Mission impossible: finding a neutral sounding headphone!

My endless search for a neutral sounding headphone is finally over after having approximated an own neutral headphone target which interestingly departs a lot from all the common popular headphone targets.
My original goal was to create a flat sounding compensation for my binaural sound samples which turned out to become a nightmare, as no headphone could render those precisely equalised samples correctly. I had to find a headphone target which would allow for my sound samples to be rendered as faithfully as possible and at the same time sound neutral on it's own, which became some kind of mission impossible. A properly equalised headphone to render my flat equalised samples won't sound neutral, while a neutral sounding headphone won't playback binaural sound samples that were equalizsed to flat properly.
In the meantime I made some changes and decided to dump the "precise" target I am talking about in this video to make everything more simple. I already had to depart from strictly neutral for my sound samples to be rendered faithfully with common headphones at all, therefore I will simply apply the necessary compensation to my recordings so that a headphone follwoing my "neutral" target will be neutral on its own and will also render my samples as lifelike as possible making the "precise" target simply obsolete.
All my upcoming audio recordings will be compensated properly and playing them back over a headphone following my "neutral target" you should get the most lifelike possible result, which should give you an even better idea about the sound of all that audio gear out there. I am quite baffled on my own how realistic the results turned out thanks to all the effort I invested into this.
Check my pubblic Patreon post for more details including further sound samples: www.patreon.com/posts/mission...
You can find my EQ for the HD600 in both EqualizerAPO and Qudelix 5K variants here: www.patreon.com/posts/sennhei...
More headphone profiles will lbe coming every month, I welcome any support and feedback on your results!

[@PimpmasterMcGooby]

Well, I won't be the first to admit that I was highly skeptical of Oluv's idea that HD600s with his, frankly magical sounding EQ would somehow make the HD600s more enjoyable than my other, more expensive headphones. (For reference my other headphones were as follows: Sony XM5 (just to have ANC for travels), DT770 Pro 80ohm, Fidelio X2HR, AKG K702, HD650, Hifiman Sundara (sold the Sundaras recently, after using them as my primary headphone for 9 months straight), Meze109 Pro, and Hifiman Edition XS.) But I wasn't going to discount a theory that sounded like it had some merit to it, so I went ahead and bought a pair of HD600s, which I applied the EQ Oluv references in the video. Now after spending a couple days of practically non-stop listening, I am starting to believe that you Oluv is on the absolute right path. I will admit I was very skeptical after having spent close to $2000 chasing headphones these past couple years, I did not want to believe that the HD600 was all any one would actually need to fully enjoy music. I am still not in complete agreement however, as I still believe there are headphones which are more capable as far as sub-bass extension, soundstage width (though I am starting to warm up to the idea that imaging is much more important for a natural reproduction. But, I would still consider a wide soundstage highly enjoyable for certain things such as video games and also just picking up on where a sound is coming from in a space), and just retrieving details that are often well hidden in a recording (sometimes intentionally hidden, but there nonetheless). For instance, the Hifiman Edition XS still has merit to me, if I want to immerse myself in a video game with good audio, or watch a somewhat action packed TV-show, I do still prefer the XS to these EQ'd HD600s. Or just try to focus on a very specific instrument in a song, or a specific voice in chorus. With that said, as far as just sitting down and enjoying the music you are listening to, this is it for me! The HD600 with this EQ, though still not perfect IMO, is just so much more natural than any other headphone I have used. Of course, hearing is very different from person to person, I can't dismiss the possibility that it just happened to work for me by sheer luck. But also it does seem fairly logical to just try making headphones sound like a good pair of speakers. I do strongly believe that user variability and other factors such as pad wear will always be a problem for headphone tuning, but I also can't just pretend that HD600s with Oluv's EQ doesn't sound really great to me. To my ears, I have wasted a lot of time and money chasing different headphones as of late. Only to now discover that the HD600 with this specific EQ, would completely satisfy my music listening experience, while the Hifiman Edition XS also meets any perceivable idea I have of what good bass delivery, soundstage and imaging are. I am very surprised, and a bit upset at this development (I really didn't want $300 dollar headphones sounding preferable to my $600 and $900 dollar headphones (Norwegian retail pricing in USD)

[@ratomirstevic6135]

Oluv used to work for Bose, but they fired him for being a self-centered maniac.

[@Tripokaridos22]

@@ratomirstevic6135 People that interview for work in Bose must not be very clever .

[@Tripokaridos22]

I started with HD580 and go to Sony,Focal,B&W,B&O , Hifiman and many others ... Guess what i sold them all, and now i only keep 2 headphones , HD600 and HD660s nothing else . By the way the last headphone that i sold was also the Sundara 2021 version , it was nice headphone but didnt sound organic to metalic for my taste. For neutrality i use 600 and for Smooth sound with amazing imaging i use 660s and thats it . ABout EQ ... I get that there must be a Neutral target but i am Not a Neutral Junkie for just 1 Reason The hearing capabilities for every people are different and a perfect Neutral headphone will not sound Perfcet neutral to every people There is NO way . For example if u measure the shame person at age of 20 and then at age of 40 u will see that graphs are way different and in some areas they need some db boost to sound exactly like it was back to 20 years old. So Yeah its nice to have a Neutral base but getting Maniac about Neutral Doesnt make any sense and i have epxlain the reassons.

[@VENOM-vq3ju]

After much listening on youtube with an equalized HD650 well I think this one sounds natural: Neumann NDH 30

[@mikafoxx2717]

I agree that the frequency response is like 90% of the thing you need in headphones. A good dynamic driver like the hd600 is pretty capable in of itself, but planar or electrostat would be more technically capable of low resonance and distortion. Etymotic IEM's with a single BA are really damn good, because they have a really good tuning, which could be made even better with some gentle EQ.

[@charlesjag3407]

It's inspiring to hear how much time and effort you put into your EQ for the HD 600. I look forward to trying it out for myself soon! I am new to this hobby and trying teach myself about this "audiophile" stuff to have an expert understanding. But, it's been so difficult to navigate through all the BS and contradictory opinions to find useful information. Your channel has been a helpful resource for me. Thank you!

[@mikafoxx2717]

Wow, thanks for the plug to the binaural channel. Your recordings must be great. You're the reason I bought the HD600's. Even though I had the sundaras. They seem to sound better to my ears than yours in your demo but they could use EQ moreso and aren't as comfortable as the 600's. The 600 is probably just the most well rounded headphone ever.

[@HansLaros]

Excellent discourse on 'EQ to the neutral holy grail'. I've been designing speakers for many years and found so much recognition in your many findings. The ear is easily fooled and not a 'lineair measurement device', simply because it's connected to your brain which is happy to process and adjust just about anything. It's crazy fascinating. Thank you for your commitment and this contribution!

[@convolver]

I love the binaural recordings. You can hear the aquarium to the left of Oluv. :-)

[@hartyewh1]

Sounds great. I really appreciate this pedantic madman for this work. Happy to keep being a patron. The "old" GRAS rig wasn't accurate past 8kHz so it was rather limited, but the newer B&K 5128 ought to improve that. It's one thing to accurately measure a headphone and EQ it to a common target, but having a very precise personalized target is a step further still. Btw I was under the impression that Oratory1990 does some listening tests on top of the measurements. His presets I've found are excellent in comparison to the stock sound and I've mainly struggled to improve them above 200Hz. That said you're tuning of the EFFP2's is still notably better, but since I can't make it myself for my headphones like Edition XS or HE6se V2 I've used the best I've found. Also using the AutoEQ presets have issues since the pdf's on Oratory's page sometimes show very different values and are better.

