No One Wanted To Believe This…

[@STUCUBE]

As many have brought up, it's also important to take into consideration the other part of section A4 (besides the rule against touching the cube whilst hands are on the timer): A4b) The competitor uses their fingers to touch the elevated sensor surfaces of the timer. The competitor's palms must be facing down, and located on the side of the timer that is closer to the competitor. Penalty: time penalty (+2 seconds).

[@ryneiscool]

@hdjdshfjhfchfjkthat’s because this comment was 3 days ago, while the top comments are 2 weeks ago

[@fasgy410]

So he should have got a +2?

[@PositiveOnly-dm3rx]

there is a chinese saying "if you can cheat, then cheat" this boy and a lot of china take that to heart...

[@ryneiscool]

I can’t wait for the next 2x2 WR single to be -0.37 Seconds

[@rynethegrynd]

@ryneiscool thanks :)

[@TheAstronomicalCuber]

0.37 isn’t that fast lol

[@ryneiscool]

@@TheAstronomicalCuberI said -0.37 not 0.37

[@Throughpond]

@@TheAstronomicalCuber lets see you do it.

[@TheAstronomicalCuber]

@@Throughpond if i get lucky enough sure

[@PaddyPower_IRL]

Update timer. Have a mat measuring for downward pressure when cube lifted it starts and ends when cube dropped.

[@jere1372]

So inspection would be timed too?

[@PaddyPower_IRL]

@@jere1372 Yes you can do the timer any way required. I'm not familiar with the exact rules of competition. Basically, 1) Pickup to inspect starts 15sec inspection. 2) Put back down to register replaced. 3) Pickup to start official time. 4) Any registered touch back to mat ends timer. 5) Judges only required to monitor a) you place cube after inspection completely b) remove hands completely from cube.

[@PaddyPower_IRL]

This also means faster times as no movement towards cubes are counted removing the sliding on timer issue.

[@SCidejump]

​@@PaddyPower_IRLcould cause problems with one handed solves if they use the table, and also accidentally bumping the map while solving. Could probably just record every time when there's pressure and then pick the one that's correct

[@kennethjor]

Or sense when the cube is lifted, so the electronics can declare a false start if the cube is lifted before the hands leave the pad.

[@morwitzz]

I'm pretty sure there's a rule un the WCA regulations that proves this is not allowed: A4) Starting the solve: A4b) The competitor uses their -fingers- to touch the elevated sensor surfaces of the Stackmat timer. The competitor's palms must be facing down, and located on the side of the timer that is closer to the competitor. Penalty: time penalty (+2 seconds). So you should have your fingers on the pad when starting the timer, sliding seems to me like you're using your fingers first, but at the end you're starting with the back of your hand (almost your wrist), which shouldn't be allowed. Also, i've seen that sometimes Yiheng starts turning the cube before the timer started, which should also go against the rule that you can't touch the cube while starting the solve.

[@PositiveOnly-dm3rx]

every sport is full of cheaters lately... and a lot are from china where they literally have a saying "if you can cheat then cheat" (loosely translated ofc)

[@amzarnacht6710]

Easily solved - move the cube 3" further away.

[@banana9494]

@@PositiveOnly-dm3rx nice strawman

[@Purplevids]

Maturity is when you realize that all of these are going to be nostalgic after 5-10 years when we start droping sub 0.50 second averages 💀

[@smoceany9478]

wouldnt say nostalgic, im not nostalgic for lucas's 4.90. it definitely has a weird feeling of that insane solve isnt even wr average holy shit, i remember that being groundbreaking though (also rip keaton ellis's wr)

[@TYAbandonedAcc]

it's like the hit game geometry dash and its community

[@PositiveOnly-dm3rx]

maturity is when you realize the people cheat, and this kid did.

[@aternialaffsalot]

@@PositiveOnly-dm3rx you jelly? Yeah you jelly 😋

[@j4e339]

times should realistically be first touch of cube to release of cube like the bigger issue is how solve times aren’t standardized

[@dutchraider2]

Might be expensive, but pressure sensors on the cube itself might actually be used to accurately time when you start holding it and letting go. Could even be some magnetic signal type surfaces like those used in touch screens.

[@curiousNic]

Looks like sliding is the new meta. I think it‘s a slippery slope.

