Pickleball! The Perfect Swing For A Powerful, Effective Serve! How To Hit It Like A Pro!

[@susaneasterly]

I'm new to the game (about 6 months). I really enjoyed watching this video. I appreciated your explanations, the rewinds at just the right places, and the pace. Thanks a bunch!

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

You're welcome. Glad you enjoyed the video. Best of luck in your pickleball journey.

[@clintondavis3363]

The serve from the guy in the reddish colored shorts shows at the beginning of the video shows him hitting the ball very high, above his waist. ( I played the action super slow to see this) This helps him clear the net and gives him more drive on the ball. I think it’s questionable as per the rules. But, it seems that the boundaries of rules are constantly being tested, stuff that plagues so many sports as players seek to dominate opponents.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Yes. It's a tough calm Thanks for watching.

[@evidencebased1]

Both pony tail guy and white shirt guy are questionable on contact height of serve.

[@SSIPickleball]

@@evidencebased1 No illegal serves at all. Borderline, maybe, but certainly not something that could be called out as illegal. Ever seen Tyson McGuffin or Dekel Barr serve??

[@erkell5]

I thought the same. Good catch!

[@lonnythompson8131]

I am serving like guy in white shirt, and many recreational players that I started playing with that use the bounce serve keep calling foul above my waste, which is the belly button but I think they think is lower at my belt line. What should I do?

[@SSIPickleball]

Thank you for taking a look at our game! You’re right that Ted (guy in white) is the best player, he’s rated over 4.5 on DUPR. Shane (in grey) is 4.3 and Austin (blue and white) is 4.28. After reviewing this game there were several questionable line calls, but sometimes that happens in the moment especially playing under lights. Thanks again, and very helpful insights!

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

You're more than welcome. The video is getting a lot of views and a lot of comments. My experience is, line calls are hardly ever called. LOL.

[@okayest_amateur]

8:28 good analysis of the serve. I would like to add another key difference. White shirt hits with a C shape motion whereas purple shirt hits with a U shape motion. This is a significant difference. C shape motion is a much more consistent swing pattern with a larger strike zone when compared to U shape. Also C shape allows you to accelerate through the entire backswing whereas U shape negates half of the backswing because you need to reverse direction. The result is better control AND power using the C shape motion. C shape also allows for a more compact forearm stroke which come straight from tennis. U shape requires a much larger swing path to generate the same amount of speed because of having to stop your momentum half way through the shot. This is why purple shirt has a longer backswing. White shirt is doing it right, however I must caution that it is possible also to have too small of a backswing that you end up losing power and consistency. Its something that each pickleball player has to experiment with to find the sweet spot in terms of backswing size.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Awesome analysis in comparison between the C and the U shape. Thanks so much for explaining.

[@edwardlacalifornia9634]

Technically that first was an illegal serve he hit the ball just above his waistline ☠️ His paddle edge was not below his wrist when he hit the ball Swinging sideways and then up after he hits the ball. Something with the guy in the pink shorts. Both would be given a warning ⚠️and a fault there after .

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Thanks for watching and thanks for your comment.

[@highlife7241]

Compact swing for serve is much more consistent than bigger back swing serves.✅ Took me awhile to embrace this as a former tennis player.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

I seen tennis players using their long loopy swing in pickleball. I'm glad you were able to adjust. Thanks for watching.

[@janinemurdock2043]

@highlife7241 Oddly my own (current) worst habit seems to carry over from ping pong and not my tennis background, in that I *cannot* seem to stop myself putting my index finger up on the paddle surface. It is driving me bonkers trying to stop doing it, but I've been at it a few months now and now it feels odd to not.

[@KingKangUSA]

if you are a former tennis player, you can utilize your full serve skill to bounce the ball either 1+ foot higher (top spin) or 1+ foot lower (top spin slide).

[@aljerones99]

The fellow in the blue baseball cap does have a nice rich deep serve with topspin and power but he tosses the ball upward and hits it after it crests and then descends. Do the serve rules not require that the ball be dropped only and not have any upward motion? This would make his serves illegal, no? Am I missing something, here? Even at 3:11, Mr. Ponytail hits the ball above the waist. That serve, though the ball has no upward toss, is an illegal serve, too. My serve is much like the blue baseball cap guy but with no upward toss. I actually coil my core backward and uncoil forward to meet the ball that I release. So, my paddle head is way back to gain momentum from the uncoiling. I coil with a bent knee from my load-bearing leg (I'm righthanded) and I swing slightly upward to meet the falling ball, below my waist. Sometimes, I drive hard with little or no topspin and other times I use the windshield wiper motion as I hit the ball to increase spin and wrist lag as I make contact with the ball. The latter, though more powerful, is a bit less controlled when I apply extraneous spin. I'm not sure the blue cap guy is serving, legally. Who I think has an interesting serve, is the fellow in the white hat. That backhand spin serve, though soft, can be tricky to handle, unless it's being returned flat or with topspin. He could mix things up to be less predictable.

