Nissan Leaf 50k Mile Update - New Battery Time, Obviously!

Most Anti-EV comments I get mention the batteries needing replacement after a few years, well using their intelligence I guess I'm now due new ones given my Leaf is nearly 4 years old and has passed 50k miles!

[@wobby1516]

Current range specs are now nearer real world mileage, my Kona is specked at a range of 260 miles however on local driving I get over 300. Winter nearer 240 with everything on. Thats more than enough for me as I need a leek break and a coffee ☕️ after a couple of hundred miles on our congested roads. Colin.

[@bbbf09]

You must be very Welsh to need a *leek* break after two hundred miles. ;o)

[@ronharman2280]

Colin. 1 The Kona seems like a great car. Really all EV’s are great. Some are more expensive up front but may have a higher resale value also.

[@wobby1516]

Ron Harman In the end it all about personal preferences and how long your going to keep the car. I tend to keep mine at least 6 years although I’ve kept one a Honda CR-V for going on ten years. The Kona was, is quite expensive but for me in the U.K. a £4500 grant plus the fact that Hyundia up the price by £2000 after I’d place the order, I got the pre price rise deal, means depreciation on my investment is better than most. The truth is I waited for the first EV with fairly high mileage ability and went for it. We are both delighted with the Kona and will keep it for many year to come.

[@LeicesterMike]

Interesting, we are up to 38k miles in our 30kWh late 2016 leaf. Just bought a MG ZS EV as well which should reduce the use of the leaf a bit. Similar story nothing has gone wrong, see no reason to change it. Thanks for the update.

[@andrewkirk3159]

It’s also worth considering that whilst your battery has lost 9% in 4 years the number of places to charge has gone up hugely. Less than 10k in 2015 to over 25k in 2019. So even if you charge mostly at home you can now manage the lost range more easily if you need to go further afield.

[@computerbob06]

Obviously never driven around North Wales then?

[@andrewkirk3159]

computerbob06 Have I missed much?

[@gelisob]

well, actually you care more about the speed curve of the degredation. In first year it probably was like 4%? next year 3%? then 2%? then 1%? so yeah.. i'm going to buy used leaf that has done 330 000km with original battery, 2013 year model and that has 9 bars. So there's plenty of battery to drive around.. oh and thats the 24kwh one.

[@siraff4461]

@@computerbob06 Or shropshire. Or most places out of large cities. Or anywhere the chargers are blocked.

[@TF12191]

@@computerbob06 it's also very hard to get fuel there, the place is pretty much a field

[@vk6xre]

I have a 64kw Kona, 500 km range on the GOM @ 100%. I plan to get rid of it at 50% capacity. I am 61 years old. I expect the car will outlast my driving licence.

[@Tron-Jockey]

I believe the Kona EV uses active battery control for the battery pack (liquid cooling). It should return well over 1000 "full" charges (and thousands more partial charges). So with a 258 mile range per charge and at least 1000 "Full" charge cycles you shouldn't see significant capacity loss before 250,000 miles. Even then it will likely have retained over 70% of its original capacity. If you're driving 12,000 miles per year you won't need a new battery for more than 20 years.

[@vk6xre]

@@Tron-Jockey Yes it is liquid cooled, a necessity in these parts, Western Australia. I charge to 80% at 4kw. I can do 7.2 kw but why? I use about 6-7 kWh a day (10%). In 5.5 years I may retire. In 5.4 years I will own the Kona outright. In 20 years time what will be MY range hahaha. Will I beat my Kona to the scrap heap?

[@Thametownguy]

In reference to your comment - I enjoyed this video more than many of the more planned ones. I think the time pressure added energy to your delivery and conciseness to your thoughts. I am in a similar position to you - hard working, married to a partner who works just as hard, doing your best to look after children and always just a bit too skint (and a bit too mean) to buy any of the exciting new EVs coming out. Unlike you, I don't yet own an EV, but I think this video has inspired me to go out and see what I can afford on the used market.

[@ronharman2280]

thomas heidkamp Hey Thomas, be careful when shopping for a used EV just as you would an ICE car. Nissan normally warranties the battery 8 years or 100,000 miles whichever comes first; however, the degradation is normally 8 bars out of 12 or 60,000 miles. Unless you live and drive a lot in a hot desert, a Leaf without thermal management is fine. Great video EV man!

[@ronharman2280]

thomas heidkamp Hey Thomas, to explain battery warranty better... The 100,000 mile or 8 year warranty is if the battery just stops working altogether. The 60,000 mile, 5 year degradation warranty is to cover the cost of replacement only if the battery degraded below 9 bars out of 12 or from about 66% to 57%, and within less than 5 years. Don’t let an owner or dealer lie to you!

[@ianmathieson65]

Ron Harman: Sorry Ron, there are errors in what you state. If you read the warranty terms for 24 and 30 kWh Leafs, you will find the statement that if the battery capacity drops more than 3 bars in less than 60,000 miles or 5 years for the 24 kWh Leaf and less than 100,000 miles or 8 years for the 30 kWh Leaf, Nissan will replace the battery free of charge. There is no mention of total failure because this is covered by the drop of 3 bars clause. I have a 30 kWh Leaf and my boss has a 24 kWh Leaf and I’ve studied the warranty terms of both models. My local Nissan dealer assures me that they’ve sold Leafs since they became available in 2011 and have never had to replace a traction battery.

[@ronharman2280]

Ian Mathieson : Thanks Ian. I only bought the 2011 Leaf with 24 KWH’s from a Nissan dealer three years ago. Not one, but three salesmen told me that the battery had degraded around to 75% or 9 bars out of 12. They all told me that if the battery lost one more bar by July of 2019, then they would replace my battery for free under their warranty. I brought my Leaf back to the same dealer in June of 2018, when the battery degradation dropped to 8 bars out of 12. I was very excited to think I would get a brand new battery, but told by the service manager that the 8 year warranty was only if the battery just stopped working. The degradation warranty had expired 5 years after the car was first sold or July of 2016. All I’m saying is be careful when you buy a used EV because the owner or even the dealer may lie to you to get you to buy the car.

[@dwc1964]

Just came here from a Transport Evolved video in which Nikki and her wife are talking about their need for a replacement for their 100k-mile Leaf on account of the battery having fallen below what they need - because they live in the country and apparently can't plug in at work. Discussing issues with the Leaf, lack of thermal battery management, etc. I recommend giving it a watch after this here.

[@mrspeigle1]

Yeah I wouldn't bother with anything that doesn't have active thermal Management in the current generation oh, it's one of the first things I look at in the specifications of any vehicle I am considering

[@MsPaulathomas]

Good video, I think 91% after four years is pretty good.