[@Speedcubenz]

10/10 pun work, very impressive 🫡

[@J.J.J.J.J.J.J]

Everyone already doing it. People just jealous of Yiheng so they're picking on him. All the best times in the world have been pushing these boundaries.

[@cookierobber]

@@J.J.J.J.J.J.J No, they haven't. People have compared the timer starts of top 2x2ers, and Yiheng/Ellery are clear outliers

[@J.J.J.J.J.J.J]

@@cookierobber Ya and I've compared them to myself and others who go straight up and the top cubers become the outliers. So they are all taking advantage with their method, which is partly why they are best in the world. Depends on the sample you take. People are suddenly cherry picking who's times to assess. Do it yourself instead of spouting misinformation.

[@curiousNic]

@@J.J.J.J.J.J.J There are plenty of examples of top 2x2ers to show that clearly not everyone is doing it. And it’s not about Yiheng, it’s about a level playing field for everyone and abiding by regulations. Ultimately it’s up to the WCA to change the regulations/allow sliding or make clear that it’s not ok and also enforce it, which is the trickiest part.

[@rodrigoqteixeira]

"See some kids not only slide their way down the slide of the playground but also slide down to times faster than you" hits hard man...

[@cookierobber]

Yiheng's starts for sure break the regs. WRC precedent makes it problematic to actually *apply* the regs here, but starting the timer with your palms/wrists is clearly illegal (not to mention the 0.74 where he *started turning* before actually starting the timer)

[@pixxxxxel3403]

It's frame perfect and frame perfect vid doesn't count in wca sunless it's seen in regular fps vid . Bro get your facts right

[@cookierobber]

@@pixxxxxel3403 That's what I was talking about with WRC policy. It's *unambiguously* against the regs, but WRC has historically been lenient if it can't be caught in real time. That precedent was based on people who have *slightly sloppy* starts/stops tho, not people who are deliberately breaking the regs. It's a different situation and there's a reasonable argument to be made that the same precedent shouldn't apply here

[@dan-bz7dz]

Clearly illegal? The rules are pretty ambiguous to me. Nowhere does it say to let go of the sensor with your fingers

[@cookierobber]

@@dan-bz7dz A4 covers starting the solve, and A4b specifies you must do so by touching the sensors with your fingers, with palms on your side of the timer

[@d5kenn]

Oh man, good point about what the point is for self-filming. I suspect we'll see people privately film, but then not release them (I lost the footage in a boating accident).

[@thenakedcanadian13]

I know man my dog at mine!!!

[@tymon_kolasinski]

2:30 - Part of the rules is that you cannot touch the timer with your palms when starting the timer, you have to use your fingers. „A4) Starting the solve: A4b) The competitor uses their fingers to touch the elevated sensor surfaces of the Stackmat timer. The competitor's palms must be facing down, and located on the side of the timer that is closer to the competitor. Penalty: time penalty (+2 seconds). A4b1) The competitor must have no physical contact with the puzzle while starting the solve. Penalty: time penalty (+2 seconds).”

[@STUCUBE]

Yeah a lot of people have been mentioning this, it’s mostly gonna come down to the judge noticing it with the current regs we have in relation to framecouting. But that’s the main one now that I’m realizing will have to be looked into more

[@SerKubos]

Yo tymon

[@TylerSoriano]

THANK U tymon hopefully the wca does regulate this and make a decision, whether by removing the average now or by making an announcement banning the technique

[@paper2222]

YES i reached the exact same conclusion you _must_ start the timer with your figertips slidig basically eliminates that, and you end up starting the timer with your palms/wrist anyways as a result

[@OP-pe4yc]

​@@paper2222you probably wouldn't recognize me from this username, but I know you from like way back 2020/2021(?) in the colemak server. Just cool to see someone lol.

