FFXIV - Wait... They Just Made A WHOLE NEW Dungeon!?

[@vaidenkelsier7757]

The "farming" point about the gear is undoubtedly a WoW player's perspective, since most FF players would just be farming tomestones to get the gear they want, unless there's a specific glam they're trying to get. It's interesting seeing Preach's mindset. I've noticed that the WoW players all get some very interesting hangups about things

[@MikeDawsonPal]

Yeah I was gonna say, aint no one farming dungeons ever, so his point was kinda moot.

[@sauceinmyface9302]

Yeah, FF's progression is very simple compared to other games. There are only a couple steps once you're leveled and done with the MSQ. Step 1. Get base gear with tomestones, alliance raids, normal raids, dungeons, EX weapons. Step 2. Get bis with savage raids, relic weapon. Slot some materia, and boom, you're done.

[@KutsukiTsukiyo]

Honestly the irony is that, once the max level dungeons are out of rotation you don't "farm" them, but you're always farming the leveling dungeon versions for experience, as dungeons are the best way to level.

[@GekoHayate]

@@MikeDawsonPal Glamour, some FC mates will run a dungeon 200+ times for a single chest piece.

[@BottledDelusion]

The things people like in ff are the same things hard core WoW players have railed against forever if you told a WoW player most of their gear came from a badge vendor they’d be furious about how casual the game has become. This is mostly a thing in the past as most of the people who say stuff like that have moved on it’s just funny how accepting people are of systems they said they hated a few years ago

[@benjaminrosiek5007]

two words my man, "daily roulette". why are your queue times so low? because high level characters are constantly being thrown back into these lower dungeons with good incentive. that's why you can do any dungeon in the game hard mode or easy and still find a group in a fairly reasonable time; because they are being done, and not just one and done'd.

[@TheAssirra]

i don't think he realized about the roulettes yet.

[@Ryukai-san]

Ahhh yes, the seemingly never ending poetic/seals farm for the special weapons.... just finished the 6K needed for the Anima weapon, now for another 1750 for the Hyperconductive... To the Roulette /charge! It never ends (at least it feels like it). 🤪

[@Ceronia]

@@Ryukai-san You would be mind blown to know that the poetic usage for anima is only exist after HW

[@CrashB111]

Yeah, someone needs to explain to preach that the dungeon gear itself, isn't the true reward. It's the currency you get for doing roulettes each day. That currency being able to purchase either endgame gear or high powered leveling gear depending on if it's poetics or not.

[@amiablereaper]

Which is also brilliant from a business standpoint. You get way more value out of your dev time spent on dungeons, because players will be visiting them again and again throughout the life of the game

[@gameprose4293]

So, about the Tonberries. It's an interesting experience after doing the Scholar quests and finding out about their origins. No spoilers, but it does put things in a different light.

[@derekbuechele]

decided to look for this comment before i did it myself lol

[@gameprose4293]

@@derekbuechele Like, I don't even play Scholar, but because I play Summoner I decided why not, let's do the Scholar class quests too. lol

[@sitheclimber]

@@derekbuechele Yep me too!

[@78MatWar87]

when in the scholar story does this come up? i've only gotten to 33

[@gameprose4293]

@@78MatWar87 There's hints to it around the lv.40 quest, but the reveal is in the lv.50 quest, The Beast Within. Wont spoil anything, of course. But like I said, it puts the whole Tonberry thing in a different light.

[@tinamclennan]

"Only gonna run this dungeon one time..." chuckles....

[@unfinest]

Hahaha 😂

[@borntodie297]

manical laughter.exe

[@Aquilenne]

It's possible if you only want to level one class and don't do relic/anima/resistance grinds

[@nenram.5786]

daily roulette says HI

[@ArmageddonEvil]

He actually ran Amdapor Keep Hard twice. lol

[@umngyr]

You don't farm a single dungeon for gear though, unless you're going for a piece of glamour. You farm endgame/high level dungeons for tomestones, and you can switch them up as you like

[@Vera_Nova]

Or Ultimates, but that's a very specific case and is only for specific best in slot builds

[@FerrickAnima]

tbf, glam is kinda the endgame for some lol

[@matthewshull9345]

Won't lie, I can't get enough of your FFXIV content.

[@nvsammy]

Same

[@VictouffeVideos]

I am still extremely disapponted that when he lists the primals he has killed, he forgets his kill of king Moogle Mog Extreme. But yeah love his FF14 content otherwise

[@danmarshall4812]

@@VictouffeVideos long may he reign Kupo

[@ArmageddonEvil]

@@VictouffeVideos It's probably because that boss scarred him. XD

[@Maria_Erias]

@@ArmageddonEvil King Moogle Mog scars everyone that goes into it. XD

[@puresinn6996]

One of the reasons they don't have hard modes of the basic Dungeons aside from 2nd versions, is because as you level up other jobs, or level your squadron, you absolutely will revisit them all. Cheers mate, glad you're enjoying yourself.

[@WhatKindOfNameNow]

Not only if/when you level other jobs or your squadron, but also for daily roulettes/the grind for poetics, and for relic grinds. Not to mention it may take quite a few runs on a given dungeon to get a specific piece of gear that you want for glamouring. Or if you'd rather get a rare drop like a minion from the dungeon itself rather than paying on the MB.

[@krekkaking]

Squadrons didn't exist in 2.1, they were added in 4.4, I believe, hard modes were initially pitched as revamped versions of the original dungeons, I kinda want yoshi-p to bring back 2 dungeons per patch

[@WhatKindOfNameNow]

​@@krekkaking Squadrons were added in 3.4.

[@krekkaking]

@@WhatKindOfNameNow thank you, there's a Lotta features that start muddling together when you look back far enough

[@Gatsby3737]

Some historical context for those new to FFXIV: the 2.x patches added numerous dungeons each update in order to simply add more content to the game which was pretty bare save for dungeons, trials, and raids. As more unique content like the Gold Saucer and Deep Dungeon got added they began focusing on adding more new stuff and less on just adding more and more dungeons so we get far fewer with each patch now. If you were ever wondering why the list of ARR lvl 50 dungeons is so massive, now you know.

[@Upstart051]

I do kind of wish they would keep adding more dungeons though, I love exploring them and getting those tidbits of lore they provide

[@Nirual86]

@@Upstart051 they did still had hard mode dungeons until Shadowbringers, though less and less. And with Shadowbringers they nixed them entirely in favor of focusing development time on other content. Including the dungeons we do get (one per patch, always tied to MSQ) being consistently really well done.

