New Heavens and the New Earth

[@Highestgato805]

Thank you 🙏🏾

[@charlespalmer2333]

Thank you for this excellent teaching!📖

[@larrymcclain8874]

I listened to Kerry Duke's presentation again in depth, and this is priceless. It's near perfect teaching. It's a mistake in churches of Christ to avoid eschatology as we do, for obvious reasons. We are so very much divided on the subject that we fear discussing it. Instead, we hear series after series on more pedestrian topics, usually dealing with families or marriages, or other related pop psychology oriented subjects. It's the Mormons who erroneously believe that marriages will last through eternity after all, yet one would think that we agree with them based on our over emphasis on the subject. Far too many sermons that we hear these days could be preached in any denominational church in any town with hardly any disagreement. Maybe we need a restoration of the restoration.

[@DorisIngram-dp2cr]

Thank God for brothers that God put knowledge in their hearts to feed his flock

[@DanielCooper-j9r]

A very clear and consice lesson great attention to contex and very informative keep up your good work

[@danieltheavatarmusic]

New earth is mentioned in the bible, many times but the old one must vanish first.

[@John832biblestudy]

The idols could never tell the future… telling the future is how we know God exists and God teaches us apologetics in Isaiah!!

[@darrellclark2248]

Any serious student of Revelation will find Dr. Allan J. McNicol's book; "The Conversion of the Nations in Revelation," 2011, a powerful instructive resource. It is pricey, but very informative.

[@JamesMoss-g5o]

Mike Hisaw of the PP network has a video on the Subject of A New heaven And a new Earth. He says in this video the bible does teach that there will be a new heaven and a new earth. You should or Aaron G should challenge him to debate this subject.

[@DorisIngram-dp2cr]

I love this casting woe. it's good to my soul. Hallaugha

[@warnerhaley6157]

Amen, i love this biblical and truthful teaching, keep up the good work brother!

[@DanielCooper-j9r]

Praise God for when I leave this Earth I won't be coming back

[@liamwilson12345]

Earth

[@es7503]

If Jesus bodily, physically resurrected-Paul said “our bodies shall be conformed to His glorious body”-WHY are we making New Creation theology symbolic? Was Jesus’s resurrection symbolic? NO! This old body becomes the old earth-our new, resurrected bodies will become the new earth. We try to over-convolute the simplistic word of God. “In Christ we are His NEW CREATION.” “He made in Himself ONE NEW HUMANITY.” Our image bearing nature is tightly tied into our humanity. “Let us make humankind in our image-male and female He created them in His image.” If God created the earth for human beings to physically reflect Him and we messed that up-why is it so hard to believe God will restore this purpose and intention. In order to be an image-bearer of God you have to be a human being. God is trying to renew us BACK to His image. God is in the RESTORATION business, NOT annihilation (please be careful teaching this!). Jesus is ushering in the new Genesis of creation. Thank you, Lord! Deliver us from this body of death to put on incorruptible bodies of righteousness! 💛 Genesis opens up with God creating the heavens and the earth-Revelation close up with God recreating a new heaven and new earth. Follow the ultimate narrative of scripture.

[@jorgealexandrerodriguesmai5048]

Thank you for explanations and interpretation of the words "New Heaven and New Earth". I do agree that it refers to a spiritual awakening or change. But when you got to around timestamp 38, and you went into Revelations, you lost me with the preterist representations. But all good.

[@darrellclark2248]

You are over contrasting heaven and earth (false dichotomy and straw man argument) rather than trying to understand what the authors are teaching.

[@darrellbaker2895]

You have gone a circuitous route in an effort to convince viewers that the plain language of Revelation 21 does not mean what it explicitly says. In light of Revelation 22: 18-19, one must be careful with respect to denying the words of this prophesy. Heaven is where God is and is not necessarily some fixed space above the firmament. Your position is that we cannot be in heaven above AND on the new earth. Is there any reason those in Christ cannot ascend to New Jerusalem in heaven as the temporary state then descend with New Jerusalem to the nex earth to dwell there with God in the permanent state? Revelation 21 says New Jerusalem will DESCEND down from heaven to the new earth and that God will dwell with the justified there. The message is clear. God is restoring the creation He loved after it has been purified of all remnants of the sin curse. Paradise lost in Genesis due to the consequences of sin is restored by its Creator.

