Pivot Phoenix DH Bike with a Singlecrown and AXS Dropper for Enduro? Let's Go Racing - Episode 3

Why would you want to make a Pivot Phoenix downhill mountain bike ready for enduro racing? Brian Cahal goes through the details of his bike setup, converting a DH bike into a race-ready enduro rig with a singlecrown fork, dropper seat post and 12-speed drivetrain. He has to run a SRAM AXS dropper seatpost because the Phoenix doesn't have cable routing for a dropper and his RockShox Zeb fork is 180mm travel because axle-to-crown of the 190 was too tall. Plenty more bike tech where that came from!
#MTB #enduro #mountainbiking
Watch More Episodes of Let's Go Racing
Episode 1 - • Paying a Friend to Sit...
Episode 2 - • Paying a Friend to Sit...

[@Lou-f]

Very cool. Why the zeb over the boxer, just weight?

[@DaBigBomb123]

A few things, weight is one of them but also I really like the performance and feel of the zeb, I feel like it has a little better small bump then the boxxer and is better suited for trail use. Also I had the 51mm offset boxxer and I liked the feel of the shorter offset on the zeb. It didn’t happen often but on tight switchbacks I would max out the steering on the boxxer every once and a while.

[@Lou-f]

@@DaBigBomb123 makes sense, boxer is more for successive big hits.👌🏻

[@sroyk778]

eduro set-up

[@Vanadium]

Just get the new Formula :P

[@xx-----------xx873]

@Carl Wozniak Nope, it's a DH bike which has had enduro stuff put on it. A Boxxer would be at home here, and it would be what I'd put on.

[@Thematty635]

Man the way he breaks down how the geo actually suits him is top notch. Lots of good explanations of why not just a hey this is how it is because I like the look

[@FLY1NF1SH]

Well that's one way to actually get your hands on an Enduro frame in a reasonable amount of time in 2021

[@fpeter01]

Or in 2022, because bike supplement didn't get better. But soon there might be more frames available, because manufacturers don't have shifters.

[@BMagPH]

Vital went back to 2009 for that intro song

[@BurnsRubber]

ATTN Ed Masters. This setup makes a whole lot of sense for racing EWS and World Cup. Same bike.

[@rickkoehler3796]

Everyone knows you never go full Enduro.

[@Lou-f]

The “enduro” went full DH with that link design ;)

[@dougiefresh9676]

im an old school downhiller, and this mans ideas excite me

[@nickray1694]

Cannot get over how much I love that intro

[@eg4760]

We finally went full circle ! I used to pedal my Stinky DL 2004 and a friend a Radical with hammershmit up to ride down, it's time to go back this route.

[@topspot4834]

Completely agree about your arms not having to be fully extended when getting over the rear. Opted for the Mach 6 and geo was a big reason why. Really like their lineup right now.

[@funkytomtom]

Really interesting geometry points. Makes me want to do this as opposed to riding these insanely long reach modern bikes.

[@madstoppie]

I was thinking the same about his views on geometry and me, coming from the BMX/Freestyle world, I can understand exactly what he means. I just bought a 2022 Santa cruz Bronson Large after test riding the Large and Medium...M felt small for me, I'm just under 6ft tall. SC did something interesting with the reach and TT length so I hope to feel what Brian is describing on this fine video!

[@jtsblocks]

I don’t know, if I wanted a smaller reach on a size large enduro bike the most logical thing would be a size medium enduro bike

[@topspot4834]

@@madstoppie you get it already? Which build did you get? I was on the fence between that and the Mach 6 ... Opted for the Pivot cause the size/model Bronson wasn't in til 2022.

[@madstoppie]

@@topspot4834 It's on layaway right now. I called my LBS when I saw the release video and they said they were getting 6 in two weeks time. I didn't know MTBs came out so early so I wasn't ready to drop the cash so soon...anyway, they took my info and two weeks later I was at the store testing them, but they only got a Large in Pay Dirt Gold and a Medium in Moss Green, both S builds so not much choice there. Before doing all this, I called Santa Cruz and they told me the first batch of Bronsons was sold, that I should grab what my LBS was had available. My LBS said Santa Cruz isn't taking any more orders....it's crazy out there man!