[@arrken33]

Hey Oluv. Could I get a close to neutral fr by using small binaural microphones (similar to the ones you use to record hp) to get a fr and equalize it to neutral? Or is the microphone too obstructive to the point it wouldn't improve SQ? If it's posible which, microphone would you recommend?

[@hugomouteira7015]

Can anyone help me out? I see you praise alot the q30 and I also wanted to get them. But I went on reddit to know how to use them wired but many ppl complain about the wired q30 because new versions of the q30 dont let you eq them and the bass gets even worse with some weird interferances. Is there any work around or any alternative? Regards from Portugal

[@douwedevries2026]

It's great to see the research you are doing in regards to sound. It keeps me being really interested in following your work. I don't have the HD600 myself. Otherwise I would love to try out your EQ presets. I may look into getting one as it would be great to have something reference. Your new binaural channel is really helpful to me when it comes to tuning to dail in my EQ settings for the Free Pro 2 to get the natural sounds to sound natural. Then after listening to music it's an immediate improvement to me. I mostly used to use pink noise and music listening to tweak my EQ. Listening to the binaural sounds is another addition I now use to make more precise adjustments.

[@markzaharov2345]

Hello Oluv. What do you think about crossfeed? I guess most music mixed to listen it with speakers which have cross sounding effect. Do you think we should add crossfeed to the chain with EQ for stereo non-binaural records?

[@eliranamr5748]

You are amazing ,very professional and answering so many Thank you oluv it is a pleasure to follow you. BTW. Do you have an idea or a link to foam you tried on 6xx so it dosent hurt the head with long use

[@BO-kh1iz]

I don´t know what to think about the HD 660S. Is that any good at all? Or is it so bad that even Sennheiser realised the flaws and replaced it with the HD 660 S2 ? And is the S2 really better and worth the much higher price?

[@myplaguesify]

hey oluv do you consider tribit stormbox still the best value for money right now?

[@bazar9000]

Just finished watching the video and I am blown away by the amount of research and effort that went into creating it. The information presented was not only informative but also easy to understand. The visuals and animations used in the video were impressive and made the learning experience more engaging. I particularly liked the way the presenter explained complex concepts in a simplified manner. This video has given me a better understanding of the topic and I appreciate the effort put in by the creators to make it so accessible. Keep up the great work!!! 💪

[@philipweiner1248]

Hi :) I have an interesting question for a speaker recommendation: I currently have a Tribit Stormbox Blast and a Minirig 3 + Subwoofer 2 system (i.e. 1.1). The MiniRig are great for "closed rooms", but if you want to listen to electronic music outside at a fun volume, you simply reach your bass limits for me and the Tribit simply knocks out a whole lot more bass. However, the Tribit also weighs 5.5 kilos and is much larger...but a soundcore Anker Motion Boom Plus, for example, again has too little bang for me... I'm looking for the golden middle for myself, what else I can hang on a backpack because I often walk or ride my bike, so not too big and heavy. Just a speaker that you can always take with you without a headache, but which also sounds great (more bass than the 1.1 system from MiniRig). I don't really care about the price, it can also cost 1000€, for example I had the Devialet Mania for a mere 800€, but it failed miserably in the outdoor test (but great part indoors). I'd be really happy if you gave me a few ideas or if you said that what I want doesn't work technically, that's ok too, of course ^.^ (If it sizewise stays below the JBL Extreme it would be really cool, but I'm just curious what you suggest) Kind regards Philip

[@rlaiola]

Great video! From your experience, does FR measurements change substantially at different volumes (that is dB SPL)? Asking because I noticed some raw measurements shared online are captures at different dB SPL and I’m interested to know what would be the correct normalization method (e.g. offset, rms, equal contours) to compare measurements. Thanks

[@rlaiola]

Oluv, in case I become a patreon, would it be possible for you to perform raw measurements of one of your iems for a single tone at different target levels (dB SPL) and share them with me? Thanks.

[@sorrenable]

Excellent information Thanks for taking the Time!!

[@xXxRK0xXx]

Fantastic video. What are your thoughts on on Hifiman HE 4XX? Do you think it would be hard to equalize to your ears?

[@oluvsgadgets]

I made lots of videos with the HE4XX also showing some mods and simple 10-band EQ how to make it decent. I haven’t used it for a while though, it’s also full of peaks in the treble region just like most planars which are hard to handle precisely. It’s better to start off with something really neutral to begin with just like the HD600 or HD6XX. If equalised properly matching the response to your ears it will outperform all highend headphone IMO. I still haven’t found a proof for the contrary.

[@calvinyip364]

This is so in depth. Feels like a engineering class on sound. But than again it's interesting. I didn't know you can use pink noise to calibrate headphone and speaker. This man take alot of dedication. He need more sub. Also seen lots of reviewer saying the r70x supposed to be neutral or flat don't know its true or not .

[@REFondrums]

Fascinating. Educational. Highly useful. Well done!

[@Razarex]

What is your EQ for the Q35s? I have been looking everywhere!

[@velko2433]

I want to hear your opinion on Audeze LCD-2C ( classics open planars ) , i am very curious what you think of them! I have Hifiman HE4xx and the LCD-2C and i love open planar sound.

[@tanhockjun]

Hello Oluv, have you tried KZ linglong in ear earpohnes?

[@chungang7037]

I'm curious, what music genres or albums are you enjoying so much with these neutral headphones?

[@oluvsgadgets]

All kinds of decent recordings especially jazz, try the recent album by Snorre Kirk for example but also many smooth jazz artists manage a perfectly balance and smooth production for their recordings. It would seem as if some cared about the actual recording quality. I release playlists every week on my Patreon with representative recordings. They are actually not that easy to find and you really need to dig deeper into this to find all the gems. But next week I am at playlist #74 thus more than 150h of listening material. Unfortunately it’s mostly jazz which is recorded really well. If someone is not so into jazz it will be even harder to find something really amazing sounding.

[@Orko1]

I am searching headphones that sound like or very similar to the Hama Cs-410, I used them for about 20 years and now they have broken. Any suggestions ?

[@oluvsgadgets]

I don’t know the hama

[@saltedpeanut5571]

Hi Oluv. Have you listened to the Avantone Planar? It is not 100% neutral, but it's damn close.

[@RetroPlus]

I was actually going to mention those earlier, i agree that it's very close to neutral. Oluv will probably be quite impressed with those.

[@GeneralOccam]

I haven't listened to it, but another youtuber has mentioned the avantone planar to be the most neutral headphone. Have you listened to this pair before?

[@ResolveReviews]

Just to be clear, that forum thread you referenced is meant to get feedback on how we should consider listener preference variation, and to determine where to place preference boundaries around the target. These EQ settings are NOT a reflection of what we individually prefer or even consider "neutral". Instead, think of it as a baseline to solicit feedback. It's also important to note that this could've been done on the GRAS as well with the same theoretical foundation, it just made more sense to start with the 5128 since there was no standardized target there to begin with.

