New Best PokeRogue Starter Trio After Cost Update

[@callumellis8303]

I agree entirely with this, having cost 4 starters for new players is a bit shit. Once completed, these costs make absolute sense, Fuecoco with Punk Rock and it’s egg moves is disgusting, as is Torchic with its egg moves.

[@april-bloom]

@callumellis8303 I know right? I was just going to start up a run with popplio and I wasn't able to :(

[@DoctorOaks]

I think it would've been fine if they'd had more than just Chikorita reduced to a 2 cost, personally.

[@jaydog77]

Skelidirge is legit broken compared to every other fire starter only because of torch song

[@MrKoutsuko]

We have a toggle to activate/deactivate paassives, it's very easy to bump the cost when the toggle is on. Bit harder to do it by hidden abilities and egg moves (not that hard, bit troublesome to validate, but can be done easily once you select the pokemon and check for flags to determine the cost before going in the party, it can be messy not doing upfront for every starter, but it is a solution that wouldn't take more than 10 lines of code), but the passive toggle raising the cost is a very nice compromise that would be healthier for the game than simply nerfing everything by usage and popularity without any hindsight.

[@GARGANTUANMASKEDFISH]

New player who just started the game a month ago here - agreed with this comment. Getting into the game as somebody new now feels unnecessarily frustrating and miserable.

[@lyteshadowz]

It feels like they're punishing popular choices more than "strong" choices. As you pointed out, it punishes fresh start beginners who don't even have hidden abilities or egg moves, yet plenty of ones that can mega evolve or gmax during a fresh start run are still 3 cost (Bulbasaur, Squirtle, Charmander, Treecko, Mudkip, Grookey, Sobble)

[@tylerwebb2495]

I just think accessing hidden abilities should be easier. If you could actually get hidden abilities more then the cost would probably be justified.

[@Parasaurolophusful]

@@tylerwebb2495 Agreed. If HAs are being taken into consideration for pricing then they shouldn't be as hard to get as they are.

[@Triobros1098]

What if they made a HA gotcha machine? That would solve the problem of not getting HA’s

[@tylerwebb2495]

@@Triobros1098 I was thinking HA gatcha or you can buy it with candies

[@usernametaken017]

make HA appear on the egg move gacha. it's probably the least used gacha anyways, and both mechanics serve a similar purpose

[@DragonoftheDarknessFlame]

Beast Boost Chaizard is just straight up better than damn near all of the 4 costs

[@xavion333]

We are technically capable of making it so hidden abilities or egg moves are costed differently, but last I remember the balance team considered it not worth the work they'd have to put in. It would add more than a thousand new things to be costed after all between every egg move, hidden ability, and passive ability, just for a slightly more nuanced pointing system.

[@RibombeeTeacher]

At the same time, I think the investment is actually worth it to make the game healthier. Nothing good comes from making something an average Pokemon setup the same cost as an optimal setup. There are too many Pokemon that incorrectly costed because of this.

[@eeveeongirl]

​@RibombeeTeacher fair point but also to be fair the team working on the game is not making any money on it so I can understand them not wanting to kill themselves over programming that many things (at least until all the abilities and moves are put in properly)

[@MrKoutsuko]

We already have a toggle for passives, just bump the cost when passive is true and don't throw the baby with bathwater, wouldn't fix 100% and balance everything, but it wouldn't take more than 10 lines of code and would allow for newer players to have an enjoyable experience. And lets face it, the cost "rebalance" was nothing but a usage stats spreadsheet to nerf things by popularity instead of a deep gameplay analysis, no buff or cost reduction made any pokemon more viable or attractive and the nerfed one will keep their usage by regular players since they already farmed the passives, costs and egg moves, but the new players will have nothing but resets for their first 30 runs since they rarely can reach wave 30 and when that happens, the evil teams will stomp them really hard. Yes, there are pokemons that are objectively better and excel in this game, which is very good for people struggling to beat classic mode, raising the cost of them makes nothing but screw with them and no difference for stacked accounts. Idk, watched too many games doing this kinda stuff lately and get out of touch with their community, seeing it again just hits way harder than it should, probably overreacting, but I feel like it's way harder to people talk about what is healthier for the game than what they personally feel like should be. Fuecoco and Primarina are ideed stronger in this game, but that isn't a problem and it isn't bad to let them be the outliers. It is a game of choice and having reliable picks open space for more freedom for the other slots if you have enough points.

