Northern vs Southern Kung Fu - What's the Difference?

What are the main characteristics of Northern and Southern styles of Chinese Kung Fu, and what are the conditions and factors that led to these differences? This is the first of a series of videos I will be making where I present my findings from the various research trips I have undertaken in China & Asia.
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Discussion with Russ Smith • Origins of Karate, Fuj...
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Conversation with Josh Viney: / @shaolinyuzhai4784

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Anything I missed? Let me know your thoughts on the topic below!

[@themadrazorback2019]

Excellent as usual! Will - Your next mission, should you choose to accept it, is to proceed to Shanghai, infiltrate the Triads by any means necessary, and document the most effective techniques used by these gangs. Then, proceed to Chinatown in San Francisco. Compare and contrast these lineages and modern usages. As always, should you or any of your Monkey Force be caught or killed, we will disavow any knowledge of your actions. This tape will self-destruct in five seconds. Good luck, Will!

[@PEFANIS1]

Great video and very educational, what i would like as a greedy viewer that i am is more video examples of each thing you were saying especially for the forms. Not saying that there werent any, but i feel like they werent enough.

[@shohibarridho9067]

We are both northern styles, I'm a student of Thifan Pokhan, from the city of Turpan, Xinjiang province.

[@shawn6669]

I think the emphasis on "bridging" in southern styles would have been a notable difference to cover. My 2c.

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Yea true... completely slipped my mind!

[@marcoseschi]

I believe "bridging" is a consequence of the short distance expected in Southern styles that Will spoke about it. Maybe this is something to develop into it.

[@allancampbell86]

Agreed shawn6669! Southern bridge hands are an important training part of Hung Gar and a lot of other southern systems.

[@kungfulavaletmontreal6391]

good explanation

[@kungfulavaletmontreal6391]

would argue that feet, body and hands arrive at the same time in many southern systems including My flying crane and choy lay fut and many others...foot arriving first is in my eyes not a sign of advanced proficiency ...

[@jjrj9343]

the main thing that I noticed training in a southern style is that the main purpose is to train 'qualities' above all else, the technique then becomes the expression of the quality you have fostered within yourself. so you kind of use the qi gong aspect to create peng, which allows you to fa more easily. then you can use these qualities to bridge and stick, strike or na. but everything comes back to using mindful intention to create internal and external balance

[@tungshoupin5065]

Great point! I practise kyokushin karate but what you said reminded me of a traditional Chinese doctor (who is a big local lion dance figure and Hong Quan master) who advised me that the most important thing to just focus on making sure you can give a strong blow and take many strong blows, which is kind of what you’re saying!

[@BobJohnson992]

It might be worth noting that many, if not most, of the classical admonitions in both southern first and northern first are pretty much identical. The idea of using the "whole body" tends to overlap both general styles. For instance, if you read the classical body-admonitions from Hun Gar, they are pretty much the same that you will find Chen style Taijiquan. I agree with a lot of the observations in the video. Thanks for putting that up.

[@tsuikr]

The founder of Chen taiqi stayed in FuQian for a period of time. I practiced Taiqi for a number of years, I think Taiqi has absorbed some influences from the souther styles.

[@BobJohnson992]

@@tsuikr I feel reasonably sure that in centuries past the Six Harmonies orthodoxy spread out broadly over China. Many/most of the old arts would have Six Harmonies (Liu He) as part of the full official name of their art; many still do, even though a lot of the six harmonies criteria have faded and left a lot of arts. It would have been during the spread of this orthodoxy that the similar classical admonitions would have permeated a lot of arts. I'm not sure who you think was the "founder" of Chen's Taiji: a lot of people think it was Chen Wang Ting, but in Chen Village they still think of Chen Bu as the founder of the art, even though not much was written about the art until the time of Chen Wangting.

[@ShizumaKusanagi]

Very informative. I had heard the saying but never understood the idea that Northern Arts were based around kicking since it seemed like it was more dynamic than that. Appreciate you adding more history and context to it.

[@Gieszkanne]

I think many nothern styles are carry influence of the Yijinjing. Thats why there are these open and wide stretching postures. For me in southern styles the application for combat is more obvious and movements are shorter more direct.Especially Chu Gar/TongLong,White crane,Wuzuquan,Pak Mei, Dragon Wing Chun have these same straight forward aggressive attitude. But the Emei styles again have a quite differnt flavour, not northern or southern.

[@JuliannaHolmes]

Oh my gosh! I love learning all this kind of stuff! I had no idea that triad hand gestures made their way into the forms of Southern Kung fu! So cool!!!