[@oluvsgadgets]

But why not creating a target which sounds natural? The one I tried was by far the worst sounding to me. It does not reflect a natural spectrum at all to me, sounds just harsh and nasal. I rather opted for something as natural sounding as possible. You should immediately “feel at home” if you listen to natural spectrums or pink noise. Listener preference is out of equation here. If you hear some spectrum in front of you (ever consciously listened to wind noises and how smooth amazing they sound in real life) do you think: there is not enough bass or this sounds pretty harsh if you play around with a plastic bag, because it does you cannot turn down treble with your ears, but try listening to these sounds over a headphone, they will sound completely artificial regardless which headphone I tried. All sounded different but none really correct. I didn’t care about any bass boost etc just recreate the same spectrum I would usually get in real life. This can be a speaker or something else. The problem trying to simulate the sound of speakers in a room you will end up recreating the flaws of them as well, including interference, room resonances etc. That’s not what I wanted. You probably have a HD600 I can send you my settings. Would love to hear what you think about it. Although I would need more units to create a better average among them.

[@ResolveReviews]

@@oluvsgadgets Couple of issues there. If you read through the thread, you're supposed to adjust 3khz to your taste, and then give an indication of how much you adjusted it by. There will of course be other areas for variation as well, but the key point of that thread is that ear gain is a third point of adjustment that we need input on. For example, I personally reduce it by about 3dB, as that sounds more natural to me. But as others have indicated in the thread, some prefer leaving it at 0, some prefer -1.5... you get the idea.

[@oluvsgadgets]

@@ResolveReviews i tend to differ as you cannot just change one single aspect , this will screw up all other aspects of the sound as well. Boosting bass can often have a bad impact on treble etc. It’s not that easy actually. It must be a harmonic balance between all frequencies to be perceived as smooth and natural. I will try recreating your EQ here on the go as I am on holidays now but habe the Audelox 5K and Hd600 with me. will let you know if any change of the 3k filter improves something for me. Unfortunately the Qudelix interprets filter values differently than EqualizerAPO so not sure the result will be valid. I tried it, -3db for the 3000khz filter is definitely better but the upper mids are still way off

[@ResolveReviews]

@@oluvsgadgets Yes, everything matters, not just one single aspect. But we're testing this because it's the strongest part of the ear gain, and this was adjusted in Harman in the later research as well. So we've essentially used the same preference tilt that most people prefer and we have data on preference clustering for bass and treble. But what doesn't exist is preference ranges on ear gain specifically. Also, I could share my own personal EQ profiles that I like, but an official reference curve can't be based on one source, since headphone to ear and head related transfer functions will differ across users. Basically... no single line can satisfy all users, and as you noted... the headphone to ear transfer function is going to play a role too. That's why headphones that may graph the same (or when equalized the same) often sound different from one another. So to accommodate that, we need to build preference boundaries around the target in a number of places. In my view that should be bass, ear gain and treble. Others view it as just bass and treble. All of the minutia is going to matter to the individual, but there's no way that can be predicted to be a perfect match for everyone.

[@oluvsgadgets]

@@ResolveReviews you should be careful with “preference” because what some may prefer doesn’t mean that it’s actually correct especially in the overall context of the sound. One may prefer this the other one that because he is used to it but in reality it’s maybe not correct. It’s a complex topic but I am curious what you will come up with. I haven’t yet heard a single tuning which would sound right to me therefore I had to create an own completely from scratch. I will also do some experiments with modifying my ears and see how that will change everything. I would like to hear your preferred settings though. Just drop me a line on Discord if you want to.

[@Unicorn-ST]

Thank you for another great video, you do a very good job. I was looking yor an AKG 712 Pro review from you but I am not able to find it. If you have no review that AKHG, I really would like to know your yhoughts about those headphones and how they work compared with the HD 600

[@oluvsgadgets]

I had the 702 and 612 and kept the 612. I am not sure how big the differences really are between them all, but they are not outstanding

[@nils_3335]

Hi, würdest du (2023) den Teufel Rockster Cross noch empfehlen, wenn’s um diese Preisklasse geht? Danke schonmal

[@JohnDoe_333]

The key are the other parameters rew measures. They can give you a great hint in what frequencies have problematic echo effects, resonances or group delay and you can adjust according to that. I playing around with dsp and speakers for many years and recognized the same as you, the same response sounds extremly different. My home cinema speakers at home sound nice and have the "perfect response" to me. I've tried to match the response it to speakers at my desk and my car hifi, all with PEQ filters but it isn't even comparable. Not mostly the same but with a little less stage, but worse than not equalized. There is 10-15dB difference especially in the car frequency response to have the subjectively same sound.

[@b.z9940]

danke dir sehr für dieses Video. Sonarworks Calibration mit HD 600 sorgt für Phasing in den Hochmitten, was z.b beim mixing von E-Gitarren und Amp Plugins ein großes Problem darstellt. Du könntest versuchen, den Focal Clear zu EQ`n vielleicht bekommt du mit dem ein besseres Ergebnis bezüglich der Neutralität. Gibt es eine Möglichkeit, wie ich deine EQ Einstellungen in meiner DAW verwenden kann und welches EQ Vst Plugin würde sich hier am besten dafür eignen? LG

[@jerry1769]

Hey, I just came across your page and would love your input. I am looking for a good speaker(s) to use with my mobile laser tag business. Currently, I use a Large Soundcore Rave and it has been great however I am now in the market for a speaker I can link 4 speakers with through my phone. This way I can spread the sound out through the playing fields. I'm not sure what a good Bluetooth distance would be but it would need to be a decent range so it doesn't get muffled. I have an event coming up that has a 240000 Sq ft warehouse that they will be using. So I want to give them the best quality music I can provide but also not going broke myself. Looking at about $150 - $300 per speaker?

[@nout1972]

I wonder if you have ever tried the Audio Technica R70X? To my ears more neutral and natural than the HD650s.

[@BO-kh1iz]

Great Video. Thanks for all the effort, it´s much appreciated. I collected quite some headphones over the years. Which headphone I use depends on the kind of music and also the mood I´m in. I still love my old HD600, it´s not perfect but does a lot of things right.

[@sergehenri2302]

Please can you do your magic EQ for the HD 650 ?

[@ilianto]

Hi Oluv. Thanks for your efforts! Could you also do the MH1?

[@oluvsgadgets]

iEMs are impossible to cover with a single tuning. I would need to compensate for the individual ear canal resonance which I did for the Free Pro 2 but the effort is enormous, and I would do that for a discounted product which hardly can be found original anymore.

[@MrChanw11]

Have you tried the m40x? Not saying these are perfectly neutral but they are kinda close. Just a little too much high end

[@RetroPlus]

I found those to be too bassy to be considered neutral, that's something i always disliked about them

[@oluvsgadgets]

They were my first kinda studio headphones but actually they are all but neutral. I dumped them many years ago

[@Tacet137]

Your ideas are very interesting and worth exploring, for examply for me the older harman target from 2013 definitely sounds more correct to me than the current one. My reference for neutral reproduction is Neumann KH420 in studio environment (pretty dead but not completely), imo its ultimately not worth losing your mind over this since recordings very so much sometimes that one track my sound great on your target and other trash, for example I find good 5.1 classical recordings to be much closer to real in person expirience than stereo

[@oluvsgadgets]

Actually I didn’t care about recordings as they are all so different but simply tried to recreate a natural spectrum you would usually hear in front of you (not necessary taking any speakers into account) through a headphone.

