Orchestral Composing Template | Reaper + Orchestral Tools + VE Pro

[@PhilsHarmony]

Lifesaver. For years I've been struggling with Reaper + VEP MIDI routing, especially getting MIDI port 2 working. That hidden option you showed at 7:00 ("Map REAPER MIDI buses to VST3 MIDI buses") finally did it. Totally agree that this should be the default option. Thanks for the great tutorial.

[@AudikK]

This is what I've always been looking for. Thank you very much. Looking forward for future cool content!

[@maplefoxx6285]

I understand why you don't want to use regular keyswitches, but have you tried Reaticulate? the articulation management program for Reaper? it names your articulation on the midi track in the main view you can see when each changes are made. It would lower your ram and cpu usage a lot. It's always being updated too. Right now we can set keyswitches to have velocity range or pitch range or even transpose a note, the programmer is working on being able to set offset times of notes per keyswitch... they show up in Program/Bank, and to insert them you just right click on the icons on the articulation manager. You can even insert these from the main view without having your midi item open in piano roll. I tink a lot of Reaper users still do not know about this, I am supposed to make a few videos teaching how to make custom banks soon. There is another way to do what you are doing also. I have tried this style of divisi writing before

[@bennywollinmusic]

I'm aware of Reaticulate, I think I tried it once briefly and ran into some issues - but that was a long time ago and I barely gave it a fair shot. I should look into it again. Thanks for the reminder!

[@VitalKmusic]

Thanks for your ideas! I noticed that you move the cursor in piano roll to the beginning with the mouse, but it is easier to do this by pressing the "W" key.

[@BenRandall]

So when you are moving midi items from say channel 1 to 2 are you literally just pressing ‘1’ on your keyboard or is it a different shortcut? Also insanely informative vid btw

[@bennywollinmusic]

I mean, I press "2" to move to channel 2, but essentially yes. :)

[@tam_ryan1036]

Benny this is SO useful. Thank you! Liked and subbed 🙂

[@bennywollinmusic]

Thanks Tom!

[@bobco5]

I'm not a composer but I'm inspired to try out your work flow , I'm just a life time lurker , I produce and create using Reaper , they are compositions , but in the traditional sense of composing using orchestral tools , pun intended , I just mock about , again , pun intended . I've been collecting wares for an eternity , and I've thrown perfectly good money at templates and what have you , but your approach using Reaper, and VEPRO looks completely efficient to me , the midi channel aspects vs keyswitching I like and could perfectly embrace these ideas I feel . ...

[@lauro.f]

Very useful point of view and very simple. Thank you for sharing

[@rayphenicie7344]

A great video and thanks for putting this up here. I could not follow along at the very first part where you added tracks so I dropped out. Maybe revise and explain like to a 7th grader how and why you're adding tracks; esp. the 'how' part. I'm not sure why folders were set up as parent and child and exactly how that maneuver was done as you really sailed over that *very* quickly. Also, my version of Reaper is not showing a routing button in the channel strip for each track. Also, how does this work if I'm not trying to hook up to internal busses with Kontakt.

[@bennywollinmusic]

I recently discovered that I might be able to accomplish the same thing by routing between subprojects. Wouldn't have the possibility of running on a separate slave PC like VE Pro, but I'm not doing that right now anyway. Gotta set aside time to investigate...

[@andreapolidori5616]

Hi. Great video but I can only add notes in each track using the piano roll. How to I connect my MIDI keyboard to each track so that I can it MIDI keyboard to compose a piece? Thanks!

[@bennywollinmusic]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/gp6oqmdvha1sppo

[@BenMartinBox]

@Benny Wollin: I see that you are on "Windows 10" with an ASIO buffer size of 128 samples. I'm still on "Windows 7" because "Windows 10" creates a lot of latency and drop-outs with my "Tascam Us-16x08". Strangely I have no problems with "Windows 7" (same hardware). Can you please tell me what CPU and ASIO audio interface are you using? Many Thanks.

[@bennywollinmusic]

I'm using a Ryzen 3600, and my interface is an Audient (comes with its own ASIO driver). Unfortunately, I'm not really sure how I was able to get my buffer so low. I've actually changed my workflow since uploading this video and currently usually have it at 1024 :(. I might share an update if I can figure out how to get it lower.