[@janinemurdock2043]

Only in PPA, not USAP or rec play. Afaik you can still toss volley serves outside of PPA tournaments.

[@aljerones99]

@janinemurdock2043 OK. Thanks. The groups I play with only follow USAP serve rules. Hence, my comment. The toss aside, it's a good serve. I'd avoid the toss, though, just to make sure I don't incur the wrath of those who follow the USPA rules only.

[@janinemurdock2043]

@aljerones99 I mean, it's probably a good habit to break if you ever plan on playing in PPA tournaments, but personally i'm at a loss as to the rationale behind *why* you can't toss a volley serve a little, so long as you're still making contact below your waist with an upward motion, and aren't putting spin on it. It's not like a good pickleball serve requires a lot of backswing, so it's not like that extra time is of any huge benefit or anything, it seems.

[@aljerones99]

@janinemurdock2043 Yeah ... I made this point on another comment, to which you replied but I'm adding it here for others who might follow this discussion of ours: I think the toss is controversial because the motion of the ball can be manipulated, even slightly when not simply dropped. It is hard to decipher whether the ball is being manipulated or not, otherwise, no matter how slight.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

What the others said. Thanks for watching.

[@garywasik8875]

I think both players on near court are serving illegally. They either swing horizontally or contact ball above the waist.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Thanks for pointing that out. It's really a tough call.

[@jaimetarne9436]

​@@pickleballpick-apart9787i am surrprised you didnt mention that the players in the near court were serving illegally because of their feet. The one in white lets his serve momentum bring him into the court and the one with the long hair has his foot well onto or over the baseline. Unless they are not playing under USAP rules.

[@keithr5638]

Looks like ponytail had a foot fault on his serve at 14:13.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Thanks for watching and thanks for pointing that out.

[@fredmargolin1909]

I relish when my opponent offers a slice serve or return as it makes my top spin shot easier and with greater spin. Plus, I have the impression that a sliced ball tends to float frequently off the court.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

I couldn't agree more, it's so much easier to hit a topspin shot when your opponent slices the ball! Thanks for watching.

[@MurphysTouch]

That's because your opponents are doing it wrong, if done correctly, it stays low and hitting topspin on a ground ball is basically impossible, because you have to go low to high. It can be effective, but should be mixed up with other serves.

[@JohnKeeling]

@@pickleballpick-apart9787 not sure i agree. a low slice or cut shot tends to hug the ground, and if done well, it wont be very high off the bounce. the spin continuation into your paddle will make it gear down , so that it is harder to get over the net, unless you lift it more. sometimes it is very hard to get enough upward wipe on the ball, since some players slice shots dont come off the ground very high at all, while topspin shots jump up off the ground. i notice my slice returns tend to get hit into the net more by players that don't understand spin continuation, because they dont lift the ball. thoughts?

[@JohnKeeling]

I would agree that a slice/cut shot tends to float off the court, because it does not have the spin pressure downwards like topspin balls do

[@bernieshapiro3716]

Nice breakdown of the player Stokes, serves and court position

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Thanks. I appreciate you watching and your compliment.

[@kathysommer5991]

I am only at 4:28 and I see a foot fault from the guy with the pony tail and the guy in the white shirt looks like he is tossing the ball when he is serving. Isn’t that an illegal serve? Update - At 11:05 the guy in white is totally tossing up the ball on his serve.

[@caotikforlife]

toss serve is legal, paddle has to hit the ball below the wrist and the waistline on toss serve

[@73NF14Ret]

I just got challenged on this the last time I played, I think people are getting the drop serve rules and volley serve rules mixed up. There is zero restriction on tossing up the volley serve(just don’t put spin on it), but the drop serve cannot be tossed up at all. Most people don’t toss the volley serve up very high(a few inches) because of the 3 volley serve swing rules.

[@kathysommer5991]

Got it! I was definitely mixing the drop and volley.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Yep, you can toss on volley serve, can't toss or put downward force on a drop serve. Thanks for watching.

[@JohnKeeling]

the toss serve is illegal and i think that the video at 8:20 or so clearly shows the guy in white tossing it up. here is the pickleball rule posted following, if you toss the ball up, you are propelling it (as opposed to releasing it, whihc infers to me, you are letting it fall from your hand): 4.A.8.b. When releasing the ball, the ball shall not be propelled in any direction or in any manner prior to striking the ball to make the serve.

