Passive Solar Greenhouse Design

[@rakeshsimpson]

KZbin needs more folks like you that get straight to the point and give really useful information rather than unnecessary backstory. You, sir, are doing a great service. Please keep it up!

[@harrymills2770]

Traditional lecture is what people crave to hear and to deliver. As I get older, I just want them to jump in and get straight to the new thing they have on offer.

[@SimpleTek]

thank you

[@resilientfarmsanddesignstu1702]

You can create a solar battery with water as well as air too. Bury a tank of water beneath the greenhouse. Set up your thermal solar collectors on the ground next to or on the top of your south oriented passive solar greenhouse. Run the pex tubing from the collectors to the tank and run another set from the underground tank to a radiant floor in the greenhouse. Charge the thermal battery with heat during the day and release this heat into the greenhouse during the night. That should work.

[@SimpleTek]

Great idea

[@hotel3667]

@@SimpleTek The big problem with solar greenhouses, is that in places where it rains a lot, you get no sun to heat the back wall. So solar greenhouses only work in places with constantly clear skies.

[@outthere2460]

Great video! i really do like the double frame with a 2 meter airspace. the inside frame having a solar blanket operated by a motor. the outside plastic layer can also have a vibrating motor installed to help shake the snow off!

[@SimpleTek]

Thank you!!!!

[@denipar69]

We are about 95% of completion of my new passive solar greenhouse!!! (Northern AB!) Yeah! Just waiting on the rest of the polycarbonate panels to come in to finish the south roof line (currently heavy poly for now) the north wall is insulated to the 11’ peak! (And shingled) All of the other walls are insulated as well but only to the top of the 8’ height. I’ll be working on later this summer the ideas I have for heat battery storage and possibly an insulated blanket installed inside the GH to roll down or I may create insulation panels that are put in place at night to retain the heat at about 6’ level inside (effectively have a closed in greenhouse inside the greenhouse! 😜) And I also have ideas that I might build a secondary insulated (foam sheets) wall (with doorway) inside the GH as soon as I enter that would help to have a zone where the extreme cold stays out of the warmer zone. And maybe, not sure yet, toying around as I get used to this new structure, I may install my 5x5 grow tent inside the GH with LED lights, exhaust and shelving inside that will be exhausted into the main part of the GH and it may use some of that heat that gets exhausted from the grow tent. Oh! Forgot to mention, I live in the city so I wasn’t about to do a big dig in my city yard for the maybe possibly of geothermal air exchange, so I chose to insulate the plywood deck 6” of foam board insulation between the joists and plywood! So many possibilities now that it is built and in use! I’m ecstatic and over the moon to be using this GH this year and watch what happens!! Thanks for all your posts and videos over the last 8 months! I’ve taken a several ideas from you and the Chinese built greenhouses and others to come up with what I hope will work for us here! 👍👏💪😁

[@SimpleTek]

Thank you for the kind words! I'd love to see pics or video of your greenhouse!

[@aleksandrabissani567]

The first passive greenhouses I saw over 50 years ago were Belgian small greenhouses used to produce transplants in the spring and to extend growing season in the fall.

[@SimpleTek]

That’s awesome

[@harrymills2770]

Seems like an organic way to build a home, starting with structures that extend spring into winter and fall into winter. It's only natural to bridge over the whole winter. I would build totally to optimize for getting through the winter. Then cover all or most of it with trellises, every spring, and put it in shade every summer. Put it in shade, and with the earth tubes, you're golden.

[@SimpleTek]

@@harrymills2770 good idea

[@kamra99a]

Suggestion: Extend the north wall 2 meters up from the peak. Cover the south face of the extension with a reflective material.

[@SimpleTek]

good suggestions

[@DC9848]

Great cumulative wisdom in the video, would love a another deep-dive video of your take what would be a the ideal combination of elements for greenhouse for Northern Europe/Northern America

[@davidford694]

Once again I feel obliged to temper the conclusions of one of your videos. The design of what most people think of as the standard greenhouse originated in Holland, that source of so much agricultural innovation over centuries. The winter climate there, while not overly chilly (like Manitoba for instance) is excessively dull. Thus the design they came up with was not optimized for heat retention but for absorbing light. This explains the glass on all sides and the north - south orientation. Perhaps a better way to begin the decision making process for a greenhouse is to review the climate records for the place you want to build it. With the Internet this is very easy indeed to do.

