Bard's Tale Trilogy Starter Tips for Maximum Fun

[@MrJimbo-ew9vk]

My party recommendation (especially if you are playing all three games with the same party and transferring the party with all their spells and equipment): 1) Warrior or Paladin - in the 3rd game, this character will be your Geomancer. Before you defeat Mangar in the first game, look for the Spectre Snare weapon in a room behind the room Mangar is in. Give it to your Warrior/Paladin. This weapon will prove especially useful in the 3rd game, when the ability to take enemies down with one hit will become more important than how hard you can hit. 2) Hunter - keep in mind that the Hunter's insta-kill abilities also extend to the missile weapons s/he uses, meaning s/he is as very bit as lethal with a bow and arrow as s/he is with a sword. The Hunter's ability to even one-shot bosses means s/he will be the one to take down both Mangar (using a Long and Zen Arrows) and Lagoth Zanta (using either an Aram's Knife or the Sword of Zar) from afar. In the 2nd game, look for the Sword of Zar in the Maze of Dread and give it to your Hunter. In the 3rd game, the Hunter's ability to one-shot KO enemies makes him very useful late in the game. 3) Bard - a required character in the first game and an important character in all three games. Has a lot of great buffs. His ability to do breath attacks using certain types of instruments is also quite helpful. 4) Rogue - Another important character in all three games and a required character in the third, since only the Rogue can kill the final boss Tarjan. Can one-hit kill enemies, disarm traps and identify items. 5) Conjurer - my recommended path for the Conjurer: Conjurer ---> Sorcerer ---> Wizard ---> Magician (--->Archmage in BT2) 6) Magician - my recommended path for the Magician: Magician ---> Sorcerer ---> Wizard ---> Conjurer (--->Archmage in BT2) 7) Third Mage (Conjurer or Magician) - my recommended path for the Third Mage: Conjurer/Magician ---> Magician/Conjurer ---> Sorcerer ---> Wizard (--->Archmage in BT2) (In the second and third games, you will starting dealing more and more with multiple large groups of enemies. Having three mages can be very helpful in these situations. In the second game, pick the Archmage with the most Spell Points to be your Destiny Knight, as Spell Points will become your HP. In the third game, it would be prudent to have two Archmages and one Chronomancer in your party.)

[@richardlee9949]

what about monks?

[@MrJimbo-ew9vk]

@@richardlee9949 After replaying the trilogy, I came to a realization: both the Monk and Hunter would also make a good combo. The Monk will be your minor boss-slayer, while the Hunter takes out the Final Bosses of the first two games with missiles. Towards the end of the third game, I'll: 1) convert the Hunter into a Geomancer and give him/her a Death Dagger (and later the Strifespear); and 2) give a Death Dagger to my Monk so s/he can one-shot the really tough enemies in Malefia.

[@pacbilly]

Whoa, how did I miss this great post?! Pinning it!

[@pacbilly]

@@MrJimbo-ew9vk If the monk can use the Death Dagger, I can give it to mine in my C64 original Thief of Fate game and not have to kick him from the party. Unless this was just something they did for the remaster. Everything I read about the C64 original said there's no instakill weapon for monks.

[@jgmaurer31]

A small thought on this - a hunter and rogue's viability comes down to your willingness to save scum levels. Hunters (and rogues) get a NASTY penalty to their skills depending what dungeon/level of dungeon you're at (up to -60% I believe). This is why you hear a lot of people saying "my hunter/rogue doesn't do anything", because if you just go with the average skill increases, they probably won't :(

[@JimPlaysGames]

Bard's Tale Fundamentals! Great stuff!

[@pacbilly]

Bard's Tale Beginnings? Bard's Tale Basics? Oh man, I missed an opportunity for alliteration!

[@sirellyn]

This is awesome. Glad I'm subscribed to you. Honestly if they ever did a half decent remake of Times of Lore, I'd be over the moon.

