Bucks SMOKE the Thunder in NBA Cup Finals | The Panel

[@MarzTalksSports]

spilla was here for 2 seconds lmao wtf

[@anthonycelestin3559]

Pen really thought Shai was better than Giannis before this episode cause he thought Giannis was on a decline 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@Luciandl1]

I agree that Giannis is definitely better but 1 game doesn’t prove that

[@Jordan-hw7cq]

@@Luciandl1sorry to tell you but it’s not only one game

[@thatBRUDDA.]

@@Luciandl1 u haven’t watched giannis of you think people are only basing this off of one game

[@Luciandl1]

@@thatBRUDDA. this is literally a reaction to 1 game like what? 😂 if Shai had hooped yesterday and Okc won he wouldn’t be saying this and u talking bout “you haven’t watched Giannis” 😂

[@Luciandl1]

@@Jordan-hw7cq which is why Giannis is the better player. But look at all the takes about Shai coming out after 1 game

[@Youcankicktheball]

There's a clear separation between players like jokic, giannis and Luka (I would also put embiid but injuries are what they are) and players like shai and tatum who are great but definitely not on that level. You gotta be biased or blind to not see that.

[@MarzTalksSports]

i agree

[@strongbone9471]

There's a separation between jokic and giannis vs luka.

[@Youcankicktheball]

@strongbone9471 luka comes from a season averaging 34/9/10 on good efficiency, making the finals and 2 WCF in 3 years with two diffrent teams, leading the entire players in the playoffs in pts/reb/ast/stl, although he didn't win yet like joker and giannis you can argue his playoff legacy is already as good if not better, he's definitely in that tier.

[@anthonycelestin3559]

Embiid doesn’t deserve to be there regardless of injury. Embiid is the most overrated player of all time. He’s constantly in convos he’s not supposed to be in

[@Poppi_302]

@@anthonycelestin3559People like you make no sense. When healthy, he’s clearly the best scoring center in the league, maybe ever. And not to mention, he’s probably the best defensive player outside Gobert. He comes up short in the playoffs, but he’s literally always hurt. I dont understand how you can definitively say Giannis or Jokic is a tier above him when they’re all on the court.

[@pemp9606]

The gap defensively is WAY bigger than the gap offensively between Jokic and Giannis. But y’all will never give Giannis his due respect.

[@tusharbisht6832]

Gap in offence just comes down to pts rbs and assists While gap in defence usually boils down to athleticism blocks and steals so the defensive gap always appears larger But the gap on offence certainly makes up the gap in defence in this case although picking Giannis over Jokic is not a hot take

[@pemp9606]

@ absolutely not Giannis is an alltime offensive player who is the most dominant scorer since shaq, and is an alltime defender. The Offensive gap isn’t big enough to make Jokic the “Clear better player”

[@tusharbisht6832]

@@pemp9606 all time offensive player? Anything outside box score that supports this? Maybe the fact a wall has continued to stifle him due to a lack of counters or the fact his teams have continuely been bottom 5 in offence in the playoffs?

[@pemp9606]

@@tusharbisht6832 maybe cause his only good offensive players on his team have been Khris Middleton who is always injured/underperforming, and Jrue who shoots 35% from the field in the playoffs. He literally has to carry EVERYTHING. He has never had a Jamal Murray who can average 30 points in a finals. They don’t have any offensive elite creators until they got Dame. You saying this proves you down watch buddy.

[@XolileNompumelelo-ps9ti]

I can't wait for Penn and swipa to downgrade the tournament bcz giannis won 😅😂

[@ggrlyggrly4476]

Everybody crowned the cup last year but suddenly because run and dunk man won it, we supposed to praise him?

[@NostradamussSchalke]

Ox hate for Giannis is real but atp I respect it lmaoooo

[@BIGOXMedia]

I was showing Giannis big love today

[@officerricky3230]

Call me crazy but I think Lavine and Jokic would be a top 3 duo right away

[@ninoboom2453]

You’re crazy

[@aboogeytheboss5043]

That’s laughable

[@CoDPlayer45435345]

fax but casuals dont know

[@kingDrAgOnZoRdS]

Without a shadow of a doubt 😂

[@tayluc777]

🤣

[@Cersiba21]

The gap between giannis and shai is enormous

[@Matthew-xl5bc]

2:16:21 This part was a really good convo. Jerry West should have gotten on mention as well if people went by criteria. He would be the greatest pg ever by this standard. Also CP3 would do well in this criteria.

