Labour manifesto analysis, and Reform overtake the Tories in the polls | Podcast #67

Dudes rock and I'm tired of pretending they don't.
Today we're breaking down Keir Starmer's Labour manifesto after it was launched on Thursday.
Subscribe to our new podcast now, or you're a silly goose:
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[@sluglife9785]

"If an MP's allowed to have sex with you, you should be able to vote." That's not only funny, but a solid argument.

[@FrengleMcFrengle]

Personally I don't think 12 year old should get the vote

[@stanogden8864]

If that had actually been applied during Ted Heath's tenure then primary schoolers would have been able to vote.

[@OxidusMagicus]

Just don't apply the same logic to the clergy

[@giansideros]

​@@stanogden8864people forget that the lights went out under Heath (erroneously attributed to Labour by the rightwing media), it makes a lot more sense now as to why they did it.

[@ValQuinn]

I see the placards now: 'No ejaculation without representation'

[@carysworsley5162]

Postdoc here: people coming to do PhD postgraduate degrees are basically coming here to work. A PhD- especially in science or engineering is basically a research job. These students are not what the average person considers a student, and are often older, or have young families. Telling them they cannot bring said families means they will not come- and the UK will miss our on the essential contributions to research work they provide.

[@diabl2master]

Same thing when PhD students are barred from renting at half the homes on the rental market due to "no students". Like, mate. I'm 27. Most of my peers have been working jobs for 3 years...

[@Olc2906]

Oil’s take here is wild. Can’t help thinking he’s taking this stance for the sake of being controversial. Agreed that PhD’s are more like research jobs - especially in STEM. We want the best people from all over the world contributing to our research institutions and researching on behalf of British affiliated companies.

[@alst4817]

As someone that has recently been through the uk PhD system, this is a bit of a red herring. The issue is masters students, coming for 1 year degrees; everyone in the system knows that it is absolutely rife with cheating and corruption, both to get in, doing coursework, and finally graduating. There are huge numbers of Chinese students that buy essays and coursework online, the going rate is currently 1000 yuan for 1000 words. Many universities rely on these cheaters to survive, and so no one dares to chuck them out. It’s an absolute scandal and if it continues everyone will realise a degree from a uk university is not worth the paper it’s written on. And yes many of these students will bring ‘dependents’. The whole system is corrupt

[@carysworsley5162]

@alst4817 You're not wrong! The idea you can get a credible, thorough and well rounded masters' in a year is shocking to be honest. I understand why the universities introduced them, but in the long term there's a serious risk of really devaluing UK postgraduate degrees. I do think the distinction between that sort of degree and a research intensive doctorate need to be highlighted in this context though, as PhDs are an entirely different cohort of people! We don't want to end up with legislation that limits PhDs and postdocs because they're being lumped into the same group as other students. High quality research benefits from diversity, and given rhe roles are paid, I feel that doctoral positions should be viewed as employment in this context.

[@mattnorris9152]

True, but the vast vast majority of the 500'000 student visas issued last year are not going to mature PhD candidates. Yet the total number of dependent visas is 160'000. These are crazy numbers, and adding in a restriction to which kind of international student is allowed to bring in dependents, and who exactly qualifies as a dependent is a very good idea.

[@pastyman001]

"First they fascinate the fools and then they muzzle the intelligent". Bertrand Russell on how fascism manifests...

[@wumpyjumps]

I noticed that Age is the biggest factor for voting Tory and Education the biggest for voting Reform. Support for Reform quadruples among the GCSE or below compared to degree havers; pretty telling imho.

[@_xeere]

Imagine the world if Ed Miliband didn't eat that sandwich.

[@Kohanman]

imagine a world where you think the sandwich was a cause not just an excuse

[@TheFlash-rh2el]

We would probably be a few years delayed but it would still be the same outcome. The cost of living crisis would have been delayed a few years as The Tories would have won again within 14 years of Labour rule.

