Outnumbered 3:1, How A Faction Overcame the Odds | Space Engineers

[@CaptainSovereign]

"KE ships. Staggered line! Captain, they outnumber us, three-to-one!" "Then it is an even fight."

[@maverickr0x822]

"then, it's a massacre" because being on the 1 to 3 size means the KE had the upper hand, imagine outnumbering the COA 3 to 1... XD

[@garrusvakarian4300]

"Burn their mongrel hides!"

[@HandyManny77]

Release the gary

[@FizzieWebb]

Came here looking for this exact comment, I was not disappointed.

[@GetBrocked]

"Then it is a even fight" Okay, there, I said it.

[@LezlyLikesYuri]

Lol, nice Rtas 'Vadum quote

[@Khornecussion]

GOOD.

[@themagicnerf]

Now we just need that pelican scene but with Ospreys, lol.

[@CrescentPHI]

At the time of writing, the Khans have over 70 unique ship designs to choose from, of which not even all of them have been used! :kekfrog:

[@GetBrocked]

70 unique headaches

[@mikegrubbs16]

@@GetBrocked "10 million strong, and growing" comes to mind :D

[@shaybaker9176]

LOL

[@jasonjsalgado4091]

Hi guys Im new to this. I was wondering how do this events work, how many players play at the same time, and if they build their ships in survival to go to war??

[@GetBrocked]

@@jasonjsalgado4091 view it more like a board game where we play out the moves. Building is handle by a ingame mechanic. We don't typically build stuff

[@META_mahn]

I want to imagine that these videos are actually lectures given in an Earth lecture hall by the old, retired captain of the Eternity's Edge. To most people, this man is a nobody, but to the people who know and study war, this man is a foremost expert.

[@GetBrocked]

I like that too. shieeeet, I might run with that

[@TheDovensian]

@@GetBrocked if you do, you can definitely pull the lecture hall structure.

[@GhostOfSnuffles]

I get the impression that the CDF wanted perfection in every performance and felt demoralized when they couldn't achieve it. The Khan's were ecstatic when they got things good enough. When it comes to warfare (the IRL kind) it's often said that good enough is the truest perfect. Despite the Khan's ships and leadership not being perfect they were good enough to beat the CDF's concept of a perfect ship and strategy, and in the end that's what wins battles, not pursuing perfection but simply getting the job done.

[@GetBrocked]

that's a big part of it. The CDF wanted to play the game a certain way, and when that didnt' happen they lost interest (IRL). There were other factors as well, like covid coming to a end, and a lot of the CDF being burnt out by repetitive losses.

[@maverickr0x822]

yes, perfection is the enemy of efficient. KE wants results, not a fixed way of achieving them.

[@ben1000bhp]

Honestly, as a rider the KE deserve all the props they get and then some. The CDF and Riders at the start didn't give them the respect they deserved and paid for it. The riders now have realized how much they truly have to learn from the KE. To all the KE boys (and gals) reading, god speed you beautiful bastards I hope you somehow beat the odds, even if it's not the way you usually do

[@Josh-iv2bw]

We're like cockroaches ;)

[@michaeljohn7275]

Love you too!

[@1984Phalanx]

As you said the leadership thing is true in real life as well. If you have hundreds of crew who are well trained and have the ability to make decisions for themselves that ship will always outperform another where the commander has to make every choice. No one commander no matter how smart they are can know everything at every moment in time, though they have to be the ones to coordinate strategy.