[@emanemanresuresu]

Uh, is left and right swapped here, or is it on my side? The febreeze thing is clearly swapped, at least on my maybe neutral akg k701 from Austria.

[@dazquez]

You should review DT900 PRO X ($259) or AKG K702 (~$200). I know these headphones are not flat but their drivers are really good for imaging and soundstage. I wonder how much the imaging and soundstage depends on the driver and EQ. Maybe switching up the EQ changes the imaging for the best or worst.

[@MrPassiontea]

He's obsessed with tonality and doesn't seem to care about imaging or soundstage. If it doesn't have an intimate mid forward natural tonality like the 600 he won't like it. (The 600 has weaker soundstage and imaging than most of the other headphones he doesn't like for their coloration).

[@leonardussumargo775]

Hi Oluv, i think you should hear Neumann ndh20 as well. My current favourite when it comes to "neutral sounding". And now there's the openback option which is ndh30 but I haven't got any chance to try them yet.

[@stargazerxd13]

Can you still listen to Earfun FP2 tuned by you? Or does it sound off now?

[@oluvsgadgets]

Of course off, not bad but definitely far worse. It’s mostly the balance that has changed. I will need to recreate this for the Free Pro 2 as well and hope to manage sooner or later.

[@4thesakeofitname]

Very nice stuff as always, but I think I've missed some of the parts: what do you refer to as *flat* , what is the *target* , what is defined as *neutral* , and what you do you mean by *equalised* . How do you record the audio? So we listen to your recordings with ordinary headphones? What shall we do with our headphones to get the natural sound field that you capture? Can you please describe the big picture again... :-)

[@oluvsgadgets]

It’s all explained in the video

[@4thesakeofitname]

@@oluvsgadgets well let me watch it carefully then ;-). Thank you.

[@poleepwka]

​@oluv's gadgets this is fascinating and something that I have been noticed too. Most IEMs are simply too peaky. Maybe Etymotic are onto something with their very deep insertion. When will the Earfun Pro 2 EQ target be ready?

[@oluvsgadgets]

I will try to work on it as soon as possible, the balanced changes a bit compared to my previous approach and needs some adjustment within several areas within the mids as well. I also want to take sample variation into account this time and create a better average among all 7 units I have. But it will be lots of work to adjust the responses for all ear canal resonances and I am not sure it’s really worth the effort. My ears are already ringing from the micro adjustments I tried to do perform to improve treble smoothness even more. I need some rest now for a while.

[@poleepwka]

@@oluvsgadgets most likely it is not worth it. Would it be better too only use the 2 most common earcanal resonances? Considering this is allready one more than the manufacturers do.

[@oluvsgadgets]

@@poleepwka unfortunately half a mm difference already has a huge impact on the final result with frequency shifts like 200hz in the treble region. I will definitely do it for my own and will try to achieve it for myself as I don’t want to wear full sized headphones all the time. It will depend on the support I will be getting how much time I can invest into everything. The most reliable approach would be to offer personalised tuning to a given unit. This way I can ensure that the end user will get exactly the same result I was intending as sample variation between different units can ruin everything.

[@nickjonas3704]

Sir, could you campare Soundcore Motion 300 to Bose SoundLink Flex please 🙏?

[@gabrielgavril3435]

Hi! Can you try the superlux HD 660?

[@martineikmeier]

I would like to hear your thoughts on the sivgas sv023. If you ever tried one. Nice videos btw ... thanks

[@Dan-pi6dx]

Can't you just equalise every headphone to your preferred diffuse field tilt with maybe a small bass shelf ?

[@oluvsgadgets]

You can but every headphone needs individual treatment and listening. Just matching 2 graphs doesn’t work unfortunately, like demonstrated in the video. 2 headphones showing exactly the same response still sound quite different. Probably due to the different driver interaction with your ear. As you need to perform lots of measurements of different positions and average over them; doing so for different headphones will still give you a different result although the final graph may look exactly the same. To get it really perfect needs time and hours of listening. Therefore I cannot offer this “service” for free, as I cannot handle this in my spare time. I am not even sure my personal results are transferable to others but it would seem so at least to some degree according to the feedback i got so far everyone preferred my EQ for the HD600 over stock or the other common EQs

[@gr1zzed915]

I've tried the EQ for quite some time now. On songs were a lot of natural in world sounds play, it is very close to real life which I like. Songs by Yosi Horikawa sound really close to life. On some tracks though it appears to be quite shouty. For example Sisters of arequipa by Nils Landgren and Easy rider by Odetta. Would you say that this is because of the recording if you listen to it yourself? Might be a point of interest but would love to hear your feedback.

[@oluvsgadgets]

Have you tried checking pink noise if that sounds smooth to you? You cannot quite judge by recordings as every recording is mixed differently. You can also try Top Dog by Snorre Kirk, which I think is mastered really well.

[@vipxpert]

It depends pretty much on the mixer side too. Every mixer have different mixing style.

[@cruizzz]

This is song is quite good for testing but not enough...at the end all those targets sound pretty good - yes there are differences that you can hear when you quickly change beetween them (on some vocals sound more distant, some closer and imaginary soundstage changes because of different treble) but when you listen only one - it just sounds good and that's it. I didnt listen on hd600 but I equalize IEM's for 3-4 years already - just by my ears - and as result all of them sound 95% the same - so I pretty sure my own target (whatever not precise it may be) sounds very good. Pink noise sound smooth but I cant understant how it can be used to hear small differences in treble - even if you elevate some areas just a little bit - it doesnt changes too much. If you create many filters in EQ APO (not just parametric filters here and there) - changing some mid frequencies will not affect high frequencies etc - yes it colors the sound overall if you listen songs or pink noise - but perception itself is not affected (at least for me). I wish I could understand completely how you equalize your samples and all these "compensations" and sh*t, all your researches are very interesting and important. But in my experience it's smoothnes of the sound that is the most important (at least when it comes to treble), harman target in its concept I think is correct, it just has too much 3k elevation and not enough subbass to compensate for it, as result it sounds shouty on 90-93 dB volume level, so you probably have to listen on 80-85 dB - as result you loose bass and treble "resolution".

[@rodslist77]

hi how are you, i apreciate all of your videos thanks allot, what are your thughts about the status audio hradphones, saludos from Mexico amigo.

[@teknolojigundemi]

Does your measurements include, soundstage, seperation of instruments?

[@oluvsgadgets]

Those are all aspects of a correct frequency response

[@RommelAbella]

Hello oluv, i hope you can try the new LG xl5s and LG xl7s

[@bonked9426]

Perhaps neutral sounding headphones or IEMs can only be achieved if everyone's ear shaped similarly or the same.

[@oluvsgadgets]

Which is impossible for IEMs as any insertion difference, ear canal length will heavily influence the overall sound. Let alone the concha which is just approximated within the response. But if done properly IEMs can have a way smoother sound as you just need to deal with your ear canal resonance and won’t get additional peaks. But it’s hard to approach a target which would represent the response of your ear let alone one that works for others too.

[@GrigoNiko]

It wasn't easy, but I get it. Nice April 1st video!

[@BurningBushPedagogy]

Thank you so much, you are a huge huge blessing to the world, you have no idea of how your videos, you are the one who shows us tests not just telling us your opinion, you always do real scientific test. God bless your family and tell your wife, we appreciate her patience, the world honors her roll of supporting your work. Much much love

[@blbg]

Try this with some super cheap iem like cca cra($15) widely available, it has good bass and treble extension. I am trying this myself and I think it can be tuned to a high level but for me treble tuning is hard by just hearing or using auto eq's.

