Fox's New Electronic Live Valve NEO Suspension Compared to Rockshox Flight Attendant

[@antoinedoinell]

Ok fine. make the mechanical stuff cheaper then.

[@mike-b4h4d]

😂😂 I wouldn’t hold my breath. Especially for sram

[@wurst656]

that's how the world works... oh wait

[@ignaciosevil2157]

@@mike-b4h4d but who has better wireless tech though.. Seems like fox is more open regarding tuning and updates. But flight has been on the market for ages. I wouldnt know how to choose between these too.

[@jokermtb]

I've never found myself during a ride thinking "I wish my fork and shock had on the fly damping alteration"......that hill you hate to climb still suxx even with this fancy tech.

[@MrScart35]

Price: $949-999 USD for shocks, + $399 for sensors. Who is asking for this stuff?

[@branna8829]

Literally no one in their right mind.

[@troycifer42]

Why dentist and doctors. That's pocket change to them.

[@litwanlazerdimfan]

Racers maybe

[@joedesimone1444]

Probably very few. They built it because they can not because it is greatly needed. It's the classic technology scenario "a solution looking for a problem".

[@SavageAudits]

Kooks, poseurs, etc....

[@scottmeredith3359]

Yesss, just what I need on my motorized electric mountain bike to go with my wireless drivetrain, I hope it has a special app to go with it and I have to charge it too. Can I sync it with Strava so I can show the bros my shock telemetry from every ride?? Man, how did even enjoy mountain biking twenty years ago 🤦‍♂️

[@nathantoney.1501]

Don’t forget to get the sidekick wheels too

[@ManchurianCounterweight]

haha it was terrible, we just rode around with NO WITNESSES or VIDEO it was horrific, it was like it never happened.

[@ABoringTool]

I enjoy both analog and digital. It's nice to have lots of data sometimes. the problem is companies trying to tell you to buy new digital stuff so they can lock you in.

[@and30ers]

Love Dario! Excellent presentation of this technology, it's applications, use cases, pros and cons, real life user experiences, bugs, shortcomings, competitors, cost etc. Missed nothing. Well done!

[@ridemx323]

Rather have reliable and easy to service suspension. Without special tools.

[@mkim64]

Bumble down the trail - now with live stats!

[@ioliveira]

No, I can't ride today because I forgot to charge my derailleur/shifter/dropper/shock/fork. Wireless brakes coming soon apparently.

[@sagebrush3222]

I charge my derailleur about once every 200 or so miles …I think I’ve charged 3 times since June…just sayin

[@curtisgoodwin8962]

🤣🤣🤣

[@battistaverardi1240]

I agree nothing but bogus gimmicks!

[@Basement_CNC]

I heard about wireless steering as well, that's really gonna be a game changer 😮

[@ioliveira]

@@Basement_CNC Canyon KISS:ON, wanna bet? 😂

[@Coolcmsc]

Seriously, get some high end coaching. For $1000 of coaching you’ll be able to ride a shopping trolly down the Fortwilliam DH track - not joking.

[@aleixbartomeus4135]

100% true

[@Nomad-MTB]

I just added the DHX Live Valve Neo to my Moterra SL. There is no bob when I peddle and it's open when you need it. I ride at 210 lbs and always have an issue with my suspension because I ride thick . The benefits I see here is if I am racing my ebike, that will translate into seconds without a doubt. Also, it's instant when it opens. You don't even think about it. Either way I am sold on this tech and will be throwing another one on my SJ 15.

[@koopatrpa]

what happens if you wheel drop off a skinny. The fork doesn't hit first, so do you end up landing on a locked out shock?

[@pinkbike]

Good questions! It has freefall detection to curb this issue.

[@muzzarobbo]

what about manualling into a root or rock? it might think the front is just gradually going up a rise

[@michaelmann3636]

Jeff Kendal Weed did a review of this system also. His front wheel is almost never on the ground and he liked it. He bounces around the trail like a ninja on steroids, if he says it has potential I can believe him. For me though I don’t want electronic stuff on my bike.

[@darkness789]

This system makes sense ten years ago when peddle efficiency sucked but now bikes are so good you should never be using the lockout

[@LlenadeMalo]

Unless you are an XC racer or going up fireroads, I don’t see when you would use a lock out.

[@mtbohana]

If it has a battery, it doesn't go on my bike, unless it's lighting up the trail at night.

[@TeamCykelhold]

cool cool...but I just want stuff that works well all the time (doesn't blow seals) and isn't too expensive and is easy to service and has parts easily available and is easy to tune. You can keep all the electronic stuff for the dentists.

[@nathantoney.1501]

My guess is there will possibly be dramatically less efficient (pedaling) suspension designs coming that might put the sidekick hub and neo to good use.