[@pacbilly]

Ha, thanks! Man, Times of Lore could benefit hugely by a remaster. They would have to keep the art style in the same spirit of the C64 original, but I would love to see some features to help make navigating those dungeons a little smoother. And maybe a special dungeon you have to escape from if you habitually kill innkeepers. ;D

[@JimPlaysGames]

@@pacbilly What would be great is to move the UI to the right and have the play area square. It's bizarre that you can see things coming from the east and west, but things to the north and south might as well be invisible.

[@pacbilly]

@@JimPlaysGames Yes! That would be perfect. In fact the NES version let you see a lot more of the playfield. Unfortunately it was inferior in most every other way.

[@PaperlessWriter]

I love this remaster so much; it's just done so well. I played the original trilogy on my C64 on their original release dates so this just takes me right back. Great content, good job on the video:)

[@pacbilly]

Thanks!! The C64 version of the third game may be my favorite game of all time. Now there’s a new EasyFlash cartridge image so you can play without disk swapping and load times are instant.

[@PaperlessWriter]

@@pacbilly Would love this on the iPad or Android.

[@pacbilly]

@@PaperlessWriterNot the remaster, but the Apple IIgs version of the original trilogy is available for the iPad as part of a bonus feature if you buy the 2004 Bard's Tale featuring Cary Elwes. It looks and plays okay but lacks the Quality of Life improvements of the remaster.

[@krugec23]

Very good tips. I struggled abit when starting BT, I never played it before remaster. I enjoed playing part 1. I got to a part with some magic trap and darkness, and just quit out of frustration. Bards Tale 1-3 remaster and might and magic 1-5 is on my to do list, just wow classic eats all of my game time these days...

[@pacbilly]

Ah, wow classic... I was playing it for a while, until I got to level 60. I really don't have much interest in joining a guild or doing raids. My friend did that and it was like a part-time job. You had to spend a couple hours just flying around and getting buffs. And then when you get in the raid, everyone has to be geared a certain way and do exactly this or that at exactly this or that time. It doesn't leave any room to do things your own way. Plus I was playing as a pally tanks, which were worthless before Burning Crusade. Nobody in raids wanted them.

[@krugec23]

@@pacbilly I know what you mean, but the que on my server is over 10000. So I resumed my bards tale save :)

[@Shot97]

No one can stop the party of Killdall and Cheifet!

[@pacbilly]

The ultimate front line

[@bearbeard6604]

Red Letter Media shout out! Good followthrough from that young birthday boy to the matured birthday man!

[@pacbilly]

:D Rich Evans is a national treasure.

[@phimseto]

Love that this got recommended to me. Great video, thanks for putting this together. It's fantastic seeing people still enjoying the games.

[@pacbilly]

It's really the only game I reach for these days. I actually bought it twice. Since on the GOG version of the game I have to reserve the save game for our playthrough on the PB&J channel, I wanted to be able to keep playing on my own, so I bought it a second time on Steam. They really did a great job on the remaster. It's everything you'd want a remaster to be, and nothing you wouldn't.

[@akamadmaxx]

Ricky Butt-Chutney will be used in every RPG playthrough from this day forward

[@pacbilly]

Lucas Boy is already using him in his BT series. kzbin.info/aero/PLVH-yUTFZWZJv4GF1bng4K4QRZ4v4eyNB

[@sirellyn]

Actually liked the voiced non sequitur with the wizard animation at the end too.

[@pacbilly]

Ha, thanks, I started doing that just to amuse myself while I was looking over the footage and felt like it needed to be preserved for all time.

[@jgmaurer31]

Small tip regarding Paladins. Fleeing and certain spells require a "group saving throw" which uses the FIRST PERSON in your party. Paladins get a scaling bonus to saves that caps at +6 at lv 30+ (for comparison, the 2nd highest is +3 which is wizards). If you're going to have a Paladin in the party, put him in the front. Also makes a good target for Geomancer as I believe Paladins keep the save bonus when switched over.

[@pacbilly]

Wow, great to know! I think I actually made my paladin into a geomancer in BT3 on the C64 back in the day, but I had no idea about the group saving throw or the first slot thing. I currently have three different games going on three different computers, so I'll move my paladins into the first slot on each.

