Hyper D67 REVIEW - The Daddy, but Daddy got issues. (+ knackered rotors)

[@Gozzilah]

intro>everything

[@Hambini]

I've found disc rotors do not last long. I've had several sets of the IceTech freezer type. They tend to warp and a small amount of grit causes the material to pick up. I think the pickup on yours is a fragment of metal from the road that has done it. In fairness you'd get the same thing on a rim but due to the tangential velocity, it's unlikely to stay on the rim for long.

[@TheMoodyedge]

Completed the Fred Whitton at the weekend with campag afs rotors. No issues and they get hot on that run.

[@SnowmEVE]

What pads / rotors do you recommend for durability?

[@PeakTorque]

@@SnowmEVE campy afs Rotors last absolutely ages with any pads. However i have found the rivets can work a bit loose then they can get noisy.

[@galenkehler]

Brake pads work as a system with the rotors and those are not the oem pad replacement, curious what those pads are.

[@waynosfotos]

Are those pizzas 🍕 on your bike! 🤣

[@global_nomad.]

honest as ever.....still happy with my hyper 50 gen 1's even for everyday riding.....thanks for all that testing a few years back...

[@TrickyTree84]

I'm looking at changing mine now because I can only get 25mms on and keep the profile, and they are so still I'm just rattled at the end of a long ride

[@silviugheorghe7118]

I just ordered the D45 with your code. I can't wait to receive and ride them.

[@morelife9103]

Also a mechanical engineer here, I had the same issue with the disc rotor, but I have addressed mine. If you observe the concentric circles left by the brake pads, and follow the concentric circles, the part that has got damaged has no cutout to clear any mud or debre, and I believe that is the reason that caused the failure. I have drilled one 4mm hole to effectively function as a cutout and the issue never came back.

[@morelife9103]

Also it only happened on 160mm version of the XTR rotor, the 140mm and 180mm has just enough cutout overlap to cover the whole braking track

[@MieseType1985]

I got the hyper R67s on my super six evo high mod rim brake from 2017 I love them The rim brakes work perfect 👌🏻 The whole bike is awesome

[@enriquechavezjimenez1174]

Nice bike 🙌🏽 just one question: What brake calipers do you use? I want to put the R67s on a CAAD10

[@seanmccuen6970]

​@@enriquechavezjimenez1174 best rim brakes are shimano dura ace/ultegra or CANE CREEK EE brakes. choice of brake pads and set up is critical for any caliper.

[@CrabgrassFarmer]

Would love to see a pic! I'm considering them for my 2019 rim brake high mod Supersix. My only hesitation is how harsh the ride may be on those short carbon spokes. What size tires are your running?

[@ehrenfull]

@@enriquechavezjimenez1174 Not using Hypers but when switching to carbon rims I changed my rim brake pads to red Campagnolo because Jesse Coyle (afaik) recommended them in a video. It looks like they wear out p fast but the braking quality feels the same as on my alu braking surface with "normal" pads. BUT I haven't used them in the wet.

[@Steven-Sea_gull]

Best intro on KZbin great content as always 💪 ice rotors are not worth the expense

[@mountainsofthemind]

Langdales footage makes me want to come back home to the UK! That's also one of my favourite corners of the country.

[@JSDiercks]

I have the Hyper D45 and I have the same sound, but only in the front which obviosuly is the shallower than both of your wheels (okay also in the back, but only when super wet). I changed the pad from a Shimano L05A to a SwissStop 34 exotherm (which reviews say are LOUD when wet, but I want to do bikepacking transalps in summer) this morning and the noise is gone. I mean total SILENCE when dry. So not sure what to make of your findings yet, I am convinced I had solved my problem because there was no noise on my 80km ride today. Let's see, interesting though to learn about it and I will keep testing mine, so far I love them.

[@TheChindoboi]

Love the outro!

[@motovago4641]

Hey Torque, so if you had choose one set of wheels for your daily or maybe weekend bike would you go for D67 or D45, are the aero benefits enough to go with the D67. I mostly ride flat but do plan on taking on the rolling hills soon, once I get my Reacto 5K in :D.

[@sustainf]

I personally use 45mm wheels as all-rounders for hills and flats and 67mm for triathlon races on flatter courses.