[@evilvirtuoso9408]

Focal Radiance (yes, a closed back), and most newer Focals in general, when you EQ it just a little bit, is some of the smoothest natural sounding headphones out there. HD600 is good too especially because it is way cheaper than Focal. As an aside, love how diligent oluv is in replying to comments. Not a lot of KZbinrs who get many comments would do that.

[@Dan-pi6dx]

Do you believe that spatial qualities are somewhat seperate from frequency response ( of course some dips in midrange can make vocals seem more distant and the such) but hd800 does sound much more wide compared to hd600 even when equalised to targets as similar as I could do

[@oluvsgadgets]

I assume this has to do with their spacious earcups and additional interaction with the individual ear also the angle of the driver etc, but actually it sounds even more off to me after I somehow managed to achieve a response which appears “neutral” to me. I even can’t really notice those spatial advantages anymore. For me the correct and smooth frequency response outweighs all other effects, and adjusting some HRTF dependent frequencies which simulate sound coining rather from the side can also change the imaging quite a bit. That was the effect I noticed between my flat and precise target.

[@soothsayerslunk1]

Maybe someone said this already but did you try the audiotechnica m40x???

[@oluvsgadgets]

why should that be neutral? it's a completely colored one.

[@pikkyuukyuun4741]

Personally, I have a Superlux hd668b equalised according to some settings by oratory1990 following a harman curve i think. I find it the most pleasant headphone to listen since there is no peaks of harshness anywhere so I conclude that having an even frequency is good enough

[@oluvsgadgets]

Back then I also thought it was decent and a run for its money. But once you dig deeper into it you will simply notice that there is lots of room for improvement

[@TheMaxterchef]

Great video, super grateful to have someone like you in the community doing what others, as you say, with much more power really SHOULD be doing. I listened to your sound demos at the end of the video with my HD600 (its Custom Cans modded for more bass, so take what I say with a grain of salt), and to my ears, the neutral target is by far the closest to what I believe is natural to my ears. When it switches over to the precise target however, I feel as though the netural target may be missing just a tiny bit of treble to upper treble energy (nowhere near as much as to the level of the precise target). Something in between neutral and precise target (closer to the neutral target) will sound the most natural to my ears, although this preference could be to do with the shift in spectral balance due to the extra bass from the Custom Cans mod. I will be going up to the hi-fi teir in the Patreon and do some more critical listening. Thanks again Oluv for your hard work!

[@oluvsgadgets]

Did you try the pink noise samples I posted on Patreon? They should give you a better idea than music which you never can quite judge properly how it was recorded etc. I readjusted my settings slightly for smoother treble in the meantime as it’s quite tricky to get it right. I will post some further details later explaining my filter settings and how one can individually try to get even better results. I am just tired from the long sessions I had lately and need my ears to give some rest now.

[@TheMaxterchef]

@@oluvsgadgets I tried these samples as well and came to the same conclusion, that your netural target is by far the most natural, although there was no precise target file, so I could not compare between these two like I could in the music demos of this video. Looking forward to your updates and please, do not feel pressure to get the results quickly. This hobby is about enjoyment and you should prioritise this, take your time and enjoy the ride! Glad you are here with us all!

[@deadline7610]

Thanks for sharing. Can I ask which app you are using or plan on using to eq ? Thanks

[@TheMaxterchef]

@@deadline7610 EQ APO

[@FINNdeischgut]

Hey, Oluv, was genau müsste ich kaufen um den Earfun Free Pro 2 mit deinen EQs zu bekommen? Den Earfun + Patreon? Wäre cool zu wissen, würde nämlich gerne mal einen relativ neutralen Kopfhörer ausprobieren, aber müsste darauf sparen, weil ich zur Zeit krank und arbeitsunfähig bin und von meinem Vater "gepflegt" werde. Bin erst 20 und wohne bei ihm, deswegen bekomme ich auch kein Geld und müsste, wie gesagt, sparen, deswegen wäre es gut, wenn ich wüsste wie teuer das wäre. Ich finde deine Videos richtig interessant, da ich tatsächlich auch jemand bin, der neutralen Sound (So gut wie ich es mit dem Ohr hinbekomme, da ich nicht messen kann) mag und z.B das Harman Target absolut grausam findet. Danke schon mal im Voraus. LG aus Deutschland. Finn

[@oluvsgadgets]

Warte noch ein wenig, ich muss mein target für den Free Pro 2 erst noch anpassen. Das kann etwas dauern, weil ich das meiste nach wie vor nach Gehör anpassen muss; sich rein auf Messsysteme zu verlassen geht leider nicht. Habe auch gemerkt dass wenn ich den Kopfhörerklang exakt an mein Ohr rein nach Messung angleiche, dass es falscher klingt als wenn ich in gewissen Bereichen abweiche. Ich habe jetzt auch mehrere Exemplare vom Free Pro 2 um so hoffentlich auch besser die Serienstreuung abzufangen. Habe gemerkt dass die dich etwas voneinander abweichen. Hoffe jetzt einen besseren Durchschnitt zu erreichen, wobei dann zwar alle vermutlich etwas besser klingen werden aber keines so wirklich perfekt, wenn du verstehst was ich meine.

[@FINNdeischgut]

@@oluvsgadgets Ja, ich weiß was du meinst. Danke für die Antwort, dann werde ich warten und deinen Kanal weiter verfolgen bis es neue Infos dazu gibt. Aber deine alten Tunings für den Earfun Free Pro 2 mit den vielen Variationen kann man noch auf Patreon bekommen, oder? Falls ja, welche Stufe auf Patreon bräuchte ich dafür? Habe zum Geburtstag die Sony Linkbuds S bekommen und bin mit EQ auch ziemlich zufrieden mit ihnen, man muss vorallem den Bass ziemlich runter regeln und noch paar andere Anpassungen, wie 400hz und 1khz hoch stellen, aber keine Ahnung wie neutral meine Abstimmung am Ende wirklich ist. Wenn man eine gewisse Zeit über einen Kopfhörer hört, gewöhnt man sich total daran und merkt Vieles nicht mehr. Mein Vater hat noch Galaxy Buds 2, die ich aber absolut grausam finde von der Abstimmung und wenn man im Internet nach EQs sucht findet man von Oratory1990 Harman Target und Oratory Target EQs, aber die machen es nur noch schlimmer, sie heben die Höhen und den Bass einfach noch mehr an. Ich raffe einfach nicht, wie die meisten Leute Harman Target als angenehm empfinden können, für mich klingt es einfach nur furchtbar. Und das meine ich wirklich so, nicht nur ein Bisschen daneben, sondern komplett. Aber deswegen glaube ich, dass ich bei dir auf der richtigen Spur bin was Bewertungen zu Kopfhörern, Lautsprechern und EQs an geht. Kenne dich schon relativ lange, habe mir damals Ende 2017 dein Unboxing zum Teufel Rockster Cross angeschaut, welchen ich dann zu Weihnachten bekommen habe

[@kubakot1655]

Czy mógłbyś przetestować i przekazać swoją opinię na temat Superlux 668B ? To są bardzo naturalnie i neutralnie brzmiące słuchawki 🙂

[@kittydukakis]

These headphones have elevated bass and treble, and the V shape sound is more "neutral" than flat. Among my headphones, only AKGK702 and DT1350 are close to flat, but most people will consider them bright. Using SoundID flattens the AKG702 bass roll-off, but the only issue is that the added bass narrows the soundstage.

