Nick Bare Breaks Down the Maffetone Method

[@AnthonyAllioo]

I stopped running for a while, was doing good before, ran 2 half marathons and was getting down to a good pace at around 7:30 to 8:30 on my runs. Stopped running, got out of shape tried to get back into it, tore my plantar fascia in November and just started to try to run again and have been struggling to run a whole mile straight. I’ve seen Nick talk about this before, saw this earlier and decided to try it, ran under 148bpm and was able to run 4 miles straight with no problem my pace was 11:45 but I’ve been so caught up on my old pace, and this taught me to train where I’m currently at. At some point my pace will be get back to where it was with the lower heart rate.

[@CarianneHixson]

good on ya!

[@Perkustin]

Good Comment, Plantar issues are imo the most devastating for runs (in terms of 'minor' stuff). I've had minor injuries elsewhere but it was a bruise on the bottom of my foot leading to plantar pain that put me out longest. I'm also 100% done with minimalist shoes now despite how great they were not worth the risk imho.

[@jamesquinn9866]

I love that like "train where Im currently at" because where you are at will always change, thats fantastic! Great work brother

[@beamoscrilla7691]

I use the maffetone method every time I train. Stopped getting hurt, got faster, stronger, and had more endurance when I did triathlons

[@Pkurkowski2]

When you say every time you train are you saying during one workout or as a principle used in creating programs. Like 80/20 where 80% of workouts are aerobic 20% are anaerobic?

[@fluorophoremusic3679]

I really need to tame my ego--the most difficulty in employing this MAF method or 80/20 method is...the pace you find yourself running is so much slower than what you are likely used to doing that it feels silly. I always seem to speed up and then look down at my watch to see my heart rate is over the 180 formula. At that point, I just think about how slow I am and get sad. Anyway, though...I need to be consistent with this. My mileage has increased a lot and I do most of my miles the other way around...hard. As you can imagine, I'm usually in some sort of pain in my day-to-day (e.g., knees, ankles, feet, hip...something).

[@nikitaw1982]

@@fluorophoremusic3679 i'm the same. have to get a completely different philosophy somehow. i think for me i might have to do all my runs with a chest strap connected to a treadmill with heart rate controls. so speed is all up to the treadmill. motivation for running has to change to. i wish they did segments on what the other benefits are....like can work better thinking if work in an office. way to manage relationship stress. better sleep.

[@nikitaw1982]

@@fluorophoremusic3679 i'm guessing if run when not stressing then better mind muscle connection. how hard to stand on one foot? running is cooridinating ur full body as land on one foot then propell off. maf method develops the smaller muscles required to run better....maybe....avoids injury?

[@aaronreilly1061]

I like this method vs the old 220-age,

[@Essentialoils4ujess-weagle]

Currently training for a 45 mile ultra marathon using low heart rate training. Few things I’ve learned. Use the data from your watch as a guide. These new watches are fairly accurate. Your max heart rate from a recent race will be close enough or push yourself on a hilly route. And my Garmin Forerunner has a training effect section. It tells me what type of run I’ve done (aerobic, endurance, tempo, VO2max, etc) I use that data as a tool to stay on track. If you’re interested in training this way just prepare the ego 😉 hills and humidity do slow your overall pace WAY down! If you live in a hilly area you’re probably going to be doing a ton of hill walking on those easy days. But keep in mind your cardiovascular system doesn’t understand pace/distance. It knows time/intensity. This style of training does take a long time to get faster at the same heart rate. I’m 9 months in starting low heart pace was 15mm now I’m at 14mm

[@dang4504]

Garmin watches have the ability to set a custom HR alert. Example, I set the alert to 140… this allows me to zone out on the run and not continuously look at my watch. When you’re in the Run activity… go to Run Settings - Alerts - Add New - Heart Rate - Custom (you can choose a high and low HR alert)

[@nikitaw1982]

do u need ear phones? can u pair ear buds and a chest strap? if no ear buds is the beeP reasonably loud?

[@lymphomasurvive]

@@nikitaw1982You can hear the beep. Maffetone recommends no music or listening to anything while training.

[@goodyeoman4534]

Definitely no music or distractions while running - it ruins your intuition for pace and rhythm. My HR alert is set to 146. If it creeps above that, I just walk for about ten metres and it immediately drops back down to Zone 2 level again. I used to feel like I'm cheating by going into a quick walk, but who cares? You're staying below your first lactate threshold and putting money in the bank.

[@jesseshaver2262]

Glad to see this. So many think hiit builds endurance, when it really mainly maximizes whatever endurance you already have. It just takes forever to build endurance, while hiit “peaks” you very quickly, so it can turn people off when they don’t quickly see results. Only problem I have with maf is that it doesn’t take max hr variability into account, which can vary a ton. But low heart rates are the way to build endurance. Just take your time and it’s worth it

[@DarthBane-zf8wv]

Yeah MAF is flawed since the formula only is close for about half of people. I have a friend with a Max HR of 213 that plays competitive tennis at age 25. And then mine is 198 at the same age. Both tested in a VO2 max test at a qualified facility.

