Passenger Causes DUAL ENGINE FAILURE | Accident Case Study

[@PilotInstituteAirplanes]

Consider subscribing for more case studies - coming soon!

[@zdenekkindl2778]

More case studies? You mean this was not the last accident? Do people have desire to crush every plane they fly on? Wow.

[@ahlee7472]

​@@zdenekkindl2778 case studies is meant to reduce the crash, but we can only reduce the possibility, not totally eliminate

[@Great-Documentaries]

The 60 year old pilot was former Oklahoma University quarterback Steve Davis and his friend was 58 year old Wes Caves. Let's actually use their names since they are responsible.

[@RWBHere]

That pilot's casual attitude (I'm being very polite there) caused the death of the two front seat occupants, and the serious injury of three other people. Not to mention the grief caused to at least two families. All for a 'bit of fun'. I'm shuddering at his totally reckless attitude and sheer stupidity.

[@christarwitch]

😊😅😅​@@zdenekkindl2778

[@shooter7a]

We had a wealthy family friend who had turbine aircraft for personal use. He was a pilot himself, but always hired a professional pilot to operate this plane. He knew that he did not have enough time to maintain expertise in such a complicated aircraft (this was the 80s-90s). He always sat co-pilot, but he made it very clear that once the door closed, his employee, the hired professional pilot, WAS THE BOSS.

[@Gantradies]

huh. unironically a good boss from the sound of it..

[@amgguy4319]

I knew a doctor with a King Air who always hired a Pilot & Co-pilot. It was 1979 and I still remember him saying, "I don't take chances I don't have to." I think at the time the King Air was considered the safest... I was a teen and had no idea what he meant.

[@Xerdar36]

Very smart man…

[@geroutathat]

How did he become weatlhy from being a pilot?

[@shooter7a]

@@geroutathat he was a recreational pilot....not a professional. He made his money in construction.

[@psubond]

One of my squadron ready rooms had the following painted on the wall: "Truly exceptional pilots do not put themselves in situations that require them to use their exceptional skills"

[@deucedeuce1572]

I wouldn't assume guilt of the pilot, but I think it's a possibility that he set up the failure, so he could then save everyone and prove how great of a pilot he is... but then he failed to be as good as he thought. It is possible that the copilot/passenger made the mistake too though. We'll probably never know the truth for certain.

[@tunkunrunk]

looks like some novice private pilots never take time to know their plane , whether they trash the user manual to the bin , or they think it's non essential . To me , for a true planes lover , the cockpit is a place where we would spend hours looking at all the wonders of switches , levers , dials , screens , buttons and we would spend days trying to learn how all of them work .

[@Dxn6alc03Belod7m1o]

Applies to many things in life, really . . .

[@tinkeringtim7999]

​@tunkunrunk There's a good video on the dunning-kruger effect in the context of aviation. This seems to be an example of that to me.

[@Razm-a-Tazzi]

@@tinkeringtim7999 Would love to have a link to that video, tinkeringtim!

[@eldoradoboy]

flying with friends.. creates a whole different dynamic.. I fly with a friend of mine a few times a year.. ( im not a pilot yet though i have solo'd a single engine prop).. he briefs everyone who flies with him before we even board the plane that he will instruct us when casual conversation is permitted.. and will call out sterile cockit when casual conversation is not permitted. when curious people are aboard, he sets up a camera and records from the rear of the cockpit... thus avoiding the "what does this do and what is that" questions that would always come about as part of a flight.. he will watch the video with anyone who wishes after the flight and then questions and casual talk about what he is doing is handled.. I love his approach...

[@Mightiflier]

Very cool

[@Dxn6alc03Belod7m1o]

Brilliant. And a true leader.

[@johnnunn8688]

Sounds like a paragon, good on him. 👍

[@jonslg240]

ONE THING about ATC *REALLY BUGS ME* on this one. If you know they have no engines, WHY would you tell them to GO AROUND just because they don't have landing gear out? They have far better chances of surviving a belly landing than going around. In fact, it's IMPOSSIBLE for them to go around if they have no engines in operation. That seems like beyond negligence. In fact, that seems like PURE stupidity to me. Edit: I'm mainly posting this to seek an explanation for why they'd instruct him to go around, knowing both engines are inoperable

[@jasonb4370]

That is a great idea I'll do that

[@prayerpatroller]

Showing off in front of his college buddy. Humility is so essential for everything.

[@ericsalidbar1693]

Seriously I can only fly using instruments I have no sense of direction in the sky. I've flown with a senior professional pilot many times he was a great teacher but I wasn't actually being taught he just let me fly. He did the yearly inspections at John Wayne airport and he could land at Catalina like it was a regular runway. He never let me land or play with anything else he was a really great teacher.

[@deucedeuce1572]

Yeah, Despite the passengers mistakes, I think this is 100% on the pilot and no one else.

[@oneanddone7992]

@@deucedeuce1572 Aside from the pilot's complete dereliction of safety and common sense, when the passenger said, "...[pull the thrust levers] all the way back?", the pilot should have said, "no, not all the way, that will shut down the engines - just to the next-to-last click." And by the way, what in the name of all things aviation was the pilot thinking by allowing a non-rated pilot _to help prepare a jet for landing_ .

[@Vousie]

@@oneanddone7992 This was definitely the pilot's mistake - he's the pilot there, thus it was his responsibility, not his friend's. But I do wonder, what kind of a design is that to put the idle and cutoff commands right next to each other? In other planes, the engine cutoff switch is completely separate from the thrust levers.

[@3BK235Y]

The word "humble" comes from the Latin "humus", which means "ground". A humble man is a man who is realistic about his abilities and skills, and exercises moderation in the appreciation of the things he has. He doesn't think of himself as more nor less than what he is. A humble man is a down-to-earth man in reference to himself. That means that a humble man never thinks that nobody is better than him, but he also believes that he is, or can be, better than many people. Being humble doesn't mean denying your abilities and skills. An intelligent man doesn't have to convince himself that he's stupid in order to be humble, nor does a beautiful woman have to convince herself that she's ugly. That's why humility is such a difficult virtue (in the classical Greek sense αρετή). To achieve it, we have to come to a precise assessment and understanding of our virtues and vices, weaknesses and strengths, in reference to the other human beings we live with. Let's not forget about false humility - bashful self-abasement - , but that is another thing..

[@wm.tomlinson1434]

This was PILOT error. The pilot was instructing another NON-JET QUALIFIED pilot in a jet with which he was totally unfamiliar . The passenger cooperated but the PILOT was the one who was at fault here.

[@captlarry-3525]

the passenger/pilot kept saying he was uncomfortable, and recognized he was far behind the aircraft. If only he had refused to play co-pilot .

[@thewisewolf768]

@@captlarry-3525 Yeah, really had me thinking about how potentially bad peer/social pressure can go. If he had felt just a bit more comfortable saying no. They might both be alive. I'm not assigning blame to the passenger at all, but it's something to think about.

[@levanataylor790]

Yeah, he knew well that Alex would scoff at him if he refused to "play jet pilot" -- the proper answer is "You can call me chicken all you like but I intend to live to cackle another day." If he had that kind of sense he might not have been friends with Alex in the first place.

[@roxcastaneda]

In my opinion, terrible things happen when people are too nice to say things that are wrong clearly and out loud.

[@km077]

Exactly, the cause was literally the pilot forcing a passenger to operate the trust levers without any supervision or accordance to procedures and warnings whatsoever.