[@alexandersalazar9820]

Hello !! Hey how do You make the velocity looks like Fl studio velocity (8:05), with the horizontal line .

[@bennywollinmusic]

If you're talking about the velocity lane at the bottom of the MIDI editor - it looks that way by default. Maybe you have the lane set to something else (CC1 or something?). There's a menu down there to change it. If you don't see any lanes at all, it's collapsed and you have to drag the dark grey bar at the bottom upward.

[@alexandersalazar9820]

@@bennywollinmusic hello, no, the velocity stick has a horizontal line that is proportional to how big or small the note is, I only see a little ball on top of the stick ;( ​

[@alexandersalazar9820]

@@bennywollinmusic update!! I just find how do it, i went options in piano roll/ CC velocity lane/ show note length in velocity lane

[@bennywollinmusic]

@@alexandersalazar9820 Ah! Glad you figured it out.

[@jefffogle1288]

Very powerful idea. Thank you for sharing. :)

[@bennywollinmusic]

You're welcome! I'm glad some people have found it useful.

[@norburybrook]

very interesting. I set this up and it works like you describe when drawinf in notes,however for some reason you cannot record from a midi keyboard into the Reaper midi tracks /VE pro . You can see the midi getting to VE pro but theirs no sound in Reaper.

[@bennywollinmusic]

Weird. At first I thought the MIDI record settings might be weird (recording post-fx or something like that), but if VE Pro is getting the MIDI, that can't be it. I would guess that there's either SOME difference in the played vs drawn in notes (channel, CCs, something), or else maybe a buffer setting? But that's just grasping at straws. Sorry I can't be of more help.

[@jezzaroddy]

Dang VE Pro looks super legit! But how is it when you are recording with live performance? How would you switch the channels there? I heard you say something about pressing a number?

[@bennywollinmusic]

In Reaper, in the MIDI window, I have the numbers 1 through 10 (I use 0 for 10) assigned to custom actions that do two things: Set [selected] events to channel X, and set channel for new events to channel X. Makes editing articulations a breeze. For input, I have buttons on my MIDI controller assigned to flip through channels - although I tend to just perform with one articulation that's close enough, then edit them on screen.

[@jezzaroddy]

@@bennywollinmusic thank you for the reply! Ya what you've shown is very useful. Btw, which midi controller are you using to switch channels?

[@spunicunifait2697]

All cool, but why are you not using Reaticulate? Is there any disadvantage doing so? Grüße aus Houston, TX 🙂

[@bennywollinmusic]

That's a good question. I haven't spent enough time with Reaticulate to be able to compare. I really should sometime.

[@istominmusic]

Привет! Хотел поинтересоваться. Если использовать на одном компьютере Reaper и VE Pro = это работает лучше, чем загрузить сразу все в Reaper? То есть VE Pro высвобождает ASIO буфер Reaper и реально можно загрузить больше инструментов? Интересно сравнение нагрузки в двух вариантах, где в одном варианте все загружено только в Reaper, а во втором варианте с использованием Reaper + VE Pro. Интересно посмотреть разницу) Спасибо!

[@bennywollinmusic]

I don't think it would affect your ASIO buffer - it might actually need a little bit more of a buffer, since it has to send MIDI to VE Pro, the audio back to Reaper. The advantage is that the instruments aren't loaded/saved in Reaper, so projects open, close, and save very quickly.

[@istominmusic]

@@bennywollinmusic I watched tests when many KONTAKT libraries are loaded into DAW and ASIO begins to give out "crack and crunch," but the computer processor is not yet loaded, but the ASIO indicator shows that the buffer in the red zone is overloaded. And, when all KONTAKT is transferred to VE PRO (on the same computer), then in DAW everything works perfectly and you can see that the load on the ASIO indicator DAW has dropped significantly and the sound is clean, and the processor is not overloaded. In these tests, I saw how VE Pro helped greatly unload DAW and in this case you can load many more KONTAKT libraries and at the same time DAW will not rest on the overload of the ASIO buffer.

[@bennywollinmusic]

@@istominmusic It's possible that VE Pro is better optimized for how it handles VSTs. What you said about ASIO crackling before the CPU is overloaded - that might just have to do with single thread speed being maxed out? The total CPU usage includes in all the cores, so it could be misleading.