[@1bluensx]

I think that you did a great job presenting these. What did I learn? That I absolutely do NOT want or need these on my bike. I absolutely do not want anything on my bike that needs an app to run it.

[@Steve-r3g]

I can see the top 1% of competitive racers benefiting from these. And there will always be those who love cool new gadgets. But I vote for simpler bikes with manual suspension tuning and no batteries. The last thing I want to do is pull out my phone to adjust my suspension settings during my mountain bike ride. I'm out there to commune with Nature, not a phone app.

[@ricatkd]

It's been a while since I MTB; feels like the industry is out of attractive ideas to squeeze money out of customers. This doesn´t feel like fun.

[@andyboy198577777]

So stay out of the community if you don’t like it. Bye 😂😂😂

[@cheddy_chedderson_cheddouard]

​@@andyboy198577777you like electronic suspension my guy?

[@Onlydansmtb]

Thanks but il stick with a climb lever ...

[@roqclimber]

I'm not sure I like my Bike being Smarter than I am. It might go riding without me!

[@Timthecommenter]

It will be super fun to replace this in six years when they inevitably stop supporting these ‘obsolete’ shocks and sensors in the apps. Subscription shocks coming soon.

[@supachill1]

Meh, I’m waiting for Laser suspension.

[@80211Denver]

Sounds REALLY neat. I wonder if we'll be able to say one day use "speed, assent/decent, roughness, acceleration" combinations each have not only open/close but adjust dampening proportions? oh, you just dropped fast, open but not too soft or you'll bottom out hard feels like you're climbing super technical, lock out mostly but a little give to dig in and maintain traction.

[@philipyii8396]

i likes fox come out the live valve suspension system for the fork. Looking forward for it.

[@and2244rew]

Shoulda called it the Fox ‘NOPE’

[@LucasMillerMTB]

If they release it for the Dhx2 I will buy it for my DH race bike. Especially living in the Midwest where we have a lot of mellow downhills, an adaptive lockout would be ideal for this. We have fast chunk, but we often have to pedal a fair amount to keep speed between sections.

[@mazditzo]

Can't wait for wireless brake system yihaaa

[@mackrate]

I think it's important to note that you can run flight attendant without a fork as well. I also feel there are many disparities between the two systems. As you mentioned there will be a manual remote coming for fox at some point in the future... this is feature is already present on flight attendant systems. Another thing to note is that lack of integration that the NEO system offers. Perhaps with more back end support for pedal sensing from the likes of ebike motors we will see similar features to the Flight Attendant system. It is also important to note that the rockshox system does not require the flight attendant pedal sensor and can instead be connected to any of the sram/rockshox powermeters (crank and quarq). The support for integration of pedal sensing with the fox system could unleash a new realm of potential with the NEO system. Overall, I believe that Flight Attendant is still the better option due to the share amount of system integration that it offers. Perhaps in future we will see this integration with the NEO system but for now Flight attendant still takes the crown.

[@jonathanhowson6420]

No thank you. The only electronic thing I want on my bikes are lights so I can keep riding in the winter months. I ride mtbs to get away from all the electronic crap.

[@stanleykachuik2589]

Welp, at least we know they're done fiddling with our bikes geometry. When they move to electrify our components.😅

[@thegarageluthier]

So now its have i charged my groupset, have i charged my dropper, have i charged my shocks, have i charged my bike, do i have my phone for the different apps. Seriously when did just getting on a bike get so crazy and costly. Think i will stick to my analog setup and enjoy the simplicity and cost savings.

[@danielreynolds5012]

Acuity ... that's fun to say!!

[@pkvillager]

All I'd like is an electronic bar mounted shock/fork lockout button with no sensors but that would still be too expensive. I like the idea of the Neo system and its more appealing to me than Flight Attendant, but both are insanely expensive, and I'll never get either one.

[@francisdee9955]

Still dont want electronics on my bike

[@scottpratico1315]

I want all this on a long travel E enduro with wireless group and post. All run from the 1000wh battery.

[@DarrenSmith-x6h]

God i carnt even finish watching this ,its painful ,the removal of simplicity

[@Tony_P]

I lasted 3 minutes.

[@johnlesoudeur3653]

I could not handle the vocal fry.

[@lilblaster22]

You still have to set up your suspension. So I'll stick with the climb switch since I'm not a racer😮 I tested the system and at speed the shock packs up big-time...

[@didato6926]

@fox nice option for manual override controller On bar.

[@Rayman.g]

So adaptive dampers? Cool stuff will be interesting to see how this develops. I’m used to EDC costs from my BMWs 😂

[@Ryan-pf3qo]

In a few years every part of your bike is going to have its own battery that you need to charge. People will complain about having to change batteries before every ride and one of the big manufacturers will release a standard for a centralized battery which will require running power wires through your frame to each individual part. Taking us full circle back to the internal frame routing that the original battery tech was supposed to avoid.