[@catzilla9330]

I don't think it is a matter of being tryhards, quite the opposite tbh, we have a shit load of fun and WANT to get ultra engaged, meaning more training, practice, communication and all around effort. not to say the other factions don't have that, but KE is fuckin WILD

[@alpha_9997]

Which fits with the lore i think. The ke loves war and actually enjoys it. Funny how that works

[@boad6484]

honestly our voice chat expecialy during the first few turns of season 2 where just scuffed as hell. So many people talking at once an giving orders. Plans being constructed mid battle by low ranking members. People having dificulty recognising the voice of the leader from the other voices. and constand memes and battlecries being shouted. plenty of people joined our VC during filming. listened for 2 minutes and left and I dont blame em XD It was honestly quite fun those filming sessions. I kinda miss the choas since we streamlined voice chat an lot as well and people sadly have stopped trowing out stupid ideas, and leadership stopped accepting those stupid ideas. But hé we had an lasting impact on outlands. And even if KE becomes the next CDF in the future we put our mark down As pretty much CO leader of the faction I want to thank: Upgrayedd, Crescent, Maverick, Caraboa, Markus, Xeno, Spitfire an lot for designing and coming up with an lot of these ideas and play styles for KE during the early days. Maverick and Crescent pretty much invented the KE ship design. And all of them pretty much helped make our leadership style the way it is. props to you guys you did good!

[@GetBrocked]

honestly, KE has it good. Burn hard and bright, and then checking out as the unique aspect faded

[@Alewxx]

Outlands is my Star Trek substitute. So i love it.

[@dakaodo]

I love how the human dynamics played such an important role in the development/progress of this campaign. I think that indicates you guys did a great job creating the gaming framework and culture/atmosphere to facilitate and encourage it. Also, amusing that you're using a Rimworld music track for your BG music. :D

[@GetBrocked]

rimworld slaps!

[@RD1R]

Wow I need to get this game. This is literally the tactics and strategies the USN used to beat the Japanese in ww2. The specifics of pilot training strategy and decentralized decision making are even eerily similar.

[@GetBrocked]

it's worth notiing. This series, layout, etc is hyper specifics to outlands. We've created a framework that does not exist in the base game. The base game is just minecraft in space

[@RD1R]

@@GetBrocked ty, I'm waiting on a new graphics card as it is so I'm in no giant rush. It seems like a great idea tho! You basically have a dnd/wargame style setup with certain scenarios and benchmarks? Are things like training methods and leadership actually up to players within the game or is it predetermined by lore and established doctrine? It would be a great true game, maybe y'all can find a few dev fans who want to make a mod 😉

[@zelphion5248]

EFN: COA sounds cool let's do it! COA: Who just scratched my paint?!? EFN: We're still gonna talk about putting down your big scary guns right? COA: *Input declaration of war against KE* Edit: I absolutely love this video. Some parts felt a like it skated over some background info but, honestly, it's pretty accurate! As a break down for season 2 this is absolutely beautiful ❤️

[@zelphion5248]

Let's be real, if we hit ALL the politics we'd be here for hours 🤣

[@GetBrocked]

it'd also be very... messy for the lack of a better term

[@Josh-iv2bw]

Another part is... things change pretty rapidly, and most background info is pretty public on the discord.

[@shinyentree225]

If I could relate this to anything in history, it would be the rise of the Mongol Empire and I LOVE that their name is the khan Enclave it’s like something out of stellaris (sorry I’m a console player I wish we could do stuff like this in SE without it lagging to death)

[@maverickr0x822]

YES! the khan is a direct mention to the mongol tribes! and the enclave is from fallout ;-)

[@ruskibot7745]

the design philosophy of something thata just good enough is what leads to greatness.

[@mobiuscoreindustries]