[@michaelm5926]

Great video, thanks! Question: Is there a function in Reaper like in Cubase to disable your instruments/tracks to save RAM? In Cubase this works really fine even without VEP... But I'm curious about if this is possible in Reaper, too.?

[@bennywollinmusic]

If you're actually *disabling* tracks, you can simply hit the little power icon next to FX to bypass them. You can also use the action "set all FX offline for selected tracks" (you could assign this to a shortcut or make a button for it). This will complete unload the instruments from RAM, but store all their settings. You can also render tracks (right click -->render/freeze-->render to stereo) which will mute the original and create a separate track with a stereo wav file. This way you can hear the composition with everything in it, but also have the freedom to turn the original back on if you want to change anything. As a third option, Reaper has a crazy awesome "subproject" feature. Right-click the track header and select "move tracks to new subproject". Reaper creates a separate project with that track and all it's data (midi, instrument, whatever), renders it, and then inserts the rendered file into your original project. It looks and behaves just like a wav file, except that when you double-click it it opens the subproject to edit it.

[@michaelm5926]

@@bennywollinmusic Great! Thank you! Now it works fine!! 👍

[@apollo3340]

Thanks for your video! I have a strange question: did you buy those hollow stands for your speakers, and if so could you share a link? I'm looking for something exactly like that and can't find any.

[@bennywollinmusic]

Made them. You could literally just grab a 1x12 board and have them saw the right lengths at the hardware store if you don't have a saw at home. (Or find a friend with a miter saw). Screw/nail/glue, paint, done. The best thing about making them yourself is that you can be exact about dimensions. I measured my ear height and where the tweeter is on my monitors to give me the best height.

[@apollo3340]

@@bennywollinmusic I had a feeling they were made. I guess I'll have to attempt it myself. Thank you!

[@jumpingfrog4323]

Hi Benny Wondering if you have used reaper without going through VE pro. Like reaper directly with OT sine player

[@bennywollinmusic]

Yes, all the time. The purpose of using VE is to not save the VST instances with each project. My projects went from 180MB to 320KB... which makes a difference when you're doing automatic backups every 15 minutes. It also means projects open, close, and save nearly instantaneously.

[@jumpingfrog4323]

@@bennywollinmusic yes it is an excellent way to load instruments without stressing the pc. I use Reaper with Musio player (cinesamples budget offering). I've loaded all instruments in their respective midi channels on musio and reaper. But only 1st midi channel plays and makes sound. Other channels seems to accept input but don't provide any sound. Wondering if you had to go through this error where only 1st channel gives sound and others not please

[@bennywollinmusic]

@@jumpingfrog4323 Sorry, I don't have any experience with Musio.

[@lockinski]

Thanks for sharing this Benny! Much appreciated - I think I will change my templates from key switches to midi channels. Quick question - you show changing midi channels in a track by highlighting and the you say something about numbers, didn't catch that bit. I can right click in a note and select "note channel" and then select the channel from there, but you seem to have a more convenient way. Can you please explain that?

[@bennywollinmusic]

Custom shortcuts. I literally just press the number for the channel. If you use Reaper, go Actions-->Action list. In the top right drop-down, select MIDI Editor. Click "New Action...", "New custom action...", then name the action and give it the following two actions: "Edit: Set events to channel 01" (this sets selected events to that channel) and "Set channel for new events to 01". Then assign that combined action to the shortcut "1" in the action list.

[@fideldelgado9218]

This is amazing. Such a great workflow you've created. I might switch over from Ableton to Reaper just to get that extra speed in my workflow. What reaper theme are you using here?

[@eliseypermyakov]

this is a default reaper 6 theme

[@uzer_zero]

There are some great ideas here, Benny, even without VEPro. One thing I noticed is that you have an FX bay to the LEFT of each track. How do you configure that?

[@bennywollinmusic]

I use the script 'fxlist' by doppelganger. It's technically deprecated and not maintained anymore, but it works flawlessly, and I much prefer the layout to reaper's native way of showing FX in the TCP. Here's the forum thread, which includes download links(they appear to still work!). I don't remember what steps were involved in setting it up within reaper. forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=210987

[@uzer_zero]

@@bennywollinmusic Interestingly, that forum post is open in another tab in my browser, so I guess my search was on the right track (npi). Thanks so very much for the LIGHTNING FAST reply! Cheers!

[@alexandersalazar9820]

Hello, how do You set shortcuts to change MIDI channels?

