PLA VS ACETONE, ETHLYL ACETATE and METHYLENE CHLORIDE

[@RFC-3514]

3:06 - Note that methylene chloride can go through nitrile gloves (which is what you seem to be wearing). Use either butyl or neoprene gloves, or don't wear any gloves at all (it actually evaporates very quickly off your skin). Any gloves that are permeable to it will actually make it take longer to evaporate and increase the likelihood of skin burns / irritation.

[@Cloakfiend]

Its all good i dont use it at all anymore. Its too filthy.

[@iroll]

Even better, just never use methylene chloride indoors, because it's just not something you want to breathe. I used it a lot when I worked in a very well-equipped analytical chemistry lab. The only other place I've used it is as a VERY GOOD paint remover, and I do that outside and upwind. It's actually not the most dangerous solvent you can mess with, but there's really no reason to ever be breathing it.

[@RFC-3514]

@@iroll - Er, what does indoors vs. outdoors have to do with the material the gloves are made of? :-P

[@iroll]

@@RFC-3514 OK, how about instead of "even better" we go with "and also"

[@mainstay.]

I wish you had shown us the 'before' print with the original print lines first.

[@Cloakfiend]

Dont worry ill do a comprehensive acetone video soon!

[@andyspoo2]

Apparently Tetrahydrofuran (THF) or oxolane (which is used for cleaning pools) will dissolve PLA. You might want to consider experimenting with that.

[@Cloakfiend]

Id try some thf, but when the filament companies change thier pla formulas it ruins everything. Ultimaker filament used to smooth the best but after maufacturing issues the company making their filament changed the formula and it no longer smooths. Must have removed the pha? Colorfabb is my main choice now.

[@RonFloyd]

You punch the top with a medium flatblade screwdriver, then, with the flat side pointed up, pry the top out by leveraging against the top of the threads. It should pop out fairly easily. After that, the cap will be the seal. The seal is just for storage and transportation mishaps. Thanks for the video.

[@sublimationman]

That seal lid on acetone, place a flat screwdriver on top (corner down) and whack the back with a hammer, it will puncture it and go inside a little, then tilt the screwdriver down and it will pop out, dispose of it as it's no longer needed.

[@Cloakfiend]

Yep agreed!

[@FuhrChris]

I worked in Boeing's Paint shop. Both Acetone and MEK "VAPRORIZE' faster than the particles will travel over to the target. You were not missing what your were aiming the Air brush at you were only hitting it with a gas, not an air born partialized liquid.

[@mnlala]

FDM inventors should feel proud of watching how you use the technology

[@michaelbujaki2462]

I don't know if that's an insult or a compliment.

[@sergeantseven4240]

I use Methylene Chloride to fuse and smooth most of my prints, it works on PLA, PETG, and other materials really well. almost too well some times, I buy it in 1 gallon Jerry cans off of Ebay for relatively cheap, can't get it anywhere else. plus it is really strong stuff so it needs to be stored safely and used in a well ventilated area. I use a respirator too even when just pouring it. I use vapor smoothing most of the time, where I have a pool of it in the bottom of a can and the part hangs above it for a few minutes. it evaporates really fast so no need to heat it or anything.

[@Cloakfiend]

Sergeant Seven it evaporates REALLY fast. I bought some and after a few months without using it less than half the bottle remained! Poorly packaged. I still prefer acetone though. Will try vapour with methelyne.

[@sergeantseven4240]

Cloakfiend acetone doesn't do anything with most PLA or PETG. I know you said you are only using colorfab. But acetone won't do anything to most other filaments besides ABS.

[@abcd199725]

Dude can i ask you some questions.? Write me on [e-mail] please

[@sergeantseven4240]

@@abcd199725 Sorry I don't give out my email address. You can ask me here or on my youtube channel and I can reply back.