[@foxdavion6865]

A lot of players don't actually know how bare bones 2.0 really was; Apart from Beast tribes, the stuff carried over from 1.0 and Hunts; there really wasn't anything else. Gold Saucer and Deep Dungeon wasn't added till just before Heavensward and most of the content in both were added in Heavensward. Same for PvP. I didn't even know this till I took time to look it up.

[@totallynottrademarked5279]

@@foxdavion6865 Back in my day you leveled by grinding Fates in a zerg. When you needed your other job to 30 to do your level 60 quest on your main job lol.

[@chrisanderson7820]

They still have some hard mode remixes in Heavensward, mainly the earlier stuff before the story starts steamrolling.

[@ChrisMorray]

It's like seeing a kid in the candy store. "A whole new dungeon?!". Yup. Also: since you were interested in Edda's story, go try some Palace of the Dead! It's a Deep Dungeon, basically like a randomly generated dungeon with certain rules, special items, and an interesting story.

[@jace743]

I have to add: As a former WoW player, you may think, "Sounds like Torghast. Hard pass." I'm a former WoW player, and even though I hated Torghast, I ended up soloing all 200 floors of Palace of the Dead because I enjoyed it so much (as well as all 100 floors of the Stormblood version of it!). Turns out that I like deep dungeons if I'm not forced to do them. Maybe you will too, Preach!

[@StarGazerTom1991]

@@jace743 It's almost like player choice is important! PotD ain't my cup of tea all that much, but I've been absolutely LOVING Eureka.

[@TerryVideoZone]

@@StarGazerTom1991 eureka's so good

[@tommenno]

There's a whole slightly hidden quest-line around her that eventually ends out in Lisma.

[@toximenexythol]

@@masterpain7742 There is pvp

[@ninnoofthelastunicorn]

Preach is still stuck on his WoW mind set when it comes to farmable Content. I feel like he's going to have a nice surprise when he reaches end game either at Shadowbringers or Endwalker. No my Friend, you won't be farming these dungeons, you'll be farming *every* dungeon. The power of the Daily Roulette

[@Maria_Erias]

Yeah, and it's nice that the same currency can get you a full set of level 50, 60, 70, etc gear, and you get tomestones just from doing content.

[@YueEntialpoh]

Wellllll technically if he does ultimates he'll be farming a single dungeon on repeat. But anything before that? Absolutely.

[@baconbankai]

I basically only farmed expert roulette coming into shadowbringers recently for tombstones of revelation. because they gave 90 tombstones when combined with the ones from the dungeon itself and outside of that I found hunt trains are super rewarding for very little effort out side of just being only when they come up. I wish the 80 dungeons roulette gave the same or near the same so I had more incentive to do them. Think that is just the result of me coming in during the final patch though sadly.

[@TheRedAzuki]

@@Maria_Erias the poetic ones are just for the catch-up stuff. Allegory is for "farmable end-game startup gear" and revelation is "End-game subsidized gear" over doing savage raiding.

[@Mightfox]

Daily roulette is a real crapshoot though. You often end up with lower level dungeons with your abilities yanked away from you(unlike level scaling in other games), making many classes super simplistic and boring. When daily roulette works out and you get something that's like 70+, yeah, its pretty nice(aside from dungeons, which are always pushovers), but there's always that big chance of just returning to a garbage version of your class where you just faceroll.

[@hooliganj391]

As a note - one reason they don't have leveled up version of old dungeons is that you're never required to farm dungeons for drops. Every new tier of gear includes a crafted and sellable set with stats equal to or better than the dungeon set(s) in the same tier. Of course you can always farm a dungeon for glamour pieces, but by design it's not part of the process for gearing up.

[@mjs3188]

The Hard Mode idea is a stroke of genius. You get to reuse 90% of the assets for the dungeon and even some of the same locations to reduce the development cost all while delivering additional story and dungeon content.

[@DarkScreamGames]

Not really genius (as in innovative), WoW did this already several times. The problem is they stopped doing it.

[@CrashB111]

And the Hard mode of a dungeon in FF usually explores alternate paths that were inaccessible in the original dungeon, oftentimes running the dungeon "backward". A big one is Pharos Sirus (Hard) and Sohm Al (Hard). Instead of fighting your way up the lighthouse or mountain, you start at the top and descend down a different way than you came up the first time.

[@sauceinmyface9302]

Unfortunately, they don't really do that much anymore in FF14. They don't release dungeons nearly as fast as before, since dungeons were considered to be much more important. Nowadays, content releases focus on other content, with only 5 dungeons getting released in the SHB patches. All unique dungeons, mind you, but only those ones.

[@knicknevin9975]

@@DarkScreamGames To be fair FFXIV stopped doing it as well. It was mainly a stopgap measure while they tried to bulk out the launch year content. To put it in perspective, Heavensward only has a handful of Hard mode dungeons, and Stormblood only two. Shadowbringers is all new content in terms of dungeons.

[@zackg3507]

Why is it a "stroke of genius" though? This sort of design methodology has been around since the 80s.

[@michaelkpate]

There are a few dungeons - like Pharos Sirius and Saint Mocianne's Arboretum - that are strictly optional.

[@Ashtarte3D]

But skipping out on Saint Mochaine's means you won't get the Hard version at the end of Stormblood and it's one of the most fun dungeons in the game IMO.

[@mithshude]

@@Ashtarte3D whoa wait, you mean don't get it as in can't unlock at all? new and just started stormblood and i would rather not lock myself out of content ^^

[@Masterherocard]

@@mithshude While you need to do the original dungeon to unlock the hard mode, nothing is stopping you from running the older dungeons as you see fit down the line. Whatever the content, you can always unlock it or do its prerequisites at a later point if you feel like it. As far as I'm away, there's nothing you can permanently miss or lock yourself out of except maybe some of the timed seasonal event stuff.

[@joevoyles2005]

One doesn't skip Pharos Sirius/Hard. I adore that song in Pharos Sirius one if my favorite pieces of music in ff14.

[@michaelkpate]

@@joevoyles2005 I did unlock both of them - just not until after I hit 80 and started doing things I missed.

[@terenceng5177]

you will get the true tonberry story when you level up your Scholar. They have a good back story.