[@Speedcubenz]

It's pretty clear cut for me, it breaks a couple of existing regs; B2b) When using the Stackmat timer, the competitor uses their fingers to touch the elevated sensor surfaces of the timer. The competitor's palms must be facing down, and located on the side of the timer that is closer to them. Penalty: time penalty (+2 seconds). A4b1) The competitor must have no physical contact with the puzzle while starting the solve. Penalty: time penalty (+2 seconds). Kit Clement was on my stream on Thursday and said, in his opinion, the average shouldn't count and it's very clear cut based on those regs. However... it wasn't possible to catch this in real time, and that's arguably the bigger issue. I predict an adjustment in the regs to make things a bit clearer and less open to abuse. And if that's the case, the Ellery .53 should be binned too as that's an even more obvious abuse of the regs! I didn't know about that one, but seeing it now it's super sus! Just my 2c lol, let's wait and see what happens. Also, another great vid, nice work 🙌

[@STUCUBE]

Yeah, great points. Overall it’s probably not legal if we’re looking at not only regs but just common sense. Have to wait and see tho

[@picklypt]

@@STUCUBE But isn't it better? since it more accurately represents the actual time that the cube is being solved? If they don't touch the cube before the timer starts, I feel that it makes sense.

[@mofeiyang4587]

bruv just allow sliding...

[@solver5k]

@@picklypt I agree it's more accurate as long as it can't be abused... I mean, what if you can do the whole solve with hands still on the timer and just lift and drop the hands mid-solve. It may be easy for delegates to detect on a recorded replay but a lot of judges would just write down the time, no questions asked.

[@kazedcat]

​@@solver5kThen video record all competition solves. It's 2024 now and everyone has a video camera in their pocket.

[@eawcuber2985]

solution: make 4-pad mandatory, it won't be perfect, but it will definitely cut down the timesave by a very significant margin, as well as make sliding very difficult, thus making the problem not as severe

[@thecalculatedcreativecoder1428]

Some past records have used sliding though so they would have to DQ every single record that uses sliding and then switch and that would take a lot of analysis. Also, there is no way of verifying records without recordings.

[@Thatonecuber025]

I think that 4-pad should be mandatory as well tbh

[@FireStriker_]

4pad has a sliding hack that allows you to force an E1

[@StackAttack1]

i bet if they make 4-pad mandatory the entire cubing community is gonna genuinely flip out and a year later everyone will be fine with it, that's what happened with stacking lol

[@pi3.1415]

@@FireStriker_ nice job, stackmat company!

[@BenTheCuber]

6:12 this is crazy 😭

[@CubingKuba]

I'm just waiting for yiheng to come out of no where and get the 4x4 world record...

[@Nw_Cubes]

I’m scared 😣

[@eeaaaeaeae]

i don’t think that’s likely 1. yiheng isnt too good at 4x4 and he hasnt improved that much over the past year compared to 2x2 where early last year he already had some mid 1 averages 2. planning does not help as much on 4x4 3. sliding does not work on 4x4 4. above a certain amount of tps does not work on 4x4 5. 4x4 is much less algorithm-based 6. max park is cracked

[@adelmosallami]

China doesn’t bother with 4x4 it seems, as of right now they’re focused on trying to dominate 3x3 Half of the top 10 3x3 averages in the world are from Chinese kids. In 4x4, there is one, and it’s Ruihang, so he’s not even part of the cubing revolution.

[@youare790]

Once Yiheng gets older with big hands he would end all competition, like Feliks basically. You’d strive for WR2.

[@fantiscious]

That intro was FIRE 🔥

[@STUCUBE]

Thanks 🙏

[@CubingEmperor313]

fant

[@Cubinginatree]

Yiheng Wang is sliding into a new era.

[@PositiveOnly-dm3rx]

of cheating...

[@damionwilson5391]

The negative time... Is because he was touching the cube before the timer started...

[@vpexmc]

So I could slide my hands off the timer to accommodate for the rules, but keep my forearms on it to prevent it from starting, solve the cube, and get a negative time.

[@_TORN4D0_]

@@vpexmcno, the books say it’s 2sec penalty

[@Anthony_Jiang]

@@vpexmc😊

[@jere1372]

​@@_TORN4D0_it's a dnf...

[@_TORN4D0_]

@@jere1372 2:36 it says +2

[@ReubenBBX]

i knew it. It was his next video

[@Mark73]

Get rid of the timer buttons. Have the cube sitting on a scale that starts the timer when the cube is removed.