[@segoiii]

not really. Four years is no age. My car is 18 years old. And furthermore this limits the limited range of an EV even more. And what about the guys that park outside all the year ? The battery would suffer even more. When you have just 250km of range, the range isn´t something that should degrade in my opinion. Having 800 or 1000km would be something different. But 250km range at that price - and then it still degrades with the time. No thanks.

[@Eric-lx8hp]

Great as a commuter car

[@MsPaulathomas]

@@segoiii And how many parts have you had to replace in that time?

[@edwardmullins2176]

​@@segoiii The average petrol car will last about 150,000-200,000 miles. Even with a previous gen leaf like this one, the reduction in range that would happen over this time would make no difference to the vast majority (99%+) of car journeys. With upcoming battery technology, new battery management systems and battery KWh's increasing this is going to become even less of an issue. Even in current gen EVs the battery will probably outlive the car and may go on to have a second life as stationary battery storage. Most people make the mistake of overvaluing the importance of range in EVs, and the corresponding seriousness of battery degradation. These are probably the same people who almost never fill their car up the whole way or drive long distances, and are perfectly comfortable driving somewhere with only just enough petrol.

[@rodh1404]

It's not terrible, but keep in mind that England probably has one of the best climates in the world for EVs. If you live in an area that gets hot, that battery is likely to degrade much faster because of Nissan's decision to have no active cooling in their battery packs. As mentioned in the video, most EV makers do have some kind of active cooling in their EV batteries, but the Nissan Leaf in particular doesn't have that feature, which makes it much less suitable for long highway drives, fast charging and hot environments. And replacing the battery in the Nissan Leaf can be very expensive too - Nissan Australia wanted AU$33,000 (about 17,000 GBP) before they caved and offered a "subsidized, reconditioned" battery for AU$10,000. IMO, that's an outrageous price for a battery pack that doesn't even have active cooling, particularly since battery pack prices in general are decreasing.

[@prerunnerwannabe]

The Leaf works well in the UK, most of Europe, and Japan, but in most places in the U.S. the battery degrades SUUUPER quickly. I believe the temperatures of the States just don't work well with the Leaf.

[@WTFaq]

I live in Sydney Australia and it’s at 89% 75k 2016 30kw it’s pearl coloured which helps reflect the suns heat.

[@MattPSU02]

And our higher proportion of highway driving doesn't help.

[@pioneer7777777]

The US is a diverse place, I do not think it's accurate to say one vehicle doesn't work in the entire country. There are loads of urban areas where a LEAF works well - it's all about what driving you have to do regularly. We've had our 24 kwh LEAF for two years and may get another. They are ideal cars if you live in and work in a metropolitan area (about 150 million people in the country I would guess).

[@guidetechnoguide4852]

My 1.5 year old 2018 LEAF has 52,000 miles and still getting between 150 and 169 miles per full charge. The range varies by season. I probably do 3-4 fast charging sessions per month and L2 charging on a daily basis. Overall, no issues so far and my $$$ savings will continue to increase due to my 200 mile daily commute.

[@zeon5323]

Battery technology has come so far! From the late 1970s to 2008 I have had 5 Battery Electric cars as daily drivers. All flooded pBa, golf cart batteries. If I got 10,000 miles on a set of batteries that was outstanding. Your at 50K and only lost 9%!!

[@ronharman2280]

Zeon Zeon, you’re absolutely right. My first electric car was a 1975 CityCar by Vangaurd. The original range was almost 40 miles on 8 golf cart batteries. After eight years and about 5,000 miles, my range was down to about 20 miles. Wait till they come out with solid state batteries that have 1,000 miles range and can charge in 15 minutes or so!

[@Coltn3125]

@@ronharman2280 And cost less to make.

[@chrisdigital]

I have a 2015 with 48k miles... Battery is fine, I have all my battery bars. I live in NH.

[@pastie3131]

Thanks for another great vid. As you say, the Leaf is a great car and it’s a shame about your dealer experience. When discussing battery degradation, people often forget how the performance and efficiency of an ICE car decreases over time.

[@pastie3131]

Thanks for the reply M Bacon. Your experience with ICE cars (even modern, fuel injected ones,) is different from mine, where I have registered fuel efficiency drops, sometimes after very short service life. I work in an MOT test centre, so my anecdotal observations may cover more subject cases than your anecdotal observations. The primary reason for the loss of efficiency in ICE engines is the inescapable compound effect of wear on all the moving parts (engine and drive train) and the fact that modern components are built to a price. You are correct that currently EV batteries are more expensive than some ICE engines, but prices are falling fast and longevity of life is increasing. The inescapable fact is that EVs (while not perfect,) are far more efficient at converting energy to motion than ICE vehicles

[@mbjeepcherokee5542]

@@pastie3131 I've monitored my fuel usage for the past 35+ years on all my ICE vehicles and the drop in mileage is not significant due to wear. Two of my cars had/have over 200k miles on them. I like EV tech but the long term cost of ownership with battery replacement (> $5 k) is still far too high.

[@afgoodcompany4500]

Have had all kinds of car... Looove my 2013 leaf... And it's running just fine... I like to race it vrooom

[@michaeltwomey9751]

I’m the 3rd owner of a 2012 24kwh Leaf. Yours is not the worst case scenario. I’m at 52,000 miles. SOH 75%. I wish I had Leaf Spy when I bought it 4 years ago.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

Yours is 4 years older! Of course it’s not going to be as high.

[@Ro55stw]

My Nissan Leaf is coming up for 8 years old at the beginning off next year and it still has 83% of its battery remaining. Which for an early leaf I think is good. Keep up the good videos mate

[@twotone3070]

Have you decided what you are going to do when the degradation reaches a point that doesn't suit your usage?

[@Ro55stw]

Twotone yes if can have it for another year or 2 I will buy the new 62kwh leaf.

[@twotone3070]

@@Ro55stw What do you expect it's residual value to be at that point?

[@Ro55stw]

Twotone well part exchange it’s worth £5000 just now. in a year or 2 I would be happy with £2000 - £4000

[@twotone3070]

@@Ro55stw Thanks, just trying to get an idea as no one was discussing this.

[@MCSMIK]

our 30KWh Leaf is on 84% SOH at 65K miles, 1 bar lost. Seems yours will likely follow the same pattern. It had 90% from memory at 53K miles when I got it. Still perfectly usable of course

[@heatleynoble]

What indicated range does that give you on the 30? I have a 24kwh with same health, indicated 78 miles ish.