[@carlmeaux3518]

Plus you get to escort a Lovely lady around *wink*

[@yvindvego9404]

@@carlmeaux3518 i always thought alka zolka was a boy, then someone called her a she or something and i got confused.

[@GekoHayate]

@@yvindvego9404 wiki says male, which is what I thought. I think Carl was talking about one of the tonberries.

[@yiggygames1774]

salene or eos I thought but it may be a joke I don’t understand so I’ll r/woooosh myself

[@zakuraayame5091]

Ty, I forgot where their origination story was.

[@HookahOtaku]

Youre slowly unraveling the layers of the ff14 “onion”. Lots of surprises. Checkout the Beast tribes/rep quests offer amazing rewards/mounts.

[@hermespymander9167]

Ananta, Sylphs and Pixies

[@adjwindu70]

I just started stormblood.andnonly have mounts for arr beast tribes. Love the kobold mount

[@miri5373]

the story's of the beast tribes can be incredibly good

[@highmane6343]

I love the lxali wolf mount !

[@adjwindu70]

@@highmane6343 working on that. They require more trust than the other tribes

[@ramontavaresdacruz2256]

What's funny about these old dungeons is that you might get them in roullete with 3 sprouts while you yourself don't remember shit and end up wiping like 6 times on the last boss. Happened yesterday.

[@TheWickedWizardOfOz1]

"First timer here, be gentle!" "First timer here too" "First timer, any guidance?" "Shit, I did this once a year and a half ago and can't remember a god damn thing"

[@Alynis_]

Roulettes and leveling alt jobs will put your through all the dungeons many times. I liked that I was incentivized to unlock and complete the hard modes (and raids) because it added diversity to my roulettes.

[@Ch4pp13]

Only to get Sastasha and Copperbell Mines over and over... and over....... and over again............

[@TheAssirra]

@@Ch4pp13 I take those over thousand yawns of Toto rak.

[@bigbay1159]

@@TheAssirra Me and some FC peeps were discussing worst leveling dungeons. That one took the crown.

[@davidcasey1119]

@@Ch4pp13 Change your party settings in duty finder, the bottom option (Limited Leveling Roulette) keeps your dungeons within 7-8 levels of your level.

[@Ch4pp13]

@@davidcasey1119 As long as I get to have fun, I'll happily take 5 extra minutes of waiting time.

[@MonsterMogster]

We've litteraly been brainwashed to believe that wow was the only MMO with engaging end game content. FF14 is blowing my mind on a daily basis, and I am barely through Stormblood!! You have so much to look forward to Preach.

[@Exxy6965]

You also have a lot to look forward to :) Shadowbringers surpassed not only game's previous expansions but also many single player RPGs. It's just... Amazing.

[@NameIsZ]

There's plenty more to explore! Don't forget the side missions when you can fit done added gear or gil. Some of the quests even link up with the expansions if you do them, fixing up side stories and all

[@BsetXOXO]

Enjoy shadowbringers. That expansion was kiss the chef worthy.

[@batosai85]

Oh god I'm half way through post stormblood and you telling me this? Noice cant wait.

[@jessicajones641]

Same! I am halfway through Shadowbringers (started playing seriously at the end of July). I forgot how it felt to enjoy a game fully. I cannot believe I slept on this game for so long. Heavenward alone would had hooked me instantly!

[@kn0bhe4d]

For the past 8 years, we were thinking we were playing the king of MMOs, and this game was there, quietly doing its thing in the background. Makes one feel like a fool for having ignored it for so long.

[@ENGRtube]

Can't wait until he does Coils. Thats when it will pop off!

[@jimi_jams]

*Twintania appears* Did someone ask for a game of Twister?

[@paladinbrewer]

Just a note, but "every" dungeon in the game is not a part of the story. There is several you have to unlock from side quests. Much more in ARR, and then gradually less of those later.

[@ZeepZerp]

Though, there are two in ShB that are side content to the MSQ.

[@fjshdf]

In addition to the ones that were always side-quest stuff, they trimmed the post ARR experience a bit in a ShB patch, so some of the dungeons used to be mandatory but are now side-quests.

[@Sherolox]

So, from my memory: Sunken Temple of Quarn is certainly an optional one, Halatali, Dzemael Darkhold, Aurum Vale, most of the 50 dungeons. Can't name anything else from the top of my mind right now, but I'm sure I missed a few. For Heavensward, I only know about Dusk Vigil being an optional one for the main story, with the rest of the levelling ones being tied to the main story.

[@royox]

@@Sherolox Cutters Cry. I unlocked that in Heavenswars not knowing I accidentally skipped it lol and been playing aince 1.0

[@XMAlek]

There is one in shadowbringer (with one of the best music). They are still here but they reduced their numbers as they started to have less dungeons overall per expansions

[@Eonymia]

10:30. There's a reason for the difficulty ramping up like this for the ARR ex primals. They made you do them in sequence, much like you'd have to do current savage 1, then you get access to 2, etc. So Garuda was the first extreme fight, and would thus be a bit simpler, then came titan ex, then ifrit ex that was the last extreme for a while.

[@Hagosha]

In GW2's base game, they did something similar. There were the "story" difficulty dungeons and then there were "explorable" modes, each with multiple paths and new bosses/encounters. I was always really impressed with that system and i'm glad to see that ARR did something similar as well.

[@KotCR]

Yeah, it's a pity they abandoned it in favour of Fractals. Fractals itself was a nice idea, don't get me wrong, it gives the dungeon designers alot of creative freedom, but I think there was place in the game for both dungeon systems - similar to how we have both the core dungeons, and the deep dungeons in FFXIV.

[@lingwisyer88]

It was sad when they nerfed dungeon rewards into the ground... Now the only time you do them is if you are achievement hunting or are making a gen1 legendary that requires the currency...

[@dedexter88]

RIP Gw2 dungeons

[@cattysplat]

@@KotCR They basically went the WoW system instead focusing on achievements for optional difficulty. Which most players will obviously not care about.

[@Highstar25]

It was great. My favorite part of GW2... And then they never made another dungeon ever again. Fuck fractals.

[@GordonHamsay314]

"Heavensward soon™ " every time someones talks about getting there soon, I just have a good little laugh XD

[@Sherolox]

He's over the slog part of ARR and has also finished the Crystal Tower already, so it's really just smooth from here on. But, for any other player, the Crystal Tower can be the wall that keeps you out of Heavensward, being a 24 man raid tied to forced sidequests doesn't help either. It would probably even take a healer over 30 minutes for the queue.