[@CheekyMonkey1776]

This is why I always avoided flying on my company’s corporate plane. The pilot was the President of my division and often volunteered his services to gain flight time. I would make every excuse in the book to miss his departure and fly commercial.

[@user-jt5vm3mi1w]

Seems like an invalid reason

[@donnarupert4926]

@CheekyMonkey….😮‍💨Whew, I don’t blame you pal!!

[@jrambo7495]

@cheekymonkey1776 smart thinking!!

[@mikhailiagacesa3406]

@@user-jt5vm3mi1w why?

[@jeremylawson6648]

I’m a photographer & traveled with a race team for a season that was my first experience with small planes, someone we knew was killed in a small plans crash that year. I still prefer to not fly small crafts.

[@crownviclx2000]

“The cockpit makes a terrible classroom”. 😂. Love this.

[@arosnett]

Same goes for driving practice with my teenage daughters😂

[@deucedeuce1572]

Yeah, but at times it's the only classroom. Every pilot has to fly for the first couple times... and in every case he is learning with a pilot reviewing and teaching him as he flies. Even with modern simulations, a pilot still has to fly for the first time for real and learn to actually pilot a plane. (Although AI may soon take over flight).

[@falconwaver]

Mentour Pilot might disagree.

[@danmartens8855]

@@falconwaver He flies a simulator cockpit for training.

[@danmartens8855]

It's a pass/fail class. There is no respawn if you fail.

[@RubenKelevra]

Pilot: "we lost all power, no hydraulics, plane barely manovreable" ATC: "no gears, go around" 💀

[@AntonioPeralesdelHierro]

@RubenKekevra. Yesss❗

[@leexgx]

When the engines were shut down, they shouldn’t have told them to go around Should’ve just done a belly landing

[@ascherlafayette8572]

They totally could've survived a belly landing. That go around was the nail in the coffin.

[@RubenKelevra]

@@ascherlafayette8572 yeah at least it added a lot of stress duration making the outcome likely worse.

[@rhyoliteaquacade]

@@leexgx Yeah the ATC should not have made that a command. Had they belly landed they might have all survived.

[@somestuffithoughtyoumightl6985]

This is a textbook example of the worst kind of pilot; no procedure, no respect for limitations and no knowledge of aircraft systems. All this led to several missed opportunities to correct the problems he created. I can guarantee this pilot should have failed his last recurrent check.

[@somestuffithoughtyoumightl6985]

@RetreadPhoto Experience is always a factor, be it total or model specific. Insurance companies often decide what experience is required (not a terrible system as they are risk averse). My main issue here is with the atrocious attitude towards safety and complete lack of professionalism.

[@marcelogouveia9614]

If you're riding a skateboard... it's best you know what you're doing eh!

[@bobbykeene12]

Well, in a roundabout way, he certainly did fail his last check.

[@MiguelAlejandro1969]

If both engines go out at least look at the location of the throttles. That would give clues as to why they were turned off. Immediately ready for ignition. In seconds.​@RetreadPhoto

[@jjsifo1]

No respect.

[@seaskimmer9071]

"Aviation in itself is not inherently dangerous. But to an even greater degree than the sea, it is terribly unforgiving of any carelessness, incapacity, or neglect." (Anon.)

[@Triple_J.1]

Google says: Captain Alfred G. Lamplugh, a British pilot and Principle Surveyor for The British Aviation Insurance Co., Ltd., is credited with saying, “Aviation in itself is not inherently dangerous. But to an even greater degree than the sea, it is terribly unforgiving of any carelessness, incapacity or neglect”

[@scottpatterson4105]

Actually it is inherently dangerous because of the affore mentioned, and other issues.

[@somealias-zs1bw]

It's inherently extremely dangerous. Insanely complicated machines with hundreds of thousands of parts that must work flawlessly, moving at hundreds of miles an hour through oftentimes severe weather and filled with large volumes of highly flammable fuel that is apt to explode when subjected to airframe damage. And that's just the machine and the environment, not even taking into account the human factor. Indeed, when you think about how many things have to go exactly right for any given flight to not end up as a massive fireball, it's a wonder it is as safe as it is.

[@scottpatterson4105]

​@@somealias-zs1bwYet it is statistically proven to be vastly safer than automobile or horse travel.

[@robodabbler]

@@scottpatterson4105 By dint of strict regulations and requirement, and an extremely structured safety culture whose rules are 'written in blood.'

[@Roy-gi5ul]

We've seen this sort of thing so many times with supercars and rich drivers who are totally out of their depth. They seem unable or unwilling to accept that wealth and privilege do not imbue them with ability and good sense. It always ends in tears!

[@tyrotrainer765]

Brian May of the group Queen is a brilliant exception. Mega rich but he opted to be a line pilot for Easy Jet in the UK.

[@MetsterAnn]

@@tyrotrainer765huh?

[@gregculverwell]

I think the problem is that in business they can bullshit their way to success, but out in the real world competence is the only thing that matters.

[@therealchayd]

@@tyrotrainer765 I don't think Brian May holds an ATPL, on the other hand Bruce Dickinson of Iron Maiden does, and did fly for a charter airline for a while until it went under (but not Easyjet), and now owns an FBO in Cardiff, Wales.

[@boathousedave2383]

The same mentality when people ignore gun safety rules that end in tragedy

[@jimmiller5600]

Some of my wealthy friends ask me if they should fly their own aircraft. Some I say "sure". Others fall into "you can't take "no" as an answer" or "you won't follow the rules that keep you alive".

[@burnerjack01]

Flying, like motorcycling, just “ain’t for everybody “. All the money and training in the world won’t save you if you cannot resist the urge to panic.

[@stscc01]

Exactly right. Flying a plane isn't advisable for everyone. If you can't take advice, have a problem taking orders, and hate to read manuals, you better let somebody else do the flying and relax in the cabin as a passenger...

[@Triple_J.1]

People who take orders are the ones who aren't fit to fly. Fly the wing. Speed = Q Angle of Attack = lift coefficient. "Elevator" sets angle of attack. Do not exceed 15 degrees AoA unless in an F/A-18 with both blowers lit.

[@stscc01]

@jj4791 have you ever flown a plane yourself? And no, flight Sims don't count here... If you don't follow the orders of ATC, you get a number to call the first time, and if you continue not to follow orders you'll soon have a problem, because you don't have a license anymore.

[@friedceleron]

even flight simmers listen to ATC. guy doesn't know what he's talking about ​@@stscc01

[@scottmoseley5122]

This rates right up there with the AeroFlot captain letting his 15 year old take controls and "Fly" the plane into the ground. why oh why.

[@johnwayne2103]

I believe it was his son who was messing with the auto pilot and the PIC becoming confused as to why it was on and it showed no indication in the Co-Pilots chair.

[@TMD2978]

iirc he turned the ap off by accident when moving the yoke, and for some reason there wasn't an ap off alarm

[@PressRecord777]

If it's the crash I'm thinking of, the AP was somehow "partially" engaged/disengaged, or at least engaged without the PIC's knowledge, and his attempt to manually execute a turn caused the AP to "correct" for the change in direction, which caused the plane to start to roll. The harder he fought (unknowingly) against the AP, the more severe the roll became, until it was ultimately unrecoverable. If he had just taken his hands off the yoke when the issue first presented, the AP would have resumed normal flight, giving him opportunity to troubleshoot.

[@johnh8705]

They passed the landing portion of the test.

[@deucedeuce1572]

Damn, I'm gonna have to look that one up. Sounds like both situations would be the fault of the pilot and no one else.

