Humanity’s role in nature. Are we more than just a problem? A conversation with Rupert Sheldrake

Environmental degradation caused by technological progress is in the news almost everyday. So can any sense be made of an ancient intuition that human beings are not just part of nature but have a distinctive and positive role to play in nature?
In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss issues from the significance of consciousness to cosmic emergence in order to explore a vision of humanity in nature that goes well beyond our life being the meaningless byproduct of random processes.
Humanity contributes to the diversification and beautification of the natural world, even as monocrops undermine that enrichment, too. Alternatively, religious traditions add a layer of meaning to natural processes that science alone can’t provide, from expressing divine creativity to returning that blessing in the praising of God. Panpsychism, strong emergence and Charles Darwin’s appreciation of the excessiveness of nature are other themes in the conversation, making a case for humanity’s place as participant in the remarkable abundance that surrounds us.
For more conversations between Rupert and Mark see www.sheldrake.org/audios/shel...
and www.markvernon.com/talks

[@Borsfrancis]

So enjoy these dialogues. Thank you both

[@cynthiaford6976]

" 'The feeling remains," wrote Teresa of Avila, "that God is on the journey too." ' "John Keats once wrote that no tenet of philosophy is ever really accepted in us until it is proved on our pulses." Christian Wiman, Zero At the Bone: Fifty Entries Against Despair

[@lenitavanhoff2961]

My understanding of T. de Chardin and noosphere, was that everything came into being, or potentiality, at the same time. That would include consciousness, or its potential. God to some.

[@xoxox1011]

in some previous talks there was a word about this life being a "preparation" for the next life. In this dialogue, it seems that you are both ignoring that there is a "next life". Whether top-down or bottom-up approach of interconnected consciousness, the listener gets the impression that the approach is very materialistic, omitting all the troubles and suffering that the ruling demons cause to human souls. Actually completely ignoring the demons as rulers, like everything is kumbaya, and thet capitalistic demonic Mammon is not enslaving human consciousness.... Well, the most important humanity's role (in "nature" and everywhere else) is to point out that there is some "next life" (or some "life" outside/beyond this "world"), that the demonic archons rule this disgusting Demiurge's simulation, and that Mammon (and its global system of "values", forced upon the "world" through its "history") is our everyday reality. An absolute extreme metaphysical injustice (that shouldn't be ignored) is shaping the "world" and its "nature", as well as the "nature of this world"! The very purpose of "evolving consciousness" is turned upside-down and becoming void... it seems that true goodness and sincere compassion is practically impossible to learn here, but only evil/malice, anger, fear, vanity, wickedness. It never really was intended to be taught, since it was purposefully designed the opposite - to mock any good intention. thank you.

[@geoffreynhill2833]

Nature better off without us? Chickens might be better off without foxes but here they all remain! 🤔(Green Fire UK)

[@susanmcdonald9088]

Its my understanding of the ancient greek word, "Logos" from which our word Logic originates, was tied to two other concepts, a kind of trinity, Logos, Ethos (ethics, morals, values) and Pathos (emotions) of which they also had much to say in their tragic theatre dramas, as they went about inventing democracy, politics, olympics, trial by jury, free speech which came out of comic dramas criticizing & laughing at their leading politicians, freely. But I think the current creation story of science is lacking in what the ancients & prehistoric peoples were TRYING to tell us! And we have totally misunderstood them! And science seems to care less what they were saying! All bunk & superstitious primitives! The evidence is overwhelming! What we humans have developed, myth, religion, rituals, art, paintings, petroglyphs, statuary, monumental constructions, all now being used as proofs and explained by our new god, aliens & ETs! Of course, it's human arrogance that drives it all! Look what putin & netnyahoo are doing! It's horrific! Ungodly! And the people's voices mean NOTHING! SO, human nature has not evolved one iota, not in millenia! Which brings me to people who find the ancient voices, credible. So do I. And their theory, huge explanatory power! And it's inspiring far beyond dry theories of big bangs and mucky ponds. It was a primeval source, a Cosmic message, events so startling that every culture on earth remembered and recorded, the beginning of all myths and religions; roles and behaviors, everything. Even the extreme building projects, HUGE in size, shouting "Hey! Here we are!" We made gods of them. Gods still with us in one form or another, with many of us turning atheist, hogwash & good riddance! But I bet atheists never built a damn thing to honor these mysterious forces, like time, or gravity, or reality, or the gods. Nevertheless, it has shaped and developed us from the beginning, this humongous set of events of both beauty & catastrophe. Will we figure out our basic problems in time? I doubt it! I seriously doubt it. We are too melded to our "stories". And we'll kill each other over them! While tyrants rule our minds, and take what they want. i.e., greed. History was one of the 9 Muses, yes the different poetry and hymns, but also mathematics and adtronomy. We disregard the Muse of History, Clio for short. But the goddess Nemesis, awaits her retribution & vengeance on those who do wrong, she waits. And I suspect, it will not be pretty. SYMBOLS OF AN ALIEN SKY on YT, by The Thunderbolts Project. Plasma science. Metaphors. Art. Its astounding. kzbin.info/www/bejne/qmiocp-KmL95rbssi=177GuOQNXb37hpLo A possible education for the world; "know yourself" as the delphic oracle commanded. i.e. know what kind of creature you are! And Socrates agreed. Its time to know our ancestors, too. And to remind scientists, you don't know everything. The Cosmos tells us so...