[@xavion333]

@@MrKoutsuko I can promise you this is at least somewhat wrong because we don't have a usage stats spreadsheet, making the server and game keep running is hard enough, we haven't been trying to save every game every one has ever played.

[@DashtheBard]

This may be my own bias, but I feel Chikorita at cost 2 is underselling its usefulness. At the least, having Stone Axe and Sappy Seed as egg moves gives it utility against the hardest fights in the game. Stone Axe for all the AI switching, and Sappy Seed for nasty Boss mons, or the final boss at the end. It was one of the starters I chose for my completed Gen II run.

[@nunocarvalho6671]

Tbh, i feel both those moves way oversold, sappy seed is good,but meganium is an atrocious mon, and besides the final boss, you dont need leech seed, and meganium will just die to a cross poison

[@DashtheBard]

@@nunocarvalho6671 That's fair. Like I said, its my own bias. I just feel having a bulky pokemon that can set something up has value, and I would still set it higher than other Cost 2 pokemon. I do agree Chikorita is the worst starter pokemon though.

[@nunocarvalho6671]

@@DashtheBard tbh, out of all the grass starters, why would you choose any besides bulba or spriga?

[@warcriminalyes]

​@@nunocarvalho6671because reading is hard. It was a gen II run. And considering how shit Gen2 is, Chikorita is top of the line.

[@DashtheBard]

@@warcriminalyes It is slim pickings, for sure. And considering most of the Gen II mons gotten evolutions that disqualified them from a Gen II only run (like Ursuring), you have to be careful of either not letting mons evolve, or just not picking them at all.

[@RibombeeTeacher]

I love how they costed up Pokemon based on their hidden abilities, but Rillaboom and Serperior were not raised despite having absurd hidden abilities that make them way stronger than the fresh start.

[@MrKoutsuko]

Balancing by usage and passives isn't fair, they should bump down the nerf and bump up the cost if you chose to activate a passive. Classic mode is becoming harder and harder and casual people can't go past wave 30 for their first 10 tries, and when they finally get a run going, the evil team floors just end the run as if itt was nothing. The cost balancing isn't working and the candy farming is far from ideal, but since only the hardcore community is engaged enough to cause ripples in the water and are abstained from the drawbacks of a fresh account, the game became unfriendly for new players and thus the decrease os popularity

[@galaxy_brain]

found this game today, hope the update cycle is ongoing 🙏

[@eldorado__]

punishing charizard would make a pokemon developer die inside.. the bias that monster gets is crazy

[@murphyduck]

To be fair to Sprigattito, FlowerTrick always critting and never missing is extremely good against pkmn that are Evasion spamming/defence boost spamming. In My Opinion, Piplup should be cost 4 because, like you said, Water/Steel is a very strong typing. Squirtle should be cost 4, as it has a GMax form, Mega Evo, and access to strong moves like Ice beam (by TM), Hydro Cannon (also by TM), Shell Smash, Hydro Pump and Water Pulse (For the Mega/Mega Launcher) Charmander should be cost 4 for the reasons you said. Inteleon being both faster and stronger (SpAtk) than Blastoise, and getting Ice Beam should make Sobble cost 4 That's all the changes I would make (that I can think of), but overall I do agree with the new costs of the starters. EXCEPT CHIKORITA HER EGG MOVES ARE BUSTED, AND JUSTICE FOR MY LITTLE HAPPY NECKLACE WEARING LEAF DINOSAUR

[@TonySatta]

Hot take Nacli should cost 5-6 cause garganacl just wins pokerogue

[@Robin280497]

A better punishment is for the evolution line to simply be harder to encounter. If its cost increases, it's more likely to just be skipped to begin with and people instead hunt for it And it's very easy to do, as the line is as common as the likes of Geodude and Roggenrola.