[@IvanMalechko]

11:51 I've personally tested the trueness and spoke tension of my own D45 set, and while it's acceptable, it falls short of perfection. Therefore, it's important to be cautious about the ones we see being presented for free directly to reviewers by winspace-they most likely are "KZbin specials" :).

[@PeakTorque]

Yes i did mention in the video, they could be KZbin specials

[@IvanMalechko]

@@PeakTorque Sure, I made sure to include the timestamp when you mentioned that. It was really interesting and explained why my wheels didn't come perfectly straight and even, unlike what I saw with most KZbinrs. Nevertheless, considering the price, the wheels are still pretty nice. Thanks again for being honest and for helping WS make valuable improvements to the Hyper 2023!

[@yuva]

Mr Peak Torque, you mentioned you're running a 52-34 chain ring. Any shifting issues on the front D with that? Am considering running a similar setup on my bike

[@PeakTorque]

Once tuned, absolutely no issues for 7 years now I've run this combo

[@KyriaxWitch]

the best rotors i still using after 10y on my touring bike the deore rt-54 and slx rt-66 (160/180mm) full steel rotors 1.57mm and more than 12.000kms never warped and using with lots cheap semi-metal china pads ,some times with e01s metal shimano pads.

[@BioStuff415]

ditto

[@hermannstephann4987]

hi could you do a video on TIME frames

[@madmonkeycycling9098]

Have you tried Galfer disc rotors? I'm going to try them as shimano RT800 discs are squeeling like a pig and don't have great stopping power..

[@NickPavlenko]

Galfers are amazing. Pair them with Galfer pads, it's a bliss to ride.

[@ephboulder]

I have been having great luck with Galfer rotors and pads on a SRAM setup lately. Recommended.

[@workshopninjathe1st]

Blea tarn road? Langdale is my favourite place in the world - hope you stopped at the Sticklebarn for a pint. 😊

[@PeakTorque]

Sitckle is closed currently. Absolute bummer. And yes one of the best places in the world for a pint and a slice of cake. They're looking for a new lease holder to run it. Hopefully back up and running asap!

[@workshopninjathe1st]

@@PeakTorque - it’s been a while since I’ve been up that way - living in USA at the moment. Can’t believe it’s closed - but I guess life’s hard running a business like that in the UK right now. I definitely appreciate seeing the peaks though - jealous of you rides :)

[@johnny212]

Will there be a noticeable difference in terms of feel between D67 and D45? I prefer the no pattern of the D67 but just afraid the rim profile and weight might punish me in the long distance ride

[@LordFilbo]

I would like to upgrade my DT Swiss PR1600 32mm to carbon wheels. The wheels i'm eyeing are the the EV Drive 65D (989$) and the HYPER D67 (1170$). Which set would you choose, are the hypers worth the extra money compared to the elite wheels?

[@karlnorberg7768]

Thanks for the review. Very appreciated. Maybe I missed it but there was no summary at the end of the video? I'm using the D67s this season for casual riding and races here in Sweden. 28/25mm GP5K S TR. Incredible wheelset. Like you said - can't see why anyone would spend more money for performance. No noise at all from rotors or spokes. Dead silent at 80kg. BR-R8170 calipers paired with SM-RT900 rotors and L05A-RF pads. Only switched out the wheelset for a week when I was in Mallorca for something medium depth (42s).

[@JBR.1974]

good to hear you personally get no spoke noise.wheel resonance....

[@CrazyAboutCycling]

Thé rotors were terrible for galling! Excellent feed-back! Would you use the recent discs you highlighted at $8?! There’s a few bikes that give of high resonance, in our club rides. Another insightful lesson, thank you ❤

[@HuntShootOffroad]

Are stiff wheels/carbon spokes more dangerous in the wet?

[@ClubRide]

Great review as always, Can you tell me what camera mount your using ? Insta 360 one broke o first ride for me.

[@alexcollins5150]

Another 52/34 brother. Loving your work PT

[@PeakTorque]

Im thinking of going to a 53 - 36 now...prawn watts are on the rise... riding a bit, you know im kinda a big deal now

[@philipk4475]

@@PeakTorque Larger chainrings make you faster. It's called induced demand, taught in econ 101

[@daijones1515]

Hi, is your 52/34 mechanical or di2 shifting. I'm thinking of doing it (52/36 now) but a mate tells me its hard to setup and one negative aspect is you have to be in the mid sprockets to shift either up or down. I'm interested on your experiences....thanks.