[@franfran6152]

I think this is mislabeled. This absolutely IS pilot error. Pushing an unqualified and uncomfortable passenger to control the plane in a critical phase of flight is foolish and dangerous.

[@randall2665]

Agreed. His attempt to show off was infuriating

[@julienb5815]

4:30 love how a controller asking for a go around was enough to fix the engine... A pity they didn't just land without gear though, might have ended up better :/

[@EricTheBlue2010]

That was my thought too. Had they come in gear up they might've made it

[@mowtivatedmechanic1172]

@@EricTheBlue2010you are correct.

[@Bax60]

All he had to do was pull the emergency gear handle all the way out and the main gear would have extended .If he would have practiced that in the simulator at flight safety where he likely got his type rating ,he would have known this .

[@julienb5815]

@@Bax60 well, sure, with all gears down would have been the better scenario, but it looks like that wasn't a day to be too picky about those little details 👀

[@Bax60]

@@julienb5815 Its not about being picky, it's about flying the airplane properly and using the checklist. And you have to do it that way every single time.The bottom line here is this never had to happen .Even after he made rhe bad decision to let the unqualified pilot pull the throttles in to cutoff ...all he had to do is run the engine out checklist and restart the engines ..there was never a need to pull the emergency gear handle yet ...and if you are going to pull it ,pull lt out all the way ,and the gear comes down...it's better to land with no gear ,than just the nose gear ...This whole thing went south because the pilot just did not follow checklist procedures for a double flameout of the engines.He had plenty of time altitude and airspeed for a restart..he got one relit ,so climb back out and run the checklist and start the other one ..This aircraft will fly just fine on one engine for hours ...no need to hurry

[@coffeeisgood102]

I was friends with a guy who was a commercial pilot. During conversation I was stunned when he casually told me that he doesn’t pay attention to weight restrictions as in his view the plane can handle much heavier loads than what the charts say. I had never ridden in a plane with him and after learning this there is no way I would ever get in a plane with him at the controls.

[@deucedeuce1572]

Weight restrictions rarely ever come into play, in the fact that the pilot will almost always have plenty of space to take off and land... and the weather rarely ever creates problems with weight... but it DOES HAPPEN. There are definitely situations in which the weight restrictions become important (and crashes have happened, because of it). They always make the restrictions a little excessive, so a lot of pilots ignore them... but the reason they're excessive, is because they're accounting for the rare situations and weather that pilots will run into on occasion (Like landing/taking off on shorter runways and landing at high altitudes or during certain weather events, like abnormally low pressure or tailwinds if I'm not mistaken). I'm no pilot and know very little, so I can't say for sure... but that's just a couple things I've heard over the years when I've read/heard about other crashes.

[@nevillegoddard4966]

​@@deucedeuce1572 Letting a pilot decide what regulations/rules they're gonna follow is a recipe for disaster. There's not only the weight, but the balance of the plane. The aircraft may not have enough trim adjustment. Limits are set for a reason.

[@UncleKennysPlace]

@@deucedeuce1572 Actually, flying 10% over gross will severely impact the climb rate of a small plane. In Alaska, it is allowed.

[@allenelswick6961]

I know what the pilot was telling you and if he is flying cargo all those cargo planes can handle some extra weight past the limit set for said aircraft.

[@alexsis1778]

Weight restrictions are usually (but not always) a limitation of the landing gear. As long as you have a sufficiently long runway you can takeoff "overweight". Commercial flights do this all the time with the intent being they burn enough fuel in flight to get them under their max landing weight by the time they arrive at their destination. This is why sometimes when planes have issues and need to return but are flyable (and don't have a fuel dump ability) they may end up circling for hours. Of course in an emergency getting the plane down is more important than excessive wear on the landing gear and returning immediately is always an option. Without knowing whether he's intending to land above the gear's max weight or he's taking off above it its hard to really judge too harshly without full knowledge of the comment. But at the same time its definitely not a good sign in combination with his other attitudes. That being said a good engineer knows users are idiots and always puts in a safety margin. If they told the public that it would support 13,000 you can pretty much guarantee that its probably rated to 15,000 if not more. Not to say it can take those loads every time without failing early but if maintained properly its not going to immediately collapse if you exceed the max. You just may have to replace parts of the gear after.

[@intheshell35ify]

No room for rich arrogance when you're piloting. He didn't fly the plane. The plane flew him to a smoking crater.

[@tjroelsma]

Agreed, this Alex sounds totally clueless and never even came close to grasping the emergency of the situation.

[@Bax60]

The guy had enough altitude and airspeed to just calmly run the checklists and relit both engines .That's the sad reality here. .Never panic ,but straighten up and fly right immediately after you find yourself in an unusual situation like this

[@lebojay]

@@acbulgin2Well said. There’s no reason to think this guy was especially arrogant because he was rich. It looks to me like just the normal amount of arrogance, coupled with enough money to finance some potentially very risky activities.

[@lebojay]

@@acbulgin2The crash of Sikorsky S-76 C-GIMR was similar in that respect. It belonged to the organization I worked for at the time. Without being a training pilot or briefing the situation, the PIC was instructing the FO on how to perform a black hole approach - while performing an actual black hole approach. That meant that there was no pilot monitoring. They descended into the trees and totalled the aircraft. Fortunately they suffered only serious but non-life-threatening injuries from the CFIT. Interestingly, the PIC swore up and down during the investigation that he suffered a compressor stall. I’m sure he thought he did, but the investigation revealed that the thumping he heard was actually the sound of his rotor hitting trees. The same organization lost a hull and crew a couple years later during a black hole departure, also due to neither pilot assuming PM duties, among other factors. That one was C-GIMY, also a CFIT.

[@longshot7601]

I see this attitude a lot with cars. Many think that just because they can afford a fast car they can drive that car fast.

[@rossbabcock3790]

I spent 6 years in Naval aviation and another 4 in civilian aviation as ground support. Checklists and procedures are written for a reason, usually in blood. The ultimate responsibility is the Pilot in Command.

[@BarryHoffman-g4o]

ATC - N26DK your gear is not down. Perform an engines out go around. Those Air Traffic Controllers are geniuses.

[@Darkvirgo88xx]

They definitely need remedial training ive never heard something so dumb.

[@cpl_0503]

My guess is, that instruction was a CYA call, not a call they thought he could follow. I make the assumption the controllers are at least as smart and tuned in as the rest of us. With that assumption, I would guess they just want it on record they told him and waived him off.

[@cpking7]

It seems that although the pilots were not communicating, air traffic control could see they had managed to restart one of the engines. This is what powered their way to coming around for another landing attempt.

[@PRH123]

​@@Darkvirgo88xx the aircraft indeed did do a go around, what exactly was dumb?

[@jamesdozier3722]

They would have been better off doing a belly landing on the runway. Hindsight is a bitch. The whole thing is just sad.

[@exponentmantissa5598]

My father for a while was involved as a MD on accident investigation teams. I remember him saying that there are some pilots who should not have a license. He further divided that group into two categories, those with substance abuse issues and those that have an intrinsically bad attitude towards safety and routines. I remember him saying that by far and away the biggest cause of crashes was a malfunction(s) compounded by pilot error(s).

[@secondskins-nl]

Think is that substance abuse also can work well to get overconfident of your own abilities as a pilot. Well, if it's cocaine, but alcohol won't make you a better pilot as well. In a way I can kind of understand those people who are rich, and everything/everyone is lifting their ego, they are successful, and nothing can harm them. They get the idea they literally can't fail and have the idea checklists and rules are mainly for lesser people who need the guidance. Pretty misplaced form of arrogance if it's about flying but you see the same with expensive race cars etc. especially sad for the passengers.

