Festool Domino, Mafell Doweller or Lamello Zeta? [video

In todays slightly longer video I take a look at the three best portable jointing systems available; the #FestoolDomino, the #Mafell DDF40 DuoDoweller and the #Lamello Zeta P2. Enjoy!
If you liked the video give it a thumbs up, and subscribe for more weekly workshop videos. Check the blogpost that accompanies this video at bit.ly/10minute...
+++++++
Special Thanks for Alan Harrison at ProTrade - bit.ly/ProTrade...
Mafell Doweller at ProTrade - bit.ly/DDF40
Lamello Zeta P2 - amzn.to/2Xpu5vB (US: amzn.to/2Kufuv1)
Festool Domino - amzn.to/2pVSnMk (US: amzn.to/2o7E22Q)
Amazon store - bit.ly/10minute...
Channel blog here:- bit.ly/10minute...
My ‘social’ links in one place - www.10minutewo...
Support the channel directly - bit.ly/donate_t...
Support the channel on Patreon - / 10minuteworkshop
Full list of ‘Stuff I use’ at Full list of ‘Stuff I use’ at www.10minutewo...
Connect with me on twitter @10minuteshop
Connect with me on Instagram - @10minuteworkshop
+++++++
Related videos:-
10 year of Domino P1 • 10 Years of Domino Par...
10 Years of Domino Part 2 • 10 Years of Domino Par...
Domino follow-up • Domino Follow-up [vide...
One handed domino • One-handed Domino?? [v...
Dominos at 20mm centres • Dominos Close to the E...
Clamex or Connect • Domino Connect or Lame...
Zeta first job • My First Commercial Jo...
+++++++
As an Amazon Associate, I earn from qualifying purchases made through these links.
Wherever possible links are to actual products used, but this is not always possible e.g. some products are not available in the US, so something similar has been linked to instead.
Amazon UK - www.amazon.co....
++++++++

[@hhanger1]

I had a domino and sold it and then got the Mafell DDF40 after I saw one on display while on vacation in Munich. I'm just a hobbyist so probably won't get that much use out of it but it is joy to use. I find myself trying to think of projects just so I can use it.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

The Mafell’s a fine machine. I’m a long-term Domino user, so I found it a little slow and awkward to use in comparison, but I was happy with the results it produced. 👍👍

[@hhanger1]

@@10MinuteWorkshop yes, there is a pretty steep learning curve to take advantage of all of its capabilities. I find myself carrying my laptop out to the shop and watch their tutorials to refresh my memory. I can't bring myself, yet, to think about replacing my 8 year old TS55 for the Mafell MT55 but I did bite the bullet and get the p1cc jig saw which is a fantastic "piece of kit" as you Brits like to say! :)

[@hhanger1]

I couldn't help myself. Just sold the TS55 and got the MT55cc. What a fantastic piece of engineering. I hate the internet! It's cost me a lot of money! :)

[@bayernmunchen6762]

@@hhanger1 I love the mafell. I had an erika for 25 years and it stopped working. because of its age it could not be fixed. I bought a Makita mitre and am sorry that I did . its a fine machine but not the Mafell style. I have a festool - drill, driver, router, 1400, jig saw and will be selling them all and buying Mafell. I not in the business just love German tools.

[@k.b.woodworker3250]

Still in love with the Domino! Those other machines look cool, too! The wiggle room would be a key factor, both in terms of accuracy and of allowing wood movement since I often work with wood. Just made a bunch of face frames with the domino and it was effortless to get everything lined up and glued, just a quick sand to take off glue, no more sanding to get things flush. Life is good! Thanks for the great video.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Yep! Still very flexible and versatile; always a place in my heart & my workshop for a Domino. 👍👍

[@360S0DJefferson]

Thank you for the review of the three tools. The small details you've covered really help someone who's considering a purchase of one of the tools. You cover the simple important things that occur during day to day operation of the tool.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! I think it helps that the I’ve used the Domini and Zeta for a while, and was kindly allowed some time with the Mafell in order to familiarise myself with it. Glad the video has helped. 👍

[@martylts]

Funny how KZbin works, until today, I had never seen one of your videos. Nicely done! Hello from Utah United States.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thank you, and welcome! One of my Patreon supporters from your neck of the woods very kindly sent me a 'Ski Utah" t-shirt, something I hope to put into practice just as soon as I learn to ski! 😂Happy New Year from London!

[@jayv205]

I discovered your channel while looking for information on the Bosch GSS 160. Thanks to you I added a Zeta P2, a Domino 700 and a Rotex 90to the collection. After watching the grinder comparison, a Festool 130 duplex will follow. My wife will be so happy I don’t need a ddf 40 :)

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Haha, thanks Jay! 👍👍

[@gilbycoyote]

As a hobbyist I always found it difficult to justify the expense for any of those, but as we have a zeta at my workplace, I used it to build a Desk this year. What a breeze. It solved a million problems at once. Now a domino is on my list, as it’s the cheapest and most adapted to my needs. I don’t care to much for how the mafell dowels narrow stock.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

As a long-term Domino user, feel free to call me biased, but using all three of these together brought home just how versatile the domino is. As well as being the 'least expensive' of the three. 👍

[@SusiesRepeat]

I have only just now found your channel Peter, thanks very much for all the advice you give. I am retired and just a diy thirsting for carpentry knowledge. Your channel along with Finish Carpentry, Inside Carpentry, And Dave Stanton have helped me out a lot.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thank you, and welcome! 🙌

[@thomasbussey5824]

Wow, that seems like a massive oversight in the design of the IXConnect system. Thanks for pointing this out as I was researching specifically with knock down fixings in mind.

[@sadiporter2966]

maybe mafell should give them a call and get them to make 14mm versions. Alternatively mafell could make their own competitor to those fixings without violating the patent.

[@jasonlaverty76]

Just purchased a biscuit jointer from Aldi and I am just getting to grips with it. It is a step up from my self made dowel jig. It is not a pro tool by any means, but as I am DIY , i have a bit more time to play around with joints to get where I need it to. If its your business to get spot on joints to a deadline, then the Domino or the Mafell look the dogs dangles!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

I’m so tempted by one of those! 👍👍

[@Alastair_Freebird]

Ooh I imagine this will be a popular video! Just starting watching now, with interest!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Cheers Alastair. 👍

[@Alastair_Freebird]

Fantastically informative Peter and the direct comparison approach throws up a lot of interesting thoughts. For example seeing the resulting slots/holes created by each machine side by side immediately suggests that you are getting a bigger/stronger joint from either the lamello or the Mafell vs the Festool. I hadn’t seen those Hafele dowels close up before either and your point about their limits with drill depth in 18mm corner joints was helpful. These sorts of insights make your carefully planned and filmed videos very valuable 👍

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Cheers Alastair! To be fair I was using the second-smallest dominos for this vid - you can go significantly bigger if you need them, though tbh the ‘smallness’ of the domino slot is a real benefit when working on narrow stock eg rails. A well-glued domino joint is very strong - I’ve never had one fail in ~11 years of making cabinets with them. What jointing system are you sill using currently?