[@cameronlowry7599]

What happens if you're hitting jumps? I'd like to see a Sam pilgrim mode lol.

[@AfroBob420]

this is the best mode or stairs of doom!

[@Onceayoungidiot]

Don’t know how much difference it’ll make to a DH bike, but electronic suspension made a huge difference to my motorcycle handling. Even compared to the good setup I had before (properly tuned progressive fork, Ohlin TTX rear).

[@v3spert1ne]

in contrast to electronic shifting it this technology at least does something the analog counterpart is not able to.. would like to try it..

[@tonyroma9305]

They should put the bump sensors in the thru axles

[@pernyberg2816]

An actual nice thing to all this "smart"-nonesense would be a dropper that can go both up and down by the push of a button...or two.

[@Conwayfreeky]

Elastic foam inserts 🎉time.

[@Surestick88]

How do these sensors handle the heat from a set of absolutely roasted brakes? Electronics generally don't like heat and lithium batteries can get spicy.

[@80211Denver]

if your brakes are so hot they are interfering with the batteries sitting 1/8" away from them, you have other things to worry about

[@Cinnabuns2009]

So this makes a next gen High Pivot bike a great pedal'r? Who doesn't want that?

[@ellleuquino6823]

What happen with this guy voice? Is electronic too or what?

[@ballofsnow]

It's unbearable. I bet this video has good info but I just can't watch it due to his raspy vocal fry voice.

[@NocSuKow]

Ohlins butter 🧈 tough to beat

[@chiefsilverback]

If the unit fails does it default to open or closed?

[@GeorgeMilkasIgore]

He explained that it stays open by default.

[@noControl556]

So is the idea that the electronic tuning is just turning the lockout on and off based on inputs or can you tune the amount of dampening electronically as well? Or on the more advanced shocks do you still manually set the clickers and then the electronic control just goes from closed to that manual tuned setting? I would like to see a cheaper / simpler option that just has a remote to open/close the valve manually vs having to stop and reach down to flip the switch. Are there any plans to integrate with the Bosch controller for ebikes? So I could assign the shock "recipes" to modes in the ebike controller? This would give you one switch on the bars to change modes. Also with anything electronic on an ebike being the shock, or drive train, it would be great for them to be wired to the main battery vs. needing to charge 3 separate batteries.

[@lameboysmtb6705]

Now its time for Shimano to make electronic MTB derailleurs that work with the fox batteries

[@Emtbtoday]

Just watched the new Flaot X version before this cool to see it in coil have they done an X2 version?

[@gazyates5228]

Think I would just prefer a wireless bar control so I can click in to firm mode save reaching down to the shock trying to switch that fiddley little leaver .

[@QuakFu]

So maybe it's just me but isn't that a Rockshox flight attendant shock in the video about the 3:10 mark...?

[@Mark__A]

Another data harvesting phone app and battery to charge. Yeeeeee. This is what I needed.

[@rouxenophobe]

Copilot calculated that if you are going 300kph then the rear shock fails to react in time to the detected bump...! Sensor speed: 1/70s Wheelbase 1200cm

[@ClarkKent23823]

what's up with the vocal fry ? I'm just curious where it came from. so fascinating. Great review by the way. ty

[@mmiisshhaa]

hey pinkbike, could you please do a comparison between the dh x and x2 factories? there's actually barely any info online. There's just 1 video review, from a rider who didn't seem to ride them hard anyways. My bike came with a dhx, and I want to know how it compares to an x2!

[@skiboot1]

The x2's have high and low speed rebound and compression where as the X's just have high speed rebound and compression.

[@mmiisshhaa]

@@skiboot1 yes, but nalso the x have a thicker stantion which may or may not give more friction but more strength, and it's not just the extra adjustments on the x2, but also a completely different damper design. Would be nice to know how do these differences actually translate on the trail with pro riders.

[@JohnFinelli-wl3di]

Dario ,What Conti combo tires you running?

[@porroco]

Is this for xc riders who needs a firm shock going upslope?

[@justpatkathings]

Is this the suspension that Loic Bruni and Specialized were testing?

[@danielpatino81]

I love my electronic shifting but I hate when I forget to charge the battery. I think the electronic suspension will work great for racers, i dont think it will make any difference on the weekend warrior as myself. Other that have more batteries to be worry about.

[@ej4796]

Hey Dario, what knee pads do you use?