[@bennywollinmusic]

Open the action list (shortcut: '?'). In the top-right dropdown, select 'MIDI Editor'. I actually combined two actions in a custom action: 'Edit: set events to channel X' and 'Set channel for new event to x'. I made one of these for each MIDI channel, then assigned them to shortcuts (in my case, just the numbers 1 through 0).

[@alexandersalazar9820]

@@bennywollinmusic hey thanks, I appreciate your answer!!!! :) Thank You !! :)

[@tylereddington1449]

Just a few questions. 1 when drawing in midi, do you have to draw modulation for each channel separately, or is there a way to write on all channels. 2. Is there a way to route the audio back to individual tracks so you can mix them in reaper?

[@bennywollinmusic]

1. I don't think there's a way to do that. I rarely would want that anyway - I often want to control them separately. ex: I might want to use CC1 for a fp effect on sustains, then use it to fade in tremolos on a separate channel. 2. Yes! I actually did it with my new template this year (haven't made a video about it). I actually took that feature back out - sending hundreds of channels of audio between Reaper and VE was killing my PC. I'm now using a small MIDI FX to control each instrument's volume slider instead. It doesn't give me full mixing control (I can't do instrument-specific FX), but for me it's the right balance of flexibility and simplicity. If I need something special, I can just lead an instance of that instrument directly into Reaper.

[@АлексАлекс-ю7х]

@@bennywollinmusic Please tell me what this "small MIDI FX" is and how to install it?

[@lockinski]

Hi again Benny. Do you know of a way of hooking up this system with FX plugins in VEP so that different articulations have different reverbs, for example? It seems that because all the articulations are on one track they can only be assigned the same FX. Unless there was a way to control the audio channel inputs by midi as well.

[@bennywollinmusic]

I don't do a lot of work with multi-channel audio routing. VEP hosts things pretty much like any DAW. I believe it can handle multi-channel routing, so you could do it all within VEP the same as you would if you were hosting the instruments in your DAW. As a workaround, you could easily set this system up with a separate instance of Kontakt for each articulation, though that might eat into RAM. This thread seems to be addressing your question: www.vsl.co.at/community/posts/t26470-Multi-out-Kontakt-from-VE-Pro

[@msstephbiggs]

Awesome video! How did you install the sine player for orchestral tools? For some reason im not able to see it in reaper

[@bennywollinmusic]

Do you know what folder you installed the Sine .dll in? Reaper checks in several folders for VSTs. You can edit where it looks in Settings -> Plug-ins -> VST If you need to add the path for Sine, select "Edit path list" ->"Add Path". If that doesn't work, I'm out of my depth. :)

[@msstephbiggs]

@@bennywollinmusic thank you! Will try this!

[@NorbFuchs]

Hi Benny! This looks interesting, thanks! However, in reaper 6.43 I can't find the MIDI I/O button ->Midi input -> 'Map REAPER Midi buses....' - Also no "Edit: Set events to channel 01" in the actions list. What am I missing? :)

[@bennywollinmusic]

MIDI I/O: When you're in the FX window for a track, there are several buttons above the VST UI, including one that says "2 out". That button will open the routing window where you'll find the I/O button. Action List: At the top right, in the "Section" drop-down menu, choose MIDI Editor. You should be able to find it then.

[@bennywollinmusic]

Clearly, Reaper's UI has its weak spots. :)

[@NorbFuchs]

@@bennywollinmusicYes, I've found the I/O button, but there is no "Map REAPER MIDI buses ..." option in the list.. :\ - Action list is ok now.

[@bennywollinmusic]

@@NorbFuchs I think it has to be a VST3.

[@aholder4471]

@@bennywollinmusic Do you by any chance happen to have the SWS (Standing water studios) extension pack installed in your Reaper. This sounds like something that would be in that extension pack and it's easy to forget it wasn't always there and isnt stock with Reaper. It definitely has a bunch of little useful actions. I have a bunch of custom buttons set up with some stock and some of those SWS actions, like hide all envelopes, and zoom out to project extents, and maximize / minimize height of all tracks, zoom into selection, and my favorite for what I do, write all current values to automation for time selection, which revolutionized my mixing workflow for live music recordings, now I don't have to chop up the set into 10 different files, 1 for each song, instead just write current values to automation for time selection and boom that mix for that song is automated into the whole set. This also helps me keep a more consistent sound from song to song so it ends up sounding like a live performance that was played by the same instruments the whole time. Kenny Goia over at Reaper Mania dropped that little nugget In a video and I didn't even know how much it would help my workflow. Those actions in Reaper are where the real hidden gems are that will really change your game up.