[@raycomer50]

I’ll stick with my Domino 500, the Zeta handles knock down builds better but I just can’t justify the cost for the small amount I do. Great review though, really detailed and non judgmental 👍 - and I love the fact that the Festool is the ‘cheap’ option 😂

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Yep, the Lamello’s great, but the most niche product ever. I did just fine with the domino for over 10 years, and if it wasn’t for a burning need for KD fittings (now just an ember, go figure) I’d still be using it exclusively. 👍👍

[@GeeTheBuilder]

I love my Domino nearly as much as my wife. It’s ok, my wife understands 😁

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

😂👍👍

[@paulwhite760]

there is a rubber attachment you can buy that turns it into a sex toy for wifey , that's why she doesnt mind.

[@aeromedical6750]

10 years from now, that Domino will still be joining boards together like a champ. The wife ...............

[@detroittrickster3327]

@@paulwhite760 lol

[@jimiwhat79]

I have none of them, I have owned a dewalt biscuit joiner for about 20 years now still working fine, and am very happy with it. I must say the original lamello biscuit joiner is more stable. When it breaks down I’ll look for something else.

[@attheworktable]

Always great information from your channel. I appreciate the comparisons between the three tools. I'm in the same frame of mind with Domino and the Lamello. Even though it is two systems, I still think that those two are in synergy.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Yes, very much so. And thanks! 👍

[@OstinKisuke]

Oh, that was surprisingly nice to see the mirock marking ruler in the video 😎

[@qn1010]

Festool is the cheapest ... don't hear that often

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Haha - I’ll go with ‘least expensive’ 🤷‍♂️👍👍

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

michaelbuddy Lots of folk make their own Dominos from scrap and offcuts. Harder to do that with dowels, impossible with the Lamello fixings. And the difference in cost between the doweller and the domino buys a *lot* of dominos.

[@whitey211]

I was going to say the same thing. And by a decent amount too.

[@TheDarthvader123]

People always complaining about Festool, but Mafell is the most overpriced brand in the wood machine industry.

[@SingleTrack66]

@@TheDarthvader123 however it is pretty much the best as well. You pays your money. VW ....BMW .....Porsche.

[@Benchdogtools]

A great review peter. I still love my domino machine and your right to say that I helps speeds up production. God knows how long it would have taken to make my daughters bed without it and the great connection sets.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Cheers Ralph!!

[@BischBaschBosch]

Great job mate. No fat in the vid just clear info. All the best.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Cheers Stu! 👍👍

[@jaronb007]

I have very much appreciated your content and the care in which you approach your work. I agonized over the decision between the Domino and the Duo. This video was very helpful to me. I'll be using the Duo for joinery as well as shelf hole pins, which saves me the cost of the LR32 system. I believe I'll add a Festool Domino XL down the road. Thanks again, I've learned a tremendous amount from your content.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks, glad the video helped and appreciate the comment! 👍👍

[@HondoTrailside]

I bought a couple of biscuit joiners after they went off patent. Great system, and the biscuits are easily available and cheap. Domino would have made it in the shop, except as an amateur who normally does real joinery, I can't justify it. If I was a lot younger I would get the worth out of it. But at 60, there is not enough utility for my needs. I have used biscuits to destruction in certain applications, and all you need if they will not be strong enough is something like a dowel. The biscuits are super strong bond wise, but can in certain applications use extra support across the short axis. A dowel is poorly bonded, but strong across the axis. I was not impressed at the quality of construction of Festool as revealed in AVE's deconstruction of their chop saw, so the money is not going into making solid tools, whereas my Dewalt and PC biscuit joiners are pro quality, and cost about 1/10th - 1/5th what Festool comes in at. Also, there is no domino advantage strength wise in shallow penetration joints. I just made an easel where a plate of 3/4 ply is attached to side runners. There is only abou 1/2" to get a hold on, if you don't want the joints to print through, and no way the joint can be split off on the short axis. Bombproof in biscuits. Biscuits are faster to put in. Domino's advantage is in frames, but those are high visibility and worth doing with real joinery Which is a lot stronger and integrates with raised panel joints better. Domino is still bond dependent, so the joints will still fail over time. It is still a sloppy fit in the x axis system.

[@clearcut6818]

What a big load of Bollocks.

[@danthechippie4439]

The lamelo is also now available in cordless. That may be a deciding part for some

[@delprestonroadie6606]

Brilliant objective review, thanks Peter.

[@MP-ou7lb]

If you want to buy only ONE of those machines, heres my opinion: - Doweller: quick, cheap, but you need prepare your wood with very high precision. 1/10mm! Wouldn't recommend for the hobbyist. - Lamello: perfect for panels. quick, easy, allowes quite high tolerances if your board sizes don't match precisely. Lamellos can NOT be used within small parts (e.g. thin picture frames). - Domino: quick, good for panels, even better for small parts. Most versatile of all machines. Allowes high precision or tolerance by the flick of a switch. Machine has no cheap alternative Manufacturers, Materials are expensive, too. Out of dominos at the weekend? No problem! I make my own domino dowels from longer scrap (>50cm). Pass it through the planer, round the edges an you can save a lot of money.

[@kiwdwks]

Thanks for the Mafell info. A dowel has it's place but for me the Domino and Zeta are my preference. Thanks Peter.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Mark! Yes, mine too, but it was good to get some hands on time with the Mafell.