[@iss8504]

@@DarthBane-zf8wv it's an estimate. I actually prefer Mark Cucuzella 's method of just breathing thru the nose and to heck out with the heart rate monitors etc. I row and just look at meters rowed in a same time period.

[@MrMcGuck]

MAF is a one size fits all model that works for very few people, I have a max heart rate of 198. So running at MAF is way too low and for others it’s way too high.

[@jesseshaver2262]

@@MrMcGuck I concur that the biggest issue with MAF is Large heart rate variability.

[@benanderson4639]

I've found my watch is almost useless for monitoring hr at least 60% of the time, but the chest strap works almost all the time.

[@goodyeoman4534]

For people who want to know more about the physiological adaptations from low-intensity, high-volume running, the main things are: increased mitochondria, increased capillary density, and increased VO2 max. Doesn't regular, harder running also see those changes, you might ask? Yes, but to a lesser degree and with more injuries to to lactate build-up; your body will learn to run at those faster paces but without the physiological adaptations of slow-running (increased mitochondria etc,). Best thing for beginners or intermediates is to get a good THREE MONTHS of 3-5 slow, 60-90 minute runs a week, and only AFTER that, start adding in intervals and tempos. Or just ignore that, rush things, and then get injuries and plateaus.

[@hathwayh3209]

True, I trained for a couple years in the wrong zone, painful longer runs. Marginal improvements. Diet and correct zone 2 training will aid endurance.

[@nikitaw1982]

tempted to do maf just to avoid injury. develop all the little muscles and tissues. maybe do a skips b skips sort of stuff once or twice a week. maybe build up single leg strength in gym so again avoid injury. also want to have a few beach muscles.

[@Ahki_Ethan]

I grew up having to do physical therapy until the age of five because of underdeveloped upper body. By the time I was 12 I was running 8 miles a week, I got into parkour in my teen years as well as powerlifting and bouldering. Due to an injury and extreme ignorance at 19 I allowed myself to develop a habit of drinking and smoking while hanging out with friends, I ended up homeless and over three years I’ve gone back to a point where I’m beginning to work out again but it feels like I’m just never going to get back to the point I was as a teen.

[@Foxtrottangoabc]

I am sure you will of you keep going steady 💪

[@lululx3760]

Wow that‘s hella random to drop such a story here

[@alexm1841]

Yup! I do easy runs zone 1-2 and speedwork in zone 4-5

[@dw5523]

It's astounding how that 70%-80% rule applies across the board to all human effort training.

[@barbellsandbowhunting]

It worked for years for the Russian weightlifting team. Only going maximum effort every once in a while but playing in the 80% range. Such a good comment 🙌

[@theruggedscholar1544]

@@barbellsandbowhunting 👏👏👏👏

[@theruggedscholar1544]

Thank you for your post!

[@indoex]

It also applies to life in general

[@catpantalones]

I wanted to see if anybody had some guidance on this method. First, a little background. In 2022 I was 331 lbs. Signed up for a half marathon at the end of 22, trained just off some random programming I found on the internet and was able to complete the half pretty easily. Signed up for a 35 mi trail ultra in Sept 2023. Trained all 2023 for that. I didn't get a HR monitor till the VERY end of that training. When I did, I was able to run a decent distance keeping my HR under 148. Finished that race, handled it pretty well (that mountain tore my feet up haha) and then decided to focus more on strength for the winter and then restart my running journey again in 2024 with the idea of STRICTLY following this method until I felt comfortable running long distances below 148. Put on some muscle (and some fat) during the strength training and began running 4-6 times a week again in late January. I am trying to strictly follow this 148. But I am struggling. I have not been able to run longer than a minute or two before I am at 149 and need to slow to walk. I have told myself my max distance right now is 3 miles until I can get at least a mile under my belt all at 148. But has anybody dealt with training like this where it seems like you are almost constantly walking? When I do walk I am trying to walk as fast as I can to try and keep my pace up while allowing my HR to fall hopefully continuing to aerobically train, but I havent seen all that much improvement over three weeks. I wanted to see if you guys had any advice or history with this. Thanks in advance.

[@kevinhaskins6619]

The trick is accurately finding your thresholds. The simple age calculations like the MAF method employs I think are questionable because there are simply too many variations in the population. For most people, it is fairly easy to do a max heart rate determination (plenty of methods online) and use the variation of the Karvonen method with resting HR & Max HR to nail your zones. If you are really serious, buy a lactate testing meter and verify with a finger prick measurement. After all, lactate accumulation is the underlying metabolic reason for all these determinations and there is no better method than measuring directly for lactate. But back to the HR methods. I'm 54-years old and I know my resting heart rate with a high degree of confidence (48-50 bpm), and my max heart rate is right in the 178-182bpm (varies based on when/how I test it). The MAF method would have me at 126 bpm as the base calculation and my calculations have me around 140 bpm. I build in some wiggle room and try to keep my HR 120-135 bpm on my easy hike/run days. Dr. Maffetone has other modifications to his algorithm and I don't see any research to document their validity. Just use RHR & MHR and plug them into this calculator and I think you get reasonable numbers that are age-independent. As you train, your numbers change and you can change your target based upon actual physiological measurements. www.calculatorsoup.com/calculators/health/target-heart-rate-zone-calculator.php Another bone to pick is to stop worrying about pace and distances. If you want to train with these types of methods think in terms of effort (measured by HR) per unit time. Thinking in terms of pace is just a distraction. By all means, start focusing on your pace when you are trying to nail a race pace strategy but leave it out of base training and unit time is more meaningful than distance because paces will vary widely as well as terrain/conditions you train under.

