New Laptop Memory Is Here! LPCAMM2 Changes Everything!

[@highvis_supply]

the fact that you can replace the pins as well is frankly a godsend

[@BrentBlueAllen]

Absolutely love that design choice

[@turolretar]

Cause they wear out so frequently right

[@MattThompsonOnGoogle]

At first I was thinking 8-bit NES pin problem, until I saw that.

[@BigBenAdv]

@@turolretar They made it for a (user) field replaceable component and LGA pins can very easily be bent out of shape or broken by accident. Having a replaceable compression connector like this allows for the 'socket' itself to be another FRU without needing specialized tools. Additionally, the compression connector allows for the correct 'tension' to be applied to the pins without requiring any specialized clips (think CPU brackets) that would increase the costs and size (not good if you want ultra slim laptops).

[@2xtreem4u]

not on a apple computer :)

[@JoaoCarlos-df1zw]

Ok, you got me, that compression connector being replaceable is cool af

[@marius8032]

exactly

[@JacobScharmberg]

Yeah I was thinking just that! Those pins look very fragile but if its replaceable that's not a big problem at all. Makes me wonder if we couldn't have replaceable LGA CPU sockets to save all those motherboards that die every year because people drop CPUs into them.

[@Myself-yh9rr]

Are the pins similar to that of a CPU socket? That would be a good reason to make them replaceable. LGA sockets are so delicate!!

[@RichardEricCollins]

That made me go "wow".

[@JacobScharmberg]

@@Myself-yh9rr I'm not sure but they certainly look very similar to me.

[@shApYT]

Hopefully the new ARM Laptops use this instead of using the platform architecture change as an excuse to start soldering RAM and storage like Apple. That pin interface is genius. Just replace the cheap interconnect instead of worrying about bent or broken pins. CPUs should also do that.

[@lineax5927]

The inability of ram swaps is my biggest concern about arm chips. If that is the solution i am optimistic that we will see more arm chips in the future especially in laptops.

[@hasyidanparamananda]

I clearly hates apple because they soldering ram and storage. If storage dies first the board absolutely die for normal ppl

[@hishnash]

It all depends on how large the GPU is, If you have a large enough GPU then just like a dGPU on desktop having socketed memory (even this LPCAMM2) is just to limited when it comes to bandwidth and your going will end up bandwidth starved.

[@DigBipper188]

On a processor LGA it would be more challenging due to the increased pin density. Instead of 240 pins you're looking more like 1331 or more in a densely packed grid. That's gonna take some serious pressure engineering to get right but man oh man would it ibe worth it!!

[@trivolous28]

@@DigBipper188 it'll probably just be expensive

[@EATABAGOFHELL]

3:06 "compression connector is also replaceable" okay, NOW I'm impressed. i been saying for years motherboards ought to do this for their CPU socket; make the bottom of the CPU and the top of the board both an LGA, have a replaceable interposer between the two that's _just_ a grid of double sided springy pins.

[@bobbymoss6160]

I've been building PC for 3 decades and never had an issue with the CPU or CPU socket. Some people should just stick to laptops...

[@datachu]

@@bobbymoss6160 Then evidently you've never been tech-curious enough in all that time to have a bench PC that you frequently like to change out the hardware on for testing or experimentation lol Cause let me tell you, Intel style CPU socket is a disaster for that use case, especially if even the tiniest drop of thermal paste ever drips onto it

[@bobbymoss6160]

@@datachu If it works, it works. Why FAFO?

[@dimitris_verlis]

@@datachu best way to clean thermal paste is wd-40 contact cleaner, it melts the thermal paste. then use compressed air or leave it for 1 hour until it dries.

[@Flying_Spaghetti_Monster]

​@@bobbymoss6160because sockets change all the time anyway and it's really not that big of a change. If you only replace the cpu, then there will be no downside and little to no change. On the other hand if something does break, you can just switch out the socket and you're set.

[@lucoot]

Soldered RAM would be less of a jerk move if the prices they charged were reasonable. Charging people $400 more for an extra 16GB is the real reason they want to solder it on.

[@andrewt9204]

Exactly. I prefer replaceable, but I'd accept soldered if price/GB was reasonable. That fact you can buy whole ass retail packaged RAM modules at 1/4 the cost of a couple soldered dies is robbery. DRAM is pretty robust, I'm not too worried on the small chance of failure with soldered.

[@Agret]

Apple charge you more to go from 8GB to 16GB than I paid in total for the 64GB ram in my laptop.

[@tomtube1012]

All of my laptops have replaceable memory. I wouldn't consider buying one without it. Being able to easily expand your memory is too useful not to have.

[@sebek23b]

not only that. I have 11 years old 17" laptop with i7-4700m it still works, but I had to upgrade memory couple of times and replace it two times because it failed. Yes performance of i7-4700m is around 100 $ intel n100 NUC PC, but I can always replace memory upgrade it as I need it.