[@The-Contractor]

Nice lucid presentation. Well done. Another factor is that of purpose distance is covered. Northern hands tend to load body mass into the structure via momentum generated in entering, closing, etc. Southern hands tend to set a firm root and then quickly transfer some percentage of available mass into the movement. On the fly vs. set first.

[@mooselee902]

they work by relaxing and putting your bodyweight into the ground, then it comes back up.. your whole mass not whatever percentage you throw. nei kung

[@epone3488]

Thank you for "the legs drive the body" definition. I've tried in my limited reach to express this concept about "northern legs" as opposed to just strong kicks. I hope this becomes much better understood going forward.

[@marthaperugia]

Great! Loved the historical background!!!

[@metalema6]

Focusing more on grounding their stance shows that they had a fear of being thrown to the ground... maybe because in the north fighting was done mostly in groups, so falling wasn't that dangerous, compared to fighting alone in your house where falling would mean losing the fight...

[@johnlloyddy7016]

Actually, I have been told that it is because majority of southern Chinese lived in the flooded plains near rivers and rowed boats to travel from one place to another. All that rowing plus the unstable motion of boats helped them developed strong arms and great balance influencing the southern styles to naturally favor grounded stances and hand focused striking. While the northern Chinese who live in mountain ranges with vast open fields developed stronger legs and had a lot more open space conducive for wider striking motions and grappling.

[@mooselee902]

@@johnlloyddy7016 these reasons are fucking retarded, they focus grounding because its the key to power. All of the nei jia focus grounding and theyre from the north. The southern arts dont kick high either (only have to be half as flexible and half as fast to beat a high kick), purely practical

[@davidbarnwell6180]

@@mooselee902 I disagree. I think environment has a powerful influence on the development of styles like it has an influence on the development of species. I've heard that the boat travel had an enormous influence on Southern styles too. But NOT because boat travel built balance (though that may be true). It's because (a) boats are small so a style that evolved for fighting on a boat had to adapt to small spaces (much like an art that developed in narrow mountain passes). BUT there is also the influence of lack of footing. Wet wooden boats are slippery. So if you use a power generation method that requires pushing the ground/deck with your feet you are going to slip! No question. Slipping in a fight is a problem. So Southerners used their waist rather than their legs to generate power to get around that problem.

[@davidbarnwell6180]

Nah, fighting in groups meant falling was dangerous. If you fell or were pinned by some enemy dude that enemy dude would have friends nearby to stab you while you were on the ground. Falling in Southern arts was dangerous too. Falling was dangerous, period. They mostly tried to avoid fighting on the ground. People back then didn't appreciate the profundities of MMA, I guess. Lol. I think Dog Boxing is the exception to the 'don't fight on the ground' rule. It'd be interesting to know why they fight like that.

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

There are many ground systems besides Dog Boxing in both north and south China, but in the 20th century they have declined a lot and don't get the attention they used to

[@AngloSaxon1]

Really good video, Great information and well researched. Looking forward to more videos like this.

[@thomasbrandon5111]

Well done, you most deff hit all the high points of the styles. We teach a lot of the same explanations in our classes.

[@coreyrutherford7231]

Awesome video man, this is something that I have been trying to research for a long time. I'm praying for you during these crazy times stay safe! GOD Bless!

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Thanks man, Western Australia is one of the safest places to be in the world right now! Hope things are ok where you are!

[@coreyrutherford7231]

@@MonkeyStealsPeach I live in the U.S but in a very small town in western part of Virginia. So it's not bad here either, but you never know just have to trust in JESUS and his salvation.

[@shawn6669]

“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?” ― Epicurus

[@coreyrutherford7231]

@@shawn6669 I call him GOD because he brought me out of darkness and gave me hope. JESUS died for our sins so we can be forgiven. GOD loves you and wants whats best for you and I love you and want whats best for you as well. I'm praying for you.

[@oferjrl5845]

Very nice presentation of the subject, Will, Thank you

[@daterrellwilliams3496]

Awesome video. Thanks for the share!

[@franciscofalsettixavier9010]

Mate, simply awesome video. Thanks for the historical and cultural background; aside from the detailed curiosities from the southern styles - I had no idea! Cheers!

[@stanleng]

Very good overview.