[@kzantal]

Amen !

[@david7101]

When I minus my age from 180 and jump on the rower it says I’m training in the high end of zone 3, at 149 heart rate, should I stick with that?

[@kzantal]

@@david7101 My advice would be to actually evaluate your resting heart rate and max heart rate. Then you and won't need faulty equations.

[@ramamoorthyh]

Agree. I'm 52. Max HR under TMT is 187. RHR is 55-60. MAF limit makes me walk all the time. Karvonen method makes me run. I'd rather enjoy running than walking all the way

[@goodyeoman4534]

Correct. I've seen CPET tests at work and even then, there is some debate as to where exactly the LT1 and LT2 thresholds begin. One thing I know is that the 220-age is total bollocks. I'm 35 and I have had my max HR up to 192 on many occasions. I can't figure out how to change the Zones on my Garmin so I just stick to Garmin Zone "3" which I know is really my Zone 2.

[@TheSubieFan]

The only way to train your aerobic base is with long form cardio. Keep the HR in zone one and just cruise there is no secret to having a better aerobic base. Granted most of us don't need a high aerobic base because we aren't going to be doing aerobic activity for 12+ hours in a day.

[@rusochileno639]

Breathing in through the nose and out through the mouth is definitely my sweetspot! Thanks for the details!

[@EvanTorrens]

Read this dudes “the big book of health and fitness” years ago. Made total sense. I still definitely got way too comfortable only lifting sprinting and walking. About to reimplement this technique. I read being too anaerobic can raise cortisol which can decrease test. Makes sense. My question is in his book He says you need 3-6 months of just aerobic before you can start doing anaerobic things. I’m def not trying to stop lifting for 3 months lmao. But I will say I will take 3-5 minutes between sets and shut down A lot of the Met con stuff. I think a lot of guys go way to hard and it ends up biting them in the ass. Less is more gotta build that foundation. I wonder how Getting his aerobic capacity optimized helped his strength go up if at all. Did he stop anaerobic activity for the beginning of his aerobic capacity journey ?

[@UnhumanNewman]

I’ve worn my Apple Watch during stress tests with my cardiologist and found it to be fairly accurate the entire time.

[@CPTKenpachiZaraki]

And?

[@BR33L]

They are. I’ve read studies that show that there is a very slim difference between an Apple Watch monitor and chest monitor.

[@nathancragg6202]

There’s lots of factors such as tightness around the wrist, specific activity, sweat, weight of watch/bezel size, location. They’re accurate in ‘some’ scenarios with ‘some’ people and god awful in others. So a consistent recommendation is a chest strap which mitigates a portion of the variables

[@tlims22]

No doubt a chest strap is superior in accuracy...In my experiences.

[@BR33L]

@@tlims22 I mean, this was an actual study performed by researchers. An Apple Watch at least is nearly just as good as a chest strap. The margin of difference was less the 2bpm. Anecdotally, I use both while on my air runner and the reading are always within 1-2bpm. I’d say the only advantage the strap has it’s that it’s much more consistent, because if the Watch moves too much it will stop giving readings.

[@dynamicsoulslayer]

I use to think chest monitors were corny but realised chest monitoring is far superior. I tried this heart rate technique in boxing and am able to spar without getting gased. I stopped wearing the monitor after about 5months.

[@qaaronrodgers2479]

🧢

[@NOIDTV915]

@@qaaronrodgers2479😂😂😂

[@Pkurkowski2]

This is also called the 80/20 method and it's a staple in triathlons

[@nikitaw1982]

zone 2 is 220 minus ur age maffetone method is 180 minus ur age. big difference in heart rate. do you do gym sessions with weights as well as run swim bike? i'm guessing body weight core pretty important.

[@lincolnward85]

Looking back at track practices, this sounds like the methodology used during the season.

[@gator7082]

Kettlbell swings are great for this type of training if you don't feel like running. Five one hand swings every 30 seconds with an appropriate weight KB can easily keep your HR in that range. Just throwing that out there for an alternative.

[@nikitaw1982]

@Beastbombshell are u serious? yes it would. better than skipping sessions if raining outside. stuck baby sitting do infront of the tv.

[@maulstar1]

@@nikitaw1982won’t help at all. Totally different. Training and it’s adaptive response is very specific. Some long slow stuff on a bike or elliptical can transfer to running, but kettlebell work is totally different.