[@jgmaurer31]

@@pacbilly evidently, I might be wrong about the running thing in the remake, but I'm pretty sure the group saving throw thing is still correct.

[@gavinw77]

I loved the croaking wizard at the end of the video, what a fellow.

[@Retromicky82]

That was really cool thanks for this I did get this not long back . You should play more of this on the channel . I'd love to see this on switch or something . Was actually playing the remaster of the ps2 one on my vita recently

[@pacbilly]

Yeah, I'd love to have this on Switch as well. I guess you could have it on the go if you got a Steam Deck, but those cost a pretty penny. You know, I've never actually played the overhead-perspective Cary Elwes one. I've had it forever, but I only just used it to load up the original trilogy that comes with it. Is it any good?

[@gearsofgames]

Wasn't aware there was a remake! I tried several times to get into Bards Tale I on my Atari ST back in the late 80s. But I always managed to get hold of the same.. uhm, dodgy copy of the game 😉 . So it would always crash when entering the first dungeon!

[@pacbilly]

One of the main C64 cracks of the third game is dodgy too. It gives you all the treasures you're questing for in an empty building right at the beginning of the game. Way to go, cracking team!

[@gearsofgames]

@@pacbilly That sounds vaguely familiar, wonder if that was a thing on the 16 bit versions as well...

[@Dandizz]

TRAVELLERS TUNE!!! 😂

[@pacbilly]

:D As stuck in my head as that song was, now it's been totally replaced by its equivalent in Bard's Tale II.

[@mary_syl]

The Bard has the Flame Horn from the beginning these days. You just have to get it appraised first.

[@pacbilly]

That's only if you use the pre-made bard. Or if you add the pre-made bard to your party, steal their stuff and then put them back in the guild. But in the video I advocate for not doing that because it robs the player of their early-game rewards and makes things too easy. If you create all your own characters, they will start with nothing except a few coins. In the remaster, though, it won't be long before you have plenty of gear, and gear that you've earned, no less. If you're playing, say, the C64 version, yes, go ahead and add the pre-made bard, steal his stuff, then kick him to the curb. But it really isn't necessary in the new version. Not only that, it makes the game less fun when you're playing with gear you didn't earn. It's easy enough as is, and you're robbing yourself of the early-game rewards.

[@theyetidude]

I can't believe you included that Red Letter Media gag. Definitely a jaw dropping moment when they riffed a movie containing BIlly Bob in the same episode as revealing that shirt to embarrass Rich.

[@pacbilly]

What was the movie they riffed again? It's been so long ago, I don't actually remember the movie, but my memory of the shirt and Rich's embarrassment is quite clear.

[@theyetidude]

@@pacbilly It was Trick or Treat "starring" Gene Simmons and Ozzy Osbourne on a Halloween Best of the Worst Ep.

[@nesmandan1037]

I’d dump the Warrior and paladin. 2 monks and a hunter for the front 3. Also no need for the bard at all. You don’t need it for the first dungeon, and by the time you get to the castle, you can APAR 1 square east. Also no need for a thief until the 3rd game. So I use 2 mages and conjured to start. Just fight the undead groups in the early game to level up, and then the castle IIRC APAR 3 UP, 4 North, and 12 East (?). It will put you in the berserker fight. Have all 3 magic users cast MIBL to decimate the ranks. Tons of XP and you can get to level 50 or higher in no time. Monk AC is so low that nothing really touches them and anything they hit dies from blunt trauma - over 2000 hp damage at one point. Hunter pretty much auto crit. When you get to the 3rd game, descend to the bottom of the starter dungeon, and the boss gives like 400,000 xp (I haven’t played this in decades) but when you surface, remove a party member, cast wind dragon or Brothers Kringle to add a new character and teleport back to the spot. I forgot if you automatically get the XP again or if you have to fight the boss, but it only takes seconds. I think I spent an hour or two and was level 1000+. Literally just walked through the game after that and creating a thief that got to level 300 in minutes.