[@caskwith]

Peter you have done a wonderful job of proving that you must have all 3 machines as none of them are perfect in their own right. Best sell the car and get spending! lol

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Haha, thanks! Funny thing is I got along just fine for over a decade with ‘just’ a domino. 🤷‍♂️😂👍

[@caskwith]

@@10MinuteWorkshop As much as I hate to admit it I think the domino really is the superior machine as long as you don't want to do knock downs. It's well priced, including the consumables and will work on large or small projects.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Yep. I talk a bit more about it on the blog at 10minuteworkshop.com but using these other machines really brings home justice how good the domino was at launch - CIA that’s pretty much what you’re buying today, the sam domino that launched over a decade ago... 🤷‍♂️👍

[@Skelf71]

Hi Peter, loved the review helped me make my choice between Domino and Duo,( Lamello not easily available or supported here in NZ). Great to get a non biased viewpoint, and interesting to hear your needs for knock down fittings as being preference. In the end I went for the Duo, as here in NZ it was actually cheaper than the Domino, and by the time i added in the various fences and guides was 25% more for the Domino. Although I do like the ability to allow some play in the Domino, you. can still achieve this with the Duo with a second cut if required, not as easy granted, but workable if you get it wrong as we all do! Also buying Dominoes here is expensive, and not always available, dowell's are cheap as chips and always available.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Ewen! Yes, things like pricing can vary so much depending on where you are on the globe! And I agree, dowels are very cheap, and, perhaps more importantly, available in lots of DIY-type stores so never really a big deal if you run out or decide to try an 8mm instead of a 6mm, whereas Dominos seem to be a much more specialised purchase. Glad the video helped, and thanks for taking the time to comment and let me know. Cheers, Peter 👍

[@Skelf71]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Yep price was in there, i had was about to get a Domino, as I had looked at the DD40P, but the MaxiMax DDF40 had every thing i needed, and can do 12m@40 so I can use it for bigger jobs. The side rail was the clincher, no need for the 800mm template guide, and the ability to do shelf pins(although i have drilled rails for that with router). Also I have the service agent (also my machinery supplier) right next door to my panel supplier, handy! Thanks again.

[@tomshahriari6602]

Brilliant videos. You are a natural teacher.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thank you! 👍

[@David-xu3yk]

This video has answered many questions I've always had and more! Thanks for sharing!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks David! 👍👍

[@jimhooper475]

Great video Peter.. feels like I've been waiting ages for this video! Part 1 of many hopefully. If you have access to the Mafell for long enough...

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Jim. The Mafell went back yesterday, sadly - though I have had it for a while... 😬🤷‍♂️

[@ronh9384]

Hello Peter. I watched this video a year ago when it came out.... Not long after this came out a friend asked me to go to his cabin with him while he put together the kitchen cabinets he made. ( I was supposed to be fishing while he did the cabinets). He also has the domino and had already cut the domino slots and dry fit everything. We get there and he starts to put them together.... he has his clamps, dominos, etc all ready to go. Then realizes he forgot to bring wood glue. And the nearest store that has wood glue is a 40 minute drive. I noticed he had a bin of screws so we clamped up each cabinet and from inside the cabinet we drilled pilot holes through the cabinet and through the domino.Then put the screws in. And if it was a 90 degree corner we drilled it from the outside and inserted the screws through the exterior and into the domino. Each end cabinet had shaker style panel that went on each end and covered the exterior screws. Supposedly he was going to pull each cabinet out at a later date and glue them up but I know he hasn’t done that yet. He said they are strong as is and isn’t planning on gluing them now. Probably the cheapest knock down fastener I have used in a while... 😊 Ron P.S. We did drill the pilot hole at a slight angle toward the connecting boards and used a depth stop on the drill bit and of course made sure that the screws were not too long. Also the face frames were 1 inch thick and the plywood cabinet carcase was 7/8” thick.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Good work! Draw-bore loose tenons, but with screws! 🙌👍👍

[@ronh9384]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Exactly. It worked great.

[@ThisTall]

I really wish the Mafell did much larger dowel sizes for some joinery. I just made a support stand from 2x4 lumber, but used 5/8 or 16mm dowels with 1/4 lock pin dowels for all the joins. If the Mafell did larger dowel it would lend itself nicely to be able to cross drill smaller dowels for joinery this way.

[@metal-adventures-joerg]

Thanks for video and for testing the Mafell (it's from my home town!) Greetings from Germany!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! More Mafell to come, as well! 👍

[@metal-adventures-joerg]

Brilliant! 😃

[@mgdew]

as normal a great video Peter - one thing to consider if you only have money for one machine though is face frames - the new ddf40 can now handle face frame assembly due to removing one doweller, the domino can obviously handle typical face frame styles, but the llamello Zeta P2 to the best of my knowledge wont manage a small enough size for typical face frames - is that still the case? if so, you are going to need to consider a second machine for face frame or an alternative tool of some sort.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Martin! I do mention the ‘narrow stock’ option on the Mafell, and I expand a bit more in the blog post at 10minuteworkshop.com. But I agree, the Lamello is lacking in this regard - I couldn’t use it as my only machine. 👍

[@mgdew]

@@10MinuteWorkshop oh yep, I watched the bit with the ddf40 around the narrow stock option. Its such a shame the llamello doesnt have some way of jointing small stock, I desperately want it but cannot justify the cost when it still has limitations as a one tool option. maybe I just need to save some extra pennies and have one of each like in the video ;-)

[@joecox9958]

Thanks I'd like to mention that, biscuit joint is not good for high force tenon joint, and I see dowels in window frame loose might due to its limited glue surface, although I'm not afford the "cheapest" Festool. In US DF500 is 5~10X more than biscuit jointer.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks. The Lamello Zeta isn’t a biscuit jointer - different animal. Yes, with a blade change and some messing around you can turn your ~£1300 Zeta into a biscuit jointer, but I wouldn’t - for all the reasons you point out! 👍👍

[@gerrydoherty7895]

Hi Peter, Another great episode..!! Really enjoyed the reviews regarding these jointing machine's, but I'm at a loss as to why the likes of makita/ Dewalt and Bosch don't see any financial rewards in bringing a fit for purpose jointing machine to the market , say in the price range of £300 to £500 range !! I can't believe it's beyond their expertise to get something on the market in the very near future to rival the triton jointlng machine (price wise..!!) And not functioning ability or lack of it...!! I've seen plenty of reviews, Must be killing the triton reputation ...!! As a serious contender in the power tool community, Anyway I decress , thanks again for the review of those lovely looking machine's If I come into some money in the near future I will buy all three ...!!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Cheers Gerry! It is a mystery as to why the Triton doweller is so poor when other machines they make are solid. They do seem determined to try and chase that particular price-point, and I’ve always said that there’s a clear space in the market for a ~£300-400 tool that does a solid job, at half the price of the Domino. 👍👍

[@negotiableaffections]

Seems that, with your specific needs quantifiable, it wasn't such a hard decision. This vlog/vid extremely useful for making that point. Cheers [just to be a thorn in your side, I'll say 'pocket holes' and run for cover! lol]

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Cheers Keith. Given the speed of working, I’m afraid pocket holes don’t come into the equation; cheap though! 😂👍

[@martincarlberg9671]

Why using plastic?