[@nikitaw1982]

@@maulstar1 disagree. Try it and see.

[@CJFranciss]

Could be my rudimentary understand but it’s not dissimilar to strength training. Volume at lower intensities builds base level strength. May not drive your 1rm, or in the case of maf method, your 100m sprint, but it drives progress through quality volume.

[@stevez3332]

Here in FL this is about impossible to do in the summer when its a feel like 93 degrees before sunrise my HR being 47 is in the 150 range on easy slow days ,otherwise im onboard

[@jgreenhaus4]

Can he breakdown his pinning method

[@eats4cheaps305]

Fitbit just got full fda clearance for their wristwatch heartbeat sensor because of how accurate it is.

[@Manaconda-Mike]

Huber man Lab Podcast with Dr. Andy Galpin is one where they cover all this and more - with more in depth information. Highly recommend

[@robvdent]

Is being able to nose breath during the entire run a sign of a good heart rate? Or is this unrelated?

[@skybird5845]

Always breath thru your nose. It's a super power

[@Foxtrottangoabc]

I would say its all related , simply a different way of measuring , a bit like the rule of being able to haveca conversation while running will mean you are jogging at a lower threshold , if u can't talk then its cause your completely fooked 🤣 but if if u can breath through your nose whole run, then by default you are not running at maximum intensity , where as if you were full sprint or starting to run out of gas, you will start to breath using your mouth as that can consume more oxygen, which your heart will then tryto pump as fast as possible to transport air around the body.

[@someguyusa]

My only comment about this talk is regarding nose-only breathing. You can condition yourself to nose-only breathe at higher heart rate zones. I started doing it after I watched a podcast featuring James Nestor who wrote a book about it. It's much better overall.

[@dpmercado5400]

What if all I can afford is a Garmin? I have an entry level 245...seems okay. Your opinion please.

[@shanegill5091]

Well explained by Nick.

[@nathancragg6202]

MAF works great for cardiac output days but I found as a longer term program, unless someone had a very specific training history, it was generally only ok. I’ve found a couple MAF sessions combined with some aerobic power sessions during the week seems to have the best across a broader range of training histories

[@adeelali8417]

Yeah same. I think 2/3 zone 2 sessions for every 1 interval session is the best ratio for most people.

[@edschobs5204]

To each their own. It clearly works for Nick though. He’s a running monster!

[@nathancragg6202]

@@edschobs5204 and that’s the caveat. Most ‘runners’ need something like MAF to rebalance years of misbalance, which leads to the conclusion that everyone needs MAF; when in reality everyone needs ‘some’ MAF depending on their training history

[@edschobs5204]

@@nathancragg6202 I definitely need MAF to get back to a good balance for my running. I was never big into running but I really want a good program to get back into it. No more than like 5-6 miles. I’m not into super long distance running at all.

[@j.johnson8360]

@@edschobs5204 he’s also on the juice.

[@spencerconrad1075]

Still confused on what’s best as a beginner distance runner? MAF training vs zone 2. I’ve found my MAF zone is 144-154 bpm and my zone 2 is technically 116-135 bpm (220-age)*60-70%

[@hercules71185]

I really like Nick and his information is great. But on some topics there are better sources for information. Look up huberman lab with Dr galpin episode 2. Find the parts that pertain to cardio. It'll explain everything. Basically zone 2 is more technically correct but you must have a proper lactate test to know.

[@nikitaw1982]

don't u have those numbers round the wrong way? z2 is 220 minus age. maf is 180 minus age. why the big difference?

[@HairyManBeast]

I have run many Ultra-marathons and I find this method slightly inaccurate. Heart rate over time is fairly inaccurate if you are running an "easy" long run; say 20-30 miles. Once you pass 20 miles the heart rate variability is very minimal. So this really only applies to shorter runs. Using RPE is better overall for long-term training. Also, don't stay one dimensional and only run. Just my experience from doing several races. Race day comes down to cumulative training over speed anyways ...

[@oliverallen5324]

For novice athletes you know RPE isn’t effective in any sport. It’s clear you’re correct as a seasoned runner, but most people are neophytes and will always be. These concepts help people get from 0 to running

[@ollielloydjones5774]

using the MAF heart rate calculator, I should run at 180-16 the minus an additional 5 for asthmas. Does this really work as it feels quite a high heartrate

[@siemniak]

so basically 180 minus 16 minus 5 is 159 ... How is that high for running ?

[@chinothedreamgiver1629]

I’m 50.. so that means my maf would be 130.. that’s pretty much me walking… I live in Florida… the heat alone raises my HR.

[@AmberIshtar]

Ok the whole "conversational pace" doesn't work for me because I've had full on conversations running uphill when my HR is pushing 175, yet my max zone two HR is 153. So should I completely ignore that metric or is my zone 2 max HR incorrect? When I "run" (sometimes i have to walk to get my hr to stay below 153) at my zone two pace i can sing whole songs, it feels unbearably easy. Also has anyone ever addressed how people with excessive stress and anxiety can do this bc I'm fit but I have panic disorder and anxiety through the roof, one thought can raise my HR about 20-30 bpm while sitting still. It just feels like I'm fighting an uphill battle when I attempt this training.