[@DeltaInsanity]

@@Sherolox I'm a WHM that went through the Crystal Tower quests/raids in the last month or so, and it definitely didn't take 30 mins to queue, maybe 5-10 mins tops. But honestly I think it was even less than that.

[@Exxy6965]

@@Sherolox I had to do the crystal tower at some point during Shadowbringers as it was not a mandatory quest when I was going through the story before. As a red mage, the longest I waited was around 10mins and it was only for one of the raids, others were even faster. So it's word you say healers wait 30mins in queue o.O

[@powerofk]

@@Sherolox Crystal Tower raids rarely have a long queue due to their required status. Honestly, the longest 24 man queue times are currently the Shadows of Mhach queues. Why? Because Crystal Tower is required for the MSQ, Return to Ivalice is required for starting the Shadowbringers relic weapon grind, and YorHA: Dark Apocalypse (crossover with Nier: Automata) is current expansion.

[@Zakjuh]

@@Sherolox The post-2.0 to 3.0 MSQ is quite a slog. But it's good that he has Crystal Tower done. I imagine he'll be trying to do Coils, though. Which.. will take a while. :p

[@lasarila1629]

What keeps me coming back to you and Asmon is your integrity when it comes to critiquing your games. Not being afraid to talk about what you dislike and you even make suggestions on how to improve content. These are the kind of developers who really do listen to feedback so I honestly believe they gained some valuable allies when streamers who are genuine to themselves started playing their game. Thank you!

[@cattysplat]

There are too many fanboys and "neutral" point of view when it comes to most content creators since they don't want to risk getting hate feedback and their own fans abandoning them. It's OK to have an opinion and share what you feel instead of copying what's popular.

[@HiddenEvilStudios]

Shadowbringers breaks with this tradition for story reasons. Wonder if Endwalker will return to it.

[@CrashB111]

I think Yoshi-P said in interviews it was partly Covid, and partly shifting resources. Instead of making as many dungeons in Shadowbringers they instead built stuff like Bozja.

[@bangormc3rd562]

Also possible we'll get (Hard) variations of Shadowbringers stuff, in the same way that Stormblood added (Hard) for some HW dungeons (like Arboretum).

[@JackgarPrime]

@@CrashB111 Which honestly I think was the right call.

[@Ashtarte3D]

COVID had a lot to do with us losing out on additional Hard modes of old content. Same reason we didn't get the ShB arc of Hildebrand.

[@redwitch95]

@@Ashtarte3D I'm pretty sure they hadn't wanted to include Hildibrand in ShB anyway, they were very quiet on whether he'd be included even after ShB released

[@magicalduckye2356]

"I will run these dungeons ONE TIME..." Introducing, Roulettes!!!

[@jonathansoko1085]

It is always weird to me in mmos when the story impacts a zone but after you finish the story its all the same and still in ruin

[@Carionoso7416]

Same, especially in regards to Stratholme in WoW. We were going in there, basically to cleanse it. That was revamped in... Cataclysm? And it still hasn't been purified and shown to be being worked on. People will probably disagree with me, but that one always stuck out to me.

[@CrashB111]

The fun thing with beast tribe quests in FF, is they always leave lasting changes on the area around the quest hub. All of the crafting beast tribes have you completely refurbish or construct a new location that exists in game for your character afterward.

[@zaelheimricht4978]

Doman Enclave: Allow me to introduce myself

[@omegaweaponredux]

FF14 actually reflects changes in the world at certain points for the MSQ.

[@Upstart051]

Allow me to introduce you to the Firmament

[@chryobanshee]

Eda is one of my favourite story lines in FF14. The fact that she was outside of Satasha before you entered it the first time with her fiancé is so awesome. It went unnoticed when i did it but looking over it on KZbin its so good.

[@GekoHayate]

At a later point there is an identical party of adventurers outside sastasha with their personalities reversed. The tank becomes the timid one and the healer is the verbally aggressive arse.

[@ZephWraen]

To be clear, they have stopped doing Hard Modes in favor of fewer brand new dungeons in recent years. That development time has gone to other systems like Eureka and Bozja.

[@taylon5200]

Which I think has been equally fantastic! Hopefully though, with the influx of new players and revenue it allows them a lot more development freedom by having enough people and time! After end walker I feel patch content should be pretty stacked! Sadly this giant boom for the game couldn't happen sooner to help out endwalker, But it'll definitely add value to the future of the game.

[@rollio8791]

I switched to FFXIV some time ago. Watching Preach cover it now is so great for me! Welcome to our new home Preach! It is such a pleasure and privilege to watch your vids on FF. Thank you!

[@docmedecal]

ESO does this system pretty well, where the base game dungeons are an initial story and there's a second dungeon at max level (as well as a max level scaled version of the leveling version with a hardmode for the final bosses) that expands on the story in the same area but with different bosses, mechanics and layouts. So you have the traditional "hard mode" increased difficulty for higher reward if you choose to activate it (as well as a normal/heroic difficulty) but the "part one" and "part two" are two different dungeons. Ex. There's City of Ash I while leveling where you're navigating a burning city and close a gate to Oblivion then at max you get City of Ash II has you take a direct path to the gate of Oblivion and instead of closing it this time, you enter it so instead of fighting a bunch of cultist in a burning city, you're playing Doom (2016) instead. Then there's normal and veteran difficulty of both dungeons and an extra challenge mode you can activate in veteran when you reach the last boss for added mechanics and scaling in exchange for extra loot/rewards.

[@Maria_Erias]

Yeah, I love ESO for the sheer scale of content it has. It doesn't have the tight combat of WoW, the narrative-driven story focus of FF14 or SWTOR, or the focus on open-world stuff that GW2 has, but it literally has more you can do than any other MMO out there. Everything from being an assassin with the Dark Brotherhood to all of the thief quests and heists with the Thieves' Guild to all of the dungeons, delves, crafting, resource farming, skyshard hunting, Cyrodiil mass PvP, focus arena PvP... It really is massive on a scale of things to do.

[@Xbob42]

@@Maria_Erias It is. It's a shame it doesn't play better. I struggle *really* hard to stay interested long enough to do anything in the game.

