Rivers Cuomo's Anti-Pedal Approach to "Only in Dreams" | Shred with Shifty Podcast

"I don't use effects," Rivers Cuomo states, matter-of-factly, to Chris Shiflett on this second episode of Shred With Shifty. That might come as a bit of a shock to all the Weezer fans out there who went and bought a Big Muff in an effort to imitate the alt-rock guitarist's sound. For his tones on the band’s famous debut album, he went straight into his amp, and the only effect heard on that record, he says, was a bit of delay on the swells in "Only in Dreams."
The outro solo to "Only in Dreams," the final song on the album, is the subject of this ep. And after the guitarists spend a few minutes discussing Cuomo's inspirations, influences, and the production of both that album and the band's sleeper success, Pinkerton, Cuomo walks Shifty through the solo lick by lick. There's the sequence of octaves high up on the neck, colored by an unexpectedly placed major 7th chord ... and Cuomo's vibrato, which reminds Chris of Brian May. What shapes a guitarist's vibrato? “Must have something to do with your nerves between your brain and your fingers,” Cuomo says.
Before the recording of the album at Electric Lady Studios in NYC, Weezer's label insisted they work with a producer, which Cuomo rejected at first. Then he heard the Cars' "Just What I Needed" in the supermarket one day, and sought out the band's guitarist, Ric Ocasek. Ocasek was the one to push Cuomo to record an outro solo over the previously stripped-down, rhythm-section-based final three minutes of "Only in Dreams." After weeks of Ocasek's encouragement, Cuomo found himself alone in the studio one weekend and improvised his way through the solo. "This might be hard to believe, but when we started out, we were much more like a hippie band," Cuomo explains, describing his past devotion to Trey Anastasio. As it turns out, part of the "Only in Dreams" solo came out of Weezer's jamming portions of the song during their live shows.
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Producer: Jason Shadrick
Executive Producers: Brady Sadler and Jake Brennan for Double Elvis
Engineering support by Matt Tahaney and Matt Beaudion
Video Editors: Dan Destefano and Addison Sauvan
Special thanks to Chris Peterson, Greg Nacron, and the entire Volume.com crew.

[@tr_murf4399]

Pretty hard to overstate how important the Blue Album was to those who started picking up guitars in the early-2000s. Everybody my age knows how to play 2-3 songs off that record off the cuff, because they all covered ‘em in high school bands. “Only in Dreams” is probably my favorite closing song ever.

[@SO-ym3zs]

So true. I learned all the rhythm parts and had a blast playing along with the whole album. A great feeling for a budding musician.

[@hamsandwichson]

Definitely! When I figured out that open string thing in the riff to Say it ain't So I was so damn happy w myself!

[@GlennJimenez]

“Say it ain’t so”

[@lw1391]

Was oblivious to this at the time but I really wish now that they used standard tuning

[@hamsandwichson]

@@lw1391 haha same.

[@bscepter]

Love how he totally gives Ric Ocasek credit for Weezer's massive guitar sound.

[@TheOtherJCBroadcast]

Yes I’m glad Rivers came around to understanding Ric had the bands best interest in mind. Back in the Pinkerton days Rivers use to bemoan the fact that Buddy Holly is actually a tragic song and Ric pushed them to make it upbeat. I totally get where Rivers was coming from but Ric knew how the whole album should feel

[@SecretSpots]

Indirectly he was giving Eliot Easton credit

[@Hejirah]

Video editors: How many intros do you want in the first 4 minutes? Producers: Yes.

[@danh2696]

I’ve never seen an interview with Rivers before and he is exactly how I hoped he’d be. So present, clear-headed, and mindful. And his touch on the guitar is absolutely beautiful.

[@robbocat7643]

Definitely don't check any 90s interviews with him then lmao

[@seanmartinez6908]

If it seems cool to you the podcast episode he did with Conan O'Brien is also very good

[@MrMotherfuck123]

Exactly. He was open af.

[@clubzak]

Damn, this dude had the vision, went for it, and f’n nailed it.Listening to that build up + solo at 15 was like a religious experience almost. Thanks for putting this together 🙏🏻.

[@bristlefist]

Music totally is a spiritual experience and that song for me was also a perfect distillation of that. I remember listening to it in my bedroom at 15 and feeling this rush of all these different powerful emotions. It was overwhelming and awesome

[@cheeseburns11]

Pinkerton is an absolute gem. I never understood how it wasn’t received better. Such a great album and production. The hidden map in the disc holder too was epic at the time.