[@rhyoliteaquacade]

Arrogance is a big factor. While would love to fly planes, and have a good knowledge of their systems, I recognize that there are a number of skills I would be lacking. I think panicking under stress might kill me, and my passengers as they sleep soundly behind me.

[@klausstock8020]

I am also aware of MDs who will certify rich people as "fit" if they clearly aren't.

[@franklofarojr.2969]

​@@klausstock8020but also, FAA medical rules are too strict. If you ever been in anything less than perfect health, it's going to be very hard to get a pilot's license even for private

[@burnerjack01]

Some of the final clues, such as the partially extended emergency gear down lever gives me the hunch that the pilot began to panic, further hampering his ability to think withe resolute clarity. After that, it was all over but the crying.

[@chrisbeauchamp5563]

I agree, I’m assuming once an engine is relit you would leave the main battery on. Going back to standby seems strange and could indicate panic.

[@somealias-zs1bw]

Probably the first time he had to use that emergency lever, maybe he had no idea how far he had to yank it. Or just fudged it under stress. Either way, what a stupid way to die. After all the stupidity that went into putting himself into that situation in the first place, the flight would have ended with both the aircraft and his body perfectly intact if he had just tugged on that lever a little harder.

[@pukaseek]

@@somealias-zs1bwthat lever needs to be redesigned. Reminds me of a knob on a analog watch where the first detent sets hours and second detent sets day. But screwing up a watch knob won’t kill anyone.

[@deucedeuce1572]

Yeah, some people were claiming ignorance, but I think it could have been panic and negligence/incompetence.

[@Vousie]

Or quite possibly - given his earlier actions - he told his the passenger to pull the emergency gear down lever instead of doing it himself...

[@sirtom3011]

Oh so in his mind, he was playing the role of “super experienced I know everything” with the guy that hasn’t flown for years. And that became the center focus of his mind instead of the safety of the aircraft.

[@LaRossaMusic]

“Don’t worry about the overspeed warning guy just keep working those throttles” I’m sorry WHATTTT

[@intheshell35ify]

Pretty sure there are some really smart engineers building the plane to certain parameters. It's not like a car or motorcycle.

[@LexipMedia]

That's the attitude of a pilot who never learned to appreciate handling a clean, fast airplane. Even when i was just transitioning from slower Cessnas to a Mooney 201, many years ago, the instructor kept reminding me that "in this airplane you can not both slow down and go down at the same time". In studying this accident I see the poorly-trained right seat pilot failing to appreciate that he is flying a high-performance aircraft as he repeatedly busts Vne trying to descend the aircraft.

[@mowtivatedmechanic1172]

@@LexipMediapitch for airspeed and power for altitude

[@AntonioPeralesdelHierro]

🌿🏆🌿🍷😉👌

[@SeekingTheLoveThatGodMeans7648]

just a LITTLE too fast, no biggie

[@DeltaVTX]

I’ve been in aviation for a while, but never flew with real pros until recently. I appreciate the good pilots that keep us safe.

[@KuostA]

absolutely mindblowingly dumbfounding incompetence, ineptitude, and wantan reckless disregard for airmanship and safety smfh

[@dgcastellanos]

Brains don’t always process properly during intense stress which is why it’s important to stay calm. Who knows what else happened during those last 7 minutes.

[@andrewmaclean9810]

@@dgcastellanos This is what checklists are for. Idc how well I think I know my procedures, I will always be reaching for that checklist especially in emergencies. The last 7 minutes are of course a mystery and at that point the mistakes make sense due to task saturation but they never would have been in that situation to begin with if they were flying with a modicum of responsibility. So sad.

[@realSethMeyers]

Wanton*

[@goodbonezz1289]

@@realSethMeyerswas just checking if anyone else caught/corrected that…nice.

[@crownviclx2000]

@@dgcastellanosprolly getting a sloppy toppy from his college buddy

[@Strahan740i]

I'd never want to buy a house near an airstrip. Imagine you're sitting there in your recliner, relaxing and watching TV when a jet decides to drop by for a visit. Yikes.

[@Wecanhelp]

I’ve been to a house just under lax airport the houses are ridiculously cheap in those areas but during the day the landing it’s loud

[@davidmotter5140]

Thats ridiculous and stupid

[@Strahan740i]

@@davidmotter5140 Tell that to the people in the house.

[@explodethebomb]

An extremely unlikely event. "I'd never want to buy a house near a road. Imagine you're sitting there in your recliner, relaxing and watching TV when a car decides to drive through your wall for a visit. Yikes"

[@elisehalflight]

@@explodethebomb To be fair the noise and the fumes are no joke

[@RaulEduardoDTrewethanLozano]

This is by far the best study case I've seen on youtube!

[@KymCrane]

My dad and brother-in-law were the two passengers, and only survivors, on this airplane. This was a tragic event that we are reminded of everyday from the permanent injuries they sustained. It changed our lives forever.

[@Oliver-q8k]

Another unfortunate example of why you should not fly on a plane piloted by someone who does not fly for a living.

[@nevillegoddard4966]

​@@Oliver-q8k More like an example of why a pilot should not allow someone who is not qualified to fly a plane.

[@DeirdreMcNamara]

both! @@nevillegoddard4966

[@Shadi2]

Did they hear the overspeed warnings when the pilot was letting his friend fuck around with their lives?

[@sayorancode]

it must suck to be the guy that is listed as a ground injury , dude was just minding his/her bussissness and got hit by a plane

[@francoislepine4698]

Thirty years ago I happened to be on a very expensive west coast (halfway to Alaska) fly-in ocean sport fishing trip paid for by an industrial supplier. (The owner of the company I worked for could not make it and he gave his seat as a perk). The 20 people on this trip were all in civil construction from companies all over BC and Alberta. Sitting in the lodge one night, the conversation turned to very successful owners who had purchased planes over the years......and crashed. The amazing part is that everybody in the room could recall/tell a story of somebody they knew or heard of in that industry that had died in a small plane accident!!! Chilling! The moral of the story is probably: All of a sudden you're successful and could buy your own plane....maybe you should keep working until you're REALLY successful and can afford a PILOT....to fly the plane....in the meantime flying first class ain't that bad, eh?

[@michelchaman6495]

i love watching these, they scare me so bad i always make sure my procedures are good and i think about situations and emergencies. Thank you for these. You've prob saved more lives than u know from these.

[@Dxn6alc03Belod7m1o]

Glad they help you. I, personally, am so afraid of flying in ANYTHING now, that these case studies just make me sure that I've made the right decision. (I'm not a pilot). But I've worried for years that a plane will crash into my house and kill or injure me, like it did in this scenario. Gotta focus on the probability as compared to falling off my step-stool . . .

[@johnnymentero6313]

@BomalNeloAnagrm300 I was in a cruise liner for a few years. There I learned that in many respects, you're safer in a ship at sea than in land, especially in regards to planes. They're in constant communication with coast guards, weather stations, other ships, and planes. They know in which direction, speed, etc, everyone is moving to ensure not to be on each other's way, and to get out of the way. They're also informed immediately about anyone who's in trouble. You can't know any of this if - like you said - you're sitting in a house in land. Can't do anything about it either.

[@aeomaster32]

Well done story. It's all about attitude. I was always highly concerned about being caught in a situation I couldn't handle, so made sure to be fluent in emergency procedures, and also put my imagination to work in extracting myself from hypothetical scary scenarios. Some told me I "worried too much". My reply was let them know there were plenty of pilots who didn't do that if they preferred a more casual operation. This story is a sad example of someone who didn't "worry enough" about dealing with the unexpected.