[@topspot4834]

@@madstoppie yeah i had originally looked at the Nomad and wanted the x01 ox blood but I didn't get in on the first batch so the wait was indefinite. This was December 2020 ... I put a deposit down on the 6 but wasn't obligated to take delivery, and when it finally arrived SC just announced the Bronson. My LBS only had a large (pictures don't do it justice, as you know the pay dirt is absolutely stunning in person). Between a Bronson, Nomad and Mach 6 it's impossible to get a bad bike (other option was Revel Rail) but if SC didn't have such long, and more importantly, indefinite wait times, I'd probably had gotten that Nomad (especially if I saw the ox blood in person). The fires really hit them hard and was a big reason why they couldn't get bikes out ... BTW new Reserves (without the Santa Cruz branding) coming around Christmas per a SC rep who responded to my DM).

[@PabloMollAN]

Thanks for the guides tip. Awesome build.

[@Whitehawkvisionfilms]

I learned SOOOOOOOO much from this video!!! Wow, can't thank you enough! I have been looking at Specialized Enduros in size S4, i.e. a Large and the size S5, i.e. a XL and thought I wanted the XL and after watching this video I realize I will be too stretched out on the XL on the steep roughs and stuck straight armed and "just a passenger hanging on for dear life." Learned alot about bike setup and how to better BALANCE my setup choices too! Great stuff!

[@juliuskliem2312]

Very interesting and cool concept. Good luck with that setup

[@JJ_MTB_15]

He is spot on in regards to the long reach on trail bikes. The stack and reach on my DH bike (V10) is so much better than on my trail bikes which are all new modern bikes.

[@RunRideHikeThrive]

Sweet, great details on the explanation of your rig 👍 right on! 🤙

[@josephmascolino2419]

The intro was fucking amazing

[@bertusbob]

Thank you, this helped me a lot..

[@joyofthelord2]

I totally agree about sacrificing more travel for more comfort I’ve got a rocky mountain slayer and it climbs fine and I feel like I can still sprint on it well and absolutely eats rough and hugs to flat which is just all I want out of my bike especially on the steep fast loose and rough

[@austinado16]

I picked up an '08 Rocky Mountain Flatline 1 on May 22nd, and did this too it. AB30T Oval up front, 11-48T on the rear. 3 position Gravity Dropper, and it felt a little cramped so I added a longer stem, and a pair of climbing bars for the steep techy trails I train on. It's a 44lb brick, but it is an absolute blast to ride, both up and down. Climbs great, even w/o a lock-out. I have about 170mi on now, all on a 10mi route, up and down the local 1,200' peak.

[@lynnbattista787]

Best person on explaining mtb geo and reasons why… I saw your videos from the future on your forbidden dreadnaught… great videos on bike geo and overall bike riding techniques.

[@freezer4230]

Thanks for the great idea bro! Just built up a TR11 for N*, but didn't want to wait 6 months to ride it, so I threw a 12 speed drivetrain and AXS dropper on it. Now I can access nice singletrack runs in Norcal with a worthy bike in the offseason. See you on Livewire next season. :-)

[@calypso2niner]

Great thinking, thank you!

[@theparkrat2260]

I did this a while ago but in a more budget version!. It totally works.

[@danielstuckenberg469]

Awesome bike man 🍻 After racing Downhill for years DH bikes are what I'm comfortable with as well and Definitely received some flack turning my DH Kona Operator into my all around Enduro rig.

[@DavidMontreal]

2 year of racing later on this bike and it is still the best bike I have ever been on in my life.

[@kondawg7424]

the best bike ad i have ever seen

[@eddieknight8392]

been doin this for years.....I run a 180 fork on my dh.....heavyer spring in the rear...dropper..11 speed .......good to go....

[@ChunkyCheeseBurglar]

Yasssssssss. This is rad.

