008 - ?

[@byrnemonty]

how do you make a 7.5x53.5 from a 284 winchester ???? love to see a video how to do it .

[@fishblade2]

@fishblade2 also I notice you talked about how the inside reamer for this process is set at factory specifications. My question is do you have to buy one neck reamer for each rifle round you need to neck turn internally?

[@robertgilbert6939]

when do you turn your necks ? when it's brand new OR after first firing ? and WHY on the choice

[@ammosmith]

I peel off about .0002" on new brass depending on the variation in neck thickness. Sometimes I don't I just shoot them as is. Why? Several reasons. 1, it makes the neck a uniform thickness so the neck grabs the bullet evenly. 2, It lets the neck tension be almost identical from shot to shot so the bullet is released from the brass uniformly during firing. 3, when I convert a cartridge, say 308 to 6.5 Creedmoor the necks are too thick to chamber a round with the bullet seated. Commercial brass as good as they can be aren't "perfect" If you take a Sharpie and make a dot on one side of the neck and measure at the 4 points 12, 3, 6 and 9 o'clock you can measure a difference to a varying degree depending on who makes the brass.

[@razorseal]

@ammosmith you think Lapua might need this? I don't have the equipment right now. (I'm buying all my reloading stuff at once to start reloading) adn instead of using commercial brass to reload, I figure I get lapua....

[@ammosmith]

I never had that problem, thanks for the tip.

[@ammosmith]

I can't make a case from raw brass plugs..too much pressure to form them but, I can make one caliber to another with ease. What caliber are you in need of making? PM me if you like.

[@fishblade2]

what about neck sizing neck turning on the inside. I know that this still thickens and you have to turn it as well. How do you do that?

[@razorseal]

is that a specific shellholder I have to buy to put in my drill? also, how much do you remove? you kept adding .002 there. bit confused =/ don't you want to stop adding more depth when you make contact and start removing material?

[@ammosmith]

@ScopedOUT2 Dies are expensive and I don't have a rifle chambered for it yet....yet.

[@13thmistral]

but isnt there a problem then with the tickness of the case mouth making the rounds kinda worthless ?

[@bill65761]

Since the only number you are concerned with is the run out, you can also just set the dial on the caliper to zero before taking the second measurement. On a digital caliper, tap the "zero" button. Now you know that the initial measurement is zero and any measurement other than zero that shows up (bigger OR smaller) represents run out. Because you are only taking two measurements, you don't know exactly how much run out so if you see "some", take a couple more measurements at other locations around the neck. Two more measurements will only take about 3 seconds.

[@13thmistral]

so if im right, you cant do anything with youre case is their any way existing for a civilian to make his own case for real ? you know, like shortening a case how you cant it and neck it down how far you want it ?

[@XGaming128]

You should turn further down into the shoulder so as not to cause a (doughnut) commonly formed by misturned necks.

[@Yellowshark667]

30 reloads sounds like a lot, do you anneal your cases???

[@1300nessie]

30-06 to 5-06 also may need to be turned down depending on the rifle. I had experienced over pressures in that conversion. The loaded cartridge would chamber but there was no room for expansion when firing. This i beleived caused the over pressure.Also i was well below the max pressure loads recommended in the hornady manual.

[@ammosmith]

Neck turning is usually required for operations like this.

[@RedDelPaPa]

Also, in my opinion, you should cut your necks right to the shoulder/neck junction. Maybe even a hair farther. The reason for this is after you fire your turned case, the brass will flow to the chamber and that ring you left at the shoulder will move to the inside of the case, forming a doughnut inside the neck. This doughnut will need to be reamed. Or, you can avoid it by turning the full neck of the case. But, as you stated. Do not cut too far into the shoulder or u will weaken the case.

[@ammosmith]

@Yellowshark667 Yes...every 7 loadings

[@ammosmith]

@wvcoyotetrapper I'd fireform them with a non precision bullet or a fireforming blank charge.

[@ScopedOUT2]

@ammosmith Hey Ammosmith, Could you teach us how to reload 5.45x39 from A-Z? All these ranges (both in and outdoor) don't allow bi-metal jackets and thus depriving us 5.45 fans of shooting that cheap surplus or bear ammo. Thanks

[@RedDelPaPa]

In my opinion, for taking your case neck thickness measurement, you should take it with a ball vernier micrometer. Not enough sensitivity in a pair of calipers. A good set of micrometers will measure in 10 thousandths.

[@floridafyme]

Good video. Your press looks about as old as mine,35 yrs.

[@GeneralG1810]

I don't do competition shooting but like everyone I'm always searching for that small group. Does lot weighing and neck turning make THAT much of a difference to the average Joe who just likes to plink at the range, or are we talking about millimetres of difference in the group size. If the difference is only minor I wont bother but if I can shrink my group by 1/2 and inch at 200 yards I'll definitely look into it Thanx

[@williamdelarge2491]

I've done competition, hunting and as you said that smallest group possible just doing informal shooting. Honestly I will admit weight sorting and neck turning is very helpful. My process of case prep for my bolt guns or even my ar semis I do this to. New brass of course FL size. I trim to min OAL of case I uniform al primer pockets I uniform and chamfer all flash holes I also weight sort And neck turn all cases. And I neck size for my bolt guns. Now I'm bump sizing .001 thou for my AR-10. Plus I weigh my powder charges exactly even, if it's my pistols or AR semis I weigh powder only to a 1/10 of a grain. Don't forget to set your COAL to what your gun loves unless your using a magazine! Most important I match bullet length and weight to my rage of twist! This is so important! To give 1 great example, and I'm being honest my .223 savage model 11 factory rifle , went from 1" 1 1/2" MOA @ 100 yards shooting plain factory loads to 1/4 inch MOA @100 yard hand loads !