[@JeansiByxan]

Conversational pace is not a good metric. It is better to use a heart rate monitor.

[@JeansiByxan]

If you have anxiety it is best to just put on a heart monitor and not look at it until the session is over. I found that looking at it every few minutes raised my heart rate as I was trying to get it down without truly relaxing. Let your mind drift away, focus on your breathing, switching up your route and other small tweaks. Hope this helps. Running is a great antidote to anxiety. It’s not a fix-all but it helps.

[@krazedmino2890]

I run in Thailand, there is no way I can keep that heart rate in the heat. How do you deal with cardiac drift and this method?

[@lymphomasurvive]

You go slower.

[@Pigpensblanket]

Love it, bootcamp shuffle is the pace I like jog at

[@SeanPatrick71]

The problem I have with MAF is that it assumes everybody has the same aerobic HR based on their age.

[@maulstar1]

It’s not perfect for everyone but it puts most people into the right area to get started. Can’t ask for much more outside of the lab.

[@billbraski]

I wear a whoop 4.0 and it matches my heartbeat within 2 bpm

[@ryanf494]

Whoop straps are the 🐐!!

[@HighSpinSwingSpeed]

I do all Nicks stuff, it works

[@c.galindo9639]

Cool. I kind of get what he is saying as I used to run so naturally but years of not running makes it feel like I am a beginner again so I have to build my foundation and find my seeet comfort zone

[@nikitaw1982]

i wonder what working on single leg strength for a month would get u back to where u were. older u get ur heavier weaker stiffer generally.

[@c.galindo9639]

@@nikitaw1982 not really true. You only get weaker when you’re older, if you do not maintain your physical strength and fitness. There are many healthy and fit elderly people who have maintained their great health by constantly doing what they need to keep their natural physical strength and endurance

[@nikitaw1982]

@@c.galindo9639 yes true lol. Notice I said generally and generally people don't maintain them selves. I got a bunch of injurys from preparing for 5k parkruns. Took a brake and for 3 months did barbell back squat 3 times a week with seat calf, tibialis raises and quad leg extension. Sole goal was to get to 100kg back squat. When I got to 90kg for sets of 10 I was late for a train, I had a heavy back pack and a side carry bag. I sprinted for about 4oometers and ran up 5 flights of stairs... I couldn't believe it. I felt like a rugby player running down the feild. If I had worked the same strength program with lots of back pack walking first I would have avoided all the running injurys. PS last night I saw a runners strength program done by physios and they said if run at 20min 5k pace ur soleus muscles take 7.5 times body weight!! No wonder most get shin splints and explains why the seated calf and tib raised for a few weeks made me feel like an awesome runner. PPS I dare u to try zercher marches for a few weeks and see what it does to ur Hill runs...focus on solar plexus away from tail bone. All the best with ur running. Thank you for replying a year later. Did u stick with maff? I did my first run yesterday and feel good, hamstrings a little tender...I just ran slow as I dont have a hrt rate tracking device yet. I'm looking forward to it to keep my ego and lack of patience in check. Also I want to know if weakest link get fatigued and produces lactate that's what causes hrt rate to go up even if small muscles..met a lady who stopped because of neck nerve pain..of she did maf then the muscle that got fatigued before any damage occurred increase in hrt rate would have slowed her to a walk.

[@c.galindo9639]

@@nikitaw1982 neat. Well that’s some good progress on your part. I haven’t ran in awhile since I usually put it off and only did easy 1 mile runs. I should do some roadwork though when I maintain more time. Some good hiking with packs should do me well for leg work and will keep me fit like old times. Rucksack time

[@davidweck]

Great information!

[@imawarrior313]

I like to do 1 minute walk and 1 minute run for 30 to 45 minutes as cardio

[@Foxtrottangoabc]

Nice

[@imawarrior313]

@@Foxtrottangoabc thanks .. what do you do?

[@Foxtrottangoabc]

Well today just done a 1hr strength workout , body weight type stuff , and 20min on indoor bike. My achilles tendon was ruined month back, getting old and an old injury reoccurring ! but keen to get back and just focus on doing 1 to 3 mile distance well without injury.I was doing 1 mile walk warmup 1.5 to 3 mile run 1 mile walk , but I'm gonna go back to shorter 1 min walk 1 min run type stuff to reduce injury . Unless one has to deliver a message in the next valley, 1 minute sprint or jog is what we all require do 90 percent of the time anyways 🙂👍

[@MattRuns]

This is good science, this is all aerobic respiration.. your resting heart rate will lower as your heart becomes stronger, increase in red blood cell count, capillaries widen.. it's a massive successful knock on effect that helps your body cope with them high intensity speed workouts alot better 👍🏻👍🏻

[@Foxtrottangoabc]

Yes im thinking instead of the 10 percent rule of increase training distance and time , which I personally think is way too much ,its bad maths , the average heart rate another option to use for distance . Though the old school method of being able to have a conversation while running also a good guide

[@MattRuns]

@@Foxtrottangoabc It is but when you talk, your heart rate evelates.. taking you out of them good zones. It's like, the feeling like you could.. but dont haha. 10% rule is a good one for distance increase and keeping the HR low throughout.. not just a good average.. like if the pace drops then let it drop and keep the HR consistent 👍🏻

[@dylanmorin6468]

This is the 80:20 Method or Polarized Training, not Maffetone. Maff is extreme low intensity discipline. Very high volume at very low intensity (relative to Max HR), We are talking continously running hours at

[@northtacomaninja]

What do you think of the whoop heart monitor wrist strap?