[@TonySatta]

@@Robin280497 that could be a solution too cause more times than not if you go through cave youre finding one. I try my best to not get one but if you want to pretty much guarantee a win Garganacl is part of that team.

[@Pendragon310]

Sprigatito - Magician - triple axle - scope lens(es) = busted for endless first 1500-2k levels

[@nunocarvalho6671]

Yup, magician and triple axel is just disgustingly good, and with multi lens, jesus christ, you clean a whole mon's item stuff just cause

[@Pendragon310]

@@nunocarvalho6671 and getting all the lucky eggs allows you to keep all pokemon leveled up

[@jm2270]

That's a single target move so there's nothing busted about that.

[@Pendragon310]

@@jm2270 k thanks for sharing your thoughts

[@jm2270]

@@Pendragon310 You're welcome. It's like the first rule of endless: If the pokemon has no good spread moves then it is a bad carry.

[@nousername191]

Torterra does get Headlong Rush at 63. It was quite useful when I used it.

[@ivorycxxxx]

I’m always a Cinderace user. Never not bringing it to a run unless it’s a challenge. No Guard plus inaccurate but insanely good egg moves, not to mention the Hidden Ability (I think it’s Libero but might be protean) it’s just insane.

[@Spider8itchy]

I'm having difficulties...I'm not very good at the rng heavy sections

[@Spider8itchy]

I really like rowlett, fuecoco, and mudkip I think

[@ryanmeyers7652]

Just keep at it, you’ll hit a point where you get a good amount of drops and eventually you’ll learn and get through it. It’s very hype when you get over that hill

[@eldorado__]

@@Spider8itchycatch a nacli, salt cure>

[@C0d0ps]

@@Spider8itchy I love rowlet I’m about to start my first ever run with him. First grass ghost and then grass fighting. I’m also looking to do raichu kanto and alola. Typhlosion* fire ghost.

[@Spider8itchy]

@@C0d0ps I LOVE RICHU SM!! Both forms really! I've never used typhlosion...I do really like ths hisuian form!!

[@icyphoenix2401]

3:32 i did have a thought like this earlier. Like why would a combee that cant evolve cost the same as a female combee. same with salandit

[@april-bloom]

Omg i was literally *just* watching your "how to beat classic" guide, thank you so much for remaking it for the noobs like me ❤

[@GrimoireOfTheSage]

I don't think I mind the costs too much. You basically pick a hard carry(the 4 cost starters) and then 2 to supplement it. It just kinda stinks that there isn't a 2 cost of each type so that folks can have their grass/fire/water core with 2 hard carries. I do agree with your perfect world thing though. One thing they could do I suppose is for the trio starters is having the Hidden Abilities unlocked by default so that the 4 costers that are being set to 4 cost for the hidden abilities actually have access to what makes them worth 4 cost. This could also act as a big draw point. People do love the Hidden Ability starters. So getting to use them without hours and hours of grinding eggs and such could indeed be a draw.

[@APhantom86]

Just wanna say never doubt your content or the reason/purpose behind it because this is the exact kind of video I was looking for as a new user…in 2024…in August as you said🤣

[@Cynthia139]

4 cost torchic for hidden speed boost + mega (ability is the same as the hidden ability so the mega is kinda pointless) 3 cost charmander for passive beast boost + 2 megas and a gmax (tough claws or drought + beast boost on top of that) 4 cost scorbunny for hidden libero passive no guard egg move high jump kick (exodia is shaking in its boots) + potential gmax 2 cost chikorita for light screen + synthesis + leech seed by level up (goodbye phase 2 eternatus) plus it has great egg moves

[@SuperCripple]

Not trying to be "that guy", I normally wouldn't care because I still understand you. But I see there are a couple other people confused because they think you're saying "protein". "Protean" is pronounced /pro-tee-ehn/. Great video as always, though.

