Occitania: The Secret Nation that France tried to Erase

[@1000eau]

Hi, actual "Occitan" here, thanks for making this video about us ! And if you may, I've got some stuff to say about the perspective of the events you've presented in your video... The first is that we're not really a nation, I can understand that you'd use this term for the sake of simplicty for teaching which isn't a bad thing, but we're french and not less than anyone else in this country for any reason, sure, we can be proud of our culture and language, and we are pretty much are, but that doesn't have to interfere with our national identity as french. I'm saying this so that people may understand that we're not a totally separated people who 'seek to be freed from french oppression' or whatever (I'm not implying that's what you meant, but I just wanted to precise it considering it's a way that misinformed people could interpret it.). That also means that we're not really feeling 'Occitan' first. We're french, and we also have our regional identities which can also be pretty strong (Aquitanian/Gascon, Languedocien, Provençal...etc), it doesn't mean we have no pride in our culture, but personally I'd say Occitanian identity isn't really something that you have passively and that you think of telling people if they ask where you come from, but it's really something that is lived in action, through the language and culture which is really something I love about it ^^ The second is about the reasons of the 'decline' of Occitan. We're not an oppressed minority or something like that, the french government isn't tracking occitan speakers and shutting our culture down... We're not Xinjiang... The reality is that the only reason for supposed "decline" of occitan today is apathy. Basically, today no one is actually trying to kill regional languages and I'd even say that the tendency is rather towards encouraging their growth ! However, the reality is that even though everyone supports it, it doesn't mean much is done about it, most people just see it as vaguely good and not that useful if not useless for the most insensitive. Most people never learn occitan or regional languages in general (although that depends on the region). There is just no large enough citizen or political engagement to really carry an important revival, although I wouldn't be pessimistic about it... Let me explain, you said that Occitan was the language of the elderly but even that may not be entirely true anymore, at least in my family, the last generation who spoke occitan from their heritage is alreday dead since years ago, it was my great-grandparents who I didn't even know that my dad told me that they still knew Occitan, but that means we did hit the lowest point we could, occitan had disappeared from my family but I'm learning it on night class in university, which means it can only grow from there ! Continuing with my exemple, we could imagine that someday I'll have kids of my own and that if I'm good enough, I might teach them occitan and that it could re-develop from here ! That's why I believe even if it is considered endangered it's not going to dissapear anytime soon, because whatever the state of it there's always foing to be people who will wanna preserve their culture, especially since we're talking about a territory comprising a third of France ! Which means even in a terrible scenario where only 1 person out of a thousand knows Occitan there's still going to be 20 000 people who know it (honestly I didn't check the numbers but I guess it's about that). Hoping that it will be better than that, and, I can't know what will happen, but I really wanna do my part in it ! Well, I've pretty much told you everything I wanted to about this fascinating subject, hoping you'll be satisfied by my quite long rant from a guy who happens to have started to learn occitan a few moths ago, motiavted by proud in his origins and hope for the future ! De còr et d'òc ! Cara amiga ^^

[@Embur]

Hey hey! There's definitely only so much I can say without actually having any first-hand accounts to work with, so I really really appreciate all the info you've given here! It's really cool to see that you're trying to stay in touch with your roots, it's something a lot more people ought to do! I hope there's enough resources out there for you to fully support that. :)

[@36erjunge]

Uh oh, Parisian imperialist bot spotted… Occitania liura !!!! ❤💛👊

[@tximino_baztanga]

what no historical materialism does to a mf

[@Domina1190]

@@36erjunge Occitania Liura!

[@Domina1190]

You have been brainwashed by the French occupator. Occitania Liura.

[@kaindestuto2053]

All i got to sing to that is: I saw the wolf, the fox and the hare. All three circling around the tree. They where circling around the sprouting bush.

[@Thanadeez]

apparently the french revolutionaries also made sure the people in french flanders didn't speak dutch anymore either

[@zachpoure]

yeah and basically with anyone who didnt speak parisian french, so same with brezhoneg, arpitan, basque, elsassisch

[@anthonyn.7379]

It’s literally so criminal that such a well-made video only received 800 viewers. You just got yourself a new subscriber

[@Ra-ss5pn]

I actually never knew Occitania existed, pretty sad that the culture and language is endangered of being extinct and I hope for the best for the occitanians. I do have an idea for an video, what if you do an video about Brittany? It has an Celtic culture. Just like Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Isle of Man and Cornwall.