[@richardhobbs9038]

Everyone is in a hurry . If I drive the speed limit it is slowing everyone else down and they cannot wait to get around me to be the first one at the next red light ! ! !

[@dwc1964]

On traffic light controlled city streets it doesn't make sense to drive faster than the lights turn green, though I do get annoyed when people dawdle at the green light and take their sweet time clearing the intersection. Green means go; get up to speed rapidly to make room for everyone behind you; and then cruise at the correct speed so that the next light is green when you get there - that's how I do. On the highway, go ahead and drive the speed limit if that's where you're comfortable - just please *keep right except to pass* [*] so that others may pass you. People who camp out in the passing lane *really* annoy me, and are much more of a hazard to navigation than someone going fast, but following all of the other rules (maintaining safe distance, passing properly, etc.). There's plenty of room for everyone to go the speed they prefer, if everyone makes room for each other. That's how they can have no speed limit on the Autobahn - because people follow this one simple rule. [*] or left, in the UK or other places where they drive on the left...

[@richardhobbs9038]

@@dwc1964 - Agree , and I am always in the slow lane except for turns , etc. I try to stay out of their way so that they can get to the next red light first. (Not too many towns in S. California use traffic light speed controlled systems.) Thanks for your reply !

[@lubberwalker]

@@richardhobbs9038 it's not the slow lane. It's the driving lane. If you want to overtake, you leave the driving lane and move into the overtaking lane. When you have completed overtaking you move back into driving lane. Using terms like this helps spread the word to the cerebrally challenged drivers who do the opposite (whichever country they are in). Later on we can start introducing into language, the advanced concepts of mirrors and indicators.

[@richardhobbs9038]

@@lubberwalker - nit pickin' time ? In my brain of diminished capacity the slow & driving lane are the same since most people exceed the speed limit whether passing or not . . . they may exceed the speed limit a bit less in the lane one first encounters when entering a 'freeway' in the USA . . . . hence it is the 'slow' lane . The next lane over might be considered a driving lane as well as the next lane over. Finally, on a four lane freeway , the final lane before the 'carpool' lane would be the 'Fast' lane where folks seem to think it is the German Autobahn . . . . . but whatever . What the heck are 'mirrors and indicators' . . . . . . ? ? AND , Ellul , I see on your channel you enjoy some of the same music artists as me . . . . . But , I did not see Angelina Jordan among them ! ! ! What's up with that ? ? ? Take care, RH

[@lubberwalker]

@@richardhobbs9038 I and my diminishing brain were agreeing with you, but l expect my use of "you" instead of "one" ( that comes over on the netweb as "up one's backside") didn't survive the transatlantic translation. Although I did use "we" as well. Don't worry though. I'm used to the nit-picking charge since words of experience became dismissed as dementia as they aren't splattered with tautology "I don't 'even' know", "I was like", "know what I mean?" and "like" the latter two often used together in awful symbiosis. As you investigated my channel (I don't have one BTW) I checked yours and see you can do no wrong in my book as you like sailing. But that means you ought to know that all lanes have the same speed limit. The inner lane is the one for driving in, progressively outer lanes are for progressively overtaking manoeuvres that all end in returning to the driving lane and the slow lane is any point of sail on the well found sailing yacht I will buy in 2020. As an electrickery nurd, you may find "Sailing Uma" of interest. Dan & Kika replaced Uma's broken diesel engine with a used fork lift electric motor and a lithium battery bank, wind and solar gen and sailed 18000 miles (zero carbon) including the Atlantic. All before reading their first RYA instruction book and discovering COLREGS. But you may also find this article interesting.. Blows cool on "Zero carbon. www.lowtechmagazine.com/2008/03/the-ugly-side-o.html I wonder what a contemporary rewrite would look like? Did you notice that I didn't confuse my comment with right, left, further left (or further right - UK) nor indeed IALA and IALB? I'm pleased with that. I noted your facetious treatment of "mirrors and indicators" and took this to be amusing flippancy. But for other readers, these are the things that, in the UK, one (over millennial age) checks and signals with before one's lane changing manoeuvres. Millennial's and younger don't need to do any of this as they just know better and/or have greater driving skills and anyway, are too busy running their important businesses on their phones and/or applying their make up. Great bumping into you Richard! Up the special relationship!

[@jonathancolling2284]

Batteries are notorious for being fine for ages and then dropping off in an avalanche style as the cells reach end of charge life.

[@BrianGuitars]

Your degradation is pretty amazing. I've got a 2017 Leaf with 30,000km on it and we're down 15%. Probably the super harsh winters we get and the car isn't garaged. My Tesla has essentially no degradation in and it's got around 30000km on it too.

[@mrspeigle1]

In fairness the 2017 battery life was a step backward, i cant comment on the current batteries but i know the 100 milers have a bad rep for degrading here in the states.

[@hamshackleton]

You say that Nissan service is very slow - I took my Citroen filthy polluting diesel in for a booked-in new battery, as the old one was beginning to struggle in the cold. It took them nearly four hours to undo two clamps, and two nuts, swap the battery, and do them up again, while I sat in a plastic chair in the waiting area. If there is a next time, I'll do it myself in about eight minutes, if I can lift the darn thing, as I'm getting past wrestling with awkward lumps of lead.

[@thomasm5714]

I've had my 40kWh Leaf for one year now, and I can't fault it. A pleasure to drive.

[@Walterp60]

I love my Model 3. Best car ever. You only live once, and I enjoy driving again.

[@Walterp60]

@@newmediaone Apparently it has three packs which can be replaced individually. In 12 to 15 years battery costs should be cheaper than now. And also the long range should go to almost 500k. So that's something like 40 years @ 12k miles per year. To be honest it's got a good chance to outlive me. And finally how much will the equivalent prices BMW or Mercedes be worth at 12 to 15 years. And the others we cost a fortune to get going with failing gearboxes, engines, exhausts you name it - old petrol and diesels cost an arm and a leg to keep running. And they breakdown all the time. Electric motors are rated at 1 million miles.

[@tmtcschannel]

2013 leaf owner - 40k miles and 1 bar loss, very pleased with mine. hope by the time I go to replace battery that the price will be cheap as chips

[@gethinrees1]

Slightly reduced range just means to have to charge slightly more often. Having recently bought a used Leaf I fully appreciate now that range is a bit of a smokescreen, mainly used to deter EV converts and as a way for manufacturers to compete on headlines.