[@RunningOnAutopilot]

Sliding removes the timing of the dead air between time start and cube start As far as I am concerned time start and cube start should be the same Sliding good

[@jjsyphor8288]

sliding or no sliding, some will have an advantage over others because of physical traits they were born with, so someone's always gonna feel cheated. having time pads under the cube is the only solution

[@Skeeve-Magick]

As a non-cuber I think the most easy solution to the issue is to have a rule that the cube has to be in a given spot a defined distance away from the timer so that it impossible to grab the cube before letting go of the timer.

[@Videos-lq9io]

This should be fine. Its like having the timer count the solve time more correctly. The time shown would be closer to how much time you spent to solve it

[@dbrokensynth5920]

Seems reasonably legal as long as al the turning is done inside the timers timeframe, what's the point of counting picking up and putting down the cube as part of a solve?

[@dbrokensynth5920]

Note* obviously it needs to be studied more and some changes will be required but as long as you don't get time " discrepancies " it seems like a reasonable technique that doesn't take part of the solve process

[@tux1968]

As long as the rules are clear, and applied consistently, then this isn't a problem. Everyone can use the same technique. It's a fair, level playing field.

[@Flib_smmh]

I like when you say that people will have a better time without getting better at the event...but this is the event ! If anybody can train and achieve the same result, it's part of the game. It's like saying that lubing and setting up the cube, having 120 magnets in it, using a coating or those small pouchs used to warm up or remove the sweat is unfair just because it wasnt used 10 years ago.

[@Christoph5782]

I just kinda assumed that this was a Technique everyone was already doing. Why would you life your hands up instead of rushing straight for the cube/cups? Then logically you’d follow by attempting to keep pressure on the timer for as long as possible before touching the cube

[@apizs]

if the avg gets disqualified NOONE will post their wrs online...

[@sheeparefine]

noone will film there solves

[@rodrigoqteixeira]

​@@sheeparefinetheire

[@maskboy2743]

​@@rodrigoqteixeira ooga booga

[@gegan0112]

It’s not even yihengs video

[@sheeparefine]

@@gegan0112 a few years ago there was a person who dindt want anyone to film his solves there is only 1 vidio of him solving a 7x7

[@pepkin88]

4:10 Moreover, judges usually don't even look at you when you start, they look at the stopwatch (which IMO is a mistake), so you could abuse it even further.

[@AedanBryant]

A couple things to note. Sliding is undoubtedly an illegal technique that will result in a +4 if caught by the judge. The key phrase here is caught by the judge. The way sliding starts look make it almost impossible to tell in real time if it was a legal start, which makes frame counting solves the only reliable way to tell. The WRC has a precedent about disallowing frame by frame analysis for timer starts. This means unless it is caught by the judge in real time (which sliding starts are hard to do) you can’t retroactively +4 the solves. People in the WRC are currently discussing the matter, and have stated you should NOT attempt sliding starts as they ARE illegal. I know I will certainly be looking out for the technique from now on as a judge.

[@solver5k]

I'm sure WRC is well aware perhaps 25% of judges are also first-timers at most comps, and we all started there, focused mainly on calling out 8 seconds. Even as a seasoned competitor, I'm not sure I would detect a sliding start.

[@maxxiong]

FWIW judging sliding starts in real time are problematic because you need to actually establish that the slide results in an illegal start. Also I do have suspicions that Yiheng's time malfunctioned and was detecting input without contact (yes I have seen this failure mode on a gen 4 before).

[@cookierobber]

​@@maxxiong There are other videos of Yiheng doing this kind of start in other averages and getting the same results (~0 difference between his recorded time and solving time, which shouldn't be possible)

[@PositiveOnly-dm3rx]

there is a saying in china. loosely translated it is "if you can cheat then do cheat"....

[@aternialaffsalot]

@@PositiveOnly-dm3rx copy+paste 🤡

[@BenTheCuber]

your video quality is incredible

[@Eddiecuber]

Agree

[@a_asp829]

Agreed + yours too

[@lilarrin1220]

Since this technique exploits flaws in the equipment used to start the timer, the community has to decide if this fits within the spirit of what they're trying to speedrun (i.e., executing the turns necessary to solve the cube) and how important it is to maintain this spirit. Then the rules or the equipment will have to be updated according to what the community values. This is a similar sort of discussion that leads to new categories in many videogame speedruns, especially those that have been rendered almost unrecognizable through stuff like arbitrary code execution or extremely heavy use of glitches, where it can be argued that this is no longer playing the game. But at the end of the day, this totally depends on what the community values in their competition, since the rules are ultimately arbitrary.