[@Embur]

I have a short video on Britanny! kzbin.info_5L9JlmT0zg

[@Ra-ss5pn]

@@Embur Oh, I didn't know that, thanks for showing me the video :D

[@volpilh]

Hello ! Good video and surprisingly good pronunciation ! I have a little comment, «Occitània» is not an actual thing, so much as a category of things; it is in fact much more regional in its nature - as an example, I, a provençal have had some difficulties talking to another «occitan» from Bordèu, and the dialects of lemosin and auvèrnhat may also be a bit challenging, however, I have had greater ease with communicating with some italians, particularly piedmontese - and on the other side, I can imagine that a gascon would have greater ease talking with a catalan. It is in fact a lingual continuum, the «missing link» between castilian, italian, and the oïl languages ! The bilingual signs are not just there for tourists, and people in my village get offended when one would pronounce the village's name as the french orthography would suggest, so I have the sense that the bilingual signs are as much there to remind ourselves about our own heritage and particularity. We are still around ! Perhaps not so much in the big cities, perhaps not thriving, but I have some optimism :3

[@Embur]

Thank you!! I've gotten a few comments like this from a few folks, and I always really really appreciate it! It makes me genuinely really happy to know that a lot of what I said about the road signs and such was just me being overblown. I made this video from a place of perceived empathy and solidary with the state of the Occitan culture/cultural group. I admit that I certainly got a fair bit wrong, and certain bits were certainly embellished a little for the narrative, and it's really nice to see folks (like yourself) from the region engaging with the video and filling me and everybody else in on the topic! :3

[@guilhemane]

Calling the south the "midi" is still common today.

[@divinairy]

very underrated :)

[@prussoccitanist222]

AQUELLAS MONTANASSSSSSSS Here's an actual occitan, awesome video!!!!!

[@igorzkoppt]

So true, macarel.

[@luizfellipe3291]

That map that you used seems odd... it seems to consider some oïl dialects in the east as òc and some òc dialects in the east as Arpitan.

[@vernicejillmagsino9603]

Monaco history was Occitan

[@dylangtech]

France's Scotland

[@zachpoure]

nah france's scotland is more like bretagne (aka breizh or brittany) cause they are celts

[@Historical_events]

Christ bless

[@alexandrub8786]

2:40 oh you left out the most strange of the latin languages:daco-romanian,more commonly known as romanian.

[@syldaviaball9545]

Adieu, actual actual Occitan here. This is such a great video explaining Occitania. I, an occitan, (the better ones, my mother town is Toulouse) is proud to have such rich culture which influenced the world. Adieu-siatz!

[@goldholz]

And here i was as a german and thought only we (between france and germany) had so many dialects. Ha! France you made fun of us for that. Now its time for operation "dialect" bringing back all the french dialects! THEN THEY CAN SHUT THEIR SUPIRIORITY COMPLEX!

[@36erjunge]

its not a dialect its a language in its own right

[@tximino_baztanga]

it is not a dialect it is a language + literally all languages are composed by a lot of dialects

[@damgonzalez0]

unjustifiably underrated

[@andremontoro]

Thanks for the video! From Brazil, I had a trip from Barcelona to Marseille and Occitane interested me a well! I hope the language keep its traditions!

[@imperialdawg4167]

The Burgundians you mention early on in the video were never really an ethnic group or nation seperate from the mainline french unless youre refering to the old germanic burgundian culture that went extinct in the 6th century which is before the creation of france

[@chtabarddumultien6075]

« Et n’est pas chose estrange et nouvelle que ledict conte de Bourgogne ait seignourie souverainne… car le pays et nacion de Bourgongne a eu de grande ancienneté royaume qui contenoit et s’extendoit en long dès la rivière du Rhin, qu’est es parties d’Allemainne, jusques à Arles le Blanc, qui est es parties de la mer devers Marseilles… » (ADC, B262), cité par Richard J., « Les débats entre le roi de France », art. cité, p. 120. That being declared with the authority of Phillip the Good - Lord of the Burgundians - towards the Kingdom of France. The Burgundian States were declared distincts of the French Kingdom in 1471 following what he argue to be a breach to the treaty of Péronne signed three years earlier. So there’s a decent ambiguity in there. And that can perhaps be deduced when in the « Faits des Romains » written around 1213-14 the author make the precision : « messager borguegnon ou francois tot est un ».

[@alucard347]

Great video! A note about Hebrew though, hebrew never went "extinct". It was practiced and learned and was in use continually since ancient times, but it was simply used mostly in religous contexts and it was frowned upon to use it for day to day speech. This changed in the early 20th century, but only in areas that would eventually become israel. It is still only a ceremonial language for many relugous jews outside of israel, qnd is only distantly familiar to non religious jews who aren't Israelis.

