One Simple Tool for Complex Japanese | Modification Structure

[@tcsocal5554]

Every time I revisit any of these grammar lessons I remember how well she explained things, and it helps me understand things so much better. Thank you and RIP Dolly Sensei.

[@mrAMMW]

Sadge

[@Subfightr]

... what?! :'( ' rip dolly sensei" REALLY?!

[@Eltaurus]

@@Subfightr yes. ... - 09.2021

[@seeanthonyn]

I immediately clicked on this when I saw it. These videos are so helpful and has taken the frustration out of immersion. Im glad you continually produce these. Please keep it up!

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

頑張りまーす！

[@JorgeMP53]

This lesson was incredible. Immediately after I put this into practice, I was able to grasp from 35% to 85% percent of what a sentence (or a paragraph) really means. The other 15% stays for the Kanji i still don't know xD. Anyways, another outstanding lesson from an outstanding Japanese teacher. このレッスンを教えてくれてありがとうございます!

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

I am glad it was so helpful to you!

[@daviddavidson1090]

(Since this was so well explained) **I** (feel like I pretty well) **understand!**

[@Narulopo]

This is the most valuable lesson in Japanese ♡ Even though I watched a lot of your previous videos there is always more to learn or remember from you Sensei ♡

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Thank you!

[@jmew3346]

Thank you so much for uploading another sentence deconstruction video. As someone who really wants to read in Japanese, more than speak, these are so helpful. I've been studying Japanese for over 3 years and recently started reading light novels. It is so hard to find people who teach grammar that focuses on reading and not just conversational Japanese. Here is an example sentence from the book I'm reading. I’m pretty sure I understand the meaning of it, but if you have a time to give me your interpretation I would really appreciate it. 王宮でも最大の広さを誇る大広間いっぱいにひしめきあう人々は、周囲にぶつからないように気を配りながら、宮廷楽団が奏でる優雅な舞踏曲にあわせ、軽やかにステップを踏む。 This author uses so. many. commas. O.o There was one sentence with five commas and I couldn’t understand it (I can't find it at the moment unfortunately). Even google translate and DeepL were like ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I've recommended your videos so many times to people struggling to learn Japanese because they are so different from the way most people teach (and it is a better approach IMO). Thank you again for all your hard work in making these videos!

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Commas in Japanese have no grammatical function (unlike European languages) so you can just throw one in wherever you want a pause as I explained here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/gnW0nXqkpqqfirc Your sentence is long, and only complicated because of that. Literally: Even-in-the-palace, most-wide-reception-hall (here is a missing particle, probably で) (in) bigly-crowd-people All this is just the modified noun 人々 which is marked with は and also ∅が in-order-not-to-collide-with-the-surroundings-pay-attention-whilst In-time-with-the-palace-orchestra-plays-elegant-dance-music Lightly-steps-a-step (treads a measure in very similar older English) Core is 人々は∅が　→　踏む Everything else is modification of modification of modification!

[@user-uc9gi2xf8r]

I remember having sooo much trouble understanding this modification structure. Reading books is a perfect way to push this knowledge further. It is pretty normal to find one big chunk of a sentence modifying one noun that would've been written as 3 separate ones in English omg...

[@jamesroschupkin5601]

You will be surprised how common these sentences are in Japanese. I recall struggling to understand some sentences in novels on shisetsuka ni narou. The sentences are very long sometimes with a lot of modifiers that you can get lost with what modifies what. This video is a big help cure dolly. I hope you do more videos on really long Japanese sentences because they are common in Japanese and confusing.

[@user-pt3ij9gv3c]

ありがとうございます！！！本当に本当に本当にありがとうございます！！！！🥰 This video helps so so much!!!!!!!! Thank you so much

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

So happy to help.