[@nuubda_shreyan]

Epic videos man. Took a little break from cubing and came up to this. more inspired than ever.

[@slouch186]

if you want to prevent this you could put a short barrier between the timer and the cube so solvers have to lift their hands up and over it to reach the cube instead of being able to slide directly forwards. you could also switch to timers that start when the cube is picked up and put down, instead. this would mean that all future times will be faster than past records but would reduce the impact of non-solving hand movement across the board

[@MrKannikka]

Or switch the pad around so that the touched parts are behind the cube, not in front of it. Makes sliding impossible

[@Dagg361]

The WCA should remove this record because of 2 rules about starting: 1) You need to start with your fingers and 2) your palms need to be facing down on the side of the competitor. Sliding move your fingers to the point they aren't touching the surface of the timer and your palms are now on the timer, and not at your side. Solution to prevent this: switch to 4-pad in all events. We will be fine.

[@sevenbook1992]

it should not be legal at all. going by the same logic, you could literally already just put your hand closer to the cube, no need to slide. oh but guess what? thats bannable sliding is the same thing but adding motion to it. theres no reason why this should be deemed legal by WCA its literally breaking the rules

[@Mike__B]

Do the rules state that the cube must be a set distance away from the timing mechanism? If not, then I don't see an issue with sliding as long as it can be shown the clock started before hands touched the cube. However if there is a distance the cube needs to be from the timer, then sliding seems a bit of a suspect way to get around that distance requirement.

[@adelmosallami]

Just straight up, this needs to not be a thing. I know that there are several drawbacks to trying to enforce proper timer starts, but the sanctity of the results should be the most important thing here, and sliding starts explicitly break the rules. The WCA’s vision is to see speedcubing as more of a sport and less of a hobby (which is a whole Nother matter) but when even addressing this problem is controversial, it’s hard to take the WCA seriously.

[@Lukcarrot]

0:41 This went harder than it should ngl

[@GPRaitsakas]

They should also add a blind over the cube, and removing it only after the timer starts. Being able to see and analyze the orientation beforehand is a significent advantage.

[@amzarnacht6710]

Easily solved. Resistance capacitors - the kind cell phones use to read fingerprints - in the timer and mat. So if the cube is moved while the capacitor detects X resistance (i.e. a conductive object i.e. hand) is within X range of the timer as well as the mat it would be 'sliding' - particularly if the cube moves prior to X resistance achieved in the timer it disqualifies the move. But, honestly, this is all merely more efficient movement and it's on the judging panel to factor it in more than the players 'stop' using a more efficient hand motion.

[@gerald216]

I have no idea how I got here, but thank you for the new rabbit hole to fall down.

[@akakus]

The first transition is so cool.

[@timothychinye6008]

The thing is, even if he didn't slide. If you add the 0.15s to his 2x2 time, he'd only be 0.01s away from being #1. You can't call him a cheater, if when you remove the "cheats" he's still better than everyone. To give people context in how insane this is: This is the WR average, which means he has to do solve it (correct me if I'm wrong) 5 times. And then they average it out (seems like they also get rid of the fastest and slowest solves, to get rid of anomalies). This is Wang's solves: 0.74 0.70 0.97 0.78 0.81 This is the previous #1's: 0.84 2.69 0.71 1.04 0.88 Remember, the best and worst ones are removed from the average calculation, so really it's more like: Wang: 0.74 0.78 0.81 Former #1: 0.84 1.04 0.88 Do you not know how insane that is? Every single solve Wang did, was better than every single solve the previous #1 did.

[@BlazingSun72]

Build the timer into the cube with wireless reset controls and rotation sensors to start it, you scramble, hit the remote's timer reset button, then as soon as you start turning any axis the timer starts

[@Harold-Saxon]

Would be impractical as cubes have VERY little space on the interior to implement such device

[@BlazingSun72]

@@Harold-Saxon I mean my earbuds are literally just the bud, it doesn't take a crazy amount of space, especially for peak competition levels where they're likely spending big money on cubes anyway?