[@benfarmer-webb1016]

Exactly, if you have a car that can do 300 real world miles but the nearest charger is 350 miles away, then you cant go further than 150 miles from home. Charging points are more important, not range necessarily

[@patreekotime4578]

@@benfarmer-webb1016 that's not entirely true either, it just means you have to be willing to make a longer stop somewhere to add 50 miles of range at a slower charge rate. Because there is no such thing as NO chargers, just incredibly slow wall plugs. Stop somewhere and catch dinner and a movie and then go on your way. Given that 300 miles is 4.5 to 5 hours of driving time anyway, most of us humans want to take a nice long break in there somewhere for food, potty, and a stretch of the legs.

[@glideman]

Patreeko theArtist potty🤣

[@Sofala]

@@patreekotime4578 Totally disagree, if you asked the question to most people in the UK about that trip a quick toilet break is all they would be prepared to take. The mindset of charging on long trips is the biggest hurdle of mass EV adoption in the UK.

[@patreekotime4578]

@@Sofala Frankly, the mindset of people to need to OWN a vehicle in case they might need to make a long trip once a year is ridiculous. The future isn't going to be better unless people's mindsets on a whole lot of things are changed. Period.

[@loftysaltmarsh69]

Manufactures should be lending you cars for long term testing.

[@gospelman7222]

Hmmm. I bought a 14 plate LEAF some weeks ago, just 18500 miles on the clock and the state of health of the battery according to LeafSpy is 83.98%. Lost one bar on the dash indicator. No idea what the previous owner did to degrade the battery like this; LeafSpy records only 12 Quick Charges and 800+ L1/L2 charges. Love the car to bits, but I've noticed using the heater reduces the battery charge significantly.

[@davidhamishwill367]

I drive a 30k Leaf, almost 4 years old, just passed 50,000. the first 2 years the battery degraded virtually not at all, and since then it had degraded to about 80% capacity. Then I took it in for its usual annual service (£159) and they said they had a couple of 'recalls' to do. When I picked it up they said I might get a couple of miles range extra. But in fact it was MUCH better. I reckon it is back up to about 95% capacity, according to GOM and other instruments - and my own experience. Very gratifying. Has anybody else had an experience like this?

[@davidsworld5837]

for those petrol car you should watch a top gear video on horse power loss on old cars when they put on test machines. I think the thing is the cost of the battery when you bought the car is not the price today to buy it but I think that 24kwh or 30 kwh cars for most people will be seen as not good if you take away and need to do 200 or 300 mile trips. if you take it has the new leaf not now being fitted with much larger kwh batteries. I have to say I dont like the shape of the leaf

[@pabauza]

Ok, I just subscribed. I'm considering a used Leaf. Excellent reviews.

[@WTFaq]

Hi. I’m at 89% on 30kwh leaf 2016. 75k. Has anyone else noticed that when you use charge timer, when you plug in on leaf spy it records as 1 charge count, it then times out after a while, the charge timer turns on and it counts as another charge count even though you only plugged it in once. Basically it is counting 2 charge counts for one charge.

[@jenkinseric2]

I drive a 2002 Toyota RAV 4 EV. 18/19 years old and still getting 80% of the original range. The body is still in decent shape and I plan on keeping it on the road. By the way, Toyota used the same battery cooling as the leaf, i.e. air circulation so it is battery chemistry that counts more than the cooling that limits the lifespan. My car only charges at 18 amps at 240 volts so it never gets hot during charging. I am in Victoria BC Canada.

[@mrbenn747]

91.2% seems reasonable after 50k miles. I wonder if rate of battery degradation will increase as it ages or remain linear.

[@mvansumeren4313]

If his is similar to mine, the degradation will be fairly linear. My 24 KWH has ~ 80% remaining at 7 years old and 65,000 miles. I periodically monitor the SOH of my battery and it degrades by how much power (KWH) it delivers. I live in a cool climate and garage my vehicle similar to EVM so mine should be a good gauge of how his will age. On a side note, 9% in 50K miles is good for a Leaf, but poor compared to EVs with active thermal management. Our Model S 70 has degraded ~4% in 90K miles and there is much more spirited driving taking place in our S. (Stop signs and highway on-ramps are fun!)

[@mrbenn747]

M VanSumeren Interesting info, thanks!

[@ronharman2280]

M VanSumeren Just wondering, how much money did you pay for your Model S Tesla compared to your Leaf?

[@Coltn3125]

@@ronharman2280 you still have to think the Leaf has 4X the battery degradation of the S. Plus the longer range of the S so it is a trade off yes.

[@mvansumeren4313]

@@ronharman2280 I paid about 17K for my '13 leaf that was two years old new. It had about 600 miles on it presumably from test drives and the like. It was an old stock vehicle and I knew this going in and used it to my advantage. Our MS fetched ~88K with options new in 2015. If I had it to do again, I'd definitely purchase the MS again. I'd not buy the Leaf again simply because of the lack of service the dealers provide. It sounds like EVM has had about the same experience with Nissan's apathy towards their customers in the UK as I have in the USA.

[@Tron-Jockey]

Ha, beat you. Albeit slightly. My 2015 is at 94.6% SOH at 51,000 miles. I live on the US east coast near Washington DC. My daily commute to work uses roughly 40% and the commute home uses the same. I charge at work so the car rarely goes below 55% before being recharged. It's almost always been recharged via Level 2 (6.6kW charger). It has only seen about 20 CHAdeMO 50kW charges. I avoid any sort of charging when temperatures are above 95F, usually waiting for evening temperatures before plugging in. Dependability is awesome. I've had absolutely no reason to return to the dealership. NOTHING ever seems to go wrong with these damn things. Most dependable vehicle I've ever owned BY FAR.

[@minuslr]

Yeah well done - it's worth doing your homework on what keeps the battery healthy. At service centres in the UK they used to give you a graph showing how well you were doing in difference areas such as number of supercharges, 100% / 0% charges etc

[@ronharman2280]

Chuck O Hey Chuck. Great comment. Nissan Leaf gets a bad name but what about other EV’s after 4 to eight years? Unless you live in a hot desert, you( we) don’t need a battery thermal management system. I use mostly 50 KW chargers because they are free and faster and I’ve lost less than 1% SOH in 19,000 miles in my Nissan Leaf E Plus!

[@henrikcasell5765]

@@ronharman2280 Interesting. My Leaf 40 is down to 93.58% SOH after a little over 60000 km / 38000 miles, a loss of about 6% since new. (It started a little below 100%).