[@diabl2master]

​@@Kohanman If you think that was irrelevant you don't know the extent of how many people vote

[@ILikedGooglePlus]

"Feel like shit just want chaos with Ed Miliband" 😢

[@rob-c.]

@@TheFlash-rh2elMilliband wouldn’t have had the referendum.

[@GrowYourOwnLife]

This is the issue with Farage. Just like BoJo. People laugh at his jokes and ignore the hate. The old. "I'd love to have a pint with him" argument

[@keirmitchell5560]

The issues with labour or the left is there is nothing that makes sense.

[@danmayberry1185]

My algorithm is loading lighthearted Enoch Powell interviews. I watched a Thatcher clip and a Farage clip to earn that.

[@evolassunglasses4673]

Nothing is more hateful and extreme than mass replacement migration against the will of the indigenous population.

[@nathanaelsmith3553]

I'd love to have a milkshake with him 🥤

[@alanbarker2279]

The real issue is: How does this toxic grifter get so much air time?

[@jameshowarth4801]

The uni discussion (like most discussions) is just someone talking Oli Dugmore down from essentially being Joe Rogan.

[@anewsortofgramophone]

Starting to agree…

[@tdsok]

This podcast is literally getting more and more chaotic and rambling each episode, and I absolutely love it.

[@sinc10]

The whole point of the original bad apple phrase is the one bad apple can spoil the barrel! The fact its now so common for people to say "it's just a few bad apples" is infuriating, if you reference the whole bad apple thing the implication should be that they may well spoil the whole bloody barrel whether you're applying it to apples, Met officers or Oli's milfs (milves?)!! A pointless crusade of mine but it's exactly the sort of pedantry i expect to see championed here, team, buck up!

[@jackoh991]

Agreed

[@Hill_Walker]

Hear hear!

[@ChrisMalme]

Do you mean that the Osmonds lied to us? "One bad apple don't Spoil the whole bunch, girl"

[@ericaceous1652]

Did Keir's Dad make that drill?

[@Toodyslexicforyou]

Is that what a tool maker does?

[@ericaceous1652]

​@@Toodyslexicforyoudon't ask Ed, he doesn't know

[@omegonchris]

​@@ericaceous1652he had a better idea than Oli and Ava

[@simonturner1]

Possibly, but he definitely owned the factory that did.

[@enemystand2981]

@@omegonchrisAye lay off hahahaha. What makes this even funnier to me how every comment was on Ed’s side

[@mohammadbeitsadi]

"I think the sound quality is too high. We might need to start using a power drill just in case"

[@SarcasticDespot]

I think its a very Western view that stems from an air of superiority that people should be so thankful for the opportunity to study there that they should have to leave their families behind. These people are not just receiving an education, they will be contributing to their community as well (as well as basically subsidising school costs for homegrown Brits with the current system) and I think letting them be with their spouse/kids is literally the smallest thing. Especially considering if anything this is the type of immigration Brits should like. Also my socialist pov is that a lot these people don't hate immigrants for even the reasons they think, they feel left behind by their society and the changing face of the nation is an easy thing for them to associate with their woes.

[@matthewv4170]

Let them do it at home then

[@SarcasticDespot]

@@matthewv4170let them do it in another country while this one continues to sink to the bottom of the barrel to appease gammons such as yourself

[@RockabillyRaver1959]

To the people of Shetland. Reform UK are not THE CURE...

[@kalebdaark100]

...but they might be Disintegration.

[@SpankableRoxyRaeOnlyfanscreato]

Workers party reform will only have a few seats and we get change

[@gwynhyfer]

@@kalebdaark100 You win the internet! 🤩

[@gwynhyfer]

Rishi, Farage & Starmer - three imaginary boys .

[@kalebdaark100]

@@gwynhyfer Thankyou 😆

[@mentality-monster]

Oli channeling Aaron Bastani's taking the counter point just for the sake of it. Ed is spot on with uni dependents.