[@Agret]

@@sebek23b Put SSD into that laptop and it will run good, the m chips are strong CPUs for laptops still. Most laptops in that generation used the Intel U chips that only had dual core processor and were ran with a very low wattage prioritizing battery over any kind of speed, they are painful to use but yours should still be quite good. Comparing performance to a NUC is a bad move as you can compare most laptops to the Intel i7 2600 (the 2nd generation i7 for desktop) and the i7 still beats most of them. Desktop processors are just a totally different class to laptops.

[@nutzeeer]

Framework shoudl get this

[@Ebalosus]

Fingers crossed for a future version, eh?

[@weiSane]

Best believe they are already on it behind the scenes alongside the snapdragon X elite processor.

[@darkm007]

Maybe 2 or three laptop gens from now. I always recommend for new tech to always wait a bit for the growing pains, because you would hate it if there are issues with it and the Motherboard is now worse for no reason other than the new tech and you have to replace it with a fixed version. Let the tech age a bit. Also the framework solution is good for now so there is no need to rush.

[@hasyidanparamananda]

They should change to this for next year.

[@boop]

I hope they keep sodimm slots or release a sodimm version of their boards so people can still upgrade the main board without having to buy new ram too.

[@TheJohnRowley]

The chances of Apple using this are zero

[@danmarm5357]

They are a green company and love the planet as long as it helps them make more money. No way they are gonna help the users extend the life cycle of their product.

[@TheJohnRowley]

@@danmarm5357 They are not a green company and do not love the planet - but perhaps you are saying this in a round about sort of way? They have no reason not to help the user extend the life cycle of their product because Apple makes billions of dollars per year on their services alone (iCloud, Apple Music, apple TV, Game Center) - the extra profit they make on being hostile to user repair is pure greed and not necessary for them to be a successful business and maintain their power. Apple has huge stockpiles of cash that they don't even know what to do with.

[@glasses2926]

@@danmarm5357 The green in Apple's green vision stands for the colour of the US dollar bill

[@prathamshenoy9840]

they want higher sales. they will not provide upgradibility especially now that non-apple laptops will catch up with arm

[@Chefteguh]

until they get slapped by EU

[@torracat1185]

Hopefully we'll see Framework offer laptops that have this! Although I wonder if they'd need to redesign the mainboard so the RAM's closer to the CPU...

[@DoctorX17]

Probably would, but they probably can figure out how to make a new main board fit the existing chassis

[@LmgWarThunder]

They might be able to get some performance increases since the ram will use less of the power budget, so they might be working on it already

[@jorper2526]

​@@LmgWarThunder Performance? Not for the reason you are stating. Memory module power budget isn't going to affect the amount of power the CPU will draw. That is ultimately a cooling issue, as any laptop will boost up to its max.. But, inevitably the thin and small cooling solutions they demand will cause the CPU to then downclock. That being said, this is a performance increase because LPDDR is faster than SODIMM memory.

[@Winnetou17]

@@jorper2526 I wouldn't call it faster. It has higher bandwidth, but worse timings, aka latency.

[@jorper2526]

@@Winnetou17 that is not true.. It is physically closer to the cpu, which means traces are shorter which does in fact affect latency. LPDDR is just "better" but comes with downsides like repairability and upgradeability. LPCAMM2 should address those. Besides which, bandwidth is speed. It has much greater bandwidth than competing SODIMM parts. Ultimately even if latency was slightly higher, the entire throughput would be faster.

[@ArthurZakaryan23]

The fact that it's debuting on Lenovo's most expensive mobile workstation laptop and the demo unit in the video is a 32GB LPDDR5X module gives me a bit of pause that it will be some time before this trickles down to sub-$1000 everyday machines but the tech is definitely cool and I am all for future upgradeability that accompanies power and efficiency.

[@sveilien]

the 64gb LPCAMM2 is $330 listed right now on Crucial. its $100 more than their DDR5 SODIMM 64gb kit. But thats first, today, for one computer in the world. So if adoption occurs, that'll get cheaper fast.

[@WayStedYou]

Economy of scale. They cant put it in their low end models when the profit margin isnt there yet

[@gamagama69]

well yeah thats how it always be

[@DigBipper188]

The fact the CAMM pin stack is replaceable is just too awesome. Whoever managed to get that to not just work, but work reliably needs a medal. Can you imagine if desktop mainboards had a replaceable LGA like that for the processor? you could have a socket that can just be popped off in amatter of seconds and replaced just as fast. Bend a pin? Contact the vendor and get a replacement! No more dead board for a bent pin. Socket full of thermal paste? Pop that sucker off and bathe it in IPA and ditch the tooth brush! CALGA would be a major win if it can be made to work on a CPU package...

[@satsumagt5284]

Can’t you use switch cleaner for sockets with thermal paste though? It comes in a spray can, so it shoots out nicely, but not strong enough to bend pins

[@DigBipper188]

@@satsumagt5284 You can and I previously have done so before. Works pretty well too since the pressure also blasts the chunks out. Depending how well embedded the paste is though it can take quite a lot of switch cleaner to get a good cleaning.