[@seanmckelvey6618]

It's a great album, but it was a pretty big departure from things like "Buddy Holly" and "Say it aint so". Lyrically I think it put quite a few people off, simply because of how emotionally honest Rivers was. I can understand why it was received poorly, but I still think it's a better record than Blue.

[@moustachio334]

​@@seanmckelvey6618Rivers developed an opiates addiction post leg surgery during the writing of Pinkerton. It was a hard time for the band.

[@buzzcrushtrendkill]

It's not uncommon, movies, music, that become more popular in time. Not immediately embraced upon release. Many of my favorite albums didn't grab me the very first time I listened.

[@AaronEddieHYo]

​@@moustachio334I don't think that was a part of any strife. The main point that was ever made by anybody related to the band was that the Percocets contributed to writing amazing songs.

[@Snowflake-hg1tn]

Pinkerton is the best album

[@davidarless7865]

Legendary song-writer. Very nice human being. If I could pick any famous musician to be friends with, it would be Rivers.

[@kylewagoner]

This ruuuuules. Every question, the gear talk, Blue and Pinkerton backstory, insights, lead and musical theory breakdown. 10/10

[@chrisjensen1380]

Such a cool idea to interview a guitar player and and have them teach one of their solos. This show is pure gold and I love hearing a guitar player interview another guitar player. I loved the Alex Lifeson episode. Shifty, keep doing what you’re doing! 👊

[@stanknugget]

There are so many better Rivers Cuomo solos, though.

[@johnjohnsonf739]

@@stanknugget bad take only in dreams is goated

[@stanknugget]

@@johnjohnsonf739 No.

[@DW-xt7vz]

This is the best thing I’ve ever seen on Weezer’s guitar thought process. Truly an amazing and important documentation of American music history - well done!

[@andrewpappas9311]

I’ve always been a fan of River’s playing and songwriting, super talented dude and Only In Dreams is one of my favourite songs with one of my favourite bass parts

[@lillymayer6114]

The bass though. Yes.

[@andrewpappas9311]

@@lillymayer6114 Such a killer bass line, yeah. So fucking good

[@DaddyDepression]

Chris thanks so much for hanging out with Rivers, he was very kind to me and my kids while on tour in Australia, what an amazing career he has had. An unusual perspective of playing and music. Thanks again Chris.

[@infn8loopmusic]

The phish influence makes a lot of sense in terms of modality and the brightness of it. You can hear it. it must have taken so much restraint to take the jam band mentality and make iconic alt rock songs that essentially become a staple "pop" 3.5 minute classics. What amazing compositions, absolutely genius.

[@Eth_C]

Dam so cool to hear how Rivers evolved as a guitar player and how to play the guitar parts in only in dreams. Was really interesting to hear how he initially mostly used the neck pickup since most of not all live videos I’ve seen show Rivers mostly playing on the bridge. Guess using bridge pickup on Rick’s les paul special and junior really influenced his tones further on. Also hopefully Chris can get Rivers that signature fender. If anyone should make a signature guitar (or 10) it’s Rivers.

[@bengooch4306]

I have to say that this is my favorite new podcast. Absolutely incredible! Chris is such a good interviewer and he asks the best questions. Great job guys!

[@MaxPrehl]

Even Rivers was impressed that he knew about the Warmouth 😂

[@drewnorth3816]

Damn, I loved this interview. Brings me back to when I first started playing, learning to the blue album. So cool to hear some about the recording of it. And also just amazing to hear two accomplished, really cool guitar players, chatting about the craft.

[@iDannyism]

I just saw Weezer play live under a month ago and they were amazing. Like, I've seen 20 shows this year, and they are in the top 3 for sure. Amazing vibe and Rivers is a riot up there.

[@ChrisMedici]

This is amazing - an incredible opportunity to listen to Rivers and Chris talk about their influences and get a "behind the scene" glimpse of what it was like to produce one of the best debut albums of all time. Plus, the nugget about the lyrics for Pet Sounds was mind blowing - thanks to all for putting this podcast together! Keep 'em coming. 🤘

[@user-ks8ux4ig6b]

I'm not a guitarist but Chris is such a great interviewer. This was fun...

[@Burakami]

Man this was so good. That solo was the first time I figured out using octaves. Thanks for putting this together. Im actually feeling quite emotional in a good way. Love you both ❤

[@rabidhamster]

Best Premier Guitar video in history. Thanks Chris and Rivers! I'd love to see another couple hours of this.