[@Yozzyfellow]

Also, uncharacteristically misinformed. I'm pretty sure only Children in school (ages 4-11) can have their parents (only 1 parent btw) apply as dependant. For uni students it was spouse and children only. Do better Oli. Team Ed's stash forever!!!

[@steffmay7969]

@@Yozzyfellow what so if youre 12 you've just gotta raw dog English society until you become an adult?

[@chazzerbox131]

@@Yozzyfellowno it wasn’t people were bringing their parents 😂 whilst attending uni then applying to stay after if I’m going to the us to study I’m not taking my mum or dad no matter what my age their were hundreds of cases of mature students bringing their children then not attending the university corse of course that doesn’t apply to everyone but the system was being completely abused

[@Yozzyfellow]

@@chazzerbox131 ​ @chazzerbox131 I don't think this is correct. Take a look at the UK immigration rules, you can't bring adult dependents on the standard student visa. The point about abuse is valid, but outweighed by the reality that a lot of these students come from backgrounds where they live with 3 generations of family members, and don't for example have gap years. Asking them to embark on a 3 year course without their family does seem draconian, and likely to disincentivise talent and numbers when we seriously need both.

[@Yozzyfellow]

@@steffmay7969 Ah not sure what this means dude, If you're 4-11 your parent can apply for a parent of a child visa. Otherwise I think (1) you're looking at boarding school (which isn't all that uncommon), or the parent tries for a different visa, maybe one outside the rules. .

[@danmayberry1185]

To hell with Swifties, we're stocking every pub in South London for a chance to pap Ed.

[@kgaia]

Lets get out on the street lads, we'll find 'im before the game kicks off 😈

[@pauljordan4829]

He will be in the Scottish Stores in Kingscross.

[@Stevies_Precog_Gym_n_Spa420]

Pap smear? Idk if he'd be keen

[@DrDanWeaver]

Note about retirement at 80 from House of Lords, here is the wording: "At the end of the Parliament in which a member reaches 80years of age, they will be required to retire from the House of Lords." - seems to me then that if a peer was 80 on day1 of a new parliament they could still be there nearly 5 years later.

[@Chris-Longhair]

Oli over here doing his best to make the podcast unlistenable. Gotta respect it

[@jnielson1121]

Proposed Labour tag line: Steer Calmer, with Keir Starmer...

[@benadams6019]

Day 26 of asking for a production team microphone

[@GucciedUp]

A referendum to scrap valentine's day is a nailed on vote winner

[@GameCountryUK]

It would fail as there's more women. Just so you are aware. The gender population is 52%-48%

[@OxidusMagicus]

@@GameCountryUK did you just assume everyones gender?

[@meganfrancis1628]

Have you considered that women may not like Valentine’s Day as well ?

[@OxidusMagicus]

@@meganfrancis1628 Yet to meet a woman that doesn't like chocolate

[@localshaman]

Can we get Ed reading more discontinued magazines from the 1980s?

[@ruairihair]

That ending. Perfection.

[@Rachel_M_]

If tories = gammon, and tories go to Reform does that make reform "reformed pork"? 🤔

[@adambinnie3762]

I work adjacent to higher education and I think the university funding issue is one of the next crises for the next government - essentially as we rely on overseas students (especially in Scotland) and we've already seen a decrease in the population of around 20% 👀

[@markfarnworth2488]

Applications have already dipped for Master's degrees and many universities are making redundancies as a result. Also important to note that dependents don't come over for free, they still require evidence of money to support them and an NHS levy. For some people a parent is necessary to care for children during study, especially if their spouse is working in the home country or they do not have a spouse.

[@ChrispyP]

Only a Dudes Rock episode could end with such artistic poignancy

[@edwinmoriarty8255]

International student recruitment in universities has absolutely crashed and is in total crisis - there *is* a dearth of applicants.

[@danmayberry1185]

Never pegged Robert Smith as a Reformer

[@moretimeneeded56]

I’ve never pegged Robert Smith.