[@PeakTorque]

@@daijones1515 run it for years on ultegra mechanical and dura ace di2 11sp with absolutely no issues. Front shifting not quite as crisp, but its 80% there. As long as you set up the front mech perfect it works fine.

[@daijones1515]

@@PeakTorque I'll give it a go, many thanks. Also bought some R45 Hypers last week using your code, really excited to be using them out here in Albir. I waited for the 2023 edition, but more so for the dollar exchange rate to improve.....result. Your content is absolutely fantastic.

[@JBR.1974]

Hyper D 45s (possibly the SE's now as I prerfer the aestheitics) are still in my top wheel list...but little concerned about the disc resonance.....assume there is no fix for this on this wheelset? but another great video as always, thanks for doing what you do and showing real world application

[@cipo36an203]

Thanks for the stiffness table, always instructive even if you seem to find lower values than anyone else. what make the D45 Hyper so flexier compared to the 50? (there was no real design change, a bit taller and wider rim) and the D67? mechanically that can't come from the few mm shorter spokes.

[@PeakTorque]

Stiffness results depend a lot on the test setup, so everyones will vary. But all mine are done on the same table. I also start from a completely unloaded state which includes the bearing/axle deflection from rest (this is a good indicator of how much preload is on the bearings and much slop is in the system). I know Raoul Luescher applies a load of 10kg or so before measuring which is why he sees slightly higher stiffness values because he takes this slop out. But its an important part of the system so should be measured. The difference in Hypers is probably due to bearing preload and hub stiffness which will differ quite a lot just due to tolerances.

[@cipo36an203]

@@PeakTorque thanks, but 25% stiffness difference (47/35) seems an awfully big number to put just on bearing play no? Particularly on hubs that rely on machined shoulders with tolerances within few 1/100th.

[@jackriley1989]

Great video and super interesting about the braking detensioning resonance. On a front wheel that's tangentially laced both sides (12,12) do you expect the effect to be less due to more lead in spokes on the other side of the hub? Also, what are those cages you're running? Are they unbranded, the carbonworks, or the new topeak ones? They all look the same

[@andyman127]

strange issue with the disc brakes. Coming from the mountain bike world and living in the Rockies, I have never had all the issues that roadies talk about with disc breaks. Wondering if it is the pad and rotor size that is causing the issues. I run 180 with ferrous pads, and generally get even wear across the radial height of the pad. At lease much more even radial ware. Wonder if it has to do with 4 pot calipers - though they are a PITA to get evenly pressed out on the occasion that you need to do a full flush.

[@Gozzilah]

PT - is there anywhere to buy the axles for the hyper 50 (pre anodized)((rim brake)) ? Please and thank you :-)

[@philipk4475]

Tried TPR Rotors? I run the TRP TR-25's in 160 and have had no issue. They're a bit heavier but I'm not going to compromise on something which may save my neck.

[@jsargcyclingsportsandtech]

Do you get this issue with the ice-tech Rotors using the L03A or L05A disc pads?

[@TrickyTree84]

That would be my question if I was Shimano and I received that email.

[@PeakTorque]

Organic only. Thought i mentioned that but my mistake if not

[@stuartdryer1352]

So what would you recommend for everyday riding? Something similar but with CX Ray spokes? Also, what are your favorite rotors?

[@PeakTorque]

Cx ray are my go to. Rotors, anything solid steel. Riding 12 quid Amazon ones on my MTB and it gets 11h per week.

[@porkyparry1]

D minor i believe. Which is the saddest of all keys .Makes people weep instantly

[@dgianstefani5694]

Good intro editing.

[@sabamacx]

What's wrong with dragging brakes on the descent --- you still have the same Hamiltonian total energy to dissipate irrespective how you bleed it off?

[@PeakTorque]

Exactly

[@Al.2]

Air drag slows you down too, and it grows with speed squared but I'm not sure how significant is that practically.

[@sbccbc7471]

Do this on rim brakes and you're sure to blow your rims up. Warranties don't cover this kind of damage.