[@oluvsgadgets]

K702 flat? Now way, they sound horrid. Far from natural sounding and the SoundID profiles are even worse

[@WyattPost406]

We appreciate what you’re doing and the audio fool community is lucky to have you!

[@feisarfpv]

hi Oluv, I tried many (sometime even high-end) headphones yet and the best I tried (and still currently use) about beeing the best neutral and natural sounding is the ATH-MSR7b. It needs at least 300 hours of proper burning to sound their best, coupled with a Mojo 2, it's just amazing how they sounds. Hopefully you can try one pair one day to confirm. Can't wait for your impressions. Cheers'

[@RetroPlus]

As another commenter has mentioned, you should try the Avantone planar headphones, they are a mixing headphone targeted at professionals. I know in general you find planar magnetic headphones to have a weird tonality, but the Avantone planars are different and in my opinion are very well tuned neutral headphones that you should try out.

[@chungang7037]

Yea, by the few reviews I've seen they are one of the most neutral ever

[@oluvsgadgets]

@@chungang7037 noted. I will check them out next. Will also do a sound demo on them relative to my own target. The problem with planars are all the resonances in treble probably due to reflection from the flat driver with the ear and head which are hard to deal with.

[@VENOM-vq3ju]

Hi Oluv. If possible a test of the Neumann NHD30.

[@oluvsgadgets]

They suck big time

[@sapphiro]

I never use any EQ because I need headphones to sound good with many different music sources that might not have EQ at all or EQ would degrade the source signal because it is digital processing that introduces additional distortion to the source signal. The solution is to find synergy between headphones and DAC/AMP so that the system will always sound good and the same regardless of the source (PC/phone/DAP etc.). I had Sennheiser HD600 but I never liked how bad the upper midrange sounded. The best synergy I have now is Beyerdynamic DT880 250ohm + ifi Zen Dac/Can amplifier. "Warm" amplifier and "bright" headphone make for very good and balanced combination.

[@oluvsgadgets]

I recommend the Qudelix 5K with 20 parametric filters and dozens of user saveable presets. You can make any shit headphone sound great with this and also use them on the go if needed.

[@sapphiro]

@oluv's gadgets Thank you for your reply. In my experience, small portable DACs with built-in battery like this are not good long term solution for me as the battery is not easily replaceable and will degrade in few years. They lack dynamic range of a desktop amplifier and don't drive demanding over-the-ear headphones very well.

[@oluvsgadgets]

@@sapphiro never had issues with the most demanding headphones but I don’t crank loudness that high to begin with as listening over headphones you tend to listen too high anyhow which will damage your ears pretty quickly. With the HD600 I am at -16dB with the Qudelix and it’s plenty loud, would want to listen much louder than that

[@sapphiro]

@oluv's gadgets by not being able to drive demanding headphones, I don't mean only high volume. Small dongle dac's can provide a lot of additional volume, but that's not enough to drive a good headphone properly. It's physically not possible to fit large, quality capacitors in a small portable dac and as a result, they sound anemic with small dynamic range of sound even at high volume.

[@MieluPL]

Sooo, apparently Aryas V3 with very slight tweaks on tube equalizer preamp (Douk T8 Pro) sound true to life basically, based on the plastic bag and air freshener samples you provided. :) Much more neutral / natural compared with HD650, Philips Fidelio and Beyerdynamic DT880 anyways. Great opportunity for folks to test their gear out. Thank you for that!

[@Thorstende]

Ich gucke ja schon länger deine Videos. Aber was für Mikrofone trägst du in den Ohren? Wenn du es schon mal erwähnt hast dann habe ich das Video wahrscheinlich übersehen.

[@oluvsgadgets]

Sind ganz einfach Mikrofonkapseln mit einem speziellen Gehäuse um sie immer exakt im Ohr platzieren zu können.

[@Thorstende]

@@oluvsgadgets kann man die so fertig kaufen oder ist das selbstgemacht?

[@jeweltom2973]

Waiting to see which budget headphone you will pick. I request you to change the earfun free pro 2 for the in ear though. It's fine and i am daily driving them with your eq around an year now but 1. It doesn't have features like multipoint connection which is very nice to have especially when you have more than one device. Now i have to disconnect and reconnect every time when i need to switch between my laptop and phone 2. The newer earphones gives more battery life. I am satisfied with the overall battery life (buds+case) but it would be nice to have more battery on the buds itself. Like if i am watching a web series or sth i hate to charge it after couple of episodes😅 3. They are not widely avilable, for example i am in India and it's not available here (atleast not at a decent price) i had to import my unit from canada and that was a big headache

[@gabrielgavril3435]

What about stax L300?

[@Yossiamos]

Hi Oluv, How fun is to follow your videos! Very interesting and relaxing and above all helps to make decisions about a purchase. Thanks for that. I have a request from you please if you can try to test the E-MU Teak Headphones According to measurement the E-MU are balanced, and according to reactions they beat their brothers and sisters fostex\denon. It will be very interesting. Compare them against elex & hd600... and especially against the legendary fostex th900. Thank you very much

[@fun_ruiner]

Truthear Hexa which costs $80 has a perfectly smooth fr with perfect extension from both ends. Although it does have inverse polarity, so you would have to reverse it either by buying a different cable, or through equalizer apo but it still has one of the smoothest trebles you can have, much better than any headphone under any price including the hd600 there are other iems which are also very smooth, but a lot more expensive. If you are going to eq anyway, then the most important part is definitely the treble, other parts can easily be fixed with eq, as long as the treble is smooth and has proper extension up to 20kHz. That also means there shouldn't be that much deviation between different people, because there are no peaks that would otherwise shift around. and because it's an iem, you can power it though practically anything, even a cheap apple dongle. but obviously, you cannot use OE targets with iems, so you would have to come up with a slightly different version for iems. also, do you have a graph csv file which I can use with autoeq or something to have an idea of how your target compares to other targets? Are you going to create an eq profile for the HD58x, since I already have it?

[@oluvsgadgets]

I need to hear an IEM with smooth treble. Even an insertion difference of half a mm will change the entire treble balance shifting all peaks. If you do not compensate properly for your ear canal resonance no IEM can even sound acceptable. Apple is doing some auto compensation but their target is off.