[@McGrrrrrowl]

The ending to this podcast was beautifully abstract. DUDES ROCK!

[@beththehuman7532]

'Holy war on the NIMBYs' took me the fuck out

[@El-Burrito]

Lisan al gaib!

[@Hill_Walker]

JCBs well and truely parked on their lawns!

[@beththehuman7532]

@@Hill_Walker JCBs armed and ready to dig.

[@TinkerTailor117]

Sauroman did nothing wrong

[@reverendroar]

Best intro ever! Whether the dudes are together - we should have random intros like this. *fucking Classic!*

[@DavidManser]

"Would we call him a DILF?" 🤣🤣🤣

[@aircongosney]

Lol Ollie's take on dependants and study is taken so clearly through the lense of a relatively privileged childhood. Not everyone will get the opportunity, but there are actually serious people out there who have dependants that rely on them whose study adds value to society.

[@TheSurrealWolf]

Ed is the reverse Clark Kent

[@samuelmelton8353]

Vote Greens

[@stonehengemaca]

I fear brexit, covid and 14 years of tories has meant we can't afford to go green at the moment. We need to recover first. In my humble opinion.

[@samuelmelton8353]

@@stonehengemaca It will just be a cost we'll have to pay later on - had we already been more serious about it we could have been there by now. We have also benefitted from centuries of fossil fuel use, while others around the world will suffer for it. But let's look at your concerns: Brexit: Greens want to return to the EU. Labour, Tories, and Reform want to keep us out. Covid: If you think the cost of a pandemic was bad - please consider the impact of increasing mosquito ranges as temperatures rise, or the disease spread in cities by floodwaters, or even the re-emergence of prehistoric viruses being released from permafrost. Besides, looking beyond the UK, climate change will be very costly to some countries in terms of loss of farmland, property destruction, disease, and humid conditions affecting the ability to go to work in places such as India and Bangladesh (where your clothes might come from). In many cases these will impact food and goods imports to the UK. Lastly, oil and coal will only ever *increase* in price, and in a couple of centuries be depleted. Renewables and nuclear will become increasingly competitive and necessary. Delaying only compounds the effects.

[@archvaldor]

@@stonehengemaca You can't afford NOT to go green. It costs you money not invest in a renewable energy resource. That's money you are wasting NOW. Look at the returns you get from investing in, say, solar panels, the risk/return is MUCH better than the stock market.

[@stonehengemaca]

@@archvaldor The energy model in the UK is broken, but the money we waste now is producing energy, instead of producing infrastructure and THEN energy. I'd rather see that funding go to repair the damage done by the tories. Later, the greens might get my vote, but not at this election.

[@Bungleandgeorge808]

@@stonehengemaca tax the rich

[@jnielson1121]

There is a world of difference between an undergraduate degree and a PhD. There are large numbers of undergraduates funded by their parents from overseas but there are also a large number of experienced, talented academics who would like to do PhDs in the UK, raise the overall standard (which is pretty poor for PhDs now) and would have dependents they would need to bring.

[@woges5093]

January indicators Before we explore the PwC analysis, it's important to note recent data from Enroly that shows that Confirmation of Acceptance for Studies (CAS) issuance for the January 2024 intake of international students coming to the UK is down by 36% when compared to January 2023, and deposits are off by 37%.

[@lewischerry3552]

As a nobody who doesn’t even like the fact that my neighbours know where I live, I support Ed 100% on the not wanting to let randoms on the internet know where he lives or where he’ll be at a specific time

[@cheeseburgerbeefcake]

The drill sounded JUST like Farage talking, it was uncanny.

[@newchrisusa]

That drill woke me up from a nap, fuckers!

[@contemporarycross]

LOL! I took that poll - Prolific released an apology afterwards

[@Hill_Walker]

Oli has well and truely parked his JCBs on the lawns of the NIMBYs!