[@adellng4169]

Would like to see how the elite wheels with similar price point would compare to the hypers.

[@WonderSausage]

I'd love to see you figure out how we can determine if brake whine is caused by the rotor or by spoke resonance. Maybe, weaving a rubber hose or some foam through the spokes, so if it still whines then you know it's the rotor?

[@PeakTorque]

It happens at the same Freq with 3 different rotor types. Which tells me its probably not the rotor.

[@WonderSausage]

@@PeakTorque Yeah, I'm not doubting your findings, just wondering how the average viewer could tell the difference without buying another rotor or two.

[@DerRofflers]

new intro goes hard

[@alastairstedman7840]

Try Ashima rotors. They are an oem manufacturer for a lot of rotor brands. Give one if their rotors a try

[@jon65160]

I've also got the icetech rotors on my bike (11spd ultegra). which rotors do you think are a better choice?

[@PeakTorque]

Anything solid steel even the 12 gbp Amazon ones. But choices are limited in center lock.

[@jon65160]

Thanks for that. I’m going to consider this next time I replace a rotor.

[@nicolas.goumas]

@@jon65160Galfer is my go to recommendation for rotors

[@petermadach]

This intro penetrates my brain about as hard as a Scud missile, and if you're familiar with the scale of penetration, you know thats a lot.

[@PeakTorque]

Not familiar with Scuds but i know some people at BAE who could drop off a storm shadow in your back garden

[@TheFuzzedOUT]

Looks like the disc is galling in an area where it has no slots/holes to clean/scrape debris off the pads... Do they always gall in the radial area between the through-slots and the OD scollops?

[@benjaminhie5325]

where possible on those descents i'm alternating between front and rear to give the brakes a chance to cool even if it's a second, rather than having the front and rear together.

[@PeakTorque]

Yep, normally do that!

[@jimjam218]

Suprised to see you using the stock Giant computer mount. Ive heard people have issues with the mount falling forwards regardless of how tight its bolted in position. Any issues? Still using it as it has the camera mount? Considering changing it?

[@abedfo88]

i run 65F/70R psi on my 28mms and im a fat knacker at 92kg.

[@JamesMason-i7s]

I have the same rims that you're showing on this video mind.Do not do that on the downhill and wonder what's the deal

[@visionset1456]

Question, does spoke count lead to an increase in RIM strength? So I am thinking impacts, like potholes, rocks, high load concentrated on small area. In my mind it would not.

[@hockysa]

That’s the best intro

[@rehview]

What is your opinion on Hope floating rotors for road use? Have you tried them?

[@ream_my_tang_hole]

I love when my two dads post on the same day

[@phattyboomba1125]

So for all-round use, would you recommend D45 instead of D67? Cheers

[@scherzo0o]

what rotors would you recommend, if these ones are so bad? (and indeed they seem to be)....

[@dogwithatie]

where's that intro clip from, it's amazing!

[@PeakTorque]

Tom Boonen dancing mashed up and beat matched with the Hambini techno mash

[@borjagarcia6858]

Try Galfer rotors

[@CoreProject05]

So basically based on aero testing and considering the weight and agility difference the 45 is almost on par with the 67? 5W diff at 50km/h seems marginal.

[@rickybarker4023]

How deep of a wheel for someone who lives in the lakes and spends a lot of time climbing?

[@nemixCOD]

Wanted to ask you your opinion on this issue, using the winspace 50mm Hyper blacks, with ultegra discs, juin tech semi hydro brakes. Above 60kmh i get speed wobbles. Any suggestions? I would be on the larger side like yourself, 6ft3, 103kg. Wheels could need a service? fresh rubber on them. Noticed the wheel gets unstable slightly when free wheeling at that speed, touch front brake to scrub speed and its gone into a wobble.

[@PeakTorque]

Speed wobble is rarely wheel related. Normally its the frame and fork going into resonance above a certain speed, have you had your front and rear dropout alignment checked?