[@737tech]

Seems very dangerous to have the fuel shutoff built into the throttle. One bad muscle memory could be a disaster

[@barbecueman6352]

I was thinking the same thing fuel shut off really shouldn’t be on the throttle

[@RedArrow73]

A foretaste of "Flying Cars", amigos.

[@jamescollier3]

yeah. not going to happen

[@bobbykeene12]

An autonomous airborne drone class transportation fleet for human beings is probably 25-30 years out, but there won't be any human control involved. You just get in, give it your destination and whoosh- Off you go. 99.999% of the time you won't die.

[@zsigzsag]

@@bobbykeene12 Hopefully you won't run into birds, hail, micro burst even volcanic ash.

[@xiaoyaoxu134]

@@bobbykeene12 not much difference from commercial flights right now then

[@bobbykeene12]

@@zsigzsag That stuff will not factor in, the system will probably use existing roadways as flight paths 90% of the time, never go more than 40 feet above the ground and leverage vertical flight while coordinating peer to peer to maximize efficiency and reduce congestion. Range will probably be max of 80 miles.

[@peanutbutter2597]

Even piloting a Cessna 172 is serious business 😮

[@russellmoore5711]

And don’t ever let anyone tell you it’s not.

[@cturdo]

The tower knew they had no power or hydraulics and they should have just made the first landing and sort it out later.

[@neilkurzman4907]

Don’t blame the tower. He could’ve gone in. They told him his gear was up. He could’ve kept going.

[@bwalker4194]

I do blame the tower for complicating a nasty situation. 30 yr controller here and adding extra stress by telling a deadstick-landing pilot to go around is ridiculous. He could have just calmly questioned “verify gear-up landing?”

[@neilkurzman4907]

@@bwalker4194 After reading the first comment about that, I thought it was pretty strange to tell pilot with no engines to go around. And then watch the entire video. And while stupid, it had absolutely nothing to do with the crash. When he came around the second time and crashed. They let him know only his nose gear was down. at that point he had a functioning flyable aircraft and should have gone back up in the air got it fully functional and then landed.

[@JapanesePiano1]

@@neilkurzman4907 "Go around, go around, I repeat go around, go around." Hop off the tower's lap. And it absolutely did have something to do with the crash. There are always many factors that lead to an accident. The pilots incompetence was only one.

[@neilkurzman4907]

@@JapanesePiano1 And the pilot can say unable. But it had nothing to do with this crash. He, we gained his engines and was able to takeoff. He then went to land without fully recovering the aircraft. At that point, it was no longer an emergency. I certainly think it’s strange to tell a plane with no engines to go around. But in the end, it didn’t contribute to the crash. We’re also assuming this guy could’ve made a successful belly landing the first time. Since he failed the second time.

[@oscarnovember]

Instructing an aircraft to go around with dual engine failure was just hilarious.

[@BrilliantDesignOnline]

Nurse: "Wake up Mr. Smith, it's time for your sleeping pill."

[@falconwaver]

Discovery, go around and maintain FL370

[@jimamizzi1]

Yeah what was that all about…go around to where mate.

[@theBlankScroll]

Giving the plane to an untrained passenger when the pilot himself didn't even know how to fly the plane is hilarious.

[@daveblevins3322]

Some peeps have more $$$$$ than brains. I've seen it before, especially in aviation.

[@LexipMedia]

That is why the V-tail Bonanza was always called the "fork-tailed doctor and lawyer killer".

[@andgate2000]

Bit like presidents

[@Bax60]

You don't have to be a genius. You just need to do it by the checklist, and do it the same way every single time .He had plenty of altitude, and enough airspeed and time to run the emergency restart checklist .If he would have just calmly done this immediately, he could have relit both engines easily, and landed safely

[@RedArrow73]

They see an airplane as a "Flying Household Appliance" Literally.

[@derp195]

​@@RedArrow73 Which ironically resulted them in flying *into* household appliances.

[@captlarry-3525]

The only time in 60 years I was ever shipwrecked, the "captain" 's sole qualification was being the Owner. Despite my warning him of impending trouble, and giving him clear options which were safe, he plowed ahead and wrecked his large and expensive vintage sailing yacht, and endangered our lives doing it ! In this case the passenger/pilot was clear in expressing his discomfort with being unable to control the airplane. We both made the mistake of continuing to defer to the "captain" instead of being really unpleasant - which in the end was the ONLY way to save the ship.

[@dragade101]

darwin hands out rewards from time to time. You only need one and can only get one as your life time achievement. Good job alex lol

[@Skandalos]

I wonder how many of the passengers were only there to serve as an audience to Mr. Big&Rich.

[@dannyo3317]

All of them...

[@navajojohn9448]

Wealthy owner operators should just pay for an experienced safety pilot. Cheap insurance.

[@Mistamannfour]

Why? Just because someone is a wealthy owner and operator does not mean they can't engage in safe single pilot operations for jets certificated for single pilot operations. Providing the wealthy owner operator has the requisite type rating, current training and proficiency, and exercises proper ADM, why would being a wealthy pilot be a problem for flying small jets? We should always examine the root cause of the crash and not characteristics that do not contribute to being a pilot, like being wealthy.

[@georgesheffield1580]

They are RICH and therefore invincible.

[@patrickeppler6438]

@@Mistamannfour was a contract corporate pilot in the LA area. Flew right seat as a safety pilot for many; usually required by insurance or the board. Most were competent, but flying wasn't their profession. They often exhibited, laziness, cut corners and most of what I saw was impatience if things weren't going their way. It wasn't until later when I became a airline pilot I realized how "cowboy" a lot of Part 91 flying is.

[@Mistamannfour]

@@patrickeppler6438 Understood; however, your experience speaks to quality and professionalism of the pilot, not the impact wealth has, or lack thereof, on piloting. Also, professional pilots are trained to a different level, that is not needed for GA flying. Therefore, you may evaluate a non-professional as lacking skill when they meet the skill, training, and competency to pilot small jets. The point is, wealth has no impact on a pilot's ability.

[@zdenekkindl2778]

@@Mistamannfour But being wealthy contributes to being arrogant! Many wealthy people have that problem.

[@dwaynesykes694]

Always heard the Premiers were built like tanks, anecdotally at least one of their salesmen would hit the fuselage with a hammer at exhibitions to showcase how strong the CFRP was, but wow... to stay together like even after going full lawn-dart is very impressive.

[@matthewc7334]

Hitting CFRP with any heavy object can cause hidden damage (delamination) inside the material, so hitting a real aircraft with a hammer is pretty silly!

[@dwaynesykes694]

​@@matthewc7334 I believe it was just a fuselage-only mockup hauled around to shows like NBAA BACE when they were trying to fill the order book before deliveries even started, but I wasn't there so I'm not sure. I can say Honda's Echelon mockup was clearly not build to the same specs or from the same materials as a real airframe, so it may all be hogwash.

[@klausstock8020]

@@matthewc7334 No it's safe. "It crackles before it breaks, it's great!" -- Stockton Rush.

[@franklofarojr.2969]

​@@klausstock8020he made some Titanic level errors in judgment

[@MazianCorvus]

@@klausstock8020 In aircraft (primary structural pressure is tension, not compression!) It's fine. Titan was a submersible and ergo was under compression. Very bad for composites of any sort - but carbon fiber very specifically thrives under tension and absolutely hates compression.

