Pilot 823 VS Twsbi Vac 700R Iris - Fountain Pen Comparison

I happened to place these two pens on the desk next to each other and that inspired me to do this video. Hopefully this will help you in any purchasing decisions you may have.
Bonus talk about proper design when it comes to posting a pen.

[@13noman1]

I rather like my TWSBI Iris for the looks, the filling mechanism and the value equation (I'd be sad but not broken hearted if anything bad happened to it)...but I LOVE my 823, have had it for 5+ years now. It's an absolutely great writer, perfect for me. I've often thought the 823 would be my "if only one" pen. I'd replace it instantly if anything bad befell it.

[@stormycatmink]

I just noticed my inexpensive Sailor Compass 1911 has three soft flats inside the cap. Cheap $30 pen and they designed the cap to mate at three points and not wiggle. Bravo to those engineers.

[@munozrick]

Thanks again for going into the detailed design and materials. Always fascinating how such small changes can make a big difference.

[@JuceePeachz67]

Great comparison. I have the Iris in a stub nib & I love it. The 823 is on my wishlist this year.

[@Avocado818]

How do you like the stub nib? I have a pilot vanishing point stub nib and mine squeaks a bit, my twsbi is in a fine nib and it works extremely well 100% of the time

[@anguswhite8233]

Love my Pilot 823 ‘F’ which I’ve had inked from the moment I took delivery!; my TWSBI 580 has ‘EF’ nib which puts down a broader line: if you’ve got small handwriting, go for the Pilot; if price point is prime consideration, go for Pilot 78g+ w EF nib: cheap as chips and consistently good nibs - this is what I’m buying after 5yrs in the game:)

[@fossilimprint2954]

Wonderful comparison, now I will have to get both.

[@MD-eb6iu]

Loving the engineering behind the pens. Not something I’ve found elsewhere.

[@geoffberteau2847]

Doodlebud has a Lamy 2000 to show you, then 😄

[@adrianhughes5831]

What a useful video. Thank you. I have both of these pens. My Pilot 823 has a broad nib re-ground to a cursive italic, and the TWSBI has a 1.1mm stub, which I have smoothed. The TWSBI wrench fits both pens! If I could only have one then it would have to be the Pilot. It just feels a better pen in the hand and with use you begin to understand the price point difference. If your budget doesn't stretch that far - you still get a very fine pen from TWSBI

[@thuntz29]

I’m waiting for my 823... and just rewatching all the videos about it... PenSachi is taking forever to dispatch it...

[@Doodlebud]

Lol... Patience is a virtue

[@C4CH3S]

And I'm waiting for my Iris! Haha

[@bizqrd5310]

The cap design on Pilot 823, allows the system to breath while posted.

[@Doodlebud]

Yep, can turn the knob to open up the reservoir then just post the pen so you don't have to worry about running out of ink

[@thepenman357]

Nice comparison! I've owned my 823 for a few years, and I love it. I got a broad nib, and it had no issues out-of-the-box. I really appreciate my 823 after watching other videos comparing it with two of my other grail pens - Pelikan M800/805, and the Montblanc 146. I think I can be easily content with just my 823, unless I find one of the other two at conditions and price points I couldn't pass up, of course.

[@Doodlebud]

The 823 is a super solid pen. Very well made, reliable, reasonably priced, and every other quality you want in a high end fountain pen.

[@siyuanxu3537]

I have both of them (the old 700r), I changed the TWSBI nib with a spare Bock Type250 Palladium (all the steel nibs I have from TWSBIs are "not good" to "just so-so", I think I just have bad luck). But I would say, all in all I will go for 823 for the one-stop solution. Thanks for the video.

[@Doodlebud]

My Eco nibs don't do much for me. The Vac 700 is a decent fine steel nib. That's a interesting nib upgrade! Glad you liked the vid 👍

[@siyuanxu3537]

@@Doodlebud my two nibs on 580 were the high point that they both have only half tips, other half are bearly to be seen. But I still think that the problem is I got the earlier batch, so maybe things have changed now.

[@Doodlebud]

@@siyuanxu3537 Damn! That's a crap nib lol

[@williammodlin2621]

I have some TWSBIs that I like a lot. Do wish they posted better as I prefer that. I am in the market for a Pilot 823, so I appreciate your mini-review. Thanks.

[@Doodlebud]

823 is a very good pen

[@AlTheEngineer]

You really gotta own them both! Can't have one over the other :)

[@hikingpipes6911]

Nice review. I only have 5 pens at the moment, and regarding the posting wiggle... My Lamy Al-Star (cheapest pen) has no wiggle what so ever. All my others have a bit of wiggle. It was also interesting to see the geometry of the Pilot in the cap. Shame that a pen at the price point of the Pilot required some work of the nib.