[@KarateUnity]

great historical reference, thank you! keep up the good work brother

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

If you wanna support the running of this channel you can get access to lots of extra content by either becoming a KZbin member or by joining Patreon at www.patreon.com/monkeystealspeach There is also a list of references/further reading in the description above

[@obsidianx01]

Need to get southern shooting short books and etc... for some reason a lot of southern arts have strayed

[@markiec8914]

Lama Pai, Pak Hok Pai and Hop Gar/Xia Quan ( of the Lion's Roars tradition ) are such syncretic styles which were born in Northern China and then adapted by Southern Kung fu exponents (Choy Lee Fut and Jow Gar too). Despite of being now classified as "Southern Kung Fu" , they still retain the high kicking, long fist sets and joint locking/wrestling techniques that sets them apart from most of Southern styles.

[@michaelbarnhart2451]

Enjoyed it immensely Will. Thanks mate. Good work 👍

[@mahaganpatiproductionsgoa.2142]

Thanks for this one. Very informative.

[@fujitafunk]

Great job in dissecting the famous phrasing and giving credit to what it's intended to mean. One of the more environmental factors I'd heard of when talking about Southern styles, was the fact that a majority of these places have more water and sea access. So that leads to boats/rafts/ships and what have you. Hence if you're have a fight on a boat or at sea, not only will you be rocking around due to the waves, but there isn't much space on boats/ships. This is one of the reasons, Southern martial arts tend to have tighter more compact footwork and stances. Grounding with every step was very important. This also transfers into the architecture down there too. Unlike Northern and Central China which tends to be flatter. you had mentioned that the South is more mountainous, which leads to less space to build and expand, therefore buildings are closer together. In the south, you get lots of alleyways in the cities. When you have to defend yourself with not much ability to move to your left or right, except forward and back, you cannot have such wide movements like the ones seen in Northern styles. A lot of southern styles beginning forms move only forward and backward. You also run into the concept of 十字, "cross pattern" (in this case, not the character 10 ), meaning you mainly face north, south, east and west.

[@JimmyPong]

Very informative and comprehensive.

[@SuperFuego2010]

Very informative, thankyou for sharing

[@roloduarte3100]

Great video, it answered a ton of questions I had about kung fu, thanks.

[@MG-bi6mq]

Every day is leg day in kung fu!

[@huntergrant6520]

Truth

[@RamonChiNangWong078]

only in the old kung fu

[@efremendez]

Sucks I hate leg days. No kung fu for me then

[@MG-bi6mq]

Efre mendez Are you proud to hate leg day? Embrace the suck my friend. Get in there.

[@larrydicus7822]

Man your not joking! I have a bad right knee from Hung Ga training

[@yourdaisihing4715]

I wish I would have known about this channel sooner, great stuff! 🤙

[@EliteBlackSash]

Interesting note, Bridging - esp considering how similar Northern Mantis bridging concepts are to Southern KF. Especially 7 star and 8 step. Attended a NPM seminar before the pandemic, as a SPM practitioner and it was pretty shocking.. and also exciting the similarities. Wasn’t much of a stretch to adapt to at all. Even with the long bridging, because SPM in Hong Kong already has some long bridging and a slightly bigger horse than what was brought to the USA. What I found is that NPM preferred moving into Shuaijiao more while SPM’s mentality - essentially - is the equivalent to a western boxer who aims to go for The Liver Blow, cut above the eye, hit the guard, etc. The goal is to disable. The footwork also coming from the weaponry is also similar. Civilian weapons, the knives and poles, are the Southern basis as well. The shifting of the feet is directly from the pole. And the hands mirror the knife and saber for sure. The forms are definitely the biggest difference North to South. It does feel like Northern forms are more like strings of pearls, athletic but with a lot of gross motor skills, while Southern forms are more developmental. Developing “body karma”. And with that, so many of the southern forms are really kind of templated. Sanzhan, Character 10, Lower Horse, etc. Most of the famous styles all have a version. Just my observation. Doesn’t matter if its Hakka, Fujianese, Cantonese, etc… 3 steps fwd, 3 steps back, close is a template. Character 10 or Cross Pattern, is a template. Most southern styles have the same 6.5 Point Pole template. Etc etc etc. The dynamic footwork is usually a form you get to. The same goes for, “groundboxing.” I don’t think the terrain is why the footwork. My experience of it is that the mentality is a lot more about prep for a surprise attack. You may not have advantageous footing, etc. So you have to do it all in a single moment. Hakka styles go a bit further, they are the only ones I have ever seen that have drills that purposely make you work from a disadvantageous position. You have already lost the initial engagement, and now you work from there. Very old school Rickson Gracie type of mentality. But that goes along with the Hakka’s unsafe living experience

[@ozowen5961]

Very considered and well presented. Thanks

[@davidcapurro2594]

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing

[@KeithOng]

I really liked your analysis of the forms of martial arts. Very detailed and shows that you really put a lot of effort to understand the chinese culture and the martial arts. Fantastic work.