That and understanding of game mechanics. I make a lot of custom weapons and used to run with factions sharing that way of playing the game. But where I diverged from my peers was that I would actually shove my prototypes into as many fights against actual players as possible, and within the bound of survival if at all possible. It was hard and took a lot more time as well as often seeing that time being entirely lost when a particular design under-performed and lead to serious damage or total loss. However it taught me exactly what the breaking point of many things are and to better understand game mechanics that would influence the design. Things that are easy to miss for my colleagues that tested the weapons against big slabs of heavy armor. AP is a very nebulous stat and often "I can pen 15 layers of heavy armor with my super stick" did not translate into greater combat effectiveness. For example my missile design has shifted towards maximum applicability rather than raw damage. Simply put, what is the cheapest and most reliable way to do damage to the target profiles you are most likely to encounter. This phase of the analysis discounts ordinance entirely and sometimes I even employed dummy payloads in live engagements because it would make it far easier to see where projectiles impacted and how they did (tracking dents on a ship armor was easier than the gabled mess left by actual ordinance). This allowed me to tailor ordinance doctrines to specific servers, not only leveraging any new blocks (such as better thrusters, warheads or gyros, for example) but better defend against unique weapon balance (such as exploiting turret lead by having missiles mimic the ciruclar dodging partern that was presented in the video) or having missiles intentionally "miss" via a wide arc offset only to spin around once they reach the midpoint of the ship to sandwich it between a direct volley and the previous offset volley. Manipulating ship trajectories by making low threat missiles more "obvious" was also very useful to exploit a range advantage of normal weapons. For example if your ship has railguns that give it a good 5km range advantage you can use obvious PMW missiles to force people into an evasive which most won't have the balls to try so head on (cause if you fuck it up, your ship gets shredded), so they usually speed cap the missile, which means they are now moving away or parallel to my ship, meaning they are NOT closing the gap where the range advantage no longer matters. Similarly by concealing their launch you can bait someone into a charge and hopefully apply the previous relative speed benefit to inflict catastrophic damage on them if they do not react fast enough.

[@Aaron47916]

warring tribes united under one, troops focused on mobility, taking down a far larger force and becoming the dominant power in record time, litterally named khans. straight up larping the mongol empire

[@CoronisAdair]

I'm not quite through the entirety of season 2 yet, but it seems to me, watching the edited videos, that the Jump Inhibitor was a major factor. The season 1 combat seemed very indecisive, with a ship jumping out as it became critically damaged and the 'victor' unable to complete the kill. When the KE show up, you can tell that the COA had no clue how to handle the loss of their ability to safely retreat, and that combined with the KE aggressiveness gave the KE a serious edge.

[@Orcscompany4660]

I always play the 'Paragon' type character in video games/dnd, maybe with a chaotic flair. But I LOVE playing the 'bad guys' when that's the whole point of the medium/task. Maybe I ought to re-download SE and actually commit to learning its ins and outs....

[@trinalgalaxy5943]

Having watched both seasons, season 2 has reminded me of early WW2. The allies were too busy fighting the previous war while germany was trying out a new tactic. big surpise that the germans were fairly dominant against Poland, Belgum, and France. however as the war progressed, the nazis started slowing down using more known tactics while it was the allies that adopted to a new doctrine that used their superior manufacturing power to just pummel Germany into submission. We can only hope that with the EFN putting pressure on, the Riders can adapt with the new CDF units and fully turn the tide. sort of going on analogy, the CDF are france refusing to adapt and falling (but a stubborn group joining the Riders ala Free France), the Riders appear to be both a combination of Britain and the Soviet Union (think officer purges). First fleet is almost doing the role of the US. almost. and the EFN are the fucking Poles fighting long after their country was destroyed. God I love the Polish.

[@GetBrocked]

Like with the French, the CDF was mired with the results of last war. And politically and mentally there wasn't much left there. And while the CDF had way more in it to fight the war. The leadership, and state of the war meant it actually wasn't really feasible. Good analogy.

[@trinalgalaxy5943]

@@GetBrocked History rhymes in strange ways.

[@brathernumzy]

I noticed one thing a fair few times , even though the battles are in space . The ke Followed the art of war and the other factions didn't . The ke regularly appeared weak when strong or would play of what their opposition would expect tactically, leading to coa committing or over committing to battles they shouldn't have and every time they backed the ke into a corner. The coa would try to completely encircle the ke using numbers and forgetting to leaving a big exit sign from battles , Which lead to the coa to take more loses then they should have and that happened in a few battles and forced the ke to fight harder then they would have if it was easier to escape from those battles .Never press a desperate foe to hard :)

[@advencro3379]