[@KTCHNPickleball]

Thanks for this! 💪

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

You're welcome! Thanks for watching.

[@jimrobertson716]

The near court players are consistently hitting their serves above their waist. OK in recreational play but I don’t think they would be acceptable in tournament play.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

It's a tough call. Thanks for pointing out.

[@okayest_amateur]

Actually in official rules the waist is considered the belly button. It may seem like they are swinging above their waist but if you look carefully they are swinging at or below their waist. I paused the video quite a few times to verify this. Both players are definitely playing close to the line especially since they are tossing the ball up before hitting the shot. Tossing the ball up is still technically legal but you do run the risk of hitting above the waist. I personally hold the ball at the belly button and just drop the ball to ensure that no one calls my shot illegal.

[@evidencebased1]

All very good points you are making. That slowmo at 9:00 really show the problem though. He holds the ball at chest height, then tosses the ball up. It is hard for me to believe it has fallen to navel before he strikes the ball.

[@Nysoupla]

Good video choice! Any way 4 U to slo-mo any actions? Thanks

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

I can do that. Thanks for the suggestion and thanks for watching.

[@billrector]

You can do that in KZbin settings.

[@JohnKeeling]

you tube settings (select the gear icon). you can slow down to various speeds

[@Nysoupla]

@JohnKeeling thanks. Know that. Just wanted his commentary with speed change. 😉

[@ToanDao-gr6ez]

Some of your videos are interesting, but would you please update your about info with your pickleball background to give us a baseline of your skill level. Thx !

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Sure. Thanks.

[@OlafWang]

White shirt blue cap serve looks illegal to me since the toss looks like the balls goes up before it comes down and he then hits it. I can hit much better serves if i do this as well.... I avoid this on purpose by facing my palm down and dropping the ball and then i hit the ball out of the air. Please advise if i can do what he is doing because i could serve even better then....

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Thanks for asking. Yes. What he's doing is legal. There was a trial period in either the PPA or the APP where players were not allowed to do that. So, go ahead and give it a shot. Now if you were doing a drop serve you could not throw the ball up and you cannot put downward force on it.

[@CryptoVin]

When you’re getting attacked at the NVZ you should move back to give you more time to counter, no? I’ve seen the pros do it. Maybe that was too far back?

[@73NF14Ret]

I agree with retreating on a pop up, otherwise stay.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Sure, back up if you pop the ball up and get in a defensive position with your knees bent and paddle at your feet. In this instance I don't think the ball was going to be slammed. Thanks for watching.

[@jmcloughlin]

@@CryptoVin The player in grey had some interesting movement patterns. Backwards scooted right off the court a few times and on a couple of pop ups did not move forward to attack ball but rather waited for ball to drop below level of net and then drove ball into net with two hand backhand. But who knows why? Perhaps shoulder problem or maybe ball was not as attackable as it seemed on this camera angle ?

[@CryptoVin]

I’ve seen pros shuffle back off the kitchen line a few feet as they are being attacked. It’s funny, I noticed that everyone has different opinions on what to do in certain situations. I’ve had one player tell me one thing and another tell me the complete opposite.

[@johnmclou]

Deborah Irvine takes a full step back when under attack she looks about 2' off line. I agree that people can be pretty dogmatic which is interesting because one of the best players, ben johns, gave advice (paraphrasing) keep your mind open because it's a newish game.

[@jmcloughlin]

Rory, Could you tell us the pro who advocated ditching the drop? I've had success with drops if opponent past the baseline and not mobile. I add backspin so ball doesnt exit nvz. even when it's returned, its pop up and i hit at them before they escape the nvz. demoralizing to sprint up just to get slammed. Cat and mouse game. worth doing once early in game to give the opponent another thing to think on? less useful now that younger, faster players have joined us. My partner has seen me have some success and is trying shot but ball is carrying out to midcourt and is getting us blown up. I wish she wouldnt learn a shot that i should be quitting myself. i'd love if you tell me where to find video and i'll pass it on. Best, Jm

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Sure. James Ignatowich. Of course, the players he plays against are probably younger, faster and more athletic than the ones you are playing against. Most of them can get to that shot. If your opponents can't, hit it. I tried to find the exact video and could not. He has a lot of videos out there with really good advice. Check them out sometime.

[@okayest_amateur]

Rory is correct on this one and I've seen the video he is referencing. If your opponent is not mobile then go ahead and do it (but its still kind of a douche move lol). if you keep your opponent back you are almost guaranteed the point id like to say 80% win ratio. It might take a few shots but it is the safe option because you are hitting easy volleys / overheads while your opponent is making very difficult low percentage drops. I would probably give my partner the evil eye if he tried this maneuver and then call him a show off especially if we ended up losing the point because of it. Lol!! The moral of the story is in general you should respect the movement of your opponent and do not underestimate them. If you are in a position to win a point with an 80% chance by keeping them back why would you ever want to bring them forward and reduce your chances to 50%. The point is that you wouldn't especially if you were in a competitive settings. Play the shot that will get you the best chance of winning. But if you just want to have fun play whatever shot makes you happy. Sometimes I will play an overhead in rec play that is waaaay out just because I love slamming the ball.