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Thanks! Glad to hear its of value to you

[@RichardW0063]

Very clear explaination 👍👏🥰🙏

[@Artsalloverone]

You really have immersed yourself into your martial art journey and make great presentations,,I enjoy your various content videos..😊😊

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Thank you!

[@dreamsalamander]

I find it believable what u said about empty hand Vs weapons origins of northern and southern. Cos it seems to reflect in the different spinal postures of boxing and hema/fma combatants. almost all southern martials arts adopt a flat back posture, with different levels of tucked tailbone and forward rounded shoulders. This resembles the compact front body posture of a boxer. By comparison, most northern styles spend more time in a neutral spine - which always seems more necessary when you're handling objects. (Interestingly it's the traditional shaolin forms that have more round back moments) Likewise hema fighters don't round their backs as much.

[@mizukarate]

Good stuff. Thanks

[@eventu08]

Everything you said is right on target . I only read lots of things about martial arts and is very right what you have said. You lived speak, write, practice the chinese fight arts so, that makes you a specialist and an expert. Thank you.

[@Tony-de4px]

really appreciate this ..I thought it was going to be boring and it just got so interesting and the insights were something appreciated AAA+++👍👍👍

[@NightKnight252]

excellent work!

[@BrianBerge]

nice video. in parts of the south (or their neighboring territories), weapons were banned at certain periods of time: doing those periods, many weapons techniques were adapted to empty-hand forms & applications. some of these continue to associate the armed version/application: some as the primary/original; some as a "supplementary" yet vital exercise (just some things i heard related from a non-commercial cambodian senior master). thank you for your video! 🙏

[@ninpo23tj]

Hello! Good video!!!

[@julioezequiel8935]

Nice content 👍

[@ivanalejandroortizsegura3455]

A video on the kicking techniques of traditional Chinese styles and if there is any relationship with Korean martial arts would be interesting.

[@kaisersoze9886]

I like what you do brother very respectful very knowledgeable so thankyou for the info

[@azlaroc12]

Excellent thank you again.

[@deanhickmanii5589]

I learned a lot, thank you.

[@peterkhew7414]

Generally speaking, Northern Chinese are taller and bigger in stature than Southern Chinese, so maybe it's easier to kick rather than punch someone shorter than them? Koreans are also similar to Dongbei people, and they love kicking a lot. You can see it in Taekkyon and TKD.

[@laurasardinha]

Awesome, thank you!!

[@nayambingartroots1139]

Thank you brother

[@240fxst]

well put together sifu. thank you.

[@ejdet.feeney9020]

This is what Choy Lay Fut is from Nothern and Southern China and it’s based on relaxed power

[@greenshifu]

Wonderful stuff. Quite a history lesson. I have been to two different teachers of Taiji and both do a salutation differently. Are these secret hand gestures still in circulation today and means anything or just carried on with no meaning

[@bobyoung5322]

Wow, womderful explanations. I study karate, but a lot of this sounds remarkably familiar. I wonder just how much "karate" history was "borrowed"? The timeline for Southern development also sounds remarkably familiar....

[@ambulocetusnatans]

The north/south dichotomy has also influenced the way Japanese martial arts are practiced in the West. The styles from northern Japan were similar to the styles of northern China, in that the weapons come first and empty hand comes from that. But when the Japanese styles started to become popular with westerners, many of them had learned Okinawan Karate first, so a misunderstanding occurred where it was thought that one only trained with weapons to help improve empty hand fighting, when actually it was the other way around. This is why styles like, for example, Aikido have a bad reputation for being not effective in fighting, when in reality they could be very effective when weapons are involved. It's just that the focus is misunderstood.

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

That’s really interesting, I’ve never really looked into JMA so thanks for sharing!

[@Gieszkanne]

The problem with Aikido's effectivness has different causes. The problem is simular with Taiji. Its an internal art and very very view have truly internal skill.

[@Veepee92]

Aikido is still pretty bad with weapons, since they don't understand the basics of their implements. It's essentially doing weapon techniques mimicking the principles of hand techniques that mimick the principles of weapons rather than applying real weapon principles to weapon work.

[@Gieszkanne]

@@Veepee92 You are right. In Aikido weapons are rather taken as a tool to deepen the understanding of aiki.

[@ambulocetusnatans]

@@Veepee92 That's because it has been taught wrong for so long. It's a problem with the practitioners, not the style itself.