[@scottgodkin781]

If you’re an older runner (like me), the Mafetone method means walking 50% of your easy runs, which I cannot imagine is ideal.

[@NuclearSpinach]

(Statistician here) Models like 180 minus age are approximations that usually lose accuracy near the tail ends. A fit 70 year old might have limits far from what a rule of thumb might say. It's an average, not a law.

[@SieSo]

At that point you need to go off RPE (Rate of Perceived Effort). Which means if it feels easy, then it's easy. If it feels hard, then it's hard. So your easy runs might say your HR is well above the MAF Method but if it feels easy (talk test) then it's good

[@ibbjos08]

How old are you? I'm 42 and will need to walk to maintain z2 if I'm going up steep hills to get my HR down. Maybe you are old or you're just out of shape if you need to walk 50% of the time.

[@scottgodkin781]

@@ibbjos08 I’m old- 50

[@ibbjos08]

@@scottgodkin781 lol, you're not old. I think the key is to do a threshold test to determine your zones. The 180-50 might not actually be your z2 top end as mentioned in the video.

[@therealfonsooo]

Not saying this method is inaccurate or ineffective but through my experience I simply just ran for fun and always tried to run to the best of my ability on each run no matter the distance. Just repeting that gradually made me faster. I have seen major improvements in how I run and in my stamina. I never had to check my heart rate and plan my run accordingly like mentioned in the video. I ran trying to beat my best always. Would I beat it? Sometimes, but certainly not often. I find plateaus to be natural. Reps help to break it. Again this is not to deny or negate the effectiveness of the Maffetone Method but being conscious of your goal and what your body is telling you is always my answer. What do I know tho

[@regulardude7961]

That's fine if you run for fun. There's no legit training program for serious competitors that are anything like you described.

[@freepat101]

I think this is fine for most people. Especially if you’re not running over 5k.

[@bsherf934]

@@freepat101 It is very sub optimal to try and "PB" on every single training session. Is it 'fine'? Sure, any form of running is better than not running. However, you are severely handicapping your progression using this method over quite literally any legit running plan.

[@jakemartinez1354]

So many people are running way too fast on their easy runs and they wonder why they are getting injury’s 😣

[@FlaminalLow]

Not the best way of calculation aerobic threshold. That would mean that any 2 individuals of the same age have the same max aerobic HR, which is totally wrong.

[@fendy9733]

If you read the method in the website, actually there is another plus or substract. Ex: if i am not well trained, and then i can subtract with 5. So 180 - 30 - 5 = 145. But if i am well trained, i can just 180 - 30 = 150

[@aclsass]

I thought it was 220-(your age) for max aerobic heart rate?

[@tniles408]

220-your age determines max heart rate not max aerobic heart rate. 180-your age is used for mafetone method heart rate training.

[@atois408]

Fuck ya. This helped me clarify some stuff greatly.

[@alexm1841]

Do a mile test every other day for a few days and then find the average and enter it into Jack Daniels VDOT calculator. Training passes there are pretty accurate

[@Fullloafofbread]

Or a mile test every 30 mins with a shot of Jack Daniels

[@no79way]

Great method for recreational runners

[@davidtejeda4323]

good show way too many ads, way too many ads 🤦🏻. Its like i signed up for premium for a reason, to not hear ads

[@JayEs31]

All data shows that watch is nearly identical to chest strap - FYI

[@Dirtydreamer2023]

I can nasal breath even at Zone 4. I don’t think that’s accurate for everybody, checking the HR is the way to go.

[@maulstar1]

The whole nasal breathing *thing* is mostly terrible.

[@Dirtydreamer2023]

@@maulstar1 why? I find it only natural, always done it.

[@dreswan1]

Is this good for enhanced athletes or non enhanced?

[@gankhammer9926]

Both I’d imagine, none of this is new in the running community. This goes back to Arthur Lydiard and his base building philosophy. It’s really super old news and is just periodization really. So if you’re enhanced I’d imagine the benefit is you recover faster? So you might not need it because the benefit to running slower is building mitochondrial whilst recovering so you can hit key workouts better.