[@redstone1999]

I have seen plenty of less than 45 degree roofs wide dome roofs fail. We, in the snow and freezing rain countries need to design & build accordingly.

[@jakes3546]

Thank you for this. Your simple, concise, and economical videos are a blessing. I had a few questions about the thermal blankets which may be a good follow-up video. I've seen your description but I wanted to know more about the different materials you can use. Also, I live in the north and I'm wondering how to combat the elements of the deep winter and still use a thermal blanket. Large snow load, freezing rain, high winds? Once again thank you so much, Inspiring work.

[@SimpleTek]

That’s a great topic for a video!!! I think I’ll do it very soon!

[@redstone1999]

I tried using orange construction insulated tarp for thermal cover. It worked until a wicked North-Easter storm ripped it off 2X4 holding board and found the shredded tarp 200 ' away tangled in thorn trees. It is scary the power of a 60-100 kmh with snow can do.

[@harrymills2770]

@@redstone1999 I can see wanting the thermal cover to also be a storm cover that's pretty rugged and heavy, maybe. But maybe instead of covering the entire structure, you make a blanket for your babies, inside the greenhouse. Make a little plastic tent for them inside the greenhouse. Some variation on the cold box idea within the green house idea, can be used.

[@ANJA-mj1to]

Good for characterizing the solar radiation incident. Depending on the position of the solar of the sun relative to a given building aperture, as well as other factors, the solar radiant flux incident on the aperture is composed of three items : direct solar radiation, diffuse sky radiation, solar direct and diffuse radiation reflected and scattered from the ground, vegetation, adjacent building, etc. In general, as prof. have said, each of Green houses can be built but with different spectral and angular distribution.

[@trent5098]

Dong Jianyi said something about not orienting the greenhouse directly east to west. Something about a 5 degree skew to allow light earlier in the morning or something.

[@SimpleTek]

He's right for where he lives near Edmonton, it depends on your exact location though.

[@redstone1999]

@@SimpleTek Predominant winds also plays a role. For example: My location is SSW #1 and ENE # 2 winds. So I go 5-10 degrees westward from South. The warmest part of day is 2 PM real Solar Time.

[@yamaha550xz]

In your opinion would you have your wall painted black to absorb heat or silver to reflect light,, or does it not matter?????

[@engineerabetterlife8301]

It depends if your north wall is a thermal mass wall or just a low mass wall. If the north wall is made from a thermal mass material with a relatively high thermal capacity e.g. Clay, concrete etc then you would paint the wall black to allow the wall to absorb the solar radiation in the day and 'charge up'. The wall would then release the heat back into the greenhouse at night when the temperature drops. If the north wall is low mass e.g. wood, Gib board and insulation then you would paint it a reflective colour to reflect the light back onto the plants during the day. Obviously a low mass wall will not 'charge up' and release heat at night.

[@romannavratilid]

@@engineerabetterlife8301 You might even instal some basic roll down sheet that would be white, and during winter when there really now real heat from the sun, and not enough sun in general, you could roll down this white roll down on the (otherwise black painted wall) so this way you would reflect light back to the walls, since during winter (at least where i live) theres not that much light, so i assume any additional light the plants might get it good... ANd because there is not much sun light, the thermal mass of north wall wouldnt really heat up anyway, so its better to lower the white cover to use it to reflect light... Is my thought correct?

[@SimpleTek]

Is a Chinese greenhouse a Passive Solar greenhouse?

[@paulp.l.4869]

Yes, there is a KZbinr located in Alberta who has a big Chinese greenhouse. It was around 20-25°c inside when the exterior temperature was below -20°c. The hight between the 2 layers was quite a lot, and there was an motorized insulated blanket over the lower Polly. Vibrators on the outer frame to make snow fall off.

[@SimpleTek]

Yes

[@yager4092]

What about the North wall being large Polly tanks follie tanks for aquaponics using fish water

[@SimpleTek]

good idea

[@jeffliddicoat714]

Fgreat presentation thanknyou very much, l have a polycarb grren house here in New Zealand and it has given me some ideas for better wintering

[@SimpleTek]

Wonderful!

[@ludikonj8927]

Where can I found more about those thermal blankets? In my country there are no passive greenhouses maybe few passive houses started building these years.. But I hope to be the first one with passive greenhouse 😁 .. find your video helpful, I like 👍

[@SimpleTek]

Try Amazon, eBay or alibaba!