[@Harold-Saxon]

@@BlazingSun72 have you seen speedcubing cube from the inside? If so you should know how impossible is the task of installing such device

[@BlazingSun72]

@@Harold-Saxon I mean I feel like the design has come a long way since the original with specific tasks in mind to allow for the speeds but it's not crazy to think of adapting it differently to allow for a slightly larger center. It could also be inductive charged I would think. The module doesn't necessarily have to be exclusively in the center either, it could be one module per face and 5 of them communicate with the 6th "leader" module that's what pairs up to the phone or whatever.

[@andyc5612]

Easy to stop, put a low barrier just in front of the timer. High enough to not be able to slide over and still keep pressure on the palm timing pad. Which makes the competitor lift their hands to reach the cube. If they find a way to beat that. Then make the timer a two switch timer. Pressure on the finger barrier (forward pressure) and the palm pads (downward pressure) as soon as one switch is released the timer starts. Or if that’s too hard. Make the distance from the front edge to the palm switch to the cube 1.5 to 2 times the competitors hand span. If you have big hands it’s further away but the distance is still 1.5 to 2 your hand span making it equal for all competitors.

[@geechan4744]

Change the format: Contestant press a button. Timer starts. A cover is lifted. You have six cubes. You hit the button to stop the timer when cubes are solved.

[@heroclix0rz]

It really just depends on whether you think the time spent not touching the cube OR the timer is important to the final time.

[@Amtcboy]

For the original cube, I think the competitors should be able to inspect the cube before solving it. Each competitor gets the same puzzle.

[@arcreehysteria9805]

petition for more comprehensible titles

[@matthiasheymann]

They need to start placing the actual cube on a timer button, so that the timer starts when the tube is lifted.

[@timothychinye6008]

For wondering what it'd be like if you add the 0.15s to his average 2x2 time, he'd only be 0.01s away from being #1. Which you might think is still impressive, but in reality everyone in the leaderboard are all like 0.02s away from each other. Of course him being #2 is still impressive, but there's a difference between being 0.01s behind the #1 and... 0.14s ahead of the #1. 0.14s is the difference between #5 and #24. This is why sliding is such a game changer.

[@anonymous-sf3ul]

devs need to update the game this new slidding meta is broken

[@inferior89]

This has a very straight forward solution. The timers need to be made robust against this. It's impossible to catch by naked eye so technology will have to step in.

[@hemmojito]

That last line. Sliding in kindergarden 😁 Big dub bro, big dub.

[@blockshift758]

I think this is more of a problem with how we do timers. Maybe in a future we can have internal timers small enough that it doesn't affect the feel of the cube. Or for cheaper sensor on the table it self but that would still be more expensive that what we have today.

[@occubing]

6:12 Nice segway... 😜

[@JXPplayzYT]

Dude this is crazy AND COOL

[@MathijsHerremans]

The easy solution to fix this problem is to use the new gen stackmat with thumb function right?

[@STUCUBE]

Yeah it’s just that stops are a little harder with it. I think Tymon did an ao1000 and got around his global average

[@simonpraschl5339]

@@STUCUBE sure the stops are a little harder but its the same for everyone and also you will get used to it once you practice these stops.

[@skwebjacob]

@hughjass3184 they're not, I just tried it and they're really hard, if the stops could be 2 pad that would be a very viable solution though I think. (ryan pilat talked about this in WCA forum sliding discussion I think it's a great idea)

[@cookierobber]

​@hughjass3184 No

[@maxxiong]

One of the problems with the stops is that it prevents you from pulling your hand away quickly after the stop to not somehow touch the cube by accident. We need larger thumb pads at least.

[@BFSpeedCuber]

such a high quality vid... Keep up the great content!

[@gaiustacitus4242]

I'm waiting for the 1x1 cube competition before entering. 😆

[@kennethjor]

Measure the time using the cube? I know GAN has a Bluetooth cube. Surely, the cube could signal when the first move started to eliminate sliding completely. Time the solve from first movement or when it's picked up, not when your hands leave the pad.

[@timb8098]

Speed stacks need to be updated so that they vibrate and/or beep to signal a start after a random amount of time with the fingers contacting the pads. They can program them so that there is a minimum required time discrepancy between hearing/feeling the beep or vibration signaling the start, and the fingers leaving the pads. Or, the better solution in my opinion is to have a device that the cube rests on that records the moment that the cube leaves the surface. It shouldn’t be hard to do these days; maybe it would require a thin, electrically conductive sticker to be placed on the white center cap for example.