[@fun_ruiner]

​@@oluvsgadgets the cheapest one I could find that has actually good quality treble would be the Truthear Hexa, just inverse the polarity by inverting the cable (you probably need a different cable for this), or using equalizer apo. Also, you forgot to answer my other questions

[@gorgicvetkov932]

@@oluvsgadgets khalid have no clue dont listen to him. If you are aiming for this there is only 1 iem etymotic er4xr or er4sr its the same iem just with bass boost on er4xr

[@gorgicvetkov932]

@@fun_ruiner hexa is not smooth and have inverted polarity. There are 15 and 20$ iems that are better then hexa. Even hola is better then hexa but those iems are far far from ER4 models in frequency responce and technicality

[@fun_ruiner]

@@gorgicvetkov932 What are you talking about? Name a single IEM under $200 that has nearly as smooth treble as the Hexa? I'm waiting. Hola has a huge dip in the treble/air frequencies and doesn't even extend properly up to 20kHz. Did you compare graphs before writing this comment? Etymotic IEMs aren't as good and are unusable for daily usage. They have stabbing peaks that shift around in the air frequencies, and they don't even extend properly up to 20kHz. FYI, EQ can't fix poor extension, not to mention the price difference. Technicality - whatever that means - is just frequency response. When you have both peaky treble and poor extension, that means you have a shitty frequency response, which is impossible to fix. The Truthear Hexa does have inverted polarity, which is a shame, but it's still the best option for the price, and I'm not aware of anything better up to at least $500 (which also happens to have inverted polarity, a lot of expensive IEMs do this as some kind of a gimmick to increase the sound stage). And if you're going to EQ anyway, you can easily fix invert polarity with a single Equalizer APO filter.

[@user-yz6xx2wl5d]

With full-sized speakers, everything is much simpler, the speaker is tuned to a Butterworth quality factor of 0.707, adjusted for acoustic design, and here it is, a smooth neutral sound

[@legendaryblood1937]

I'm not sure about this but I think also Audio Sources(Phones) sound differently , I noticed that When I used Samsung Galaxy S5 as an audio source for my headphones and when my phone broke I used my New Huawei P30 I noticed that it sounds different than my S5 and when I tried another Phone like Iphone X it sounds different than my Huawei P30.

[@oluvsgadgets]

Different output impedance will change the balance.

[@leonisbacher1772]

Wow cool glasses

[@gorgicvetkov932]

Guys...just don't get confused mixing over ear headphones with in ear headphones, don't make mistake doubling the pinna gain like listening headphone measurements, with iems you need to compensate the pinna amplification and for over ear headphones you don't because the sound is hitting the whole ear and with over ear headphones we have the pinna gain already. If you put binaural microphones into your ears and start recording you also get the pinna gain in your recording. Measurements for over ear and iems is very different when you measuring iems for example sounds above 6k is not accurate at all usually when there is a resonant peak on 8khz lets say 6dB to 10dB there will be dip very close to this frequency around 10khz-11khz and after that we have another peak around 14khz to 16khz and so on! In reality those peaks and dips does not exist ( most of them ). And now i want to explain something about harman target. The harman target goal for headphones is to sound like flat speakers in a room with add subwoofer (bass boosted frequency) sounds bouncing and reflecting from the walls boosting some frequencies and also reducing some of them as well and this is not the way to do it in my opinion but also we need to consider how the song or track is mixed and mastered in the end of the day we want to hear what the sound engineer want us to hear at the same time. This is not natural sound like sounds in nature like birds chirping or waterfall and because of that there are two type of sounds.The first one is the pure natural sound and the second one is the sound engineer who use studio monitors in a room or even worse using headphones! I know what Oluv want to achieve and i think i know how to do that because Oluv is aiming for the pure sound like in anechoic chamber pure sound without room gain and i have some ideas how to pull this off but also this doesn't mean this is the right way we have to consider how the music is mastered in the studio with the room gain added to the track/song.>>>> kzbin.info/www/bejne/mKbQZoepj5asb5I

[@oluvsgadgets]

It just room gain your will be missing but that’s only relevant below 500hz let’s say. The problem is that the entire balance above sounds wrong as well regardless if Harman or another target. Listening to pink noise over all headphones sounds just like some mess, while listening to pink noise over with my target comparing it to a speaker in a room still sounds more or less the same regardless of room. The character is perceived pretty well. Then you have the option to add some additional bass simulating room gain by taste. I rather opted for a fully linear and natural chain.

[@gorgicvetkov932]

@@oluvsgadgets depend on the room from 100hz or lets say from 200hz to 20k at 20khz you are between -5dB to -9dB rolloff at 20khz compared to 200hz. The rolloff starts around 2khz

[@oluvsgadgets]

@@gorgicvetkov932 roll off yes but no room adds additional peaks which the headphones are full of.

[@musikus7092]

​@@oluvsgadgets That's not true

[@oluvsgadgets]

@@musikus7092 prove the contrary

[@jorgbornefeld1689]

It's difficult. And it remains difficult. The differences between the different targets are smaller as I expected, which is for the first impression good. I can't judge which one is the best because I don't have the 600, only the 58x. The trueth of yesterday (Sonarworks profiles) is overboarded today. I don't think that this is the end of the journey, dear Oluv. It's hard to accept, that there are two profiles for each headphone now neccessary, the neutral one and the preceise one. The journey to the natural sound will be continoued, I guess ...

[@oluvsgadgets]

I changed my approach and will get away with a single target and simply equalize my recordings differently instead to still have exactly the same output. And I am planning to add the 58X and 6XX next month. It’s just that it’s not that simply to equalise a headphone properly within minutes. It takes lots of time to verify the results by listening tests. But as the HD600 is already pretty neutral the differences may appear small to some while huge for others.

[@jorgbornefeld1689]

@@oluvsgadgets yes, I can imagine that it tooks a long time to find the right EQ - settings for the different models. Thank you for your seemingly neverending enthusiasm to find the right EQ for natural sound. I'm curious, how the results for the mentioned headphones come out. Wish you and your family a good Eastertime!

[@megatrance91]

Would you make a new video on the Motion Boom Plus🔊

[@oluvsgadgets]

It’s not new and I already made some videos

[@JTB--]

I've got an HD600. It's a good headphone. But that 6XX line of Sennheiser HP's sound can change as the pads wear down

[@oluvsgadgets]

Try my EQ, really curious about your verdict.

[@notdefined8289]

Będzie pan recenzował focal bathys ? Jestem ich posiadaczem i fajnie byłoby zobaczyć pańską opinie na ich temat.

[@oluvsgadgets]

A trzeba? Co maja zmienić w porównaniu do innych? Ja nie mam tyle kasy żebym mógł sobie pozwolić na kupno wszystkich tych słuchawek promowanych przez wszystkich innych. Wszystko co kupowałem była tylko zaleta i straciłem mnóstwo kasy.

[@notdefined8289]

@@oluvsgadgets Rozumiem Pana, nie zdawałem sobie sprawy, że wszystkie audio produkty kupuje pan za swoje pieniądze, myślałem że wypożycza pan na czas testów od prywatnych sklepów lub same firmy oferują panu wypożyczenie. Słuchawki faktycznie nie oferują nic ponad przeciętnego (oprócz wbudowanego dac’a), więc faktycznie nie ma wielkiej potrzeby. Pozdrawiam!

[@gabrielgavril3435]

What are more neutral? HD800s or HD600?

[@ezioauditore1588]

hd600 but it still needs little eq.

[@gwapster13]

"Neutral" is a much-debated concept, with tons of different interpretations, especially in the headphone world. That's why manufacturers are just betting on a "majority preference" because at the end of the day, making headphones is a business; they need people to buy their stuff. So yeah, finding a "neutral" headphone that serves everyone is truly mission impossible. So instead of searching for the most neutral headphone out there, I just focus on the other aspects of the sound. For example, I'm willing to bet that however you equalise both the HD600 and HD800S to the same personal target (given the limits of today's parametric EQs), the latter would still sound more detailed and "larger". It's those differences that I'm more concerned about, because I always use EQ to take care of the tonality anyway. I'm not one of those who believe that not all aspects of the sound are in the waveform that reaches the ears... coz it IS that waveform that we hear. But what I'm saying is that equalisation has its limits, so adjusting the signal to give us the EXACT waveform that we want is a futile exercise.