[@chrislind2048]

You must have got a good battery. Earlier this year I drove a 2015 Nissan Leaf for three weeks performing deliveries in the Denver Metro Area. TThe work was done in May and June when neither the heater or the A/C was used. The car was a fleet vehicle with approximately 11,000 miles on the clock. It was plugged into a dedicated 220 Volt outlet every day. The sticker for this Leaf said it had a 120 mile range on a full charge. After leaving it on the charger overnight or over the weekend, the dashboard showed that it had only an 84 mile range. However, even this estimate was a joke. After driving it 30 miles, the range estimator said the remaining range was less than 40 miles. All driving I did was in city traffic without using heat, seat warmers, radio, windshield wipers, or air conditioning. The car itself was cheaply made, rattled, and rode quite rough. It did have good acceleration. Sorry, but I would never consider buying or paying anything near sticker price for this contraption. Maybe the newer ones have better range when new and hold their range after 5 years.

[@HerminiePA]

I'm an old guy with a 2011 Leaf. I now have 30 miles range in the winter, 40 miles range in the summer. But I only need to go about 10 miles on the most extreme day. That's retirement. But I have a second car which is petrol--if I need to go out of town.

[@EgoShredder]

3:19 - Phew! I thought you were going to get your Floppy out for a moment!

[@ronharman2280]

EgoShredder Did he commit a quid pro quo at 12:00? Lol. Something for something (money for merchandise).

[@bigdougscommentary5719]

Glad to see u finally have LeafSpyPro. Takes away all range anxiety when u can see charge in detail.

[@cybertrucklife7716]

I'm planning to learn to drive next year and considering getting a secondhand E-NV200 (low end but making sure to get a rapid charging model) for my first year or two driving around for my painting and decorating work. Does this seem a reasonable plan? I expect my insurance will be worse as a first time driver (at least I'm late 30s rather than a young guy for insurance) but the running costs should cheaper and I'll avoid Bristol's diesel ban that's coming in. Long term I plan to upgrade to a Cybertruck for work and as a live in vehicle but I have to start somewhere. Thanks

[@patreekotime4578]

There will be a tipping point where people realize that EVs are low maintenance and a ton of people switch over. I suspect around that time fuel prices will go through the roof as well, with lots of corporate and government shenanigans to try to keep them "low". And after that tipping point, folks will think it's absolutely insane that everyone spent hundreds of dollars a year, every year, just to keep their car running. That in our collective imagination a car is "reliable" if it only costs us hundreds of dollars every few years to keep it running.. all the while knowing that a fatal engine or transmission failure IS coming, it's just a matter of when. Talk about anxiety.

[@dwc1964]

Yes to all of this. And in my mind, the tipping point will come when the first large roadside diner chain decides to future-proof their facilities by installing charging ports at every space in their parking lots - thereby eliminating in one fell swoop the "can't do a road trip" argument that's really the last remaining bit of "range anxiety".

[@segoiii]

it´s just a question of range and price. People won´t switch as long as the batteries are crappy and expensive like today. The mass doesn´t buy a city car for 20k or more with 200km range.

[@patreekotime4578]

@@segoiii EVs are finally within the price ranges of ICE vehicles, especially when cost of ownership is compared. And I think it's more likely more people will realize they simply don't NEED to own a long distance vehicle. Because most people don't. And I say that as someone who lives in the country surrounded by mountains. Most people's perception of how far they drive is completely illusionary.

[@segoiii]

@@patreekotime4578 they are not. you have to compare the range ! You cannot compare a 200km range EV with an 600km range ICE. And please don´t say that people don´t need range. They do. EV is still very expensive. Too expensive. As i said i drive a 18 years old citycar. If it broke, i would buy a Mazda CX3 Center-Line for 18.000€. Tell me EV that comes near this. They are all double the price, if not more.

[@patreekotime4578]

@@segoiii There is certainly no car in the lower range. I personally cannot afford ANY new car. I'm not talking about the people who can't afford them. I'm talking about the people who CAN afford them, and CAN afford a rental for the occassional long trip, and still make up ridiculous excuses as to why they absolutely have to own a vehicle that can go 500 miles per charge, when it's doubtful that their current vehicle can go that far on one tank of gas. Mine certainly cannot.

[@alexanderwilson602]

Good update.My Env200 has done 24000 miles used on a daily basis and i only charge using rapids up to 80% every day,Interesting if i drive to the west coast Scotland a distance of 180 miles by the time i do the third charge on that trip ,Leaf Spy wil say my SOH is 94% where as on a daily basis it gives me a reading of 89.4%,I think battery Temp must affect SOH percentage ,has anyone else noticed this. Alex

[@F15HHOOKS]

Yea, last time I checked my 30kw 2017 LEAF with 18k miles was on a cold morning and it read 92.5%. I'll check it again when it's had a good run and see if different.

[@xboxice2005]

Yeah lower temperature will increase battery internal resistance,a warmer pack has lower resistance 👍

[@glideman]

I’ve had a very similar EV history as you, my 30kw Leaf has 99% soh after 40,000 miles which I would say is great 👍

[@Pete856]

I assume you have looked after the battery by not charge to 100% all the time and draining it to near empty, and kept fast charging to a minimum? The biggest mistake I see people do is charge to full every few days and drive it to almost empty before charging again, rather then keeping it in the middle by small charges everyday. Almost like they're still in the mindset of how you fuel an ICE car.

[@glideman]

69aussieguy To be honest I know how to look after the battery but have completely ignored that🤣 We had an Ecotricity charger on free vend near where we live so I used that every day for 6 months and I’ve run it down to zero percent numerous times 😟 I always tell people not to stress about the battery, it’s not worth worrying about, just enjoy the car and don’t stress about it. We’re on the V2G trial now so my battery is also used to run the house when I’m not driving and the V2G sometimes charges it to 100%.

[@badchefi]

Are you willing to share your LeafSpy report?

[@webcomment8895]

Obviously, the UK environment is one of the most ideal places to drive an EV due to the mild weather than leans towards cool all year long. So, whenever anyone from the UK posts their battery degredation numbers, I have to take it with a grain of salt. UK-driven Nissan Leafs will often have the "best case scenario" for the most minimal battery degredation. People in other parts of the world where hot summers are the norm will deal with much more extreme battery degredation on Nissan Leafs.

[@jason333333]

Hi. Can you answer a question? Just bought a 2014 leaf and not sure what I should expect from mileage. Drove it back from the garage , 6 miles, and its dropped 20 miles from a full charge of 79 miles! I am new and don't know if I should panic and return it within my 7 day grace period. I have ordered an OBDII and will start monitoring, but just wondered what your thoughts might be. It has done 31500 miles. Thank you!! Great channel by the way!!

[@topofthefossway]

I'm seriously considering buying a 24kWh Leaf early next year...90% SOH will be be perfectly acceptable to me.

[@Tron-Jockey]

Stick with a 2015. They have the upgraded Heat Tolerant battery (Lizard). They also have the efficient Heat Pump heating system.