[@Cuboctus]

Except WSSA regulations specifically allow the competitor to hold their hands on the timer as long as they want

[@p4z9m]

First time seeing this type of content. I guess the KZbin algorithm is mysterious. Anyway, could the timer build into the cube solve this? I would think two components-capacitive touch (and maybe an accelerometer) would be a good start. I don’t see the point of having a start position anyway. As a spectator, having it count with the first touch sounds good enough. With this, only the time the cube is manipulated is counted.

[@babuu2009]

why doesnt anyone talk about the delay between the timer and the display, like him sliding is noticable but it is actually not a 0.1 s difference. if you watch the end of solves frame by frame one of them shoved 0.67 when yiheng touched the timer but the solve ended up being 0.78 so there is about 0.1s delay between the display and the timer

[@rodrigoqteixeira]

1:02 it is commonly and almost systematicly abused by not puting the fingers on the timer and instead using the palm. Usually without intent of unfair advantage, usually without even an unfair advantage. And puting the cube that close is allowed, but it's super awkward tk grab it.

[@thecubeisalie413]

I did that a few times at my 2nd comp by accident and didn't get punished for it (I would've +6ed one of my solves due to bad stop but I never told anyone, worst solve anyways)

[@rodrigoqteixeira]

@thecubeisalie413 yeah, but I don't think that, at least in my opinion, it should be banned at all. It doesn't give an advantage and fits better the hands' shape.

[@_4y4m3_ch4n_]

Solution: Maybe place the cube on a pedestal of some sorts (basically so that the the cube is higher than the palms)?

[@vectorlua8081]

1:51 The time shown on screen here, is 0.0004, which is four ten-thousandths of a second, instead of the stated four thousandths.

[@jdrmanmusiqking]

KZbin algorithm doin a thing. I didnt even know that i didnt know this was even close to being a thing

[@timothychinye6008]

To give people context in how insane this is: This is the WR average, which means he has to do solve it (correct me if I'm wrong) 5 times. And then they average it out (seems like they also get rid of the fastest and slowest solves, to get rid of anomalies). This is Wang's solves: 0.74 0.70 0.97 0.78 0.81 This is the previous #1's: 0.84 2.69 0.71 1.04 0.88 Remember, the best and worst ones are removed from the average calculation, so really it's more like: Wang: 0.74 0.78 0.81 Former #1: 0.84 1.04 0.88 Do you not know how insane that is? Every single solve Wang did, was better than every single solve the previous #1 did.

[@SJrad]

i wonder what the scores in the leaderboard would look like if they were retimed where it starts the moment the hands make contact with the cube and ends when the cube is in a solved state. however the cameras are probably do not record more than 60 frames a second so it wouldn’t be completely accurate

[@ophello]

Hey…crazy idea…how about we stop including the time taken to move your hands, and you simply record starting the moment they touch the cube to the moment they drop it?

[@LinksQuestResearch]

Negative time sounds like he was working the cube before his hands were off the mat

[@morefiction3264]

Redesign the timer so it counts down to start and the competitor has to be touching the pad with their fingers until the timer says go.

[@PezzaSauce]

This is like when that pro Tetris gamer invented the controller technique known as “rolling” years ago.

[@velnicasal9740]

this could be very easy to regulate... the cube must be at a certain distance from where the person put his/her hands... the older/taller you get, the more distance the cube will be... i think thats a good idea

[@vpexmc]

Hypothetically, could I (someone who can solve a 2x2 although slowly) just slide my hands off the timer but keep my forearms on it, my hands wouldn’t be on the timer, and I could technically solve the entire cube before starting the timer.

[@oQuindo1]

Sounds like they are gonna need to start using a different timer system that will detect movement of the cube rather then the release of the hands.

[@F0reverYoung]

Need new tech to change the timer to start on cube pickup and then end on the double tap. That way everyone is on the same playing field

[@Gretchaninov]

It seems like better technology might be needed soon. Like something that detects contact with the cube itself. What if a slider is still touching the StackMat when they pick up the cube? How is a judge meant to tell when it might happen for only a fraction of a second?