[@lucasacosta8259]

2024 Revisit: Dolly sensei was amazing, she really logically and coherently explained so many of these Japanese concepts. I miss her, definitely one of the better teachers for english people

[@caiodesousakasakevic8881]

This channel is the best

[@Soulskinner]

I don't really have many thoughts about this topic. So just thank you for the video. ^_^

[@Angel-de4er]

I wish i found this channel way earlier, such deep explications. I really appreciate it

[@nysttren]

Great video as always Cure Dolly!

[@hisodesu1]

Brilliant, so good, very helpful. It actually makes sense now. Thank you. Text books and so called KZbin teachers don't seem to explain it like you have just done.

[@barrydanser4334]

All the other parts I fully understand and as others have said has really helped med understand structures. I will now look at sentences with new eyes.

[@MaxIzrin]

I can't quite explain it, but I feel I understand things a little better after the lost cat example. That was a good example, and a really good video. Thank you.

[@JSCG12]

More complex examples would be appreciated! I often seem to have issues when multiple different tenses/forms of verbs are used throughout the same sentence. Things like the 買って in the last example I find a bit confusing as well. I don't really understand how a te form verb just exists in the middle of a sentence like that and then is able to transition into a noun/clause and still make sense. If I was constructing that sentence on the fly I would have probably written it as: 市場で買ったお菓子が川に落としちゃって魚さんに食べられた。

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Two problems here. You need a clause connector after the first clause so (which is why 買って is in て-form) and 落とす is other move (drop, not fall) and the candy can't drop itself, so it can't take が. Self-move/other move here - it even has the 落とす・落ちる pair: kzbin.info/www/bejne/e33OYpenlqqgr80

[@pazispeace]

omgggggggg this is very helpful like all your videos!

[@lesthermiranda1794]

If anyone is struggling with these type of sentences, what I recommend ya'll to do is to download audiobooks and listen to them while reading the book, turn off the lights in your room if you're using a tablet or a computer to read and put on some traditional Japanese background music while listening to the audiobook, that will help you; and try to picture and imagine every single word within that book, that will give your brain the ability of processing the events within the word order of Japanese, and eventually all of the sentences will become easy. When the book comes to life in your head, that Japanese structure also comes to life in your head.

[@johncameron5453]

Very interesting I am glad you covered these examples only because I tried to understand for a long while how each sentence connects to each other. Then it turns out to be a modification clause that sentences modifies nouns instead of it being similar to English with it being descriptive clauses Which I was kind of doing. I would like this to continue at least for now because it's essential for beginners and for those who are still trying to understand key structure of Japanese.

[@attilagoijra54]

Very helpful video

[@learnlibyanarabic8760]

Can you please do a lesson on 付く / ついてる? It can mean "attach", "go along", "be lucky" among other things. I'm also struggling to understand what it 's doing in this sentence: リハビリを始めてから,体力が付き始めた (after he started rehab, he started to regain his body strength), thanks in advance ❤️ love ur channel

[@zamyrabyrd]

I was just scrolling down the comments and saw your avatar, how fascinating! The furthest I got to Libya was visiting Cairo. Of course, Masri is quite different from Jordanian/Palestinian dialect that I struggle with but still could understand a bit. I'd love to visit further along North Africa sometime but probably would not be able to figure out Maghrebi.

[@learnlibyanarabic8760]

@@zamyrabyrd You're welcome to visit Libya, now things are actually getting better. Libyan Arabic is like a transitional dialect between Eastern and Western Arabic and it is understandable to speaker of Egyptian, Levantine, Gulf dialects, etc if we avoid words/expressions that are too regional. Check out some of my videos and see for yourself

[@zamyrabyrd]

@@learnlibyanarabic8760 Cool!