[@blanknam3d]

CALGA deez nuts

[@concinnus]

Not happening. LPDDR is a few watts at most, while CPUs can be 300W (200A). Bandwidth density is also much higher on the data pins.

[@lenshibo]

As someone thats had to spend many many hours of my life repairing lga sockets, seeing that compression connector being easy to remove made me SO happy! This is a massive win and WILL be a deciding factor when im ready to upgrade my laptop.

[@SahitDagani]

LPCAMM2? I slept and missed LPCAMM1.

[@drone_video9849]

you probably didn't sleep through it, I think LPCAMM1 was dells version that that donated to the JDEC standards, and it seems they finally agreed to accept it, and that what LPCAMM2 is

[@bakedPython]

@@drone_video9849I am pretty sure Samsung had something to do with lpcamm and were working on it in 2023. I don’t know about lpcamm2 though

[@viewer-of-content]

@@bakedPythonDell actually released some press materials on lpcamm1 and did a press circuit advertising it. There were several articles on it in 2022. They just basically had 2 years of industry standards to plow through until we got here. And Dell is not known for user friendly compatibility, so the industry had Lenovo and Micron lead this round of press. Because nobody trusted dell appearantly

[@kreuner11]

​@@bakedPythonLPCAMM would be the original Dell implementation in this case

[@mowtow90]

@@drone_video9849 Yes ,LPCAMM1 is the Dell's version which was bigger and bulkier. The interconnect was replacable but it was a hassle. Pretty much ver1 was the prototype that Dell and Samsung developed. Then Mircon took it and fixed the "bugs" . This is much better. The original didnt even had a heat sink and because it was big , it didnt attack anyone.

[@northwestrepair]

Next on the TODO list> Compression mount memory chips for GPU.

[@blakegriplingph]

Nice to see you here mang

[@Demopans5990]

But there goes 90% of your business

[@northwestrepair]

@@Demopans5990 you wish. 80% of all my repairs are not faulty memory but a faulty solder joint. In which case, if they go with this idea, I'll have even more work because it will be even easier for cracked solder joints to develop 😂

[@ross-carlson]

It's FAN-FUCKING-TASTIC that you can also replace the compression fitment as that would be SO easy to damage, destroying the entire board. Great design!!

[@UmairA5]

Imagine desktop ITX motherboards having this connector mounted close to the CPU without interfering with the cooler

[@iaial0]

Idk about that, I think DIMM (or SODIMM, for that matter) use more efficiently the real estate since they can be socketed vertically. But how about LPCAMM2 sockets on the rear of the board? 👀

[@ryaja8445]

Or you could piggyback off the CPU cooler and have it run faster

[@bocahdongo7769]

Worse They add it into ATX motherboard. Bittersweet win😊

[@GewelReal]

It will probably replace the DIMMs too

[@AlpineTheHusky]

@@iaial0 Wouldnt really work since the CPU footprint is insanely dense even on the back....THO you can put it closer there. Right throught

[@BunkerSquirrel]

About time. I’ve wondered why we kept the SODIMM form factor ever since Apple started soldering in RAM back in 2012. Never occurred to me to move the pins to a discreet interposer though, that’s an incredible innovation that will drive down costs both on the manufacture and repair sides.

[@Zzzlol94]

Seeing a CPU socket like connector was frightening, but that it's also replaceable is amazing.

[@dazley8021]

At this point i never expected replaceable or upgradeable ram in laptops anymore and theres micron and lenovo one-upping my expectations by making the pins replaceable as well! Good job!

[@AviatorXD]

This is actually so cool. Even a replaceable socket with zero soldering??? Just insanenly cool.

[@PeterdaPanda]

Too bad many laptop OEMs most likely won’t support it, as they would rather make more $$$ forcing customers to buy a laptop with more RAM that is soldered.

[@rondobrondo]

I mean yeah I guess, but external storage is so fast now that the majority of people don't really care in the first place. Most people don't even really need that much active storage anyway, it's pretty hard to fill up 256-512gb with stuff you are actively using unless you downloading huge amounts of high res video or a bunch of games at the same time or something. Even SD cards are super fast now, especially with UHS-II and all the special features it has. I get nearly 300 megabytes/second in my computer's built in SD reader and the cards are getting pretty cheap now too. You can buy 256gb UHS-II cards for $80. I'm both a programmer and I work as a mix engineer for musicians on the side, and even I have a hard time filling up a TB of all my samples and instruments and active audio projects

[@intoxicode]

It's funny cuz this tech has been around for a few years but I've seen no one but Dell use it...

[@dpqb-web]

It's the "Phoebus cartel" all over again.

[@ross-carlson]

Yeah, but companies like Framework, etc. CAN use this.

[@wayando]

​@@rondobrondo... I have 256Gb on my phone, and it has 20gb free ... And I barely use my camera. In my laptop (5yrs old) ... I have a 3TB that only 500gb free. We DO need tonnes of storage in our devices. And it should be upgradable. Because that gives the device new life, so it lasts longer.