[@ElBikeShop]

Sick rig ! I am runnin a Large 2021 Norco Shore Park Edition, to which i fitted a 210mm dropper post and an 11-50t cassette. Still running stock suspension as im happy with it ! Dh bikes are sooo perfect..I dont mind pedaling a lil harder 😂

[@fouglasdir]

Your explanation about reach and geometry in general makes total sense. I think reach has gotten a bit too long on a lot of bikes. Sick bike, man!

[@danaminyip]

Nice trails U got there Brian

[@tristansmeda8054]

So for those out there that actually read he comments, the AXS dropper is not the only dropper that you can put on a downhill bike. I came from riding department store xc bikes with no internal cable routing and I recently bought a downhill bike that I have been thinking about turning into a downduro bike (this is because I don't have any lift parks near me and most of the trails near me are more xc type trails), and I found that you also get dropper posts that have external cable routing where the cable will stick out at the collar of the dropper or up at the seat, and then you can route the cable any way you want on the outside of the frame, suck as zip tying it on your top tube and routing it to the bar. The downside of the external dropper post is that it often looks bad with the cable on the outside of the fame, however the massive benefit is that they are often cheaper.

[@ErichVonCartmann]

Nice Video! I am planning to put on a 10-50t X01 AXS on my DH bike.

[@wescornett6908]

Hearing that song made me instantly happy hahah

[@niccolodefendi-cho5623]

So sick

[@mtbalpinecounty]

I learned early on that if you want that Slacker feel.. Bike your size. Seat back on rails.. Up your fork to 1 to 2 if what's your rr. If your limited, biggest tire up front and best and biggest in rear.. Game changer for fact. Simple on trail dynamics to achieve a longer, slacker and more playful bike on the return. And if your a guy who loves to climb, like me.. Than it all makes sense. Stem, bars, angles, seatback( get off the seat climbing). Weight distribution is key for an offset bike. Payoff..the Gratis Descent. Been in the dirt saddle since 1981. But it goes still farther back..like 1965. I learned to pedal.. And a bike mechanic, trail builder and am old hand at bike retail and service.. The circle is complete! #KeepPedaling !

[@ArcticPride1]

This is the best bike check I've ever watched. Have you ridden it at the Ranch or the usual Downieville lap? Feel like it would be a great setup for the area.

[@serjturischev9557]

50T ring on the rear, looks like some kind of madness for this bike.

[@1brenmaster]

It's possibly TV driven but judging by the way the ews format is changing I think we'll be seeing a lot more bikes like this next year on the circuit

[@OxxidCZ]

no we wont. The fastest bike on the circuit is 180 / 150 bike with very conservative geo.

[@karltaht2370]

I wonder this, but Yeti and Ibis on the podium with just 150, 148 rear travel respectively.

[@ericto4004]

Love it ...

[@jos8467]

On 🔥!

[@sroyk778]

that intro 🕶️

[@Climberson]

Just get the Transition Spire and be done with it :). I really like what you're doing, interesting take on Duro race bike. Keep it up!

[@gunshipanropace2gunshipand119]

Makes me wanna consider buying a phoenix

[@DDirtyDDog]

What a intro!

[@BezekCo]

Sickkk bike

[@icko16v]

Don't know about how this bike rides, but it sure looks sick!

[@montyjcm]

Sick build. I bet we start seeing this more often. Especially with the lighter weight, shorter travel dual crown forks as well. Interesting analysis on the geo preferences as well! Do you have an all-up weight of this thing? I am guessing 37-38lbs

[@stratten455]

I’ve always wondered why guys Don’t choose like a 180-190mm dual crown

[@samorban9745]

First of all many thanks for this great video, very interesting and well explained👌 2 questions: What framesize is it and what‘s the offset of the fork? Thx 🤙

[@titus1800]

This is the future of enduro bikes😂

[@thova1000]

well, i have been trying to get my trailbike be more of a dh bike....i like this

[@leventetanacs241]

That music in the beginning :DDD

[@tobiasstamenkovic9628]

This pretty much confirms what ive been expecting for a while now. The "inadequate" drivetrain is whats holding modern, well engineered DH bikes back, as an allrounder. Its really a shame no company is actually offering a kit similar to what youve built. Good job and enjoy your awesome ride. ;) (I would want a climb switch tho...)