[@simonecamozzinomercygaming]

Well, I'm just starting in August of 2024 so this is very helpful even if I keep reading it's getting harder and harder for new players. I'll see after a bunch of runs. Thanks for making this guides of us newbies anyway!

[@someone999555]

I really liked cyndaquil for my first classic clear. And its entirely because of eruption, but that move does so much for a lot of the game, and yes, fuecoco is just better period, but you get poplio as a tradeoff, which i value a lot. Zard is strong, but needing to get lucky on megas or gigamax, when you have no shinies because youre just starting out doesnt sound fun to me. Just wanted to throw it out there, do agree with your "best trio" selection, but if i were to say "poplio is a must" this is probably what id go with.

[@KillerKill95]

I'll be honest, it seems I'm the only one who can't make Fuecoco work for Classic, especially for fresh start. I get it, it gets an excellent HA, an excellent passive, and a broken move in torch song, but.... The speed! With its speed, my Skeledirge can go through a few floors, sure, but it quickly falls off, and thats with Unaware and decent IVs. In fresh start, where it has bad IVs and no HA, it performs even worse! 😕

[@Triobros1098]

I think that when you swap a Pokémon’s ability it could make some of them cost more or cost less depending on how good the ability is

[@mfafahim1]

chikorita gets a bad rap imo sappy seed and stone axe are amazing set up moves that deal damage too, for the raquaza battle u have an easy stealthrocks with stone axe and for the eternitus battle you have sappy seed which is a leech seed that deals damage. Ya it might die, but its very strong for a pokemon to be able to set up both and deal damage at the same time. Although i believe they are egg moves which does make it less viable, but if i plan accordingly i can always set up hazards since eternitus can 1 shot most of my pokemon anyways, i can bait out the beam and sappy

[@catduck4756]

Chickarita costing 2 is so funny 🤣

[@rodo9813]

How do you get hidden abilities? Are they random catches during a run

[@HoodlumCallum]

yeah, and from eggs

[@aarondeboeck3017]

Ive beaten fresh start with bulbasaur mudkip and scorbunny i pivked scorbunny over fuecoco bc scorbunny learns double kick and i could end with 2 mega or 2 gigantamax then half my team woyls have a gimmick and i could catch a garganacl and gigalith to setup with sandstorm salt ,cure, leach seed and burn and eternatus went fairly easy

[@adi_dadi8080]

Thank you for helping! I literally just started and the game is so hard

[@MOONLIGHT-x6z]

i started playing pokerouge 2 days ago furthest wave has been 70 (starter only)

[@LeoValdez1340]

I was gonna get my zamazenta to 7 so I could get cinderace & zamazenta in one run but now I need to lower one of them again

[@Stesey-B]

I feel like they should just make it so that all hidden abilities increase the cost by 1 since they us usually act like a different Pokémon.

[@theoroderick782]

Any idea what to pair with Chespin? I tried using him twice but getting past 120 wave is kinda hard with 4x weak to flying(and of Eternatus Ray)

[@calarakien]

hidden abilities isnt just restricted to non-new players, practically 95% of people who play will never see a hidden ability for any pokemon they actually use unless they spam that specific pokemon in all their runs and buy eggs

[@fable7372]

I don't think replacing bulbasaur is a good idea since if u manage to menga venusaur it literally solos enternatus with thick fat

[@theoroderick782]

Bro... 4 cost starters is prolly gonna make Frsh Satrt even harder now😢😢😢

[@Lunar_Lunatic]

Piplup has pokerus today so if you wanna do the starter team Now is the time to do so

[@darkgastly]

Im new to this game but frankly the game just relies by luck, not having enough luck you'll get swept by pokemons who have gigamax/megas/teras at least on classic mode when you have nothing, and something that i notice is if you load a new game, it's predestined what wave you're going to lose (which is not based by luck, but just a run to get a certain wave and lose it) which sucks.