[@Maria_Erias]

@@Xbob42 Yeah. Combat just feels so loosey goosey. It's my least favorite part of the game. But sneaking and thievery, assassination, and playing the market to make millions are what draws me to that game now and then.

[@RyugaHidekiOrRyuzaki]

ESO is funny for me in that, I initially hated the idea of weaving light attacks inbetween skills and having to swap between your two weapon skillsets to complete your rotations. Then as I kept playing I really liked those two things because they make for a really fast paced action-y combat, that I haven't found anywhere else.

[@TemLightKiBlade]

You aren’t completely right on things here but I’m super glad your excited and insights are interesting even if your missing the point. That being said it is all mute when this ‘hard mode’ versions are no longer a thing in game cause it was just a way to have content when they didn’t have as much resources. They’ve steered away from dungeons all together with new types of content cause dungeons are kinda the most basic form of content in game lol. Not bad but basic.

[@hopper453]

They’re leaning away from Hard Mode dungeons in later expacs thanks to other content taking their place (i.e., Deep Dungeons, Bozja/Eureka, etc.) so this isn’t typical. ShB does away with HMs completely.

[@ownageDan]

the whole bozja storyline was a great replacement though, really enjoyed the critical engagements and raids.

[@WDSimp]

That's a shame. I actually quite like revisiting the old dungeons in new ways and I was hoping to see a few of the Stormblood dungeons get the same treatment.

[@kereminde]

@@ownageDan Isn't that the one with... the Red Comet?

[@nastycrimeboy9138]

@@kereminde I have PTSD from that

[@Keldiur]

@@ownageDan i fear for Bozja. Although I am a returner from heavensward, I am afraid Bojza will hit a nosedive in player engagement, especially if there is a road to 80 buff on servers. And with how the fates are scaled... Then again, never touched Eureka, so did they have a plan for this?

[@TheDigimon2000]

You technically go back to old dungeons if you're leveling other jobs, since they give alot of exp at that level

[@MaehDoggie]

There's actually quiet a few ARR dungeons that are entirely optional, alot of them are speak to random NPC X in town Y to get an intro quest, but if you just stick to MSQ for leveling then you'll never find them. xD Also you will be back to the first versions of those dungeons all the time if you play for awhile, even for max level characters.

[@TheToasterbox]

PSA: Harder form = Minimum item level. You would be suprised what new mechanics there are in dungeons when your dps isnt skipping phases and your heals are actually needed and your mitigations and correct execution is required

[@xtremefurrycat]

Coils has some of the more memorable fights and toward the end some crazy visuals in all the fights I have done in any MMORPG. It's such a fun classic and I had a blast doing them back in the day.

[@Shiro2809]

4:13 so unless I'm reading this wrong, it's more similar than just the thematic environment, for Copperbell being a mine system. If you pay enough attention you see yourself going through parts of the original dungeon, or some bosses being in the same areas as previous ones. You're literally taking a new or different path through the same dungeon because of time or something you did in the original one. I can't say for 100% if that applies to every one of them as it's been a long time since I've done a decent amount of them I believe the tracks you run across in Copperbell hard is directly off of the first boss area and you can see the tracks in your original run. It's really cool.

[@armswar8168]

Just further clarification on something Preach said in his video - the hard mode dungeons are actually completely optional. Only MSQ dungeons are mandatory. If you want to push forward through the MSQ for Endwalker release, you don't actually have to do all the hard modes in the game to progress.

[@cstaie85]

Preach, also know that the dungeons string together to weave a larger side story. Tam Tara Deepcroft ties into Hard with Edda from Satasha which ties to Palace of the Dead and they link to Amdapor keep and Lost city of Amdapor. The story is interlocked heavily.

[@KiIowatt]

Preach thinking he can get through the whole game running dungeons once is cute

[@xerxiesdaoc]

The day this video came out i jumped into preachs stream and he had about 45quest left in the msq b4 heavensward. Cant wait to see him do the coils and the rest of the arr msq quest

[@alexpaul4144]

Bro hard mode was the best thing I found out about so fucking cool

[@keremcantarhan]

Edda's return was the moment I absolutely fell in love with this game.

[@brianmanning5351]

In the event this was a recent occurrence, be sure to check out the ending of the first deep dungeon next then! Also, for a while at least, Edda's ghost was flickering in and out of a few spots in Gridania (and maybe other towns?) and making players ask what what going on.

[@Jenn-lq9yu]

You're actually going to be rerunning the earlier versions of the dungeons - just not yet. When you use things like Leveling Roulette to get big chunks of experience to cover certain level range stop gaps, you'll inevitably get each earlier version of a dungeon at some point. That's kind of where those dungeons sit, where the new versions are actually generally ran less because the level 50/60/70 roulette is generally less useful. You get a lot better Roulettes for farming Tomestones for gear.

[@Shaijn815]

My favourite hardmode from ARR is tam-tara the fact it references some early quests from gridania while feeling like an arc from berserk just was such a great experience for me.

[@_alex_y.not_]

WoW team makes excuses for underdelivering, FF14 team apologizes for not overdelivering.

[@RiseInAfterlife]

"My favourite wasthe Tonberrys!" [Angry Tam-Tara Deepcroft Hard noises]

[@LucyTheLizardWizard]

I still can't believe no one's told him that swiftcast Flare is barely worth using (if at all) and completely demolishes the smoothness of the rotation

[@zentyrant]

Dont need to backseat him as long as he dont play ice mage

[@Xbob42]

@@zentyrant Gonna spend all week doing big donos telling him that ice mage is most efficient because he never has to worry about mana and that the whole fire phase is just a gimmick trap for noobs.

[@zentyrant]

@@Xbob42 do it sir :pepega:

[@AsaelTheBeast]

5:09 If you haven't already done the scholar questline- consider doing so. It ties heavily into Nym, the Tonberrys, and what happened there. It's some pretty interesting lore bits. Nym, Ampador, and Mhach are predecessor civs responsible for the three main magic traditions of Arcanist, White, and Black magic. Not as influential as the Allagans (who are basically Not!Rome for this setting), but still very much historically relevant. Tam-Tara deepcroft (HM) was actually released around Halloween, IIRC. There is some more Edda story if you do the deep dungeon content "palace of the dead". Fun note- the "palace" in question is more or less a fallout shelter from a couple ages ago- the ancestors of modern Elezen hid there during a long lasting calamity that almost destroyed the world. Some Elezen (Duskwights) still live in some of the nicer shelters (We never actually get to see this though- just hear about it.)