[@pernologos84]

Very interesting! What would you say about 7* mantis? In Hong Kong lineage we use some weapons of war, but to me the foundation of the style is still found in the empty hand practice.

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

It’s about the evolution of the style, and the core principles of old mantis are most definitely adopted from spear

[@eduardoherrera4151]

Wow, what a great video! in this channel i feel like a kid in a candy store lol Yes, now you mention in this video, i feel is totally correct even thought my experience in chinese martial arts is limited i did trained fundamentals Tan Tui and Wing Chun and what you say I can say by experience that is true about the movement, Tan tui you have to move with your whole body, Wing Chun is more stationary, actually in my first classes, we didnt even move! My style is Okinawan Goju Ryu Karate and i can see characteristics from both, Northern and Southern Kung Fu in the different forms of Karate (mainly from the Southern actually)

[@SUF-py4ix]

I agree interesting.

[@VictoriaStobbie]

I know you’ve done this elaborate video and I’ve learnt a lot from it. But I just wanted to say I have the same lamp as you do in the video.

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Hello lamp brother

[@rafaeloperezjr]

The terrain dictating the movement... awesome.

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Terrain, history and characters of the people mostly

[@williambreazeal387]

It's also interesting your lineage has a baduanjin. Iirc, his lineage uses a baduanjin and maybe 8 or so motions from the various mantis forms as the basic jin training, and not the Shaolin 18 Luohan.

[@YetMoreCupsOfTea]

I'd be interested to see you looking into Jow Ga or the Buck Sing lineage of Choy Li Fut, which both have heavy Bak Sil Lum influences. It'd be really interesting to hear you talk about how they've brought them together.

[@YetMoreCupsOfTea]

If you're still in Australia, Will, there are good Buck Sing CLF people in Melb and Perth. There is plenty of Jow Ga in Sydney too.

[@DiedrichKnickerbocker1783]

I believe that there is a physical border that splits them apart. The YangTze River.

[@BlueDemon77]

Interesting stuff. Curious to know, I have never done a classical kung fu system, just JKD....what styles is the guy doing from 7:40 -7:55. Looks really different to a lot of stuff I have seen, kinda...."sloppy" for want of a better expression.

[@EzeHSK]

Nice video. A lot of what you say makes sense, on how the terrain and the general cultur influences de fighting styles. I'm a Choy Li Fat guy myself which has more of a northern style footwork and is more dynamic than other southern styles. As for the weapons, the long pole, the butterfly swords and the rattan shield are very common, I think Ben Judkins from the blog chinesemartialstudies.com has done some research on why those weapons. If I remember correctly he said something about them being weapons used by local militia. You should check out his blog, he's done a lot of research into the history of southern styles and wing chun.

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Yea I’ve seen his blog before. Some interesting stuff.

[@alanlee5700]

Hey all. Has there ever been an episode comparing and contrasting Northern Praying Mantis and Southern Praying Mantis?

[@Beatinz11]

I study Nam Pai Chuan which apparently has North and South characteristics

[@oliviagraham9940]

Hello. I really appreciate your videos. I am a new subscriber. I was wondering if you could give a video with advice to those of us who are in our home cities. But want to get the most out of martial arts classes to “compete” with that of full time training. If that doesn’t sound interesting I’d love to ask you on a more personal level in email or social media. Thank you .

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Mmmmm, not sure there’s much I could say on that in a video, just “increase your training time and do more repetitions”.... I’ll be happy to chat if you have any questions send me a message on my Facebook page

[@oliviagraham9940]

Thank you!!

[@denismorgan9742]

In China as in Japan the taller people are generally from the north and smaller in the south. This also goes towards the techniques, northern have similar moves to aikido, central judo or jui jitsui and south more karate or white crane. Not that each country copied each other it was just the way it happened. Although Japan on purpose did their best not to mimic animals to make them their own martial arts.

[@Luca_Montanari79]

18:20 May be the almost still postures of southern styles originated from the sailors and merchants lifestyle which basically occured on boats and so in a small terrain like you have mentioned before.

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

You can most definitely see the boat influence on Wing Chun: the conservative footwork, the use of the barge pole as a weapon, and the wooden dummy, which most likely originated from a sail mast with arms stuck in it

[@Luca_Montanari79]

@@MonkeyStealsPeach 很有意思，Thank you very much!

