Pen Rodeo - The Allure of the Vector

[@davidanderson3425]

There is a clear winner here, in my view. When you were making the short vertical lines it was the Medium nib on the new Vector XL that was worthy of a 'wow' for its lovely wetness. I agree, the old Vector is a bit 'meh' but the new Medium nib on the XL has a real touch of character for such an inexpensive pen. Thanks for doing the comparison. Very enjoyable.

[@WaskiSquirrel]

The Vector XL was certainly wetter. But, to be fair, I wonder what the medium nib is like on the Allure?

[@sajjadhusain4146]

@@WaskiSquirrel ..It is great. My Allure has a wet, wide, consistent M nib. I like it a lot.

[@mojavejoe190]

It warms my heart that you kept your first Parker Vector so long. I would have loved such a pen with my whole heart-yet the pen gods would make sure I promptly lost it, or broke it, or that one of the fine scholars I went to school with would snatch it out of my hands and crush it under foot before my very eyes.

[@WaskiSquirrel]

I was always very careful with writing utensils, whether pens or pencils. You are right: those fine scholars were certainly in my school, but I was never one of those people they tried anything physical with.

[@ichirofakename]

Such enthusiasm!

[@WaskiSquirrel]

I'm excited to have found these two pens!

[@frankbruno7122]

Great job man! Really appreciate your work and.. your pens! Frank in Colorado

[@WaskiSquirrel]

Glad you enjoyed!

[@bikkies]

I'm glad that Parker has managed to pull off a positive reboot of an old pen on this occasion, as compared with the painful disappointment of the 2021 P51 against the Proper P51. Shows they can still do it when they put their mind to it.

[@WaskiSquirrel]

The modern 51 was a big disappointment. I don't see myself ever buying one. But, this Vector and the Allure are great, and the Vector is a real improvement on the original.

[@bikkies]

@@WaskiSquirrel I bought a steel nibbed 2021 51 which had flow issues. Foolishly bought another to see if was a one-off but the same behaviour was seen. That's where I called a halt. I'm curious about the gold nib version, but not curious enough to pay that pricetag for another disappointment. Not when I have several gold nibbed vintage 51s that, of course, work flawlessly. I'd definitely recommend the Jinhao 86 for basically the same pen as the steel 2021 51, and the Jinhao 85 is also very competent. The only downsides to both are: more turns to uncap, only EF nibs available, and of course no QC/after sales. For the price, I'm happy with those points as trade-off.

[@martynsnan]

My Waterman Graduate and Allure pens are identical apart from the material used. The names are as described by the retailers so I don't know if there is another version. The Allure is a good, inexpensive pen but I do find the metal section of the Graduate to be slippery in use. Thanks for the review.

[@WaskiSquirrel]

I've never liked metal sections for exactly that reason. Thank you for letting me know what the Graduate is like!

[@NelsonFJ]

​@@WaskiSquirrel Mine has a plastic grip (a "steel" alure, without the cap ring). So The Waterman Allure has a steel version? which is different from the Waterman Graduate, which has a metal section and body? I'm confused. Even in the ads for "Waterman Graduate" the pens have plastic grips and metal barrels. Now I'm confused. Also discovered a vintage Waterman Graduate. This confusion will problably result in me buying all this pens ... (=

[@tadeobiologo]

There's also the Waterman Graduate, which is exactly the same pen in other finishes. And the nib and feed are identical to the Waterman Expert III. I replaced the M nib in my Expert III (very wide for an M) with the F on my Graduate and it worked perfect!

[@WaskiSquirrel]

Interesting about the Waterman Expert. I haven't ever tried that pen!

[@sajjadhusain4146]

@@WaskiSquirrel…The Waterman Expert is a great, dependable writer and looks attractive enough. It is also an excellent alternative to the cheaper, very slender Hemisphere and the more expensive, more stylish gold nibbed Carene. But a caveat: in my experience, Waterman’s M nibs, particularly, write markedly wider than you’d expect. A medium-broad, easily.

[@frankbruno7122]

As an aside.. a great physician in the UK who makes great sense with public health policy.. Dr. John Campbell.. is always using his dark red Vector.. I had a dark blue one but did have it stolen at work in 1990's Frank in Colorado

[@WaskiSquirrel]

I've seen some footage of him. I love that he uses a red Vector because a pen just like that was my first fountain pen.