[@xCyanosis]

Trust me Preach, the dungeons are definitely not things you realistically farm for gear, even at end game. Maybe if you want glams, but otherwise, tomestones are your primary source of good gear if you're not raiding.

[@zarkento4881]

Yes, until your capped for the week on the latest tomes and want to gear alt jobs without waiting.

[@ChaosLightspeed]

Which... you get by running those dungeons/raids/whathaveyou. Technically, you are still farming them for gear.

[@ragezero6853]

@@zarkento4881 I believe you can buy/make crafted gear for that. Like the 510 exarchic HQ crafted gear is arguably much better than what any of the end-game dungeons drop.

[@xCyanosis]

@@ChaosLightspeed Which isn't in the same vein that he means. You're usually just doing expert roulette 5 times a week and calling it done there. Even then, you aren't farming them in the same frame as you are in WoW where you actively want the gear that is specifically from these instances vs. FF14 where you're only getting these dungeons randomly and get a currency from doing them.

[@zarkento4881]

@@ragezero6853 yes you certainly can

[@TheRealLink]

Awesome Preach! Yeah Hard Modes retelling the early dungeons are an awesome treat from WoW's style for sure. Eventually hard mode becomes the norm (just like Primals) but we still do continue to get a dungeon or two every patch. As more content has been added to the game and the (relative) complexity of dungeons and things grows, they are slowly trimming that back, which is fine. Also not *every* dungeon in ARR is required via story. You have Halitali, Cutter's Cry, Aurum Vale, and a host of others that are optional. But they are all certainly beautiful, sound great, and are fun to do! Can't wait to hear your thoughts as you get closer toward Heavensward and also doing the Coils!

[@masha8770]

Temper your excitement a little bit, they have been dialing back dungeon releases over the expansions as they looked to diversify gameplay. (Such as PotD, Diadem/Eureka etc. these were all added in HW and later expacs, ARR literally only had dungeons, raids & trials, even Gold Saucer was only added in ARR 2.51) Aside from the x.0 released dungeons (1 story finale, 2 initial expert roulettes), the following pattern can be observed: ARR: 1 original dungeon, 2 HM dungeons per patch, all except 2 are unrelated to the msq. 15 total in the patch cycle. HW: 1 OG dungeon, 1 HM dungeon per patch, all OG dungeons are linked to the msq. 10 total in the patch cycle. SB: release pattern of 1-2-1-2-1, with OG dungeons every patch, but only 1st and last being msq linked. Only 2 HM dungeons. 7 total in the patch cycle. SHB: 1 OG dungeon per patch, no HM dungeons, every OG dungeon is linked to msq. 5 total in the patch cycle. Now, overall the systems & combat in the dungeons has evolved for the better, but it is a shame that they have completely phased out the HM dungeons it seems. We'll see if that remains so in Endwalker. Personally I loved the HW release pattern the most, it made expert roulette 100% fresh with every patch cycle.

[@masha8770]

@@edwardben-eboh4787 yep, diversified content is great, but it is a shame to miss out on HM dungeon stories. Plus expert roulette can get stale.

[@Ryotsu2112]

The main advantage to unlocking all these dungeons is that you have a larger pool to draw on when doing daily dungeon roulettes. It’s makes it less predictable as to what you will get.

[@BottledDelusion]

I still feel like I get regular copperbell 2 out of every 5 dungeons in first bracket. For that reason I now avoid doing that roulette at all most days

[@Ryotsu2112]

@@BottledDelusion Makes sense. Most new people are doing that one while leveling.

[@UnwrittenNoise]

He should really do the story-heavy bit of PotD with a group at some point.

[@cattysplat]

There is story in potd? As someone who avoids mindless grinds with a passion, is it worth it?

[@UnwrittenNoise]

@@cattysplat It's a continuation of another story, one from ARR. It's fun, but not important. Although to be honest, just running the story part in a matched party takes almost no time. You get the story first time through PotD. No need go grind it further.

[@mosselyn5081]

Actually, not every dungeon is part of the story. Every dungeon HAS a story, but there are some that are not tied to the MSQ. You unlock them separately through blue unlock quests. Don't quote me on this (I'm barely out of sprouthood myself), but I don't think EVERY dungeon has a hard mode, just a few. GW2 did something similar with their "hard mode" dungeons: Each one has multiple, new, hard-mode-only paths, and you can choose which path you want to run on hard mode. Of course, they pretty much abandoned their dungeons after launch, but it was a cool way to re-use the environments while keeping the content fresh.

[@DuelerIsKing]

Can't you just do min ilvl if you want a more challenging dungeon experience? I mean if you think of it like that we not only have normal (pt.1) and hard (pt.2) but a "challenge" mode for every single one of them on top of that.

[@aeo-gard]

minilvl for most dungeons is barely harder than otherwise, though, in my opinion I'm of the opinion that I would prefer more leveling dungeons to have their level cap equivalent that's just "harder", even if it's not "hard mode". I just think some more potentially challening 4 man content would be cool, because even "Expert" roulette dungeons are inevitably braindead

[@Vera_Nova]

@@aeo-gard will also note, min ilvl also syncs your level last time I checked. Wanted to see about trying some older raids with similar damage values to launch but with my current kit (summoner just feels so wrong before 80 now lol) and realized that just wasn't how it worked. May be different for content within an expansion, but eh.

[@aeo-gard]

@@Vera_Nova well, minilvl specifically only syncs your item level down since you already have to "sync" your level down to use it as an additional option, but especially when classes are built for 80/90 and youre doing level 50 content, sometimes its a bit wank. but still good imo

[@Graendal]

I can't wait for him to get to Coils and experience the true fear of the Nael Daes Darnus experience. The last phase of that is still crazy, even compared to a lot of newer savage content.

[@shanegrayson7068]

I hope to god he runs T6-9 Savage. I bet those are still extremely tough, especially when milvl and synched.

[@KopeAcetic]

One counter argument to your argument about the newer version being the farmable version - people don't farm specific dungeons unless they're goin for a specific set of glamour. In FFXIV - EVERY dungeon is "farmable" but the community does it through the roulette system which opens up every piece of content you've ever done with increased rewards for the stage your character is currently at.