[@neverlow777]

Does logic work better with Kontakt control automation than reaper ?

[@bennywollinmusic]

Sorry, I have zero experience with Logic.

[@yichaozhang7933]

hi there, im just a little confused about the fx. how will u insert fx plugins in each instrument. thanks.

[@bennywollinmusic]

Are you talking about adding fx after the instrument VST? Like reverb, compression, etc? If I want to process an entire instrument section, I can just ad FX after the Vienna plugin. To add fx on a per instrument basis, I can do that within VEP, if needed.

[@yichaozhang7933]

@@bennywollinmusic oh! thanks

Super. Do you think I can do the same on Spitfire Audio LABS free stuff...like BBCSO Discovery? How did you switch to different articulations in midi editor? Own shortcuts or? Thanks again for great video.

[@bennywollinmusic]

It shouldn't matter what instruments you're using - anything that runs in your DAW will run in Vienna Ensemble. However, Vienna Ensemble unfortunately isn't free. Yes, custom shortcuts. I literally just press the number for the channel. If you use Reaper, go Actions-->Action list. In the top right drop-down, select MIDI Editor. Click "New Action...", "New custom action...", then name the action and give it the following two actions: "Edit: Set events to channel 01" (this sets selected events to that channel) and "Set channel for new events to 01". Then assign that combined action to the shortcut "1" in the action list.

@@bennywollinmusic yes, I'm using Reaper Linux version. Thanks for explaining everything. I dont have VE, just free Spitfire Audio Labs and Decent Sampler and instruments from Pianobook.

[@gurumajuindonesia]

now there's reaticulate in Reaper, anyway this is very smart tutorial tho, may I humbly asks whether your template is available to share? I don't have OT but it will very useful for a music teacher like me.

[@bennywollinmusic]

Yes, I really need to set aside time to delve into Reaticulate. Still haven't done that 🙈. Not sure how much use this will be as it's highly dependent on what plugins and settings you have, but here you go: drive.google.com/file/d/1BHbm9f7NAsE93fyCVtcppVSp7x7IUvMF/view?usp=sharing

[@gurumajuindonesia]

@@bennywollinmusic Oh My, thank you so much for your kind gesture sir! appreciate it

[@MusicForTherapy]

Any chance you could share your template?

[@bennywollinmusic]

Not sure if it'll be any use to you, but sure. :) drive.google.com/file/d/1BHbm9f7NAsE93fyCVtcppVSp7x7IUvMF/view?usp=sharing

[@zimouspero]

I love you my brother...10000 thanks

[@CybreSmee]

Interesting workflow, but I'd just use Rearticulate. Literally the same result but a lot easier to setup.

[@bennywollinmusic]

I've tried it. It's fantastic and certainly the right choice for a lot of people. There are at least two big reasons I prefer my setup: 1. With reaticulate, the articulations are bound to the timeline, not to the notes. If you grab and move notes, they will not always retain their articulations, depending on the context. If I'm moving a musical phrase, I can't imagine a scenario where I wouldn't want the articulations to be bound to the notes. 2. My method lets me stack articulations. Stacking shorts and longs is quite useful, as is accessing sustains and tremolos at the same time. Or having a legato upper line with sustained harmonies. Or various other permutations.

[@CybreSmee]

@@bennywollinmusic Yes, I agree. I remember those problems too. I use Reason Studio now for composing, much easier for this kind of thing. But you're right, use what works best for you.

[@dimitriczapkiewicz4238]

Great - thx....

[@landonp629]

I don't see the point of VEPro if you aren't using a slave PC to host the samples. Just saved your template purged or with disabled tracks, that way projects in the templates open immediately.

[@bennywollinmusic]

If you have all the instances of Kontakt inside your project (even if they're purged/disabled), you'll be saving all the settings of every instance every time you save. It makes project files rather large (especially if you like to keep frequent backups), and it does add to loading/saving times (at least 20 seconds for me), which again, if you're doing frequent auto-saves, is really annoying.