Penn Jigmaster comparison Made in USA vs Chinese manufactured is there a difference? YES!

[@moneyblackblood]

I have a "made in Philadelphia USA" model from the late 80's or early 90's that has more internal brass than the Chinese model you have there. It's something I am thankful for. I didn't take super good care of it as a teenager, and now that I am getting into fishing again after a quick clean it works great. No corrosion on the brass, but there is a little on the stainless steel parts. Thanks so much for your awesome channel, you have really helped a lot with the cleaning process.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

You are welcome. I appreciate the feedback and your viewership. Best wishes - Dennis

[@tapeglue8315]

Thanks for the great content. I think you summarized the whole thing in 1 sentence - "In the end, it doesn't matter who makes the reel, what matters is the compromises that the brand makes to save a few cents. I believe that is what happened here." I agree. Where ever the reel comes from, it is made to the price point requested. I don't see anyone complaining about their poorly manufactured iPhones so it's generally not true to say that a particular country can't make quality goods. For the record, I collect the old Penn's.... I like the charm and history of the US made ones ;)

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Thank you for the feedback - Dennis

[@xaviercheryba870]

I love the old Bakelite handles. They are a signature part of old penns and when I see them I get exited

[@mario7mag]

I have replaced some of my newer early 2000's penn reel handles with the older bakelite ones. Love them and just give it more character.

[@riccardocarbo2479]

@@mario7mag They aren't Bakelite.

[@jeffreybabino8161]

Yes me too I like the old style handels

[@steveokon5431]

I've learned so much from you Dennis! Thanks to you and your videos.. vintage Penn reels are my faves and you've helped shed the light on these ,, take apart, clean, service etc. Thank you again

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Glad to help. Thanks for the kind words - Dennis

[@URanInTheUglyForest]

I bought a pair of identical Ambassadeur 7000's from a gentlemen a few years back. One was made in Sweden, the other in China. I thoroughly cleaned and serviced both reels, which were both in excellent condition. When done, the reel manufactured in Sweden was smoother in all modes of operation and was especially noticeable in the spool bearings. If purchased new, I would rather save up money a little longer to get a better product.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

There is no question in my mind that there is a significant difference in the two. Just as you described. And it's not just the bearings, which I can't confirm, but I know the handles, side plates and other parts are not up to the prior quality. Thanks for the comment and thanks for watching - Dennis

[@PythonDad]

I am thankful for your objective look at the matter of foreign built vs. built in the US (or built in Sweden for Abu Garcia, built in Japan for Daiwa/Shimano, etc). Domestic reels have become incredibly cost prohibitive, especially for those who wish to have a wide array of reels for different situations. And even as far down the product line as the Battle II, the Chinese made Penn reels really are not bad. I have a Clash 2000 that I mainly use in freshwater, and I don't have any complaints about it. I will probably get a Clash II as well, as they have actually made significant upgrades to its durability in saltwater situations (more superficially, I also like the new color scheme). I also use a Fathom 15 for surf fishing, and it has impressed me the whole time that I have used it. Both of these product lines are made in China, but I've heard only minor criticisms of each of them from from any reputable outlets. It's hard for me to pay an extra 300 dollars for the made in the US tax and only minimal additional features. As you point out, the bigger issue is the corners that the manufacturer decides to cut with materials, quality assurance, tolerances, etc.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Thanks for the feedback Thomas. I appreciate you taking the time to write. Please stay safe and well during the pandemic

[@bobl4451]

I remember using my old jigmaster on the fishing barges off the southern california coast.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

I have a brother in Huntington Beach who has told me of the fun trips to fish off of the barges! The older Jigmasters will continue to fish long after we stop...if properly maintained. - Dennis

[@LBCAndrew]

@@2ndChanceTackle I didn't to much barge fishing but I spent a lot of time growing up on Don Ashley's boats out of Long Beach. Aztec, Toronado, Enterprise, City of Seal Beach, and the ancient G.W.