[@Will762]

I think the closest you can get to this style of bike off the shelf is a Geometron G1 with dual crown. Paul Aston also did a long write up on this concept on Vital

[@borthwey]

Doing that is easy as pie, and you're replacing wear components, so it's not particularly expensive either. You can even pick a used bike and do it, put a new drivetrain on it. Nothing is holding anything back, you can do whatever you want. There are also more hardcore enduro bikes you can stick a double crown on.

[@AlejandroGarciaIglesias]

That's pretty much what the Transition Spire seems to be, and it can even take dual-crown forks too.

[@simonmiles9549]

I was just wondering as he mentioned going to 12speed what GX crank did he have with 83mm bottom bracket cuz I'm looking to do the same with a saracen myst thanks great video

[@robwarden6973]

This Phoenix is kinda close to my transition spire with the cascade link. Reach is much longer and the seat tube is steeper but wheel base stack and headangle are close.

[@ridesafealways4929]

Did this on my GT Fury Pro 2018. It's a mullet though so I have to go down to 170 fork travel to achieve same axle to crown.

[@alejoYVR]

Something tells me this thought process was very similar to what the Norco engineers had when designing the new range.

[@AlejandroGarciaIglesias]

And the Transition Spire

[@Rasakson]

no way they used this song XDDDDD

[@ereotav]

i had to skip it haha

[@isakrenlund2257]

Best intro ever

[@Vanadium]

you mean worst music eh?

[@Banannalands]

“Arm travel” is the new next measurement for future bikes lol

[@gpa1978]

now that you ride the firebird 2022...what are your thoughts about the two bikes

[@Puddinghead]

What was the weight of the bike?

[@ShaftShackDotCom]

Wonder how this set up compares to a Firebird 29 with a dual crown for both DH and Enduro?

[@Dorkbike]

Longer wheelbase, instead of longer reach makes sense. Leverage from a longer rear to BB putting more traction upfront seams to also make sense.

[@Human-NPC]

loved the vid :) algo

[@bassslayr6000]

I have a 2014 s-works demo 8 that im making into a enduro/trail bike the 2023 speclized enduro geo is about the same a few things being different but i feel like itll be a fun bike.

[@RCKING1]

I own a geometron with 175/180 with a dc fork and I peddle it everyday. it makes sense. I would have kept the dc though

[@ridesafealways4929]

would a 12 speed gx drive train suit a giant faith 0 mullet (26/27.5) if it is your one and only bike? fork is a rockshox totem rc2dh coil. saint with 11-36 sprocket will do to, but i want a sram counterpart.

[@giovanni19ify]

Imma do this with my trek session 99

[@giovanni19ify]

Nothing but facts

[@dmweyland]

how does it do in a very padaley stage?

[@SHREDD-ED]

I want to make my YT Tues pedalable. How did you work out the rear hub measurements? 150mm. but, different free hub? different spacers/topcaps on a 148mm?

[@Will99x]

It's probably super boost (157mm) which Pivot use on a lot of their bikes

[@Vanadium]

Sounds like my Propain Spindrift, made 2016 . 440 CS , 440 reach and 445 saddle ( they missed one opportunity here :P ) Modified with 5mm more stroke on that 230x60mm shock made get the bike up to 195mm rear travel. Pro10 rear, VPP like. Headangle with 29er wheel on 180mm fork was 62,8°. That rear just eats up anything, was really impressed but pedal performance was shit. I tried those tires but MAXXIS kind of disappoints me. I did run the Assegai with exo + at the front also a week ago for two weeks but this tire man, it has no fucking damping in it. It feels like I lost some suspension performance to be honest compared to the Brute from Schwalbe. The Big Betty I am running now again(since NOV 2020) front and rear. I have almost 400g more at the front for that change but man it is worth it because no freaking complaints about durability or a single flat. But the most important thing for me was the damping addition and how I could run it with 8psi less for the same size for additional grip. If I tried the same PSI on the MAXXIS, even on easy turns the tire want to come off. Grip was mostly the same for the same PSI but the another advantage the Schwalbe always got over MAXXIS is cold weather performance and I don't know any manufacture who is bad like MAXXIS for freezing and below that. The king&queen is reserved for Onza in this case, make sense since they are Swiss, eh?