[@TheFlyingCougar]

Well if Nick Bare is using it clearly it works for fake natties

[@gankhammer9926]

@@TheFlyingCougar ikr

[@gankhammer9926]

@@TheFlyingCougar he sidestepped the hell out that question did u notice

[@brucen83]

My cross country coach taught us this concept many moons ago. He’s like a Tyson coach. Has quite a few guys who qualified for olympics but the athletes leave him for more established groups that have money and attract more sponsors. Coach is very abrasive and has a good network but he says exactly what he thinks to people. Told him to listen more and talk less and work on his people game soft skills he just smiled. Anyway he doesn’t do it for the money… just trying to keep youths from making babies and becoming gangsters and or alcoholics or parents at very young age. Most of the peeps that were coached by him have degrees, others had an attitude. I’m not running but I’d prob coach my kids one day …

[@nikitaw1982]

tempted to get a treadmill with heart rate controls and the kid runs an hour a day watching cartoons. cause so slow zero chance he burns out. since kids sit in class 7 hours i don't think u can over train them. ancestors would do 14 hour days hard labour from pretty young to very old. avoid obesity and mental problems in later life if have a fit base. step mums a physio she said many kids have learning difficultys because don't have the core strength and stamina to sit at a desk all day.

[@jordannewell8903]

Good information, but painful format to deliver it in.

[@DwayneThe5th]

Or you could try running in a 60lb weighted vest. That will 100% make you faster.

[@RossTheNinja]

See also Dr Stephen Seiler

[@kingelvis5502]

Max Aerobic Function = MAF 80/20 is different from MAF They work well together

[@j.johnson8360]

It also helps if you’re on the juice like he is.

[@dragonchr15]

for fatter people, it also burns A TON of body fat (assuming diet on point...), and by default, that makes you faster as well....

[@youtubelearning2990]

For 99.9 of people, just run

[@doodiebean4870]

My man’s knees are gonna be fucked in 30 yrs

[@f3penang287]

Strange how Nick never mentioned he was using the MAF method 5 years ago in his videos.

[@kennygoss6387]

He wasn’t using it 5 years ago 😂

[@ericb5666]

This guy has a subtle accent I can’t quite pinpoint.

[@CS-ww3bs]

He's from Pennsylvania

[@johnnyreb8200]

Talks through his nose lol

[@ericb5666]

@@johnnyreb8200 the more I listen the more annoying his voice gets.

[@johnnyreb8200]

@@ericb5666 When you combine it with the fake natty shtick it is pretty irritating lol

[@jovialjayou]

Does he apply the maffetone method to his steroid cycle?

[@veritas2145]

Lol

[@dkny9954]

Damn this dude overcomplicated resting heart rate and heart rate reserve.

[@haon2205]

I prefer to take a day off than spending time on meffatone

[@michaelanthony4750]

This is super interesting. I don't even run that much

[@buckyjennings8854]

Why would you take run training advice from this guy? He's a supplement salesman. Try the "Running Strength" channel

[@kylebell6955]

Nick has run 2 100 mile races and runs a 2:50:00 marathon at his size. That’s sufficient experience

[@phillipedwardness9591]

If anyone uses a Garmin it does this for you.

[@MaggyFly95]

Interesting method, but using your HR and/or the maf1 formular is very inaccurate. Ive seen 30 yrs old men with MaxHR over 200 and and MaxHR of 150. Its very genetic dependent, but I could see this method working on a lot of people.

[@siemniak]

well then first it would be smart to get your hr max.

[@kelseynakanelua3051]

This will work for the distance runners. Is this for a faster mile 2 mile, half-mile, 400 meters?? This might work for 2 miles and up but not 1 mile 800 or 400. I think that even for 3-5 miles. Doing longer intervals 800, 1 mile, and then adding in longer runs 3 or 5 or 8 miles for a steady pace building an aerobic pace.

[@DarthBane-zf8wv]

How do you think those athletes train... by only running short distance? They train super aerobically as well.

[@kelseynakanelua3051]

@@DarthBane-zf8wv They train very little aerobically. It's 80-90% anaerobic.

[@DarthBane-zf8wv]

@@kelseynakanelua3051 That's very false. Nick Simmonds has a YT channel that goes over his training when he competed in the Olympics at those short distances that you can reference.

[@kelseynakanelua3051]

@@DarthBane-zf8wv that is very false. I know Nick and how he trained. He did do longer runs like I mentioned but to run during the season he ran like I described. And he ran alot of cross country during most of this college career

[@jesseshaver2262]

800m is still super aerobic. Peter Snell worked up to 100 mile weeks before doing harder workouts to win the gold in the 800m. Obviously Simmonds did hard workouts, we arent saying dont do hard workouts. But those are more important AFTER building a large aerobic base. And even then, it's certainly not 80-90% anaerobic work lol.