[@markmattheviewable]

This show is incredible, Mr. Shiflett. I just experienced your band and Rivers' band here in Ottawa during Bluesfest, and as always was in awe of the effortless guitar and crowd handling both of you displayed. I have definitely submitted the show request on your website for a possible solo show here. Looking forward to hearing more of your solo work in October.

[@EdwardHarrisonphotos]

Ditto

[@jasonreed3739]

Fantastic! I loved seeing Rivers que up certain sections of the song and listening carefully. That kind of real-time dynamic between him and Chris really drew me in. Another example of that flavor was the two of them trading licks for a few turns. An authentic exchange . . . so great! Chris is handling these conversations beautifully.

[@JustinLesamiz]

The word is 'cue'. FYI.

[@cuteasxtreme]

@@JustinLesamizqueue*

[@jeffdixon847]

Que?

[@saraujo2]

Thank You Chris. The show is very nice and have a lot of information for guitar players. Long life!

[@crestfaIIen]

What an awesome episode! So many interesting insights especially into the making of the blue album and the pinkerton area. Thanks for this collaboration!

[@uncleant3780]

Please make the Rivers Sig happen! You KNOW we all slapped together Eddie/Rivers/Billie Joe humbucker partscasters that defined a lot of us and would love to get something with his ACTUAL specs!

[@danthegeetarman]

Amazing interview. Every time I had a question pop up in my head like “hope he asks this” you would ask right after. Love this show 🙌🙌

[@seaofbabiesmusic]

Yeah Shifty! This interview was awesome! Love what you’re doing here, you and Rivers have been huge influences of mine, thank you sir!

[@jimboyokel]

Great interview! I loved Pinkerton when it came out.

[@kleeklee4572]

I am an Asian American who grew up with grunge in middle school. I always loved rock and even played guitar in high school. Then I went to an art school and met people who could really play… it made me stop trying haha! But I’ve always had love of this craft. I’m not even a wanna be I’m what you would call a “wish to be” and I can’t get enough of these rock KZbin channels. Weeper blue album was a nonstop play for years for me in my definitive years.

[@bryanfrombuffalo7685]

The green cd

[@CoachSet]

This show is straight gold!! I smile the whole way through the episodes because it’s fun to hear these legends just be chill and talk music. Shifty you rock!!🤘🏾🤘🏾

[@shreddyvedder]

Amazing show Shifty!! My whole family was glued to the TV watching this interview. Keep up the great work 🤘🎸🤘

[@jaricklosey4607]

This is the best format I’ve seen for interviews! Love the inside talk on early alt rock too. Great interview!

[@fotog04]

That was fantastic, Chris!! Your work is greatly appreciated!🤘🤘🤘

[@jakegideon5249]

This interview is mind-blowingly fantastic! Thank you both so much!

[@seanmarshallmusic]

I feel like Im just watching Chris get lessons from his peers and idols. Fantastic.

[@naryanclaudy2116]

Man I LOVE the questions you are asking . These are the same things that I would be wanting to ask, because you are tapping into an actual feeling and trying to recapture an era rather than just gather information! Thank you!!!

[@bernieolszewski4963]

Thank you for doing these I dig the background and the Q an A the most! Thanks Shifty

[@brianpulham4033]

Great show, I wasn't sure you would be able to top Walking the Floor, but you're killing it. I'll never doubt you again, thanks Mr. Shiflett!!!

[@officespace123]

Thank you so much for doing this - i was a huge weezer fan nearly 25 years ago now, and spent a long time trawling the internet back then for snippets of info during their pre green album hiatus, and their (very good) tab books of blue and pinkerton were a big part of my early guitar learning - so to see Rivers talk through this stuff was very special; i also really appreciate the questions Chris asked, which helped steer the conversation really nicely (good mix of gear specifics and personal anecdotes). in case you're taking requests for future guests to talk then Billy Corgan (endless tracks to choose from but Hummer or Porcelina would be great) Ritchie Sambora

[@richarde3378]

This was a great interview. Thanks, Chris!

[@drb0813]

This is an awesome series, keep 'em coming!

[@matta.4816]

I love this format!! Keep up the great work!!!

[@evanmiller2579]

This is amazing. Chris you are a natural at this format. Rivers is just too cool for school. Really enjoyed this. Thanks so much.