[@saberserpent1134]

Northern - Southern/Hakka

[@piotrkurczewski6266]

i have to dissagre on something you said in the video its true most southern styles seperate hand and leg movements in their forms but there are some styles that use the body in a more coordinated mannor for example wing chun to be specifiic the chum kiu form puts emphasis on body coordination especialy coordinating upper and lover body together

[@ken-waidoo6180]

Great. But other factors, such as northern horse riding, winter clothes, especially boots, and gloves, northerers are taller. Southern junks, smaller stature, crowded restrants and alleys. Over all I learned a lot, because you are knowledgable.

[@Luca_Montanari79]

At 9:34 there is a point I like most.

[@dionegriffith376]

Thank you for your analysis. There is much to learn, for me, about martial arts. My only critique, if you’re interested, if that your presentation was very informational in a mechanical sort of way. As you noted, the movements, in a Shaolin set, are full concepts. In that way, each set is an opus. A style an opera. It’s true that when you study hands the application is dissected into specific scenarios of self defense. However, when you apply these dissections in sparring your flow becomes instinctual. Like a thirst that is filled with the completion of each successive defensive maneuver to do not think, “how might I apply my training?” It comes like a dance, and your energy flows through you to overcome your opponent. In this way it is art. What you have described is mathematical. Your mind is thinking left brain thoughts about an art form that is ingrained in your intuition, and carried out as an instinctive dance with God. The yin and yang of a battle, is the good and evil, the light and dark colliding. You push your energy from the core of your body. Just like Tesla wrote about arching energy between two points, humans are conductors because we are primarily water, as such, it is the use of the electrical energy on the Earth that no one can wield without proper training. Lightening is striking somewhere, and we are conduits of that energy, even as we wield our own intentions with the electrical energies we produce that my friend, is Southern and Northern style Shaolin.

[@The-Travel-Man]

Ha, you never mentioned the Hakka people that brought many martial arts to the South. Sanchin kata in Okinawan karate systems is one of the most fundamental forms, and it is most definitely of Southern Chinese origin. Great video!

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Well…. The Hakka settling in the south far predates the existence of any martial arts systems today. Their arts have much more in common with other southern arts

[@mattbugg4568]

It all sounds like er lu to me thats my new go to form and idea. I had an epiphany when watching shaolin er lu that it was tai chi. And that wing chun was the same art also. And it struck me when you talked about secret sects of Southern martial arts because eternal springtime hall is kinda synonymous with shaolin and southern shaolin. That that was the secret sect that is present throughout the literature i have read. As wu dangs founder was a supposedly a shaolin monk who learned a new style of shaolin and was enlightened and started wu dong, i suspect the form of his enlightenment was er lu and cannon fist. And that cross examination of these troves of information would lead to the same assertation of information. However what exactly eternal springtime was is anyone's guess as the halls and people who practiced were enemies of the state the were put down hence escaped monks like ng mu, etc.. in legends pertaining to the burning of the temple and parts of the northern temple and arts like wing chun ascribed to such mythology as verification of there authenticity. So its all out now because of this statement I belive the government of China hijacked er lu, tai chi and wing chun which was a new development through the process of eliminating the secret sect that originally designed it. Because now those arts are considered very deeply entrenched in Chinese culture and national heritage.

[@heavenhell5909]

I have often wondered what a black tiger is ????

[@bajuszpal172]

Excellent overview, mostly in terms of origin and principles. Yet, some more practical presentationsapplications could have beenmore instructive. Best regards. HOping to se your further videol. Paul, 67, retired instructor of Goju-ryu Karate.

[@brunonunez1436]

Great vídeo, what i Will like to know Is whay northern Shaolin técnicas are so diferent from south Shaolin if they came from the same background, sorry if mí english Is not good.

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

They are different for all the reasons I mentioned in the video, I don’t think they came from the same origin no

[@brunonunez1436]

@@MonkeyStealsPeach thanks

[@williambreazeal387]

It's more accurate to say the northern arts had a strong military aesthetic, and the southern arts had a strong temple aesthetic. As an example of the northern aesthetic, even at Song Shan Shaolin, the martial arts were heavily influenced by the imperial garrison of warrior lay monks resident at the temple. And prior to the 1600's, the Shaolin warrior lay monk were primarily devoted to their staff and spear as one art, and even after the 1600's their arts were developed from military methods (Song Taizhu Chang Quan, Liu Bu Jia (Hong Quan), Xin Yi 4 method spear, ...). The Southern arts in contrast seem to have been derived from the enlightenment neigong practiced at locations like Emei Shan. Those practices result in a very different body mechanic being expressed. For example, if someone diligently and correctly practices San Zhan for some time, their ability to to Tongbei, XinYi, or TanglangQuan will be substantially diminished. Similarly if someone correctly and diligently practices Tongbei's Ape Gong or XinYi's squatting monkey, their ability to do White Crane or Southern Luohan will be significantly diminished.