[@vavabeille]

Since 2010, there have been many efforts to push regional dialects back in schools. You can now learn Occitan in schools. And i'm almost certain the Occitan translation on street signs is not for tourism but was an act of political defiance permitted in the 1980s with the devolution of the French government and the regionalization effort to de-centralize France's political system. So it's not all grim, though I can reassure every one of you by stating that most French people see the disappearance of regional dialects as a disaster and all recent presidents from Mitterand to Macron have stated they would support conservation and preservation of said languages.

[@thomaslewandowski3724]

You made some mistakes I want to point out as a Frenchman. The ordonnance of Villers-Cotterêts, in 1539, asked the people working for justice to write in « French maternel tongue ». This is difficult to translate but it doesn’t specify « the Parisian French » as the language, but it could another « French langage » (tourangeau, picard, Normand, bourguignon, comtois, orléanais…). This édit wasn’t done at all to aim at regional langages, but to replace Latin who was spoken by way too few people. And even if after this edit we saw a rise of French langage, it was only in judiciary official documents. In 1789, only 15% of French people spoke « Parisian » French as their native language. The last problem is that you speak of Occitan as an united langage… and it’s not. Like langue d’Oïl have many variants (comtois, bourguignon, gallo, etc) langue d’oc too is diverse : auvergnat, limousin, Roussillon, béarnais, etc.

[@Embur]

I appreciate the clarification. I admit that when looking at history in broad strokes, I'm guilty of simplifying and grouping things into one. Next time my spotlight falls upon France, I'll do my best to clear that up. :)

[@chtabarddumultien6075]

En 1789 ça ne serait définitivement pas un Français Parisien, c’était le Français Royal, de la cour, depuis peu établi à Versailles. À Paris la diphtongue « oi » étaient prononcées [wa] contrairement au Français courtisan prononçant [wɛ].

[@tiredcatman7381]

Although they have different dialects, Occitan is one language as is Spanish with it's hundreds of dialects. I've been learning Occitan and yeah they're different but just as different as an Argentinian is to a Chilean.

[@thelegendofvava201]

Mercé de parlar de la nòstra lenga e cultura amb musica de pokemon dins lo fons

[@afisto6647]

Hello, the "oïl" from langue d'oïl is pronounced exactly like "oil" (petrol) in English.

[@chtabarddumultien6075]

No, the final « l » in French were pronounced /ʎ/ until the XIXth century and the « ï » is fractured from the precedent « o ».

[@m.j.vazquez4720]

i wish Occitan became the dominate french language then it would be more intelligible with spanish portuguese and italian

[@afisto6647]

0:08 especially the military retreat. We've tried our best but nobody is better than England for retreating.

[@eclipsion136]

2:17... i was... not prepared xD

[@HistoriaEtAl]

*cough* Aquitanie *cough*

[@datbo1]

Same happened to the bretons, sadly...

[@Slovensko89]

I am a hoi4 player. I remember

[@genmontgomeree9888]

Honestly this is france in all the regions it has ruled. Even Belgium, right after its independence, took over this policy and forced French on both Walloons and Flemings. The Walloons became homogenous french quickly because it's dialect was basically french with dutch/german syntaxis. The Flemings, as the cultural majority of the country and certainly the north, have successfully demanded recognition for their language and this has been turned from a struggle for recognition to a struggle for more autonomy since the 20th century. The seperatist movement however has gotten a very bad name especially among older generations as a far-right group, due to historical collaboration with the Germans of some Flemish nationalists with the invading Germans and because of some politicians still in politics who were petitioning for nuremberg laws around the 90's. Among the younger generation their seperatist party has become more popular, I wouldn't say it's necessarily due to them being racist but it is more likely due to estrangement with current political issues and the since that the north is financially holding up the South and Brussels.

[@36erjunge]

imperialist bot spotted

[@prussoccitanist222]

WAS THAT A REFERENCE TO MY FAVOURITE PROGRESSIVE ROCK BAND "YES"????

[@Embur]

Damn right, I love me a bit of prog rock 💜

[@goosmaw8561]

You’re channel gives me nostalgia

[@Mbwunion]

The name Occitania sounds like something out of an anime

[@Napltn]

You deserve so much more subscribers Also I don’t know if you intentionally used Pokémon XY OSTs because Kalos portrayed France but if that’s the case Well done

[@Embur]

Completely skipped over the comment (sorry!!) but yes, that was entirely deliberate :3

[@OuroborosAlchemist]

How do I say viva la occiantia?

[@36erjunge]

Occitania liura is common in graffitis etc (Free Occitania)

[@volpilh]

Viva Occitània, but as pointed out, Occitània liura is more common

[@tiredcatman7381]

Òsca Occitània! That's common too