[@sulongenjop7436]

Heaven will never be new...it is always the same heaven from the beginni g of the world. It is always full of good souls, specifically selected souls. Evil souls are thrown into hellfire! This world will be new when all men recognize and worship Jesus alone.

[@philosoFreedomGaming]

Never existed. Religion was a limited view on why we are here, how we are here. This is a sad approach to cling to what is only a metaphor

[@Theretiredplushtuber]

Here’s the real answer: No one knows.

[@larrymcclain8874]

In Romans 8:24-25, Paul is saying that the current Heaven and Earth cannot be what we are hoping for. Why? Because the current Heaven and Earth is seen, and if we see it now in the present, then there isn't any future hope. It cannot be the final place of spiritual existence if we see it now. We hope for what we do not see, and that is the spiritual place of existence after the judgment, or what we commonly called Heaven, where God is right now. If you can see the current Heaven and Earth, then that's not it. It's the unseen that we hope for, and that is spiritual.

[@larrymcclain8874]

Excellent. There are not many in the church who correctly teach that the harlot of Revelation is Jerusalem. I wish more would reconsider. If I am not mistaken, McGuiggan in the 1970s pushed successfully that Rome was the harlot, but unfortunately, Rome does not fit the text, like Jerusalem does, "where our Lord was crucified." Of course, when you identify the harlot as Jerusalem, people will erroneously accuse you of taking the full Preterist point of view, which is absurd. The heretical teaching of full Preterism is that all events of what is commonly referred to as the "Last Day," have already happened, which is a ridiculous assumption. The resurrection of the dead, the last judgment, etc. are yet to be fulfilled, and this is true because people are still physically dying, and Satan has not yet been destroyed, for which currently there is plenty of evidence. Hopefully, your discussion here will help to educate.

[@darrellclark2248]

Preterism is one of the most dangerous teaching in churches today. The other is to deny the Holy Spirit in-dwelling in the Temple/Church!

[@larrymcclain8874]

​​@@darrellclark2248 Be careful here, we all know what happens to liars (Revelation 21:8). I am not a Preterist, and your insinuation here by implication is very close to being a bold-faced lie. I have never advocated full preterism. All of the "Last Day" events have not yet happened. This however has nothing to do with the false assumption that Rome in Revelation is the harlot. It cannot be the harlot for variety of reasons, but most glaring is Revelation 11:8, "where our Lord was crucified," can only be Jerusalem. Of course, Rome was never destroyed, only ransacked a few times. The harlot of Revelation was destroyed by the beast, which is the Roman Empire (Revelation 17:16-17), and the beast hates the woman. Rome never hated itself. Rome never rode the beast in contempt of the beast, but this perfectly describes Jerusalem (Matthew 23:29-39; John 11:47-48; John 19:12, 19:14-15; Matthew 27:25). As Revelation 18:24 says, "And in her was found the blood of prophets and saints, and of all who were slain on the earth." Compared to Matthew 23:34-38, this is almost verbatim, "Therefore, indeed, I send you prophets, wise men, and scribes: some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues and persecute from city to city, that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. Assuredly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation. “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing! See! Your house is left to you desolate." The only part of Rome that fell was the Empire, but that happened in 476 AD, 400 years too late for Revelation 1:1-3, "shortly come to pass." This means that these events would happen immediately, problematic if the harlot is Rome, which has never been completely destroyed. Revelation 17 tells when the book was written, concerning the Caesars, "five have fallen" (Julius, Augustus, Tiberius, Caligula, Claudius), "one is" which makes the sixth Caesar Nero. Since Nero began his persecution of Christians in 64 AD, and he died in June of 68 AD, the book was written at some point during this time according to what the text itself states

[@AllthingsfulfilledEschatology]