[@BeOurBee]

It looks like part of the marque differentiation between new Parker and Waterman is that the Parkers come with a medium nib and Watermans come with a fine, at least for these entry-level models. They also pack in different inks (Parker Quink vs. Waterman formulas) and cartridges. I don't think they've messed with the traditional Parker vs. Waterman ink formulas, so at least those are still more distinct than the pen bodies. I've got an Allure, picked it up at Office Depot/Max last year. The ink in the stock cartridge is the exact same as bottled Waterman Serenity Blue (formerly Florida Blue), which has a very indigo sheen in some fine nibs but writes bluer in anything broader. I've refilled a disposable Pilot Varsity with Serenity Blue, it has a (buttery smooth!) medium nib. Compared to Pilot's stock blue ink it's a bit lighter, and shows just a bit of shading with the same nib. Between the Allure and the Varsity with the same Serenity Blue, it comes out looking a little "blurple" from the fine nibbed Allure and just plain blue from the Varsity's medium. Waterman inks are pretty good on pedestrian stuff like copy paper, they don't feather as much as a lot of other fountain pen inks and are very affordable. The reason I picked up the Allure is because I like the understated styling: a plane, cylindrical, non-cigar-shaped fountain pen with minimal flourishes and ornamentation. I'm not really satisfied with the nib, though. Looks like I can swap the section with a Parker if I want a medium nib in the same body. I'm wondering if any 3rd party feeds and nibs are compatible with these pens.

[@WaskiSquirrel]

That's interesting! I was sure there were multiple nib sizes, but I can't find them right now. And you are right that the pens take the traditional cartridges/converters for the brand. Thank you for the details on Waterman ink. I have no experience with it, but I know I should, and I know they are reliable. Your description of the pen is right. It's an attractive model, whether Parker or Waterman...

[@ferrypen4952]

2 really nice looking pens, I will most likely go for the Parker as I do like the look of the transparent section.

[@martinlebl631]

If I was to get one of these, then that would also be the draw for me. Plus the nostalgia of the Vector name, as I went through many in the nineties. They were cheap, but rarely lasted longer than a year. I wrote a lot, and those barrels and caps kept cracking on me. A few became very broad as the nib would broaden as it wasn't really hardened. This was hell if you just used cartridges. Now I like broads, and perhaps this is why, but with bottled ink it isn't as much of an issue.

[@ferrypen4952]

Agree about he longevity I always seemed to overtighten mine and up splitting the barrel.

[@martinlebl631]

@@ferrypen4952 Even if you were careful, it would split eventually, merely extending the time a bit. What it had going for it was that it had no retail competitor at the price level, and it wrote alright.

[@WaskiSquirrel]

I agree: the transparent section gives a slight edge to the Vector!

[@ferrypen4952]

I ended up getting the Waterman as Amazon were selling it for half the price of the Parker! Added bonus is it works with a standard international converter.

[@Johan-vk5yd]

Thanks for the comparison! Reminds me of the car industry collaborations during the last decades. You got yourself one Volkswagen and one Audi. Or is it a Skoda or Seat?

[@WaskiSquirrel]

I definitely do not have an Audi in either one!

[@sathishrao7926]

I’ve a funny (or sad ?) story ! Jotter costs a whopping $50 in India, so I ordered it from Amazon US and my friend who was to carry it from US lost it somewhere and I never got to see it ! The ‘regular’ Vector costs just around $5 though (probably because it is made locally).. Hope you’ve figured out which establishment in China is making XL and Allure and you’re all set to reveal the secret in an upcoming video 😉

[@WaskiSquirrel]

The Jotter here costs about $14, so that is quite a price jump! Your price of $5 for the Vector is only a tiny bit more than what I paid back in the mid 1980s... I'm looking into who is making these pens. According to another commenter, there are already Chinese fakes out there...

[@nikossiotas]

All throughout vector xl and waterman allure seem the same from outside, the difference is inside them. Parker needs its proprietary cartridges and converter but waterman can use international standard cartridges and converter. This give you the option to get cheap standard international cartridges and also allows you to use a plethora of ink colors from many brands compared to parker cartridges. The only thing i like in vector xl compared to allure is that has transparent body at the bottom.

[@WaskiSquirrel]

That's a good way to describe the different between these pens. I wonder why Parker, now as part of a larger company, never made the switch to a standard international?

[@nikossiotas]

@@WaskiSquirrel Probably for consistency between their models, so you can take out your half used cartridge from one model and putting it to another. Same thing with their converter. A change now it will creating a conflict between the newer and the older ones. I don't have anything against Parker cartridges actually, maybe they are more expensive in local stores than a standard international, but they hold more ink inside in comparison with a big standard international.

[@bhoola123]

John Campbell, the great Covid explainer, is now using the Vector XL, green model too.