[@MarzTalksSports]

congratulations to the bucks. theyre better than they get credit for. OKC also arent as bad as people are trying to make it seem. shooting variance at the wrong time will do that though

[@mom3ntousjatt]

I understand the shooting variance thing but who do you think will win a final series between the bucks and okc (with or without chet)

[@MarzTalksSports]

@@mom3ntousjattId slightly favour okc with chet and overwhelmingly pick the bucks without chet

[@excal1414]

OKC are overrated offensively, Bucks played good defense made Shai shoot off-rhythm 3s and I’ll live with an open Alex Caruso or an open Lou Dort 3.

[@MarzTalksSports]

@ i dont think they 'made' shai shoot those threes.

[@mom3ntousjatt]

@excal1414 man the 3 ball is gonna be the death of nba

[@Implementingdynamics]

Mark Daigneault on playing shai more off the ball: “Jackson’s pressure, he’s denying him full.. we weren’t able to shake him as much as we’d like to..”

[@thatBRUDDA.]

Ox’s logic kills me sometimes 🤣

[@BIGOXMedia]

That’s ok. I might not be speaking to you, this message ain’t for everybody.

[@NostradamussSchalke]

@@BIGOXMediaokay you Basketball genius 😭

[@BIGOXMedia]

@ 🤷🏾‍♂️🤷🏾‍♂️🤷🏾‍♂️

[@Fab_rice95]

The 'Big Men alliance' is killing me. The idea that a PF or a C can only dominate if he strictly plays with his back facing the rim is whatever to me. I hate the fact that when the conversation about the 'most dominant big men' pops up, only Shaq & Wilt are being considered. Why? Kareem was dominant; Jokic is. The same way, Giannis dominates, not just like the 'traditional big men'.

[@justsayin669]

*@Fab_rice95* I think it's a silly title to even take serious and is just a conversation that takes away from what is ultimately relevant which is effectiveness alone. When they say "most dominant", it has been clarified many times that they just mean "physically dominant". So with that being the criteria for this silly title of "most dominant big", that removes Kareem and Jokic from contention because they weren't nearly as "physically dominant" (basically not as powerful and physically assertive) as Wilt and Shaq. However Giannis may belong in that silly conversation because he is very physically dominant. This is all I really care to discuss about it though, I was mainly clarifying for you what people mean by "most dominant big".

[@BIGOXMedia]

It is an honor to be misunderstood by all yall that learned the game from 2k. You think ball is played on calculators and charts so the biggest compliment you can pay me is disagreeing with me. I couldn’t be happier.

[@retrey63]

That offence vs defence conversation was so interesting but ofcourse Ron had to cut it😂 hope we revist that convo with Pen/swipaa there

[@20k200]

Ox is the GREATEST PANELISTS!💪🏾💪🏾

[@Creamcity414]

OX a clown 🤡

[@nykareem2001]

What's the logic for offense being more valuable than defense? I'd argue there is more of a surplus of offensive talent in basketball but abundance does not equate to more value. I'd argue that guys like Hakeem, Duncan and Wilt were far far far better on defense than they were on offense (none of them were elite offensive engines minus outlier series) and they are universal top 10 players. Never forget Marz doesn't know basketball

[@tayluc777]

The fact that people think Dirk outplaying KG in their playoff series is a slight to KG, just shows how underrated Dirk really is, him and Kareem have the most unstoppable shots ever, people act like Dirk was dunking on KG and blowing by him on offense. People who are optimistic on the Thunder being contenders don’t watch them every night, I think if we were to get Jimmy Butler I’d see the vision, having no forward above 6’6 who can play 30+ minutes a night is concerning to me, not to mention no one having playoff experience like that, SGA without the whistle looks average at best. Jokic isnt levels above Giannis at all, they’re actually about 5 all time spots from each other believe it or not.

[@Sacredix]

No way you a thunder fan

[@tayluc777]

@@SacredixI am, y’all too hype and don’t know basketball. I blame Marz

[@MarzTalksSports]

@@tayluc777u blame me for ww2 atp

[@tayluc777]

@MarzTalksSportslmfao

[@theheart9681]

Downplaying every aspect of this win, W content

[@hristorimpopov5814]

Offense is way more valuable than defense for an individual player. For those that disagree - tell me where do you put Ben Wallace all time? What about Rudy Gobert? Mark Eaton? They've all won multiple DPOYs, yet nobody in their right mind ranks them higher than offensive juggernauts that play mid/poor defense.