18:50 whoever it was, was a bad ass

[@maverickr0x822]

it was Boad. we were about to disengage and regroup to cover the CL, and he called up for us to get a kill and them sandwich

[@water9367]

that beautiful Rimworld music in the background, and an overall fantastic and interesting video. Bravo man, definitely subbing. :D

[@maxhill7065]

I don't play space engineers but I've always enjoyed watching what people are able to create in it, started watching your videos a few weeks ago and I'm loving hearing about the stuff on your server. I'm sure you've already heard of him but I get some Drachinifel vibes when you're discussing ship classifications and nomenclature haha

[@skywardsoul1178]

That circular / changing vector strategy isn't to be undervalued. I remember helping a friend test their heavy armour combat ship with my little 4 gatling fighter with high thrust to mass ratio in multiple directions. Basically no armour. I was able to take out all of his turrets and thrusters by just circling the ship while changing vector.

[@tauIrrydah]

@22:00 "Ender, the enemy's gate is down."

[@andrewfinlayson4416]

Love your guys work. Will always remember the cdf and how good they did but I can't wait to see what the next two factions have up there sleeves. Keep up the awesome work guys.

[@maverickr0x822]

KE has THEET!

[@GamerX13X]

Me: Space engineers has always looked cool, but I don't know if I'd get into it. This channel suddenly appearing after Rubix Raptor vid: Shit, this looks so cool to be part of.

[@barnmaddo]

On the meta side, I think it was also hard for the COA to fight a battle of attrition, because KE could easily repair their ships at a FOB. So even if a battle was very close, all that mattered was which ships were destroyed.

[@pearchris]

Dude, some of the ship designs in this are just insanely good. There are some amazing designers in the SE community.

[@blackholefreezeray8871]

Shipmaster, they outnumber us 3 to 1! Then it is an even fight.

[@black2burn211]

just found you on YT. the content is super solid...but the rimworld music keeps me coming back:)

[@badgerwildgaming6908]

The space bar q/e is a pvp tactic mentioned by Luca the guide. It just works and you can dodge shit tons of fire. Place a decoy or wo on the bottom of your ship and it's damn near impossible to overwhelm with turrets, this is why most pvp ships will have dedicated spinal mounted forward fixed gun battery's to counter the fibloop.

[@GetBrocked]

yeah. It works, reaaaaaly well. There are other ways to get it done, but it's the easiest one to execute on

[@CrescentPHI]

Whilst some experienced pvp players in KE were already aware of it, the "discovery" and proliferation of the tactic within the KE's inexperienced playerbase was by one those players themselves, rather than from some guide.

[@badgerwildgaming6908]

@@CrescentPHI Luca the guide is an se youtuber who showed how to use this tactic in detail. Got some great vids on survival pvp tactics.

[@badgerwildgaming6908]

@@GetBrocked yup that's why you need fixed forward guns cause the turrets are just not capable of tracking the fibloop right now. That or get crazy close and slug it out age of sail style.

[@advencro3379]

go back to when the khans first appeared way before luca made this video---

[@IanOcampoPodRider2016]

I did wonder what happened to the two cruiser designs the Eternity gave to the CDF to convince them to stop making the battleship

[@lordmon555]

came here for a Space engineers video and I got some rimworld music in the background love it

[@furimindusties5736]

If I ever am capable of playing space engineers, this server is the one I'd want to join.

[@MrBones-cu1vi]

I just discovered this and damn this is radical sounding. I literally haven't seen a single episode but I think I should spend a bit doing so. Should I start at season 1 or are the seasons a bit self contained? Also FOR THE KHAN

[@GetBrocked]

Start Season 1 yeah: Called Outlands

[@maverickr0x822]

go from season 1 episode one! and yes, for the creeeD!!! to the pit with them!!

[@vygar5473]

I just stumbled onto this channel. This game looks amazing.

[@zacharyhutchison4006]

Hearing Rimworld music playing over SE is surreal

[@calebblaha7854]

One common problem decentralized structures can face is asymmetrical warfare.