[@rngrchad]

Whats the best way to turn .308 into .243? What series of FL dies do you reccomend?

[@Thatblacksilverado31]

Which do you prefer the Forster neck turner or the RCBS neck turner? I'm trying to get the best one for 50 or 60 bucks

[@13thmistral]

hm i kinda screwed it up, i meant to type you cant do everything with youre case(or can you ?) well im not planning anything im just curious because, well i just wonder if some coud, if he want it, make a .50 bmg wildcat and shorten the case to like 45-50mm in length and the neck fitted for .50 bmg bullets you know, i just want to know, is such a thing posible without things to go wrong ?

[@byrnemonty]

@ammosmith i ALSO have no specialised tools !

[@Marine052191]

I'm in the process of making my .223 range brass into 7.62x25 cases. I need to do this after forming...

[@ammosmith]

Sure can! I have seen the 50 necked to .375"

[@emburgess7186]

hi ammosmith I have a question for you about a neck turning mess up I had. I fired formed some 338 lapua brass then instead of resizing it first, I outside neck turned 20 rounds before I realized what I was doing. when I tried to then neck size these, the case neck diameter wasn't large enough to let the die push it back to 338 diameter an they would hold a bullet securely. is there any chance I can still save an use this brass or am I hosed?

[@marung9967]

+Mickel Burgess you will need to measure your neck wall thickness, they should be .0155. you may get away with a little under that, at .0130, and use a bushing neck die to size. any thinner than that with a factory chamber and your pretty much screwed.

[@emburgess7186]

+Ma Rung Thanks Ma Rung I measured the neck wall thickness an it's .011 to .0125. so I'm pretty thin. I run a .362 bushing In the die. I don't have any fire formed cases to measure yet cause I been playing with .308 lately. I can't find anything on how thin a neck wall on 338 lapua is too thin an unsafe. You know of any site that covers that subject? lots on neck turning but no one measures after turning.

[@marung9967]

Mickel Burgess benchrest guys can run there necks down to .008... but that requires a custom neck diameter in the chamber. the problem you have is the amount of stretch you will have when you fire the case in your chamber. the excessive stretch and then the extra sizing will harden the brass quickly and necks will start to split. so what you need to do is measure a fired case neck..this will give you the very close measurement of your chamber neck size, then deduct.neck wall thickness + bullet (0155 + .0155 +.338 .. .369) saami specs give .001 - .002 of neck stretch. unfortunately most info on utoobs does neglect to inform of this most important aspect of neck turning. ie. neck chamber diameter. i will get back to you soon with some reading resources. cheers p.s. hope this makes some sense..

[@marung9967]

Mickel Burgess this guy is running .005 to .007 of neck to chamber clearance after turning.. a little more than ideal as your case life will definitely be shortened. www.accurateshooter.com/technical-articles/neck-turning-basics/ you may want to consider annealing your case necks as well.. a great idea anyway.

[@emburgess7186]

+Ma Rung very nice detailed article. Thank you.

[@NOTSOSLIMJIM]

I just put mine on the lathe.

[@ammosmith]

@brisiobrien You're right..I make all kinds of goofs.

[@BDOutdoorsCanada]

Measuring the necks with dial calipers first looks to be horribly time consuming. I resize the cases then set up my Lyman neck lathe with the cordless drill. Once set, I can turn the necks on 300 cases in about 45 minutes. Change the cutting head, then square the necks while trimming to length in another 45 minutes. No measuring first, just turn them all the same.

[@davidmethvin1705]

Neck turning is only good for hand formed case to make another cartridge of different caliber / other wise a electric drill and scotch brite to litely Polish a neck to fit your chamber I E using 7.62 nato military brass to make .243 or 6 mm as going smaller makes it too thick in neck or 300 H&H to make 300 weatherby turning necks to use proper brass in original chambering is futile sloppy groups and cracks on first firing

[@normanmcneal3605]

Prove to me at my place that neck touring is more precise?! Anytime you remove cartridge size, use minimal charge. The case is solely designed to hold the explosion. Come here

[@jvalentine8376]

You going to get donuts inside the neck .

[@ammosmith]

I talked to the people at K&M and they said turn into the shoulder junction...so I am. Also the cutter has to be at the correct angle so I got several for the cases I turn. Thanks.

[@jvalentine8376]

@@ammosmith Who says KM are master re-loaders . They are machinists and manufacturers not re-loaders . If you got exactly into the junction it would be ok but from what I can see your not quite there . Image at 3:54 , case on the left shows a lip above the shoulder junction . If the cutter is not the correct relief for the shoulder angle then grind it . Just marking the shoulder slightly shows you visually that you have turned the neck fully .

[@fastbrass4673]

I will make a long story short. Get yourself a Fast Brass Master and clear all the other brass prep, machines OFF your work bench.

[@junkerjunk]

If I had enough money to buy a Fast Brass Master, I think I would rather go out and buy 3 nice rifles instead. Of buy enough match ammo to supply me the rest of my life, and skip reloading. Those things are WAY too expensive. Heck, the manufacturer doesn't even list the price on their website, it just states "Contact us for price" Nope, sorry.....

[@1300nessie]

Should read 25-06 not 5-06. Sorry.

[@ammosmith]

I'm not a spelling or grammar Nazi.

[@OutdoorIndependence]

Stopped watching at "one thousandths of an inch"... at least learn how to read a dial caliper of you are going to make a video. It was clearly eleven thousands.

[@daangrobler4061]

Why don't Americans use the metric system? Even the British do. Such an advanced society still doing the "inch" thing?

[@mmpiforall5913]

Yeah that was a weird thing for him to say! and wrong!

[@barry7413]

@@daangrobler4061 Because we don't want to.

[@uraleafintehwind2541]

Gay