[@Schlaumaier1001]

For me it all depends on what u want to do, the domino is no questions a great tool but for me the Lammelo zeta is the best especially with the clamex

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

For cabinetry the clamex is outstanding, less so for joinery and framework, which is where the loose tenon and dowels score. 👍

[@Schlaumaier1001]

@@10MinuteWorkshop you are absolutely right, I have used all of them extensively and they are all great tools as u said. Btw the adjustment screw u showed does nothing when using the clamex or tenso. It's only used when u do normal buscuits, another reason why I like it so much, you can change the blade to the normal Lamello one and it can be used for normal biscuit joinery

[@stevewalker7822]

As always Peter, very informative but out of my league. It’s truly awesome how technology hadn’t changed in years and now in the last 15-20 years, WOW!

[@boxsterman77]

I distinctly remember reading the statement in the 70's in a car-related magazine that the state of the 4 cycle combustion engine had reached it's zenith; that there were little that could be done to improve on it. Then came variable and multiple cams, direct injection, common-place turbos, improvements on the fuel dispersion and computer-aided engine management.

[@andrewhutchings4131]

Great informative video Peter, I wonder if you could do a piece about your dust extraction and hose setup and how it all links together. 👍

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Andrew! I talk about it a bit in the workshop tour - video #066 👍👍

[@andrewhutchings4131]

Great stuff. Thanks again.

[@gav2759]

I have never really got the Duo Dowel thing. It's two dowels. Judicious use of a tuppenny ha'ppenny jig comes to the same thing and I can still go on my holidays.

[@bighands69]

It is a machine that you can bang lots of projects out with. No need to start complex layouts. Just use the registration pins or guide system supplied. What makes the Duo Dowel interesting and should be considered by people is that it can do the job of both the DF500 and DF700. In that it can do dowels up to 12mm down to 4mm. Which sort of sits in between the DF500 and DF700. Now it has its downsides when compared to the Domino (one domino dowel will not twist and one round dowel will).

[@gav2759]

@@bighands69 Quite, they would not make them if no one found them efficient. I would not consider one, simply because my shop made system "bangs out" accurate work as quickly as I need and with a deal more flexibility.

[@bighands69]

@@gav2759 It really depends on what you are making and the price you are selling at. Some producers of furniture will be make one of pieces that sell for a premium so they can cost the use of slower work into the overall price. Others may be doing work that is of a high quality but it may be time critical and cost critical so the extra man hours cannot be put into the price. A duo Jointer is just as quick to use as a Domino and can do the job of both the domino DF500 and DF700. And that producer just may use the one size of dowel the whole time for tables, benches, cabinets, book cases and so on. They may also use it on site as well for jointing. There is nothing wrong with a dowel jig but it is nowhere near as fast nor efficient as using a Duo Jointer but it is much cheaper.

[@markjervis8558]

Great comparison Peter. I have been awaiting a shoot out between the three industry leading jointing machines.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Mark! 👍

[@DeeBeesvideochannel]

Great fact-filled video. Thanks. As complete as your "product list" link was I was hoping to find that handy bench hold-down clamp you used at time stamp 10:04. Edit: After posting I saw the Festool green on the clamp handle. Yep. Festool Quick Clamp FS-HZ 160

[@GOATGamerProSticks]

For the sake of 8mm dowels on repeated pression processes hand made square drill guide jigs a depth stop piece or 2 will often save you 100s - 1000s of pounds theres always a cheaper option when round stock dowel is involved. Ide sooner get a biscuit joiner shove any end grain flat piece timber i find in the hole in the absence of biscuits or use it as a groove cutter in a pinch. Some of these new tools just seem too bespoke to warant use when you really think ways arround the process or job need.

[@michaellazarou6891]

Lamello Zeta and aluminium PantoRouter owner here... at 18:25 - did the mafell split that MDF? Or did some ixConnects split it? Worrisome. Bought a decent little PantoRouter for cheaper than can buy a Domino... without a spindle in the Panto. (If you have a matching trimmer/router/spindle, this isn't an issue) Of course, the PantoRouter is no good for panel processing work - its too clumsy to set/reset. Fantastic for making custom furnitures (not a production tool!) and strong, tight, attractive joints. Only limited by your patience (and practice). It would honestly take 4-10x the labour, to do a job that a Domino can do speedily. Like, say, jointing a hardwood tabletop. The Lamello is fantastic for panel processing work, ie. kitchen cabinets, joinery, shopfitting. Biscuits aren't going to hold a hardwood tabletop together, not like fluted dowels or loose tenons would. If I had my time again: I'd do everything differently, everything. Nothing wrong with a good static doweller or mortiser! In fact, better by most standards. But I'd still be forced to buy the Zeta. It's worth it, in removable and re-openable joints. If I needed Festool's knock-down Domino fittings, there are plenty of other systems that are cheaper to buy AND machine.

[@lisahodges8299]

The fancy fittings seemed to take longer to slide in. Birdy

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

But are vastly faster when it come to assembly.

[@paulmanning9540]

Remp kitchens use the Lamello fixings on their wall unit fillers. It is nice to just click it together.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Are those the tenso fittings? Still not getting mine quite as tight as I’d like - need to play some more! 👍👍

[@paulmanning9540]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Yes, just click them together but they are not what you would call tight either. They pull together well when clicked but there is quite a bit of movement. Works well in the situation Remp use them for though. Eggersman Kitchens use similar but has an Allan key tightener to lock it all up much stronger.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Yeah the Clamex (Allen key ones) are brilliant - 80kg of pressure👌

[@simonchiplin]

This was a fantastic product comparison Peter, Its great to see these types of tools being shown without someone saying "You NEED this tool!". Also, there's about £3000 worth of tools there...and the Festool Domino is the cheapest!!, what has the world come to lol I ended up getting the Domino 500 and the TS55 over a year ago, mostly on the strength of what you've said about them and seeing that the dust collection is great for a small workshop. My workshops 4m long by 1.9m wide!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Simon! Yes, lots of pricey gear on the bench in this video - and not all of it mine! Glad the Domino & TS55 are working well for you. 👍👍