[@STUP1988]

OMG! Why did it never occur to me that the connector could also be a simple component? 🤯 Motherboard manufacturers have to make this the standard for CPUs too!

[@hishnash]

with modern desktop CPUs the power draw might well be way to high to do this. (at least with intel chips pulling 400W in some cases)

[@toby_cm]

@@hishnash but for mobile CPUs it will be a god send

[@bosstowndynamics5488]

​@@toby_cmThe pin spacing on compression connectors like this is probably a lot larger than a BGA CPU, which would make it much larger

[@rubenfasola5402]

@@bosstowndynamics5488 it can probably be made as dense as a normal LGA socket, but that is a lot less dense than a BGA

[@badnewsbeaver]

I have a newer Lenovo laptop, it's budget but I was kinda floored how modular they made it. I recommend them pretty often now so It's great to see them stay the course.

[@The8bitbeard]

Yeah, I really enjoy Lenovo laptops. I got a recent, though lower-end Thinkpad recently to replace a 5 year old Ideapad I had. There's plenty of room for storage upgrades, and I added a 32 GB SO-DIMM to accompany the 8 GB of soldered on RAM. I like that you can just buy parts as needed directly from Lenovo. I had dropped my old Ideapad, and it was a snap to order a replacement back shell as the old one cracked.

[@badnewsbeaver]

@@The8bitbeard I added a 1tb 2.5" SSD to mine. They left the drive holder in the case with screws, all I had to buy was a $7 ribbon cable. Kinda stuff breeds serious brand loyalty with me.

[@helper_bot]

lenovo budgets are pretty alright, it works as much as you paid and it lasts long provided great care

[@TokenTech]

Is this like the thing dell was doing or is this competing against what dell was doing?

[@bituniverse8677]

Dell gave it to JEDEC to make into a standard. It’s the same thing, but now a non-proprietary standard

[@pedro4205]

@@bituniverse8677 Dell opensourced it, so the Dell one is also non-proprietary. But Dell itself didn't support it. There are no laptop from Dell released in 2024 that uses it (as far as i'm aware*).

[@pedro4205]

@@bituniverse8677 But i don't know the limitations on both standard as far as memory size could go, or production cost. I found this module really tiny. Probably it is dual channel in the module but i think bigger notebooks could use two of those modules.

[@Ground15]

@@pedro4205 Capacity is not a limiting factor with LPCAMM2, Samsung has already announced 64GB LPDDR5X ICs - 256GB on a single LPCAMM2 Module, more then any laptop currently allows with DDR5 Sodimms (assuming there is Laptops that allow 4x SO-DIMM that would be 192GB max). The Modules have 4 32Bit Channels just like desktop mainstream platforms with DDR5.

[@pedro4205]

@@Ground15 That is fine then. About the 4 32bit channel, this is just regular LPDDR, the specs is the same.

[@misamokuzelpizu]

i love that the compression connector is replacable!!

[@MyxRSC]

Hope Framework uses LPCAMM2 on future laptops. Would love a customizable laptop thats thin, repairable, and upgradeable

[@LimitedWard]

The replaceable connector is absolutely brilliant. I'd love to see the same design applied to CPU connectors as well. No more bricked motherboards or CPUs due to bent pins!

[@_BangDroid_]

Now I need to download a torque wrench to help me download more RAM

[@AI-Idiot]

I really hope framework gets to use this twchnology as an option for its laptops. It would keep them as repairable, but make them sturdier and faster

[@bramvandenbroeck5060]

Ah yes, in a couple of years, we will see Tim Cook on stage saying this "We've invented something wonderfull for your macbook pro, a true revolution in consumer electronics, an industry fir-, ow right, an apple first, LPDDR Pro, tailored to make your dreams come true! You get 4gb as standard, and higher options are just 250 dollars for 8gb, which is the same as 16gb in equivalent computers, only the magic of apple can do this . . . "

[@Brando56894]

I actually laughed when he said "you get 8 GB on a $1500 macbook", Apple is at the height of ridiculousness right now.

[@estiennetaylor1260]

@@Brando56894 and most of their sheep only do basic web browsing, watch youtube videos and type documents/email. Never know why waste $1500 on a crapple laptop when

[@raduboboc]

😂

[@WhippinTheBrillo]

“We think you’re gonna love it.”

[@bramvandenbroeck5060]

@@Brando56894 Even sub 500 euro laptops now come with 16gb of ram, but you get apple magic with it, as long as it isn't a magic mouse, consider yourself lucky!

[@davidperry4013]

A gaming laptop with LPCAMM2, socketed CPU, and a M.16 GPU would be pretty cool.

[@1stRanger]

I wonder when CPU sockets are going to use the same principal of replaceable pins module.

[@daleonov]

3:02 Really cool that this connector is serviceable as well! Otherwise I'd imagine a bent pin would require a mobo replacement.