[@WaskiSquirrel]

That's awesome! In the fountain pen world, everybody notices his pen.

[@martinlebl631]

Amazon still seems to have many of the original Vectors, so who knows if it is "out of print."

[@WaskiSquirrel]

I wasn't clear about this either. And one commenter here says that the original continues to be made in India.

[@jamerelbe]

I've been looking at these two pens with interest, and wondering about buying one (but not both). Which of the two would you recommend Mr Squirrel, assuming prices were roughly equal?

[@WaskiSquirrel]

They are essentially the same pen. I like the looks of the Vector better, but the disadvantage is that choice locks you into proprietary Parker cartridges and converters.

[@MrAndrew1953]

If you buy a new Parker 51 for say $100 you will get a pen with Vector nib worth say $30. New XL looks snappy but I think I'd opt for the Allure. Snappier cap. It's more Alluring.

[@WaskiSquirrel]

Punny!!!!!

[@tiramisucocolands7952]

Which one would you recommend between Vector XL and Jotter for Fine nib? I like XL's colors better but Jotter is cheaper.

[@WaskiSquirrel]

I preferred the Vector. But I think the nibs do have a similar feel.

[@tiramisucocolands7952]

@@WaskiSquirrel Ok, thank you. I've realized after writing, Vector XL doesn't have fine nib oprion in my region 😅 I will have to search more about Waterman Allure to convince myself it's better

[@andinogonthaler787]

¿Can you swap sections, caps, etc.?

[@WaskiSquirrel]

Caps can be swapped. Sections cannot.

[@1welshdevil]

I was about to order a bottle of Cross ink to try, I watched this video, I got so distracted, that I have ordered a bottle of Washable Blue Quink, (another one 🙈🤣.)

[@WaskiSquirrel]

I have never tried Cross ink, but I do know that Washable Blue is good stuff!

[@paulherman5822]

Getting the Vector instead of the Sheaffer was a good call, most likely. The Sheaffer was probably the student one, which was okay, but after starting with a lovely writing Esterbrook, the Sheaffer student pens steered me away from fountain pens for decades... (Even the clapped out Wearever I had in high school wrote better...) I have a Sheaffer Fineline, which was the model that became the student pen, and it is still much better than the few student pens I got in the early 1990s. You seem to be fortunate to have gotten a good pen to start your fountain pen journey. As for the modern Newell Rubbermaid offerings, I really can't say, other than, though I own the Vacumatic Parker 51, I'm not so stuck on it that I'd never consider the modern 51, except it strikes me as being made out of the spare parts bin, and comparatively overpriced (when the $12.50 the original cost is about $150 in today's money...) It isn't necessary to pay a lot to get a pen that you can like. There's decent budget ones, as this experiment proves. Even if a few just get a different brand stamped on them. 😁

[@WaskiSquirrel]

I had a good introduction to the fountain pen world! And, yes, there are good fountain pens at a decent price. As for the modern 51: I have no interest.

[@paulherman5822]

@@WaskiSquirrel Neither really push the right buttons for me. But, still had to try such an iconic pen.

[@sajjadhusain4146]

To my eyes, the Waterman Allure’s nib looks very slightly different to the Parker Vector XL’s nib. The feeds look identical, though I’d point out that it is the same feed I’ve seen on some Waterman Expert pens (though that pen has a different nib). So, I wonder if it’s more a case of the Vector XL nib and feed being a derivative/copy of the Waterman Allure’s, than the other way around. After watching this video, I’m more convinced that, if pressed to choose, I’d prefer the Allure. It looks better. And I reckon I’d like it in the hand better than I would the new Vector. I’m not familiar with the Waterman Graduate. ‘Back in the day’ I’d pick a Sheaffer No Nonsense over a Parker Vector every day of the year. And I did. I still will.

[@tadeobiologo]

There's probably a minor adjustment at the tail of the feed due to the different diameter of the cartridge openings, but besides that, anything else is cosmetic.

[@WaskiSquirrel]

I couldn't see any differences in nibs other than cosmetic differences and the size of the tipping. Good to know about the Waterman Expert. To me, both pens feel about the same. I have no experience with a Sheaffer No Nonsense, so I can't comment intelligently about that.

[@jimmymac383]

It is a fact that the Queen liked the paker 51 your doing a review about a pen do not mention whether you like the British royal family British people do not give a fuck what you think just review the funking pen

[@WaskiSquirrel]

It seems to bother you that I responded to a comment and stated that I was not a royalist.

[@jimmymac383]

@@WaskiSquirrel yes I mite have taken it the wrong way but am big enough to admit it my apologies