[@elmztana1201]

Lol how? Rudy and Ben will make the Hall of fame . But arenas won't

[@MarzTalksSports]

@@elmztana1201theres no way ur a real person

[@Bigloskitv]

@MarzTalksSports 😂😂😂

[@tusharbisht6832]

Please explain how stopping a team from scoring 5 points below their average is less valuable than scoring 5 points above average yourself? Just naming players isn’t really a good arguement as appose to showing some sort of explanation?

[@nykareem2001]

Marz is the Steve Job's of bad basketball takes

[@PrinceDJj]

I think y'all should do an episode about what peak versions of players like Kobe, Jordan, Hakeem, Duncan, etc., would be the best in the world. I also think y'all missed Marz's point when he said offense and defense are equal. I believe his point was that if offense/defense were 50/50, would the all-time top ten change, and yeah, I think it would.

[@tusharbisht6832]

Offence and defence are 50/50 theirs no analytics that show that stopping a team from scoring 5 points below average is worse than scoring 5 points above average yourself. The problem is more so an offensive player individually can have more direct impact on a teams overall offence than an individual defender can on an overall teams defence due to defence is more a reactionary situation while on offence you control the flow of the ball. This is also why people are baffled at the idea of draymond being a top 10 player in the league at any point in his career cause the pre-requisite mindset is well obviously (offence > defence) which isn’t true

[@PrinceDJj]

@tusharbisht6832 How people talk about offense and defense isn't equal because if it was then everyone top ten would be different to Marz point

[@tusharbisht6832]

@@PrinceDJj no it’s not equal because an elite defender is more reliant on the team for a good defence as it is a reactionary position to be in to where the ball goes. And the ball won’t always be where you are. On offence players can impact the offence more. But in a hypothetical world a defender could be better just on defence than let’s say magic or Steph are on offence. Offence and defence are 50/50 but defensive players have less impact on that end due to the reactionary nature of the role I hope this makes sense

[@PrinceDJj]

@tusharbisht6832 I got everything you are saying i was just referring to Marz original question

[@tusharbisht6832]

@@PrinceDJj cool beans also I’d take peak draymond over Kyrie as he helps a team widen the gap between their score and the opponents score more imo. But most would take Kyrie due to (offence > defence) mentality as appose to measuring impact 🫡

[@angryteajug7067]

could someone like tyus jones have done 80% of what john stockton was doing?

[@MarzTalksSports]

120% of what he did

[@TheSage1123]

Tj doing that Ricky Rubio rn doing that tyus jones doing 3 times as much as Stockton

[@BackinstyleGT]

guys okc ain’t making it out the west let’s be real 7 game series, these boys ain’t a threat.

[@howitzdone8992]

Smh

[@BackinstyleGT]

@ big game experience is really a thing i only had the bucks winning cuz giannis has been to the biggest stage and played all or nothing games

[@tayluc777]

DO AN EPISODE RANKING THE BEST DEFENDERS EVER, DO ANOTHER ONE OF YOUR OWN TOP 75!!!

[@Matthew-xl5bc]

While I still have OKC as the favorite to come out the West, there shooting has been really that good all year. I think defense with Chet back can lead them to finals but shooting issues are still there. Also games like yesterday show why Boston is by far the best team in the league

[@JamesHarris-st7le]

Top 20 right now Giannis Jokic Tatum Shai Luka KD Wemby Ad Booker Curry Edwards LeBron Kyrie Dame Ja Brown Fox Trey Bam Harden

[@drazzzpoppp5022]

When the game is on the line KG is nowhere to be found scoring wise.He vanishes.Jokers defence sux most of the game but last few minutes in close game he plays his ass off on both ends and is one of the clutchest players of all time.Thats the difference between the two

[@PrinceDJj]

😂😂😂 I guess I don't understand "Big O Chill" because I'm not a big man. So, when I watched Giannis put up 26, 19, 10, I'm thinking that's more than enough, and he did punish people when he was supposed to. But y'all say he needs to be more than a run-and-dunk man, and when he does that to evolve his game, it's still wrong. It's like Giannis can't win, even when he does win.