[@HAL_NINER_TRIPLE_ZERO]

"uh-oh" Two words you never want to hear from your PIC. Classic case of a part-91 owner/operator's belief in his abilities being way out of line with reality. A new pilot is at his most dangerous between 400 and 1100 hours. Dude made several bone-headed decisions, got behind the airplane and panicked. The crash was almost inevitable.

[@thedownwardmachine]

My first inkling the pilot was the problem was when both engines went out, he lost hydraulics, and he didn’t call mayday

[@natehill8069]

I watch a lot of "Air Disaster" videos and about half of professional airline pilots never get around to that.

[@rhyoliteaquacade]

@@natehill8069 Flying the aircraft is higher priority. Nobody is gonna fly up there to the stricken aircraft and fix the hydraulics.

[@natehill8069]

@@rhyoliteaquacade They are talking on the radio already, but they are just chatting. The first words out of their mouth should be "Maydaymaydaymayday flight ## total engine failure." This gives them priority handling and makes people pay close attention to what they say after that.

[@deucedeuce1572]

@@natehill8069 I'm sure they were listening when he said that both his engines failed.

[@russelfernandes8483]

probably looking for a sandwich during the emergency;

[@rdawgz866]

Omg I just listened to the rest, someone should investigate how this very wealthy man got type rated, it seems he has absolutely no knowledge of his air crafts systems.

[@jamescollier3]

he likes arts and crafts too

[@deucedeuce1572]

I think that's assumed, but it may not be true. He could have pulled the manual gear release the whole way and then it was knocked partially back in when he crashed... so we can't assume he was too stupid to pull it all the way out. He could have pulled it all the way and/or could have tried to pull it all the way, but it was stuck for all we know. He was able to get one engine running and with that he could have flown indefinitely... and I don't think anyone knows why he actually crashed. We know mostly what happened leading up to the crash, but we don't know why the plane just flipped and crashed in that moment as far as I know. He should have had plenty of lift and control with just one engine.

[@dominikz.1376]

I will keep these switch settings in mind next time I am flying aboard a plane, most likely Southwest Airlines or Spirit Airlines or on a Cessna at the air show. Very valuable info for your life skills

[@krzysztofkosak4720]

I would never imagine that thrust lever used to constantly adjust power setting is one lock away from turning off engines midflight. Logic would suggest to have lowest setting as idle and separate switch under a safety cover to cut off fuel flow completely.

[@bjmaston]

Just another hole in the cheese.

[@Rompelstaump]

I was in the civil Air patrol and I got to do a sundown patrol flight. I was in there with a couple other civil Air patrol kids when I was offered a chance to take control of the plane. I was flying for a while and then I smugly turned around and said I wonder if I could do a barrel roll. The pilot immediately took over the controls and made me feel like a total idiot. He should have smacked me too.

[@mgratk]

I'm not a pilot, but I know the cause. Being an irresponsible, careless, and willfully ignorant pilot. What a shame.

[@chucklemasters6433]

most of these wealthy fools at least realize in time that this will be the outcome if they don't hire a real pilot to stop them from their final kamikaze dive! this was not even a challenging flight. this is a horrible design to have the power levers double as fuel cutoff. very good demonstration why most aircraft have separate fuel condition levers! who is the fool engineer who designed this ridiculous system? probably terrified to fly and never been in a private aircraft in flight.

[@WMHinsch]

As we say in the IT field, it was a 1 D 10 T error. Unlike most computer problems, it was deadly.

[@Atlessa]

I prefer PEBCAK - Problem Exists Between Chair and Keyboard, or I guess in this case a PEBCAY (Y being 'Yoke')

[@in4merATP]

One of the many different outcome flavors of people LARPing as a flight instructor. Even his passenger knew enough to be uncomfortable.

[@nathanhale6477]

Regulations and procedures are written in blood. Ignore either at your own peril.

[@klausstock8020]

Oh, c'mon, we all know that there are safety margins. You can always go a bit further. Reminds me, for some reason, of Stockton Rush. He knew that Röhm would provide a 200% safety margin above rated depth, so he cut costs by ordering by ordering a Plexiglas dome rated for 1300m, to go down to a depth of 3900m. And he was right, the window didn't fail. 🙄 Sadly, it wasn't just his own peril, but also that of the passengers.

[@chipsawdust5816]

@@klausstock8020 I hope you're being cavalier - or that you don't fly. One or the other. If you've ever investigated a fatal air crash, you might change your mind instead of saying, "oh, c'mon"...

[@klausstock8020]

@@chipsawdust5816 Ya know, if someone mentions Stockton Rush in a, uh, "favorable way", it's just sarcasm? 😉

[@navajojohn9448]

If the pilot didn't do a go around because of the gear he would be alive with a scratched belly and bruised ego. Instead he did a single engine go and lost control.

[@Bax60]

Once he got the left engine relit and he went around ...he could have just climbed on out and had all kinds of time to run the checklists all the way though ,several times .Maybe then he would have caught the emergency gear handle being only partially deployed and been able to get the gear down so he could do another low approach to confirm gear down,he likely could have even have gotten the other engine lit too..or set up a nice long stable single engine approach by the books ...plenty of time ,no hurry...oh yeah ...tell the other guy to shut tf up ,don't touch anything ...just let me do everything and you just read the checklist off to me one by one..after they got the #1 engine relit ,just let the airplane fly,Climb to 5000 ,circle the airport , slow down and start over on the checklist ,no need to hurry back around..climb ,relax ,don't hurry ,fix your idiot problem ,the airplane isnt broken,they got the airplane flying again ...let it fly,no need to hurry now

[@russellmoore5711]

This.

[@dustsmoke]

I think its more likely that he didn't have hydraulics and NTSB never found out what was really going on. I mean certainly pilot error but recovery likely didn't work exactly as it should have. Most people never have to restart engines in the air and never will. There are 2 people that survived and zero mention of their account tells me this was a "we don't know, but we don't want to say we don't know so we're going to put a bow on it and call it good enough" from NTSB. I'm sure the passengers have a slightly different account of events than what is described here.

[@ignorance72]

​@@dustsmoke This aircraft can be flown and landed without hydraulics. The NTSB did interview one of the passengers. The other passenger suffered a severe brain injury and I'm guessing he probably had no memory of the crash. The one who was interviewed didn't have much information on what happened but everything he did say was consistent with what was described in the video. You'd know all this if you actually read the report.

[@chrisbeauchamp5563]

I think since he had an engine back the go around was appropriate. He should have climbed and held over the airport to reconfigure start the other engine (assuming he didn’t) and slow everything down.

[@moiraatkinson]

Enjoyed the video - I love these accident case studies. You did an excellent job in narrating this and I hope more case studies are uploaded.

[@griam7641]

Great job on the recreation!

[@Freefalldave]

During my flight training for my R22 helicopter, there was some lightning way off in the distance in the direction we were supposed to be going, so thought it was a good idea to return to base. Turned out to be a good decision when a sudden storm came throughout the area.

[@nickv4073]

Looks like he panicked. Also looks like he never bothered to read the manual for this Premier jet.

[@daveg5857]

You're flying a jet, and you have no idea how to restart the engines in flight? Oh, boy.

[@Vousie]

"But it has never been a problem before! These engines are really reliable."

[@JFirn86Q]

I'm sure there's quite a few pilots like this out there. Shocking to me how you'd fly an advanced plane like this and not have everything in the POH down cold - or at least all memory items and able to look up very quickly.