[@pacbilly]

Monks are good for the first two games, but they're the only class that doesn't get a crit weapon in the third game. Everybody says they become worthless in the final dungeon of the third game. And if I'm playing a game just for the sake of enjoyment, the monk is frustrating because you can't equip any of the best gear drops. I guess they're fine if you're just speed-running, but it makes the journey less fun in the meantime. Still, they are really helpful after about level 6 or so. People also say that there's a certain party stat that is based on which character you have in your front line, and for that slot a paladin is best. Now... is it just in the remaster that you don't need a bard for the first dungeon? I could have sworn in earlier versions that the only character who could order wine to get down to the first dungeon was the bard. I like having warriors because when something really cool drops, they can put it to good use. The monk makes gear completely irrelevant for the most part. I really need to try that party composition though. Right now I'm wading through the second game, which is my least favorite. Thief of Fate was my favorite C64 game of all time, and I've been playing on my old C64 party again. I should really go down and try your boss trick in that game.

[@qwerty52676]

I add one Monk out of habit, but imo they were only good in the original game inventory system because they didn't need gear so they would be the quest item carrier. By the end of 2 the enemies have over 4k hp and by the end of 3 some have over 20k so a monk becomes useless. Hunters also become useless once you get a spectre snare or stoneblade on your warrior/paladin-they become a lower hp and worse ac version of that character

[@zarroth]

Monks are great in the first game because each level they gain AC, so you can play regen song for first few levels, then swap to anti-magic song with the bard and never take any damage after around level 6, which is super easy to achieve. There is only 1 fight in the entire game where having 4 monks in front isn't the best setup since they can't use a key weapon, and for that you can use the bard to take a frontal spot for that one fight. It's also true that in BT3, it's better to use something besides monk though, but the bard AC song works based on level in that game, so can put a group of casters plus a bard and a rogue and be fine if you really wanted to. There are options to do this in the legacy settings from the get go however, but that wasn't always the case. As far as monk being useless in the final dungeon, just gear some +hit and they are fine. Get a deaths dagger, which has +hit and also critical hit and they're more than fine. I think a lot of people don't know how to use 'em properly. Just like the OP saying don't take a bard. Has no clue how powerful a bard is in the game and how useful they are throughout all 3 games.

[@nesmandan1037]

@@pacbilly You literally never need the Bard in any of them except for the NES version where it balances out pretty well and caps at level 36.

[@nesmandan1037]

@@zarroth It frankly never mattered with my party. You get to level 1000 and nothing slows you down. Just make sure you have that thief at the end. :)

[@34blackula]

lol I believe I still have my copy of this game somewhere, great times were had with this game. Hopefully this gets an updated version on the market

[@pacbilly]

This is the updated version, came out in 2018 or thereabouts. Tons of Quality of Life improvements over the original trilogy. They also made a fourth one, but it was too much of a departure for me. They should have stuck to the Tolkienesque / D&D art style but they took it in a really weird direction.

[@34blackula]

@@pacbilly I think I remember the 4th one, didn't know they did a remake though. I will have to check that out for old times sake lol

[@qwerty52676]

​@@pacbillyI just wish they would make the encounters in 3 replayable as they did in the first two

[@pacbilly]

@@qwerty52676 Hang on, they are replayable if you have it set to Full XP requirements in Legacy Options. It was the only way to get your party leveled enough to leave the first realm. Turn on Full XP requirements and it should open up replayable encounters. You may have to restart. Dunno.

[@Polaventris]

I barely noticed the errata added in the post.

[@pacbilly]

Subliminal.

[@lasskinn474]

I missed that theres a remake/rerelease

[@pacbilly]

It was on sale on Steam until just a day or two ago. It was like $3.74 in the US. Now it's back up to $14.99. But it goes on sale all the time, so if you put it on your wishlist, you're bound to see it go on sale again, especially with November right around the corner.

[@pacbilly]

It's also on GOG, but it doesn't seem to go on sale as often there.