[@ctothegiles]

This was such a good interview! 2 of my favorite Guitar players playing the soundtrack to my childhood. Chris such a great job interviewing. Rivers amazing, need I say more! Thank you both for this!

[@gamewithweezer2677]

Getting my question in this episode was a nice surprise. Favorite song all time as well. Extremely thankful Chris. Awesome episode. - Keith

[@meliascr]

this was so much fun, thanks!!! hope both of you come to Chile anytimae soon

[@reubenacciano]

RC is bang on. I was a pure metal guy, 18 in 1991 and that year Gish dropped, Nevermind dropped. hearing those 2 LPs *blew my mind* and were a gateway drug to so much more, i more or less put metal aside - still loved heavy, but with different emphasis and intelligence - and went down a deep alt rock/indie music hole for years. it *was* pretty much overnight for me. Blue album was a couple of years later but completely changed how i looked at guitar tone.

[@chickendrop]

Shifty and Cuomo! Two of my long time favorites! Incredible interview, incredible subject!

[@user-hu8gy4fu6u]

This is probably the best and most quality show on KZbin in quite some time. Keep it up shifty

[@danielolivarria2312]

Definitely keep this series going! Love the content! Shifty is the man🤘

[@ke4nyv]

Ah, man! Thank you for doing this, Chris! I'm a huge fan of yours and I have been a huge fan of Weezer and Rivers since the Blue Album came out. I learned to play guitar in the early 90's sitting for hours figuring out the Blue Album songs. This was a real treat to hear Rivers talk guitar tech. If he comes back on, please ask him to run through The World Has Turned and Left Me Here, my absolute favorite Weezer song. =w=

[@DogGuy19]

I'm a long time fan of Rivers Cuomo. This is freaking awesome!!! You did a great job, Shifty, and I'll be checking more (probably ALL) of these. Thanks much for doing this, it made my day.

[@schmargle]

Man, I really enjoy these interviews. Keep ‘em coming.

[@trapperjakk]

Fantastic Episode Shifty!! Enjoyed this interview greatly with me not having much knowledge about Rivers.

[@seanamcdermott7122]

Couple friends and I took a little trip a few weeks ago to see weezer and this song was right at the peak of the show, amazing!

[@AZFunk]

Keep them coming, love these.

[@TheMatSignal.]

Awesome show! Saw Weezer play this song live in Auckland New Zealand and it was one of my all time greatest live music experiences- goosebumps!

[@brianwooten5022]

Such a great show! Keep em coming!

[@jeremynebraska]

Such a good song!! It always sends chills up and down my spine when I hear it. And I listen to it almost every day. It’s so good!!

[@fudsterhomme]

Yes Shifty! Please keep doing this, amazing interview and fave new podcast. What a ledge Rivers is.

[@bwa_8]

I could have watched this for several hours. That's a very cool show. 👌

[@pamstewart7243]

Relatively new Foos fan and very new Weezer fan. Love this new podcast; have loved the Walking the Floor podcast as well. Really appreciate the sense of joy in playing and learning that your brought out in this episode. BTW, vibrato can be caught from observation or taught -- consider the millions of people who play violin, viola, cello etc.

[@nicksorenson912]

Amazing - best I’ve seen with content - well done man!

[@thebarnardfamily1965]

Great interview! One of the best I have seen. As someone who is a hug Weezer fan and a guitar player this was perfect.

[@swaffy101]

I really enjoyed this! I never would have guessed he was such a nice guy. Great job Chris! I want to see you do some No Use for a Name!

[@sbadolian]

Randy was my neighbor growing up and is the reason I got into guitar. Once he got famous I asked him for s blizzard lesson and he wrote s bunch down for me. Many people have a lot of his stuff wrong. It’s now part of my shrine of stuff I had of his.

[@MaxPrehl]

Dude! If you're for real you should post that stuff!

[@sbadolian]

@@MaxPrehl It’s mostly just old guitar lesson shit. nothing super pretty or glamorous lol

[@Tony-Jabroni]

Just discovered this, and it is awesome! I could listen to these all day!

[@ddawson5793]

Another fantastic interview!!

[@PerceptionIsland]

Really cool listening to these guys geek out over such detail. Wish I could have a 1/4 of that talent. Great video

[@littledittymusic727]

This was super interesting! Thank you Chris and Rivers! Love WEEZER!

[@Mexi_Productions]

This was great! Thank you for doing this!