[@sealeddragon286]

I saw an example of a very ambiguous sentence and im wondering if there's only one correct way to interpret it. Though it doesn't have a context as it was made to be an example so maybe there isnt a correct way. 頭が赤い魚を食べる猫 Now i saw multiple ways this was interpreted in the example. Red headed cat eats fish, cat eats a red fish literally with it's head(like its head has a seperate mouth), cat eats red headed fish.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

There is only one way to interpret it and all your guesses are incorrect. Look at the structure. This is not a logical clause is it? So it isn't actually a "sentence" at all. It is a modified noun. Because the engine (verb 食べる does not end the sentence - it runs bang into a noun). So all this is simply the noun 猫 modified by the rest. head-is-red-fish-eats cat. The cat that eats (is eating) the fish with the red head. If you want to make a logical clause (sentence) you have to add a particle to the cat and do something with it.

[@sealeddragon286]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Oh that was actually my guess. When i said i saw interpretations i meant the example literally had those interpretations on them. Thanks for the assurance! I was afraid the modification split up based on context or something and perhaps the 赤い only modified 魚 or something but now i see that's not the case. Thanks again!

[@kabahentosis1718]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 If we add the copula, so it's 頭が赤い魚を食べる猫だ, wouldn't that be ambiguous? It could either be (Øが)(頭が赤い魚を食べる猫だ, (It's a cat that eats a red headed fish), or just (頭が)(赤い魚を食べる猫だ), head is a cat that eats a red fish. I know the ladder interpretation sounds ridiculous, but isn't it technically valid?

[@givmi_more_w9251]

@@kabahentosis1718 I feel that while the grammar technically allows for that, if a person for some reason wanted to say that, the 頭 would be marked with は. "As for the head, it was a red-fish eating cat." Again, just my understanding, but I feel that with this sentence, since the meaning would be non-sensical otherwise, there is a zero-pronoun "it" or "this" implied. (It) is a cat that eats red-headed fish, so with context, and to a native speaker it would not be ambigious at all. Also, there is another way to write that sentence where it is clear that　頭が赤い modifies the fish, and that is to replace the が with の. Dolly has a video about that, basically, in subordinate clauses used to modify you can put a の　where a が would normally be. 髪が長い女だ。can also be written as 髪の長い女だ。

[@amarug]

A huge fan of your videos, as always, incredible work, language modeling at its best. You sometimes poke fun at the academics, but I am sure in a few years from now, this will be the way even the academics think - because there is really no way around it. Anyway, I would like to contribute my sentence, which is troubling me. It is not super complex, but I recently heard it and something confuses me extremely: 学生時代の経験をもとに、小説を書いています。 をもとに here has the meaning in the lines of "based on". But what the hell is that thing? There is an を particle, but where is the verb, because the 書く has its own を later on. I am utterly confused. Or is it some archaic conjunction that behaves erratically, such as "~いです" and thus stands as a rare fixed expression outside the logical structre? Thanks!

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

I think the idea here is probably をもとにする (making into base) but it becomes truncated in this usage.

[@amarug]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Yes, that makes a lot of sense, thank you very much!!

[@carmcam1]

This is where i'm struggling, i thought i was reading a full sentence but then it was just to describe the noun right after the phrase, i'm practicing more by reading but it is really a pain point for me.

[@Ancipital_]

I'm never going to get this. Even if I get down the listening I won't be able to nail the speaking. But I'll keep trying. Hope that some future version of me will return to this comment and say "I finally did it!" But i doubt it 😭😭😭

[@ronin6782]

did you?

[@Hommiesyco]

I've been going through the lessons and I'm able to read most vocab but, this is my main struggle. Being able to Understand full japanese sentences. Doesn't matter if you understand vocab. If you don't get the grammar, it's over. Im going through the lessons again...