[@AD-tj4jc]

I think banking on megas doesn't always work, because I have had several runs where I have A- luck but never get the stones.

[@eeveeongirl]

Same, I found both the mega bracelet and the dynamax band before my charmander evolved to charizard and found no stone or mushroom for him.

[@HoodlumCallum]

it’s the potential though and besides fuecoco and popplio the starters were ranked because of potential hidden abilities and such lol

[@Ezecool-3105]

My best starter was Scorbunny, alongside bousnweet and goomy With these 3 i won my first classic run

[@DarthNoshitam]

Are gigantimax forms generally superior to megas? Or is it case by case

[@voicetrain929]

For me its shell smash Blastoise

[@failingartist3524]

Man I got lucky and gyrados with moxie and dragon dance carried me to beat classic my first run

[@LemonLovah]

I started today actually, thanks for the tips!

[@magnocosta2290]

now eternatus one have flametrower so it's harder even for venussaur

[@HoodlumCallum]

not if you can get the mega evolution

[@icebergerplays9639]

This is nice is there a way we could get a legendary ranking? I know they are rare but want to know what is good to spend egg tickets on

[@eeveeongirl]

Spending them on the shiny machine is probably a better investment.

[@Devin-it3uw]

Me who’s never started with any of the now 4 cost starters even when they were still 3 costs lol

[@xblowsmokex]

what is so strong about Froakie with Protein? does he have access to a crazy physical move?

[@HoodlumCallum]

Protean is gen 6 version that changes your type every time you use a new move. Paired with how fast Greninja is (edit, just realized you thought of the item and not the pokemon ability. LOL)

[@xblowsmokex]

@@HoodlumCallum ohhhh lol, thank you for clearing that up and thanks for the video!

[@skrrraaa00]

How did u get them to jump?

[@rosssherrock4984]

Ambipom is a monster

[@Holy_Grapefruit]

Noob here, why not have a general cost of +1 with hidden ability?

[@HoodlumCallum]

It's really hard to impliment apparently

[@chromethug]

they balance this game through the lens of everything being unlocked but some of this game legitimately takes multiple days (of actual playtime) to even get some of these. its just wrong. i have 10 days playtime and liquid voice popplio is my ONLY hidden ability starter and i got that like 2 days ago. a vast majority of the playerbase barely has some of these rare things like crazy op legendaries or hidden abilities

[@TeamAquaLeaderArchy]

I still don't see a problem with this because you can still start a run with the op like Jen 9 crocodile boy and Breeze through the game

[@jm2270]

Bulbasaur not being weak to Sludge Bomb was definitely a bonus for that mon, but the introduction of Flamethrower really made all the grass starters bad. And they're all weak to Rayquaza already. And while Leech Seed is useful, it is also super easy to find a mon with it.

[@JoeLthegamingmage]

Been playing for a few weeks, still havent beaten classic...it is annoying for starters to cost even more.

[@gamingweb1090]

I don't think chikorita is that bad i won with it

[@Ze_Carrot]

Torterra gets headlonh rush wichnkills 2 bars oh eternatus

[@jadenfroese8184]

This game is not competetive enough for this balancing make it so that stronger pokemon are just better because they are rare make them all the same starter cost

[@Hollow_light]

dang

[@dinosaurking8637]

I’m mad Gholdengo lost contrary

[@WinterRaven37]

No comments in one minute. Fell off Lol jk jk

[@PapaPurP17]

It's ProtEAN not protIEN pronounce the A

[@HoodlumCallum]

i do not care man

[@cooperjordan1554]

This is the one change I dont like its just making things harder for new people