[@nemixCOD]

@@PeakTorque Thanks for getting back, thats reassuring to hear, I was expecting there was an issue with the wheel. No I have not, I am currently riding a Domane Al2 Disc (basically upgraded everything) Running 11 speed. 105 cranks, Chopped steerer (by local bs) with slammed integrated bar / stem. A Friend mentioned maybe I have made the bike too fast. As its really an entry level relaxed geometry frame. Just calling it out to give you an idea of the setup. I am planning an upgrade of frameset in the next month or 2, just lost a lot of confidence on the downhill on this bike now. Not sure what to do.

[@ForeJaapie]

Interesting looking at the difference between different carbon wheelsets. I'm window shopping for my first set. I would love to see a box section alloy wheel on the cda graphs as a reference, to provide context to the gaps between carbon wheels. For now I'm leaning to a prebuild Light Bibycle AR46 with DT Swiss 350 hubs, 24 spokes front and back. Theyre in stock in their EU warehouse. Im of a similar build to you, any idea if that would be suitable? I recall you going with 28 spokes in the back for your LB wheel build.

[@piotrmkg]

I'm considering D45 2023 or Swiss Side Hadron2 Ultimate 500 or DT ARC1100 dicut, which are almost the same as Swis Side. Only problems with winspace is after importing them to Poland difference in price drops to like 100Eur (and DT Swiss are even cheaper then Winspace after importing) due to customs and sales tax.Any thoughts?

[@sbccbc7471]

In terms of compliance, Winspace HYPERs and HYPER 2023s are the least forgiving. Spoke replacement is also less convenient than with steel spokes as you need to find a wheelbuilder that has experience with carbon spokes.

[@TheCharnwoodCyclist]

Interesting about the brakes, I did my first trip to the Alps last year, prior to going I had nothing but trouble with the 105 spec rotors and pads on my Focus Paralane, before the trip I put 160mm XTR rotors and Ultegra pads and they were superb. I’m 81kgs and a fairly nervous descender so was on the brakes a lot. I got a bit of howling from time to time and quite obvious heat build up and occasional ticking but overall they stayed true and I was glad I upgraded. Do you think the issue you’re having is down to the extra energy involved with the steeper gradients?

[@PeakTorque]

They perform well, don't get me wrong. They just don't seem to last for me. 6 months isn't really acceptable for the price

[@TheCharnwoodCyclist]

@@PeakTorque I agree.

[@waynosfotos]

Nice video , clear sound and great content once again. 👍

[@timothybudge]

They look very similar to the Cadex hubs/spokes.

[@Eirikkinserdal]

did you see the price on the lun mega? 2600$, yeez

[@TheLazyGarden3r]

I've had no issue with MT800 rotors on mountain descents (think those are XT). Maybe a bit more beefy than the XTR's. What other rotors have you tried? I've found most swisstop stuff to be decent, was thinking of giving their rotors a try.

[@PeakTorque]

Any solid steel rotors work for me just fine.

[@charliecook6909]

Had icetec discs on my xc bike , they wernt great, when they warmed up would rub like mad till they cooled down , so went to sram centerline and there 👌

[@ZioComposite]

Regarding rotors, which should be used instead for such gradients?

[@JayLato]

How does it compare to to Polaris 69mm? Surprised it’s not on the graph.

[@pakelly99]

I’m, ahem, a big boy too, descending 1000m or so on a relatively regular basis and have yet to experience this galling phenomenon. I’m riding on sram disc. No doubt it can happen, just saying, never experienced it and quite astonished to see this happen on your end on multiple occasions. People knock sram, but this is imho very poor on shimano’s part. Or is it simply coincidence this happens to your discs in such quick succession? Was experience of similar issues previously a motivation in your devising a way to mount 180mm discs to your road bike? Or, similarly, just a coincidence? Appreciate this comment could read snarky in the absence of the actual intended sentiment, absent of tone, as the medium suffers, but it’s not meant that way at all. Genuinely interested to know, and thanks for all the stellar quality output. By the way, brexit, as you will be aware, wasn’t for nothing, we did get quite a cool dark blue passport now. A worthwhile trade for the benefits we exchanged to achieve that? Well, no, but there we are. We have, in part, arron banks record breaking campaign donations of dubious origin to thank for that, and I’m sure the fact the close cast mines constituting his company which appear to be derelict and unstaffed nor his frequent attendance at the russian embassy or visits to moscow are entirely neither here nor there. But, I digress.