[@BobSmith-hz6bd]

I ran one for nearly 3 years and did over 80k miles in that time commuting 120 miles per day. It was the 30kWh model and was absolutely faultless in that time. Mine had the arse crack as well 😊

[@ltrtg13]

Compared to the last Fully Charged Show. Your rant was a mini rant. Unlike Robert's 2 full blown rants. When Robert rants I start to wonder if my speakers are going to blow up.

[@joshuasmith7369]

Fellow Fully Charged viewers and/or listeners. Robert: and if you have been, thank you for watching.

[@dwc1964]

Robert's rants are among my favorite things about Fully Charged, and the reason I subbed in the first place years ago (when it was just him). And that's why there's a volume adjustment knob/button. ;-)

[@LakesGeek]

If it's anything like my Zoe, it also tends to read a low SOH at this time of year. Mine currently says 93%, last winter it said 94%.... during summer, 96-98%.... (Yeah I know it's technically autumn, but we're Northerners)

[@normanboyes4983]

Very encouraging.👍 Strategically all we need to sort out is a seamless hassle free and reliable charging network.

[@nomebear]

The cost of batteries will go down as the technology continues to improve and manufacturing ramps up. Just recently we replaced a battery on a 2007 Prius for $1,500 with a new Toyota manufactured battery. Before hand I was told that they cost as much as $4,000, and I was wrong. We also own a C-class M-Benz and average $600 a year on maintenance. We have owned it 21 years, total annual maintenance is $12,600. Electrics are the only way to go, and range will continue to improve.

[@edwyncorteen1527]

Just traded in our 24kW Leaf, 65 plate 27000 miles 98% SOH! Upgraded to 18 plate 40kW Tekna 16000 miles 93% SOH as wanted all the toys, great car, wife loves the range!

[@F15HHOOKS]

Ahh so it's the length she likes, fnar, fnar.

[@jimmcdonald6465]

Very fair commentary EVM. Currently considering my options. Half thinking about e-Niro but it would have to be a lease. Slightly tempted by 2nd hand Leaf but battery management is a turn off. Tech is obviously changing incredibly fast right now and 2nd hand more refined options than the 30Kw Leaf are not really available within my price range. Life is hard, innit?

[@t5jerry]

Is the battery knackered yet ? At 50k it must be.......

[@clivematthew-wilson7918]

The complaints about the Leaf design relate to the fact that the batteries don't have a cooling system, which means they cook in hot climates or if they are rapid-charged frequently. A Yorkshire climate is hardly a fair test of the battery cooling system.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

Clive Matthew-Wilson In the UK it’s very fair, especially as this is a UK channel.

[@Woodyjims-shack]

80k miles 82% 5 1/2 years old going well110 miles a day commute round trip but... Noticing that it takes more juice to charge the car than before due to internal resistance I imagine than before 👍

[@xchopp]

Our 24 kWh 2016 e-Golf has 20,000 miles and doesn't seem to have had much loss at all (maybe 3%?). We charge on 120v, not sure if that is a factor. It is a _bit_ of a hot hatch, tbh.

[@xchopp]

No battery thermal management either, like LEAF. Does OK in New Jersey (hot-ish summers, cold-ish winters, likes the former much more than the latter).

[@eddthirty4065]

Apart from tyres, brakes occasionally, you'll still need to have the brake fluid change (I have mine done every 4 years) and the reduction gearbox oil change (approx every 40K miles).

[@gordonmcmillan883]

Never been tempted by a Leaf. We could do with another speculation video about what you are going to buy next, although not much change in availability since the last one. Tesla truck maybe?

[@stephenrobbins2931]

Your Nissan Leaf, when new, had an official NEDC cycle range of 155 miles, but only 125‑130 miles in real‑world conditions. After only 4 years you've lost 9%, so its down to 114 - 118 miles. That means you can safely count on going somewhere 55 miles away and making it home. When its 8 years old the range is going to be down to just over 50 miles. Fine for commuting maybe, but how many people just buy a car to commute, and not for a weekend away or a holiday? Or perhaps they should buy a petrol car as well for such occasions.

[@shrewinjapan]

One thing I can say that is a big difference between the UK and Japan is the service you get from Nissan. As you might expect, the service from Nissan in Japan is excellent. However, I very much doubt I will be buying another Leaf (or sadly any EV) once my current 24 KWH model's battery range gets too low. Growth of the charging infrastructure in Japan, once enviable, has almost completely stalled (probably because other than the Leaf there are very few pure EVs available here). I currently enjoy unlimited fast charging for 2000 yen (under £15/$20) per month, but that support program is ending this month (although I can still benefit for two more years). The replacement program is more expensive and gives a limited number of charges per month before you have to start paying each time, and at 500 yen per time (30 mins charge), paid charging is almost as expensive as petrol. Obviously mostly charging at home would still work out a fair bit cheaper than a petrol car, but with the big difference in the cost of the car itself it becomes a far less attractive proposition.

[@kjh789az]

More sense from EVM. Pity this eludes so many Big Oil Small Brain commentators. Thanks!

[@effin1233]

My kia soul is 95.6 after 49000 miles well pleased

[@ewanoneill1011]

What range do you get in summer? Thanks in advance.

[@effin1233]

88 miles in summer 68 in winter

[@homomorphic]

8.8% after 50k is pretty bad if that is linear degradation. That means 17.6% after 100k and 35.2% after 200k. I expect my Bolt to have around 10% degradation after 200k.

[@cyberoptic5757]

I like this channel and watch it often. Today, I'm noticing that it's usually raining there!

[@ronharman2280]

Jay Fulton Sometimes we ask God to help us grow, but then we complain when it rains too hard! Lol

[@cyberoptic5757]

@@ronharman2280 I used to think like that but nowadays I avoid the supernatural explanations like gods, angels and demons. I find that the natural world around me provides explanations that suffice

[@danwiddon3854]

Loved the Jonathan Pie moment as you began to wrap up @9:24.

[@marks-0-0]

Subbed, sorry I thought I already was! I like your content and personality, keep it up evm 👍

[@seanwilliams6424]

Would love to know how you charge your leaf. I live in UK and have a 2015 24kwh with 25k miles down to 87% SOH. A friend has a 2016 30kwh with 20k miles and hes down to 84% SOH. Both charge on home 3.6 / 7.2 kwh chargers and never fast charge, and we are both losing capacity. Maybe your regime is in some way better for the battery, so would love to try to figure out if thats a difference.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

Treat charging like a diet. Vary it. The odd rapid charge doesn’t hurt and actually seems to help it. One thing batteries don’t like is been sat not been used, especially if full.