[@ludikonj8927]

No Amazon in my country 😂

[@Sirius-motion]

Hi, where are you from?Give me your email, I will send the price to you,

[@anglosaxon244]

I just wanted to add that when we talk abouth the Southern hemisphere,..It would then be a Southern wall instead!!

[@SimpleTek]

most populated Southern Hemisphere locations isn't cold enough to need this design - unless you're talking Antarctica and there it's too cold and growing would be hydroponic and inside under grow lights

[@anglosaxon244]

@@SimpleTek Thanks,....good to know!!.I live in central Chile,..but my mother got some land in the Southern Patagonia in Argentina,...there it is needed (I guess)with winter freezing temperatures up til -10 celsius during the coldest in winter....I love this practical design,Im glad I found your site,...Have a good day!take care.

[@SimpleTek]

@@anglosaxon244 it freezes in Argentina???

[@anglosaxon244]

@@SimpleTek yes,..its a kind like North Europe,...Its preety harsh,..but summers are greath...Here in Chile its abouth the same but with much more rain....Now we are talking abouth the Patagonia,..you know the southern part of the continent...the central part its like the mediterranean zone,and so on!...its a good place to sattle down after my experience at least...Im here since 2005,and still alive and kicking.

[@redstone1999]

@@SimpleTek Basically the same rule as further you are from equator, the colder the winters are.

[@The0ldg0at]

Does having any kind of motor running the geothermal battery defeat the name "Passive"?

[@SimpleTek]

good question

[@redstone1999]

Blower is optional for passive heat flow. But at a much lower efficiency than running a blower when needed to boost flow and energy gains. Passive flow can get to 90-100 F before a good flow happens (this is harmful to plants and human's comfort). Whereas a blower can be set on a temperature controller that turns on blower fan at 80F and 60F settings. This can be powered by solar panel and battery and inverter. ( A 'passive' purist may argue is is not 'passive'. But they will not cover the cost when your plants fry.).

[@frenchfryfarmer436]

You can use thermo siphon for water or air movement.. no power..

[@The0ldg0at]

@@frenchfryfarmer436 Thanks it's one solution I favor but I didn't know the name. Good old convection power in a closed system loop.

[@mikec3820]

"automated thermal blanket" = wench and a timer. i like that chinese one. great idea

[@SimpleTek]

Thank you for the awesome comment!

[@healthfullivingify]

Great explanation, Russell. You covered the subject well. Thanks.

[@SimpleTek]

Thank you Steve!

[@indikacbw]

Very good and interesting topic . Pls can I havemore details ?

[@SimpleTek]

Thank you for the kind words! I explore this topic in other videos in my archives on this channel

[@dominicspagnuolo2837]

what about in Australia?

[@SimpleTek]

you just build them upside-down

[@dominicspagnuolo2837]

@@SimpleTek funny...

[@IAMentertainment204]

Love your channel!

[@SimpleTek]

Thank you soo much! That made my night.

[@robmosher362]

I enjoy your videos a lot and have watched most if not all of them. A positive suggestion is to take your appearance overlay out of the video. I find that I am missing your diagrams and just watching you instead.

[@SimpleTek]

Thanks for the tip

[@jeffshotpeppers3732]

Thank you brother for your hard work! I am in the process of lining up materials to build just this. I live close to Ottawa(plantagenet), and am trying to start a hot pepper, fruit and veggie house. Thanks again for everything! God bless you!

[@SimpleTek]

You can do it! Sounds Awesome!

[@robertliepe6766]

🤓👍💯

[@CN_SFY_General]

The span length (width) is very important, 12 - 15 m is enough.

[@SimpleTek]

well said

[@dwighthires3163]

Why do many passive solar greenhouses have north walls with a southerly slope? This seems counter-intuitive to me. If the back wall is vertical of even better if it slopes away to match the degrees of the winter apogee, then it should catch more thermal mass on winter days than a south sloping back wall. What is wrong with this logic?

[@guitarAndy71]

I like the idea of heat system using compost and water lines. and in turn have a hot water for showers for free.

[@SimpleTek]

;)

[@yLeprechaun]

You didn't mention a cold sink.