[@droka1564]

Love these videos, your analysis is spot on

[@QualityPen]

Me, who has played Warfare, seeing the hydrogen freighter with exposed tanks stacked right on top of each other: O_O

[@samuelreese1816]

If I could suggest an adjustment for the eternity, maybe having multidirectional thrusters to help shift that big booty out of the line of fire faster, it seems to have a decent blind spot for your weaponry

[@CaptainRhodor]

She has internal maneuvering thrusters, but they're intentionally limited to keep her balanced. It's not fun or interesting to watch a gargantuan unstoppable battleship dancing around with the power of bullshit

[@henryfleischer404]

Maybe I should join up. I'm done with D&D for the forseeable future, and I don't have college until fall.

[@GetBrocked]

Give it a go, check out the pinned channel video for info. as it is quite unique, and different from regular SE play.

[@maverickr0x822]

join us, and enjoy the show!

[@catzilla9330]

join the khans >:) no but really, because we have such a liberal policy on new players getting in on stuff you can see if you like it within like 2 sessions

[@farsalor2627]

@@catzilla9330 on it

[@Otto_Von_Beansmarck]

17:04 this is one of the reasons the Prussians were so militarily dominate through out their existence

[@Hugo-yh2cd]

so confused when i heard the rimworld soundtrack, i thought i left my game open

[@trolly4233]

I’m gonna make a ship which is unbeatable. It mate be ugly, massive, uncanny and unconventional, but it will survive. Redundancy is key.

[@maverickr0x822]

embrance the BRICC

[@dragonstrike406]

"Then it is an even fight."

[@kingsleywray6632]

Curious. Thanks for sharing

[@GetBrocked]

thanks for watching

[@marcoschramme3990]

Jup kann die KE verstehen mir macht es auch spaß einfach mal den Bösen zu Spielen und die Sau raus zulassen ist auf manchmal auch sehr erhollend wenn mann einen Schlechten Tag hatte👌

[@danielshin4526]

Good enough in military Design is f**king perfect

[@nightfalc0n9]

I'm very new to this series but during this entire video, my mind kept repeating "Enders Game type stuff"

[@bandannadee9370]

Skill > "Good" Ships

[@bluemoon1368]

Let’s be fair it’s a combination of both with the khans. We’ve had to change many of our ship designs just to keep up with theirs

[@bandannadee9370]

Noice

[@maverickr0x822]

@@bluemoon1368 and hate of some specific ships XD

[@mikegrubbs16]

@@bluemoon1368 I feel like we Khans have actually slowed down on new designs, aside from those who join that wish to build. If the Riders are making more modern ships, I would predict it would not be long before the KE bulk ship design crumbles because of a lack of innovation.

[@bluemoon1368]

I’m cool with valiant for now

[@tobor88]

How viable would carriers be?

[@jasonhenry8067]

My thoughts exactly

[@samuelreese1816]

A thought , has anyone tried to create a flare system, or decoy system to redirect enemy missiles?

[@GetBrocked]

yep, I've seem decoy launchers in the past. It's not that effective though, especially now.

[@Kan-di8re]

Actually, yes, there are dedicated decoy blocks ingame, they don’t launch away though

[@danielshin4526]

Always fear the one who believes themselves in the corner

[@Baguette939]

"Then it is a fair fight" -Rtas 'Vadum, Halo 3

[@ferro9926]

Probably a little late to the party, but i do have a few thoughts and curiosities: 1- would it be possible to publush the pov of the other factions on the channel, with a slightly different opening and voice? 2- you mentioned having a patreon, could it be possible to have some of them make an appearance as 'trainees' or "bomber" pilots? Trainees to demonstrate a variety of skill in some of the factions. And bombers as to break up the big ship vs big ship type combats, adding in a new threat from whoever can deploy them 3- how would sieges and boarding work, should it be implemented?

[@PattPlays]

the BAWLLS

[@Sup3r87]

just came across this and it seems really cool. do you need really strong internet to play on it though?