[@RussRyan7713]

Worth noting I have been using leafspy for about 3 months, I have a Dec 2014 64 plate 24Kwh leaf that has 53K miles on it. When I first check my SOH it was about 87%. However today its at 90% and 2 weeks ago it was at 93.5%. So it seems to me that the SOH definitely fluctuates over the months up and down. I rarely rapid charge and have not some so in over 5 months. My car has only ever had 31 rapids according to Leafspy and 25 were before I brought it just over 2 years ago.

[@chrislees430]

Loved your comment about paying Nissan for service and only getting an equivalent read-out that you demo'ed yourself, and some screen wash. Is the Nissan service worth paying for? And if you don't do it (just for the virtual "stamp"), can it really invalidate your warranty?

[@cyberoptic5757]

I'm in Maine, USA with a 2014 Leaf and my experience matches this. I lost one 'bar' after 50,000 miles. Otherwise, reliable and useful daily. We charge on a home charger. In 3 years, my expenses have been 250 USD plus purchasing a set of tires at 44,000 miles

[@stnln2180]

I lost one bar on my 2015 Nissan Leaf with 38K ml..... I would not recommend to buy EV without active cooling system....

[@debeeriz]

the best idea with an electric car is to put the money you save on fuel cost into a separate account to pay for battery replacement, if you sell it it before replacement it will also help with depreciation costs, and if you need to take a long trip you can also use it to hire a fueled car

[@deelawrence1135]

It's good to hear that overall you haven't really noticed any difference in daily routine, but as I've not owned an ev and know little about them other than what I read / watch from others etc, Can I just ask - do you think that possibly the reason you haven't noticed any change is that the 9% has come from the 40% of the battery that you don't use ? or do you generally use all of the capable distance ? I could be misunderstanding but from vids I've watched I'm lead to believe that you should basically charge the vehicle when it gets 20% and are also best not to charge more than 80%, so essentially a middle 60% window for general use. Is that correct ? In which case 9% from the 1st 20% would make no difference ????

[@flitsies]

Have you considered that perhaps your loss could be down to battery balancing. Perhaps the cells are fine but slightly out of balance, an unbalanced pack can make a huge difference to the performance of the pack as a whole. It might be worth checking that out before buying a new battery.

[@kristianwetterstrand4401]

flitsies This is very important notice! I got used replacement battery to my 30kWh and it was like new but one cell totally down. It was manually balanced and now the SOH for the battery shows 101,24%. Strange but true! Old battery had 178000 km drive behind and 84, something%, but still the battery health indicator had lost no bars...

[@flitsies]

@@kristianwetterstrand4401 Yes it's one of those things that most people just don't bother doing or simply don't know about. But it's well worth doing because as you said it can make a huge difference.

[@Milhouse77BS]

Now, if you had a 2012 Leaf with 42,000 miles, you might be seeing 8 bars with 64% SOH, OR ABOUT 55 mile range at 55 mph. :)

[@computerbob06]

Cam belt, £450! Someone definitely saw you coming!

[@dougowt]

It depends on the car, you can pay a lot more! I was in a friend's workshop recently and the whole front end of the Audi he was working on had to come off to replace the cambelt!

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

We’re not talking a 12 year old corsa.

[@G-Cam1]

£450 is probably about right... Some are way more ..eg a full belt change on a Discovery 4 at a main dealer could cost from £1700 to £2400 (depending on the labour element of the job)! Its a full body off job (unless you know a well versed LR specalist who can do it with the body on)... By comparison EV service and battery replacement costs are imho pretty reasonable..

[@yvs6663]

If the loss of capacity continued the way it does, i would have to buy a leaf with sub 30 000 miles for it to survive for as long as i expect a car to survive.

[@kateevans4892]

Thank you, your videos are useful, interesting and honest - and I don't even own an EV yet! I'm afraid I didn't like the Ford Mustang one, but then I don't like SUVs in general. It should be possible to upgrade the battery on an EV like the Leaf, then you wouldn't have to buy a whole new car. But I suppose that way leads to bankruptcy for Nissan. Keep up the good work and I look forward to the sarcastic merchandise!

[@dougowt]

Some manufacturers are offering upgrades, BMW and Renault for the Zoe (only in France so far). But even if most manufacturers don't, you can guarantee there will be aftermarket suppliers offering upgrades.

[@kateevans4892]

@@dougowt I know I've got to wait patiently until the price comes down enough that I can afford even a 2nd hand EV. By that time I'm sure you're right about the aftermarket market; another couple of years!

[@dougowt]

@@kateevans4892 I'm not a fan of SUV's either, I just don't see the point. If you live in the UK try GoGreenAutos, Matt has some very nice used EV's. He is currently selling his own Zoe for £6,995 which has the addition of DC charging. Remember you can afford to pay more for an EV as your running costs fall through the floor. My current Zoe is entirely being paid for in fuel savings.

[@scobo4592]

@@dougowt Exactly, an awful lot of people forget that they won't be paying for diesel/petrol. Even public charging is way cheaper than fuel.

[@pioneer7777777]

Our 2013 LEAF with 57k miles is at 89% SOH.

[@xboxice2005]

How many bars have you lost 😎I just bought a 2012 with 2 bar lost but I don't know where the SOH is at,waiting on A OBD2 🤔

[@greenboi6640]

What is the app you use to connect to the leaf?

[@a-aron2276]

Check it again if you can get the battery warmed up first then charge it, I'm not actually expecting much but just curious if the weather is having an effect?

[@Dr-EV]

Not had my dongle plugged into my car yet, but my 2015 24kwh leaf is still showing full bars on capacity.indicator. and im approaching 57,000 miles. As with your comments, ICE cars probably degrade a lot faster than evenLeaf gen2 batteries. Its only going to get better than this with newer battery tech.

[@RWBHere]

Those Lancastrians are going overboard, sending all of their spare rain over the Pennines to us. 💦 So, are you planning on having a spare battery for when the old one goes incandescent within the next few thousand miles? 😄 Can't blame you for wanting to wash your hands of Nissan. I'd do the same in your position. Thanks for the video Andy.