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

がんばってください。

[@pazispeace]

Hi 先生 hope you are doing great, your videos are really helping me I came across this sentence in shirokuma cafe when panda and penguin are having a conversation about how would it be to have their own restaurants... and what I can't grasp is the fact that there is an を and two actions 選んだ and いただける コンセプトは四季折り々の新鮮な海の幸を店主が選んだこだわりのお酒でいただけるカフェ (四季折々 was actually　四季折売り but I can't hear the U in 売り and also it doesnt makes much sense if it were uri, also i didnt find such combination in google) as for the concept, cafe where you can receive osake carefully chosen by the shopkeeper and fresh seafood in each season is the 四季折り売りの新鮮な海の幸を acting on いただける? also is this お酒(で) the te-form of the copula? 店主が選んだこだわりのお酒でいただけるカフェ sorry if there are too many questions, I feel a bit embarrased bc I ask too much lol, but you are the only android to whom I can understand the best (I wanted to ask you in patreon but I thought it would be better here so other people can see it)

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Good work getting 四季折々. Shirokuma subs are a little inaccurate in a few places. The long sentence of course is not a sentence but one huge modified noun, カフェ 四季折り々の新鮮な海の幸を is the direct object of the the possibility inherent in the cafe (いただける receive possible). It is a receive-possible cafe. And everything else is telling us what it is possible to receive. And that is the fresh seafood. But then we also have the rather strange 店主が選んだこだわりのお酒で The modification structure is 店主が選んだ → こだわり (こだわり is of course a noun) And then こだわり の → お酒 The で is the slightly strange bit because it seems to be the particle, marking the super-carefully chosen お酒 as the means or instrumentation by which the food is received or enjoyed. Or at least a very prominent enabler of it. But this may be fine-food language.

[@pazispeace]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 thanks for your help, I really appreciate it (◍•ᴗ•◍)!!!

[@mornon2394]

I encountered a sentence I'm not sure how to parse; context: there is a rumor of a heartless mannequin, and two students went to the prep room and took a mannequin to use it in a haunted house. In the end, one student says to the other: つまり人体模型は動くことができないから‌心臓があれば場所に移動してもらおうと‌私たち働きかけたんです‌ My doubt is, is the ば form a sentence ender, like て, so the parsing is 心臓があれば / 場所 (something like "if it has a heart, it got us to move it in this place", I think); or should I read it modifying 場所, so something like "It got us to move it to the place where it heart should be"? I checked the English sub, which is "Since the model‌ can't actually move,‌ it charged us with moving‌ it to where its heart is!‌", which is how I read it and supports the second parsing; but I'm unsure if this is the right parsing.

[@haygamtheocachcuaban]

can you explain what happen in this sentence , 父にタバコをやめてほしい。 is that I is the subject of that sentence

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

It is. Xてほしい means "(I) want someone to do X", The "someone" is marked by に.

[@KoreanVaporeon]

Might be unrelated to the video, but in some song I came across this sentence: 未来の夢だけ　語るはいいけれど Making 語る into a noun, shouldn't it be 語るのは instead of just 語るは?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Strictly it should. Is it a song? Songs break all the rules. That's a reason I don't regard them as ideal immersion material.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

PS - oops you already said it is. Sorry not to notice. Think of many English songs and how they break the rules of English.

[@KoreanVaporeon]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 That's what I thought, thanks! Is it common though? It's the first and only time I've seen の dropped when nominalizing a verb

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@KoreanVaporeon Lots of things get dropped in very casual Japanese: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rZLQpWZ3dq98bK8 - "song language" is even worse.

[@yasashisagakawaii]

Sensei, I have a question. I often meet those kinds of words: 差し置く, 差し引く, 差し押さえる, 差し込む, 差し入れる, 差し伸べる, 差し替える, etc. Is it possible to make sense of that 差し which will make it easy to understand 差し+*anything* words or I just should learn all those doublewords just like that? 差 - difference, 差す - to shine, 差し - between (e.g. two people) , face to face, hindrance, prefix used for stress or emphasis. It's kinda confusing.

[@Arc_Soma2639]

Hello beautiful dolly, may you please remind me of your video about the contrastive ha は particle pretty please?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

I've talked about it a few times but this is the most comprehensive coverage of the whole subject: kzbin.info/www/bejne/lZ-7eaOhibmZfdU

[@Arc_Soma2639]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 I love you sensei, thank you

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@Arc_Soma2639 Thank you so much! 頑張ってね.