[@CambridgeSuper8]

dont use metylene chloride, very bad for the environment and the ozone layer and seriously gives cancer. Banned in many labs (i am a chemist) ! Dont use it for this application

[@jayd9203]

Can you do video on how to get the lid off? Thanks!

[@Cloakfiend]

Lol

[@danlane9917]

Thanks for the video, Will multiple applications of acetone get a result as good as methylene chloride?

[@Cloakfiend]

I still think a 30sec dip of acetone is just as good. Methalene chroride will destroy your prints over time. Acetone wont if you dont over do it.

[@TriptonStudios]

Does the Methel cloride affect the strength and hardness of the print ? I want the silk rainbow fillament color to be retained but with gloss and no layer lines ?

[@Cloakfiend]

The Meth chloride dries out the part a lot. Id personally go for acetone. I heard you can remove the whiteness with a heat gun apparently. Im going to try it again this weekend. Its time for another acetone and pla video. Methelyne chloride is seriously nasty try not to use it. Acetone produces just as good result imo. They both handle well. But acetone is safe imo been using it a lot for years. As long as you dont come into contact with it too often you should be fine. And if you usr transparent pla pha filament your part shouldn't split if printed well!

[@TriptonStudios]

Excellent if acetone works just as well; I heard the part stays soft and flexible after the process. Also I use many highly toxic Chemicals often so no stranger to the hazards of that! If I can use acetone though it’s better since it’s cheap And I already have a ton laying around!

[@Cloakfiend]

@@TriptonStudios dont apply it with an airbrush. With small objects you can dip them for like 30-45seconds. Then leave them for 20mins for the acetone to absorb. After the surface is dry, polish it up with an old toothbrush so that they become shiny. They may go white in which case you can apparently use a heat gun gently to remove it. Ill see how that goes tomorrow....

[@Cloakfiend]

@@TriptonStudios Btw, the parts only remain soft for about an hour or so then become harder and slightly more brittle.

[@bitsurfer0101]

I would use an ice pick to poke the top of the acetone can then pry off the seal.

[@statoilbensin2190]

I have used Ethyl acetate to clean airbrush, same with acetone it works great for lacquer and enamel paint. The chloride stuff sounds like its quite strong so I would not dare use it to clean my airbrush as it might damadge teflon seals.

[@Cloakfiend]

I use acetone and airbrush cleaner. Ethly acetate is a bit strong for me. Methylene chroride is filthy stuff stay well away.

[@blade5098]

Thanks for this, I had never heard of Methylene chloride but I will be giving this a go. I watched a video made by DIY perks last night on his method of treating abs with acetone that seems to be quite effective and easy. He creates a simple vapour chamber so you don't need to use as much solvent or sit there brushing dipping or spraying and produces a very even finish. As all these solvents produce vapour at room temperature I would assume the method is interchangeable with all three of these. The video is called "Simple way to make ultra-smooth 3D prints at home"

[@Shinobubu]

Acetone does not chemically react with PLA. Ethyl Acetate looks promising I wonder if it can make Clear PLA more clear ?!?

[@Cloakfiend]

I use pla/pha from colorfabb and it works great. Dont use pure pla filament as it obviously wont work.

[@Cloakfiend]

Ethyl acetate is way to destructive btw.

[@Shinobubu]

@@Cloakfiend anything that dissolves is destructive! it's like poison/medicine. It's a matter of dosage. Clear PLA is purest PLA so yeah Acetone won't work.

[@gustavotobon7042]

Hello, Love the video, can you tell me how to prevent resin from sticking to pla printed molds. Thank you

[@Cloakfiend]

I wouldn't use pla to make a mould. I'd use a normal silicon mold for that. I dont make many molds but used to make a lot. Then you spray in mold release and pour in the resin. It comes out easy. Not sure if mold release works with pla but I would defo not use pla for molds!

[@Flagazz]

That's cool @Cloakfield ! I printed a sea horse at 70 microns with old blue ultimaker filament, one half with 0.8 wall (forgot to change) and the other with 1.2mm. I will try with Acetone 100%... maybe it's a crazy torture test cause the tail is too thin and tends to warp, right? I will post the pics in UM forum...