[@ragezero6853]

Not to mention that we don't farm the dungeons for gear, at least not at max level. We get gears from exchanging tomestones or from crafting and get ready for savage raiding.

[@moggiosven]

Thank you for being so thorough!

[@dannyboi7877]

You still have things really wrong. The lvl 50s aren’t the “farmable dungeons.” That’s simply not how this game works. You will do the first version dungeons just as much (actually more) as the lvl 50 dungeons because of roulettes.

[@JohnDCrafton]

When 50 was the level cap, those dungeons were the Expert Roulette, just like level 80 dungeons are now. They really were the farm dungeons.

[@NerdlySquared]

There is like half a dozen different “random dungeon finders” at the end, with different pools of difficulties/versions of dungeons in each one, which include dungeons from the start of the game to the finish. With relevant end game currencies from each different pool you choose. You don’t just “farm” the latest slug of the few latest of them like in WoW at different difficulties, that is just a tiny part of what is available to you. Have to forget the very limited WoW mind rails here, it really works very differently.

[@dannyboi7877]

@@NerdlySquared yeah I’ve been playing since ARR. the part you are forgetting is that the roulettes worth the most exp etc are leveling and main scenario. Those are the most played. Therefore lvl 50 dungeons are not played as often. There is almost no reason to do the lvl 50 dungeon roulette as the rewards are extremely minimal compared to other roulettes. Also, the most played “first time content” is the levelling stuff, as every player must play them, but many skip the lvl 50 and lv 60 dungeons etc. So even in things like mentor roulettes that encompass everything, you will still get that content more than lvl 50 dungeons.

[@dannyboi7877]

@@JohnDCrafton yeah, that was years ago. No longer applicable.

[@JohnDCrafton]

@@dannyboi7877 if you paid attention to the video you supposedly watched, that's exactly what he was saying. these _were_ farming dungeons. past tense.

[@JMulls]

Absolutely love watching Preach react to stuff we kind of take for granted or forgot about since it's from ARR. Hard mode dungeons were/are such a really cool idea.

[@luchts4547]

Not to be one of those "hey mr streamer you should do this content" but if you like the story of Edda you'll want to do the optional Palace of the Dead eventually.

[@kurisutihart8386]

"I don't know what's gonna happen to Edda" ...you poor poor man

[@xekete3776]

Take your time and enjoy the content! Dont let people rush you

[@Saimeren]

I love Edda's story line in Palace of the Dead.

[@boothbytcd6011]

Preach, not every dungeon is required for the story, at least in ARR. You never have to go to Wanderer's Palace or Amadpor or Pharos Sirus (just off the top of my head, there are probably others) and all of those have Hard Modes as well.

[@ur3sh11]

There's also Shiva and Ramuh Extreme. And on top of that, the hardest content of ARR is the Coils of Bahamut which is actually SUPPPEEEEER important story stuff that ties off the entire plot of 1.0 and ARR

[@astrafallen7973]

I enjoy doing undersize parties so you can take on the dungeon or trial by yourself you can lvl synch or keep your lvl at max and take it on. You get the main weapons and gear for defeating it but you won't get exp if you don't lvl synch.

[@hkoizumi3134]

Love the video! Keep them coming! At this point of the Journey, trying to expect wow things in FFXIV will always leave you with a surprise. But from a FFXIV veteran's point of view, some of us are starting to ask was WoW actually even a game at this point because ex-wow gamers are so impressed about a mundane things in FFXIV.

[@normalmighty]

TBH, while a lot of praise is well deserved and FF14 is awesome, I feel like a big chunk of new players gushing over it were somehow completely unaware of the major flaws in WoW, and are mind blown that any game exists without some very WoW-specific flaws. They could go to almost any other popular game and be just as shocked.

[@Exxy6965]

Nice avatar...

[@SuprUsrStan]

Here's the thing about these hard modes. Back in 1.0 dungeons were the size of WoW's Mega Dungeons or old school vanilla dungeons. Think Karazhan, Scholomance, BRD. In 2.0, they sliced up these big dungeons and streamlined it often just a quarter or a third the original size, think Return to Karazhan Lower or Upper. That gave the team a lot of assets they could easily create a different hard mode with the unused assets.This is something that is unique to ARR dungeons.

[@otone7seven]

These videos are absolutely awesome. Loovveeee listening to you go through FF14, been a long time fan and as much as I liked wow I've played FF14 since ARR and it's so exciting to see this. You're awesome Mike keep it up

[@DarthSoto78]

Thing is when you reach endgame, and you are tombstone grinding, or if you level another class all those dungeons can come up in your roulette. Old, and hard versions. Basically every dungeon in the game can come up at endgame, and it is totally random what roulette will come up.

[@unfairbullet]

Man I was just checking last night if there was a new Preach video

[@a.parreira6934]

To my memory i think that tonberry dungeon conclusion was the first custom one they did/ i saw. I Love those custom victory fanfare endings! Even when they are sad.

[@kicore9624]

Hey Preach, I hope that you and others see this. You mentioned that max level dungeons are the “farmable” dungeons. While you may be technically right, daily roulette makes use of every dungeon and provides you with much more BiS currency than you would get by just farming end game dungeons. Yes, you can farm the dungeons, but doing the roulettes daily over the course of a week will get you BiS gear for levels 50, 60, and 70. Time referenced 6:30

[@thovarisk8699]

you can see Eda in Gridania sometimes as a ghost that appears sometimes in the distance, i've seen her like once.

[@DifunctedReble]

I love seeing these reactions. Also, I'm sure it has been mentioned before just haven't seen it, give farming the Primal EX a try for their respective mounts. The accompanying boss music while riding them and the mount you get for unlocking them all is a real treat. Happy hunting. o/

[@wendykosak1988]

They don't wrap up the tonberry story until the healer quest line in Shadowbringer. If you play scholar, you get the entire story behind the tonberries that include a "some day in the future we need to fix this" and then they go back to that on the First.

[@monkeygamerzofficial3012]

The first time I saw that Tonberry ending I was shook too

[@acevang7380]

Edda becomes a ghost that you can find at certain spots around the 3 main cities.

[@Fabbychama]

Honestly, seeing you enjoy yourself and the game brings me great joy! Really happy for you, Mike!

[@thesciencemobile]

Hard modes for dungeons have slowly been phased out as they have trimmed back the number of dungeons released each patch. For reference, back in ARR we got 3 dungeons a patch, but now we only get one (as they have moved resources from the dungeon team to creating new types of content).