[@barrydanser4334]

Can you explain the use of ことと why it’s required after こと

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Examples? Could be various reasons depending on context.

[@srajanverma9064]

Mine is 1st comment...love your channel and your method of teaching❤

[@ace-2k8qa6]

This video is very helpful, but I still can’t really comprehend complex sentences in Japanese. How can I learn how to do this?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Practice. This may also help: kzbin.info/www/bejne/q6DNZp9uYrWjrdU

[@ace-2k8qa6]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Thank you. I really am grateful for all your help😊 I'm sorry if I ask too many questions, it's just that I need to make sure I truly understand japanese structure before I start the immersion stage of my learning. Other than that, Thank you so much 🥰

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@ace-2k8qa6 No, that's quite all right. It's important to make sure you understand things.

[@ace-2k8qa6]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 If that’s the case then I need to find books at me reading level. Is there any sites online that have Japanese books I can read for free?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

​@@ace-2k8qa6 There are several, though most of the books won't be at a beginner level. Depending on your level, you may want to start with readers for foreign learners of Japanese, because even small Japanese children have a huge vocabulary, and such readers will feed vocabulary to you gently rather than overstuffing you in the first five minutes, which native materials can do. This all depends on your level, of course. White Rabbit is one supplier of such books. If you find a free online source, please let us know on this thread.

[@barofsoapies9016]

I'm sorry if this feels out of place, but a few days ago I started immersing for the very first time and ran into a sentence I feel like is quite vague and difficult: 教室では話しかけないでって言われてたのに I don't understand what role かけない plays and why it's 言われてた and not 言われた. I'd really appreciate it if you can help me with this one.

[@jxoosy]

so i think that the verb 話しかける is its own verb, not a verb form and it means “to talk to someone” and the 言われてた means “was being said” so basically instead of “you said x” with 言われた it’s “you were saying x” i might be wrong so dolly could clarify if i am

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

話しかける is not a separate verb but the い-stem of 話す plus かける. I talk about かかる・かける here, including its use with 話す: kzbin.info/www/bejne/Z37FoqCQhd6GhrM and as you say, it means "talk to someone" - specifically initiate a conversation with someone. 言われてた is a very standard abbreviation 〜てた = 〜ていた, so literally "existed in a state of having gotten told" (receptive helper れる in て-form + いた)

[@user-uc9gi2xf8r]

I used to get confused by such sentences... Until I no longer did! Keep trying!

[@jxoosy]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 ohh, i see, my bad and thank you

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@jxoosy Your contribution is valued.

[@deedanner6431]

I have a quick question about the の in 田中さんにこういうのもらったんだ。I would have expected を instead. Do you have to use の because もらった is nominalized by the ん/の?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

That has no effect on it. The thing is that the doer of the head verb もらう is me. And 田中さん is not what I receved (direct object of もらう). It is the もの. So with the zeroes made visible by the magic light: ∅が田中さんにこういうのも∅をらったんだ Remember that も is also a non-logical topic marker.

[@deedanner6431]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Sorry for the extended response but I'm super confused. 1. Are you saying that もらった is or isn't an inflection of もらう？ ２. If it is, are you saying we can view もらったんだ as も∅をらったんだ? 3. The doer of もらう is the が marked subject and the source of the action or もの　is marked by に, right? 4. When you say 田中さん is not the direct object of もらう are you thinking that I meant 田中さんをこういうのもらったんだ　instead of what I was questioning which was 田中さんにこういうをもらったんだ？(which I see now probably wouldn't work anyway because こういう isn't really a noun, right?) I've spent an excessive amount of time on this one sentence even though I understand what it means. I'm just stuck on trying to clarify the grammar.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@deedanner6431 1. もらった is the past tense of もらう 2. Yes. (But please don't separate particles from their nouns - they are a unit). も is a non-logical like は so if it is not marking a "pure topic" it implies a logical particle - in this case を. 3. Yes. In this case it isn't an action but a thing that is being received. But the source is still marked by に. 4. I was. Sorry. As you say though, を can only mark nouns so こういうを doesn't work. Are you clear about what the んだ is actually doing? If not please see this video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/oorZeoKfbbZmf5o

[@deedanner6431]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Thanks so much. I may not be clear on んだ so I will visit that lesson.