[@brunof1996]

2:50 Does anyone know how tight a torque of 0.18 Newton-meter is? Are we talking tip of the fingers or something more?

[@TsukiShimizu]

0.18 is pretty light. iirc you can exceed that using 2 fingers with a small screwdriver.

[@kornrexxx]

I’m glad someone brought this up.

[@elaquen7]

0.18 Nm is roughly like holding an 18g object. Then imagine that as a twisting force. Which means less than finger tight. Probably just until you feel resistance and then the tiniest bit further.

[@vladislavkaras491]

Darn, this RAM is so thin! How nice it is to finally have a both thin laptops and have possibility to upgrade the RAM! Thanks for the demonstration

[@LordSaliss]

Dont forget each module is 2 memory channels already, so you dont need 2 sticks for dual channel mode. I wonder if this sort of tech can be implemented in CPUs? Everyone complains about bent pins, so what if the pins were the same compression module thing that could be replaced? 🤔 Id also love to see these replace normal dimm slots on desktop MBs. Maybe have 2-4 LPCAMM2 sockets on the backside of the MB? These are pretty low profile so looks like they could easily be placed there and free up space on the front side while also getting the memory sockets closer to the CPU that way.

[@ericxpenner]

Was already impressed, but then the compression connector is also replaceable...that is absolutely superb. Would love this on my next laptop.

[@mysticmarble94]

Boo, wake up. New laptop memory just dropped 👋

[@inappropriateJester]

Holy GB!

[@Pseedholm]

Stop talking to your right hand.

[@mcslender2965]

@@inappropriateJester actual compression!

[@cataclysmicterrain]

call the cas latency!

[@ranjitmandal1612]

💪

[@transcendtient]

Manufacturers will still scoff at the fact that they need 3 screws and a socket to mount it and continue to solder the chips onto the motherboard to save 2$.

[@magicmanchloe]

They should have called the new memory module Compression based Repairable Attached Memory Module. Or CRAMM for short bc they’re cramming memory as close to the CPU as possible!

[@helper_bot]

i bump this comment because i approve

[@typingcat]

Heaven knows, the Earth knows, you know, and I know that Apple won't support it.

[@dominicmillerca]

I like the 2 parts build with the compression connector to improve reparability.

[@irwainnornossa4605]

This is great! I've been looking forward fot some actual product using this. I hope this will catch on.

[@MMuraseofSandvich]

0:28 It started with the Macbook Air. OEMs didn't paint themselves into a corner, customers started demanding ultralights that had the portability of a tablet and a keyboard/trackpad; the most visible expression of this turned out to be models like the Microsoft Surface and the Asus Flow Z13, basically PC tablets with a dockable crappy keyboard/trackpad.

[@garynagle3093]

This looks great! Hope Framework can adapt their motherboard for this!

[@Rick-vm8bl]

Whats the betting Apple adopts the standard....but sticks a propriatary chip on the ram module so you can only buy upgrades from them. I mean, it's still better than being stuck with 8GB ram but you just know they'll have 200% markup on their upgrades.

[@hishnash]

Apple will not adopt this standard as the bandwidth it provides is still not fast enough for SOCs with larger GPUs. once your SOC has a large enough GPU you need to provide it enough bandwidth and while LPCAMM2 is nice it is not desigend to provide the needed bandwidth for larger SOC gpus like Appels. You could also ask NV and AMD why they are not using this on dGPUs on desktop and the response will be the same.

[@frederikex4545]

I mean you xan use a 4 channel interface getting to 256bit

[@someguy4915]

@@hishnash There's nothing stopping Apple (and other companies) from including 8GB (or more for 'PRO' models....) and a connector for additional memory. Thus including very local memory for the lowest latency possible and 'quite local' memory for low latency expandable memory.

[@Winnetou17]

@@frederikex4545 The M ultra chips have 1024 bit! Aka 16 channels! I can't wait for 4 channels to become the new standard on both laptops and desktops. Especially with the rise of integrated GPUs, they can really use it.

[@hishnash]

@@someguy4915 multi tier memory is very complicated no major platform ships sys mem in that way outside of very very costly mainframe developments.

[@RemirezSfesa]

the creativity in your videos is beyond amazing!

[@leoben53]

Is it possible to have multiple modules like sodim Ram or is it limited to one module?

[@aravindpallippara1577]

Probably limited to one for power efficiency less traces to drive

[@zyhawk42]

It has dual-channel support in a single module, so it would in theory need a platform that supports quad-channel LPDDR5 to use more than one module. It shouldn't be impossible, but maybe unviable

[@novakk86]

​@@zyhawk42this would be amazing for APUs

[@jordi28panama]

LLMM Low Latency Memory Module that is what I think makes a lot of sense

[@Laundry_Hamper]

I like High Power Shahram. He knows what's up.

[@Nanobits]

This is great news, been looking forward to this for ages.