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

That’s interesting stuff, do you know where I can find more information about the Emei Neigong practices?

[@williambreazeal387]

Among people with a fair bit of video information in English, Hendrik Santo understands the methods and history of the 12 pillars Emei that is incorporated into the Cho Family Wing Chun that he inherited. Yap Boh Heong (in particular wrt the Wu Mei system of his lineage) has a deep understanding of a different kind of Emei like Neigong. I don't think he necessarily considers it to be essentially Emei, and its origins may be from another location, but it uses very similar principles.

[@williambreazeal387]

The Neigong for the Emei 12 Pillars and the internal basis for the lineage of Yap Boh Heong's Wu Mei have significant differences, but they both have a distinctive Southern Chinese martial arts flavor, which is quite different from the Northern flavor of Taijiquan or XinYi (both different internally, but with a Northern feel).

[@williambreazeal387]

Which systems of martial neigong do you know?

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Ok, I’ve seen those guys, yes...... and I practice Mantis’s Luohan Gong

[@luiscesargonzalezavila1894]

norte kick and sou punch

[@stump4522]

Northern vs Southern is basically Cavalry vs Infantry.

[@azmathahmed2476]

For street fighting main factor is foot work cos when multiple opponents come.so northern is much better than southern style

[@Bobby-he9zs]

I appreciate your your channel regarding the information,I resp S a good learning tool .I have at least over 50 years of monkey kung fu ,therefore,l know enough what you are sharing is legit ... Master Bobby of shoalin Buddhism Bling-Bling 🥰

[@jcastro0229]

San soo brother. Kung fu San soo didnt do dancing and punching boards BS. They taught you how to actually defend yourself and break people, not boards. You can take my life, but you cannot take my confidence.

[@leecheng_lau]

身為一名中華武術家, you speak perfect English, Sifu Will!

[@gandalf7354]

as a southern pratitioner, the boat theory for southern kung fu is pretty far fetched if you ask me (i know no one did). both northern and southern styles have solid stance and legwork. i think the difference in range is more to do with a size and strength disparity. southerners tend to be smaller in stature, the short range is literally within their reach and not only that but to most southern fighters its safer inside a long range fighters range than in it (where they can reach you and you cant reach them) or outside of it (where you still cant reach them and they can bombard you while advancing). given the obvious danger of being so close, sharp explosive power is nessecary to end things quickly. being close this also negates the ability to build power via momentum leading to different methods of generating force and therefore also subtle differences in coordination patterns in terms of weight, placement, footwork, entry techniques etc. also, many styles both north and south are not fans of going to the ground traditionally (obviously with exceptions). not incase they fall off a boat. but because on a battlefeild this means being trampled by horses, breaking formation, or getting knifed (dispatched) and in civilian defence results in grappling which increases the risks expodentially: environmentally, the use of weapons, multiple opponents, larger/stronger opponents etc. anyway i could go on and on. maybe boats had something to do with it, i wasnt there so im not sure. but differences in physique and context (military vs civilian) make more sense to me in the development of both the northern and southern highly effective varieties of kung fu we have today. great vid though appreciate it

[@MonkeyStealsPeach]

Its been a while since I made the video, but I don’t remember talking much about boats if at all….

[@gandalf7354]

@@MonkeyStealsPeach sorry late to the party 😅 as i said it was more a reply to some of the comments here which seem to talk about southern kung fu being the way it is because of small spaces, like on boats etc. my thoughts were just that to me its more to do with physical and contextual differences rather than environmental.

[@old-karateka]

Nam Quyền Bắc Cước.

[@wisnuwardana6771]

What about martial art based on their faith or believe's.for instance, at the begining shaolin based on budhism, wudong emphasis on taoism, kunlun maybe konfusus, in dalian distric there are some sect or cult. Even in gobi desert they have different style (go gut pay?). From what i read, shaolin temple being terminated for good in 1926. So before that some people become monk's in run down place by the manchu's in the first place&time.since i watch hongkong movie's.at that time i belivied that after manchu's ransack their monesthery.the 5elder's split to north &south.meanwhile there are much older martial art teaching beside shaolin as a "foreign" religion.