[@rontruocchio5744]

thanks denis. nothing like a buffed and polished american made jigmaster sitting on a shelf with your other cherished artifacts. the reel that put it there was a daiwa 50h and the year was 1971. i adjusted the handle to the power setting and never looked back. the daiwa 50h sits on a ted williams rod i bought the same day and is still my go to set up for anything outside the inlet.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

You bet! The 50H is among my absolute all time favorites, You just cannot beat the high speed (for the day) retrieve, ball bearings, aluminum frame and total over-engineering of that reel. Best wishes - Dennis

[@riccardocarbo2479]

The bridge isn't S.Steel. It's Nickel plated brass but could have some chrome in it. The handles are chrome plated brass. The handle isn't bakelite, and I'm not sure what it is, but it's probably nylon/ABS. Those eccentric springs either lasted forever or broke soon, as you said. My opninon is that it's not about being made in China; it's a cheaper means of production, directed by Penn, of course. A long time ago, (circa 70s), when they were American made and afterward as well, Penn used cold-rolled steel which made sense for a gear because it has higher corrosion resistance and hardness, aslo by adding chromium 16% and nickel 8% to it. But if fishermen attribute the changes to being "made in China" I think they'd be wrong. They are simply cost-cutting changes that would have happened, even at 3028 West Hunting Park Ave., Pennsylvania. ((The best and worst of Harley Davidson bikes were both made in the USA. Now, more are made in China. Their efforts to resucitate H.D. are doomed, as an American manufacturer.)). Thanks for the comparison. I have the JigM. 500HS. USA... and it's fabulous.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

That's been my opinion all along. It is not whose hands put it together, it's who made the engineering decisions to use a cheaper or more cost effective method to build the reels. As you pointed out, they would be the same poorer quality here if they changed the manufacturing specs and materials. Dennis

[@riccardocarbo2479]

I sent you an email about a bail wire. :)

[@sirfishalot923]

Thanks for that perspective. So they save on labor and cheaper materials

[@cyrus7210]

I found an old maroon side plate Jigmaster 500 at a garage sale. It's mounted on a solid fiberglass rod, looks to be a trolling rod. It's 6 1/2 ft with 2 ft being the grip. There's no markings on the road at all. But on to the real. All I've done to it is to clean it up on the exterior and clean and lube inside. Works perfectly. This setup works very well flat lining for stripers out of my kayak. Penn fishing reels from back in the day are hard to improve upon. I'm fortunate to have run up on this one....

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Sounds like a great combination ready to catch lots of fish!....Again!

[@cyrus7210]

@@2ndChanceTackle Yeah, I'd like to hear the stories this thing could tell. I'm gonna give it every chance to catch some more....

[@2ndChanceTackle]

If the reels and tackle could talk! Best wishes for great fishing - Dennis

[@carlosprovost5765]

This is one of my favorite size reels. I have a regular maroon jigmaster a jigmaster high speed and a newell 338-5. I picked up all 3 for $75.

[@jeffreybabino8161]

Just reasontly picked up a penn 309 m really like it thanks

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Enjoy - it is a nice reel

[@arturoerickson1799]

Difference? One will be used, loved, serviced and used some more. The other, goes into the landfill.

[@urbanangler1576]

I love my vintage Penn Jigmaster! I Plan to pick up a few more American made versions on Ebay.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

You can still find them at a reasonable price. Good luck fishing! Dennis

[@urbanangler1576]

Thanks, Dennis! I have a question that maybe you can answer. I read somewhere that there is an aftermarket pinion gear for the Jigmaster that fits a bit more snug than the stock factory gear. This gear supposedly eliminates that slightest bit of wobble that we experience with the Jigmasters retrieve when reeling in line. Have you heard of this gear, and if so do you know where I can order one? if not, then is there another way to eliminate the retrieve wobble?

[@urbanangler1576]

Correction...I think I meant to say gear sleeve, not pinion gear.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

There is an aftermarket stainless main gear, gear sleeve and spool gear available. I have not explored these as the cost is significant. There are two causes for the wobble. One could be the worn internal diameter of the gear sleeve. The other could be where the post attaches to the bridge plate. Please make sure that the post is secure and not turning before you do any upgrades. - Dennis

[@urbanangler1576]

Thanks again, Dennis! I will do a teardown of the reel before my next trip and see what I find.

[@jeffreybabino8161]

Bought my first one about two years ago so far so good

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Just keep it clean and lubed and it will will be problem free for a long time - Dennis

[@freddy2064]

I was planning on moving my old vintage Penn Jigmaster but after seeing videos on KZbin, I'm holding on to them. American made is always better!