[@lucasboy]

I will probably botch it up extra good when I sit down with this, but that's part of the fun. I'm glad this is here to help me get the ball rolling, though. Question: if I just take whatever the initial character stat roll is, even if it isn't an ideal one, can I still complete the game? Or is there some cursed set of stats that'll let you get like 93% of the way and hit a wall due to lack of damage or whatever?

[@pacbilly]

It should't do anything but make the beginning a little more difficult, but man, that's a great idea! Play the ball as it lies, so to speak! Oh man, I gotta do this myself! Every time you level, you get a stat point randomly assigned until all your stats are maxed out. So if you grind long enough, eventually it won't be a problem at all. This is a really great idea and I'm glad you brought it up. I can't wait to do it myself.

[@lucasboy]

Once I think up character names, I'm gonna give this a shot. Hope I don't bungle it too badly :)

[@pacbilly]

@@lucasboy Well, your bard has to be a female elf named Bjork. I mean, it's just begging to happen.

[@pacbilly]

And Eddie Wells should be your hitter I mean warrior.

[@pacbilly]

What about Konishi Yasuharu for a wizard?

[@billv4987]

Nice shoutout to Computer Chronicles!

[@pacbilly]

It's my favorite show of all time, as I say in the description to all my Chomputer Cronciles parody videos. Steward Cheifet is on the shortlist of people I'd like to meet.

[@billv4987]

@@pacbilly that show's amazing. I think I've seen all the shows up until 1990. The one where John C Dvorak takes apart the IBM PS/2 and has trouble putting it back together is hilarious.

[@pacbilly]

@@billv4987 Oh I'm WELL FAMILIAR with that episode in particular. kzbin.info/www/bejne/pWKXn62PhdKahtU

[@evcass69]

I still have a late 1980's college notebook with a lot of handwritten clues and maps from BT3. I thought the BT2 puzzles made it hard, whereas BT3 simply swarmed you with many maps & larger quantities of enemies. I miss having the legacy BT3 physical code wheel aka copy protection, and the arrows on the original packaging giving the path for a puzzle. I have 203hrs into the Remaster, playing BT3 malefia many times over. If there's a way to restart over on BT1 without ever losing my current progress, being able to flip between the party's, that'd be cool. But I don't want to risk losing my current game.

[@TransoceanicOutreach]

13:57 - 'I CAST FIREBALL!'

[@pacbilly]

:D

[@johnlacey1453]

I’m just revisiting these games, I played the originals as a small, nerdy child. I don’t remember them as well as I do the Gold Box series, but I don’t have access to those atm. I was wondering what you prefer about the 1st and 3rd game, over the 2nd?

[@pacbilly]

The second one is just kind of a slog. It does add QoL improvements (if you're playing legacy) but there's also more of what's annoying about the first game. More darkness squares. More scripted encounters where combat takes longer. The third game mitigates some of the second game's annoyances because the Geomancer has a lot of nice spells that really add QoL stuff. Plus for the most part I'm not terribly fond of the second game's artwork, as compared to the first and third. Second game just feels the least fun.

[@LogrusUK]

I similarly rewatched this. I never saw the option for other portraits, I wonder if this was added after I started BT2 play through, which is highly likely, as it was seventeen years ago. Or thereabouts.

[@pacbilly]

I think it was a fairly recent addition, actually. Maybe it was introduced around the update that gave us access to the third game. As much as I prefer the art style of the first game, a few of the second game's portraits are nice enough. Don't like the male archmage default though, as seen through the crystal ball or whatever it's supposed to be.

[@LogrusUK]

@@pacbilly Yes, that one is horrible and is what Sly Michael is stuck with in my playthrough...

[@theyetidude]

Monk was my favorite class..

[@pacbilly]

They're great in the early going, but I just hate the fact that they can't use any decent gear. Also in the last dungeon of the third game, all the walkthroughs say they're useless because there's nothing they can equip to instacrit, something necessary for the final battle

[@madcommodore]

Nice remaster, would love it if It Came from the Desert was remastered with lovely Unreal Engine bits for the action and some nice 24bit pixel art.