[@saleemalkinani3496]

Peter Thank you so much. You helped me make very good decisions for myself. I found that mafell doweler is exactly what I need beside my domino machines. I got the mafell. it is fantastically accurate. I have just ordered the hafele nock down dowels. I am very excited. By the way I am listening to your podcast. I really enjoy it.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thank you! 👍

[@peterfitzpatrick7032]

Pete... I was gonna ask about why no Triton doweller but you answered that question elsewhere... its just a shame the Tritons manufacturing seems to have problems with quality, it would be a good affordable alternative. I have their TRA001 router & the planer thicknesser & am super-happy with them... 🤨 Good comparison vid for the deep-pockets crowd... of which I am NOT a club-member 😭😭 😎👍☘🍺

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Peter. It does seem odd that Triton have such a blind spot with the doweller; I also have their big router slung under my bench, and a bench top sander too, both of which are excellent. They seem determined to build / engineer the doweller to the same price point as their biscuit jointers, whereas I think there’s space at double the price, for a machine that works well. 👍

[@peterfitzpatrick7032]

@@10MinuteWorkshop true dat... 🤔 😎👍☘🍺

[@hosuneoeb7756]

Another really good video. The quality of information is much better than here in germany. Excuse me for my bad english. Greetings from germany. But i have a question. Is that ok for you?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thank you, and greetings from London! Your English is excellent, and please, ask whatever you like 👍👍

[@hosuneoeb7756]

@@10MinuteWorkshop ok . Thank you. What do you really think about parkside tools espacially the plunge saw you tested??? I love my festool tools but i had the chance to work with the plunge saw and an grinder (or sander) like the festool ets125. The results were really good. The price is amazing. Thank you for an answer and good night from Hamburg

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

My apologies - I wrote a response to this but for some reason it didn’t send. The only experience I have of the Parkside tools is the Tracksaw that I own, and overally I think for the money they are generally excellent, though I have had reports of poor quality control - items needing to be returned for replacement. This has always been carried out without question by Lidl, but it’s an extra step that you may prefer not to have to take, just to get a working sample of what you bought. But overall, for the prices they charge and then warranty and returns policy it’s hard to go wrong. HTH, Peter

[@GmailNexus]

Exactly 100.000 Subscribers 🙌🏼

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Yeah! 😆👍👍

[@johnschotz1614]

excellent video!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! 👍

[@rokennet]

Well done, very nice review!!!

[@martinshaw1988]

Hi Peter, great video - thanks for comparing these. One thing you didn't mention is that I assume there is no adjustment or wiggleroom in the doweler? Like there is in the domino and zeta

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

There’s no wiggle room with dowels, no. And tbh precious little with the Zeta, +/- 0.5mm from memory.

[@alunmorgan7869]

Excellent video very informative thanks

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! 👍👍

[@martinmadsen4162]

festool has a line of knockdown dommino's that could have saved you the cost of the lamello all together

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Video #330 Clamex or Connect, kzbin.info/www/bejne/iquycqqlaNujp6s 👍👍

[@Therealphantomzero]

Hey I just saw that the zeta has a connector that wedges in like the peanut connector could you please look into that!!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Really? It hasn’t popped up on my radar, do you have a link or a name for it? All I’ve seen from Lamello is the s-Clamex connector for regular biscuit jointers. 👍

[@Hand-i-Craft]

Great video Peter and really interesting to see the pros and cons of each. After much serious thought and saving and thanks to your one handed domino video, I decided to order one from my local timber merchants who’ve just become a Festool dealer. It arrived on Wednesday and I’m at the ‘still just looking at it’ stage! 😀 Hopefully start to do some test pieces with it next week. Can I just ask, generally what setting do you have it on for the slight bit of wiggle room? I noticed there are increments between the settings. Cheers, Leo

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Hi Leo, and congrats on the purchase! Re the width of mortise, the narrow setting will be a tight fit on the domino for whatever size but you’re using. The next two setting give progressively wider slots, so more wiggle room. There are only 3 widths - don’t try setting it between widths! They’re clearly click-stopped. Any Qs shoot me a message, OK? 👍👍

[@frankslittleworkshop]

Leo, hope to see it very soon in one of your next vids 😁, you could use it for the "under the stairs" project 😁👍.

[@ronh9384]

Excellent video as always Peter. I love my Domino but have always wanted a Lamello Zeta P2. I was happy when Festool came out their knock down fittings until I saw how fiddly they were and on the pricey side. The Lamello Clamex is easier and less costly. All of which you are already aware. Does the new Mafell Duo Doweller use the same notched rail the older version did? Cheers Ron

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Hi Ron and thanks! This doweller will work with the notched rail, but it also has a little plastic jig that works for the shelf-pin holes; I didn’t have one supplied unfortunately, so I couldn’t demo it, but there are Mafell videos out about it on KZbin. 👍👍

[@GiantWillaim]

Those hafele ix connect fittings SC 8/60 are 55mm long so a 15 mm plunge and a 40mm plunge would work with mafell

[@ciptrofin]

SC 8/60 requires one 45/46mm depth hole (check technical drawings on Hafele website).

[@saiiiiiii1]

As a beginner I wonder where are the limits of things I can build just with dowels compared to screws and dowels combined? Can I built a wardrode without screws? Can I build a bed without screws? What are the guidelines here?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Good question! In many cases the screws simply act as clamps while the glue dries, and any non-mechanical fixing eg dowels, dominos, biscuits etc… are simply to help with alignment. I’ve built many wardrobes with dominos and glue alone, but you need long clamps! I wouldn’t build a bed that way, because over time the glue joints will fail, and as a bed sees more activity than a wardrobe, that will happen sooner. HTH P

[@saiiiiiii1]

@@10MinuteWorkshop OK I guess I'll have to start doing some trial and error studies. 😁👍

[@eherlitz]

Great review Peter, regarding the IXConnectors there are shorter versions of it as well, see Häfele Ixconnect SC 8/25

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Eric; unless I bought the wrong ones, the 8/25s are hammer-in fixings - they make a solid connection, but are one-time use only, so not the kind of knock-down fitting I was really after. 👍👍

[@eherlitz]

@@10MinuteWorkshop And right you are!

[@kevinchamberlain7928]

Peter, it would be very interesting to see how a pocket driller thingy would compare head to head with these high end kit. Strength and accuracy?