[@listrahtes]

I love how he complains about wrist monitoring but chooses to train in a completely random choosen heartbeat range. There is no scientific evidence behind these calculations. Max heartbeat and by that aerobic treshhold varies very much. No one should run like that esp. a beginner. Its from stone age of running and even then it was nonsense. Either test your max heartbeat or better train with breathing focused rpe scales if you are a little advanced

[@Josh181089]

The heart rate from MAF seems way too high. If my aerobic capacity is

[@beertus9996]

Heart rate is very personal and there are big differences. Find the BPM that suits you

[@baloo1522]

@@beertus9996 yeah. When I was 19 I would regularly hit 219 while boxing. Now even at 33 I'll hit 209. Granged my RHR is higher, at 59-64. My aerobic seems to be around 150s, and pace is 175-180. I hit 190s frequently.

[@RossTheNinja]

It's not a reliable method at all. About half of people it'll work for. It might be as much as 20 beats out either way

[@TK-nc3ou]

I love natural athletes like Nick Bare!

[@dannyg7141]

You need BullyJuice on here at some point

[@waynewaaaaahhh7192]

Good info, thanks nick. Just wanna add,, I have zero interest in how good my butt looks to other guys in the gym 😂 just saying

[@TheMissing8]

Tactical Barbell what's up?!

[@davidrosenthal5795]

I can’t imagine why anyone would develop all that muscle then carry it around while running.

[@ericb5666]

It makes perfect sense when you sell supplements. People believe he built his body with the crap he sells.

[@Bubblykickass27]

Because it feels good to be strong and fit. Hybrid. No point being a good runner if you have the physique of a meth head😂

[@johnnyreb8200]

He's downsized a lot since his bodybuilding days

[@alexm1841]

It’s because military is built differently. My buddy was an Army Ranger, 6’2/225 solid muscle. Also ran a 2:50 marathon and rucked 50 miles like it was nothing. They carry it well so why not

[@davidrosenthal5795]

@@alexm1841 no reason not too, except all that weight makes them much slower than they could be…..BUT they can lift much more so there is that. It’s just a trade off and what they want to focus on. In this case it’s being pretty strong and decently fast.

[@gc4346]

That got kinda sus

[@CraigKeene]

You want to improve your running, then look no further than the teachings of Eric Orton.

[@seattletyler]

apple watch is plenty accurate for this.

[@dann5480]

He's juiced up. Stop promoting these dopes.

[@ibbjos08]

You'll get injured in zone 3.

[@airhogglider]

Nick Bare uses roids

[@Owen.YouTube]

Can’t believe more people don’t talk about this. It’s so clear.

[@airhogglider]

@@Owen.KZbin he got called out on forums for his FFMI being over 25. He retorted saying that when he was active duty he never failed any drug tests given by his command. However, the military tests for marijuana and other elicit substance use NOT for anabolic steroids, growth hormones, EPO, etc. Military drug tests are not USASA or IOC drug test protocols. That's like saying a person was driving the speed limit as per the radar gun when they are heavily intoxicated on alcohol and should have been given a breathalyzer for DUI. Passing the speeding test doesn't mean they also pass for DUI. Anabolics at a lower dosage speeds up the recovery process so he can train for endurance events harder than a person who's not running the same protocols. I'm surprised that MPMD hasn't done a Nick Bare video.

[@Owen.YouTube]

@@airhogglider i know.. its absurd. not saying he doesn't train hard or anything but it's just the fact he owns a supplement brand is what is messed up. idk... just irritates me.

[@airhogglider]

@@Owen.KZbin as a Veteran, it's kind of disgraceful to sell out and use the military, branch of service, unit, etc as a marketing gimmick to legitimize a brand. Navy SEAL, Army Ranger, etc etc. Military service is about serving the country not ones own self interests or profit goals. Then to say that he's got integrity but is boldly lying about PED use is kind of a shame but on the other hand if he were to disclose that he was on PEDs publicly while on active duty he'll get non judicial punishment and processed out for violation of ABC regulations from XYZ bla bla rules. Like how Lance Armstrong adamantly denied his use and then he came clean on Oprah Winfrey show, I'm sure Nick Bare can admit the truth well after the golden goose stops laying eggs during his golden years where he's no longer relevant and depends on his brand to make a living.

[@f3penang287]

@@Owen.KZbin I know exactly what you mean and yes it is a little irritating. It’s not a level playing field.

[@Pedro-qj4tj]

I'm 32 that means 148 MAX, what's the minimun?

[@cyber_crypto]

138

[@scottgodkin781]

If you’re an older runner (like me), the Mafetone method means walking 50% of your easy runs, which I cannot imagine is ideal.

[@ginger_wby]

How long have you done MAF though? Need to be patient with it

[@scottgodkin781]

@@ginger_wby it’s been about 3.5 months now.

[@ginger_wby]

@@scottgodkin781 honestly that's only when you should start seeing one improvements/ benefits. But by this stage you should have built more time up per week doing MAF too. 6hrs+ is a minimum really to get noticeable benefits. Also if running for long periods isn't possible yet add cycling in too which will be easier to keep in a MAF zone. Stationary bike will offer a consistent effort

[@scottgodkin781]

@@ginger_wby ok, I’ll keep plugging away. Thanks for the advice.

[@Foxtrottangoabc]

Darn it I was looking forward to a max heart rate of 129 when I resume me running based on this method