[@pacbilly]

...As long as they keep the art style, lest it loose its charm. Having read your comment, I now have the Elmer's Service Station theme stuck in my head. Now to give it a proper listen here on KZbin...

[@rtc3000]

Shame that summon elemental doesn’t work here in BT1 😜

[@SonicTheFrenchHorn]

Can you change legacy settings after starting the game?

[@pacbilly]

I just fired the game up to check it, and it looks like you can't change them.

[@elcasho]

I thought Eye of the Beholder 3 was your fave :D

[@pacbilly]

Heresy!

[@SkylineTTurbo]

This was really helpful, I grew up watching my dad play the BT games on our old Apple IIe, and it's always been a personal favorite of mine. I have one question for you, though. You mentioned something about lowering your armor by playing traveler's tunes. What exactly does that mean, because I've heard it elsewhere. To me, that sounds like you'd be lowering your armors stats, and that's never a good thing, right? I'm just a bit confused about that topic. Thanks and great video.

[@pacbilly]

Ah yes! Well you're not lowering your armor, as such. You're lowering you're armor class. There's a thing called THAC0, which means 'To Hit Armor Class 0'... The lower your armor class, the harder you are to hit. Your goal should be to get the armor classes your front line as in the negative as possible. Every piece of armor brings it down so many points, depending on the type of armor it is. There are also magical items--weapons and rings and cloaks--that can decrease your armor class even further. In the playthrough I'm doing with Jim over on the PB&J channel, we're in the first level of the first dungeon, and already our front line guys have armor classes ranging from -3 to -1. kzbin.info/www/bejne/omjHc4F9oKygrs0 Today I just booted up my old C64 save from Bard's Tale III, and it looks like my characters' armor classes are all around -50. I guess one semi-accurate way to look at the negative numbers is a negation in your chances of being hit. I hope this makes sense? Feel free to ask any other questions you have! I love talking about this stuff. Just let me know if you need clarification on my lackluster explanation.

[@CityXen]

Spent a LOT of hours playing Bard's Tales games

[@pacbilly]

The C64 version of the third game is my favorite. I'm still playing the same party from when I got it for Christmas as a kid.

[@larspoulsen618]

For some reason I turned on auto run and don't know how to turn it of. Do you know how to?

[@pacbilly]

In the upper left and right border of the viewport, there are icons for dropdown menus. Isn't it in one of those? Not the border of the screen itself but the fancy border surrounding where you're looking and where the monsters appear. I THINK I remember it being in one of those icon sets that drops down. Does this make sense?

[@larspoulsen618]

@@pacbilly Thank you for your reply, Have tried everything. Think its a bug from steam

[@larspoulsen618]

@@pacbilly And its not just running in town it keeps scrolling when you have multiple menu options such as spells, choosing characters and shoosing inventory. Think something is wrong

[@pacbilly]

@@larspoulsen618 Something definitely sounds wrong! I didn't even think the game capable of that. Is there a controller or second keyboard somewhere leaning up against something? Or maybe a thumbstick on a plugged-in-but-not-in-use controller is drifting? The game does support controllers. That's the only other thing I can think of, some extra input device you may not be aware of wreaking havoc.

[@Trusteft]

So many things to say. 1. Excellent video, very helpful as i plan on playing the trilogy, "eventually". 2. at 04:07 is that a super depressed Mickey Mouse? 3. You are white? I always thought you were South Korean. Very handsome btw. 4. I will rewatch the video just before I play the trilogy, whenever that is. Added to my favs. Thank you.

[@krugec23]

Same gotta rewatch it several times to get the class changes etc... Pacbilly reminded me I gotta continue BT1 :)

[@pacbilly]

Ha, that ain't me! It's a meme photo of Rich Evans from RedLetterMedia with Billy Bob from Showbiz Pizza kzbin.info/www/bejne/nqjYYmdobLKIf6c

[@Trusteft]

@@pacbilly Wow. Thanks, I had no idea. So there is still hope you are (racially) South Korean. Nice.

[@pacbilly]

@@Trusteft For you, buddy, I'll try to make that happen, but there's a chance I might miss and accidentally be North Korean.