[@a8f235]

Given you need a 399$ kit on top of the pricetag for the shock made me bail on this completely. Then I'm way more interested in buying a Grip X damper rebuild kit for my Fox 36 and just go for the stock Fox DHX shock and this will be a much more reasonable upgrade in my mind. I'm also doubtful to first gen electronic gizmos, so I'll just watch from a far from now. I want a plusher ride, but 1400$ just for the shock is something that is a hard thing to swallow. Vorsprung Telum would make more sense to look at if one was to consider more premium products...

[@masaharumorimoto4761]

Who has money for this?!?! It's so tight here that I had to make compromises on tires and skip new riding gear this year.

[@vashusan1984]

As someone who has spent a stupid amount of money on high end bikes in the last 3 years, I cannot imagine buying or even wanting this. Maybe I'm just old and crotchety, but I'm not into any batteries on my MTB. I'd rather get stronger than spend more money and add weight.

[@michaelcuddihee6754]

super cool!

[@johnleduc4362]

Serious question - I miss my Twinlok from my Genius. Does anyone else make an aftermarket lockout device that you can add to the cockpit?

[@GabrielRueeger]

Interesting, but I prefer to have less electronics and high chances for self repair. Not sure who will benefit from that tec.

[@ctsingletrack]

I hope we'll still be able to buy bikes without batteries in the future

[@dillydean]

The Neo is brilliant! Simple, upgradable and it works. Price aside this is amazing tech. Keen to try this one-day.

[@clubtouge1052]

Mid ride your shock app subscription ends and your tune reverts 😂

[@dont_hit_trees]

Full analog for the foreseeable future over here. I’m sure it’s nice I just don’t see the value.

[@mirkobiondi2100]

As live valve user, is fuckunbelievable that they did not make a freaking basic control unit to fit on the bar, so you don't need your phone!!!

[@me987651234]

So as you go up the lip of a jump the shock is going to think it's going uphill and lock itself. This could go very badly wrong!

[@RIDINDIRTYMA]

I remeber when we were a small quirky group with only a few choices of bike. Getting out in the mountains and woods away from technology and all that was a big draw..JUST STOP!!!!!!

[@snipersulawesi9920]

❤❤

[@jerridstory2531]

Not that I’d ever buy it but I want to see what it does for a big squishy big that normally pedals like dogshit. Get all the traction of low anti-squat but great efficiency on smooth rolling stuff

[@cortarelva]

Great more useless stuff to make mountain biking more expensive to afford for regular people. And they wonder why MTB is wanning in popularity.

[@gdosiu]

NEOs DHX will probably break like DHX2 on the old Stumpjumper.... 🙄😂

[@fabianhelle6001]

Most coils will snap on an yoke like the old stumpjumper

[@BlueLineRider]

Teasing you all to spend is all it does lol gotta move product

[@arjenvangeffen2509]

I'll buy this and never charge the battery

[@didato6926]

Anyone who says “Orders of magnitude” is immediately and unprecedentedly dismissed.

[@cristilitra1251]

Can we please just get a dampers that have different tunes for each riding style and weight??? Or customizable one, easy to tinker by a nobody. Please and thank you!

[@battistaverardi1240]

Oh hahaha LMFAO! I absolutely love FOX, all my suspension is fox coil front and rear but this is just absolutely ridiculous! Nothing but another GIMMICK! This won’t last! All of the brands!

[@jokermtb]

Soooo......50 hour service and 200 hour service? What are we in for?

[@kleinkurti]

Still completely nonsense in my opinion. But its nice that they come up with something new. At this state i got the feeling that non electronic suspension is still less headache

[@AfroBob420]

can i make me wireless so i dont have to go out in the dirt and control my bike cozy out of my bed ? like VR with Motion

[@hein_mcleod]

I would love a shock like this but the prices are just insane. There will be people who can afford it but geez, all this kit is becoming unobtainium for the average shredded...

[@jacolovesbeer]

For pro racers and if I win the lottery, I won't tell you but you will see things appearing on my bike.

[@yyams]

Crazy cool, clever as fuck, but i'm out when a bike has electric shifting... less is more. Unless it's an ebike, I don't want a single battery on my bike.

[@asifitmatters1]

I would much rather they make a shock that doesn’t need to be serviced every five minutes…

[@TrailRider604]

I can't imagine why anyone would want something so unpredictable. The bike should adapt to how you ride, not the other way around 🤷‍♂

[@adamcoppock5018]

Is it to much to ask for a digital lock out system that the rider can controls.

[@fatbikedad384]

It’s for the guy who rides a bike with XTR drivetrain and carries it with a Lucid Air…

[@ignaciosevil2157]

why that battery is white?

[@doughboi007]

$1500 for rear suspension only is just ridiculous. Only 1% of mtb riders will ever actually need this.

[@KlintonSilvey]

The best thing about this is you don't have to have it for your fork!