[@paulmarshall4793]

I don't think Ollie understands that the best STEM students go to America, the second best come here so do we really want them going to other European unis?-where it's also cheaper 😂

[@giansideros]

36:18 according to the House of Lords Library online, there are 186 Members of the House of Lords above the age of 79, out of 822. That's 22%, which is a good start. The average age of the House is currently 71, if we excluded everyone above the age of 79, it would be 66. At the moment, only 35% of the House of Lords are below the State Pension Age of 68 and of these Members, their average age is still as high as 58. If we excluded the Members above the age of 79, then 46% of the House of Lords would be below the State Pension Age of 68. I think a similar age cap should be applied to the House of Commons as well.

[@hughlaw1]

Tell us the pub, Ed.

[@Hill_Walker]

As a bald man, I'd ask a barber for Starmers haircut. Would be a laugh.

[@moonman62]

We need to create a spreadsheet of every pub in South London so we can locate Ed.

[@randomzebra1233]

Ed is getting more and more savage, love it!

[@danbetts7990]

What a welcome relief, to hear a drill and not a clap

[@nev3i]

I love the vibes of this podcast, cheers me up while simultaneously getting depressed about how fucked the country is

[@benjones3466]

On the poll question of whether Rishi Sunak should be forced to join the army. I imagine a number of people answered no because him joining would only make the army weaker. Both physically and in its' public profile.

[@deemey95]

I am very happy with PoliticsJOE's choice of power tool manufacturer. I am myself a Makita man.

[@tronnyjeverton]

9 pensioners disliked this video

[@John-nu1vp]

Every time you say gift I think of Simon Jordan Let that sink in Olly 😂

[@StairChicken]

Other podcasts: "I was talking to someone very close to Keir Starmer the other night..." PolJoe: "I was talking to my mate last night and he reckons..."

[@giansideros]

1:25 especially ironic these days given that Dundee United has become an insult for a foolish person in Nigeria and is becoming more well known.

[@liamtait4845]

Gotta love hearing Orkney and Shetland mentioned randomly, figures crossed we don’t vote reform…

[@TheRobessey]

The most ASMR ending to a podcast imaginable

[@neon_jam1127]

43:50 ED: Haha, I was only pretending to like his haircut

[@verdebritanica]

Shoot and Match, I remember the league ladders and following the table for the first two weeks and then getting bored with updating it.

[@FerventRebutter]

Yeah, I'd have been at the pub.

[@bendybenbenderson]

That's the most hilarious start ever 😅😅😅

[@MsPaulathomas]

Yeah YpouGov's changed their methodology for the worse mid-campaign,, I wouldn't take their polls that seriously now except their MRP polls.

[@jamiebirley]

I think it is completely sensible for anyone with an online following to keep their address private.

[@Dominatrix97]

Starts at 29:12.

[@Lemondog22]

Take a shot every time Oli says "within the gift" for a good time!

[@GoikOShea]

I want a rabbit.

[@woges5093]

If the grass is on the pitch, let's vote.

[@arsenim01]

This was just the tonic this afternoon 😂

[@MegaWelshpanda]

what an opening 🤣 - dudes rock

[@Glashome]

Dundee United were genuinely one of the best teams in the UK in the mid to late 80s, even pre-Heysel and the European football ban for English clubs.

[@County22]

True. That was a 1988 issue so the previous season (86-87) they beat Barcelona home and away to get to the UEFA Cup Final - and the shock was they lost the final.

[@bailey3209]

Headline - Oli loves Ed's pole

[@kokomiyax]

since someone said it i can't unsee ed as harry potter either

[@albertbrammer9263]

A lot of other countries build things because the UK is an outlier in that we own more homes than in Europe. We also have factories from the 19th century that have been empty for 60 years and never demolished.

[@matthewmcneany]

Surely it would make more sense to simply non-dom the hot moms directly and paying tax on the hot mom fund that way compared to bringing them through the previously well established incredibly stringent UK migration system?