[@CrabgrassFarmer]

Are you running the 34 with the medium cage derailleur? I have done it. I'm curious if you are ok with it. Thank you!

[@PeakTorque]

Yes. Works fine, just have the B screw quite far in to give a bit more space for the top jockey

[@Onigure]

Watching your roads now I understand why you recomend 700x28+ tires. I have never ever ridden in those shitty road conditions and probably never will. As a 65kilos rider with delicate as a petal taste in roads , I decided to stick with 25s.

[@0views372]

How do you have your insta360 mounted?

[@ChinCycling]

Similar dimensions to my Enve SES 6.7 wheels, there must be something to that 60mm front 67mm rear setup

[@luukrutten1295]

So what rotors you recommend to use with the shimano road brake systems.

[@trevekneebone369]

Can you just file those lumps off the rotor and continue using them?

[@PeakTorque]

Possible, but if the lumps are formed by the steel panel on the disc then its trash. If the lumps are molten pad, then maybe. But i doubt it as they are organic pads

[@Shlopps]

Any chance you could share the route? Looks phenomenal! I have these wheels in the rim version and am very pleased! I was interested by your comment regarding high lateral stiffness not ideal for everyday use - what's the reason for this? I find that lateral flex does not feel nice at all when cornering? Not to mention brake rub for rim brake boys like myself (but that doesn't affect you)

[@PeakTorque]

Really i meant stiffness in general gets a bit tiring on the really shit roads. This is blea tarn climb. Started the ride in Lancaster, up to Windermere, on the ferry, through Hawkshead to the langdales, and back again.

[@drexydelavega5516]

@@PeakTorque I have mavic cosmic carbon ultimate (CCU) full carbon spokes from rim to rim. The wheels are the stiffest I had, it s a pleasure during sprint, and HIIT training but not cool when the road is rough!

[@Formula369]

I need a review of the new textured rim brake surface and how it performs.

[@ianhanratty144]

Langdale Valley / Blea Tarn

[@edmundjones1613]

getting back on the campy rotors?

[@cicliolmo7152]

mate, what is the name of that rear mud guard you have there ? is that a one-off fabrication ?

[@NP13000]

he made it himself, has a video or two on that topic on his channel

[@PeakTorque]

@@NP13000 correcto... I have a video on making it. Check out my channel 🙏

[@keithczechanski2625]

I’ve got a set of the Hyper 50’s with Continental 5000 s tr , set up tubeless of course. Fast and super comfortable. But I have a huge issue. The front wheel is incredibly unstable, even in light winds. Almost crashed going downhill at speed when a slight gust of wind hit the front wheel and made the front wheel lose control. I end up using just the rear wheel with a shallow alloy front. I don’t known if it’s the sealant making it unstable or a wheel balance issue.

[@drexydelavega5516]

50 is a little bit too high for front wheel, try 40 or 45 maximum

[@keithczechanski2625]

@@drexydelavega5516 it’s not completely the fault the depth of the rim. Even on low wind days, like less than 10 mph, it’s super twitchy.

[@PhilB303]

Probably a front end geometry issue. I get the same on one of my bikes.

[@vanw1554]

Really like to know how does it compare with western high end wheels like Enve and Roval

[@PeakTorque]

Much better value, stiffer, lighter, but maybe the bearings aren't going to last as long. There you go.

[@mjperez2462]

Do you use TPU inner tubes? How is it?

[@NotYourAvgJoe24]

Sub’d Would you choose these over HollowGram Knot R-SL 64?

[@boriente]

I am interested to know your thoughts on any of Prime's carbon wheels.

[@PeakTorque]

The rims are made in Xiamen but the hubs and bearings are a bit cheap. My friends have them. Ok for the money but the bearings won't last a winter.

[@reginaldscot165]

Literally buying new carbon rims for rim brakes every 6-9 years is way cheaper than running disc brakes for a month. The hyper rims are only $250 USD a set. How many disc brakes and pads would you run though in the same time?

[@TrickyTree84]

Been using the same rotors since 2018.

[@theillegalimmigrant9314]

You can use second hand bearings too Reggie

[@Ni1zz]

Reg disks how are the Campas doing?

[@PeakTorque]

Fine!