[@oluvsgadgets]

Hd800 and derail? That’s a myth. In fact it still sounded worse and more metallic than the HD600 which with a close to identical response is way smoother and more natural sounding.

[@gwapster13]

@@oluvsgadgets I don't know why I used that as an example, because clearly the opinions on these two headphones greatly vary person to person. For me, HD800 has better potential when EQ'd, but this is my personal preference. I am able to achieve MY preferred sound quality better with the HD800. I owned an HD600 for a long time in the past, and still have the HD800.

[@MrPassiontea]

You should check out the audio technica r70x. It's similar to the 600 but has little more extension and soundstage. It might be able to get more accurate EQ than the HD 600.

[@oluvsgadgets]

Why should it be more accurate? It had a similar response which is far from neutral

[@Terra101]

Did you give up on the Elex?

[@oluvsgadgets]

Long ago

[@GrigoNiko]

@@Terra101 Have you watched the video? Till the end?

[@hdsarma]

Please review the Hifiman Susvara and Focal Utopia.

[@completestrangeronline7284]

When it comes to headphones, the only thing that matters is what you like.

[@musikus7092]

You're absolutely right because sound is subjective.

[@lukabosnjak3829]

​@@musikus7092 Sound is not subjective

[@musikus7092]

@@lukabosnjak3829 In better words: the human hearing and interpretation. You know what I mean

[@Synthematix]

Mate you need to try the Samson SR850, they are incredible for £40

[@kamikaze00007]

So long story short, I think what Oluv is saying is that he wants to hit "neutral" meaning as close to the "origin" sound as possible. That way, when a person listens to the sound, they get it in as close to its original sound as possible, and the only source of deviation that will affect the sound will be the equipment the listener uses. Perhaps that's what he means? Based on purely a sound demo I've heard, I think the Hifiman HE400SE was almost exactly like the HD600 in sound, except they seem to be more "spatially accurate" to my ears. Other than that, it seems to me like the Abyss (not sure I got the name right) seems to be the most accurate to origin sound on that same sound demo I heard. But the Abyss is very very very expensive.

[@cuerex8580]

the easiest example i can give is, that a natural headphone sound, sounds like you don't have headphones on. just imgine using neutral speakers in a acoustically treated room with roomcorrected frequencies based on your listener position. you will perceive them as natural and accurate because all frequencies fit like a true instrument when they enter your ear. (a minidsp is a must for any hifi speaker enthusiast by the way) if you use headphones, you don't have room reflections, just ear and canal reflections and the raw frequency response the headphone uses. this minimises the specification to just having a correct frequency response that matches your pair of ears.. which is still only possible by manual Equalisation in software like APO since you can't insert a microphone into your ear for accurate computer measurement. and still 99% of headphones still have unrecoverable flaws in their FR signature that can't be fixed with equalisation whatever you do to achieve a perfect simulation.

[@imabeliever85]

I love the HD 600 it just sounds right to me. I also have the K361.

[@wheniztheend]

All your nature recordings sounded natural on my Shp 9500's. Honestly I like my shp 9500's more than senhieser hd600. (but also my ears are very accustomed to the sound of the shp 9500's). Infact, the frequency graph for the shp 9500 is very close to neutral. It's lower in the 2k region, while being higher in the 5k region.

[@eliranamr5748]

Have you compared it to the 9600? Its the only option for me

[@oluvsgadgets]

I actually have them somewhere as many recommended them but found them to sound weird. Maybe I will take another look and choose those for proper equalising as well because you can find them for pretty cheap

[@oblivionlord1242]

My 9500s sound absolutely natural, I've used them nonstop and holy crap they're comfortable, maybe oluv's pair were slightly faulty?

[@mikafoxx2717]

​@@oblivionlord1242I found them too bright. The 600's are much closer, still subbass roll off and it could use a little more something in the upper treble. Sundara needs more in the 2khz region and the treble needs a little taming somewhere. Etymotic is a little too shouty but alright. Still need more time to figure that one out.

[@thamusician1993]

Please for the love of all our ears! Please review the soundcore motion X600 and upload your custom eq settings. I’m begging you! 🙏

[@garygriffiths7353]

Great work Oluv. I’ve bought lots of expensive headphones over the years and over the past few years I’ve ended up not liking most of them. I had a tough time during the pandemic with ocd. I’m still struggling with it. I like to listen to ambient outdoor recordings while I work and they sound awful on all my headphones. I mostly use a hd650 now as it’s the least offensive. I find it funny people think a hd800s is neutral. It’s tuned specifically to give the illusion of a large soundstage

[@oluvsgadgets]

I will try to offer an own profile for the HD650 as well as it doesn’t differ that much from the HD600 it shouldn’t be that hard actually. Have you checked my binaural recordings? The most recent ones should be close to neutral: youtube.com/@3DbinauralaudioFPV Also check out my shorts with some complex spectrums which are rendered usually wrong regardless of headphone.

[@garygriffiths7353]

@@oluvsgadgets hi Oluv. An eq profile for the hd650/6xx would be great. I find it funny that after all the years and all the headphones I’ve tried and money that I’ve spent that I’ve returned to thing hd6 series of headphones. Shows spending lots of money doesn’t necessarily get you a better headphone. I will definitely have a listen to your binaural recordings. You are correct no headphones seems to be able to reply the sound of wind in trees. Listening to your recording using some Apple headphones def shows that!

[@natpeterson3874]

Harman has a 200hz dip because they found that's it's a similar crossover frequency to a subwoofer also in test they found boosting at 200hz had a negative effect on vocals

[@oluvsgadgets]

No it has something to do how a real spectrum is perceived by a listener and how the headphone needs to be compensated in this region to still be perceived the same. Who cares about subwoofers if you listen with a headphone? I mean come on!

[@natpeterson3874]

@@oluvsgadgets that's the reason Harman has a bass boost to compensate but that's not the reason the bass boost is shaped the way it is with a 200hz cut "who cares about subwoofers if you listen to headphones" aren't we trying to have headphones sound like good studio monitors flatbass on headphones doesn't sound like flatbass on a studio monitor it sounds lacking so what's the next logical step to do when something is lacking in bass on speakers add a subwoofer same logic here on headphones make a shelf similar to a subwoofer and boost bass until it's perceived similar

[@oluvsgadgets]

@@natpeterson3874 actually no, my intention was never to simulate speakers but recreate a natural frontal spectrum which you usually get in real life over headphones. Speakers are out of equation here but I had to use them to simulate a spectrum of course to get repeatable measurements. Thus my spectrum listened over headphones is exactly the same in bass which you also measure in real life with no boost. But I need to rescue the area around 200hz due to this otherwise the spectrum heard over the headphone would be too bassy in this area.

[@plutobars7700]

Please review Enkle speaker.

[@importon]

Very interested in a neutral profile for the Sony 1000XM5

[@oluvsgadgets]

Impossible to achieve it with just the internal 5 band EQ. But it’s definitely better than all the predecessors

[@importon]

@@oluvsgadgets The best I could do was: 400: 0 1k: +1 2.5k: +4 6.3k: 0 16k: +5 clearbass: 0 It's probably still way off but I gave up.