[@2ndChanceTackle]

There is no question that the older ones were better made than the newer versions. Smart idea to hold on to them - Dennis

[@freddy2064]

@@2ndChanceTackle Thank you for sharing your passion and knowledge.

[@jeffreybabino8161]

If you have them don't give them up unless you want to

[@joselopezgarcia528]

Great video sir, keep up the good work :)

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Thank you Jose - Best wishes - Dennis

[@jorgearispe5208]

Hace unos años Tuve la suerte de encontrar uno original 😂 no saben lo contento que estoy con el ... ahora que lo usare para pescar maki maki

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Thanks you for the note. Best wishes for great fishing with the reel - Dennis

[@AhmedTools]

Thanks a lot for this great vide but now I have two questions, are they still producing Penn at USA or moved all manufacturing to China? and if there are still some factories at USA, how can I know when I buy from Amazon or ebay if they are made in China or USA? I assume at China they can easily stick made in USA at the boxes.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Only a few models are still made in the Philadelphia facility These are primarily the International big game reels and the Senators. Everything else is made in China and the basic way to tell is if the reel says made in the USA it was and if it does not, it wasn't - Dennis

[@joeblowjohnny2297]

Hi , my penn jigmaster cover say made in USA but it has the black rubber grip handle . So what that means ? I hate to take it apart to find out cause it work really good . Thanks for your input .

[@2ndChanceTackle]

It is either a later version of the reel prior to the changeover to the Chinese manufacture, or the handle has been replaced with an updated version. Penn has been using the rubber handle for quite some time, so it is not unusual. Either way, trust the stamping and not the handle. - Thanks for asking - Dennis

[@joebyrne6211]

Hi Dennis, I am assuming that the newer China made reels don’t say “Made in USA” on them? Just looking for a quick way to tell the difference at a glance. Thanks!

[@2ndChanceTackle]

The new ones have a little sticky tag that says made in China that is often removed. Here are a few differences I have noticed since manufacture shifted about ten years ago. First, if you have a red side plate model, that is definitely made in the USA. Now the other differences. I notice the new Jigmasters have the Penn 500 on the gear side plate by the free spool release lever. It is not in a circle like the older versions. The Chinese versions all have the rubber handle knob. If you have a bullet bakelite handle knob, it is an older USA version. The non gear side plate on the Chinese models have a very plain Penn Jigmaster in bold letters Penn above the bearing and Jigmaster below the bearing. If you have an embossed side plate with Penn in larger letters or other fancier looking side plates, they are older. Cross posts. If you have single cross posts and not the double bar with 3 holes, then it is USA. Some late USA models had the double bar cross posts, so check the other items, like side plates. There could be more and this is not definitive, but it is a start. Dennis

[@pabpab871]

Thanks!

[@2ndChanceTackle]

You are welcome. I have other Jigmaster videos posted if you are interested in rebuilding or repairing one

[@fishingGator01]

The bridge and main gear are not stainless steel. The main gear is chromed steel. The bridge is chromed brass.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Thank you for the clarification. It is still a far better combination than they are using today.

[@GarthGoldberg]

@@2ndChanceTackle If you want stainless gears, you need to go with Newell. I have a set. But frankly, they're noisier than Penn and I don't really think they're better. And stainless will also corrode under some conditions. Penn went with stainless reel feet and spools at the end of their U.S. manufacture in some models. Is that better or worse? I don't know. I think the price of stainless went down to the point where it was cheaper to use stainless than to chrome brass.

[@johnmckroidskayakfishingad2006]

I had a few jig masters back in the late 70's. None of mine had Chromed main gears. Newel made a kit that one could by with a stainless steel main gear.

[@tidedownoutdoors5411]

In your opinion, is one better off to purchase Older USA reels and rebuild them as needed, or can you go with the newer reels if you have a strict cleaning regiment. The Jigmaster is my favorite "do it all" reel. I have 4 older USA models that I have picked up over the years. All but one of them has had work done on them. Right now, I have more in them (repairs/shipping) than I would buying new ones, but I just love the old school stuff. Just wondering if I'm being too stubborn in refusing to buy a Chinese Penn. Especially since I do own other foreign products from Shimano, Okuma and even Penn. Thanks and great channel!