[@Thejjgamer6]

thanks for this video very useful G

[@Cloakfiend]

Your welcome!

[@Cloakfiend]

Id reccommend acetone btw.

[@Thejjgamer6]

@@Cloakfiend thanks I’m going to pick some up tomorrow

[@Cloakfiend]

@@Thejjgamer6 remember it needs to be a pla/pha filament otherwise pure pla does not smooth. I recommend colourfabb pla/pha, the transparent red is my fave.

[@Brewermb]

Have all the chemicals removed the orange colour?

[@captain6198]

What happens if i mix them all in a single bottle and use that mixture?

[@Cloakfiend]

Lol go for it but merhylene chloride is too harsh over time. Acetone is less aggressive and so is ethyl acetate. They dry out too much and cause splits. Ill make a vid showing what they looks like years later.

[@captain6198]

@@Cloakfiend harsh on what, for the bottle it kept inside?

[@Cloakfiend]

@@captain6198 for pla/pha filament. Which is pretty much all i use. Ive had models completely deteriorate overtime. As for methylene chloride good luck storing that. That stuff evaporates through plastic, unless my lid wasnt any good, but it wasnt leaking and stull evaporated. Maybe glass vials? Not sure, but the container I bought it in was almost empty in 3 months without me touching it from being full.

[@captain6198]

@@Cloakfiend I extracted my dcm into a glass jar and using with a brush, a mask with organic vapor cartridge is a must though. The ethyl acetate ill dispose as its ineffective even when dipped into it. Methylene is the right answer but must be carefully used in a well ventilated area with a mask. Dipping into like 10 15 seconds is enough.

[@stanislawkaminski4571]

How about gluing PLA parts with ethyl acetate? Will it work?

[@Cloakfiend]

Should work but as its so much more destructive id just stick to acetone.

[@soniabrown7151]

Is acetone more powerful??

[@Cloakfiend]

Acetone produces the best results longterm. The others crack over time as ive realised, they are far more destructive.

[@s_y_305]

@@Cloakfiend by overtime, how long do you mean?

[@Cloakfiend]

@@s_y_305 like a few weeks or months. When they dry out basically acetone is best in my opinion. The other chems are too harsh. They just dont last long at all. But maybe as i print hollow.

[@s_y_305]

@@Cloakfiend really helpful, thanks man. Also another question do you know if I can apply acetone using a brush on pla? Or do I need to do the acetone chamber?

[@Cloakfiend]

@@s_y_305 a 35 sec dip is the best in my opinion but brush it on generously if you have no container big enough. Check out my trex vid or the one that called best acetone smoothing or something i dip in those vids.

[@BreydonsRC]

Not sure why you would spray these solvents on instead of just brushing it on. Does your mask have chemical filters in it? It looks like just a dust mask. The best thing I have found for smoothing PLA is UV resin. Just brush it on and hit with a UV flashlight for a few seconds. It sands easily then.

[@Cloakfiend]

Acetone is easiest snd quickest in my experience. But you need to use a pla blend for it to work.

[@BreydonsRC]

@@Cloakfiend Acetone doesn't do anything to some PLA's. In fact, none that I have tried it on. Which PLA's are you using?

[@Cloakfiend]

@@BreydonsRC i use colorfabb pla/pha. My faves are the transparent ones. But they all smooth as they are blends of pla.

[@BreydonsRC]

@@Cloakfiend ok, that make sense then. The clear PLA's and ones that are a bit tanslucent are a lot different than the opaque. I haven't tried acetone on any translucent PLA's. I typically don't use them. But I do have one brand that is like that. It seems more like PET than PLA.

[@Cloakfiend]

@@BreydonsRC the opaque ones work well also though. Ive used pretty much all colours.