[@zehrhayader-_-6762]

Sensei, I've been immersing for a while and have a few questions bothering me. One of the things I'm observing is that, despite knowing a good amount of words and Kanji from my anime (Shirokuma Cafe), I have trouble recognizing the Kanji within the subtitles even though I get them right on my Anki. Is this a natural problem that gets solved over time or does it indicate a flaw in my process? I think I'm in a weird phase where I know enough Kanji where some of them tends to blend together or that I can't recognize them out of the context of Anki. Another problem I am having is from the translation side. Since expression strategies differ in Japanese, often times, even knowing the words, structure and particles seems to keep the meaning of the sentence expressed in the realm of vagueness for me due to not knowing the connotations which Japanese speakers know. Some of these problems are solved when I find a video of yours that directly explains them (Such as 'hodo') but other times, it can be a hit or miss trying to find an article explaining it on Google. What would you generally advise to someone facing issues such as these?

[@Soulskinner]

"can't recognize them out of the context of Anki." - like you learn them in the sentences, or as individual Kanji? If the second one, it's a natural thing. Especially if we're talking about fast recognition of Kanji. Like with natural reading speed. Learning them in Anki helps, but you (we) need practice to be able recognize Kanji in actual text. Actually that's true for almost everything.

[@zehrhayader-_-6762]

@@Soulskinner Thanks. I feel a bit relieved now. Basically, I store Kanji as words on my anki and practice reading from anime subtitles in Japanese

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

If you only have "facial recognition" of a kanji and it isn't working in all contexts it may be best to break it down and make a story of its exact elements - often it is simply a question of differentiating it (sometimes by one element) from similar kanji.

[@zehrhayader-_-6762]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Understood. Thank you very much ^_^

[@zehrhayader-_-6762]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Sensei, if it isn't too much trouble, I'm facing another issue and it's breaking my mind. ‎今日はいつもとちょっと違うことをします Which と particle should I consider this to be ? Is this the quotation particle or the 'and' particle ?

[@evertgoran]

Is the second rule always true? ”その帽子は赤いですよ。” Doesn’t 赤い come after but still modify 帽子 here?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

This is not a modifier but a subject-predicate relationship. In other words その帽子は (∅が) 赤いですよ。 _is_ the core sentence. 帽子 is the が-marked A-car and 赤い (です) is the B-engine. Modifiers modify nouns that are part of the core sentence.

[@evertgoran]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 I see! Thank you for teaching me this!

[@user-og9nl5mt1b]

What do you think about "dictionary of basic japanese grammar"? Is that a ehongo book in your opinion? Aka bad japanese grammer? Because i watch your videos and read that book as well as the same time.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

On the whole it is a useful resource that isn't either good or bad in terms of structure because it is mostly based on J-expression A = E-expression B type explanations. Where it does delve into structure it essentially has the same flaws as other conventional sources, but it does have a lot of detail.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Mostly doesn't clash as it is mainly along the lines "use this with this to mean this" and is quite thorough and informative. When it does stray into structure it essentially uses the same model - with the same flaws - as other conventional sources, of course.

[@user-tc7gt3sy6y]

Is there a specific reason you didn't have the kanji in 出かけた? I thought it would be in there but it's all hiragana instead so I'm confused.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

There is no rule about which words should be written in kanji or how many kanji, so it could be 出かけた、出掛けた、or でかけた. Nothing to be confused about.

[@user-tc7gt3sy6y]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Thanks!

[@user-pc5kg3le7l]