[@Bax60]

You have to do things by the checklist, and do it that way no matter what ever single time .This pilot had plenty of attitude airspeed and time .All he had to do is run the emergency restart checklist by the numbers ,and he could have relit both engines and landed safely .

[@oneanddone7992]

From the moment I started my ppl 35 years ago, my (very gifted) instructor (who became a 737 check ride/captain for the majors) drilled into me safe flying habits and the need for strict adherence to the rules. This story would make his head melt.

[@jimcoughlin9932]

The controller telling a dead stick plane to “go around” is just plain stupid!

[@stephen3164]

“We gotta slow down to 210 - gonna need to pull the throttle way back.” “Just pull it back?” “Yeah, pull it all the way back.” I can’t believe he was instructing during final, AND not watching the guy do the actions! He would have at least seen him pass the stops and either stop him from cutting the engines, or caught it immediately. The cavalier way he goes past max speed then back to idle shows he had no idea how to use the thrusters, much less give instructions to a non-jet pilot. “I hate chasing the thing.” That’s like a car driving either being 100% on the gas pedal, or on the brakes, and nothing in between.

[@xeldinn86]

He did catch it immediately

[@lebojay]

The poor guy said “your throttles” and the PIC still gave him orders he didn’t know how to follow … during sterile cockpit time ... without an approach briefing. 🤦‍♂️ A guy did something like this to me once. He let me fly his Bonanza from the right seat even though I had no experience - none whatsoever, never been in a small plane before. I overshot the base-to-final turn and crossed the controls to try to stay on the extended runway centreline without overbanking. I don’t think he ever noticed I crossed the controls. Lord knows how close I came to stalling it right there. Had we died, the investigators would never have been able to deduce that I was the one at the controls. The rudder and ailerons were linked in that plane. I don’t know if crossing the controls to a dangerous degree was even possible, but I know I tried to input left rudder and right aileron at the same time. I was very young at the time. I know better now than to cross the controls on the base-to-final turn, or allow another person to put me in a dangerous position I’m not qualified to manage.

[@jnawk83]

"a guy did this to me once" Uh, not saying he was right, but why not take some responsibility for your choices too?

[@johnreyn100]

I wanted to learn to fly. I got my licence and took my family members for rides. I mistook my location once and and flew over water father than I intended once. After those too mistakes.and increase cost I decided my bag of luck was empty as was my bag of experience. Gave it up after 150 hours but can cross it off my bucket list and no one is hurt. I did learn a lot about myself and glad I did it.

[@misterguts]

Darwin take the wheel.

[@GoAway-vj4vj]

The title of the video is incorrect, the passenger did not cause this incident, the pilot did.

[@Darkvirgo88xx]

Why would a go around even be a topic in a emergency situation ? Land belly no gear you're life is more valuable then that airplane.

[@deucedeuce1572]

That's why he did a go-around. He wanted to get the gear out, so he could land without crash landing. It's impossible to control an airplane while landing with no gear. They can skid sideways and flip... and he had plenty of speed to try another run. Then he got an engine running, which would have given him all the time he needed to get the landing gear down and to land safely. You don't just crash land until there are no other options (and landing with no gear is a crash landing). With the one engine running, even with only front gear, he could have tried several times until he got it right... but for some reason, he inexplicable crashed into the houses, even though that shouldn't have happened.

[@Darkvirgo88xx]

@@deucedeuce1572 Im gonna have to disagree ive seen several belly landings on off airport landings and the runway surface. Belly landings are safer and have a much higher survival rate. He would not have skid far at all. I watched a similar plane do it on accident and it came to stop quickly. Him doing a go around with one engine and his experience would have resulted in a non survivable crash everytime. Would rather land on a runway and skid with plenty of distance away from obstacles or crash uncontrolled from the air and die guaranteed ?

[@deucedeuce1572]

@@Darkvirgo88xx "die guaranteed"? That's quite an assumption and a bait and switch.

[@deucedeuce1572]

@@Darkvirgo88xx ..and a loaded question of course.

[@JJJRRRJJJ]

I’ve been a south bend local my entire life. I was very much living in south bend in 2013 (just starting my freshmen year at Notre Dame!). I’ve also been an aviation enthusiast… yet somehow I have no memory of ever hearing anything about this plane crash. In a city this size, I find that so hard to believe! I guess I was pretty distracted just beginning college, but still…

[@jeffro221]

Note to self: Never fly on a plane with a casual, stooopid pilot who thinks aviation is a game, and who says things like, "I don't pay a whole lot of attention to it." Pilots like...... Alex.

[@sheldoniusRex]

High power businessmen make poor pilots. They typically lack humility. Arrogance when piloting a plane or captaining a ship is a recipe for disaster.

[@joeleeman9886]

Great content, may I recommend putting the documents in the description that you highlight in the video in the future so we can read the whole report.

[@PilotInstituteAirplanes]

That's a good idea, thanks!

[@rsambrook]

Shame, private pilot with poor attitude and skills to fly. We commercial pilots learn about human factors to protect us from such errors. Private pilots need the same skill set to avoid the traps. Capt A350

[@lalehbryanskrenes5692]

Excellent video. I thought your conclusions and closing statements were spot on! Thank you!

[@ramoneortiz]

PIC was “rusty” on emergency procedures. Failure to follow checklists and procedures. Airplane and human life was lost as a result. Practice, practice, practice.

[@RedArrow73]

He went from 'rusty' to Clueless in an instant.

[@ethanboyd7843]

RAT on the Premiere 1A? Love the incident up front, this is gonna be a great channel find for me.

[@ethanboyd7843]

I luv that u luve me but now I gotta google RATs on Premiere1As lo

[@HexagonalMan6]

"you went back behind the stops and we lost power" who in God's name thought that was an adequate design? My car's parking brake has better protection against accidental activation than that.

[@dppeachsynapse]

Agreed! This airplane seems to have multiple issues with poorly implemented human factors design. Perhaps all airplanes do, but it has to be possible to do things more intuitively.

[@gordonquickstad]

Some are attracted to aviation for the freedom it offers, but to fly safely in crowded airspace is anything but freedom.

[@Airway222]

A few thoughts from my safe armchair: 1. If you operate aircraft outside of its stated limitations, you don't know how far you can go before causing a problem. Why risk it? What happens is that people see they can push the boundaries, and then push too far. The limitations section in the pilot operating manual is the only section that you must comply with for a reason. 2. Putting aside this pilots willingness to exceed limitations, when the sh@t hits the fan, you need to go into simulator mode and follow the checklist methodically. Even to not worry about navigation or communication. Aviate includes getting the engines restarted. Just hold a heading and a safe airspeed and tell everyone to standby until you get the engines running again. 3. Most gear up landings end with no or minor injuries. A low time, single pilot, 1 engine go around after scraping the runway has a low chance of success.

[@chrisbeauchamp5563]

To be fair engine relit procedure is methodical but really designed for a single shut down engine. Given he was at 6000ft there was not a lot of time to pull out the checklist especially as he was single pilot. I would be treating those as immediate actions but I wouldn’t be in that situation either. Im a helicopter guy, is dual engine failure restart often taught in the Sim? In a helicopter we practice the failure but not a restart. There’s to much going on too quickly and configuring for the landing is more important than the relit.

[@Airway222]

You are right. Dual engine failure restart is not trained very often in the sim, or never. In a situation like this though, The idea is to get one going, level off, then take some time to go through the checklists and get the other one started before landing.

[@chrisbeauchamp5563]

@@Airway222I agree, if he had done that that he probably would have landed safely. Your other comments in first post are spot on.