[@systemchris]

Dependents on student visas could have been co habiting partners, spouse or children under 18

[@leonie563]

Do universities in an era of virtual offices even exist anymore in theory? Many Uni's already have campuses around the World so has the business model fractured and lots of primeland on offer for redevelopment?

[@rohanpuri7951]

Ed spot on about the dependents

[@swarming1092]

cold open fucking had me out dead

[@dandruff123]

The way Oli handles that drill... It's very "driller killer" vibes #goodfilm #uncensored

[@zooblestyx]

Rambunctious and deadly - The Politics Joe Podcast. Put this on a shirt and take my money already

[@belindablunderbus1365]

Best ending ever 😂

[@Qeztotz]

take this in the lighthearted and genuinely happy manner it is intended, but I can really tell that Ava is the only one of you accredited

[@lewischerry3552]

“This is exactly like the 2040 reboot of The Twilight Zone”

[@lewischerry3552]

Don’t get excited guys it’s a Disney + original. There’s no excitement to be found in the future.

[@Englishconstitution]

Read the Magna Carta

[@SashaGrace94]

All aboard the Chairman Margaret Starmer train people. Can you imagine? 😂

[@gwy41]

Oli is a Ryobi guy, aspiring Milwaukee. Ed is Dewalt and Ava is Makita

[@parametr]

Anybody noticed that Capital Gains Tax is LOWER than Corporate Tax? Why would rich people take on more work and more risk, to be taxed more? Raise CGT the hell up and lower Corporate Tax back to where it was 3 years ago. Rich people will see more benefit in doing business instead of speculating with house prices, etc.

[@farhadchaudhry]

Disallow interest expense deductibility in corporation tax and watch that speculation massively reduce. Also tax avoidance mind you.

[@parametr]

@@farhadchaudhry yep. Lovely when rich people take a loan on shares, and then uses that loan to buy assets. No taxes paid. And the loan repayment is tax deductible, so it actually lowers the taxes. FIx: if you take a loan on shares, that's you converting shares into money. Pay taxes on that conversion.

[@farhadchaudhry]

@@parametr Yep. Treat compensation via stock options as a fringe benefit.

[@adamcummings20]

Ed has just leaked his address to that one fan who spoke to him outside

[@philipgibson2643]

To the tune of Justified and Ancient - "We're rambunctious and deadly, listening to Politics Joe!"

[@xgfunk]

As a man in his early 40's with a haircut not far off of a Starmer haircut i feel offended LOL

[@alibrown317]

The mums love Ollie too ❤❤❤

[@liamcragin]

That was a pretty good Bill the Butcher!

[@RR-tk5ve]

I work in admissions and we are already seeing a drop in applications purely on applicants being spooked by the environment here re: attitude to foreign students.

[@owenfitzgerald5928]

I listen to every politics joe pod and i am from northern Ireland and hope they do every ni manifesto

[@Chungleplums]

Dudes so rock

[@marcused8317]

These dudes rock hard as hell

[@alanbarker2279]

I've got to be honest Oli's mock bullying of Ed is getting boring. Oli thinks his star is rising, but he is not as lovable (or interesting) as he thinks he is. Might all come crashing down...

[@PurushaDesa]

Ava was so visibly repulsed by his screaming intro - as any of us would be.

[@beggsy69]

Dugmore drills Ed into submission shocker!

[@andrewgoodall2183]

Ollie, there's a fooking difference between massacring the green belt (I appreciate you weren't serious) and sensible use of land. Nimbyism is often about "I (personally) don't want this because it bothers/inconveniences me" rather than being about permanently removing something natural and beautiful that should objectively be something we need to keep. . Don't confuse nimby and sensible conservation. Once it's gone it's gone. Etc etc.

[@adrian19831983]

Guys you mostly talk about centrist dads. No mummies mentioned before today.

[@markym5002]

At what point were you *in* dodge, so I can rewind?