[@rteitel1974]

@@okayest_amateur I agree. the high % shot is to get the ball deep. Pet peeve of mine is the damn drop!

[@okayest_amateur]

@@rteitel1974 haha I feel you.

[@jmcloughlin]

@@okayest_amateur You must be playing at a much higher level than i am because when we have the opponents at the baseline it is nowhere near a 80% likelihood that we win the point. Too many times we hit it long, or directly into net. Twice last week i whiffed on an overhead. Was pretty windy. I agree that the higher percentage shot is to keep them deep but 80%?? I think it would be interesting to take a random video of Rory's at 3.5 to 4.5 level and see what the percentage is. If you read my comment you will see that i mention this as a occasional shot to give the opponent another thing to worry about. Finally, regarding my character. When i play with mobility challanged people, i hit the ball to them. My last two years of coaching for my town's youth baseball/softball league i won sportsmanship awards for the league so im pretty sure noone would call me as show-off or a douche as you have. So basically, screw you lol, (does the lol make it ok?).

[@kittyha7745]

White shirt guys serve appears to be illegal some of the time. He often contacts above the waist and there is no upward mothion

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

A number of viewers pointed out. Thanks for watching

[@jeffglasel619]

take a look if the player that did the erne foot faulted

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

I didn't catch it. I'll look again. Thanks for watching.

[@Orefamilylawncare]

They guy in the pony tail isn't bad by any means as he does have useful shots however the guy in the white shirt has a much better overall game.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Nice observation. The guy with the ponytail made many more unforced errors than his partner. If he can clean that up, he'll be much better.

[@iantercero5380]

Nah, that person is not good, I wouldn’t call him a 4.0

[@goodeddie9315]

I thought you can’t throw the ball up on serve.

[@janinemurdock2043]

Only in PPA to the best of my knowledge for volley serves. USAP doesn't explicitly forbid it, and I don't think it's really considered a big deal generally in rec play. Now if you plan on playing in PPA, it's probably a good idea to get out of the habit, but. I personally don't understand why it's against the rules in PPA for a volley serve; as long as you aren't putting spin on it with your hand and are still making contact below your waist in an upward motion, i don't get what possible difference a toss could make.

[@aljerones99]

@janinemurdock2043 I think the toss is controversial because the motion of the ball can be manipulated, even slightly when not simply dropped. It is hard to decipher whether the ball is being manipulated or not, otherwise, no matter how slight.

[@janinemurdock2043]

@aljerones99 that's fair. I do volley serves myself exclusively and I do drop them underhand, but I know I do raise my hand up some as I'm preparing to let go of the ball and so it does get just a minimal bit of lift before it comes down, so this topic is definitely of some interest to me. I get what you're saying about it being difficult for judges to tell if any motion is being added to the ball though.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

What the other posters said.

[@chrishennon8504]

Dubious line calls by near court team…

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Thanks for pointing that out.

[@jmcloughlin]

@@chrishennon8504 oh yeah. Would definitely not want to end the game with that call.

[@SDPBALLCOACH]

Good lord, these guys claim 4.0+ ratings!!??😮😮 Their serves are "ok" at best and Ponytails guy hit 3 errors in a row!! Including his SERVE!! 4.0's simply don't make these errors.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Errors happen at every level of pickleball. The player that I think has a very good swing is actually 4.5. Thanks for watching.

[@okayest_amateur]

If your hitting every serve in your probably playing too safe and not hitting an agressive enough servie. Connor Hance from Enhance pickleball calls it the 9/10th rule. If your not hitting 1 of 10 balls out your not hitting aggressive enough.

[@benaiah2006]

I serve like the 1st guy, but my serve is even faster.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Nice!

[@johnquinlan5511]

both of these servers are above the waste on the follow through.... not good serves at all to be honest.

[@billrector]

above the waist is fine on the follow-through. You just can't impact the ball above the waist.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

I'm not 100% sure if they are illegal. They are, however, very powerful.

[@jaimetarne9436]

The foot faults from this team is terrible. It is on serves and at the kitchen.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Thanks for pointing that out.

[@iantercero5380]

The woman in the pink shorts was 3.5 at best….. but not even.

[@pickleballpick-apart9787]

Thanks for watching and thanks for your opinion.