[@deucedeuce1572]

@@chrisbeauchamp5563 6000ft and his speed gave him plenty of time for the checklist. He made it all the way to the runway and it appears that he did go through the checklist at least once (even if he failed for some reason). 6000ft isn't great for a helicopter, but it's plenty of time for an airplane. He had a good amount of speed to keep coasting... and once he got the engine going, he could have flown on that indefinitely until he ran out of gas. I'm not sure how he managed to crash after getting the engine up and running and I'm not sure he even said what caused him to flip just before hitting the houses.

[@klausstock8020]

@@chrisbeauchamp5563 Yes, but I guess the Premier didn't have autorotation. Actually, I'm pretty sure it didn't 😀 The issue was that the pilot didn't know what the battery switch did. The Premier is certified to fly for at least 30 minutes on battery. Cutting power to the main bus by switching to the "standby bus" just shut down most of the aircraft's systems. How often is "shutting down your aircraft in mid flight in case of an emergency" taught in the sim? 😉 C'mon, this is not Windows! And also not Apollo 12. In Apollo 12 in the in-flight configuration, the AUX bus is connected to the NORM bus, so if you "try SCE to AUX", the SCE will *not* shut down -- although there will be a brief power interruption while the switch moves (this probably reset the SCE).

[@basfinnis]

I feel entirely safe when I see these chaps below me and above me on approach into LAX and SFO 😉

[@randyhome1544]

Number one rule of flying:know your pilot.

[@davidturner4987]

I'll never understand these kinds people. It's one thing to pull this crap when it's just them on board but to do it with a plane full of passengers who are basically trusting you with their lives is reprehensible.

[@chrisbeauchamp5563]

Part of that understanding should come from the fact they don’t realise they are pulling that crap. I guarantee this guy overspeed the plane multiple times. The first time he 💩 himself, perhaps he reported in the logs and had a costly maintenance inspection that showed no damage. Each subsequent time he conditioned himself to think nothing would happen exceeding VNE, end result he’s happy to exceed it with no real idea what hard limit he is close to. This guy was an excellent example of the dunning Kruger effect.

[@natehill8069]

@@chrisbeauchamp5563 Why do you think his tail number ended in "DK"..? 🙂

[@deucedeuce1572]

Yeah, having a full cabin is not the time to teach someone to fly (hands on).

[@SilverStarHeggisist]

@@chrisbeauchamp5563 I've had alot of mechanic coworkers who were like this. "I've been doing this since before you were born, who are you to tell me I'm doing it wrong?!" One of these is the only time I've seen someone drop a car off a lift in person.

[@tofo2]

I think reckless attitudes are founded in early childhood. It is like an addiction to fix something constantly missing. Like creating fake appreciation of yourself while in the core there is a chronic lack of being appreciated. Fighting mental deamons of a neglected child without knowing it. Constantly intimidating everyone fixing your invisible issue. People with this issue should be grounded and prevented from being in charge of anything.

[@2140BlackCreek]

Big bucks and big attitudes do not a pilot make. Accidents, that they do make. Be it in a high speed complex single or an even more complex-single pilot corporate jet, Alex's attitude had no place. However, over the years as a MEI, I can attest to the common thread that is present among that pilot group.

[@samuelweir5985]

I watched this video but there's one thing I don't understand: What caused the final rolling descent and crash into the ground? At the point in time just before the crash the pilots had one engine operating and the plane was flying just fine with it.

[@dave92f1]

I'm guessing he still had only one engine running and flew slower than Vmc. (I"m not a multi engine pilot, but multi engine airplanes need to fly above a critical speed - Vmc - to maintain control with asymmetric thrust.)

[@oM477o]

To be fair to the passenger, If a pilot told me to set the engines to idle during an overspeed situation I'd assume to just pull the throttle all the way back. I only found out watching this video that 0% throttle is engine shutdown rather than engine idle.

[@cpl_0503]

It's "kind of true" but in reality, "0%" is not the "fuel cutoff" position. In the simulation you can see pulling the throttles straight back takes it back to full idle. Pulling the lock handles UP allows the throttle to come back one more notch BEHIND the Stop Gate to a fuel cut-off position.

[@Bax60]

​​@RetreadPhotoBecause the guy in the right seat isn't type rated in turbine aircraft and he hasn't flown in 4 years .As soon as the first overspeed warning went off ..that's it ,the pilot should have taken back the controls immediately.and none of this would have happened. This whole thing was a bad idea from the start ...but you have to know when to take the airplane back ...warnings bells going off is usually a good indicator that it's time to do that

[@mountainmandale1587]

I agree with your assessment of the situation.

[@georgesheffield1580]

Difference between turbine and piston

[@robsalvv5853]

At an even more basic level than not having an untrained pilot at the controls, the throttles shouldn’t have been able to initiate fuel cut off. This is a non intrinsically safe design that relies on the belts and braces of the stop gate, which themselves aren’t a great design given that they are easily defeated.

[@maxflight777]

Your last two sentences. So true. Compelling facts in this video. Thanks for making it.

[@brianmuhlingBUM]

Well done, an excellent narrative of this stupid and irresponsible disaster.

[@bobbys2160]

I cringe when I hear the CVR. As a airline pilot it was ingrained SOP and procedures on every flight so accidents like this don't occur.

[@apexkilla]

Did I miss the part that explained why the plane crashed on a single go around attempt ? If there was nothing mechanically wrong with the plane, then what caused the crash??

[@BrilliantDesignOnline]

Just what I thought...

[@jnawk83]

Task saturation potentially

[@saltiestsiren]

I can't imagine what one would feel as the pilot in this scenario...I hope he felt plenty of regret, guilt, shame alongside that panic.

[@charlesloko7698]

Most importantly, what was the cause of the crash? Stall? If so, why? Loss of situatiational awarness? Very interesting story with many lessons to learn but the most important part emmited.

[@chucklemasters6433]

don't become a pilot.....pleeeeez! you will end up like the "star" of this video! not hard to figure out that this wealthy fool is a victim of his own arrogant stupidity. i flew for a guy who was at least smart enough to realize he would probably end up like this if he didn't hire a full time pilot. HE is still alive today!

[@jimkirkendall2483]

Excellent video. These help me a great deal even though I fly something MUCH simpler.

[@tomcooper6108]

Rich guys used to controlling everything in their life don't get far from irresponsible behavior in aircraft.

[@ClearedAsFiled]

PIA.....thank you for this story....well done....so tragic AND avoidable.

[@30yearsfuelingbigjets]

single engine land here....no engines...no gear... I'm sliding on the concrete runway if I've got the field made, worry about the why's? later. I'm going to put it down right now!

[@joycedudzinski9415]

Great voice for narration.

[@junecovey-dm1vr]

Can’t stand the background music

[@chuck3441]

I don't know much about planes,but a better throttle lock that requires a second step seems to be a easy fix for such a problem.

[@buckmurdock2500]

can not pull the engines against the flight idle stop and shut them off.

[@robertwhite3752]

Sitting here trying to imagine what it would be like to make $20,000/month. It’s disgusting to think that there are people who make this kind of money yet still remain ungracious and ungrateful. Sorry about the unfortunate set of circumstances you find yourself in bud. It’s got to be pretty overwhelming for you.

[@spinynorman887]

I saw on the thumbnail where it said "Dead Stick; No Power" and my first thought was "Yep. That's what Dead Stick means all right".

[@paulsmodels]

Having a lot of money doesn't mean you have any brains.

[@douggale5962]

Nobody told him that when he declares an emergency, he can do anything he wants and can completely overrule all ATC instructions with total impunity.