[@davontawilliams3958]

Southern Style all day 😏💪🏾☯️

[@Rainbow_Oracle]

Honestly I think that all that "triad secret hand-signal" stuff is a lot of hooey invented by non-martial artists and con-men. These "salutes" all look like normal wrist locks which is very typical to include in the beginnings of a form. It arguably follows the general grappling notion of "grab the first thing you find, and twist it the wrong way". Hand, wrist and forearm are commonly the first things you make contact with, so it makes sense to include a lock for them as the absolute first technique in a set. I think that it's simply a case of the content of the forms being misinterpreted, or deliberately misrepresented, with the layers of error and myth accumulating in the martial arts community over the years. Most things I've read on the history of southern martial arts don't give any verifiable period sources, which makes their information no-more reliable than gossip or conjecture. The one-finger double-salute is the only that doesn't look like a specific locking technique. It really does look like a technique to control the general tension in front and back muscles of the hand. Trying it out, it give a very solid structure to the open hand, as well as helping to expose the bone of the hand, possibly allowing one to strike or push with greater immediacy of force. I've also heard that it can be used to condition the muscles of the fore-arm which -- fooling around with it now -- seems very possible. My forearms are indeed now sore. The pushing motion that accompanies the hand shape does seem like it might also be helpful in teaching a person to recruit the lats and the traps, helping to develop that coveted "scapular power". Regardless, it does seem like this hand-stretching exercise would balance a grip-strength heavy training regime very well. Long-time brick-layer's hands are said to often hurt, due to the great difference in strength between the opening and closing muscles of their hands, so this exercise might have been born as a kind of therapy to prevent or counter-act that kind of pain in doing hand training.

[@NotOrdinaryInGames]

Holy Molly....... you are the first to clear the misconception of northern styles being about long range attacks, the first what I heard that is.

[@heavenhell5909]

Is it therefore panther boxing!!!!????!!!!! Shows how old forms are!!!! If that true.

[@benquinneyiii7941]

Kicks vs fists

[@user-fz6ip5yq9r]

南拳北腿大体上是由于南北方不同的地理生活环境以及战争、争斗方式的不同而所致的。实际上所谓中国传统武术拳法，原本是没有所谓拳法一说，在最近的500年中国历史上才出现了所谓各种拳法，之前并没有。这些拳法在之前，也并不是“拳法”，实际是为了在不方便使用冷兵器的情况下，还能够保持一定的训练强度，以及为使用冷兵器做准备，而诞生的。大量我们现在能看到的中国拳法风格门派，里面有很多近似的招数、理论，因为都脱胎于比如马战、步战、船战，由此产生了马步（模仿骑马时的坐/蹲姿）、摔跤（各种与摔法有关联的招式）、身体势能的冲击使用（着甲时身体四肢移动，自然以整个身体的冲击最有优势和效能）、二字钳羊马步（在舟船、高低不平的地带比马步更好用）等等，以及诸如关于各种“桥”字的拳法说明，因为南方多水路，坐船比走路和骑马都快。 北腿，也是因为北方的地势，有给腿法发挥的空间，在徒手的时候，而其中各种摔法、对对方招式的封锁（block，南北拳法都有）、身体势能的运用等（利用肩肘腰背臀对对方身体重心的破坏、击打），都是步兵、骑兵下马后战斗时常用方便用的，而这些在南方就不太好用了，因为环境的原因。南方的步法讲求稳，移动少一点，小范围小幅度为主，也是南方地形环境使然，包括在舟船上的移动、打斗（6点半棍相当于撑船使用的撑杆，可以在舟船之间长距离使用），都是小范围移动为主，兵器也以短兵器为主，也是因为地形环境的原因。所以南方的环境使得战斗争斗方式不同，以近身、短兵器为主。 回过头来说拳法，如果仔细研究拳法的路径，我提供 一个思路，南方拳法包括铁线拳、洪拳等，和南方比较著名的刀牌兵的使用方法是很接近的，即左手持盾（藤牌），右手持刀（注意看铁线拳的手势！左手举盾右手持刀！），前后左右的移动，就是一个刀盾结合的功防方式。所以如果真的要深入理解中国拳法，或者说知道中国拳法究竟在练什么，一定要知道，你实际是在练一种冷兵器的使用法，拳法里的拳的打击作用，只是附带的... 比如形意拳，叫枪拳，它本质上就是在为使用长枪、刀打基础，要时刻想像你手中是持有长枪或刀的，拳怎么打，兵器就是在怎么用，就能想通它的招式为什么是那样。太极拳，徒手只是基础，没学过太极大枪和太极刀、剑，那所谓太极拳，多半就是健身为主...而其中融入的摔法，好好研究下，可能更有实战作用。 还有很多东西一时讲不开，有机会再说...

[@blackrose.9927]

Southern is way more Deadly 😏