[@BigHenFor]

About the same in strength but less time spent filling holes and sanding down with all these systems. If you were a contractor, time would be money, and these systems cut out the extra filling, gluing, and sanding time pocket screw holes need for a professional finish.

[@dubtownman9508]

Another brilliant review..top notch

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thank you! 👍👍

[@jonathanskrine770]

I'm using biscuits happily and wonder what the difference is in strength (with modern adhesives) between biscuits and dominoes or even dowels. I'm old enough to remember the anti dowels attitudes of the 60s and also remember research being done by TRADA concluding that well spaced dowels were as strong as mortice and tenon joints. The main problem for me is the cost - I've just upgraded my elderly cheapie for an on offer bells and whistles biscuit jointer (Rutlands deal £59.99). I'm wondering if I should have saved a lot more money for a domino. P.S. I would have commented on the website but there is no comments section there for older videos.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Hi Jonathan. I think the ‘strength’ of dominos if often overstated. Obviously they are stronger than biscuits - you can snap a biscuit in half with your bare hands, no chance of doing that with the smallest of dominos - but in actual use, where they’re mostly for alignment, I suspect that the material the workpiece is made from is the thing that will fail first. Compared with dowels though, a 5x30 domino has twice the gluing area as a 6x30 dowel, so in terms of that kind of glue-joint failure the domino will win out, unless you use 2 for 1 dowels for Domino. Re comments on the website - they are absolutely enabled, but there is a slight website glitch where you need to refresh the page sometimes to make them appear. It’s something we’re working on, but is hard to track down exactly why it’s happening, so in the meantime a simple page refresh - or use the Wix spaces app - is a workaround. 👍

[@jonathanskrine770]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Thanks Peter - The research did state correctly spaced dowels so that was probably multiples - my bad. The comments on the 10MW website is now working for me. So everything hunky dory here. Dowels have always been a bit of a pain - as you say the wiggle room with the dominos is a real plus - I can't remember when I last cut an accurate biscuit without 'wiggling'.

[@nutsmcflurry3737]

Hello Peter. At 11:00 in this vid you place your finger on a machined flat surface and you are commenting on that there is no pin for alignment. I watched the other vid you linked for this tool and there appears to be two tapped holes in that surface. Could you not attach a swinging aluminum tab to one of those holes on either side, that swings out and gives you an edge reference? A washer and spring under the head of the screw keeps tension on the tab yet allows for swinging out of the way. Set up properly they could be moved with your fingers but stay in place either as a stop or out of the way.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Possibly, but you’d have to remove them each time you wanted the face of the fence to be flush with the material - the pins/paddles on the domino and doweller are spring so they retract, leaving the face clear to butt against the workpiece. 👍👍

[@nutsmcflurry3737]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Look at the first few pictures at this link. This is an adjustable stop version for a milling vise, but for your purposes leave off the red knob adjustment screw off all together. www.micro-machine-shop.com/screwless_vise.htm Now if you need to butt the side of the tool up against your work, then yes they would be in the way.

[@charis128]

Great video! Thank you

[@mathewgallimore1484]

And the question remains, domino, mafell or zeta. I'm considering the ddf40 or the df500. I'm making small to medium cabinets and plan to make my full kitchen in the future. The simple shelf pin use with the ddf40 kind of leans me that way, especially as the festool route requires both the rail and separate router for the same result. Still undecided as it's a big outlay decisions decisions HELP................

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Domino. Seriously, it's not only the least expensive, but the most versatile of the three. The Mafell was also quite hard to use - I'd recommend you get a hands-on demo where you can cut some dowels as I found the plunge action far too stiff, and I'm not the only one. There are many ways of making shelf pin holes - the Festool is nice, but not necessary - and most of them can easily be funded by the difference in price between the Domino and the Mafell. All IMHO, of course.👍👍

[@mathewgallimore1484]

@@10MinuteWorkshop really appreciate the feedback. I've seen the Mafell for £840 and the Domino for £720. I think that's my mind made up.

[@DaileyWoodworks]

Question. Now that festool offers knock down connectors for the 500 do you still see the added value in also owning the lamello? I have the domino 500 and like the knock down system. But the self clamping feature of the lamello seems like a huge money saver (in increased shop productivity) Would love your thoughts on this

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Short answer - yes. The clamex fittings are much better for general cabinet construction, though they are restricted in other areas eg narrow sections. The domino connect fittings also have their place, but I use them a lot less than I thought I would. Having both systems as an option is something of a luxury - but also good to have available. 👍👍

[@kir3dempsey]

Oh another great review, just got the df500, had the xl 700 for a while also the dd40 maximax so watched with great interest, by the way I never use the mafell.

[@nicharvey7211]

Hi, why did you get rid of the XL? I'm in the same boat and considering exchanging for a 500!

[@kir3dempsey]

Nic Harvey sorry I should’ve said I have the xl700 a while, and still do.

[@nicharvey7211]

@@kir3dempsey wicked!

[@tworiversworkshop6111]

Did you have any problems connecting the Mafell to your Festool 27mm hose, or is it a compatible connector?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

No, no problems at all - they're all fine with the standard D27 Festool hose. 👍

[@tworiversworkshop6111]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Thanks Peter

[@danthechippie4439]

Which machine would you recommend for joining panels together? I join a lot of 18mm boards that are over 4 feet wide

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Lamello Clamex in the zeta. 👍

[@danthechippie4439]

Thank you

[@Fearless-ambassador]

I just order lamello zeta p2, im so excite, im so excite, im so excite

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

I remember that feeling! 😆😆😆👍👍

[@sfdclay]

Thanks for this great review video. The only question I still have about the Mafell is how week does it work with hardwoods and plywoods? Most of the videos I’ve seen demonstrate it being used with mdf and particle boards. Id really appreciate your thoughts on this.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

I found the Mafell to be really quite hard work, so in anything other than MFC and MDF I’m not sure it would be my first choice, tbh. If you’re considering one, I’d recommend getting hands-on with one for a proper demo. 👍👍

[@sfdclay]

@@10MinuteWorkshop getting a demo might be hard for me, being in Phoenix, as the only dealer I’ve found in the US is located in Chicago, but I appreciate the feedback!

[@prefect111]

The domino has excellent knockdown fittings

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

I beg to differ - see the link to the ‘Connect or Clamex’ video in the description, or on the blog at 10minuteworkshop.com

[@prefect111]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Thanks Peter. I always enjoy your videos and find them well made and informative. The lamellos look like a very easy system to use. I really only posted the comment because you were talking about knockdown capability and it seemed overlooked. Keep up the excellence!