[@DeepbloodFang]

To continue the Tonberry story even further, you would need to experience the Scholar lvl 50-70 storyline, it delves deep into the tonberry lore. As for a continuation to Eddas story arc, you would need to do Palace of the Dead up to floor 50. This is what I love about FXIV, everything is somehow connected. If there is a loose end from a previous story, even multiple expansions ago, you can bet your new hairs that the writing team is gonna find a way to incorporate it and eventually tie that loose end up.

[@robertmarsh5322]

As a note the hard mode dungeons do tend to follow the same themes of the original, gameplay wise. Take your tonberry dungeon example. The trash has focus positioning with the giant tonberry and the banners later. Gotta move the fight around. And again the same with the final boss. It's all about migrating the boss, away from the slow ads in the orig and away from the banners in hard. In both cases some selective kills are also needed.

[@lens_hunter]

I've been playing this game since 2.0 Beta and I still find stuff out all the time.

[@DarktoothDD]

“This is old content, your not likely to farm it or run it more than once…” Hehehe, that’s what you think!

[@chrisbaldwin8570]

Glad you are having fun. Levie Extreme basically takes away the walls so you can fall off and not be able to be ressed, adds dps checks in the form of adds that hysteria the raid if not killed quickly enough, and makes you go through a few more shield cycles than normal so there is a lot more raid damage over the baseline fight. I think if your group can stay on the platform and focus target quickly and efficiently you guys should have the boss killed in about an hour. If your group can't do that, well you can't res people who fall off so mistakes there prohibit learning the other mechanics of the fight and could easily drag out the time and make dps checks that much harder to meet. I really loved the Hard Mode dungeon idea. If you have all these assets it makes sense to reconfigure them into new and quick content to give your players more experiences to do. Hard Modes were originally envisioned to basically be our Heroic Dungeons from Wraith, spammable content that is harder but more rewarding than baseline dungeons to gear you out for raids. The newest expansion does not use Hard Mode dungeons as they focus instead on raid content of various sizes and other side activities with the content being balanced so you don't have to spam dungeons for gear even a fraction of the old amount. Either way, good luck on your adventures in FF14 and have a wonderful day.

[@Aisaaax]

Not every dungeon is part of the story. There are several dungeons that open up with a "+" blue quest that are completely optional, but they're still cool.

[@cas6382]

ARR had 3 dungeons per patch and they were new dungeons and while the future xpacs reduced the amount of added dungeons per patch they started to to do other types of endgame content such as Eureka, Bozja, the Ishgard Restoration effort, etc. You don't run dungeons for their gear though its for the tomestones/valor points that you spend to buy the gear you actually want and there are daily roulletes that send you randomly into a selection for great rewards so you'll be back. Also most of the dungeons were optional though and not part of the MSQ.

[@Jepegish]

So glad you're enjoying FF Mike. See you in Endwalker (hopefully). You have 36 days until early access which SHOULD be enough time granted you put in a couple hours a day.

[@TheAssirra]

He won't get there, not even close. Remember that he has been playing 2(3?) weeks and has not even gotten to HW and still has a ton of end game content in ARR.

[@Jepegish]

@@TheAssirra I mean it took me roughly a month to beat the whole game (MSQ). I also did most optional content (Alexander, Ivalice, Sky Pirate arc etc). It's very possible considering ARR is the 2nd longest expac in the game. Then again, I put in 8 hours a day. Preach is a pretty busy man.

[@thriftingtonpost]

You'll still get to see all the normal modes again if you ever have a reason to run the Duty Roulette. The roulette is great for leveling alts and grinding tomestones, so if you keep playing XIV there'll come a time when you'll see all the old dungeons again.

[@ALusivar]

I've seen some comments roughly about it, but just to drive the point home; when you reach the endgame and really start replaying dungeons, they are all "farmable" usually. Tomestones are usually the end-game gear grind, instead of just farming specific dungeons. Tomestones are gained from a variety of activities; endgame dungeons do usually give them, but you also gain them from participating in early content when you are max level. As such, you CAN run the dungeons that you love, at their set difficulty, and not only progress your own character but other newer players as well!

[@k.vn.k]

I love tanking that last boss in Wanderer Palace Hard mode - moving around the circle clockwise. It's a dps check too before he covered the whole floor with his totem aura.

[@nickizgr8]

Not all dungeons are part of the MSQ. Cutter's Cry being one example. Another example is Lost City of Amdapor which is an optional Level 50 dungeon, which gets a hard mode version in Heavensward.

[@ciaranmadden9469]

The story of the few in stromblood is the best example I think Swallows Compass my fave the soundtrack rocks 😁

[@kellynine1066]

1) WoW's Don a version of the part1/part 2 system a couple of times. The ZG and ZA revamps did it the wrong way (by removing the old version entirely), but Return to Karazhan follows the same approach FF14 does. I think the main reason the normal modes aren't scaled up is because low level dungeons don't stop being relevant as quickly as they do in other MMOs due to the job system. The normal modes leveling dungeons give better xp than the endgame (50/60/70] dungeons, so until you level cP all your jobs, you still have a reason to go back and due them level-synced. You will see those dungeons many, many more times as you go. I get Copperbell normal on my leveling queues about every fifth roulette I do. I've yet to see the HM without queuing specifically for it.

[@emikochan13]

I loved leviathan extreme so much, and that was with echo, I'm sure you'll love it :)

[@KZorander]

The ending cutscene in WP Hard is the best cutscene in the entire game, change my mind.

[@FeatherWriters]

Hey Preach, I've been loving following your journey into FFXIV and I'm glad you're having a good time! If ever possible, it might be a good idea to try to get someone more familiar with FFXIV endgame to "consult" on some videos like this though, since there's things that new players don't really have full context for. I know others in the comments have already pointed these things out, but stuff like the fact that the later expansions have moved away from the "hard mode" dungeon sequels in favor of new non-dungeon content instead, or the fact that endgame players ABSOLUTELY still find themselves running ARR early dungeons because they're part of the endgame daily roulettes. While I'm sure it's amusing for us veterans to smile at sprout misunderstandings for some of this stuff, I think it might help your WoW-focused viewers get a better idea of what the dungeon experience is actually like. No worries if it wouldn't work out, I just thought you might find it helpful!