There are some excellent exegetical material in this presentation on the new heavens and earth and their application to a non-physical destruction and creation paradigm. However, the presenter does a gross injustice to these passages especially in the N.T. by over-looking or totally eliminating the time texts from the discussion. These passages are not written in a vacuum but are clearly limited by emphatic inspired time statements. No discussion of the new heavens and earth can be accurate without them. Matt. 24:3, 29, 35 all show the old heaven and earth ends with the fall of the temple, Matt. 24:34; Lk. 21:20-22, 32.. Compare Heb. 12:25-28, Rev. 20:11, 21:1-3 The harlot's fall was Jerusalem in 70AD, Rev. 11:8; 18:20, 24; 19:1,2. The marriage and new heavens and earth followed that event. Romans 8:18-23 describes the sufferings of "this present time" (the eschatological sufferings, i.e. the birth pangs of Matt. 24:8, and related texts) with the glory that was "about to be (mello) revealed. Rom. 13:11,12, shows the day to awake out of sleep, i.e. resurrection had advanced to the "last hour" with the day at hand, and should be paralleled with Paul's statements in 1 Thes. 4:15, 17, that "we who are alive and remain till the parousia" i.e. 1st century saints, not 21st century or beyond. 2 Pet. 3:10-13 cannot be separated from 1 Pet. 4:7, 17, where the end had drawn near and the time for judgment had come, as Peter reminds them of his 1st epistle 2 Pet. 3:1, 2. The entire book of Revelation from start to finish was about events, "shortly to come to pass," at hand, and about to occur, quickly. Rev 1:1,3, 19, 22:6, 10, 12. Thus, only by ignoring time statements can such texts be erroneously forced into futurists interpretations such as this very scholarly gentlemen has done. Aside from the omission of time statements, some very good points in the lesson.

[@darrellclark2248]

@@AllthingsfulfilledEschatology You are not serious are you? You have done serious damage to the biblical narrative and ignore the end-time statement found in Rev 21-22. You have missed the point of the eschaton and distorted the message of the bible.

[@AllthingsfulfilledEschatology]

@@darrellclark2248 You have made a baseless assumption and offered no proof. How can you have TWO marriages, one in Rev. 19:7,8 that follows the destruction of Mystery Babylon, which has been established by the text, the presenter and other comments in this forum and another in Rev. 21:2, 9f? The marriage follows the judgment of the harlot city Jerusalem, the one drunken with the blood of the apostles and saints, whose cup was filled up in the first century persecutions of Christ, the apostles and the church. See Matt. 23:34-37; 1 Thes. 2:14-16, Rev. 17:1-6, 18:20, 24. Note the judgment on the harlot in 19:1-2, at which time the marriage of the Lamb comes. You can double check this by reading Matt. 22:1-8 to see that the wedding follows the destruction of the city. The same is found in Matt. 24-25. Destruction of the temple and city, then the marriage. Contrary to Catholic amillennial eschatology which the church adopted, there is no division that can exegetically be sustained between Matt. 24 and 25. Even McGuiggan acknowledged this long ago. Thus, the wedding follows the fall of Jerusalem. Now how can there be a different wedding in Rev. 21:2, 9ff, when it follows the destruction of the old heaven and earth, i.e. the Old Covenant ministration, which was already passing away when during the last days of that age? See 1 Cor. 7:31, 1 Jn. 2:17, Heb. 12:26, 2 Pet. 3:11,12, and pay careful attention to the verb tenses. The speaker has already acknowledged that the "elements" refer to Judaism. See Gal. 4:3, 9, Col. 2:8, 20, Heb. 5:12. Peter is using them the same way, and cites the prophecy from Deut. 32:22, 34-46, which is the judgment on Israel in their last days as one of his source texts.

[@darrellclark2248]

You totally missed the point! You have ignored the biblical narrative revealed in Rev 21-22. You are doing theological reflection by assumption. You have butchered 2 Pet 3. You have misinterpreted Rev 21. You are teaching the false doctrine of annihilation and have given Satan victory over God's purpose. If the wicked are not annihilated after judgment in your schema, then why not? Read its carefully. You are rejecting God's plan of recreation. Your interpretation skills are lacking big time. Interesting view on Revelation, the problem, it is not true. You have a antisemitic view of the book. Interesting interpretation of Romans 8, but novel. The problem it is not true. No real scholarship would follow your view it is scrabbled and ignores the context.