[@eggmatic1]

Hi Peter, I love your videos and thankyou for all the efforts you put into them (editing sound when operating machines) my question to you is if the zeta was available when you first got you domino, which would you have chosen? Many thanks Peter👍

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thank you, much appreciated! That's a tough one; I probably would have gone with the Lamello, but having used the Domino first, it makes you more aware of the Zeta's limitations. But fantastic for cabinet/carcass work. 👍

[@eggmatic1]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Thank you Peter, I think I'm steering towards the zeta, purely due to its fast clampless system. I have been looking at the biscos which would reduce the cost of fixings, I'll use clamex or tenso to pull the joint together and bisco to add additional strength. We'll that's my thinking so far. Keep up the good work 👍

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Pleasure; I do an overview of a number of knock-down fixings in this weeks 'cabinetry basics' series, P3 out this Friday. 👍

[@eggmatic1]

@@10MinuteWorkshop oh nice one, I'll look forward to that one.

[@saiiiiiii1]

What do you think of the Festool D8 connector system nowadays that it has aged a bit? And have you worked with Scheulenburg connectors? Really curious about your opinion.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

I think the D8 is still the poor relation to the D14 tbh. Sorry, I’ve never seen scheulenberg connectors, but they look interesting! 👍👍

[@wiggum2009]

Great video peter. Have you used the festool domino connector range? I’ve found them very useful and haven’t noticed you using them before, but I may of missed the video.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Michael! Yes, I did a ‘connect vs Clamex’ video a while back - link in the description or at the blog on 10minuteworkshop.com. 👍👍

[@enshongmiranda]

Is there a single doweller?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

No, not that I’m aware of. It’s something I wish Festool would enable with the Domino - flick a switch to stop the waggle, and you have a single dowel machine with a good fence and great dust extraction. 👍

[@enshongmiranda]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Yeah, that would be great. I think it could be a pretty versatile and more compact tool if someone makes it.

[@romibrandas4381]

it should be lamello classic x better for the test,or zeta without the connectors

[@LostBoyLA]

Was this video made before the domino knock downs were a thing? If so has your opinion changed?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

No, about a year after - already did a video (#320) on ‘Connect or Clamex’. Domino connect for the DF500 is a poorly thought out fitting in comparison to the Clamex, it’s only saving grace being able to use it on narrow stock. But it’s expensive, fussy to use, leaves a big ugly hole that needs covering up and in my experience isn’t particularly well made - I had many failures in the threads of the screws that secure the fittings, and that’s basically a fitting that can’t be used, so a couple of quid down the pan. If you have a domino already and need a knock-down connector then they work, but they’re not much fun to use. Even if I had a Domino, if I needed a knock-down fitting I’d buy a cheap biscuit jointer and and use the Clamex S over spending £300-ish on the connect set. 🤷‍♂️👍

[@LostBoyLA]

@@10MinuteWorkshop thanks you for your response! I was looking into the domino xl for building a bed frame which is why I want the knock down ability. I was taking a look at it at the store which is where I seen the clamex system and ended up here. What knock down connectors would you recommend for a bed frame? Thank you!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Domino XL connector are very different from these ones for the Df500; they were designed for the XL, then introduced to the 500 as a bit of an afterthought. The XL connectors will be fine for a bed frame - though there are many off the shelf options available eg bed brackets etc… if you wanted to go a cheaper route. The XL connectors are a good choice though, if you have the XL. 👍👍

[@LostBoyLA]

@@10MinuteWorkshop hmmm interesting comment... the bed frame brackets do seem to give the look of a more premium product. honestly I see myself building more cabinets with the domino and only one or two bed frames but was thinking about going all out in the domino 700 that can do it all even if the 500 looks more pleasurable to use... perhaps I should stop buying more tools and use my shaper origin for the bed frame brackets 😂 have you handled the xl and have any thoughts on it?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

@@LostBoyLA I have both Dominos; the DF500 get used 1000 times more than the XL - I only bought the XL because I have a jig planned to duplicate the function tbh. IMHO the XL is far too big and heavy to use for cabinets, the 500 is the perfect tool for that. HTH P

[@leonardo47000]

Peter, How do you think it compares to dado and rabbit joints? I rather like the Lamello and think i go for it if it will eliminate most of the dado work.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Haven’t used [rebates & housings] since I bought the domino tbh, the Lamello - with Clamex fittings in particular - is an excellent addition. 👍

[@leonardo47000]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Once again Peter, thank you. Hope all is well with you and in your home town.

[@MrBenjibogs]

Looks to me as though those knock down dowel ix connect things would just split mdf when you expand them?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Actually no - surprised me a bit as well tbh as that was what I was expecting too!

[@MrBenjibogs]

@@10MinuteWorkshop I hate that dreaded soft fart sound of mdf splitting! 😂

[@SalC007]

It would be great if there was a cheap one of these, say no more than £150 by Dewalt or Bosch, for us occasional DIY-ers

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

I think that’s where Triton tried to pitch their doweller, with very iffy results, so if Triton tried and failed around this price point I don’t see DeWalt or Bosch being terribly interested. But I do feel there’s space in the ~£300-ish area; a decent quality tool that’s still half the price of the domino, expensive for a DIY-er certainly, but still - half the price of a Domino... 🤷‍♂️👍

[@stefanschachler831]

@@10MinuteWorkshop once the patent of the domino ends or Festool is starting to give away licenses, the market will be flooded with cheap domino dowellers. But they won‘t work like the Festool one, because something that is really functioning is never cheap, only worth the money. Better get yourself a used Festool than waste your money on junk. Or if you only in for occasional work, learn how to make a mortise and tenant joint. There are always lots of different ways to reach your goals. I personally stick to the domino and also use their removable system. Your right Peter, it’s a little overengeneered, but I don’t do woodworking for a living, so I don‘t mind the extra time it costs.