[@chixinspace]

Interesting. Im interested as to what the maximum frequency with this implementation is as comoared to just soldered

[@TTbelis]

I would like to comment on sincerity, personality and humor at 1:31 that that help me remember the main point of short traces for signal transition. Thanks for great video

[@kornrexxx]

Are we going to ignore that torque rating?

[@georgytelelyuhin3175]

Is something wrong with it?

[@hamdichami4636]

It's nowhere near enough to be a problem. This just means that it needs to be a snug fit plus a tiny bit more

[@iowawalker]

@@hamdichami4636 that phrasing is going to cause a decent amount of support cases and RMA. They've gotta do something more fool-proof if they want this standard to be everywhere.

[@Spurdospaerde692]

Please feel free to ignore it, you don't have to ask for anyone's permission.

[@ferna2294]

I was gonna hate on it until I saw you can change the pins without destroying the motherboard. Beautiful.

[@michalsvihla1403]

I always thought the LP in LPDDR stood for Low Profile. :D

[@Jaaxfo]

Nope, but that is approximately what the SO in SODIMM means. Small Outline Dual inline Memory Module

[@muhammadaveromugi]

Shape and size supposed to be like ssd nvme 30 mm, that will be perfect

[@alexeykuznetsov211]

How about compatible USB / Power DC ports on laptop so you can BUY AND REPLACE it when broken at home? Replaceable CPU? GPU? Common whole modern laptop are soldered bricks. Just buy cheap one and throw it away when USB port is down.

[@ross-carlson]

If you don't know Framework they address ALL those issues. Typing on one right now, it's great!

[@xavierrodriguez2463]

Most new laptops are USB-C, I've charged my Lenovo laptop with a Samsung charger.

[@nanolfo_]

@@ross-carlson I'm still waiting on Framework laptops to become purchasable in my country.

[@alexeykuznetsov211]

@@ross-carlson I just checked and I see soldered CPU and GPU. By taking a second look those MB has 14mm USB ports - not common, impossible to find and replace those. Am I missing something?

[@thischannelisforcommenting5680]

replaceable CPU and GPU on laptop? not going to happen.

[@fmzaidi2001]

Can you show us the collaboration you did with Lenovo for the new thinkpad t14 gen 5?

[@njerurichard3581]

Have you been forbidden from showing the bottom side of the module?

[@someguy4915]

That looks the same as the motherboard side, so not interesting to show. A simple Google search shows plenty of pictures of the underside of the memory module so no, no secret just the same as is visible on the motherboard.

[@njerurichard3581]

@@someguy4915 I tried doing a simple google search, it only shows the top side. All I'm saying is, for a video that was introducing a new technology to people that have probably never heard of it, a 3 second shot of the underside wouldn't have hurt anyone. Which is why i had to ask.

[@DiyintheGhetto]

I hope this memory takes off like a rocket. Seriously we need to upgrade out memory again. My laptop is stuck with 8GB onboard and a Dimm slot for another 8GB stick.

[@mikk150]

My jaw dropped when connector is replaceable..

[@nikkopt]

That doesn't seem thinner than a so-dimm slot, at least a single slot one. Maybe it's slimmer than the ones that take 2 modules but thin laptops don't use them anyway. All the drawings you see online is them comparing it to a double slot one. It will take less space in the motherboard but it will be the same in the z axis.

[@explawsion]

I don't see this being much thinner than the existing SODIMM RAM

[@xavierrodriguez2463]

I could, with sodimms you have to have clearance for memory modules on both sides of the stick there's only memory modules on one side here

[@samuzamu]

Sodimm has to have edge connectors, which add a bit of bulk

[@necuz]

Dell's functionally equivalent version is 57% thinner than a single SODIMM, but was made to avoid having to put RAM slots on both sides of the board. This isn't so much a win for thinness, but rather for not having to produce (and keep stock of) separate motherboards for every CPU and RAM combo you want to sell.

[@zeekjones1]

2:53 *Ahhh!* "Any order" ??? Even pressure instructions on the sticker. I know it's most important with reassembly, but I've also followed the staggering rule for disassemblies as well.

[@atemoc]

I'll see if I can get hyped when I see the price of these modules.

[@ross-carlson]

Price will fall - look at it this way, even if the modules are more expensive now say 3-4 years from now you'll at least be able to upgrade and prices will be very low then.

[@potatoes5829]

will probably be expensive at first then fall in price later

[@atemoc]

@@ross-carlson I hope so. Many things in tech in the 2020s seem to keep an artificially high value years after for no reason, but I doubt that will be the case here. We shall see.

[@tezcanaslan2877]

Being an early adopter often means you have to leave a hefty sum of money on the table.

[@mezu-e]

Visible torque spec on the screws is much appreciated

[@Simon-ui6db]

Its repairable, apple just sitting there laughing and saying nope thats not going in our macbooks.