[@Doodlebud]

I just got unlucky with that, unfortunately it does happen. They are usually very outstanding nibs & pens overall. Build quality & engineering behind the scenes is very good

[@Merlin012001]

That wiggle and the weight of the cap flinging it off the pen was why i stopped using my Parker IM for work. The cap was hitting the floor so much I was getting to where i didn't post it and i got tired of holding the cap while writing. so i switched to a pen that would post securely, theParker Vector in stainless steel.

[@Doodlebud]

The Vector in SS was my first FP I got in high school. Some jackass stole in in shop class. Only tool about 20 yrs to get back info FP again. I kinda like holding some pen caps while I write, but it's not suitable I find in a busy work environment. Parker 51 style pens (real or low cost imitations) are a great busy work environment pen too

[@zveryok1]

I'll take my lamy 2000 EF instead 🙂 got it for $125, brand new. What a steal.

[@Doodlebud]

That is an amazing deal

[@zveryok1]

@@Doodlebud Yeah! Got it from Amazon Japan two weeks ago. I was on the fence as I just got into the hobby. They had 10 pens that went in 2 days. I got the last one 🙂

[@jorge23483]

About the scratchy fine nib on the pilot 823,I have the similar problem with a Sheaffer EF inlaid nib, and I tried smoothing the outer part of the nib tines✒️ because I discovered they had been making part of the scratchy sound when they made contact on the surface of the paper (especially not so smooth paper), so by polishing slightly the exterior edge of the nib tines✒️ it really helps with the sound and sensation of the scratchy nib. Sometimes is not the tipping of the nob but certain sharpness of the nib tines, in this case the exterior parts of the tines✒️ wich doesn't affect the nib tipping. I hope I'd explain myself 😅 and it could be of use for you. Thank you for the video 👍.

[@Doodlebud]

Thanks for the tip, I'll see if that might be the culprit

[@MrAndrew1953]

I have had a 700R for 2-3 years- a great pen with a terrific ink capacity. Very easy,mess free filling set up with Twsbi’s refill bottles. Hard trying to find a Pilot that has what I want in terms of specs. Metal Falcon with a con 70 converter and FA nib. 823 is nice, the grey is very neglected.

[@lavenderpurp6610]

I have both🥰😍

[@paulmchugh1430]

I took your suggestion and went to your comparison review of the two pens. Great review. Thanks. The 823 is a smooth pen right out of the box. The question is the USD200+ differential worth the 823? I don't know.

[@pieterpan]

I have multiple TWSBI's 700 VAC's. Their weak spot is the cap. It breaks at the thread after a while. I have had to buy 3 new caps already. I do really pay attention not to tighten them too hard. They are just not up to the daily use I throw at them.

[@Doodlebud]

Damn, 3 busted caps! I dunno maybe you just have freaky strong hands or something 💪. You might want to look into a metal pen to hold up to your use. Gravitas Pens are exceptionally well made and fairly priced I feel with lots of options to choose from. He also puts some extremely durable coatings on some of his pens as well so should stand up to pretty much anything.

[@pieterpan]

@@Doodlebud thanks for the advise. I really don't do anything wrong. It is a known problem, but not recognised as a fabrication or design flaw. I am now using a kaweco sport brass, which is quite cool, but not the smoothest writer. Waiting for a MB 149 that I bought used. 😁

[@Doodlebud]

Threads on pens will always be the weakest point. There are ways to help reduce the stress on the threads. Some manufacturers take care of this properly, some dont.... Just surprised you've had it happen so many times. Take 'er easy on your MB 149! LOL I got mine used as well and love it!

[@pieterpan]

True. It is mechanically the weakest point, but I do think the design choices and brittle material make the TWSBI 700 particularly sensitive. It happened 3 times on different pens (I have them in different colours) and over probably 5 years of almost daily use and being taken on business trips, from meeting to meeting...

[@garyb2507]

I fell for the hype, bought a Pilot 823 on Amazon. It had a crack across the barrel threads straight out of the box. A quick Google search revealed a lot of others with the same problem. Is it perhaps a design flaw? Poor quality 'precious' resin? It's a shame because it feels to be a lovely pen, perfectly sized for an everyday carry pen. Mine went back of course.

[@Doodlebud]

Buying from Amazon can be an issue. You're not buying from pen retailers or manufacturers. The pen was most likely damaged by a previous person who bought, they returned it, and the seller just put it back up for sale again. I've seen that happen before on Amazon

[@Matt-dd1zr]

One day I’ll own a Custom 823... But first comes the Pilot Myu :D

[@derekdavis5720]

Another great video & educational. Disappointed that the Pilot Custom 823 didn’t come out pitch perfect straight from the box. Overall by far my favourite brand. The feeling I get from my TWSBI pens is why don’t I use them more often?. I always enjoy them & the nibs and everything else are great. I’ve heard that the ultimate Pilot pen is the Custom 845 with Con 70 converter. Rarer than hens teeth especially if you want the FA nib. Maybe one day. Thank you for the video.