[@2ndChanceTackle]

The newer Chinese ones are fine. I tried to make a point in the video, that the differences show up under heavy usage. That's daily trips, 270 days a year. The different metals corrode and the lighter springs fatigue earlier, but the design, gears and drags are all the same. If you take care of them, they will take care of you. The cost to rebuild could be as high as the new one, and you would get the replacement parts used in the new ones, so I think getting the new one is probably the answer. - Dennis

[@tidedownoutdoors5411]

Thanks, meant to say Chinese jigmaster up there! Looks like I'll give the new ones a go then. I fish maybe every two weeks on average and don't always bring the jigmasters (inshore trips) so maybe I won't tax them enough for it to be an issue. Thanks again for the response!

[@user-lh8bg8zd3y]

That USA made Jigmaster has the sticker displaying the model instead of the embossed text. The very first Jigmasters had those stickers instead and no lettering on the left sideplate, so that reel was probably from 1958-59.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Thanks for the additional information - Dennis

[@thomasweldon8935]

It's amazing the sticker is still there. I live/fish So Cal, I can't recall ever seeing that sticker, just the raised logo in the bakelite. I have two or three milkcrates full of old Penns, I am going to check for reels with no logo.

[@Valerifon1]

Great video! Can you convert my 2 Chinese-made jigmaster reels over to the American-made version?

[@2ndChanceTackle]

The conversion depends on parts availability, which is difficult as the US parts are gone.

[@ernieg4526]

Great video explaining why American made is better, just subscribed tight lines

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Thanks for the sub! This is holding so true. Too many of the newer reels are coming in with metal freeze ups and corrosion issues not found in the older models - Dennis

[@ichadw1239]

So penn china or penn usa for most bigfish? Just different material for two product?

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Same design, just material changes. Either reel is good for the big fish. The later versions require more frequent cleaning and care, because of the newer materials used in them, but the reel itself, from an engineering view is the same and parts are interchangeable between the versions

[@jeffreybabino8161]

What do you think of the reel the penn 9 m Any good thanks 😊

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Very good. Ideal for inshore ocean, lakes and bays.

[@jeffreybabino8161]

Ok thanks was thinking about getting one 😊

[@andrewmorke]

Dismissing the new 500 as junk is entertaining but misleading. Every single component on the new Penn 500 might not last 50 years, but at its price point it still beats the competition hands down. Some of the older Jigmasters also use a bronze alloy bridge instead of the chromed bronze bridge. Stainless steel was terribly hard to machine when the 500 was introduced, and it corrodes when fully immersed in water for a period of time. Bronze holds up much better to saltwater. Regardless, the 500 is a great boat reel, but I'd put the $65-$75 towards a Squall if my mission profile required any distance casting.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

I'm pretty sure I did not say they are junk. That is not my opinion. You have valid points on the cost and value. What I wanted to show is that Penn took economies that have reduced the lifespan of the reel. I repair these for a charter boat and I have too many examples of frozen gear sleeves and broken anti-reverse features well as broken free spool springs to dismiss this as random. It is the result of design and material changes. Having said that, these reels are used commercially and the average person will not notice the difference - Dennis

[@jeffreybabino8161]

Good basic reel jig master

[@2ndChanceTackle]

It is. A lot of charter boats use them. reasonable cost, easily serviced and durable - Thanks for the note - Dennis

[@jeffreybabino8161]

Yes I have heard that with the china made reels looking for a new penn jigmaster reel not sure

[@2ndChanceTackle]

They are still good reels, but the materials they use today are lesser quality than the older versions

[@jeffreybabino8161]

Thanks Dennis I appreciate your time and help 😊

[@turbolifestyle5783]

Hello , i have the chinese one is it possible to buy from you an american one in very good condition ? i am in Greece

[@2ndChanceTackle]

I will check. Can you send a note to my email [e-mail] for additional information? Thank you - Dennis

[@turbolifestyle5783]

@@2ndChanceTackle please check your email , thank you !

[@josephryan1576]

What are the differences between the squidder 140 and the jigmaster 500?