[@GetBrocked]

mostly just a okay computer. Considering half of our team is in Europe and the Other in the US internet isn't a massive deal

[@xxxxCronoxxxx]

what is the hardware bottle neck for space engineers?

[@GetBrocked]

poor coding on keens part.

[@CaptPatrick01]

The heavy physics calculations means a good CPU will have the greatest impact on the game's general performance, followed by GPU GDDR RAM capacity.

[@xxxxCronoxxxx]

@@CaptPatrick01 GDDR is one that i haven't herd of before

[@CaptPatrick01]

@@xxxxCronoxxxx It's the RAM found on graphics cards. If the GPU doesn't have enough, SE will offload the excess onto the regular, slower system RAM and the performance will tank considerably. The game _technically_ just needs a DX11 compatible card from within the last 9 years to render on paper, but the game's voxel based nature means _a lot_ of objects need to be cached in memory.

[@sillerbarly4927]

Wow this is too much of a parody of history

[@Wallabm7091]

You mentioned that you're low on players. I would love to join if that's a possibility

[@GetBrocked]

watch the pinned video, then head on over to the discord.

[@Wallabm7091]

@@GetBrocked sweet thanks!

[@maverickr0x822]

join the KHANS! we have garry!

[@mastermagic03]

So basically the KE are da Orkz

[@Xindet]

The leadership model you described btw is not the american. Americans lead by order. You described mission type tactics used e.g. in germany. In the US military soldiers have to strictly follow the orders of their officers. In the bundeswehr the officers just give the soldier a task how to execute it is up to them.

[@johnkarako9138]

Take a look at the US paratrooper drops before and during the Normandy Landings, specifically their leadership structures when boots hit the ground.

[@daedalusmedia]

Is that ship, Eternity’s End super battleship, based on the Halo Halcyon class frame?

[@QualityPen]

Certainly looks like it.

[@MiamiPapi]

What is all of this? Are there wars in SE?

[@erickcredidiooliveira201]

So It was an even fight.

[@adrianpaz472]

All of these reasons are irrelevant without mentioning the jump inhibitor. Without that tech the CDF and Raider heavy units would have retreated to fight another day. It was a massive tactical and strategic boost for them.

[@GetBrocked]

doesn't matter actually. The CDF ended the war with a still very large reserve, and the largest Capital fleet remaining. The final battle the Jump Drive inhib wasn't used because it was already known that it'd be a fight to the death.

[@adrianpaz472]

@@GetBrocked not what I saw in the battles. Having lost their heavy ships at the start was a massive equipment and moral loss for both the cdf and raiders. The inhibitors also created total tactical defeats. That is, they lost all 4 ships instead of being able to pull out when things got tough. It also forced them to concentrate on taking down the inhibitor ship which allowed other ke ships to fight without much opposition. The inhibitor was by far the single main advantage the KE had.

[@GetBrocked]

@@adrianpaz472 sure it had a impact. But not actually all that big. The inhibs were used like 3 times over 10 battles. The moral part was correct. but the outcome would have largely been the same.

[@aidanmeacham1999]

Tres cool

[@iitim2152]

Since its an rp server I feel like you should set a teired "combat speed". Rule

[@joecool2810]

16:45-22:40

[@nekakonjina9624]

The KE is basically WWII Germany.

[@arkdromaedia]

Then it is an even fight

[@NPC.error404]

petition to rename the Khans United (succesor to the KE for those who haven't gotten to season 3 (? i think?) yet if you ppl exist) to batshit insane people united

[@fulconini]

gud

[@uzziah134]

wc fix that

[@lostree1981]

Kind of shit to degrade their achievement like this by saying "It's not that they were good, they just waited for the other team to be worse than them and then attacked" Whatever.

[@MikoMikoMercury]

Pinned video?

[@GetBrocked]

the video on my channel

[@mrbeltr5833]

Hahah sounds like the Russian army

[@reager90]

God you guys have made excellent content, just finished bindge watching season 2.