[@nitina8564]

The iris certainly has a very beautiful nib. The custom 823 is one of my favourite fountain pens. And the wiggle issue with posting is something i noticed as well and can you believe a low cost pen like the platinum preppy also posts without the wiggle.

[@Doodlebud]

I don't think the TWSBI was made to be posted. But many others are & it's not done right. A cheap pen can do it right for sure. It's not an expense thing, just a design decision... Sometimes design oversight.

[@pauljupp2077]

Thank you for this review. It really helped me decide between these two pens. Bit concerned about the nib issue you mentioned so how did you fix the issue? Most reviews gush over the Pilot 823 as a grail pen.

[@Doodlebud]

I think my nib was an outlier. I did smooth it out & it's better, but still not how I want it to be. It's also, for me at least, too wet for a fine nib. Gonna play with it a bit to see if I can get it not so wet

[@pauljupp2077]

Thank you again. You seem to know which pens I’m considering to buy! How is that possible? Another extremely useful review. I bought a Faber Castel emotion black it’s one of the few pens I own that also posts correctly. Really smooth steel nib too! Just interested in what you had to do to the nib of the 823?

[@Doodlebud]

Im always happy to hear when one of my vids helps somebody out! To smooth the nib I used to micromesh pads. But don't go on doing this on a new pen if you're not confident with what you're doing. Its a VERY quick way to mess up an expensive nib!

[@Denali_Rebel]

You’re comparing a $360 pen with a $60 pen? If they are even remotely comparable then the TWSBI sounds like the winner.

[@burgosmatthew]

@doodlebud when you say that the trim is gold. Does that mean that the metal pieces around the pen are 585 gold or that they are plated in gold?

[@Doodlebud]

That's a good question! Perhaps I can do some digging! I feel it's just plated. You can have quality plating & cheap plating. That would be a lot of gold on the pen if it was solid gold. They would probably put a 14K on the clip as well & not just on the nib.

[@davecharvella4854]

I love my 823 ... both of them! 😁

[@klt479]

Glad in have both my 700 and 822. However, my 700 does not hold a candle to my 823.

[@Doodlebud]

It makes sense that for the significant price differential and material use, the 823 would be superior. After all, it is a premium pen and is loved by 99.9% of owners.

[@anitasamuel-george5788]

Great comparison! I have the Iris with a stub. Thinking about the 823 in the future...in a medium or a broad. What ink did you use?

[@Doodlebud]

Robert oster River of Fire

[@llorcall]

It's unbelievable to hear you say that the Pilot nib needed some work and the 1/3 of the price TWSBI was great out of the box. What the hell is the problem with the big compagnies and their nibs? I have the VAC 700 r in black, why would i spend another 350€ and risk buying a pen that the nib doesn't write well? I am new to the fountain pen hobby or should I say addiction but I can't get my head around it, why pay more if you have the perfect product in front of you, be honest...

[@Doodlebud]

There never a 100% guarantee any item will be flawless. Pilot has a very good QC process and it seems like my pen is an outlier. It is very rare I hear of issues with the 823, but that doesn't mean it won't ever happen.

[@sidneyjunior8130]

Both are great pens... but I would say Pilot is my preference...!!!

[@dpajc056]

"took some styling cues..." Bro it's a STRAIGHT COPY 1 for 1!!! Hahahah c'mon let's be real

[@Doodlebud]

You legit serious? Straight copy??? So if you set these two pens in front of someone they wouldn't be able to tell them apart? In that case any pen with a nib, cap, clip, and holds ink is a straight copy.

[@ameliabuns4058]

Wiggle wiggle wiggle wiggle!

[@Doodlebud]

yeah

[@markraynal8769]

Could really do without the intrusive commercial right in the middle of the discussion. Heck, the review is only 13 minutes long - nothing is worth enduring two ads in that time span, candidly.

[@thepenman357]

Hmm, when I watched I didn't see any commercials. Keep in mind that even if a channel is not monetized Google/KZbin places their own ads as they see fit, and the content creator has no control of that.

[@basta.dotto_]

You can block the ads with software. That's what I did, and I saw no ads; the screen goes black for les than a second when the ad should have played. It doesn't affect the video or the flow of information.

[@Matt-dd1zr]

Am I fiiiirst? 😱

[@Doodlebud]

Yes you are! BOOM! 💪

[@TheMuffinMan01]

get out of my brain

[@Doodlebud]

Noooooooo, I now control your mind! 🤯