[@jesusantonioarellanovalenc3624]

Dude, every single video is a masterpiece of content. I love your chanel men, real

[@RollinShultz]

If they make a timer with a button that is also a roller then they can only lift straight up if the button triggers an alert if the roller spins at all.

[@Ron_Arama]

This is a great video that really well explains sliding, but you shouldn’t be acting like it’s legal, and encouraging people to slide until the WRC releases an official statement. There have been delegates saying it allowed, and others who say it’s completely illegal so it’s probably not the best idea to tell everyone it’s legal until a statement is released.

[@evanbriggs443]

If it's not explicitly in the rules that it's illegal, then it's legal. And really can't be deemed illegal until a relevant statement clarifying the rules is released by the authorising body or the rules are amended.

[@Ron_Arama]

@@evanbriggs443 it’s sort of a complex issue. The regs say you can’t start with your wrists or it’s a +2/DNF j don’t really remember. However, the precedent has been that frame by frame analysis is not considered a legitimate way to prove a timer start/ stop is bad. There has been a quite recent case of a cuber doing slick turns in inspection (not noticeable at all in real time). However, once the cubers videos were slowed down people could see him hiding turns in inspection. This cuber got banned for 2.5 years based on proof that was from analyzing his solves frame by frame. I would also like to mention that there isn’t a clear rule that says frame by frame analysis is not a legitimate way to prove a start/ stop is bad. The only reason this is the case, is because of previous incidents regarding stops/ starts looking fine in real time but in reality being bad.

[@JD______]

He didn’t steal the record. He broke it

[@einsamturm151]

Change the timers, so the time starts when there’s movement.

[@VEWCubing]

whats the name of the first music piece of this video? the only music mentioend in the desc is lemmino

[@NewocAR]

Just regulate the timers and make the slopes go the other way, or something to the shape that stops this.

[@i3looi2]

They should move the timer from the board to the cube.. so the time starts when you touch the cube. We have the tech.

[@cubinpenguin]

I Like the music choice in your vids

[@STUCUBE]

Thanks. It takes me more time than I would like to admit to find music

[@VEWCubing]

@@STUCUBE whats the name of the first soundtrack used in this videooooooooooooo

[@SeaPear0]

We're basically getting steroids in cubing

[@bigoofersrock]

Delegates at my comp i had today mentioned this and had to announce it during 2x2: SLIDING IS ILLEGAL. You cannot make contact with the cube before the timer starts, and only your fingers are allowed to be on the stackmat to start the timer, ending it is fine to use palm though. THIS MAKES SLIDING ILLEGAL, MEANING WHEN STUCUBE CHECKS THE REGS (no offense btw), HE MISSED THOSE RULES. SLIDING ISSUES A +4 PENALTY BECAUSE YOU ARE BREAKING 2 +2s

[@laserbean00001]

They should just make a weight based sensor that starts the second time you pick up the cube.

[@VertiumGaming]

I cant wait for the -0.62 wr single

[@GameJam230]

Who else but speedrunners to figure out that you can save time on doing stuff that isn't even the thing you're speedrunning. Something I wonder is why they use hand sensors instead of using sensors under the cube, as that would completely erase the NEED to save time on pickup

[@otamota7563]

The problem I have with sliding is that it is possible to do turns in inspection before the timer starts (this can be seen in one of the solves of Yihengs at home 0.71 average), which means that times and records could be irrelevant. Like if I have a time of say 0.49, but then frame by frame shows that I held the cube for at least 0.55 seconds, did I really solve the cube in 0.49 seconds? Does my time mean anything?

[@Fun_Cube_Master]

Yes bro like I grinded to avg 1.2 but now everybody is using sliding

[@cookierobber]

He did that on the first solve of the 0.78 average already. His time spent solving was literally longer than the recorded time, so he was for sure doing turns while the timer wasn't running

[@Larry.Roberton]

Looks like an improvement.

[@nemurinemuri2212]

idk anything about speedcubing but I got recommended this. I watched the whole video and didn't understand a single thing... I still don't know what sliding is, how it's any different, or why it might beg illegal lol

[@BenTheCuber]

this is my third comment but this is one of the best cubing videos I have ever watched