[@albo1uk]

Thanks, as always, for a great and thoughtful video. May I ask - if you were starting out and not yet invested in any system (eg no LR 32 set up for shelf pins), and you could only afford one of these machines, would that push you toward the Mafell?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Alastair. Honestly, my experience with these three machines simply reinforces how good the Domino is. As clever as the system is, in terms of use the Mafell was my least favourite. There are many way to drill shelf pin holes, and the difference in price between the Mafell and the Domino would pay for most of them. 👍

[@albo1uk]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Great. Thanks. Was leaning toward the Mafell so will have to watch your domino videos and have a further think about it all then :) (Though I notice on the link you give to the DDF40 it's under £850 these days)

[@TheNottonight]

So what’s the difference between them three machines and a biscuit joiner I have a biscuit joiner probably 20 years works flawlessly all the time and I paid US$140

[@BigHenFor]

Read this: web.archive.org/web/20130717202631/www.lamello.com/fileadmin/user_upload/mediacenter/0%20Katalog/Lamello_Catalogue_EN.pdf. Biscuits are not suitable for knock-down cabinetry. Both the Domino and Lamello systems are stronger than biscuits as well. This guy isn't a hobbyist - he builds custom cabinetry for interior designers and home owners who want the best finish and utility from their cabinets. These systems are really for the pros, or hobbyists with deep pockets. However, theirs a new system from Intelligent Fixings in the UK that provide even stronger joints with the virtues of dowelling and the strength of the Lamello. Its called Peanut 2, and with a small jig and a router you can build really strong carcasses consumables that are cheaper than the domino or Lamello system. Check it out. Intelligent Fixings has a KZbin channel.

[@bwillan]

If you were starting over looking at one of these joinery systems, which of the 3 would you pick now?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

So much depends on what you do exactly, but honestly looking at and working with these systems together, it just reinforced how good the Domino is. So, Domino, all day long - even though I’ve bought the Lamello! 🤷‍♂️👍

[@luisp8999]

If I could only have one it would probably be the Domino, but if I could have two then it would be the Mafell plus the Lamello.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Interesting, thanks! I’m the exact opposite - Lamello & Domino. 🤷‍♂️👍

[@NomadMakes]

Great vid, as always ;-)

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Goran! 👍

[@byronmaes9310]

Hi thank you for the great content! Can you help me find the Peanut in the US? Thanks

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Intelligent Fixings will shop to the US, and I’m told that proper US distribution is coming soon. 😂👍

[@benreddick7925]

hi Peter. Does it benefit you to buy via the link to protrade? I'm about to spend a bit of money and will use it if it does

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Hi Ben, and thanks for asking.Not directly - unless you buy glue - but if you mention my name or the video when ordering it’ll help generally, thanks! 👍👍

[@jamiejessup90]

Thanks for this great comparison! When you showed the “wiggle room” on the domino, did you have a wider domino setting or the standard width? I’ve never owned or used one so I’m not super familiar with how tight the joint is laterally. Thanks!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks James. The domino was in a narrow mortise on the end of the board, and a mid-size mortise on the face of the board.

[@jamiejessup90]

Peter Millard thanks :)

[@ronh9384]

Jamie Jessup It has three width settings on the Festool Domino.

[@harlanbarnhart4656]

Jamie, I make my own dominoes and almost always I use the widest slot and make a Domino to fit it.

[@kelvindrury7401]

Hi Peter. An unrelated question to the video really. I’m making some shaker style doors at home and struggling to find a slotted router bit that cuts deeper than 9.5mm. Would that be ok? Or could you point my in a direction to find a bit that cuts deeper. Thanks Im using 18mm MDF 6mm panel Bit is trend 6.3mm x 9.5mm

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Kevin! Best bit I’ve found is from Wealden tool - Heavy duty groover - bit.ly/HD_Groover Arcbor for above - bit.ly/Arbor_8 They do another version that does a ~13mm groove, but I like them with a bit of meat to them. 👍👍

[@kelvindrury7401]

Peter Millard thanks Peter that’s a great help. Love the channel by the way

[@Z-add]

You are saving labour over connector cost?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Yes.

[@williamdell5327]

Have you worked with Clamex S before? Can you compare to Clamex P? Clamex S works with cheap Biscuit joiners so I am interested in that.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

No, never used them - I’ve never owned a biscuit jointer before the Zeta. They struck me a s a bit odd - a slot-in fixing your have to screw down won’t win any prizes for speed, though if it gives you the functionality of the Clamex without the cost of the Zeta, I can see the appeal - especially if you already have a decent biscuit jointer. Not no, never used them, I’m sorry. 🤷‍♂️👍

[@eduardvaniersel7535]

Those hafele connectors are crap in my opinion. Very weak and little holding power. We've used on a couple of closets at the place I work as a test, but stepped away from them because they are more hassle then they're worth.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Glad I dodged that bullet then! 👍👍😂😂

[@eduardvaniersel7535]

@@10MinuteWorkshop The technology in them is pretty clever, but practically they are nothing compared to a clamex .

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

No, indeed - Clamex is a different animal altogether. 👍👍

[@ianthompson9058]

With the t slots .can you take them apart again?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

On the Lamello? Yes, absolutely! 👍👍

[@paulround8501]

I just don't understand why the DDF40 is so expensive, it is essentially two drill bits and a simple jig, at least with the other two there is something to the cutting action though personally I think the Peanut2 system from Intelligent Fixings beats all of these.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Well, there have been cheaper duo-doweller a attempted, and none of them have turned out well - I bought three of the Triton doweller a and had to return them all - so the engineering side of the manufacture isn’t trivial. But I agree, it’s expensive for what it is, and the peanut connectors is a fine fixing - but that’s a jig & router system, which is a slightly different animal. Peanut 2 System - kzbin.info/www/bejne/d5u2Y5Z3nrassLs Peanut 2 mini jig video out very soon. 👍

[@paulround8501]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Yes, I got the Triton and it was all over the place, even the registration on each bit is out so the holes were slightly misaligned with respect to each other. I stripped it down and machined the parts accordingly and it works a treat after that but most do not have the machines or the skill in metalworking to do that. Still it was a relatively simple job and could be done at the factory for very little extra cost. Given this it should be possible to build a decent machine in the £300 to £400 price range. Hopefully one of the mid range players like Dewalt or Makita take on the challenge at some point and we get a decent tool in this price range. If the peanut 2 people produced a hand held machine to create slots they would become a serious player for sure.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

@@paulround8501 Sounds exactly like the three that I had, lol! Someone I know has had the Triton recently, and his was pretty good, so perhaps they've re-worked it?? I agree though - and like I said in the Peanut 2 video, there's a hole in the market around the ~£-400 range and a decent duo-doweller could do well in there. I love the Peanut 2 system, but it is a jig & router system, not a stand-alone power too, and that does make it slightly different. 👍

[@MrJoeblofromidaho]

If you don't use them much harbor freight has a good enough biscuit cutter.