[@scottsunders]

Awesome show. Keep them coming!

[@tomconklinvo]

Great show!!! Rivers rocks and Pinkerton is a true favorite! No doubt!

[@ConradFactor]

What a great show. These artists are so at home and comfortable with Shifty.

[@butlem12]

Shifty gave a great interview! I need more of these two. Subscribed. Would love to hear more about Shiftys punk days with NUFAN and Me First. I think he probably played with Lagwagon too. Oh and Foo Fighters. The guy is a legend.

[@praetentious2925]

This has been really helpful and interesting to listen to. You’re a good interviewer and I appreciate cuomos openness to sharing his magic powers! Thanks

[@coreywhitacre6581]

My new favorite podcast, love it!

[@Silkysime]

This is the best youtube video I've watched all year

[@obdmpod]

Great conversation and insight. Keep up the great work

[@izeoftheworld41]

Chris, mannnn you were asking all the right questions. Thanks for this interview!

[@mattg629]

Uh, there is not one thing I don't love about this show. Not one thing. You are a natural host. Thanks so much for doing this!!!

[@DustinRadtke]

This interview was incredible! Great job, man!

[@jackshittle]

I know you'll eventually tweak some things with the format of this show, but from prospective it is already an A++. I'm a bassist (32 yrs) so I tune in to watch, but I have to say I knew nothing about Shifty beforehand, only that he was in Foo Fighters & he seemed like a super cool, chillax guy - but I had no idea that could interview other guitarists with such skill and all in a laid back manner to where it's serious but with some laughs sprinkled in throughout the interview. And he asks all the right types of questions. Keep these fantastic videos coming, cheers!

[@Winner1270]

Amazing interview!

[@JesseNorellMusic]

Chris! I love that this happened in 2023. My mind is blown! I was bummed that you skipped over the "leapfrogging" section of the solo after talking about it though. I've always wanted to figure it out. It's such an amazing idea and so well executed.

[@VernsHobbies]

Learned the entire Blue Album top to bottom in high school and started a cover band that we then started playing our own stuff. Loved this interview

[@CraigVanSickleAK]

What a great interview. Thanks!

[@LicksoftheLegend]

That was awesome. Loved the questions. 🎸

[@mattosborne1366]

This is amazing! What crazy insight, Thanks.

[@MoreMeRecording]

These guys have always been just so *fun* and I always appreciate guys where there music couldn't be further removed from their influences and just do their own thing. Weezer have always just done their own thing,

[@kevinalexpeek4020]

43:25 even in this context, when he bends up to that D, I still get chills! Next to his Conan interview, this has to be the best Rivers interview.

[@GhostFace_OG]

I love this - I grew up in the 90s, in my bedroom, on my bed listening to this over and over with my guitar with my ear to the speaker to try and figure out these parts. No youtube, no tabs (yet). This is amazing. Edit: Fender - why are you not making a dual humbucker Weezer strat?!

[@OrangutanTradeSalesmen]

I learned to play guitar by almost memorizing the Blue album tab book. Still have it to this day and it is torn and tattered. Amazing hearing those only in dreams licks. That tab book was amazingly spot on.

[@HowiesUncutBeavers]

Learning Trey Anastasio was an influence in some way on the Only In Dreams ending is one of the best examples of worlds colliding I’ve ever heard. Unexpected thing to learn about one of my favorite songs on the train ride home from Phish in NYC.

[@Zaruf]

Wow wow wow. I've been a Weezer fan for so long that I feel like I just walked down memory lane hearing the stories and nuggets of trivia, as if I was there in Weezerland. I paused and went back on the video a lot just to take in what was said. Some of my fav parts on here is about the transition from playing metal to alternative, early Weezer as hippie Phish-ish jam band, the 'Just What I Needed' reference (I became a Cars fan because of this song, because the synth part reminded me of Weezer), and even that quick mention of No Use For A Name! And someone who played in a Weezer tribute band back in the day I analyzed every single note of the guitars on Blue and Pinkerton, left and right channels. Best video I've seen on KZbin. Good job Chris!

[@kizmu2003]

Great stuff, breaking down the solo :) Keep it up.

[@peterb7435]

Rivers is awesome. Pinkerton has always been my favorite weeper album. Thanks for this shifty

[@yohojones]

Another great episode Chris. Thanks Rivers.

[@andocobo]

I got into guitar in 1995 mostly because of Rivers and also Slash - this was a really great interview, he asks so many great questions