[@cocowww]

I hope they improve it because the spec of this Lenovo P1 gen 7 says only up to up to 64GB LPCAMM2 and one slot look like. It's not enough today for certain applications and definitely not enough in 5-10 years. I have a 32go FW13 (bit thinner than this P1 gen 7 by the way using "conventional" ram slot) and the ram amount is already almost not enough for stuff like Docker, big data, etc... And I'm afraid of the price of these modules. Let's say it's just the first gen, they have time to improve it 👍

[@user-28qhfk65]

The fact that it needs to be as close to the CPU as possible to get the lowest latency definitely makes it hard to design a dual slot for it. However, the 'up to xx RAM' have also exist in the past because the product wasn't available in the past. So I'm 50/50 sure that it will support higher GB per module and I read a comment saying Samsung is developing a 256GB LPCAMM2 compatible ICs. I'm honestly more interested in the heat produced and longevity of LPCAMM2 because even if its upgradable, it will be useless if it will break down quickly over time.

[@blar2112]

sounds more like a new standard that companies can squeeze for some cash. low power sodimm existed for every generation after ddr2 and the socket can be as close to the cpu as this new thing.

[@ross-carlson]

"and the socket can be as close to the cpu as this new thing" Um no, no it absolutely can not that is why there isn't any SODIMM LPDDR5 RAM right now - this solves that, AND it's quite a lot thinner too. So yes, it's a new standard but it's better for everyone and either way if you're buying an upgrade you're buying an upgrade, how is this somehow bad?!?!?

[@E-Stoia]

did... did you actually watch the video?

[@DGao-zz5vq]

DDR4 never had a DDR4L variant, all JEDEC DDR4 standards have an operating voltage of 1.2V. As of today DDR5 doesn't have one either. And even if DDR4L/DDR5L was a thing, it doesn't make this new standard any less important. DDR and LPDDR are *completely different* standards.

[@bagasfabianmaulana]

I bet you were thinking about DDR3L RAM. No, it's not the same as LPDDR RAM.

[@blar2112]

​@@ross-carlson There are sodimm slots as thin as 2.6mm plus you can use low profile smts under it. This thing occupies the whole surface it inhabits, its made out of 3 parts without counting screws and its 4.5mm thick. Sodimm ddr5 works at 1.1v, this new thing works at 1.05v WOW!!!!! And did you check the prices? they are outrageous. All that engineering time and effort could have gone into making sodimm thinner.

[@cazschiller]

Framework's mission is finally coming to fruition, upgradable laptops ftw!!!

[@abrahamlincoln3181]

Just goes to show, everybody has a price.

[@JWooden271]

Really cool to see Dell's CAMM evolve into something other companies are adopting.

[@thelbtlover]

This obsession with making everything thin is ridiculous. I'd rather have regular SODIMMs and have my laptop be 1mm thicker. This is better than soldered RAM but we should just stop obsessing with making laptops as thin as possible to the point where it compromises thermals, upgradeability, and repairability. These new modules will undoubtedly come with a huge price premium and people will justify it by saying "hey, spending $300 for a $40 stick of RAM is better than having to replace the whole motherboard for $600." No, just no. The fact that they show this RAM in a super thick laptop that doesn't need it proves that it has nothing to do with anything other than manufacturers trying to screw over customers.

[@TheIdiotPlays]

Sodimms are nice but we are reaching the data transfer limit of that technology.

[@ross-carlson]

Still missing the problem - there aren't any SODIMM LPDDR5 modules as they can't do that, it's too far for the traces - THIS solves that problem. THAT is why this exists and is a VERY good thing.

[@thelbtlover]

@@ross-carlson There are DDR5 SODIMMs available for laptops. If it's really such a concern then move the slot closer to the CPU.

[@thelbtlover]

@@TheIdiotPlays Then why do desktops magically not have this problem? And latency isn't a problem on desktops probably because the RAM slots are so close to the CPU on desktop motherboards. Just move the SODIMM slot closer to the CPU. Problem solved.

[@thebravegallade731]

​​@@thelbtlover Socketed DDR5 for laptops exist, but not socketed LPDDR5.

[@sovo1212]

3:38 Instead of having to choose between one and another, two tiers of RAM could be implemented, even Apple could do this. System performance would be limited by upgradeable (slower) memory, while soldered memory would act as a huge, slightly faster cache. But I can totally see this being a thing, with proper software support for optimization.

[@Emu_Emu]

Changes nothing

[@nimoy007]

What?

[@blar2112]

@@nimoy007 CHANGES NOTHING

[@nimoy007]

​@@blar2112 I would have thought a subscriber to ProjectFarm and GamersNexus would be interested in having an actual conversation about an emerging technology, but whatever floats your boat.

[@thorium9190]

How so? This if implemented, does change everything

[@toadlguy]

Do we know if you can support the benefits of unified memory with this technology?

[@pbinnj3250]

I used an IBM/Lenovo for years and loved the red mouse. LOVED IT.

[@micallan.17]

Great video iFixit, and if anyone is interested the background song is 1983 - Ben Elson.