[@howitzdone8992]

U think Giannis played as good as he should have being defended by gaurds all game?

[@PrinceDJj]

@howitzdone8992 I think he did what he was supposed to do

[@howitzdone8992]

@@PrinceDJj just no way him playing a 4 gaurd lineup and not posting up every play, way too many time he had a 6’3 gaurd on his hip and didn’t go down to the block and punish them, u can say he played very good and also say he wasn’t as dominant as he should’ve been

[@PrinceDJj]

@howitzdone8992 He played the way he wanted to play 26 19 10 was enough and Giannis was dominant in that way

[@Matthew-xl5bc]

@@howitzdone8992Giannis has had great games against the Celtics and Cavs who are bigger teams than OKC. Y’all just following that nonsense Big OX was saying

[@betweendalinesnbapodcast3733]

Bucks just need another legit role player. I trust guys like aj, andre, taurean and GTJ to bring what they bring but they need a role player thats a difference maker. Like a Caris levert.

[@BillWithers-hu3zz]

Won’t matter. Celtics in 5.

[@INPERSPECTIVE7]

Saying 09-18 Lebron would be the best player in the world is crazy!! I think nostalgia makes us feel like someone was better than they were. Jokic is about to average a triple-double and literally wins games alone with no all star or superstar. He got a championship without a superstar, Bron has never done that. He needed a superstar for all of his rings. I think we have a weird way of remembering things and not appreciating the now. In 15 years we’ll be able to make a better judgement.

[@Senseicjj]

Nah the way you talk ball just sucks

[@justinjohnson861]

Sga hasn’t beat Giannis since 2018. Giannis owns okc, lucky for okc he’s not in the west & no one else can replicate the specific problems Giannis causes. Add a Cam Johnson to the okc roster which helps with shooting and size, and you’re solidified t2 itl. Also adding chet(2nd best player) helps a lot

[@tayluc777]

Cam just a shooter, he can’t hit tough creative shots when defense tightens up. I’d go all in for Jimmy and maybe try to snag Jaime.

[@Senseicjj]

I just have such a problem with the way ox,chill,Ron talk ball. Like they are missing something man. From the Joker Vs Kg convo then on it’s like what??

[@PrinceDJj]

So, for me, LeBron became the best player in the world in 2010, even though Kobe had just won the championship, because I say peak LeBron is Miami LeBron, and that's the best player I've ever seen. So, yes, peak LeBron would clearly be the best player in the world by a wide margin.

[@skeleton2189]

the bucks are a better 3 point shooting team and the okc has the best perimeter defense and still the looks that the bucks had was way better than okcs

[@Berto-c4k]

Shai looked pedestrian against giannis

[@Icarus_prime]

Eliza such an annoying anti-Jokic girl in the chat

[@ThePilot313]

Ok, when does one team say “ok the 3’s not falling…..LETS GET TO THE RACK AND TO THE LINE”?? Why is it ok we missing so let’s just keep missing and that fine smh

[@MarzTalksSports]

they did get to the rack. the end of the day they didnt take that many threes. just cos they missed a bunch people view it as chucking em. when in reality they shot less than they normally would

[@nykareem2001]

I'm taking Shai and Tatum over Giannis

[@pensarebasketball]

Free throws and spacing are the argument for those guys. But the force Giannis puts on the rim swings the balance a little bit. I don't agree with anyone saying Giannis is leaps and bounds better. But what he's doing this year warrants him having claim to #2 in the league talks tbh.

[@DrippingInStyle]

OKC has been playing the same way for the most part and it has been leading to wins and rightfully so. But now that we've seen the Bucks defense make it tough for SGA and the Thunder we pulling exuses out of thin air now? Bucks defense was on point. Bucks had 19 turnovers and OKC only got 11 points off those turnovers. Lets just give credit where credit is due. It's not that hard. Remember it was a 1 point game coming out of half.