[@Trusteft]

@@pacbilly Well, I am willing for you to take that risk. Good luck and thank you. :)

[@geofftottenperthcoys9944]

Played the crap out of this on the C64 and Amiga! I do like the newer version too.

[@understyled]

Was Ricky on Computer Chronicles too??

[@pacbilly]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/nX7dZZ2taq10hK8

[@elcasho]

PB&J run through. Do it! :)

[@judgegroovyman]

I would love this too. Brilliant!

[@pacbilly]

You know, we could take the old D&D party through. Clairic would have to become a monk, of course, and if we didn't want too many extra party members, we could turn off individual game differences, which would give us two open slots, theoretically. Hmm... This might be worth a shot.

[@pacbilly]

It's up, thanks to your suggestion!

[@pacbilly]

​@@judgegroovyman If you check your feed, you'll notice that you guys' wish is our command...

[@TheEloHim3]

Wait turn auto mapping off?

[@pacbilly]

I think I phrased it poorly in the video. To leave auto-mapping on, you have to uncheck the box, so essentially turning off the feature leaves auto-mapping on. I guess the best way to say it would be leave that box unchecked so that auto-mapping stays on.

[@Dethmeister]

I like 16bit pixel art better but this hand drawn style is ok.

[@pacbilly]

I like it because it's really the only way to update the original 16-bit graphics and still maintain the same aesthetic.

[@judgegroovyman]

I like your party layout and will probably use that but if I really want a second magic user who should I kick out of the party? P.S. I love the names you used from your Chomputer Chronicles series!

[@pacbilly]

You should kick out the rogue. I like having them for chests, but if you double up on conjurors, you'll have twice as much chest opening power from the outset. Then when they're ready to change classes, you could make one a magician and one a sorcerer, then they could both end on Wizard, if you want. Another option would be to lose one of your three front line guys and put the bard up there. But the bard is really a terrible front line fighter. I may do this myself, though, just for the extra challenge.

[@pacbilly]

Alternately you could turn off miscellaneous game differences in Legacy Options, which would give you a seventh slot, but I kind of liked the limitations the first game put on you, and it makes it more of a reward when you advance to the second game to see a few more features open up. But it's another option.

[@drgrockster]

you don't need a bard to enter the first dungeon you just need to order wine.

[@pacbilly]

The bard is the only character he'll offer wine to. The option only shows up for the bard.

[@drgrockster]

@@pacbilly not sure which version of the game you have but in my one i don't have a bard in the party.

[@pacbilly]

@@drgrockster In the original Bard's Tale they would only offer wine to the bard. I had always assumed it was that way and never tried to order a drink with anyone else. I guess they changed that for the remaster. Even in legacy mode, it appears you no longer need a bard.

[@drgrockster]

@@pacbilly I just loaded the original apple II version roms of bards tale on applewin emulator and i can confirm you do not need a bard in your party to order wine from the tavern in rakhir street.

[@drgrockster]

Perhaps there was a different version of the game that had this? I guess we will never know lol

[@Flackon]

Sounds like a pain. Amazing the bs we had to put up with when playing old school games...

[@pacbilly]

The only real BS comes if you turn off automap and group inventory. The rest of the game is really fun, and the QoL stuff they added is pretty nice.

[@Flackon]

@@pacbilly I mean the things about being locked out of late game drops if you don't plan your class changes ahead of time and whatnot. That seems like very old game design. How is a first time player supposed to know the order in which to level up the spellcasters for the moment they reach the late game?

[@pacbilly]

@@Flackon I just looked it up, and it looks like the only piece of gear that's Wizard-only is the WizWand, which casts Prime Summoning, a level 4 Wizard spell costing 12 magic points. So it's a spell that you would have if you already completed wizard and were on to Sorcerer. I guess the benefit is that it would save you those spell points, but honestly it's not something you can't live without.

[@Omegamedia313]

your cool asl. Thats all I have say.

[@pacbilly]

Ha, cheers! If you're playing BT and you have any questions, I'm happy to offer more hints & tips, especially on the first game.