[@ShowMeThePony]

Totally unrelated to the point of this video, but can anyone explain these modern gear ratios for me? Just getting back into cycling for health reasons. Raced bikes (cat2) throughout the late 80’s up until around 2005. Always rode 52/42or39 with a 12-23 cassette. Heck, I remember crit racing early on with a 13-21 “straight block” Looking to update the drivetrain on an older bike and everything seems to be 50/34 and 11-32? “Back in my day” 👴🏻 we climbed everything in a 39-23. Why does it take a 34-32 now?? Honest question before I start ordering parts. Thx and my apologies if I’m hijacking.

[@AG-el6vt]

I think the preffered climbing technique has evolved from 'grinding' at lower rpm and more often out of the saddle, to 'spinning' with higher cadence. This means you need lower bottom gear ratios. I'm not sure why this change happened, but I've read somewhere when you pedal at higher cadence and corresponding lower gears (that is, similar power output), the strain on the body is shifted from muscles to heart. At least that's what I hear, could be bollocks and more related to how the current generation of doping substances work. Edit: I've also realised recently that modern Pro Tour climbs (Angliru, Zoncola...) often show inclines above 15%, while in classic climbs like e.g. Alpe d'Huez it's rare to see over 10%. I suspect this recent 'incline inflation' is more related to advances in doping than anything else, but there's this trend to consider.

[@ShowMeThePony]

@@AG-el6vt I once laughed at the old guys that coveted their down tube friction shifters on their lugged, Campy equipped, steel frames. And they mocked me for using a heart rate monitor and dual-control brake/shift levers. I also remember Sean Kelly being mocked for running a 13-25 instead of a 12-23 at the 89 Wold Championship road race! I’m just taking up indoor cycling via RGT and Training Peaks. The data alone is a workout to comprehend! 😂 I just ordered my parts. Went with the 11-28 because I can at least tell myself it’s a Mtn bike ratio. 20 year old me is now mocking myself! Crankset I ordered is also a 50/34. I’m old, but a 34-28 vs 39-23 just seems insane. At 90rpm 34-28 is 8.6mph. A 39-23 is 11.9mph. And not to mention, what happened to 172.5 cranks? They’re all 170’s now? And don’t get me started on these 28-32mm tires!? 🤦🏼‍♂️what happened to racing on 20mm sewups and training on 23’s!? Anyway… I digress. Haha

[@swites]

Depends on gradients and what type of riding ur doing. 34x28 is just more enjoyable than a 39x25 on hilly terrain as easier on your leg and back muscles so makes one want to climb more imo. But harder on your lungs so takes adjusting. If I'm riding zone 2 (200watts) here I'm often around 55 rpms in my 34x32 as quite steep. 39x23 I'd be dying! Sure not an issue if one rides at 400+watts all day, but how many of us amateurs does that? Especially us older guys:)

[@christianmaschka]

@PT What shoes are you running?

[@PeakTorque]

Rx8 Gravel shoe and mtb pedals

[@wesw6787]

@@PeakTorque weren’t you on Lake shoes before? Not content with them?

[@PeakTorque]

@@wesw6787 they are a tad too wide for me, and i have wide feet. They're also really heavy, and even heavier when wet being natural leather.

[@wesw6787]

@@PeakTorque Thanks for the reply. Idd, my CX332 are als heavy and rain+leather does not help. Also noticed quite some difference in the last measurement between left+right(1-3mm) for 3 pairs of Lakes that I had in my hands. QC clearly in line with carbon manufacturing standards for the cycling industry ;-)

[@thomasullmann7447]

Is this Reigate?

[@PeakTorque]

Fuck yeh

[@spartanbike2260]

try the new shimano RT-CL900 rotors these are better. the xtrs have been discontinued .

[@MTBScotland]

Are they shimano pads? 160mm discs are too small for those kinda descents in my opinion. I've fucked a 160 ice-techs off road. Pads/discs got so hot they stuck to the disc. That was the rear - never used 160 since.

[@pigupigu]

Campag rotors are really good

[@mohoyer]

Which setup exactly is the "road tt baseline"? You said you're running these for your own road TTs, so I wasn't clear what other setup you're referring to in the graphs.