[@howitzdone8992]

Credit okc for missing 20 open 3s

[@DrippingInStyle]

@@howitzdone8992 you watch cricket

[@Creamcity414]

Chill you’re off today

[@jearmineburdock2526]

To say based off 1 game it ain’t just 1 game it’s a body of work Giannis accomplished more than Shai, he got 2 League MVPs, a defensive player of the year award, a finals MVP, won the 2021 All star, so based on that Giannis is better than Shai no debate until shai gets a ring, a MVP then come talk to me. OKC #1 seed as of right now, u got media, some KZbin channels calling them the best defensive team, all Ik is shai for as good as he is, gotta get it done when it matters the most which is the playoffs, because last year ppl was on they knees for OKC, I don’t care bout Shai averaged 30 against Dallas they loss, same this year no matter who they play in the playoffs, don’t wonna hear he ain’t got help because he got Chet who’s hurt right now, u got Jalen Williams who averaging career highs almost 22 a game, as well as a good defender, got dort, Carson Wallace who ppl praise, Caruso who they traded, got Isaiah Hartenstein who some ppl out here was bragging bout they was 7-1, 8-1 with him in the lineup, who’s averaging 12 and 12 on the year so he got plenty of help shai the man for the team gotta get it done period!

[@brentbrigham7243]

OX are we talking about a higher power in basketball? They choked last night. Y’all can’t pull “just wasn’t falling” on a championship night.

[@BIGOXMedia]

“Just wasnt falling” is as real as anything in basketball.

[@esleyb7968]

Kg better than jokic or giannis lol, what are we even doing here

[@BIGOXMedia]

No not better than them, HE CLEARS THEM!!!!!

[@roronoaDzoro1111]

pc getting to the bag sponsors from factor and prizepicks okaaayyyyy

[@Berto-c4k]

Giannis and shai both mvp one is in nba one is in h league

[@aaby3964]

Shai is the only player tht can get an excuse like “he knos his teams gonna win more games then they lose so he’s experimenting with the 3.” Like cmon marz lmaoooo no other player has ever gotten that but now since Shai played like ass he’s “experimenting” Blaming missed shots on experimenting is just clear bias disguised as analytical basketball talk wether the shots were open or not.

[@howitzdone8992]

Shai is playing like ass this szn 😂😂😂 OK, Would be a First team all pro but he’s ass😂

[@aaby3964]

@@howitzdone8992bro shut up lmao I ain’t say tht at all

[@aaby3964]

@@howitzdone8992yes cuz that’s wat I said right? Lmao

[@howitzdone8992]

@@aaby3964 that’s wat marz was talking abt 😂 he’s been saying this all szn not just after last night

[@aaby3964]

@@howitzdone8992 be quiet bruh I ain’t say Shai was ass all season OBVIOUSLY. Why would I say he was ass all season USE UR BRAIN

[@Berto-c4k]

Blowout loss on nba cup finals!

[@bmillersince92]

lol okc had one bad game now yall questioning Shai as a elite player?? This dude said is Shai impactful when he isn’t scoring?? It’s only a few players that impact the game like that, Luka jokic and Gianni’s that’s it, that ain’t right to do to Shai

[@BillWithers-hu3zz]

Stop elevating Shai over Tatum, that’s the point. One is a prove champ, the other is a regular season stats merchant

[@tayluc777]

@@BillWithers-hu3zzfacts

[@WRLdPeAcE96]

@@BillWithers-hu3zzthat proven champ was the second best player in the finals shai is better than Tatum

[@BillWithers-hu3zz]

@@WRLdPeAcE96 yeah he was fantastic last night. Couldn’t shoot, and contributed nothing else to his team.

[@tayluc777]

@@WRLdPeAcE96according to what metric?

[@Cersiba21]

Penn is so insufferable with his shitty takes

[@Senseicjj]

💀💀

[@aidenreyes9261]

Kg is starting to get overrated in my opinion

[@howitzdone8992]

U don’t know ball

[@aidenreyes9261]

@ why cause I think he’s getting overrated 😭😭 ox said he’s clearly over Gianni’s

[@howitzdone8992]

@@aidenreyes9261 that’s why u don’t know ball KG still being put in dirk talks He’s way closer to Underrated than overrated, KG>Giannis Anyway

[@BIGOXMedia]

KG is very underrated

[@Fab_rice95]

Luka, Tatum and Giannis are the most disrespected current players on PC. Bar a nba chip, you could argue Luka has had a similar or even better playoff career than both Giannis or Joker. The guy has been a top 5 performer and player from his 2nd season. Shai is maybe having a better season now than him, but pls Luka is at worst a top 3 player in the nba. Tatum 2-way impact gets disrespected on a regular. On any given night he might be celtics best defensive and offensiv player. Giannis gets less love lately maybe because he hasnt gone further in the playoffs since his ring and we tend to forget who the fuck he is.