[@larrymcclain8874]

An excellent review of Revelation is taught by Dan Jenkins, Palm Beach Lakes church of Christ, Palm Beach Lakes, Florida; go to the church's KZbin playlist and look up "Revelation."

[@darrellclark2248]

Not impressed!

[@larrymcclain8874]

​@@darrellclark2248 Maybe you listen to Bro. Jenkins. You might learn something. I have a confession, before I heard his discussion on Revelation I also believed that Rome was the harlot, and would scratch my bald head every time I read the actual text, because the city of Rome definitely does not fit the text itself. I had to admit that Bro. Jenkins is correct, Jerusalem does fit the text. I listened to him about four years ago thinking that I would try to find where he was wrong, but became convinced that he is correct, and I highly recommend his series. He also, like others in the church is not a full preterist.

[@stephenreeves8297]

My hope is that this continues to further divide the CoC denomination.

[@darrellclark2248]

Whatever--satan team member! Every denomination has their intramural debates.

[@stephenreeves8297]

@@darrellclark2248true but I have never seen anything like the CoC. Preachers dis own children because they would not drink from one cup during the Lords supper. When Covid was spreading. Then turn around and say that we preach the same thing in all our congregations 😂 Jesus said a house divided can not stand. I hope it falls!! You argue and slander and call it debate. By all means keep it up.

[@darrellclark2248]

@@stephenreeves8297 You have been very sheltered my friend. I have actually experience people of every stripe for over 40 years, I can personally account, everyone of us have crazy uncles in the closet. We have our crazies, and schisms for sure. Not ideal, but to wish Christians to divide is Satan's work, not a Christians (Eph 4:3) Have you ever read John's debates with the Pharisees, or how about Jesus. He was no shrinking Violet. Iron sharpens Iron! Maybe you have never been in an academic environment where they discuss heavy ideas. It would be helpful. I'm not a idealist when it comes to religion but a realist.

[@stephenreeves8297]

@@darrellclark2248 yes to wish Christians to divide is Satans work.

[@darrellclark2248]

@@stephenreeves8297 At least you are honest about it.

[@williambrewer]

The revealing came in 70AD when God raptured the church.

[@joemoore3056]

The new heaven & new earth is here now it is the new covenant (Testament) per Preterism. Jesus brought it with his spiritual second coming at the destruction of the literal temple in A D 70.

[@darrellclark2248]

You total miss the point of Revelation and the Bible.

[@rogerjohnson7667]

If this is the New Heaven and New Earth 🌍 I’d hate to see Hell. There are some wild opinions happening here.

[@darrellclark2248]

@@rogerjohnson7667 NEW is the point!

[@larrymcclain8874]

I would say the New Jerusalem i.e. Bride of Christ is now on earth (Revelation 21:2-3; 9-11). That was possible when the harlot (Old Jerusalem) was destroyed for her adultery "I am not a widow" (Ezekiel 16; Jeremiah 3, Hosea 1), and the Bride of Christ (New Jerusalem) came down out of heaven to take her place at the marriage supper of the Lamb (Revelation 19:7-9). When the harlot exclaimed, "We have no king but Caesar, let the blood of this man be on us and on our children," the Jewish nation had gone beyond repentance and their destruction was set in stone (Deuteronomy 28:15-68; Leviticus 26:14-39). The new wife, the Bride of Christ, New Jerusalem, had now made herself ready (Revelation 19:7).

[@darrellclark2248]

@@larrymcclain8874 Big problem, it isn’t talking about Judaism, but Rome. The next thing, you are not dealing with the text but reading into it your presuppositions. Citing random scriptures doesn’t prove anything. You need to reason the text at hand before you bring in any other proof-text.

[@DorisIngram-dp2cr]

Just the thought of that place (Heaven ) makes me long for it🙏💥💥💥