[@PeakTorque]

Road 'tt' position with these wheels. All the wheel tests are done in the upright hoods position

[@mohoyer]

Ah, same setup, different position. Got it, thanks :)

[@truthseeker8483]

Thanks..just convinced me to stay with rim brakes 😁😁😁😁😁😁😁

[@dtolios]

Maybe stick with solid Steelies for Rotors? Sure, IceTech sandwich is lightweight and all that, but...maybe stick with the RT70 (105/SLX grade) ? Solid steel throughout and more weight, but more weight = more heat mass and perhaps less issues with warping because of dissimilar metals getting superheated and even a slight variation in thickness from the steel on either side of the rotor causing a slight warp towards the thinner side of steel which becomes a "feedback loop" of shorts wearing the thin side even faster? Just speculating here... Go RT70...or go full MTB-tard with 2.0mm rotors, say Sram HS2. They look pretty cool. If you can make them work w/o rubbing that is. Side bonus: you get rid of some of the "pumping loses" of the ICEtech cooling fins the 5yo whines about.

[@HaveFunBikes]

Yeah, editing my entire comment because now i've finished watching the video. Anyways, here's my two cents. Top of the line shimano rotors are a sandwich of aluminium core and stainless steel braking surface. Golden brown is a good color indication on the rotor and it is the pinnacle of the temperature indicated for the best performance. If it was bluish purple, it would be the indication that you needed to upsize the rotor because of fading problems. The problem there seems to be some some copper material of the friction pad melted, or some other contaminant, to get to this balled up point on the rotor. I would just sand down the pointy bit and keep using the rotor. Even if you manage to get bluish purple color you could just sand it with 80 grit perpendicular to the braking surface, the pads too, and bed in again. About the noise. Spoke noise made by you and the howling of the brakes are not the same frequency. Close, but not ressonant. Have you noticed that after the system got up to operating temperature, there was no noise? It is common for sintered pads to do this noise while being cold. They are better for longevity and long descents as they are harder. If you are not dragging the brakes, change for the bs01 shimano pads. They are softer organic, bite better, don't make noise, but fade a little bit quicker. If the pad swap is not enough, you can go to Sram HS2 rotors that are thicker, or any other 2 milimiters rotors. Galfer pads are awesome too. If you want more power, look in to 4 piston mtb shimano calipers (they do work since the main piston, lever, is the same diameter) or the 4 piston Hope calipers for shimano road brakes. I've been mountain biking for at least 18 years, testing, tweaking and gathering information around the internet, reviews and tests for a long time. If you don't want to spend more money, remove the balled up part of your rotor, install BS01 pads and be happy. If you wanna throw money at the problem, take hope calipers and organic pads with a thicker rotor. enduro-mtb.com/en/best-mtb-disc-brake-can-buy/ Don't entirely go by their choices, the cura 2 is absolutely beast, and they haven't tested the "shigura" combo. kzbin.info/www/bejne/pXeVp3SFotWfi6s Here is more details about rotor size and system temperature. Cheers!

[@PeakTorque]

Cheers for your comment. The noise is always present, even after heating. It comes on with a certain lever force, less than or more than, it goes away. So it is resonant behaviour to me (i design stiff driveline systems for a living). I don't often use ice tech rotors, just had these lying around and I have numerous wheels on test. On all the others i run solid steel with no such problem. I have other videos where I have delaminated ice tech xtr rotors completely due to heat where the steel laminate starts ro peel up (with Shimano pads). Not fit for purpose for a fat lad like me riding hard.

[@MazingerZX]

That front bar bag kind of negates all the aero-ness of the bike and wheels?

[@StanEby1]

Eminently logical, Spock would say. Like your point about assymtrical spoke tension. This also causes bike destabilization esp. on fast corners. Racers should not use disc brakes. I wonder if anything might cause rotors to magnetize and thus pickup small metallic particles. If you said that and I missed it, my apologies. All the best!

[@Hebbs]

No such braking noise with my D67’s

[@o0o0o0o0o01]

How wide is your front tire measuring up? I have Conti 5000 TR S in 28 and the front tire measured just over 29 and the rear slightly under 29 on my D45. Would guess from an aero perspective a 25mm would be better altough you say otherwise in your video. Maybe yours is slightly narrower because it's the older version? Thanks for clearing that up