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Joseph - there are. a lot of differences. Here are a few more notable ones: Gear speed. The squidder uses a smaller main gear, so it has a lower retrieve ratio than the Jigmaster. Spool capacity. The Jigmaster has a wider spool, so it holds more line. Ball Bearings - The squidder has ball bearings imbedded in the side plates. Only the JigMaster 505 has this set up. The others do not. Profile: The squidder is similar to the Surfmaster 200 or Beachmaster 155. The Jigmaster is similar in profile to the Surfmaster 250 or the Long Beach 65. Use - The Squidder is better for surf casting. The JigMaster is better for trolling and deep drop fishing as well as, well, Jigging I hope this helps - Dennis

[@josephryan1576]

@@2ndChanceTackle The information you provided does help thank you.

[@riccardocarbo2479]

The Squidder came in a short and long spool version. Hence 140L. The Sqidder has an anti reverse switch which the Jigmaster does not, but which came with a higher gear ratio 5:1, such as what I have, 506HS. High Speed. The handle is a bit longer on the Jigmaster. Both reels are workhorses designed to last a lifetime. And whether the parts are nickel played or not depends not on the model but what year it was made. Oh, both reels have the quick take apart screw, whereas all the other reels do not. I love the 506HS. The shorter spool makes it less fussy w leveling line, less bulky n a bit more balanced in feel bcz it’s not wide. JM is ideal for boat, live lining, jigging n throwing metals needing fast retrieve. Very honestly built reels.

[@jeffreybabino8161]

About a month ago I looked at a new penn 209m reel handel looked bent

[@2ndChanceTackle]

You can straighten a bent handle in a vise. It should not be bent - Dennis

[@garylaubscher4487]

Your opening comment is you have had it several years.......... so it cant be so bad then.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

I did not mean to suggest that the newer model is a bad reel. It is not bad at all. The point of the video is that Penn has reduced the quality of the reel by substituting lower cost parts and my expectation is that the Burgundy side plated reel that I have will outlast the newer version by decades.

[@rupertmcnaughtdavis3649]

In other words, there is no comparison. From South Africa.

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Yes - two very different levels of materials and quality - Thanks for the note - Dennis

[@lakesideinc]

I received 2 Penn 500 reels in a yard sale.. one of each USA and China..both seem to work fine but a little dirty.... I loosened the screw but I cant get either one apart, I didn't want to pry them and chance breaking the bakelite,,,what can I do?

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Once you loosen the screw you need to grasp the frame with one hand and the handle/side plate with the other. When your hands are set, twist the side plate counter-clockwise about a quarter of a turn. This should free the side plate from the frame. You are correct. SO NOT PRY the side plate. It will crack - Dennis

[@tomsolanto]

Who’s fault is this? Seems like it’s Penn’s IMO. The Chinese company I would imagine is building it to Penn’s specs

[@2ndChanceTackle]

It is Penn engineering. It is not where the reel was/is assembled. Someone at Penn made the decision to go with cheaper parts.

[@tomsolanto]

@@2ndChanceTackle seems to be the way of the world we live in. What a shame. Those modifications of components makes a huge difference. Too bad...

[@sirfishalot923]

My problem with this is I think penn really made a bad business decision. People including myself would have payed the increase in price for the American made reel, built the way they were in Philadelphia. That's just me.

[@jeffreybabino8161]

A lot of people want a american made product

[@2ndChanceTackle]

These is a difference in the older US reels and the new stuff. The parts are not the same strength and they fail faster.

[@johneasler9967]

American made products are always better

[@2ndChanceTackle]

Unfortunately a lot of these that were made in the USA have been transferred overseas and no longer made here - Shame

[@moondog371]

I have a 506 it looks like the china parts inside.where the 506 ever made in china?

[@2ndChanceTackle]

The 506 was introduced in the mid 1980's, long before production was moved to China. I believe Chinese Jigmaster production started in 2005 or 2006. Jigmaster eels up until that time always included made in the USA on one to the side plates. I believe the 505HS and 506HS would show this in the circle on the gear side plate under the number. I am unsure how long the reel was in production. They are relatively rare, so they may have ended production prior to the transfer of manufacturing. - Dennis

[@moondog371]

oh thanks! had to ask!@@2ndChanceTackle