[@matthewyaron5827]

That was such a great breakdown of the what and why's, this might seem stupid but why don't they run 2 low pressure tubes in a tire, it's got to be easier then a foam insert and tube. Can't be that hard to engineer!

[@borthwey]

That's schwalbe's system with an inner high pressure tube in place of an insert.

[@viktorhecht33]

you mean RAD rider area distance. Look for Lee Likes Bikes 😉

[@benanderson4639]

How's the seat tube angle? That bike looks unbelievable. You got me thinking about doing this with my dh bike but idk how it'd work with a slacker seat tube angle.

[@DaBigBomb123]

Honestly not that bad, the longer chain stay also helps keep the front end on the ground even through the seat angle is a little slacker. Not exactly sure on the angle but it’s pretty manageable.

[@vomErsten]

I was looking at doing this with an Intense M29, which interestingly has a steeper seat tube angle and overall seemingly better geo for Enduro than their actual Enduro bike, the Carbine.

[@dialedhealth]

Flawless music choice #dialedfam

[@fastfibres629]

I run a 240mm droper on my firebird, Im guessing I couldnt run that on my phenix if i were to switch bikes for enduro racing

[@jgaronbars]

that song on the intro got me crackin’.. 😂

[@cfox109]

How's it with more travel in the rear than the front? Notice any negatives?

[@DaBigBomb123]

Not really, this bike doesn’t pop like a 140mm trail bike but that’s a trade off I’m willing to make and it doesn’t really come into play hardly at all when racing.

[@atlet_fr]

AXS dropper 150mm?

[@bradholmes4]

wow haven't danced to that song since 2008 y'all got me on some HS vibes! that way that booty movin i cant take no mo!

[@seeandsqueeze]

🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯

[@quiqueneutze3436]

Great review! Could you share your fork settings? Just bought a Commencal that comes with a ZEB and would like to know how many clicks from closed position you have on lsc and hsc

[@peetermauring8732]

I keep finding this video

[@owenissimo]

Have you heard of the canyon torque

[@sa-choul.k.t1844]

I think Santa Cruz v 10 it’s better in dh bike !!?

[@rigelsan9744]

Didn’t this set up make your bb too low?

[@vichtify]

Saying it's a freeride isn't obscene guys!

[@romainhj]

Agreed, since when is a 190mm travel bike not a freeride bike?

[@vitalmtb]

is freeriding allowed on a 29er? 😂😂😂

[@romainhj]

@@vitalmtb lol 😂

[@vichtify]

No special criteria to entering the freeride family! :D

[@DaBigBomb123]

@theinternet please let me know if I’m allowed to free ride on this bike

[@JOEmama-vk8fb]

I have a yt tues, should I make it an enduro rig or put my money into buying a proper enduro bike

[@AlexT.A.]

🤙🤙🤙

[@MTBEH]

How much travel did you go with in the rear?

[@bondomingo6837]

I also have a 2013 phoenix that I built with enduro/ trail components, made it mullet 26-27.5. It rides like a dream! Just need a dropper post and proper quad piston brakeset (currently saving for hope e4) The fork that im using is a 27.5 180mm rs yari I also added a crown race spacer adding about 10mm at the front which makes it slacker.

[@UnEmploymentDude]

Downduro?

[@vinongskie2715]

Hellow can i ask if you dont mind sir can i put 12speed drivetrain to dh bike w/ 9t to 52t cassette..and yari 180mm single crown..??

[@recsund]

"Tainted Love"

[@karl07777]

oh so that's where the rifle stays

[@rylansbeats456]

its funny when he says nothing can beat a dh bike but Jesse melamed won the crankworxs dh in kicking horse on a single crown last year.....

[@richardmorris8764]

How tall are you ?

[@DaBigBomb123]

Just over six foot