[@peterjay9697]

Can only agree about Nissan customer service. I have just traded in a 2015 24kw Tekna after having a nightmare from Nissan across 2 separate dealerships (different franchises). I had originally offered the car back to Nissan after a wrangle over the corrosion on the Tekna wheels. After they had agreed there was an issue with them I asked them to write a report to RCI finance so I would not be charged due to them not being corroded through neglect or damage. They agreed to do so while I was in the dealership then sent me an email saying it was out of warranty so could not help. Thanks Nissan This was after I had took it to a different franchise for its first MOT thinking it best to have somebody experienced in EV's to cover it. Went to pick it up later the same day and they had flattened the 12v battery making the car inoperable. Took them 3 days to work this out and have it back on the road. Thanks Nissan I have decided to trade it in on another i3 (my wife has a 2015 BEV) after the saleswoman at Nissan stated if I did not trade in against a 40kw leaf she would not be able to pay her mortgage! Emotional blackmail does not work with me unfortunately! All in all the leaf is a great car (other than diamond cut alloys) but Nissan customer service is an absolute joke!

[@leexgx]

I like the idea of i3 rex (BEVx) as it main use is battery with a backup APU that can be used below 30% charge left via hold function(or full APU power below 1% but car be at less then half reduced power mode as APU is a backup not a full power unit) , the APU can't provide the same amount of power as the battery's so give you reduced power and max speed but it's there to get you to next charge station as problem with normal eV is if you can't make it to a working fast charger and end up getting stranded and having to be towed I seen 2 people with the i3 rex and they said they rarely use it but has saved them on long trip a number of times when the charge points was not working (as in 2-3 locations) so was able to get to a working one in there own without been towed

[@jestronixhanderson9898]

Exactly , one thing no one talks about, range loss on a petrol car :) they lose efficiency even with servicing. Slight compression loses etc. I have no interest in anything but the leaf for now, 85% SOH at 6 years , It’s our town car, even at 50% range it’s very useful , I hope to see it push another 6 years, I suspect it will pay for itself outright if it does 6 years :) battery deg won’t be an issue, it’s peoples wants for flashy new and features.

[@AlainSylvestre]

My Leaf 2018, 40 kW after 93k : SOH is at 91.18%.

[@paullewis1637]

You might call it waffling on, but your real world info is a godsend to us who are looking to convert from ICE cars. Great stuff, keep it up.

[@iansimons7466]

Hi just as yourself my generation one leaf no rattles no faults all good there. But unfortunately I must report at 61000 miles I have 19% degradation and due to my car having a resistive heater winter range is no longer meeting my needs. However I’m replacing my traction battery with a new one for £6500 from Indra renewables in February. I’m happy with the car apart from the degradation and that’s cheaper than buying a new car. 🤓👍🏻

[@sim6699]

Big problem with EV's is true cost is not reflective of sales prices, who's subsides would end if everyone bought one and cost of new battery when the car is around 10-15 years old. A new battery would cost more than the car is worth while an ICE engine could be rebuilt or replaced for less than 1000.

[@EnviousNinja]

I'm glad you still recommend the leaf but not Nissan.. about to get a leaf through a lease (everything included except fuel) so luckily I won't have to deal directly with Nissan :)

[@lowdowndan]

Our two 2011 leafs are down to 7 and 8 bars (out of 12) respectively after about 38,000 miles. We are not happy...

[@RomGuyony]

Just a thought: is battery degradation dependent on battery size? If you lost around 10% range in 50k miles, or 3kWh, does this mean you would lose the same percentage in a bigger battery or does this mean you would lose the same amount of kWh in the same distance? Say with a 60kWh would you be looking at 57 or 54kWh useable capacity left?

[@dg115]

I'd like to see you hit 100k in that leaf. But I know you want to move it on already

[@minuslr]

Our leaf second hand experience was good. Very low mileage, we used it every day as second car for 3 years with no bars lost (when we sold it) and nothing went wrong.

[@sciencetutor7047]

Hi, did you measure the degradation when you first got it? Wonder if it was ever “100%” could well have a chunk of the drop off in the early days.

[@ivelintrifonov1950]

Hi EVM, thank you for the great videos! I am considering buying a Nissan Leaf. I would be very grateful if you answer a few of my questions. 1. How much is the cost of a new battery pack (refurbished or new) if you know?. I read somewhere it could be 5000 GBP for new or 2500 GBP for refurbished. 2. How much was your most recent Car Insurance (for NIssan Leaf)? 3. How much is the cost of a home charger for EV and do you recommend any particular brand ( I have seen an advert for 750 GBP) 4. Is it safe to charge the car on the street overnight? Are there any locks (on the car end) that could stop the thieves? Unfortunately, I do not have a garage or even driveway. If it is not safe, I have to give up the idea of becoming an EV owner. Thank you in advance!

[@williamstanley7900]

Tell me more about that dongle. Is it standard over all EVs?

[@pepstein]

Most EVs have OBD-II ports, but some Teslas don't. The dongle connects to that port and uses Bluetooth to transmit the data to your phone. While the basic protocol is standardized, things like battery health are proprietary, and are generally reverse engineered by clever folks. So you can't do it with every EV.

[@williamstanley7900]

Can anyone suggest a brand of OBD2 that is compatible with EVs?

[@pepstein]

@@williamstanley7900 www.electricvehiclewiki.com/wiki/leaf-spy-pro

[@MrFurriephillips]

My 2014 (22kWh) gen1 Renault Zoe has lost somewhere between 2.5-4% over the past 5 years I’ll be long dead before it cannot handle my daily commute & even then, it’s Renault’s problem. Even with £70/month battery hire/insurance, I’m still saving £230/month over my previous ICE car!

[@johngifford7725]

We lost a bit more than that after three years and less than 30,000mi on our 2013 Leaf. Pretty good. Driving a 2014 hybrid Pathfinder and I couldn't agree more on the Nissan ownership experience. Never again.

[@levenkay4468]

Regarding your puzzlement over not particularly noticing the loss in range your instruments say should be there: As time went by, you became a more proficient/efficient EV driver, which goes some way towards offsetting the car's diminishing capacity.

[@MrAlbedo39]

I suspect a lot of people think that all Li-Ion batteries are the same. So, if their cell phone battery is pooched after four years then EV batteries will also be pooched in four years. Li-Ion batteries come in many different blends of materials to suit the purpose for which they're being made; phone batteries are quite different from EV batteries.

[@seandugger9649]

We also had the worst service possible with Nissan to the point that my wife traded in our 2019 Leaf for a Hyundai Kona ICE. :( Long story short, we got a battery error which after a quick google search told us we needed a few battery packs to be replaced. We had to FIGHT with Nissan to just get a loaner vehicle and it took about 2 months to get it repairs while still making payments. First excuse from Nissan is that they needed an anti static mat that nobody apparently made, then the diagrams were too difficult to read. Finally after that once it WAS fixed they wouldn’t provide details as to what they did. Overall, I LOVED the Leaf but hated Nissan. I miss my (wifes) Leaf....... :(