[@SimpleTek]

do tell

[@yLeprechaun]

@@SimpleTek, in the cold country (Montana) I've seen them with basically a trench below the walk level. It lets the cold air settle below the lowest usable part of the floor. The theory is that it will then warm by geothermal and rise. It prevents the coldest air from settling around plants. But! I do not have a walipini myself, so.... how is yours performing?

[@SimpleTek]

@@yLeprechaun Montana is like Hawaii to me, I’m in Manitoba. My greenhouse is doing great right now, -20C last night, 12’C inside

[@yLeprechaun]

@@SimpleTek glad to hear as I am going thru design concepts. I plan to build one this coming summer. So you are telling me, I need not worry about the cold sink? Good to know. If yours works without it in the tundra, then I should be fine down here in North Hawaii. ;)

[@robertliepe6766]

Very knowledgeable information thank you sir!!!🤓👍💯🇺🇸

[@SimpleTek]

Thank you for the kind words!

[@davefroman4700]

You NEVER want to try and force the hot less dense air underground. The efficiency of your fan is minuscule, and you are working against physics. In order for air to readily expend its energy, it must undergo a drop in pressure. You do that by pulling the cold dense air up out of the ground at the OTHER end of the system.

[@SimpleTek]

And yet it’s done all the time

[@davefroman4700]

@@SimpleTek yeah, I know. By people that do not understand physics. And they all have over heating issues in the summer and end up having to add heat in the winter because of it. Pulling on the cold end of the system increases the amount of hot less dense air is collected at the peak. By almost 2x

[@davefroman4700]

@@SimpleTek The Ideal setup for cold climates is a reversible fan at the lowest point of the greenhouse that can pull the cold air up to charge the battery during the day, and then push the coldest air at the bottom of the greenhouse down at night. This results in the air heating and expanding in volume and being pumped to the top of the greenhouse and pulled down by the motion of the fan.

[@davefroman4700]

@@SimpleTek Curtis Stones fancy greenhouse in Kelowna? Was built perfectly fine. They just failed the physics of heat transfer and were trying to blow the hot fluffy air down.

[@SimpleTek]

@@davefroman4700 I agree totally on Curtis stones greenhouse and your assessment there

[@healthfullivingify]

I may have your first name wrong. What is it? Sorry. Great job though.

[@zsmokey9931]

Lots of what this guy mentions are pipe dreams that if possible would mean we would be farming the arctic circle. Go speak to anyone who has actually built these designs and see how difficult it really is. Most youtubers talk about this but don’t actually show theirs performing in cold conditions. You would be better off heating with gas.

[@SimpleTek]

As I live 60 miles NORTH of Winnipeg, I kinda do have a clue as I run a 4 season greenhouse and know many people in this climate who do as well.

[@SimpleTek]

actually farming actually occurs in the arctic circle in many communities there. they use mostly led lights for growing, and windmills for power

[@redstone1999]

No one said you can't do both. In fact it is wise to have backups of backups. Too hot from fuel industry/power company heating ? Turn on the STHC blower.

[@zsmokey9931]

The idea of using air that has a super low specific heat constant to heat dirt or rock that has a very high specific heat constant has been tested long ago and has failed. The problem is the temperature differential is very low and air is a terrible conductor. You should do better analysis before wasting time and money building any of this.

[@SimpleTek]

Obviously you've never sat in a sunbeam behind glass in -40' weather before. Sucks that such a simple example makes your fancy technical words completely wrong.

[@engineerabetterlife8301]

@@SimpleTek @Z Smokey has made some valid technical points, instead of criticising the poster with derogatory comments why don't you reply in a professional manner and provide links to actual measured performance data which would answer the concerns of the poster. I am sure that most viewers would rather see that instead of a sarcastic reply.

[@SimpleTek]

@@engineerabetterlife8301 Pfffffft! :P

[@feix5800]

@@engineerabetterlife8301 Textbook explanation on heat transfer isn't as convincing as personal observation. It's the same reason why Walipini greenhouse is dug a few feet into the ground because the surrounding ground retains heat better than air.

[@engineerabetterlife8301]

@@feix5800 The advantages of thermal mass and insulation are well known and are not in question in relation to a Chinese style greenhouse. The unanswered questions I have are related to the efficiency and cost effectiveness of climate batteries. Personally I would not spend time and money installing one without seeing actual measured data that shows the efficiency and cost effectiveness. If you have such data I would be more than happy to review it. I have not seen any data from anyone so far, which begs the question why not?