[@purplehayes5718]

Have you tried Methyl Ethyl Ketone, also known as MEK? The real stuff, not the new fake stuff.

[@NoLimitDesignsLtd]

Your videos are great.

[@Cloakfiend]

Thanks!

[@greghight954]

Has anyone tried varying concentrations of acetone mixed with alcohol?

[@Cloakfiend]

No. Ive not tried alcohol either but id assume it would need to be pretty pure to melt plastic?

[@greghight954]

@@Cloakfiend - I meant that you could basically use the alcohol to dilute the acetone. I'll mix some up and try it and let you know.

[@Cloakfiend]

@@greghight954Has to be 100% or close in my opinion. Anything less is a waste of time. But thats just my opinion, but go and experiment by all means!

[@greghight954]

@@Cloakfiend Pure acetone will mess up PLA pretty easily. I'm thinking to dilute it with alcohol which is rather inert to PLA. I will experiment and let you know.

[@michaelbujaki2462]

@@greghight954 How did it go?

[@orbleh3622]

methylene chloride is hard to store.

[@Cloakfiend]

orble h yeah i found that out as well. It evaporates extremely quickly.

[@joeynuggetz]

Cool model. What is it?

[@Cloakfiend]

Joe Bruno its the evil queen from snow white without her crown. I have a crowned version as well.

[@iam_a_dog]

methylene chloride = paint stripper...

[@Cloakfiend]

Methylene chloride is dirty stuff I don't use it at all anymore, filthy nasty stuff.

[@stabassam]

@@Cloakfiend Why?

[@Cloakfiend]

@@stabassam its seriously toxic

[@michaelbujaki2462]

@@Cloakfiend In that case I'm glad I came to the comments section. I was going to look up the SDS to find out what protections I need to use it, but I think I'll just use the pencil torch smoothing instead.

[@ele_112]

" dripping is far more waistful", really really, no one is asking to use a hole bottle for a single model, how much chemical are you using for dipping?

[@Cloakfiend]

For dipping you need to sacrifice a container and just keep reusing it until it evaporates. Most dramatic results mind you. Prone to cracking if overdone. Economical. Can be used to brush on as well.

[@bitTorrenter]

Methylene Chlorine is some toxic shit. Be very careful and use plenty of ventilation.

[@Cloakfiend]

Its all gone now and i dont touch the stuff anymore its too destructive long term. Ive reverted back to acetone only. Works best and most reliable/predicable results. Just dont get any inside the model. Methylene Chloride is dirty as hell. And evaporates Faaaaast, even when bottled. You need a glass air tight container to store it indefinitely.

[@supersixx1]

breaking bad

[@masseykev]

"Calculate yourself"

[@Cloakfiend]

This video is old but acetone wins as the others degrade over time badly. No calculations needed. Just thought id see the differences but atomizing kinda alters the results.

[@KaiserFailed]

D minus on preparation, F on scientific control (using an airbrush on some, and a brush on the others? this disqualifies this whole experiment.) A+ for atleast trying?? lol

[@Cloakfiend]

KaiserFailed i used the same method on all. All airbrushed and all brushed on after. So it is a fair test. Not sure why you think i did some one way and not the others. Look closer its time lapse same method for all.

[@cryptofaschist6522]

This is a mess

[@Cloakfiend]

My presentation needs works i agree. But i applied all chemicals uniformly. So the results are honest. Trouble is the chems atomized before reaching the target so airbrushing may not be the best way to apply. A regular spray bottle is better. Not so much atomization.

[@Andrew_Marzban]

You talk just like Ali G

[@Cloakfiend]

Andrew Marzban Yeah, lol I get that a lot but I talked like him before he was about! Its more like he talks like me!

[@durhamregionseedbank2710]

Really poor video.

[@Cloakfiend]

Lol. Why? I spray three things on a model and observe thr results. Acetone wins. The others are too agressive and totally destroy the pla over time. Facts. Now you know!