[@MattThompsonOnGoogle]

Now, it may be “better than Apple,” but they’re not the only ones soldering RAM to the motherboard. Lenovo was always taking flack for doing it. Even my Asus Vivobook has Slot 0 soldered in place, making it ridiculous to even upgrade Slot 1. I am glad to see that Micron is on top of this new standard. They are my go-to brand… the Goodyear of memory. Even it comes with Pirellis I’m changing it out.

[@IAmTheWaterbug]

At 3:30 on the video ifixit says, “We also like it better than Apple’s unified memory implementation.” Is the form-factor/attachment method wedded to the architecture? Eg could Lenovo have unified memory with LPCAMM2? Or does LPCAMM2 requires a northbridge chip?

[@cleanycloth]

This is absolutely fantastic news. I can't help but think though, didn't Dell come up with a standard like this last year? What's happening with that?

[@ravagingwolverine]

This is Dell's project. They have allowed it to be adopted as a new industry standard.

[@cleanycloth]

@@ravagingwolverine Ooohh. I had a feeling it was, but since it’s a completely different shape I wasn’t sure.

[@blitzar8443]

The compression connector being easily changeable changes everything. I love it.

[@MarioGoatse]

Thank you for fighting for these type of standards! We appreciate you! You’re great consumer advocates, and we’re glad to have you

[@vasudevmenon2496]

Samsung has them as well. Most likely hynix will be onboard, so Corsair, Kingston, apacer,gskill etc will push it past 8500MTps. Is it 32bitx4 or 64bitx4 module? Lenovo should have added it to their yoga and 14 inch ThinkPad T,P series instead of big 16 inch which will show that smaller laptop can now have bigger dram and we can choose minimum spec and upgrade later

[@zaprodk]

The replaceable connector is such a good design choice. I love it.

[@rustedfists3213]

It’s still crazy for me how the cpus are soldered into the motherboard I wish that I had the ability to upgrade it like it used to be in the past

[@Kyuubi840]

That's seriously cool. Here's hoping that this replaces all those soldered down RAMs.

[@mactep1]

Would be cool if we could get some sort of hybrid system with both "unified memory" and this working together.

[@thwangc]

How come no shout out to Dell to making the LPCAMM and giving it to JEDEC to make it a standard in the video?

[@catalin-ap]

Congrats for youFixing not just what can be repaired, and also showing and selling tools to others how to do it, but also contributing to fixing the corporate anti-repair greed of some tech giants.

[@JaySee5]

I hope Framework is getting in on this. Now the industry needs to get to work on a full speed universal external PCIe connector to get GPUs out of laptops.

[@MxSlfDstrct]

the real, question, though... will manufacturers actually implement this? from the profit perspective, this probably makes sense on higher end stuff like gaming laptops and portable workstations, but for low and mid range laptops I don't see why they wouldn't just keep soldering the RAM on board…

[@user-28qhfk65]

It will probably be on high end laptops for a while before it being cheap & common enough to be used in basic / cheap laptop. DDR5 on SODIMM are quite a new thing and used too much power to be practical on a laptop. Lenovo's Thinkpad lineup famous for its repairability had to choose soldered LPDDR5 over SODIMM might be because of these disadvantages. That's why they expand LPCAMM2 standard that were developed by Dell. I can see it being used in upcoming ARM windows laptop that prioritises on battery life and cooling as thin as possible while also being fast to compete with Apple. Having upgradable LPDDR5X also makes a great marketing too for enthusiast and professional users. If we think about it, SODIMM on DDR6 probably won't even exist because of its limitation so it is safe to say that LPCAMM2 or other better standard will be the future of laptop/tablet and while useless to a desktop, maybe we will see them on mini pcs and ITX motherboard.

[@Odd_Taxi_epi04]

Easier management of inventories. With soldered ram, they may end up with a pile of unsold hardware with a certain ram capacity, while with replaceable memory it's easier to replace the memory to the amount that is selling better. Also cheaper repairs under warranty.

[@piggyhero5174]

I have thought about this exact idea before. Easily replaceable ram that can just sit in place. I really hope this can become a new standard for all laptops.

[@tjlingram]

That compression fitting would be great on the cpu as well.

[@angusmcclelland4846]

Excellent advert for Lenova P1

[@Chuck_vs._The_Comment_Section]

I have built and expanded several computers, but I have no idea what this “compression connector” is all about.

[@3DJapan]

3:50 Jeez, I bought my HP Envy 2 in 1 in 2017 with 16gb for about $1000.

[@alexjensen990]

I will look for this feature when I buy my next mobile workstation. Thanks for the heads up!

[@Giratina143]

my only concern is the lower surface area to add more memory chips. From the looks of it, it only has one side that can be populated, but tradtional sodimm has two sides which allow for so many more chips to soldered on. I wonder what the max ram cap is for these chips.

[@brouettebredouille8320]

I hope more laptop manufacturers than Lenovo will adopt this standard to that it doesn’t die, cause it seems like nice tech